[Music]
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[Music]
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>>TY: Man, it's great
to be back with you guys.
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I thoroughly enjoy
studying the bible with you.
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It's an experience that is not
only intellectually stimulating,
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but it opens my mind to see
things and I know this is true
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for all of us, that we
wouldn't see unless we have a
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conversation with one another,
and the same is true all over
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the world.
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People should be having
spiritual conversations.
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People should be opening the
bible, not just showing up at
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church once a week and
listening to somebody preach,
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but getting together as
friends and just opening the
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bible, reading a passage
and saying, hey, what's going on
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here?
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Let's study together, and
that's what Table Talk is all
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about and it's just a
privilege, it's an honor.
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>>DAVID: And it's a joy,
it literally is fun, it's
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enjoyable, it doesn't diminish
the significance of it, or the
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importance of it to say
that it is an enjoyable thing to
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sit down, behold how good
and how pleasant it is for
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brothers to dwell
together in unity, Psalm 133.
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It's pleasant.
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>>JAMES: And a lot of people
may not know this, but this is
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probably the longest amount of
time we get to spend together,
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all four of us together.
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We catch up between sessions,
we get to talk about the
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latest apps and gadgets and
things we're doing, and then,
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of course, we get to catch
up on our spiritual journeys,
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things we've been
learning, etcetera.
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A lot of the stuff that we've
been talking about, it's like,
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well, when did
you learn, really?
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Well, how long, did you, I
never heard of that before.
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And we're taking notes.
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>>DAVID: I got a whole thing
full of notes here, I'm loving
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it.
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>>TY: Yeah, yeah.
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Well, let me ask you a
question, another question to
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get us into the passage.
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>>JAMES: 366 GTO 389 4-barrel.
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The best car.
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>>TY: I didn't ask
any question about a car.
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If right now...I just wanna
dig into your psyches, I wanna
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find out what's going
on deep inside your soul.
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Okay, so, here it is, if
you could right now, snap your
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fingers and uninvent
anything, any human invention,
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innovation, technology.
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>>DAVID: Email.
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>>TY: If you
could just uninvent it.
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You would uninvent email.
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>>DAVID: Email is
the bane of my existence.
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It's just like, it just keeps
coming and I'm waging a war
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against it.
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>>TY: But I have things
to say to you in emails.
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>>DAVID: How about this?
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You remember when you used
to get a letter, you'd get a
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letter, you'd sit
down and you'd open it.
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>>JEFFREY: You mean the letter
you got two months after the
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person wrote it?
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>>DAVID: Yeah, but I
don't mind that, a letter...
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>>TY: You would
uninvent email, okay.
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>>JEFFREY: Snapchat.
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You don't even know
what that is, do you?
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>>TY: I know what it is.
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I tried it once,
I didn't like it.
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>>JEFFREY: It's
annoying, it bothers me.
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>>DAVID: But are you on it?
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>>JEFFREY: No.
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>>DAVID: Well, why would you
wanna uninvent something that
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you could just choose
to not participate in?
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>>JEFFREY: Cause I'm bothered
that other people are on it.
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>>DAVID: [Laughter]
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>>TY: James, what
would you uninvent?
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Some technology or some device
or something, can't be the can
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opener?
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What would you uninvent?
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>>DAVID: Maybe something
more important like an atomic,
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like, the atomic bomb.
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>>JAMES: That's the first
thing that came to my brain.
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>>TY: Wow, the atomic brain.
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>>JEFFREY: That makes me
sound really trivial now.
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>>DAVID: Well, it makes what
I said sound really trivial,
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too.
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>>TY: I think I
would uninvent television.
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I mean, we're on
television doing this.
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>>DAVID: There's the irony.
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>>TY: We're just using the
medium because it exists, but
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man, isn't it
the omnipresent idol?
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If you think about it, it's
just everywhere, and there's
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so much, is there 10% of
the stuff on television is worth
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watching?
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>>DAVID: No.
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>>TY: Is there 5%
that's worth watching?
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>>DAVID: The only television
that I see in a year, the only
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television that I see, in
terms of, like, programming,
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where NBC, ABC, Fox, and all
of that, happens when I go to
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visit my parents.
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When I go to visit my
parents, the television is on.
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It is continually on.
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>>TY: It's just
background noise.
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>>DAVID: And the stuff,
they just leave it on, God bless
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them, I love my parents very
much, but the stuff that's on
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there, I'm just like,
it's either so banal, so...
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>>TY: I just can't
even endure the commercials.
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>>DAVID: It's terrible.
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Oh, the commercials are an
insult to your intelligence.
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Your IQ goes down like 2
points every time you watch
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one of those commercials.
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You just sit there like, so
I hear that, I hear that loud
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and clear.
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>>JEFFREY: I got a
visual of you drooling.
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>>DAVID: I'm sorry,
I just had to do that.
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>>TY: Anyways, anyways,
anyways, the reason I asked,
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again, I'm trying to just get
us into the text here, but in
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Revelation 13, we spent
our time together last session,
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last conversation, in
verses 1-10 identifying the sea
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beast.
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When we come to verse 11 and
onward, there's another beast
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that comes up from the earth.
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The previous one came up out
of the sea, we identified that
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power in history.
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The second beast comes up out
of the earth, out of the land,
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and that beast, I think
we're going to discover, in our
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conversation, I don't know
if the right word is invention,
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but that beast invented
something novel, unique,
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different, that really wasn't
anywhere in any human system
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in the world.
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That beast invented a
system of governance that is
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completely
unique in human history.
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So, I'll just leave it at that
and we'll see if we can make
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those
connections, but, go ahead.
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>>DAVID: Well, I was gonna
say, maybe we should say that
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the significance of coming
up out of the sea, that's the
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first beast, Revelation 13.
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>>JEFFREY: Well, read it, we
haven't even read it, have we?
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>>DAVID: Well, no, we did,
Revelation 13:1, and I stood
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on the sand of the sea and
I saw a beast rising up out of
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the sea, having seven
heads and ten horns, and on his
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horns 10 crowns and on
his head a blasphemous name?
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Did we not read that text?
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>>TY: We read the text, you
were about to define what it
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means.
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>>JAMES: Out of the
sea versus the earth.
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>>DAVID: So, that's the
sea, and then the earth is verse
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11, and then I saw a beast
coming up out of the earth and
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he had two horns like a
lamb and he spoke like a dragon.
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>>TY: So, we got a
clear comparison here.
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>>DAVID: One is coming up out
of this area, one is coming up
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out of this area, and the
earth, of course, is covered,
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you're either on land or
you're on the sea, right,
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that's what's
available to us here.
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And sea, we see in Revelation,
we see in Daniel that just as
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we're dealing with beasts
that are symbolic, time periods
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that are symbolic, horns
that are symbolic, this water is
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symbolic and it's
representing people.
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>>JEFFREY: Chapter 17,
verse 15, Revelation 17:15.
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>>TY: Can you read that verse
straight up because it defines
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the symbol.
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>>JEFFREY:  17:15 in
Revelation, and he said to me,
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the waters which you saw where
the harlot sits were peoples,
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multitudes, nations.
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>>TY: We even use that kind
of language today, we speak of
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seeing a sea of
people, a large body of people.
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So, when it says that this
beast comes up out of the sea,
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it means a power, a system, an
empire, a nation whatever, some
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kind of earthly system, arose in
a populated area of the world.
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Among nations, among multiple
nations that coexist, butting
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up against one another.
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>>DAVID: It seems a very
reasonable inference then,
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that a beast that comes up out
of the land is coming up in a
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different kind of area.
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It's the opposite.
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So, if this a densely
populated area, a nations and
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territories that have
been occupied for centuries and
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centuries and centuries, this
is a place that is relatively
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new.
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Seemingly new,
it's not as populated.
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It's not the old world.
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>>TY: It's the new world.
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>>DAVID: It's the new world.
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>>TY: And it is populated, not
as densely populated, in fact,
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it's a large land mass that
is brought to view here, but
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there are peoples there, which
we can say something about,
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but we're, we haven't even
identified yet, but we know,
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don't we, in our previous
conversation, that the sea
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beast of Revelation 13, verses
1-10, that beast is the Roman
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empire papal phase,
the medieval church, and we
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identified that that church
reigns for a period of 1260
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years from 538 to 1798.
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So, then, when we come to
verse 11, it says, then, I saw
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another beast coming up out
of the earth, it's sequential.
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So, we can expect some kind
of power, some kind of system of
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governance to emerge on the
scene of world history after
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or around 1798, and that
new system, that new system of
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governance will come up in a
relatively unpopulated part of
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the world.
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It's obvious, with those
two identifiers, who this land
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beast is.
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>>JEFFREY: But maybe we can
just read another section of
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verse 11, because it says that
the beast comes up out of the
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earth and it has
two horns like a lamb.
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>>JAMES: Before we go there,
I wanna go back to the earth, I
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just wanna give a
verification for that.
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If we go back to
Revelation chapter 12, we have a
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verification that the
earth is a wilderness, it's an
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uninhabited area.
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>>DAVID:
Comparatively less inhabited.
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>>JAMES: Yeah, look at this.
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We talked about this already,
the woman, who is the church,
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going underground and, in
verse 6, she heads out to the
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wilderness again in Revelation
chapter 12 and verse 14, the
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woman heads out into the
wilderness and this time, it
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says, to the woman were
given two wings of a great eagle
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that she might fly
into the wilderness, okay?
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That's a desolate area, a less
populated area, into her place
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where she is nourished for
a time, time and a half, time
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from the face of the serpent,
there's that timeframe again,
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and the serpent cast out of
his mouth water as of a flood
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after the woman that he might
cause her to be carried away
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of the flood, and that talks,
and that language is talking
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about, again, waters, but
a flood in the bible actually
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represents persecuting waters,
when the enemy shall come in
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like a flood, it
says in Isaiah 59:19.
00:10:01.10\00:10:03.93
The Spirit of the Lord
will raise up a standard against
00:10:03.93\00:10:05.87
him.
00:10:05.87\00:10:06.84
So, a flood is used
in the bible to represent
00:10:06.84\00:10:07.97
persecution, which is
coming against the woman, and it
00:10:07.97\00:10:11.37
says, so, verse 15, the
dragon's casting out these
00:10:11.37\00:10:15.34
waters of persecution, but
notice this, verse 16, here's
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the key verse, and the
earth helped the woman, and the
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earth opened her mouth and
swallowed up the flood, which
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the dragon cast
out of his mouth.
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>>TY: Swallowed
up the persecution?
00:10:27.72\00:10:28.96
>>JAMES: Yes.
00:10:28.96\00:10:30.09
Interestingly, during this
period of time, God's people
00:10:30.09\00:10:34.73
found refuge not only in the
Alps and the wilderness areas
00:10:34.73\00:10:37.80
of Europe, but they also
found refuge in the continent of
00:10:37.80\00:10:42.60
America.
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They actually came over
to this continent in the 15th
00:10:43.71\00:10:46.14
century and the 16th century,
in the 17th, all through the
00:10:46.14\00:10:49.98
end of this Dark Age period,
the woman found refuge in the
00:10:49.98\00:10:54.48
continent of America, which
is identified here as the same
00:10:54.48\00:10:56.99
place where this
beast rises up, the earth.
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It's the earth.
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>>TY: They escaped persecution.
00:10:59.82\00:11:01.06
>>JAMES: Yes, they escaped
persecution, they found refuge
00:11:01.06\00:11:02.66
here in the earth, the earth
helps to swallow up that flood
00:11:02.66\00:11:05.86
of persecution, and then, as
we move forward, going through
00:11:05.86\00:11:08.03
the history of the first sea
beast, as you move forward, we
00:11:08.03\00:11:10.73
find another beast, another
kingdom, another government,
00:11:10.73\00:11:12.87
another power, another earthly
power, rising up out of the
00:11:12.87\00:11:15.57
same place where
the woman found refuge.
00:11:15.57\00:11:17.44
So, it fits perfectly.
00:11:17.44\00:11:18.77
>>TY: That's a great connection.
00:11:18.77\00:11:20.31
>>DAVID: Well,
in verse, Jeffrey...
00:11:22.28\00:11:24.65
>>JEFFREY: I was just
getting to the point in verse 11
00:11:24.65\00:11:27.72
where, not only does it
tell us the coming up, you just
00:11:27.72\00:11:30.19
positioned us chronologically,
or in history, and now we're
00:11:30.19\00:11:34.32
having characteristics of what
the thing is like and it says
00:11:34.32\00:11:37.03
it has two horns like a
lamb and I think the fascinating
00:11:37.03\00:11:39.76
thing about that, we've run
into Lamb already in our study
00:11:39.76\00:11:43.33
of Revelation, but what is it,
28 times, 27, 28, 29 times in
00:11:43.33\00:11:47.97
the entire book of Revelation
that the word Lamb comes up
00:11:47.97\00:11:50.97
and every single time, it's
in reference, every single time,
00:11:50.97\00:11:54.94
other than this, it's capital
L, the translators, it's a
00:11:54.94\00:11:58.35
direct reference to Jesus.
00:11:58.35\00:12:00.78
>>DAVID: But I think even
this is a reference to Jesus.
00:12:00.78\00:12:02.32
>>JEFFREY: I think
it is, I think it is.
00:12:02.32\00:12:03.89
>>TY: But, you're gonna
make a distinction, right?
00:12:03.89\00:12:07.16
>>JEFFREY: Yeah, well, the
distinction I was gonna make
00:12:07.16\00:12:10.23
was that those other
references are directly
00:12:10.23\00:12:12.66
referencing the Lamb Jesus,
this reference is John pulling
00:12:12.66\00:12:18.00
that language, that
characteristic, to describe
00:12:18.00\00:12:23.37
this beast as lamb-like.
00:12:23.37\00:12:26.34
So, this is not
Jesus, right, this is...
00:12:26.34\00:12:30.55
>>TY: But it's
an earthly system...
00:12:30.55\00:12:32.18
>>JEFFREY: Right, this
is a Jesus-ish, Christ-ish
00:12:32.18\00:12:35.35
characteristic of
this earthly system.
00:12:35.35\00:12:38.49
That's right.
00:12:38.49\00:12:40.56
And horns are symbols of
governmental power, and so
00:12:40.56\00:12:45.36
these are lamb-like.
00:12:45.36\00:12:47.03
>>TY: Wait, you said that
really fast, back up, you just
00:12:47.03\00:12:48.63
said that as
though it were true.
00:12:48.63\00:12:51.83
>>JEFFREY: It is, just trust me.
00:12:51.83\00:12:53.10
>>TY: So, what
did you say, though?
00:12:53.10\00:12:54.57
Slower.
00:12:54.57\00:12:55.57
>>JEFFREY: I was
talking about the horns.
00:12:55.57\00:12:56.84
>>TY: Horns are a symbol of?
00:12:56.84\00:12:58.01
>>JEFFREY: Governmental power.
00:12:58.01\00:12:59.57
We've been running into beasts
that represent powers and they
00:12:59.57\00:13:01.98
have horns on them.
00:13:01.98\00:13:03.91
>>TY: By the way, for
those who are studying with us,
00:13:03.91\00:13:05.71
that's in the
book of Daniel again?
00:13:05.71\00:13:07.92
>>JEFFREY: Yes, Daniel
chapter 7, Daniel chapter 7.
00:13:07.92\00:13:10.72
And so, because the horns are
symbols of governmental power
00:13:10.72\00:13:15.42
and the horns are lamb-like,
put the pieces of the puzzle
00:13:15.42\00:13:19.86
together, we're looking at
a power that arises in, you
00:13:19.86\00:13:24.10
know, late 18th century, whose
governmental system will have
00:13:24.10\00:13:29.37
embedded into it
Christ like principles.
00:13:29.37\00:13:33.71
>>TY: This is amazing.
00:13:33.71\00:13:35.48
>>DAVID: The first time I
was exposed to this prophecy, I
00:13:37.65\00:13:39.58
was probably already a
believer of about 2 months,
00:13:39.58\00:13:43.28
but when I was exposed to this
prophecy as a premed student
00:13:43.28\00:13:45.92
at the age of 23, I
was like, God is real.
00:13:45.92\00:13:50.09
I just was like, it
just was like solidified.
00:13:50.09\00:13:52.76
Up 'til that point, I was
already persuaded, given my
00:13:52.76\00:13:54.73
life to Christ, studying
scripture, but I was like,
00:13:54.73\00:13:58.30
can you explain that again?
00:13:58.30\00:14:00.57
They walked me
through the markers.
00:14:00.57\00:14:01.64
So, this is what
we're looking for.
00:14:01.64\00:14:02.84
Late 18th century, relatively
sparsely populated, compared
00:14:02.84\00:14:06.64
to the old world.
00:14:06.64\00:14:07.94
Helps a woman escape
persecution from the Roman
00:14:07.94\00:14:10.58
power, lamb-like systems
of governance, identified as a
00:14:10.58\00:14:14.95
Christian system.
00:14:14.95\00:14:16.85
>>TY: This is the
United States of America.
00:14:16.85\00:14:19.35
>>JEFFREY: And you know
what blows my mind is that...
00:14:19.35\00:14:21.06
>>DAVID: And it's not a stretch.
00:14:21.06\00:14:22.42
What's really going on here in
your gymnastics with the text,
00:14:22.42\00:14:26.80
it's like...
00:14:26.80\00:14:28.00
>>JEFFREY: But that just rolls
off your tongue as if it's so
00:14:28.00\00:14:29.76
natural, but I think it's
fascinating that throughout
00:14:29.76\00:14:32.67
Christian history, Protestant
history, that first beast that
00:14:32.67\00:14:36.24
we talked about in our
last discussion, pretty,
00:14:36.24\00:14:39.37
the consensus is pretty
strong, pretty unanimous.
00:14:39.37\00:14:42.81
I'm on Protestants.
00:14:42.81\00:14:43.98
That beast is the medieval
church, the Roman state power,
00:14:43.98\00:14:48.75
but this second beast...
00:14:48.75\00:14:51.69
>>JAMES: Not so sure.
00:14:51.69\00:14:52.69
>>JEFFREY: Not so sure.
00:14:52.69\00:14:53.89
Through the centuries, and
it wasn't until, you know, the
00:14:53.89\00:14:56.49
mid-1800s, 1851 where a young
guy by the name of JN Andrews
00:14:56.49\00:15:03.03
wrote an article as he was
looking at the prophecy, as he
00:15:03.03\00:15:07.10
was studying was previous
Protestant, Baptist, and
00:15:07.10\00:15:10.24
Methodist and Presbyterian
scholars had written, and they
00:15:10.24\00:15:13.74
were all poking in the
direction, they were saying,
00:15:13.74\00:15:16.21
wait a second, it can't be
the papal system, because that's
00:15:16.21\00:15:19.21
the first beast, but there's
some sort of relation here,
00:15:19.21\00:15:23.05
some sort of passing of
the baton, so to speak, and so
00:15:23.05\00:15:26.92
they were thinking, maybe
it has something to do with the
00:15:26.92\00:15:28.89
Protestant version of
Christianity, literally.
00:15:28.89\00:15:31.83
>>TY: So, they were onto it.
00:15:31.83\00:15:33.09
>>JEFFREY: They were onto it.
00:15:33.09\00:15:34.23
And JN Andrews, 1951, writes
an article and he says, it's
00:15:34.23\00:15:39.93
the United States of America,
and that's the first time in
00:15:39.93\00:15:42.37
history where that rolled off
somebody's tongue like it did
00:15:42.37\00:15:45.31
yours just so naturally,
and I think, I'd like to revisit
00:15:45.31\00:15:48.68
that to realize how, I want
the wow factor back, you know?
00:15:48.68\00:15:52.78
Like, whoa, that's
heavy, that's very heavy.
00:15:52.78\00:15:55.48
>>DAVID: And here's a very
important point, with regards
00:15:55.48\00:15:57.75
to prophecy, we've discussed
this before in terms of
00:15:57.75\00:15:59.82
Daniel's book was sealed.
00:15:59.82\00:16:01.62
Well, why was it sealed?
00:16:01.62\00:16:02.82
He didn't have the historical
perspective to see Babylon,
00:16:02.82\00:16:05.26
Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome.
00:16:05.26\00:16:07.83
You couldn't have written
that the United States was the
00:16:07.83\00:16:09.80
lamb-like beast of
Revelation 13 in 1776.
00:16:09.80\00:16:14.44
>>TY: No, there's no way.
00:16:14.44\00:16:15.60
>>DAVID: You just wouldn't
have had that, but by the time
00:16:15.60\00:16:18.97
you get, 1851, you've got, you
know, 1776 is when the United
00:16:18.97\00:16:22.88
States declares independence,
you're 70ish years in and
00:16:22.88\00:16:27.32
you're looking around and
knowledge is increasing, to
00:16:27.32\00:16:32.45
use Daniel's term.
00:16:32.45\00:16:33.59
You're like, whoa,
we're in that period.
00:16:33.59\00:16:36.76
Now, let me throw in...
00:16:36.76\00:16:37.89
>>JEFFREY: Another thing,
within a generation, because
00:16:37.89\00:16:40.26
Jefferson, what, you know,
early 1800s, he's still alive.
00:16:40.26\00:16:43.53
So, JN Andrews writing,
connecting the dots, could've
00:16:43.53\00:16:47.94
been an acquaintance of
somebody who was contemporary
00:16:47.94\00:16:50.87
to Thomas Jefferson.
00:16:50.87\00:16:53.04
I think that's amazing.
00:16:53.04\00:16:54.14
>>JAMES: You know what's
amazing, though, too, is, oh.
00:16:54.14\00:16:55.41
>>DAVID: Let me just drop
one more identifying mark.
00:16:55.41\00:16:57.25
Hold on, you've got
what you were gonna say?
00:16:57.25\00:16:58.65
>>JAMES: It's the
same thing, probably.
00:16:58.65\00:16:59.61
>>DAVID: The coming up.
00:16:59.61\00:17:00.78
>>JAMES: No, you get
that and I'll get another one.
00:17:00.78\00:17:02.58
>>DAVID: Okay, so in the text
here, Revelation 13:11 says, I
00:17:02.58\00:17:04.99
saw another beast coming up.
00:17:04.99\00:17:06.62
We all think here, you've
got King James, most of us have
00:17:06.62\00:17:09.52
New King James.
00:17:09.52\00:17:10.59
The word here, the word
coming up here is grew up.
00:17:10.59\00:17:14.76
It's to sprout.
00:17:14.76\00:17:15.70
>>JEFFREY: Like a plant.
00:17:15.70\00:17:16.50
>>DAVID: It's to sprout.
00:17:16.50\00:17:17.67
So, this is not a, this is
not the old world beast, lion,
00:17:17.67\00:17:23.81
bear, leopard, conquer and
devouring, one taking over the
00:17:23.81\00:17:27.24
other.
00:17:27.24\00:17:27.94
This is growth, it's new.
00:17:27.94\00:17:29.11
It's sprouting, it's
almost quietly coming up.
00:17:29.11\00:17:33.68
Here again, we have
yet another identifier.
00:17:33.68\00:17:37.45
We're not looking for a nation
that's gonna come and conquer
00:17:37.45\00:17:39.19
a previously
occupied geographical, no.
00:17:39.19\00:17:42.26
No, this is
coming up, sprouting up.
00:17:42.26\00:17:44.59
That's mine, what
were you gonna say?
00:17:44.59\00:17:45.76
>>JAMES: Well, the other
one is in verse 12, it says, and
00:17:45.76\00:17:47.76
then he exercises all
the power of the first beast
00:17:47.76\00:17:51.07
before him and causes
the earth and them that dwell
00:17:51.07\00:17:54.54
there to
worship the first beast.
00:17:54.54\00:17:55.74
This is a power that has
universal military might.
00:17:55.74\00:17:59.51
Now, when you look at
this, in relation to the US in
00:17:59.51\00:18:02.48
prophecy, you realize that,
from the beginning, like David
00:18:02.48\00:18:06.05
said, this power
developed gradually and slowly.
00:18:06.05\00:18:10.59
The United States was fighting
for its independence in 1776
00:18:10.59\00:18:15.99
and was still
struggling with that in 1812.
00:18:15.99\00:18:17.93
It was not a world power.
00:18:17.93\00:18:19.06
>>DAVID: Many people thought
it wouldn't even survive.
00:18:19.06\00:18:22.23
>>JAMES: Right, and even into
the 19th century, there's this
00:18:22.23\00:18:24.33
World War II and the bombing
of Pearl Harbor, and all of a
00:18:24.33\00:18:27.27
sudden, now, we're living in
a time where this prophecy, it's
00:18:27.27\00:18:32.11
obvious.
00:18:32.11\00:18:33.41
>>DAVID: You have to have a
power that could be a coercive
00:18:33.41\00:18:36.71
influence on the earth.
00:18:36.71\00:18:38.65
>>JAMES: The United States has
more military bases around the
00:18:38.65\00:18:42.22
world than any other power
and just insists on having them.
00:18:42.22\00:18:44.55
>>DAVID: You probably
know more about this than I do,
00:18:44.55\00:18:47.69
Jeffrey, but post-World War
II, that war is where you have
00:18:47.69\00:18:50.06
the real rise, post-World War
I, into World War II, and then
00:18:50.06\00:18:53.06
post World War II,
that's where the United States
00:18:53.06\00:18:54.66
becomes the
military monster that it is.
00:18:54.66\00:18:58.67
It was
competition, is it England?
00:18:58.67\00:19:01.44
>>JAMES: It was the fall
of communism in 1989-1990 that
00:19:01.44\00:19:05.31
allowed the United
States to become the sole world
00:19:05.31\00:19:08.24
superpower.
00:19:08.24\00:19:09.14
Sole world superpower.
00:19:09.14\00:19:10.91
>>JEFFREY: We jumped
there, I wanted to go back...
00:19:10.91\00:19:13.05
>>JAMES: Which is interesting
'cause it's the fall of
00:19:13.05\00:19:14.38
atheism.
00:19:14.38\00:19:15.58
Just think about that, that's
in this prophecy, the deadly
00:19:15.58\00:19:16.75
wound was healed.
00:19:16.75\00:19:17.79
The wound's inflicted,
the deadly wound is healed.
00:19:17.79\00:19:19.62
The wound was
inflicted by atheism.
00:19:19.62\00:19:21.49
The wound being healed...
00:19:21.49\00:19:23.46
>>TY: Or by atheist France.
00:19:23.46\00:19:24.89
>>JAMES: Yeah, the
wound being healed...
00:19:24.89\00:19:27.20
>>JEFFREY: You're identifying
communism as a system
00:19:27.20\00:19:28.46
representative of atheism.
00:19:28.46\00:19:29.93
>>JAMES: Yes, suggests the
decline of that power and the
00:19:29.93\00:19:32.70
rise of this next one.
00:19:32.70\00:19:33.97
Okay.
00:19:33.97\00:19:35.14
>>JEFFREY: I was just gonna
say that, in the lamb-like,
00:19:35.14\00:19:36.24
'cause we just said, oh,
lamb-like, Christian, America,
00:19:36.24\00:19:39.87
but I wanted to read some of
the founding documents really
00:19:39.87\00:19:42.61
quick, just to show that
when the students identified two
00:19:42.61\00:19:46.98
horns like a lamb, okay,
system of governmental power,
00:19:46.98\00:19:51.19
but there's two, and
they started to think, wait a
00:19:51.19\00:19:53.29
second, what is the foundation
of this United States of
00:19:53.29\00:19:57.96
America?
00:19:57.96\00:19:58.99
And they identified two
primary principles, right,
00:19:58.99\00:20:02.20
republicanism and
Protestantism, freedom from a
00:20:02.20\00:20:05.53
king, freedom from a
pope, right, the two primary
00:20:05.53\00:20:09.04
principles.
00:20:09.04\00:20:10.21
And in the founding documents,
as I was reading this, I'm
00:20:10.21\00:20:14.34
reading the founding documents
trying to identify, do I see
00:20:14.34\00:20:18.11
anything
Christian-ish, Christ-ish here?
00:20:18.11\00:20:20.98
Anything Jesus would say?
00:20:20.98\00:20:22.38
Lamb-like, and let me
just read the Declaration of
00:20:22.38\00:20:24.79
Independence, which I
think is just glorious.
00:20:24.79\00:20:28.99
>>TY: Just makes my heart race
with excitement, these words.
00:20:28.99\00:20:31.43
>>JEFFREY: We hold these
truths to be self-evident,
00:20:31.43\00:20:34.56
that all men are created
equal, that they are endowed
00:20:34.56\00:20:37.50
by their Creator with certain
unalienable Rights, that among
00:20:37.50\00:20:41.97
these are Life, Liberty
and the pursuit of Happiness.
00:20:41.97\00:20:45.77
That to secure these rights,
Governments are instituted
00:20:45.77\00:20:50.01
among Men, and this is
the point that I wanna make,
00:20:50.01\00:20:51.78
deriving their just
powers from the consent of the
00:20:51.78\00:20:56.99
governed.
00:20:56.99\00:20:58.59
We've been contrasting through
this whole study of Revelation
00:20:58.59\00:21:03.56
these two powers,
these two systems, right?
00:21:03.56\00:21:07.66
God and Satan.
00:21:07.66\00:21:10.13
Satan using coercion and
brutality and so forth and so
00:21:10.13\00:21:13.40
forth, and Christ using an
entirely different approach,
00:21:13.40\00:21:17.71
and this idea of deriving
their just powers from the
00:21:17.71\00:21:20.61
consent of the
governed, that is so lamb-like
00:21:20.61\00:21:23.48
>>TY: That's so powerful.
00:21:23.48\00:21:24.98
>>JEFFREY: That is so lamb-like.
00:21:24.98\00:21:26.18
>>TY: And that's what I meant,
by the way, earlier, when I
00:21:26.18\00:21:28.38
said, is there something
that this power invented on a
00:21:28.38\00:21:33.82
governmental level?
00:21:33.82\00:21:35.19
Is there a new system that is
brought to the world as a kind
00:21:35.19\00:21:39.29
of experiment, and
this is precisely it?
00:21:39.29\00:21:42.26
It's a method of governance
that is by the consent of the
00:21:42.26\00:21:45.57
governed, it is a method
of governance that does not
00:21:45.57\00:21:49.10
involve monarchical power,
that doesn't involve papal
00:21:49.10\00:21:53.74
power.
00:21:53.74\00:21:54.98
>>JEFFREY: And so, in addition
to that, when the Declaration
00:21:54.98\00:21:58.21
of Independence is drafted
and when we finally secede from
00:21:58.21\00:22:03.92
Britain, there is still
something that needs to be
00:22:03.92\00:22:07.26
settled because this new
country cannot operate without
00:22:07.26\00:22:10.76
centralized power and
therefore, there needs to be
00:22:10.76\00:22:15.66
power invested in the central,
you know, in the government,
00:22:15.66\00:22:19.77
and so, the Constitution,
and what I love about the first
00:22:19.77\00:22:23.71
amendment, so, now, we're in
1791, I'll just read this and
00:22:23.71\00:22:26.78
you guys can chime in
about the lamb-likeness.
00:22:26.78\00:22:30.68
Congress shall make no law
respecting an establishment of
00:22:30.68\00:22:34.28
religion, or prohibiting
the free exercise thereof, or
00:22:34.28\00:22:39.12
abridging the freedom of
speech, or of the press, or
00:22:39.12\00:22:42.89
the right of the people
peaceably to assemble, and to
00:22:42.89\00:22:46.33
petition the Government
for a redress of grievances.
00:22:46.33\00:22:49.56
>>TY: Don't you love that?
00:22:49.56\00:22:50.50
>>JEFFREY: So, it's
basically the gospel.
00:22:50.50\00:22:51.70
That's the great controversy
between good and evil and the
00:22:51.70\00:22:53.97
principles of the
gospel being articulated.
00:22:53.97\00:22:58.81
>>TY: So, you could say it
this way, that the Declaration
00:22:58.81\00:23:01.88
of Independence, the part
that you've read anyway, and the
00:23:01.88\00:23:04.98
Constitution of the
United States of America, is the
00:23:04.98\00:23:08.82
gospel of Christ in the
form of governing documents.
00:23:08.82\00:23:13.49
Now, not in totality, and
there's more to the gospel
00:23:13.49\00:23:17.99
than this, but at the
core of the gospel is basically
00:23:17.99\00:23:20.33
non-coercive love.
00:23:20.33\00:23:22.46
At the core of the gospel
is the God of the universe only
00:23:22.46\00:23:27.70
desires the service and
worship that is born of free
00:23:27.70\00:23:33.24
hearts that love him
based on the worthiness of his
00:23:33.24\00:23:37.11
character so that coercion
is diametrically opposed to the
00:23:37.11\00:23:41.48
character of God.
00:23:41.48\00:23:42.62
So, this system that is
brought to view here, the
00:23:42.62\00:23:45.59
United States of America, is
bringing into the world, it's
00:23:45.59\00:23:49.96
actually the fruition of
what Jesus and the apostles
00:23:49.96\00:23:54.30
started.
00:23:54.30\00:23:55.56
Down through history,
it's developing, it's going
00:23:55.56\00:23:58.00
underground, it's resurfacing
now, it's resurfacing in the
00:23:58.00\00:24:02.60
form of a free people
that are governed by consent.
00:24:02.60\00:24:09.58
So, we've gotta take a break,
but when we come back, we'll
00:24:09.58\00:24:13.45
continue moving through this
remarkable passage that points
00:24:13.45\00:24:18.19
to the United
States in bible prophecy.
00:24:18.19\00:24:21.52
[Music]
00:24:21.52\00:24:29.36
>>The bible is a big book.
00:24:33.94\00:24:35.80
It's composed of 66 smaller
books, written by more than 40
00:24:35.80\00:24:40.94
different authors.
00:24:40.94\00:24:42.01
It's easy to get bogged
down in all the genealogies,
00:24:42.01\00:24:45.38
ancient history and
intersecting characters with
00:24:45.38\00:24:48.78
unpronounceable names.
00:24:48.78\00:24:50.72
And yet, the bible is full
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00:24:50.72\00:24:55.16
all of us need to understand.
00:24:55.16\00:24:58.19
Wouldn't you love to have
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00:25:01.36\00:25:04.83
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00:25:04.83\00:25:07.87
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00:25:36.77\00:25:41.10
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00:26:11.30\00:26:16.71
[Music]
00:26:18.01\00:26:22.78
>>TY: What we've been
discovering here in Revelation
00:26:25.05\00:26:26.75
13 is nothing
short of astounding.
00:26:26.75\00:26:29.38
If this passage actually
foretold the rise of the
00:26:29.38\00:26:36.89
United States of America as
a system, then what might it
00:26:36.89\00:26:42.43
also say to us about
the future of this power?
00:26:42.43\00:26:46.53
So, if it's telling us,
hey, there's gonna be this power
00:26:46.53\00:26:50.94
that's going to arise in human
history that's lamb-like in
00:26:50.94\00:26:53.51
its governing principles,
which we identified, does the
00:26:53.51\00:26:57.55
passage go on and say, but wait
a minute, it's not gonna be good
00:26:57.55\00:27:01.35
forever, it's not going to
be lamb-like forever, well, the
00:27:01.35\00:27:05.49
passage actually says, in
verse 11, then I saw another
00:27:05.49\00:27:08.99
beast coming up out of
the earth and he had two horns
00:27:08.99\00:27:11.49
like a lamb, but then it
says, and spoke like a dragon.
00:27:11.49\00:27:16.23
Now, we know the dragon
is traceable to the devil,
00:27:16.23\00:27:20.30
ultimately, and to the
Roman Empire, secondarily, so.
00:27:20.30\00:27:25.14
>>JEFFREY: I was gonna say
that those two images, lamb
00:27:25.14\00:27:27.08
and dragon, in
the same sentence?
00:27:27.08\00:27:29.91
>>DAVID: It's the only text in
all of scripture that has that
00:27:29.91\00:27:32.15
juxtaposition.
00:27:32.15\00:27:33.18
>>JEFFREY: Lamb and
dragon in the same sentence.
00:27:33.18\00:27:35.52
That is...
00:27:35.52\00:27:37.25
>>JAMES: It's amazing,
it's describing the conflict, I
00:27:37.25\00:27:41.26
think, that this country's
gone through from the very
00:27:41.26\00:27:43.02
beginning.
00:27:43.02\00:27:44.09
From the very beginning,
you've got these principles
00:27:44.09\00:27:45.63
that are written into our
Constitution, you've got these
00:27:45.63\00:27:47.23
amendments to the
Constitution, and then you've
00:27:47.23\00:27:48.76
got these acts, these
manifestations of dragon-like
00:27:48.76\00:27:53.03
principles that I think the
text is telling us are gonna
00:27:53.03\00:27:55.57
get more and more intense
because the verse, that's one
00:27:55.57\00:27:58.47
verse of many verses that
describes this power, so, it's
00:27:58.47\00:28:02.24
gonna get more and more
intense, but even from the
00:28:02.24\00:28:03.95
establishment of this
great nation, there were little
00:28:03.95\00:28:08.28
manifestations, dragon-like
manifestations that came out.
00:28:08.28\00:28:11.39
>>TY: Yeah, even in the
beginning phases, the fact is
00:28:11.39\00:28:13.86
that we're all very happy
to be a part of a governing
00:28:13.86\00:28:19.93
system based on the kinds
of principles that Jeffrey read
00:28:19.93\00:28:24.03
to us in the Declaration of
Independence, the Constitution
00:28:24.03\00:28:27.00
of the United States of America.
00:28:27.00\00:28:28.67
It's incredible to be a part
of a system that is based on
00:28:28.67\00:28:32.04
freedom.
00:28:32.04\00:28:33.68
But the fact is that,
simultaneously, there's some
00:28:33.68\00:28:37.38
spiritual and moral dissonance
because, blind spots, exactly.
00:28:37.38\00:28:43.39
You have founding fathers,
Thomas Jefferson himself, who
00:28:43.39\00:28:47.59
penned these incredible
words, who owned slaves.
00:28:47.59\00:28:54.30
>>DAVID: That's right.
00:28:54.30\00:28:55.63
>>TY: Who owned slaves.
00:28:55.63\00:28:57.97
So, we need to understand that
this system is based on good
00:28:57.97\00:29:05.94
principles, and
simultaneously, there are
00:29:05.94\00:29:08.51
those who are founding the
nation who are violating the
00:29:08.51\00:29:10.61
very principles that they're
articulating because they have
00:29:10.61\00:29:13.11
blind spots, I guess that
would be a kind way to say it.
00:29:13.11\00:29:16.15
>>DAVID: And not only in
terms of slavery, which was a
00:29:16.15\00:29:18.79
massive blind spot, to put
it nicely, but you have the
00:29:18.79\00:29:23.26
treatment of the
indigenous peoples of this land.
00:29:23.26\00:29:26.23
Absolutely horrific, broken
treaty after broken treaty and
00:29:26.23\00:29:29.83
mistreatment after
mistreatment and tragically,
00:29:29.83\00:29:33.97
this was being done
largely, almost entirely by
00:29:33.97\00:29:38.44
Protestants.
00:29:38.44\00:29:39.97
In other words, these are
people that have fled from the
00:29:39.97\00:29:43.04
flood of the old world,
have come to the new world, and
00:29:43.04\00:29:45.58
they land, but they're still,
to use Jeffrey's term, the
00:29:45.58\00:29:48.22
residue, that sticky
residue of the old way of doing
00:29:48.22\00:29:51.32
things, you think of Luther,
just use a simple example
00:29:51.32\00:29:54.16
here.
00:29:54.16\00:29:55.32
We're approaching the 500th
year anniversary of Luther's
00:29:55.32\00:29:59.03
protest against the
medieval church, right?
00:29:59.03\00:30:02.80
October 31st
1517, here we are, 2016.
00:30:02.80\00:30:06.67
So, we're just on the
verge of that 500 years.
00:30:06.67\00:30:08.84
Luther himself
believed in a state church.
00:30:08.84\00:30:12.74
That's why they are called
the magisterial reformers.
00:30:12.74\00:30:15.58
They believed in a
Christian magistrate.
00:30:15.58\00:30:19.15
The idea, this idea that you
will have a government without
00:30:19.15\00:30:23.49
a king, the ruled and the
rule, no, no, no, we don't
00:30:23.49\00:30:27.09
have peasants and lords,
we now have citizens that are
00:30:27.09\00:30:31.29
governed only by their own
consent and now we're gonna
00:30:31.29\00:30:34.03
have, not only that but no pope.
00:30:34.03\00:30:38.20
There is no religious
authority, whether it's a pope
00:30:38.20\00:30:40.27
or a Christian
magistrate, this was wild.
00:30:40.27\00:30:42.47
It was called, the language
of the day was the American
00:30:42.47\00:30:45.67
experiment.
00:30:45.67\00:30:48.21
Can this work?
00:30:48.21\00:30:50.81
And...
00:30:50.81\00:30:51.75
>>TY: Can people self-govern?
00:30:51.75\00:30:53.01
>>DAVID: The idea
was, this is absurd.
00:30:53.01\00:30:54.95
It was considered absurd,
and frankly, it's miraculous.
00:30:54.95\00:30:58.05
If you go back and look at the
history, and I'm not, Jeffrey
00:30:58.05\00:31:00.76
is more the historian when it
comes to American history than
00:31:00.76\00:31:03.02
I am, but it's a miracle,
for example, the Revolutionary
00:31:03.02\00:31:07.03
war, the United States
could've won that war in the
00:31:07.03\00:31:09.50
way that they did with
the minutemen and all of that.
00:31:09.50\00:31:12.23
There's a providence over it.
00:31:12.23\00:31:15.44
There was a providence over it.
00:31:15.44\00:31:17.21
Then, you get to the emergence
of, it wasn't just like some,
00:31:17.21\00:31:21.11
okay, I live in Australia.
00:31:21.11\00:31:22.78
Australia's a beautiful country.
00:31:22.78\00:31:24.61
It's roughly the size of
the United States of America.
00:31:24.61\00:31:27.05
>>JAMES:
Continental United States.
00:31:27.05\00:31:28.55
>>DAVID: Yeah, without Alaska.
00:31:28.55\00:31:29.62
It's roughly the
size of the lower 48.
00:31:29.62\00:31:31.35
But you could not stick 330
million people in Australia.
00:31:31.35\00:31:33.86
No way.
00:31:33.86\00:31:35.86
That's the population
of the United States today.
00:31:35.86\00:31:37.79
You do not have the resources.
00:31:37.79\00:31:39.49
When people landed here,
there are forests, there are oil
00:31:39.49\00:31:42.70
fields, there are minerals to
be mined, the richness of this
00:31:42.70\00:31:47.14
country, in terms of
its natural resources, was
00:31:47.14\00:31:49.77
phenomenal.
00:31:49.77\00:31:51.14
It's what enabled it to become
this global military economic
00:31:51.14\00:31:55.04
power.
00:31:55.04\00:31:56.24
If they had found Australia,
that would've been circuitous
00:31:56.24\00:31:58.91
for them to have found
Australia, you do not end up
00:31:58.91\00:32:01.35
with the United States of
America, that's not a knock on
00:32:01.35\00:32:03.08
Australia.
00:32:03.08\00:32:04.32
>>JEFFREY: Its own limitations
and resources limit its power.
00:32:04.32\00:32:06.59
>>DAVID: The middle of
Australia, there's nothing
00:32:06.59\00:32:08.09
there.
00:32:08.09\00:32:08.92
>>TY: Uninhabitable.
00:32:08.92\00:32:10.06
>>DAVID: I mean, I've
driven it, there is just nothing
00:32:10.06\00:32:10.93
there.
00:32:10.93\00:32:12.09
Not these big forests and
beautiful mountains and clear
00:32:12.09\00:32:13.26
flowing rivers,
you don't have it.
00:32:13.26\00:32:15.23
So, when you see the
providence of God all over
00:32:15.23\00:32:19.23
this, but that doesn't mean,
and as Ty was bringing out,
00:32:19.23\00:32:23.10
that there were not some major
oversights and some breaches
00:32:23.10\00:32:27.41
of the very principles
that they themselves advocated.
00:32:27.41\00:32:30.55
Whether it's with
slavery, whether it's with, even
00:32:30.55\00:32:32.41
suffrage, women voting.
00:32:32.41\00:32:34.55
That doesn't come around
until, help me out here, you
00:32:34.55\00:32:37.09
might know, like 1900s,
mid, Wyoming, I know, the state
00:32:37.09\00:32:40.22
that I'm from, was the first
ever state that allowed the
00:32:40.22\00:32:42.06
voting of women.
00:32:42.06\00:32:43.53
But that's late into the game.
00:32:43.53\00:32:46.03
Then, you have the
treatment of the Native peoples.
00:32:46.03\00:32:48.50
It's just, they got the
principles right, but the
00:32:48.50\00:32:51.00
application didn't
follow immediately.
00:32:51.00\00:32:53.07
>>JEFFREY: You know, too,
the other thing was, even these
00:32:53.07\00:32:54.67
early students, even in the
wars, the early wars, Spanish,
00:32:54.67\00:32:59.04
American, when America was
becoming an empire, now taking
00:32:59.04\00:33:03.91
possession of foreign lands,
colonizing other lands like
00:33:03.91\00:33:08.32
the Philippines.
00:33:08.32\00:33:09.85
We fully
colonized the Philippines.
00:33:09.85\00:33:11.42
And so, this is so old world
mentality being now adopted by
00:33:11.42\00:33:17.73
the lamb-like beast.
00:33:17.73\00:33:19.73
So, it's a total...
00:33:19.73\00:33:20.96
>>JAMES: Well, it's a perfect
confirmation of the verse, in
00:33:20.96\00:33:22.93
a sense.
00:33:22.93\00:33:24.10
And I don't think that I've
ever seen it this way before
00:33:24.10\00:33:26.13
because I've always thought,
we'll speak like a dragon,
00:33:26.13\00:33:28.64
we'll speak like a
dragon, that's somewhere in the
00:33:28.64\00:33:30.01
future, that's somewhere
in the future, but the verse
00:33:30.01\00:33:31.51
indicates actually that they
could be simultaneous and that
00:33:31.51\00:33:36.61
what we're looking at in the
future in the following verses
00:33:36.61\00:33:38.98
is the imbalance, is
the neglect and perhaps the
00:33:38.98\00:33:44.99
abandonment of the lamb-like
principles and the total focus
00:33:44.99\00:33:48.52
on speaking like a dragon.
00:33:48.52\00:33:49.72
However...
00:33:49.72\00:33:50.83
>>TY: So, you're saying
they're running simultaneous.
00:33:50.83\00:33:51.93
>>JAMES: Yeah, they're
running, because when we look
00:33:51.93\00:33:53.46
at the history, they
actually do run simultaneously.
00:33:53.46\00:33:55.53
>>DAVID: I think
that's closer to it.
00:33:55.53\00:33:56.87
>>JAMES: And then, as we move
on, one overbears the other,
00:33:56.87\00:34:00.07
and it's as if God is
saying, I'm going to give an
00:34:00.07\00:34:01.90
opportunity for these
principles to be seen in
00:34:01.90\00:34:03.67
government, just to get a peek
and see how they operate and
00:34:03.67\00:34:05.87
to see what a blessing
they are, but then, I'm gonna go
00:34:05.87\00:34:08.08
ahead and allow this to return
to this dominant prince who's
00:34:08.08\00:34:13.11
gonna make full manifest
his character in the end of time
00:34:13.11\00:34:15.32
and then, we're
gonna end all this.
00:34:15.32\00:34:17.29
>>DAVID: So, dominant
prince, you lost me there.
00:34:17.29\00:34:19.19
>>JAMES: The
prince of this world.
00:34:19.19\00:34:20.39
The dragon.
00:34:20.39\00:34:21.86
>>TY: So, when it says in
verse 11 that he had two horns
00:34:21.86\00:34:25.93
like a lamb and spoke like
a dragon, the word spoke is
00:34:25.93\00:34:30.97
connected with verse 12,
the word authority, he exercises
00:34:30.97\00:34:34.57
authority, which is connected
with the word causes, he
00:34:34.57\00:34:39.07
causes.
00:34:39.07\00:34:40.18
So, essentially, what's
happening here, it's not just
00:34:40.18\00:34:43.48
speaking in the sense of
uttering words, how does a
00:34:43.48\00:34:46.45
nation speak?
00:34:46.45\00:34:47.88
Well, a nation speaks in
the form of its legislation.
00:34:47.88\00:34:51.72
So, this is essentially
saying that the United States of
00:34:51.72\00:34:54.42
America, founded on
principles of Republicanism and
00:34:54.42\00:34:57.49
Protestantism, principles
of freedom, of religion and
00:34:57.49\00:35:01.20
conscious liberty, that
power will simultaneously and
00:35:01.20\00:35:07.27
ultimately legislate against
the founding principles of the
00:35:07.27\00:35:15.24
documents that gave us
this American experiment.
00:35:15.24\00:35:20.58
It's amazing that
that's in the bible.
00:35:20.58\00:35:24.12
>>JAMES: This isn't Babylon,
Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome,
00:35:24.12\00:35:26.99
this isn't the Dark Ages, this
isn't some future, this, we're
00:35:26.99\00:35:30.56
living right now in this.
00:35:30.56\00:35:31.66
We're looking at our
history, our recent history, our
00:35:31.66\00:35:35.73
present history and we're
predicting our future history
00:35:35.73\00:35:38.77
in the context of Revelation
13, in the context of bible
00:35:38.77\00:35:42.24
prophecy.
00:35:42.24\00:35:43.20
>>DAVID: There is such
a feeling of what has been
00:35:43.20\00:35:45.84
described as
American exceptionalism among
00:35:45.84\00:35:48.68
Protestant Christianity,
you know, God bless America, God
00:35:48.68\00:35:51.95
has raised up America for
purposes, you know, you wonder
00:35:51.95\00:35:56.08
sometimes what purposes people
think that is, but this is a
00:35:56.08\00:35:59.49
slight side conversation,
but some believe that God raised
00:35:59.49\00:36:02.96
up the United States,
basically for the express
00:36:02.96\00:36:05.29
purpose of protecting Israel,
like, national Israel over
00:36:05.29\00:36:08.86
there.
00:36:08.86\00:36:10.03
My point is this, I wish
that people who believe in this
00:36:10.03\00:36:13.94
version of the sort of
providential opening, 'cause
00:36:13.94\00:36:16.94
there's some truth to it.
00:36:16.94\00:36:18.24
There's some truth to it,
but it's become a version of
00:36:18.24\00:36:21.41
American exceptionalism in
which there's this giant blind
00:36:21.41\00:36:24.08
spot, hello, not only to our
history, but increasingly, to
00:36:24.08\00:36:30.02
our present.
00:36:30.02\00:36:31.72
And, I'm telling you right
now, as an American, this is
00:36:31.72\00:36:35.49
not a political statement.
00:36:35.49\00:36:37.66
There are things that
we are doing, as a country.
00:36:37.66\00:36:40.73
I say, we, there are things
that the nation that I live
00:36:40.73\00:36:43.13
in, of which I am a
citizen, that are happening at a
00:36:43.13\00:36:45.83
governmental level, political
level, that I find absolutely
00:36:45.83\00:36:49.50
terrifying, shuddering.
00:36:49.50\00:36:52.34
>>TY: Yeah, you're
simultaneously proud and
00:36:52.34\00:36:57.15
embarrassed.
00:36:57.15\00:36:57.95
>>DAVID: And concerned.
00:36:57.95\00:36:59.05
>>JEFFREY: 'Cause you're
proud of what it's founded on,
00:36:59.05\00:37:00.42
you're proud of the
founding principles.
00:37:00.42\00:37:02.08
>>DAVID: But the
application has been...
00:37:02.08\00:37:04.02
>>TY: Would you
say you're patriotic?
00:37:04.02\00:37:05.52
I would say I'm patriotic
if patriotic means to the
00:37:05.52\00:37:10.49
principles.
00:37:10.49\00:37:11.59
I would say that your
patriotism isn't tested by any
00:37:11.59\00:37:17.00
candidate or party, though.
00:37:17.00\00:37:18.97
You can be a loyal America
and reject the political parties
00:37:18.97\00:37:25.31
that are warring with one
another, but be loyal to the
00:37:25.31\00:37:27.91
principles of the
founding documents.
00:37:27.91\00:37:29.54
>>JEFFREY: I actually think
being loyal to the principles
00:37:29.54\00:37:34.05
of the founding documents
necessitates you to have a
00:37:34.05\00:37:39.55
dissenting voice when
those principles are violated.
00:37:39.55\00:37:43.26
Otherwise, we're
just, what are you?
00:37:43.26\00:37:45.66
>>DAVID: And we should
say that we are not the only
00:37:45.66\00:37:47.46
people that are that way.
00:37:47.46\00:37:49.10
There are lots of people
in the United States right now
00:37:49.10\00:37:51.03
that are raising the red flag
of hey, that whole thing about
00:37:51.03\00:37:55.04
the Constitution
and what about that?
00:37:55.04\00:37:59.74
And you know, Jeffrey, again,
you would know more, in the
00:37:59.74\00:38:04.25
context of the interpretation
of the Constitution, you have
00:38:04.25\00:38:08.35
different schools
of interpretation.
00:38:08.35\00:38:10.39
So, some say, no, it's
exactly what they said.
00:38:10.39\00:38:12.75
In the same way, you have
schools of interpretation of
00:38:12.75\00:38:14.52
scripture.
00:38:14.52\00:38:15.59
It's an ancient document.
00:38:15.59\00:38:16.89
What did they mean and how
are those ancient principles
00:38:16.89\00:38:20.10
applied today?
00:38:20.10\00:38:21.23
But at the core of it, the
kernel, the nucleus of it, was
00:38:21.23\00:38:24.77
freedom, which is what
your point about how it's the
00:38:24.77\00:38:27.77
gospel in a governmental
system, noncoersive love,
00:38:27.77\00:38:32.11
voluntary loyalty to a system,
the consent of the governed,
00:38:32.11\00:38:37.71
and every place where that
freedom and that liberty is
00:38:37.71\00:38:41.72
being impinged
upon by the government.
00:38:41.72\00:38:44.79
You know, like, our biggest
fear, you know, we have met
00:38:44.79\00:38:47.32
the enemy, was that Kennedy?
00:38:47.32\00:38:48.72
Maybe not, and...
00:38:48.72\00:38:49.89
>>TY: We've met
the enemy and it's us.
00:38:49.89\00:38:53.09
>>DAVID: We are him.
00:38:53.09\00:38:54.36
The greatest threat to America
right now, to the principles
00:38:54.36\00:38:59.57
of America, is America.
00:38:59.57\00:39:02.07
>>TY: Yeah, that's right.
00:39:02.07\00:39:03.37
We have to take a break,
but there's some pretty heavy
00:39:03.37\00:39:06.14
stuff that continues on.
00:39:06.14\00:39:07.44
We have coming up here, this
thing called the image to the
00:39:07.44\00:39:13.82
beast, it'll be
interesting to talk about that.
00:39:13.82\00:39:15.65
>>JAMES: And the
mark of the beast.
00:39:15.65\00:39:16.82
>>TY: Let's just take a
break and we'll come right back.
00:39:16.82\00:39:19.12
[Music]
00:39:19.12\00:39:28.93
Announcer: Truth is not
merely a list of theological
00:39:30.90\00:39:33.03
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revelation of God's beautiful
00:39:33.03\00:39:35.87
love in Jesus Christ.
00:39:35.87\00:39:37.74
Truth Link is a series
of bible study guides that
00:39:37.74\00:39:40.81
magnify God's love as
the center of every bible
00:39:40.81\00:39:44.25
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00:39:44.25\00:39:45.45
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00:40:09.07\00:40:16.11
[Music]
00:40:16.11\00:40:23.05
>>TY: You guys, what we've
identified here in Revelation
00:40:23.05\00:40:26.45
13, verses 11 and 12 and
onward, identifying the United
00:40:26.45\00:40:31.43
States in bible
prophecy, this is phenomenal.
00:40:31.43\00:40:34.73
Once you see this,
you can't unsee it.
00:40:34.73\00:40:36.77
Once you know this,
you can't unknow it.
00:40:36.77\00:40:39.07
This bears testimony to the
inspiration of scripture, this
00:40:39.07\00:40:43.00
tells us, wow, if that was
written in advance, that gives
00:40:43.00\00:40:48.84
testimony to the fact
that this is an inspired word.
00:40:48.84\00:40:52.58
This is an
inspired document, yeah.
00:40:52.58\00:40:53.85
And secondly, it bears
testimony to the fact that God
00:40:53.85\00:40:58.19
is active in human history.
00:40:58.19\00:41:00.56
>>JEFFREY: I was just about
to say that, that God is present
00:41:00.56\00:41:02.82
and relevant in
scriptures relevant now.
00:41:02.82\00:41:05.39
>>TY: But the thing is,
is this freedom experiment,
00:41:05.39\00:41:07.76
according to the text, is
temporary, it's going to wind
00:41:07.76\00:41:12.17
down.
00:41:12.17\00:41:13.40
We can expect, if this passage
foretells the United States of
00:41:13.40\00:41:17.37
America, it's telling us that
eventually, the principles of
00:41:17.37\00:41:20.94
freedom will be violated
through its legislation system
00:41:20.94\00:41:26.41
and this
experiment is short-lived.
00:41:26.41\00:41:29.62
It's not gonna go on forever
and ever and ever, and we're
00:41:29.62\00:41:31.89
starting to hear, we're
starting to hear dragon-like
00:41:31.89\00:41:37.13
rhetoric, aren't we?
00:41:37.13\00:41:39.46
It's coming through in the
political system, it's coming
00:41:39.46\00:41:41.50
through.
00:41:41.50\00:41:42.70
>>JAMES: Well, it's getting
louder and louder and louder.
00:41:42.70\00:41:44.00
>>TY: Yeah, anything
that comes from the American
00:41:44.00\00:41:45.97
political system, would
this be an exaggeration?
00:41:45.97\00:41:48.77
Anything coming from the
American political system that
00:41:48.77\00:41:51.91
encroaches upon freedom is
tending in the direction of
00:41:51.91\00:41:57.15
the dragon-like principles.
00:41:57.15\00:41:59.88
>>JEFFREY:
Coercion is the main issue.
00:41:59.88\00:42:02.12
The main issue is coercion.
00:42:02.12\00:42:04.29
The eroding of freedom and why?
00:42:04.29\00:42:05.79
Because the gospel principle
is the principle of freedom.
00:42:05.79\00:42:10.53
>>TY: Now, there's another
way the passage says this.
00:42:10.53\00:42:11.69
>>JEFFREY: If you know the
truth, the truth shall set you
00:42:11.69\00:42:13.03
free.
00:42:13.03\00:42:14.20
>>TY: It says, in verse 11,
that the lamb-like power will
00:42:14.20\00:42:16.33
speak like a dragon, it says
it'll exercise authority, it
00:42:16.33\00:42:19.30
says it will cause those who
dwell on the earth to worship
00:42:19.30\00:42:24.51
the first beast.
00:42:24.51\00:42:25.61
Now, we have to pause
and remember, who's the first
00:42:25.61\00:42:26.74
beast?
00:42:26.74\00:42:27.68
Well, that's the sea beast.
00:42:27.68\00:42:29.14
That's the one in chapter 13,
verses 1-10 that's being dealt
00:42:29.14\00:42:33.38
with.
00:42:33.38\00:42:34.48
So, essentially, this is
saying that the United States
00:42:34.48\00:42:37.39
of America, which was founded
on no king, no pope, that
00:42:37.39\00:42:41.76
pulled away from papal
dominance, will gradually
00:42:41.76\00:42:46.03
begin to return to papal
principles and papal loyalty,
00:42:46.03\00:42:53.80
right?
00:42:53.80\00:42:54.60
Isn't that what
this is telling us?
00:42:54.60\00:42:56.34
It'll make an image.
00:42:56.34\00:42:57.74
>>JAMES: It will
reflect that same system.
00:42:57.74\00:42:59.64
>>TY: It says in
verse, where is it?
00:42:59.64\00:43:01.84
In verse 14, it says that, it
says that the beast that comes
00:43:01.84\00:43:05.41
up out of the earth will
make an image to the beast, that
00:43:05.41\00:43:09.18
is, it will institute a
governmental system at some
00:43:09.18\00:43:12.65
point that reflects the
way the papacy, the medieval
00:43:12.65\00:43:16.29
church governed down
through the dark ages.
00:43:16.29\00:43:18.46
>>JAMES: And this is an
important point, because
00:43:18.46\00:43:19.63
sometimes, when people read
that image, they think, it's
00:43:19.63\00:43:21.26
gonna be some kind of image,
like an image that they're
00:43:21.26\00:43:23.70
gonna set up in the plane of
Durer, like an image that you,
00:43:23.70\00:43:26.10
no, it's a reflection.
00:43:26.10\00:43:28.10
It's like, when you look
in the mirror and you see an
00:43:28.10\00:43:29.77
image of yourself.
00:43:29.77\00:43:31.04
This power is going to
image, or reflect, the same
00:43:31.04\00:43:34.18
principles that that power has.
00:43:34.18\00:43:36.34
>>TY: And what was it?
00:43:36.34\00:43:37.25
What, how did the
medieval church govern?
00:43:37.25\00:43:40.42
It was by a union
of church and state.
00:43:40.42\00:43:43.42
>>JAMES: Which is why it
says that it has these two
00:43:43.42\00:43:45.45
lamb-like horns, but
then it speaks like a dragon.
00:43:45.45\00:43:48.62
>>TY: So, we can expect
the United States of America to
00:43:48.62\00:43:50.23
join church and state,
is that what we're saying?
00:43:50.23\00:43:54.10
>>JAMES: Impudiate
the principles of the
00:43:54.10\00:43:55.96
constitution.
00:43:55.96\00:43:57.13
>>DAVID: Correct, so that
these things that Jeffrey read
00:43:57.13\00:43:58.87
will be in, they'll be in
print, you know, you can't
00:43:58.87\00:44:02.67
unwrite history, the ink
is dry, but it won't be in
00:44:02.67\00:44:05.17
practice, you're onto it.
00:44:05.17\00:44:06.24
That was exactly what I
was gonna say, well done.
00:44:06.24\00:44:08.44
So, we have verse 12,
causes the earth, verse 14, and
00:44:08.44\00:44:13.11
deceives those who dwell on
the earth by those signs which
00:44:13.11\00:44:14.82
he was granted to do in
the sight of the beast, telling
00:44:14.82\00:44:16.85
those who dwell on the earth
to make an image to the beast
00:44:16.85\00:44:18.99
who was wounded by
the sword and lived.
00:44:18.99\00:44:20.36
Verse 15, he was granted power
to give breath to the image of
00:44:20.36\00:44:23.49
the beast, that the image
of the beast should both speak
00:44:23.49\00:44:26.49
and cause as many who would
not worship the image of the
00:44:26.49\00:44:29.23
beast should be killed.
00:44:29.23\00:44:30.73
So, this is not just like,
hey, we advise you to worship,
00:44:30.73\00:44:33.23
this is like, do it or else.
00:44:33.23\00:44:34.60
You've talked about the
conquistadors coming to was it
00:44:34.60\00:44:36.74
Peru?
00:44:36.74\00:44:38.04
Sword, crucifix,
do as we say, or else.
00:44:38.04\00:44:43.35
Verse 16, he causes all, both
small and great, rich and poor,
00:44:43.35\00:44:47.15
free and slaved, to receive
a mark on the right hand.
00:44:47.15\00:44:49.88
>>TY: Translation, this is
foretelling a resurgence of
00:44:49.88\00:44:53.25
persecution in the new world.
00:44:53.25\00:44:55.86
>>JEFFREY: Coercion, yeah.
00:44:55.86\00:44:57.09
>>TY: Persecution, coercion.
00:44:57.09\00:44:58.93
>>JEFFREY: Which is mirroring
what took place with the
00:44:58.93\00:45:02.46
previous beast.
00:45:02.46\00:45:03.47
>>DAVID: And it is
interesting, 'cause it's in
00:45:03.47\00:45:05.07
this context that the whole
mark of the beast thing comes
00:45:05.07\00:45:07.80
up.
00:45:07.80\00:45:08.94
There's a lot of, you
know, discussion and what is the
00:45:08.94\00:45:10.11
mark of the beast?
00:45:10.11\00:45:11.14
And for some, it's like
a mystical tattoo or some
00:45:11.14\00:45:13.11
computer chip or something,
but it's in this context of
00:45:13.11\00:45:16.98
coercion by the second beast
the United States who's now
00:45:16.98\00:45:20.25
acting, behaving, and looking
a whole lot like that first
00:45:20.25\00:45:23.59
beast, that period through
the medieval period, that church
00:45:23.59\00:45:27.42
of the medieval period, verse
17, and that no one may buy or
00:45:27.42\00:45:30.96
sell except the one who has
the mark of the beast or the
00:45:30.96\00:45:34.20
number of his name, last
verse here, hear his wisdom, let
00:45:34.20\00:45:36.80
anyone who has understanding
calculate the number of the
00:45:36.80\00:45:38.47
beast, it is the number
of a man, his number is 666.
00:45:38.47\00:45:42.04
>>JAMES: David, one phrase
that you missed there in verse
00:45:42.04\00:45:43.57
17 that I really wanted
to highlight, that's why I
00:45:43.57\00:45:46.07
noticed it, and no man might
buy or sell save he that have
00:45:46.07\00:45:50.18
the mark of the beast
or the name of the beast.
00:45:50.18\00:45:53.11
The name of the beast speaks
to the characteristics of the
00:45:53.11\00:45:56.12
beast and why this is
important is because, what
00:45:56.12\00:45:57.82
we've outlined here is
that the beast is using force.
00:45:57.82\00:46:01.42
The beast is hypocritical,
lamb-like principles but
00:46:01.42\00:46:03.99
speaks like a dragon.
00:46:03.99\00:46:05.09
The beast is filled with
deception, miracles, deceiving
00:46:05.09\00:46:09.03
those.
00:46:09.03\00:46:10.03
The beast is into control.
00:46:10.03\00:46:11.37
All of these are principles of
the character of the beast and
00:46:11.37\00:46:15.64
we can think that we're in
the right church, we're in the
00:46:15.64\00:46:17.71
right denomination, we're
believing the right doctrines,
00:46:17.71\00:46:19.77
the right truths, but if
we're developing principles of
00:46:19.77\00:46:22.18
control and deception and
force, if we're developing the
00:46:22.18\00:46:26.38
characteristics of the
beast, we're gonna go along...
00:46:26.38\00:46:29.02
>>TY: In any of
our relationships.
00:46:29.02\00:46:30.85
>>JAMES: Yes.
00:46:30.85\00:46:31.65
>>DAVID: And
that's a great point.
00:46:31.65\00:46:32.79
>>JAMES: We are gonna
go along with the system.
00:46:32.79\00:46:34.12
Once the system comes
together, we're gonna go along
00:46:34.12\00:46:36.36
with the system because
we've been developing his
00:46:36.36\00:46:38.56
principles.
00:46:38.56\00:46:39.73
>>TY: And what if your whole
way of processing reality is
00:46:39.73\00:46:45.60
based on self-preservation?
00:46:45.60\00:46:48.50
When it comes down to no
man can buy or sell, which is
00:46:48.50\00:46:51.51
economic pressure, this is
economic sanctions, nation to
00:46:51.51\00:46:55.38
nation, economic
boycott within a nation.
00:46:55.38\00:46:59.11
If there are restrictions
on commerce, that's a heavy
00:46:59.11\00:47:02.95
pressure to be placed on.
00:47:02.95\00:47:04.45
If self-preservation is
the core of your operating
00:47:04.45\00:47:09.26
system...
00:47:09.26\00:47:10.53
>>JEFFREY: Which it is
for most people, naturally.
00:47:10.53\00:47:12.36
>>TY: Including us around this
table, the gospel liberates us
00:47:12.36\00:47:14.83
from it.
00:47:14.83\00:47:16.13
>>JAMES: And we love not
our lives unto the death.
00:47:16.13\00:47:17.43
>>DAVID: I was just gonna,
man, we got this thing going
00:47:17.43\00:47:19.27
on.
00:47:19.27\00:47:20.47
>>TY: So, if self-preservation
is the core of our operating
00:47:20.47\00:47:24.77
system as human beings,
then when you come under this
00:47:24.77\00:47:28.14
pressure, you're gonna go
along with the system that
00:47:28.14\00:47:32.01
preserves you.
00:47:32.01\00:47:33.08
Who is it that said
that if you, what is it?
00:47:33.08\00:47:37.89
If you sacrifice freedom for
security, you'll have neither.
00:47:37.89\00:47:42.86
>>JAMES: We need to download
the newest operating system.
00:47:42.86\00:47:46.43
Download, download from heaven.
00:47:46.43\00:47:49.83
The newest operating system.
00:47:49.83\00:47:51.13
>>JEFFREY: He's
like spelling it out.
00:47:51.13\00:47:52.83
Download.
00:47:52.83\00:47:54.67
From up there.
00:47:54.67\00:47:56.60
>>TY: So, do you
see what I'm saying?
00:47:56.60\00:47:58.17
The point here is really that
we need to put in our hearts
00:47:58.17\00:48:07.02
the principle of
non-coercive love, in all our
00:48:07.02\00:48:10.29
relationships.
00:48:10.29\00:48:11.39
>>DAVID: Ty, I've
gotta tell you something.
00:48:11.39\00:48:13.02
One of the things that I
love that you say, we all have
00:48:13.02\00:48:14.66
language that becomes ours and
we own it and we use it and it
00:48:14.66\00:48:18.63
just comes out of our
mouths very quickly and easily.
00:48:18.63\00:48:20.76
There's a phrase that you
say with regularity that I
00:48:20.76\00:48:23.57
absolutely love and
it's relational integrity.
00:48:23.57\00:48:26.77
Okay, so you say that a
lot, what does that mean?
00:48:26.77\00:48:31.14
>>TY: Relational integrity
is a phrase that I started using
00:48:31.14\00:48:36.64
because the word love has been
so hijacked in society to mean
00:48:36.64\00:48:41.92
kind of a shallow, sentimental
emotionalism, you know, it's
00:48:41.92\00:48:47.62
in pop culture, most songs
are love songs, I love peanut
00:48:47.62\00:48:51.19
butter and jelly, I love
this woman, but I don't love her
00:48:51.19\00:48:53.60
anymore because here's another
woman and there's relational
00:48:53.60\00:48:57.33
violation.
00:48:57.33\00:48:58.67
But that's all called love.
00:48:58.67\00:49:00.17
And so, I
thought, you know what?
00:49:00.17\00:49:01.54
The word love, what does it
mean when the bible says the
00:49:01.54\00:49:05.01
word love?
00:49:05.01\00:49:06.07
Well, when the bible
uses the word love, it means
00:49:06.07\00:49:08.68
others-centeredness, it
means relational integrity.
00:49:08.68\00:49:12.15
It means I don't violate
you to preserve or serve myself.
00:49:12.15\00:49:16.65
So, relational integrity is
just my way of describing what
00:49:16.65\00:49:19.89
the bible calls love.
00:49:19.89\00:49:21.52
>>DAVID: So, what you
are saying here is that these
00:49:21.52\00:49:23.86
principles, this is not just
something that is happening on
00:49:23.86\00:49:25.93
a national level, a
governmental level, a
00:49:25.93\00:49:27.86
political level.
00:49:27.86\00:49:29.03
These principles, that's
the name of the beast thing that
00:49:29.03\00:49:31.20
you're talking about, they can
infiltrate and infect our own
00:49:31.20\00:49:35.70
relationships with other people.
00:49:35.70\00:49:37.24
We can manipulate a situation,
we can be coercive, we can be
00:49:37.24\00:49:40.38
deceptive, we can tell
half-truths, we can, all the
00:49:40.38\00:49:43.01
while, thinking, how can
I get the upper hand in this
00:49:43.01\00:49:46.85
marriage, in this neighborly
relationship, in my home?
00:49:46.85\00:49:50.99
That's the way that we
do, that's the way that we do
00:49:50.99\00:49:54.86
life.
00:49:54.86\00:49:55.62
It's just natural.
00:49:55.62\00:49:56.76
I just read recently that
children learn, this is all
00:49:56.76\00:49:58.96
over the world,
all over the world.
00:49:58.96\00:50:00.96
I'm reading a book right
now called the mother tongue by
00:50:00.96\00:50:02.40
Bill Bryson and he says many
fascinating things and one of
00:50:02.40\00:50:04.07
the things he says in
there is that in every culture,
00:50:04.07\00:50:06.94
children learn to
say no quicker than yes.
00:50:06.94\00:50:12.07
Every culture, that's
who we are, no, hey, you, no.
00:50:12.07\00:50:17.28
There's not a natural
affability, cooperation, hey,
00:50:17.28\00:50:24.35
can we, it's me, and
you're doing something, no, no.
00:50:24.35\00:50:28.16
The whole issue of
selfishness, it's a, somebody
00:50:28.16\00:50:30.96
talked about Romans 8 a while
back, the carnality, the....
00:50:30.96\00:50:35.26
>>TY: The human heart
has enmity against God.
00:50:35.26\00:50:37.17
>>DAVID: Enmity
against God, Romans 8:7.
00:50:37.17\00:50:38.87
So, if we don't have the
gospel, if we don't download
00:50:38.87\00:50:42.94
the gospel operating system,
we will go along with this,
00:50:42.94\00:50:48.31
this is the
religion of human nature.
00:50:48.31\00:50:50.65
>>TY: Ideologically, we
don't agree with it, but if
00:50:50.65\00:50:53.55
relationally and emotionally
we go along with it, we'll
00:50:53.55\00:50:57.85
violate our
intellectual opinions.
00:50:57.85\00:51:01.19
To save ourselves...
00:51:01.19\00:51:03.99
>>DAVID: Are you ready for this?
00:51:03.99\00:51:05.13
Though all men
will deny you, not me.
00:51:05.13\00:51:10.13
See, he's intellectually
saying, I will lay down myself
00:51:10.13\00:51:13.77
for you, but when the rubber
met the road, uh, yeah, I'm
00:51:13.77\00:51:16.84
out.
00:51:16.84\00:51:18.34
>>TY: That's right.
00:51:18.34\00:51:19.91
>>JAMES: You know, it's really
interesting because when you
00:51:19.91\00:51:21.48
take this analogy a little
bit further with computers, you
00:51:21.48\00:51:24.21
know, you not only have to
keep your computer operating
00:51:24.21\00:51:27.18
system updated, 'cause you
got fixes, fixes, fixes, fixes.
00:51:27.18\00:51:31.12
>>TY: You got a lot of fixes
if you have a PC, not as many
00:51:31.12\00:51:33.05
if you have an Apple.
00:51:33.05\00:51:34.42
>>JAMES: But at some point,
you may have to trade out your
00:51:34.42\00:51:37.89
equipment for another piece
of equipment in order to go a
00:51:37.89\00:51:41.33
little further with the fixes
and the operating system that
00:51:41.33\00:51:44.13
is progressing.
00:51:44.13\00:51:45.30
In other words, the path
of the just is a shining light
00:51:45.30\00:51:48.07
that shines more and
more into the perfect day.
00:51:48.07\00:51:50.04
And God can only show us so
much, and as we've looked it,
00:51:50.04\00:51:52.97
just to summarize, we've
looked at bible prophecies,
00:51:52.97\00:51:55.58
we've looked at the book of
Revelation, we've been on this
00:51:55.58\00:51:57.65
progression, and we went
into this dark period, this dark
00:51:57.65\00:52:00.62
pit, and we came out of this
pit and then, God brought us
00:52:00.62\00:52:04.09
back to the track of
progression, the light of
00:52:04.09\00:52:06.29
progression.
00:52:06.29\00:52:07.42
And it's as if we've been
trading in these models, you
00:52:07.42\00:52:12.83
remember when we had our
first $5,000 portable computer,
00:52:12.83\00:52:16.03
black and white, small little
thing that weighed about 50
00:52:16.03\00:52:18.10
pounds, right?
00:52:18.10\00:52:19.57
>>TY: He's really old.
00:52:19.57\00:52:20.77
>>JEFFREY: Older than
you, that was ages ago.
00:52:20.77\00:52:23.27
>>JAMES: We've traded in
these models, and it's the same
00:52:23.27\00:52:25.27
thing with us, we have to
look at the scripture, just like
00:52:25.27\00:52:27.68
when we looked at Revelation
13, we said, you know what, I
00:52:27.68\00:52:31.01
think those two principles
are coexisting from the very
00:52:31.01\00:52:34.52
beginning.
00:52:34.52\00:52:35.68
I don't think the dragon-like
principles just appear one
00:52:35.68\00:52:38.39
day.
00:52:38.39\00:52:39.62
We can actually trace them all
the way back, we can actually
00:52:39.62\00:52:42.26
see, but the lamb-like
principles were dominant.
00:52:42.26\00:52:46.09
They were dominant.
00:52:46.09\00:52:47.00
>>TY: They're gonna
become less dominant.
00:52:47.00\00:52:48.26
>>JAMES: They're
gonna become less dominant.
00:52:48.26\00:52:49.53
>>DAVID: You lost me
on the computer thing.
00:52:49.53\00:52:52.00
>>JAMES: The
point I'm making is...
00:52:52.00\00:52:53.20
>>DAVID: I think it's a good
point, I just wanna understand
00:52:53.20\00:52:55.04
it.
00:52:55.04\00:52:56.07
>>JEFFREY: That was
like the first thing he said.
00:52:56.07\00:52:58.01
>>JAMES: I'm cleaning out my
office and I have two Macs in
00:52:58.01\00:53:00.91
there, old, old Macs.
00:53:00.91\00:53:03.35
>>TY: Oh, you
gotta give those to me.
00:53:03.35\00:53:04.85
>>JAMES: They're
just sitting there.
00:53:04.85\00:53:05.91
There's nothing I
can do with those.
00:53:05.91\00:53:07.85
>>TY: You can give them to me.
00:53:07.85\00:53:08.85
>>JAMES: They're super old.
00:53:08.85\00:53:09.92
They can't take a new
operating system, so when we
00:53:09.92\00:53:13.66
go back in history, there's a
certain place in history where
00:53:13.66\00:53:16.16
we make a transition, we
transition out of this mother
00:53:16.16\00:53:19.39
church.
00:53:19.39\00:53:20.73
Then, we transition out of
this Protestant churches and
00:53:20.73\00:53:23.16
we transition into this advent
movement, you see what I'm
00:53:23.16\00:53:25.10
saying?
00:53:25.10\00:53:26.13
We're making these
transitions, yes, so we're not
00:53:26.13\00:53:28.20
just downloading, we're
also upgrading, we're upgrading,
00:53:28.20\00:53:31.24
we're upgrading.
00:53:31.24\00:53:32.41
And what I'm saying, just
to bring it to a conclusion, is
00:53:32.41\00:53:34.11
this, we have, for a long
time, emphasized the idea that
00:53:34.11\00:53:39.11
the mark of the beast is
all about, let's say, a day that
00:53:39.11\00:53:42.48
we worship.
00:53:42.48\00:53:43.62
But what we're talking
about right now, we're upgrading
00:53:43.62\00:53:45.85
now.
00:53:45.85\00:53:47.06
We're downloading some bugs
and fixes and we're realizing,
00:53:47.06\00:53:48.76
you know, it's about
principles, it's about
00:53:48.76\00:53:50.63
character, it's about the
way that we relate to people,
00:53:50.63\00:53:54.36
especially the people
that we're closest to.
00:53:54.36\00:53:56.70
It's about the principles that
make up the character of God
00:53:56.70\00:54:00.97
and the seal of God, or
the principles that make up the
00:54:00.97\00:54:03.34
name or the
character of the beast.
00:54:03.34\00:54:06.27
>>DAVID: I love all of that.
00:54:06.27\00:54:09.18
Something that I feel like
I need to do, just for myself,
00:54:09.18\00:54:12.98
is to go back to Revelation
12 because we didn't really wrap
00:54:12.98\00:54:17.75
up 13-17, but it
won't be difficult to do.
00:54:17.75\00:54:21.19
>>JAMES: 17 especially.
00:54:21.19\00:54:22.06
>>DAVID: Exactly.
00:54:22.06\00:54:23.26
That's the point I wanna get
to is 17, but this will not be
00:54:23.26\00:54:25.29
difficult to do.
00:54:25.29\00:54:26.59
>>TY: Do it.
00:54:26.59\00:54:27.76
>>DAVID: Revelation 12:13,
now, when the dragon saw that
00:54:27.76\00:54:30.07
he had been cast to the earth,
he persecuted the woman who
00:54:30.07\00:54:32.23
gave birth to the male
child, we've talked about that.
00:54:32.23\00:54:34.24
That's the persecution by
the dragon of Christ, verse 14,
00:54:34.24\00:54:39.94
not of the dragon by Christ,
but of Christ by the dragon.
00:54:39.94\00:54:44.25
But the woman was given
two wings of a great eagle that
00:54:44.25\00:54:46.38
she might fly into the
wilderness to her place, where
00:54:46.38\00:54:48.22
she is nourished for a time,
times and half, and time from
00:54:48.22\00:54:50.22
the presence of the serpent.
00:54:50.22\00:54:51.22
We've dealt with that, right?
00:54:51.22\00:54:52.32
Verse 15, so the serpent
spewed water out of its mouth,
00:54:52.32\00:54:54.82
like a flood, after the woman,
that he might cause him to be
00:54:54.82\00:54:56.73
carried away by the flood.
00:54:56.73\00:54:57.73
You've dealt with this, James.
00:54:57.73\00:54:59.16
Verse 16, but the earth
helped the woman, and the earth
00:54:59.16\00:55:02.90
opened up its mouth and
swallowed the flood which the
00:55:02.90\00:55:05.10
dragon has
spewed out of its mouth.
00:55:05.10\00:55:06.60
Okay, so we've
covered that territory, right?
00:55:06.60\00:55:08.27
But here's what I love, verse
17, which I don't think we've
00:55:08.27\00:55:11.27
dealt with.
00:55:11.27\00:55:12.47
The dragon was enraged with
the woman and went to make war
00:55:12.47\00:55:15.38
with the rest of her
offspring, who keep the
00:55:15.38\00:55:18.71
commandments of God and
have the testimony of Jesus.
00:55:18.71\00:55:21.18
I'm gonna make one point
and then I'm gonna let you guys
00:55:21.18\00:55:22.68
wrap it up.
00:55:22.68\00:55:23.89
The dragon makes war against
the church of God, against the
00:55:23.89\00:55:27.99
people of God, against
the remnants, God's people on
00:55:27.99\00:55:30.46
earth, and the means by
which he makes war are these two
00:55:30.46\00:55:34.56
beasts.
00:55:34.56\00:55:35.70
That springs us into chapter 13.
00:55:35.70\00:55:38.70
The first beast, which is
the medieval church, and the
00:55:38.70\00:55:41.00
second beast is going to
be the United States, and it's
00:55:41.00\00:55:44.51
this confederacy
of the whole world.
00:55:44.51\00:55:48.64
I just wanna make that point.
00:55:48.64\00:55:51.38
These two beasts don't
just show up and rocket out of
00:55:51.38\00:55:53.58
nowhere.
00:55:53.58\00:55:54.85
It's like, hey, the dragon
went to make war with God's
00:55:54.85\00:55:56.69
people and these are the means
by which that war was made.
00:55:56.69\00:56:01.29
First beast, second beast.
00:56:01.29\00:56:03.26
>>TY: So, essentially, what
we've discovered in Revelation
00:56:03.26\00:56:05.89
chapter 13 is that the sea
beast, the first beast is the
00:56:05.89\00:56:12.13
medieval church and
it operated by certain
00:56:12.13\00:56:15.04
principles, governing
by certain principles.
00:56:15.04\00:56:18.17
The second beast comes
into existence and operates by
00:56:18.17\00:56:22.08
principles of liberty and
freedom, but eventually, what
00:56:22.08\00:56:25.85
we're going to see
happen, I mean, the bible is
00:56:25.85\00:56:28.48
prophesying, it's
saying, this is us.
00:56:28.48\00:56:31.19
Where it's headed is the
United States of America will,
00:56:31.19\00:56:34.49
at some point, abandon the
principles of freedom in favor
00:56:34.49\00:56:39.33
of reconstituting a system
of religious coercion like the
00:56:39.33\00:56:44.80
first beast before it.
00:56:44.80\00:56:47.10
That's where we've landed.
00:56:47.10\00:56:49.17
[Music]
00:56:49.17\00:56:52.24