The following program
discusses sensitive issues.
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Parents are
cautioned that some material
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may be too candid
for younger children.
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Welcome to the New Journey,
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where you meet real life people
with real life testimonies
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and real life
working ministries for Jesus.
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I'm your host Aaron Chancy.
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Come join us on The New Journey.
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Welcome to The New Journey.
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We have an exciting program
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that I think you'll
find very interesting.
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I want to welcome Mr.
Howard to the program.
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Welcome. All right. Thank you.
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Mr. Howard, you were
involved in prison ministries
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for a number of years.
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How long were you
involved in prison ministries?
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And what motivated
you to get involved?
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Okay. I want to share
one correction on that.
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I'm still involved
in prison ministry.
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Praise the Lord. Okay.
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I have been
involved in prison ministries
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for over 30 years.
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I was trying to figure
it out but over 30 years.
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But I guess the
thing that drew me
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to prison ministry was
that people were there.
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Okay. Okay.
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It seemed like a lot
of people were in prison,
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had been in prison and
someone has to speak to them.
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Okay. Okay.
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Now what is your
background for yourself?
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Aside from prison ministries,
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what is your background
that eventually led you to that?
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Well, I would have to say that
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it was kind of a
different thing for me.
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Because eventually yes,
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I got involved
with prison ministry
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and as you know health ministry.
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But what drew me to
that was a friend of mine
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had joined prison
ministry and invited me
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to become
involved but I was already.
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I joined the Seventh-day
Adventist church in 1975.
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I was a young college student
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so I decided I was
already into Bible study.
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But you yourself, you
hadn't been incarcerated
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before with no
criminal history...
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Never I've been incarcerated.
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And that's what I
find interesting is
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because you weren't actually
living that kind of lifestyle.
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But you had a desire or
God gave you that desire
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to work in that aspect.
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And that's what I
want you to touch on?
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Well, let's little disclosure,
I grew up in the hood
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so I was a breath on
by those same people.
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You know, I knew people
who were into a lot of things
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and only by the grace of God
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and the strong hand of my mother
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that I did not
actually get involved.
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But it was a
familiar lifestyle to me.
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Okay. Okay.
Definitely. Definitely.
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Now do you think
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or why do you think
it's important for people
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to get involved
with prison ministries?
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Well, I think that
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if people would really look
at it prison is a microcosm.
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It's almost the exact same thing
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that you see on the
outside, it goes on there.
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There's drugs. There's,
you know, deviant behavior.
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That's true.
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There's all sorts of
things, there's corruption,
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there's good people.
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So it's really the same.
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So I think if
we looked at it is,
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why are we
involved in the world.
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Okay. Okay.
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We're involved in the
prison for the same reason
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to reach people
that God wants to reach.
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Now for a person especially
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that has not been
incarcerated before.
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But they see the need,
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you know, they see the
need to go inside of prisons
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to minister to individuals.
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But they have
that fear within them.
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They have that fear of actually
going behind those gates,
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behind those walls and
actually talking to people.
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How can an
individual get over that fear
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to actually get
into the prison system?
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Well, I think really
it's about meeting people
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and not about thinking about
the clank of the doors, right.
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I like the way it you put that.
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Right, you know,
because it's like telling people
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go out and witness.
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A lot of people
are afraid of going out
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and meeting people in general.
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So when you put them
in a box to meet people,
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it's just
heights to fear, right?
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But really the excitement for me
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was really about
meeting those people
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and as I knew some people
in different circumstance,
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I think the first time I
went to prison was locally.
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I've done state
and local prisons
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and halfway houses and
other things like that.
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So when I first met
people, it was just a rush.
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Because I didn't realize
that they would be giving me
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as much as I'm giving them.
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So I think the person
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who is thinking
about getting involved
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in prison ministry
should understand that
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that you will get
as much from going
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and ministering to
them as you will give them.
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Praise the
Lord. Praise the Lord.
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Now you said you've done
some state and some local.
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Where have you done?
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Where have you
been at in the prisons?
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What states? What
towns, things like that?
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Most of it I think was in Ohio.
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I did some in
Indiana a few times
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just kind of as a guest
but most of it was in Ohio.
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We did Chillicothe Correctional,
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Ross
Correctional, Warren County,
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a lot of jails
and halfway houses,
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there are a
number of halfway houses.
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And I've done some other things
that with juveniles as well.
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So it's been a
broad mix of things.
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Now from the 30 plus
years of prison ministry
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going into juvenile centers,
jails, prisons, halfway houses,
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what have you seen
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as being some of the
biggest needs of the inmates?
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Well, I think as we
were chatting before,
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you know, I think the
prisoners live the same lives.
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They have health concerns.
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They have family
concerns and issues.
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Money they worry about.
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Some of them worry about money
or what's happening back home.
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So again they don't have
any different needs than we do.
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Really they are the same people.
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I think the difference is,
if you think about yourself
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and I'm sure you
can relate to this.
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When you're in prison
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the difference
is the powerlessness
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that most people
feel because you can't.
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If my mom was sick
and I knew she was sick,
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I could say,
"Oh, I got to run over
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and go see my mom."
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If you're incarcerated,
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you just can't get
up and pick a phone.
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But if incarcerated,
it's just on your mind
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all the time,
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you have to think about it
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and you can do nothing about it.
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So I think that what we do
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as an extension
of Christ ministry
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to these people is help them
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have a sense of
continuity of confidence
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and then help them learn
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what they can do for themselves
and what God can do for them.
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Now what's
specifically do you do
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when you go
inside of the prisons?
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And I ask that because times
when I was in prison years ago,
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we had different
ministries, different religions
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who would come in,
they would do programming.
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We also had different people
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like substance abuse
counselors that would come in.
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There were
different education things
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to get your GED.
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There were
something called Project Rio
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at one of the prisons I was at
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which would help
reintegrate individuals back
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into the society.
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But specifically
what are the things
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that you do or have
done over the years,
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30 plus years in
prison ministries
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done in the prisons?
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Well, I would say
when we first went in,
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we would go
especially on the state prisons.
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One of the state
prisons we went to,
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actually we were fortunate,
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the prisoners had a actual
Seventh-day Adventist church
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in the prison.
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They still have it.
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And so they had
deacons, they had elders...
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Now, who were the
deacons and elders?
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The inmates? The inmates.
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I'm talking about the inmates.
I've never heard that before.
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Okay. So it's still going on,
it's a very unusual situation.
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We were involved in helping them
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get rights to do
baptisms and food...
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I'm just curious
who was the pastor?
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Well, okay.
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There was at
that time, at the time
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we did that there was a guy
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that I think
3ABN has done a story,
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his name is Rick Wise.
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And, but he was the pastor
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because he could be
that but in a sense he was.
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He was a really...
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He and another guy Rudy Walker,
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they were the driving force
in that particular ministry.
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But they had a church.
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So we came in and enabled them.
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But later we had to
actually we would do the sermon,
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we would do to help
them do Sabbath school,
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but then we had
to take over that
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because of some
changes in the state law.
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So at first we would do
bring a program to local jails,
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we always and we still do that.
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We kind of bring
set programs, songs,
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testimonies that they do.
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We do, you know,
message and such as that.
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But in that particular instance
we, we're enabling them,
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we're helping them.
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We do Sabbath school and such.
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But then for me it
grew over the years
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that I would bring in,
I would do Bible studies,
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not the set
necessarily Bible studies
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but things that I would make up,
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that would speak to their needs.
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And eventually I
began to do health program
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which was wildly successful.
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And we're going to talk
more about at the end of it.
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And then we did...
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I did Daniel and
Revelation series
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and other series
that would draw people
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because we were
trying to build numbers.
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This was mostly
at Ross Correctional,
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I did this.
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Now, a person wants
to go inside the prison,
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they want to do
basically what you did
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with the Bible studies,
00:10:49.41\00:10:50.75
Daniel Revelation seminars,
set up a church service,
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whatever it may be.
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But what is the
process of an individual
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even trying to be
able to get in to a jail,
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or prison, or juvenile center.
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'Cause you can't
just walk in there
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and just say you know what,
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I want to do
something for the inmates.
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So what is that process
00:11:05.93\00:11:07.56
that an individual has
to go through to be able to
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even get into the prison
to do some ministry work?
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Okay. The first
thing is internal work.
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Okay, okay.
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You want to make sure
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you're going in
for the right reasons.
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I've seen the opposite happened.
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So, but, you want
to go in not thinking,
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I'm going to help these
poor unfortunate people.
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Wow. Yeah. Okay, okay.
00:11:32.65\00:11:34.02
You want to go in
saying, here's a child of God,
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I want to minister to them.
00:11:38.53\00:11:39.86
So basically you have to
change your outlook for them.
00:11:39.89\00:11:41.23
You have to change your outlook
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or your work will
never be affective
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because they can
smell that almost, you know.
00:11:45.43\00:11:48.17
They'll smell that
and say, "Ah, this guy,
00:11:48.20\00:11:50.17
something is wrong with him."
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Yeah. He's a phony. Right.
So that's the first thing.
00:11:51.57\00:11:54.51
But then once
you've dealt with that,
00:11:54.54\00:11:56.51
then you have to investigate
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"what the rules are" for
the particular facilities.
00:11:59.35\00:12:04.05
Some have very stringent rules.
00:12:04.09\00:12:08.09
I mean, to the point
where some places I've gone
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you'd almost be strips.
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You know when you go in there
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where other places
you would just walk in,
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you know, you could
have, you know, it seems like
00:12:20.87\00:12:23.27
you could have carried
a machine gun at first.
00:12:23.30\00:12:25.91
But then they
slowly tighten up too.
00:12:25.94\00:12:29.14
So you got to check out that
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and I would get with
the local prison ministry...
00:12:30.55\00:12:36.65
things in the local areas
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because they will
know specifically,
00:12:38.32\00:12:41.29
but I think that number one
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you want to have something
to say or something to offer.
00:12:44.53\00:12:48.76
Don't just go in
as a blank canvas
00:12:48.80\00:12:50.83
'cause they'll be looking at you
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and you'll be looking at them
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and then you'll
say, oh, let's read this.
00:12:54.47\00:12:56.27
Well, they don't
need you to read that.
00:12:56.30\00:12:58.24
They need you to offer them
something that they don't have.
00:12:58.27\00:13:02.48
So you know, if you don't
have that clear in your mind,
00:13:02.51\00:13:06.41
what it is that you
want to bring to them
00:13:06.45\00:13:10.02
then take a little more time.
00:13:10.05\00:13:12.09
Definitely. Definitely.
00:13:12.12\00:13:13.46
Talk about some
of the instances,
00:13:13.49\00:13:14.92
some of the people
that you have come across
00:13:14.96\00:13:17.23
in the 30 plus
years of prison ministry.
00:13:17.26\00:13:18.99
Talk about the
different instances
00:13:19.03\00:13:21.86
that you've had, the
encounters that you've had
00:13:21.90\00:13:23.73
with these different
people, the different inmates
00:13:23.77\00:13:25.83
that you've dealt
with over the years.
00:13:25.87\00:13:28.07
Boy, there's a lot of those.
00:13:28.10\00:13:30.47
But I tell you one
I'll give you some extremes.
00:13:30.51\00:13:34.31
One extreme was I
was at a local jail.
00:13:34.34\00:13:37.75
Okay. Okay.
00:13:37.78\00:13:39.18
And I was presenting
00:13:39.21\00:13:40.82
and I do it in a
little more unusual way
00:13:40.85\00:13:43.52
because I don't
want to just say,
00:13:43.55\00:13:46.02
"Okay, here's the text
and here's what we do."
00:13:46.05\00:13:49.12
I usually challenge the people,
00:13:49.16\00:13:51.49
you know, I talk about get
them to sense their weakness
00:13:51.53\00:13:56.93
and their failures and
guilt and things like that.
00:13:56.97\00:13:59.97
And then I say, "Well,
God has done away with that,
00:14:00.00\00:14:02.54
now, what you're
going to do with that.
00:14:02.57\00:14:03.91
What do you..."
00:14:03.94\00:14:05.27
You know, so to
get them to move beyond
00:14:05.31\00:14:07.04
what they've done wrong,
00:14:07.08\00:14:09.31
to what God is now going
00:14:09.34\00:14:11.05
to make the
potential for them to do.
00:14:11.08\00:14:14.08
And I was doing
this in this occasion.
00:14:14.12\00:14:17.55
And this man came up to me
00:14:17.59\00:14:19.75
crying at the end of the service
00:14:19.79\00:14:22.46
and I'm thinking,
"Wow what's going on?"
00:14:22.49\00:14:24.76
So I talk to him for a
minute. He was 50 years old.
00:14:24.79\00:14:30.07
And he said, "This is
the first church service
00:14:30.10\00:14:34.40
I've ever been in my life."
00:14:34.44\00:14:37.27
He said, "I've
never experienced this."
00:14:37.31\00:14:41.18
He said, "And I
wasn't going to come today
00:14:41.21\00:14:43.75
but I heard your
voice through the door.
00:14:43.78\00:14:46.48
And I decided to come out."
00:14:46.51\00:14:48.82
And he said,
"This is the first time
00:14:48.85\00:14:50.82
I've ever been in church."
00:14:50.85\00:14:52.19
And he said, "I'm crying
00:14:52.22\00:14:54.82
because I've
missed this all my life."
00:14:54.86\00:14:57.79
Wow. Okay.
00:14:57.83\00:14:59.16
So, wow! What do you say?
00:14:59.19\00:15:02.33
Somebody tells you that's like.
00:15:02.36\00:15:05.07
Okay.
00:15:05.10\00:15:07.50
Praise God.
00:15:07.54\00:15:08.87
I mean, but on
the other extremes
00:15:08.90\00:15:10.47
I've done programming.
00:15:10.51\00:15:13.17
And I really and we'll
talk about this I think.
00:15:13.21\00:15:16.48
But some of the health
programs was interesting
00:15:16.51\00:15:20.08
because we tend to
have stereotypes of
00:15:20.12\00:15:23.49
who we have in the prisons.
00:15:23.52\00:15:26.02
But...
00:15:26.05\00:15:27.39
Now what do you mean by
that stereotypes of those
00:15:27.42\00:15:28.76
we have in prisons?
00:15:28.79\00:15:30.13
Well, it's just like out
here, we kind of pigeonhole
00:15:30.16\00:15:33.03
but we say this person
00:15:33.06\00:15:35.16
is not going to be
interested in this...
00:15:35.20\00:15:36.53
Yeah, we do this.
00:15:36.56\00:15:37.90
This person is not going
to be interested in that.
00:15:37.93\00:15:39.87
Or only these people will
want what I have to offer.
00:15:39.90\00:15:46.17
I remember I was
doing a heath series
00:15:46.21\00:15:48.44
called Divine Medicine.
00:15:48.48\00:15:49.94
Okay. Okay.
00:15:49.98\00:15:51.31
And it was drawing people.
00:15:51.35\00:15:55.15
Normally when I first began at
this prison Ross Correctional,
00:15:55.18\00:15:59.49
we were getting
may be five people
00:15:59.52\00:16:01.86
to come out or something.
00:16:01.89\00:16:03.89
Then I worked out
through the Bible study
00:16:03.93\00:16:05.66
and different things
we were getting 25, 35.
00:16:05.69\00:16:09.36
When I did the health series
00:16:09.40\00:16:11.53
we were getting
85 to 100 people.
00:16:11.57\00:16:14.70
And people were
like, "Whoa." Okay.
00:16:14.74\00:16:18.67
But who these people
were is more interesting.
00:16:18.71\00:16:23.68
We were getting
Muslims by the droves.
00:16:23.71\00:16:27.05
I remember I was
giving a Bible text
00:16:27.08\00:16:29.75
from the New Testament
about clean and unclean foods.
00:16:29.78\00:16:33.42
And I bet you many
Adventists couldn't tell you
00:16:33.46\00:16:36.06
New Testament text
about clean and unclean foods.
00:16:36.09\00:16:39.46
And I gave this text
00:16:39.49\00:16:40.83
and the guy start waving
his hand he say, "Hey..."
00:16:40.86\00:16:43.33
a Muslim man "What is
that Bible text again."
00:16:43.37\00:16:48.24
They were so into it
00:16:48.27\00:16:49.64
we actually had
several other Muslim
00:16:49.67\00:16:52.21
become Seventh-day Adventist.
00:16:52.24\00:16:53.58
Wow. That's amazing. Right.
00:16:53.61\00:16:54.94
But we had
Jehovah's Witnesses come.
00:16:54.98\00:16:59.81
In fact, their
services were at the same time
00:16:59.85\00:17:03.28
as ours were
00:17:03.32\00:17:05.52
and a lot of them
just left and came to ours.
00:17:05.55\00:17:09.52
You know, in fact the
teacher for one of those,
00:17:09.56\00:17:12.89
he actually became vegetarian
00:17:12.93\00:17:14.60
through our helping for
the Jehovah's Witnesses.
00:17:14.63\00:17:16.90
Now what do you think
was the difference between
00:17:16.93\00:17:19.67
before you
implemented the health
00:17:19.70\00:17:21.67
and then you
implemented to help,
00:17:21.70\00:17:23.10
because at first you only
have five to ten people coming.
00:17:23.14\00:17:25.64
Now you have 80 plus
people who are coming.
00:17:25.67\00:17:27.74
What was that
difference that you saw?
00:17:27.78\00:17:29.11
Well, I think
that before I came in
00:17:29.14\00:17:31.68
there was a team of people
00:17:31.71\00:17:33.21
and we were all working together
00:17:33.25\00:17:35.32
and we talked about and I said,
00:17:35.35\00:17:37.49
"We've got to meet life issues."
00:17:37.52\00:17:40.82
So we can't just go in and say,
00:17:40.86\00:17:43.22
"Here's this is Bible
text, this what it means."
00:17:43.26\00:17:47.40
You can't do that.
00:17:47.43\00:17:48.76
You've got to meet
these needs as real people.
00:17:48.80\00:17:51.83
And, man, health was
a phenomenally important
00:17:51.87\00:17:57.31
to the prisoners.
00:17:57.34\00:17:58.87
I mean, and I'll just
give you one other example.
00:17:58.91\00:18:02.74
A guy, he knew what I
was doing as a naturopath,
00:18:02.78\00:18:07.05
and so he had questions
and he said, he came to me,
00:18:07.08\00:18:11.02
he said, "I've been
having this backache
00:18:11.05\00:18:13.76
and my doctor says he
can't figure out what's wrong
00:18:13.79\00:18:18.43
and he's been just giving me
some aspirin, it's not helping.
00:18:18.46\00:18:22.03
What do I need to do?"
00:18:22.06\00:18:23.93
So the Lord put it
in my mind, I said,
00:18:23.97\00:18:26.94
"Your backache is
it about right here?"
00:18:26.97\00:18:30.21
He said, "Yeah,
that's exactly where it is."
00:18:30.24\00:18:33.64
I said, "It's your kidneys."
00:18:33.68\00:18:35.81
I said now normally I
would use some herbs and thing.
00:18:35.84\00:18:39.38
I said, "I'll tell you
what I want you to do though.
00:18:39.41\00:18:42.35
I want you to start
drinking a lot of water."
00:18:42.38\00:18:45.19
But then I set out on
the prison yard over there.
00:18:45.22\00:18:50.03
There's some
weeds growing. Okay.
00:18:50.06\00:18:52.16
Okay. I noticed that.
00:18:52.19\00:18:55.33
And I've shown this guy
00:18:55.36\00:18:57.17
and this guy
where those weeds are.
00:18:57.20\00:19:00.37
And there was dandelions.
00:19:00.40\00:19:02.04
So I said, "You grab
those, get some hot water,
00:19:02.07\00:19:06.84
make a tea out of those."
00:19:06.88\00:19:10.11
And he did this
00:19:10.15\00:19:11.85
and when I saw him
again about two weeks later
00:19:11.88\00:19:15.08
he said, "I have
no more back pain."
00:19:15.12\00:19:16.55
Wow. Praise the Lord.
00:19:16.58\00:19:17.92
"I don't have to
take pills anymore.
00:19:17.95\00:19:19.92
My blood
pressure is better." Okay?
00:19:19.95\00:19:22.46
Okay. Wow.
00:19:22.49\00:19:24.66
If I hadn't approached him
as a normal person I would say,
00:19:24.69\00:19:30.57
"Brother, we're
going to pray for you.
00:19:30.60\00:19:31.93
Let me pray for you now."
00:19:31.97\00:19:34.00
Well, sometimes you
need to do prayer plus.
00:19:34.04\00:19:36.87
Yes, exactly. Okay, okay.
00:19:36.91\00:19:39.34
Now of all this time of
doing prison ministry how often,
00:19:39.37\00:19:42.74
how frequently do you
go inside of the jails,
00:19:42.78\00:19:44.71
in the prisons and
do the health work,
00:19:44.75\00:19:46.61
or do the preaching,
do the church services?
00:19:46.65\00:19:48.32
How frequently do you do this?
00:19:48.35\00:19:49.78
Well, usually
local jails we do...
00:19:49.82\00:19:54.06
Our team was twice a week
00:19:54.09\00:19:55.96
and usually I used to
go we had a small team.
00:19:55.99\00:20:02.06
I would go well,
several times a month locally.
00:20:02.10\00:20:07.60
And then we work
to build the team
00:20:07.64\00:20:11.37
and trained other people so.
00:20:11.41\00:20:13.71
And with my travel schedule now
I still go maybe once a month
00:20:13.74\00:20:18.11
or something like that.
00:20:18.15\00:20:19.51
With the state
prisons I went once a month
00:20:19.55\00:20:24.19
we had Sabbath
service, and then after a while
00:20:24.22\00:20:27.56
I begin to do my
own Sabbath service
00:20:27.59\00:20:30.09
at a different prison.
00:20:30.13\00:20:32.33
And then while another
team went to another prison
00:20:32.36\00:20:35.13
in the same city.
00:20:35.16\00:20:36.67
And then so that
continued that way.
00:20:36.70\00:20:39.30
So it used to be I was doing it
00:20:39.33\00:20:42.07
maybe three or
four times a month.
00:20:42.10\00:20:44.01
Now I do it maybe once a
month or something like that.
00:20:44.04\00:20:46.17
Now you said
earlier that you've been
00:20:46.21\00:20:47.98
in the juvenile centers,
00:20:48.01\00:20:49.34
you've been in
the halfway houses
00:20:49.38\00:20:50.71
and you've been in the prisons.
00:20:50.75\00:20:52.45
What is the difference
with working with the juveniles
00:20:52.48\00:20:55.68
because for myself
I've been incarcerated
00:20:55.72\00:20:57.09
in juvenile center,
00:20:57.12\00:20:58.45
I've been in halfway
house, I've been in jail,
00:20:58.49\00:20:59.82
I've been in
prison, all of them.
00:20:59.85\00:21:01.19
And the juveniles
though are a little bit more,
00:21:01.22\00:21:03.06
you know, bouncing
around doing things.
00:21:03.09\00:21:05.73
What difference did you see
in working with the juveniles
00:21:05.76\00:21:08.60
in doing the same
program as you're doing
00:21:08.63\00:21:10.57
versus working
with the older guys?
00:21:10.60\00:21:11.97
Well, I'll tell you
something interesting
00:21:12.00\00:21:14.04
that I was able to do
00:21:14.07\00:21:15.40
and it's
something the Lord open up,
00:21:15.44\00:21:18.17
I had nothing to do
with it other than just going
00:21:18.21\00:21:20.71
and doing, right?
00:21:20.74\00:21:23.14
I had a situation
where I was able to be paid
00:21:23.18\00:21:28.55
by community and...
00:21:28.58\00:21:34.66
Municipal, local municipal
agencies to do life skill work,
00:21:34.69\00:21:40.90
okay, which is
really we would go in,
00:21:40.93\00:21:44.57
me and another partner,
00:21:44.60\00:21:47.14
I would design these
workshops and we would go in
00:21:47.17\00:21:50.34
and do life skill workshops.
00:21:50.37\00:21:52.81
Okay, where we're
challenging them who are you,
00:21:52.84\00:21:58.68
you know, etc, etc.
00:21:58.71\00:22:00.05
But we were doing it in a way
00:22:00.08\00:22:01.42
that captivated their attention.
00:22:01.45\00:22:03.89
Well, pretty soon these
kids were talking about things
00:22:03.92\00:22:08.96
that you would never think
they would be talking about,
00:22:08.99\00:22:11.09
they were letting go.
00:22:11.13\00:22:12.69
And I challenge them, I
said, once one workshop I did
00:22:12.73\00:22:16.46
it was about the
spirituality of time.
00:22:16.50\00:22:20.60
Now wait, wait what are
you talking about, right?
00:22:20.64\00:22:23.71
Because that's out of the box.
00:22:23.74\00:22:26.47
But I said what time
you get up in the morning
00:22:26.51\00:22:31.28
is driven by a
series of moral decisions
00:22:31.31\00:22:35.48
that you make.
00:22:35.52\00:22:36.85
I said, do you want to...
00:22:36.89\00:22:38.85
What time you get up?
00:22:38.89\00:22:40.86
And they'd say, "Oh,
8 o'clock, 7 o'clock."
00:22:40.89\00:22:46.39
I said, what time
you have to be at school?
00:22:46.43\00:22:48.66
"Ah, 8:15."
00:22:48.70\00:22:50.53
I said, "So how can
you possibly be on time?"
00:22:50.57\00:22:54.87
What makes the
difference between this person
00:22:54.90\00:22:57.54
who has to be there at 8:15.
00:22:57.57\00:22:59.44
They get up at six
and you get up at this
00:22:59.47\00:23:02.21
and I said there's a
whole series of decisions.
00:23:02.24\00:23:05.15
And it was amazing
because at the end of this thing
00:23:05.18\00:23:08.38
this person says, "I'm
going to get up earlier.
00:23:08.42\00:23:11.75
I'm going to prepare my life."
00:23:11.79\00:23:13.99
We have to see
these young people
00:23:14.02\00:23:17.33
as not waste products,
00:23:17.36\00:23:20.13
but a fertile
field that we can say,
00:23:20.16\00:23:25.43
"If I plant seeds,
something will grow.
00:23:25.47\00:23:29.30
But if I don't plant any seeds,
00:23:29.34\00:23:31.47
surely nothing is
going to grow except weeds."
00:23:31.51\00:23:34.21
And that's what
we've kind of had.
00:23:34.24\00:23:36.24
So in the halfway
houses you had people
00:23:36.28\00:23:40.42
who were
transitional on their way out
00:23:40.45\00:23:43.62
or on their way up.
00:23:43.65\00:23:47.39
You know, so what I did was
00:23:47.42\00:23:51.63
it was a ministry of empowerment
00:23:51.66\00:23:53.86
and just like it
is in the prisons.
00:23:53.90\00:23:55.80
We want to help them see
that despite the circumstances
00:23:55.83\00:24:00.10
and I, you know,
dealt with people
00:24:00.14\00:24:02.07
who were facing
long prison sentences.
00:24:02.10\00:24:06.01
And I remember when I
went in and talked to one group
00:24:06.04\00:24:11.41
they were, they had
been there five years
00:24:11.45\00:24:15.75
and now it's like
been 40 years almost
00:24:15.78\00:24:19.55
that he's been
there still strong.
00:24:19.59\00:24:22.56
So we have to encourage
people like that, you know.
00:24:22.59\00:24:25.66
In about two minutes I
want you to talk about,
00:24:25.69\00:24:28.26
prior to the
interview, you told me something
00:24:28.30\00:24:29.63
about a three legged chair.
00:24:29.66\00:24:31.60
Talk to us about that?
00:24:31.63\00:24:32.97
Well, I think, you
know, my approach to ministry
00:24:33.00\00:24:36.07
and my approach to
health is probably different
00:24:36.10\00:24:38.87
than most people.
00:24:38.91\00:24:40.34
Because most of the
time people will go in
00:24:40.38\00:24:43.14
and they'll say, "I'm
going to tell you about
00:24:43.18\00:24:46.01
your backache or
high blood pressure
00:24:46.05\00:24:49.72
and then, oh, let me
tell you about Jesus."
00:24:49.75\00:24:51.69
You know, it is so integrated
00:24:51.72\00:24:55.22
that if I tell
you about your health,
00:24:55.26\00:24:57.26
you're going to
automatically learn about Jesus.
00:24:57.29\00:24:59.93
So we are made
in the image of God.
00:24:59.96\00:25:03.93
Everybody knows
that right so to speak.
00:25:03.97\00:25:07.04
But do you know what that means?
00:25:07.07\00:25:10.31
Okay, Father, Son,
Holy Spirit, three,
00:25:10.34\00:25:15.01
but there's only one God.
00:25:15.04\00:25:16.81
Okay.
00:25:16.85\00:25:18.18
So those three
were interchangeable.
00:25:18.21\00:25:20.75
So us being made
in the image of God,
00:25:20.78\00:25:24.45
there has to be three dimensions
00:25:24.49\00:25:27.49
in this one being,
00:25:27.52\00:25:30.13
moral, which is you
could almost say the operator,
00:25:30.16\00:25:34.80
mental, which is the software,
00:25:34.83\00:25:37.43
physical, which is the hardware.
00:25:37.47\00:25:39.13
Okay, I liked it.
00:25:39.17\00:25:40.50
Which one of those
things can you break up
00:25:40.54\00:25:43.10
and not interrupt the operation.
00:25:43.14\00:25:46.57
If your software is not working
but the hardware is fine,
00:25:46.61\00:25:49.94
you still not
going to do anything.
00:25:49.98\00:25:51.91
Same way with that stool.
00:25:51.95\00:25:54.12
Life is about that
balance of those things.
00:25:54.15\00:25:57.62
So if you've got
mental, moral, physical
00:25:57.65\00:26:02.16
all of those stool
legs need to be stable.
00:26:02.19\00:26:06.39
So if you see one is broken,
00:26:06.43\00:26:10.03
the other two are
going to lean as well.
00:26:10.07\00:26:12.43
So I think that's a
great way to think about it
00:26:12.47\00:26:15.47
is integration
of all these powers
00:26:15.50\00:26:19.44
to heal that whole person.
00:26:19.47\00:26:20.81
So if you go in only
working on the moral part,
00:26:20.84\00:26:25.91
you've got a one
dimensional work...
00:26:25.95\00:26:28.02
Yeah. There is a
deficiency somewhere else.
00:26:28.05\00:26:29.62
There is a
deficiency somewhere else.
00:26:29.65\00:26:31.22
So the work
that God has given us
00:26:31.25\00:26:34.42
is a three dimensional work,
00:26:34.46\00:26:35.89
and I have a
whole series of stuff
00:26:35.92\00:26:37.66
on the three
dimensional living I call it.
00:26:37.69\00:26:40.23
So our ministry to
three dimensional people
00:26:40.26\00:26:44.30
has to be three dimensional.
00:26:44.33\00:26:45.90
Praise the
Lord. Praise the Lord.
00:26:45.93\00:26:47.60
What I want you
to do right now is,
00:26:47.64\00:26:49.70
I want to look into the camera
and take about 30, 40 seconds
00:26:49.74\00:26:53.14
and talk to the individual
that wants to get involved
00:26:53.17\00:26:55.88
but as we stated they
might be scared to get involved,
00:26:55.91\00:26:59.15
or they don't know
how to go about getting
00:26:59.18\00:27:02.48
their record
expunged, or taken care of
00:27:02.52\00:27:05.62
so that they can get
involved in prison ministries
00:27:05.65\00:27:07.66
and go inside of there.
00:27:07.69\00:27:09.29
Talk to that
individual to give them
00:27:09.32\00:27:10.99
some words to get up
and get into the prison
00:27:11.03\00:27:14.03
and be able to do something?
00:27:14.06\00:27:15.76
The first thing and I would
say to anyone that's interested
00:27:15.80\00:27:20.04
in joining prison
ministry is will you be obedient
00:27:20.07\00:27:25.44
to the call of Christ?
00:27:25.47\00:27:26.81
He said for us to
go so we have to go
00:27:26.84\00:27:30.58
but what does that mean.
00:27:30.61\00:27:31.95
When it comes
to prison ministry,
00:27:31.98\00:27:33.62
you don't have to start
off jumping into the jails,
00:27:33.65\00:27:37.99
you can support
with letter writing,
00:27:38.02\00:27:40.16
you can support with
funds, you can send literature.
00:27:40.19\00:27:43.53
If you've got a record already,
00:27:43.56\00:27:45.43
you do have to make some
maybe a little time a year,
00:27:45.46\00:27:49.30
year and a half
they have you wait,
00:27:49.33\00:27:51.53
but then give
yourself the opportunity
00:27:51.57\00:27:54.60
to join with a prison
ministry, get with those people
00:27:54.64\00:27:57.77
and get involved.
00:27:57.81\00:27:59.14
That's the final
thing, get involved.
00:27:59.17\00:28:01.31
Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
00:28:01.34\00:28:02.68
Well, Mr. Howard, we
appreciate you coming on
00:28:02.71\00:28:04.75
and sharing with us
this important work.
00:28:04.78\00:28:07.92
Viewers, we want to
thank you for tuning in.
00:28:07.95\00:28:09.92
Be sure to tune in next time
for another exciting program
00:28:09.95\00:28:12.45
of The New Journey.
00:28:12.49\00:28:13.82