Participants:
Series Code: TDYL
Program Code: TDYL240034B
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00:10 Well, welcome back to the second hour of a very exciting, very
00:15 informative, very engaging program, Lineage. 00:18 And if you missed the first hour, you're going to have to catch it on 00:22 the replay or a couple of days from now. 00:24 But we're talking about Lineage, a ministry that grew from a fledgling 00:29 idea to now more than 300 episodes. 00:33 And we have with us today, Adam... 00:36 Oh, the word blessing is probably... 00:39 It needs more letters. 00:41 Because this is just, it's transforming. 00:44 I mean, Adam... 00:47 Ramden. 00:48 Ramden. 00:49 And Clive Coutay. 00:50 That's right, yeah. 00:51 You know, that's just... 00:52 I worked so hard on remembering your name before I got his. 00:54 Do you both have families? 00:56 We do, yeah. 00:56 Tell us about them. 00:57 So I married 11 years ago this coming Sunday. 01:02 Oh, nice. 01:06 two, Enoch and Eden. 01:09 Oh, I like the name. 01:10 Yeah, they're here with me as well. 01:11 Oh, they're here? 01:12 Wonderful. 01:17 Okay. 01:20 Is she British? 01:21 She is, yes. 01:22 I think we met your wife. 01:23 Yes, she did meet my wife, yes. 01:24 So I have, my eldest is a daughter and then I have three boys. 01:28 Oh, nice. 01:29 Wonderful. 01:31 And so when you say your generation, you're a young man, but 01:34 you're a dad. 01:34 Yes. 01:36 He said it's his generation. 01:40 But thank you for contributing to the generations that need this kind 01:43 of media. 01:48 generations because it's pretty low every class. 01:51 It's phenomenal. 01:55 about the roots, not just Adventist roots, but the Bible roots. 02:00 Christian roots. 02:00 Christian roots, yeah, yeah. 02:02 Identity. 02:03 Identity. 02:07 lot of what you cover, like the book of Revelation is not an 02:10 Adventist book. 02:13 Have you received input from people of different walks of life that 02:16 have watched your series? 02:18 We do, and that's an interesting question because we do hear a lot 02:21 of people that watch lineage in churches or they watch it in 02:25 schools. 02:28 Adventists and so on. 02:35 maybe our immediate faith community. 02:37 One of them is a story that comes from California, actually, and it's 02:40 connected to 3 of them, but I'll let Clive share it because he's the 02:42 one who connected it. 02:44 Yeah, last time we came up on the show, I think it was 2019, on the 02:51 roll, we didn't have a personal, we didn't have a ministry phone 02:54 number. 02:55 So it was actually my personal number. 02:57 Oh, no. 03:00 a blessing. 03:05 was a side project back then. 03:08 And I got a phone call and it was, I picked up the phone, I looked at 03:12 the number first and I didn't quite recognize it and I picked it up and 03:15 it was a machine and the machine said, this is a collect call. 03:21 This person at this prison would like to speak to you. 03:27 I'm thinking in my head, I'm racking my brains and I'm like, you 03:30 know, I've not been in the U.S. 03:31 too long. 03:32 I don't really know anyone in prison. 03:33 If it was the U.K., I'd probably understand, but I don't really know 03:36 anyone in the U.S. 03:38 but I'll just take the call. 03:39 I took it and then it was a guy who picked up and he said, I'm so-and 03:43 -so in prison in California and we have really enjoyed watching your 03:49 show on 3ABN. 03:51 And I think something's happened with the schedule and we're no 03:54 longer able to watch it and I have a group of about 20 to 25 people 03:57 who are studying the Bible and we were able to watch your episodes. 04:02 Would it be possible to donate some of your resources, some books, some 04:07 DVDs or your videos to the prison so that we're able to continue 04:12 studying it with the inmates? 04:14 They can watch it on demand. 04:16 They said there's about 60 people in the prison who don't have 04:20 anything to do and are looking for stuff to digest. 04:23 So he gave me the chaplain's phone number. 04:25 I contacted the chaplain and arranged for him to go to send 04:28 resources. 04:33 resources and then about two weeks later, the guy from the prison 04:37 called me back again and he said, we still haven't received the 04:39 items. 04:39 Did you send them? 04:40 And I was like, yeah, yeah, I sent them. 04:42 Another two weeks passed, he called me back again. 04:44 Did you send the items? 04:46 Like these guys were hungry for the word and I said, I sent them and he 04:52 said, I think they've gone missing somewhere and would you be able to 04:55 send them again? 05:01 comes forward again, you can call me back. 05:04 By the way, he only had two minute phone calls once a week and he was 05:08 using them on me. 05:10 And just to get these resources. 05:13 So eventually he called me really excited saying, we got the 05:15 resources, they cleared. 05:17 Because I think when you send a package to the prison, they have to 05:20 be checked and all the content has to be checked. 05:22 And, you know, I'm guessing the guards would have to watch some of 05:25 that stuff as well. 05:29 he was just so praising the Lord that he was able to find this 05:32 content, study through the Great Controversy, study through some of 05:34 the Reformation, Adventist history, and all started by him watching or 05:39 somehow in the prison being able to watch 3ABN. 05:42 And you know, you asked the question, you know, when did you 05:45 realize this came big? 05:47 For me, it's when I hear stories like that. 05:49 Because it's like, you know, here at 3ABN, you know this as well. 05:53 You have no idea how far the media can go. 05:55 You know, you have no idea who's home or what YouTube channel or a 06:01 prison or what country. 06:02 You know, the work you do is almost a thankless job because you don't 06:05 know, but those stories are really what fire us and keep us going. 06:09 When we meet people in our travels, we just kind of funny story out 06:15 kind of along the same lines we were in Jamaica recently and we 06:19 were in a place called Wyes Falls, which is very inland falls. 06:23 And we're coming down the falls, my wife and her sister are ahead of us 06:26 and of other people. 06:28 All of a sudden this guy says, oh my, what are you doing here? 06:32 And I thought, he caught me off guard. 06:35 He said, I watch you all the time on 3ABN. 06:37 What are you doing here in Jamaica? 06:39 And you realize we are inland in Jamaica, up in the mountains at 06:44 Wyes Falls. 06:45 And you realize even among the young people, because a lot of 06:50 times you would say, well, you know, 3ABN is for a certain age 06:53 group, but not everybody watches it. 06:54 This guy had to be about 15 or 16 years old. 06:56 He said, wait, wait, wait, can I take a picture with you? 06:58 And he's soaking wet. 06:59 And he says, Cameron, you realize it's getting everywhere. 07:02 And we travel around the world and the stories are that way. 07:04 And that's why lineage, going through the window of 3ABN, as a 07:08 matter of fact, kind of go back. 07:10 When did you connect with 3ABN and remember having your programs 07:15 started to be seen through 3ABN? 07:18 2018 and 19, I think it was around then, I think that we had a first 07:21 interview on 3ABN. 07:22 I think it was 2018, the first interview on 3ABN, but another one 07:24 in 2019. 07:26 And I think 3ABN started showing around that time as well, 07:30 broadcasting the episodes back then. 07:33 So we've been really blessed by, you know, 3ABN showing the episodes 07:38 and the breadth of that. 07:41 Yeah, great coverage. 07:45 And yeah, I mean, back to your other questions about, you know, it 07:48 going outside. 07:49 There's another story as well. 07:50 Yes, yes. 07:51 Well, there's a couple of them actually. 07:52 I'll just share one of them. 07:54 And that is, we know a lot of Christian schools or a lot of our 08:01 own church schools show the episodes whether, you know, we have 08:05 friends who are teachers and they use those episodes in the class. 08:08 But it's happened five times that it's come to me. 08:12 I've been in England where I've been approached three times in 08:17 churches. 08:21 and as they're there in the public school, the teachers have used 08:26 lineage in the classroom, religion class or history class, in a public 08:30 school. 08:31 And then just, it was last year as well, one of our team members in 08:34 Australia, she goes to church and two girls came to church on 08:38 Sabbath. 08:42 Anglican school, Adventist girls, but one goes to an Anglican or 08:44 Episcopalian, as they say here, school. 08:46 One goes to a Catholic school and they came to her and said, Hey 08:48 Suki, the teachers are using lineage in our class curriculum. 08:53 She's like, oh really, did you tell the teacher about it? 08:57 Like, you know, you told the teacher. 08:58 She said, no, we didn't tell the teacher anything. 09:00 The teacher found the resources online and put it in the class 09:04 curriculum. 09:07 student is in the class who knows one of us and comes and tells us. 09:11 So we think that maybe it's happening more than that, but we 09:14 just don't know because they don't tell us. 09:16 So we don't know. 09:17 We did some work on our website, trying to optimize the back end 09:20 and... 09:21 You have a wonderful website. 09:23 ...help to rank higher on the Google searches and I think that 09:26 has helped out with people, teachers and looking for resources 09:30 can find it. 09:31 So schools... 09:35 then a teacher can easily just slip it into a class. 09:38 It doesn't change the complete dynamics of the lesson plan. 09:44 But speaking to that, that's why maintaining the legitimacy of the 09:49 chronology of the events that are taking place, the pictures, the 09:52 locations, and that's another bit of time because when you start 09:55 looking at, okay, we're going to be going to this particular location, 09:59 what historical credibility can we add, can we maintain in finding 10:04 dates because people check it out. 10:05 They do. 10:09 date. 10:10 And so thank you for that. 10:12 That I know is just the accuracy. 10:15 The fact checking. 10:19 through the spirit of prophecy in the Bible and you can kind of know 10:22 what took place. 10:23 And then you're reading the artifacts in this actual location. 10:26 You're like, well, that's not quite how it happened. 10:28 You know, this has been transformed to being something that was 10:31 Protestant to almost something that was Catholic. 10:34 So, you know, it really helps to have all the book references to 10:37 have all those things, all the photos, the videos and really 10:40 transport people to those locations. 10:43 Okay, well, here's somebody. 10:47 I think this is a question. 10:48 This is Mark. 10:49 He says, the lineage team is fantastic. 10:54 I love your programs. 10:56 Please provide a program, okay, on the origin of the term Shekinah 11:02 used by Ellen White. 11:04 And then he wrote, bless you in Jesus' name, Mark. 11:07 The Shekinah, that's interesting. 11:09 The Shekinah glory, yeah. 11:11 No, maybe we can do that sometime. 11:13 Thank you, Mark. 11:13 Yeah, thanks, Mark. 11:15 So now talk about some of the resources because we want to talk 11:18 about some of the books that you have. 11:20 Sure, so we have a few, probably as lineage, we've made three of our 11:24 own and then one of our team members has also written two that 11:26 we distribute as well. 11:27 So the three we've made are two educational coloring books, which 11:33 one of our team members who is an illustrator drew all the... 11:35 It's on your website? 11:36 It's on the website, yeah. 11:37 Do we have a graphic of that? 11:38 No, not the coloring book. 11:42 So each page is the original artwork, then there's a write-up 11:46 next to it, there's a fun fact, there's a QR code so when they're 11:49 coloring they can scan the code and go to the video that connects with 11:53 the story. 11:54 So we have a book on the Reformation history, we have a book 11:56 on Adventism. 11:57 They're not thick, they're just thin. 11:59 Coloring books for, I won't say children, but for people, anyone 12:03 who wants to draw. 12:04 So they're educational coloring books. 12:06 Then we have another book called Bringers of the Dawn. 12:09 This one we released in 2021, I think, and that book is like a 12:16 study guide. 12:21 the Reformation. 12:23 There's 48 or 49 chapters in that book. 12:26 Each chapter is about three or five pages long. 12:29 There's pictures in there, original pictures that we've taken. 12:31 And at the end of each chapter, there's about five questions that 12:34 are discussion or reflection questions. 12:36 And then there's also a QR code that you can scan that will take 12:39 you to the video. 12:40 Originally, we made this book as a digital resource. 12:44 It's on the Apple iBook store, and you can download an iBook on there. 12:49 But then we put it into print form, and it's... 12:54 We have a graphic of that one. 12:55 Okay, let's bring the graphic up. 12:56 Yeah, we have a graphic of that one. 12:57 I kind of wanted to touch... 12:58 Oh, here it is. 13:00 Oh, Bringers of the Dawn. 13:01 Bringers of the Dawn, okay. 13:03 Oh, there's books. 13:04 So it's in four. 13:05 Okay, that's the book itself standing on the... 13:08 Yeah, just one single book. 13:10 Okay. 13:10 Oh, look at that. 13:11 And that's another expense. 13:13 We're going to talk about that before the end of the program on 13:16 how you could support this ministry. 13:18 Because to say that support is a worthy factor for what you do is an 13:23 understatement. 13:24 And we know it takes... 13:26 The maintenance of equipment, the updating of equipment, you know, 13:29 laptops, they come out really fast, and after a while, technology just 13:33 morphs the sizes into say, well, we need more RAM, we need newer 13:36 lenses, something needs to be updated. 13:39 And so just kind of give us an overview of how this is maintained, 13:44 I mean, maintenance, because as you mentioned earlier in the program, 13:49 it's expensive, and the team has never been in the same location at 13:53 the same time. 13:54 It's nice if we could. 13:56 Where do you... 13:59 own... 14:00 Training session. 14:03 us at 3ABN and we're going to have a meeting. 14:05 Yeah, that would be nice, yeah. 14:06 But talk about where does... 14:09 Where does all the equipment house? 14:11 I mean, how is it when you get together to do a shoot? 14:14 Okay, bring this and you bring that. 14:15 So most of the video stuff would probably be with myself. 14:19 Our other team member, Jasper, he has his own stuff as well. 14:22 So just in case I'm not able to make a shoot, for some reason, 14:25 Jasper can go with Adam and do it. 14:28 Our photographer has all his own gear. 14:29 It's interesting because when we started this ministry, there was no 14:33 money involved. 14:35 just volunteering their time. 14:37 They're volunteering their mics, their cameras, their photography 14:40 equipment. 14:43 But over time, as the Lord has blessed, we've able to build some 14:45 things up for the ministry. 14:47 But a lot of that is now located in California where I live because of 14:53 I'm the person editing and I'm doing a lot of the filming as well. 14:57 But it kind of varies on what we have. 14:59 You're full time doing this. 15:01 Yeah, so as of this year, as of June 2024, I went full time. 15:07 Adam went full time last year, three quarter time, January last 15:11 year. 15:16 voluntary into full time. 15:18 And obviously that takes a lot more resources, kind of a step out in 15:22 faith. 15:26 get to this point. 15:29 And everyone has been doing it in their own time. 15:33 So all of us have got, most of us have got families and children and 15:36 other jobs and other commitments and just taking time to do this on 15:40 the side to get it to this point. 15:42 And then at one point it gets so big where you're like, okay, we 15:45 can't keep doing two things. 15:47 We have to focus our attention. 15:48 I think that's the stage we're moving towards right now. 15:51 Is it 501C3? 15:52 Yeah, so we're fully 501C3 nonprofit in the U.S. 15:56 So we can issue tax deductible receipts to anybody. 15:58 Wonderful, wonderful, that's going to be good because there are people 16:00 that are saying, man, that's just so many of these episodes. 16:04 We've got to get the other 299 and the continuations of it. 16:07 And we're going to talk about the website there also. 16:10 But now we want to look at a little bit about something that is very 16:13 relevant to today, Liberty of Conscience Threatened. 16:15 We have like an 8 minute video. 16:17 We're going to look at some of that. 16:18 But just kind of talk about that a little bit because sometimes people 16:22 don't know about what that is, Liberty of Conscience Threatened. 16:24 That video is part of our great controversy series. 16:27 It's chapter 35, I believe, in the book, The Controversy of Liberty of 16:30 Conscience Threatened. 16:31 And like you say, it's a very relevant issue right now. 16:35 As it's right now here in the United States, worldwide. 16:40 These are pertinent issues. 16:42 And so that chapter in particular, we wanted to make sure that that 16:45 chapter was filmed as good as we could. 16:48 We filmed part of that on location in Rome and we filmed part of that 16:52 on location in Washington, D.C. 16:54 Outside the Congress, outside the Supreme Court, buildings that, what 16:59 takes place there may have an impact in the future. 17:03 And so that episode I think is very pertinent and that actually may 17:09 play partly into what we may be doing in the future in terms of our 17:13 future plans. 17:18 of Religious Liberty and how it's developed over time. 17:22 Not just in the U.S. 17:23 but kind of around the world. 17:25 Around the world. 17:26 So it's in Washington, D.C. 17:29 and where else? 17:30 We filmed in Washington and Rome. 17:32 In Rome. 17:33 I want to get a chance to look at it. 17:35 If we don't look at the whole thing, we're going to look at the 17:37 greater part of it. 17:38 I think, and as Adam stated and Clive stated, this is an issue 17:42 today that is challenging the world very much here in the United 17:46 States. 17:47 Liberty of Conscience Threatened. 17:48 Check it out. 18:11 During the 16th century, the Protestant Reformation made great 18:15 strides in various countries in Europe, such as Germany, 18:19 Switzerland, England, Scotland and across Scandinavia. 18:23 But here in France, it struggled to get going. 18:26 There were great reformers who were French, such as John Caldron, but 18:30 by and large, the Catholic Church was able to stay as the dominant 18:34 power. 18:40 persecuted. 18:46 thousands of Protestants were killed. 18:54 Throughout the early 1700s, Europe's economy expanded, which 18:59 also led to population growth, with it almost doubling during this 19:03 time. 19:09 meaning it was the largest and most populated country in Europe at the 19:13 time. 19:18 There were several factors to these. 19:20 Among them was a crop failure and also a financial drain from 19:25 France's heavy and prolonged involvement in the American 19:28 Revolution. 19:35 Another contributing factor was the departure of the Huguenots in 1685, 19:40 after many of their rights as citizens were taken away. 19:43 These persecuted Protestants contributed significantly to the 19:47 economy, and their absence was a huge loss. 19:51 At the time, Protestants and Jews were denied full state rights. 19:55 Unemployment was also at an all -time high, and the gap between the 19:58 rich and the poor continued to widen. 20:02 Distrust in the church was also very high, and with a huge 20:05 disparity between the classes, it eventually exploded into a full-on 20:09 revolt against all those in authority. 20:12 Both the ruling classes and also those in religious authority. 20:27 The Age of Enlightenment and the Scientific Revolution led by men 20:32 like Voltaire, Descartes and Rousseau, among others, led to a 20:36 suspicion of the church and distrust in religion in general. 20:40 This was because France, more than any other country during the 20:44 Reformation, was able to suppress the reading of the Bible. 20:47 The Catholic Church retained a stranglehold on French society that 20:52 the Reformation never had the chance to break. 21:01 The suppression of the Bible in France during the French Revolution 21:04 was prophesied in Revelation, Chapter 11, which says that the two 21:08 witnesses, which contextually are the Old and New Testament, would be 21:12 clothed in sackcloth, a reference to the Bible being sidelined and 21:17 disregarded. 21:18 Revelation 11 goes on to say that a beast would ascend out of the 21:22 bottomless pit. 21:23 In Bible prophecy, a beast means a nation or a kingdom, and this one 21:28 would arise at the end of the 1260 -year prophecy around the year 21:32 1798. 21:34 Revelation 11 goes on to say that the great city is spiritually 21:39 called Sodom and Egypt. 21:47 Egypt is a common reference to atheism in the Bible, for no other 21:50 nation so blatantly defied God. 21:52 Exodus 5 verse 2 says, Who is Jehovah that I should obey him? 21:57 Sodom is a common reference to sexual immorality. 22:01 We see both of these characteristics come to pass here 22:03 in France when starting in 1793, for the first time an assembly of 22:08 educated men governing one of the largest nations in Europe, sitting 22:12 in the building behind me, unanimously renounced belief and 22:17 worship of a deity. 22:19 Every nation has had their fair share of atheists, but France 22:22 stands alone as a state which declared there is no God. 22:33 Wow, that is amazing. 22:34 We're looking at the segue of history. 22:37 Talk about how that great controversy has broken up. 22:40 That's a good point, because those who have read the book Great 22:43 Controversy, it's kind of split into two halves. 22:46 You've got the first 20 chapters that are historical. 22:48 It talks about Luther, the Wadenties and so on. 22:51 And you've got the second half that are to talk about doctrinal issues 22:54 and also future prophecy. 22:56 And you may wonder why are there kind of two halves to the book 22:59 Great Controversy. 23:00 Why is one half past and one half is kind of future? 23:03 And I believe the reason is this, because it does talk about in the 23:06 book Great Controversy about the end of time, how liberty of 23:09 conscience will be threatened, how there will be time of trouble or 23:13 the Christians will go through a crisis. 23:15 It explains all of that. 23:16 And as you read those latter chapters you can probably wonder 23:19 how will I live? 23:22 How will I survive during that time period? 23:25 Well, you can find the answer right in the book because you can go back 23:28 to the early chapters with the historical ones and say, Ah, these 23:32 Christians lived during the time when liberty of conscience was 23:35 threatened. 23:37 This is how they lived and this is how... 23:39 But not just what they did, this is more importantly how God protected 23:42 them. 23:43 This is how God led them. 23:44 This is how God orchestrated their journey. 23:47 So the first half is really case studies of how God led his people 23:52 during a time when liberty of conscience was threatened. 23:56 And then the later chapters are describing the future scenario of 24:00 how will live. 24:01 And so to me that's kind of how the book Great Controversy comes to the 24:04 fore. 24:08 a snippet of the French Revolution and French Reformation which was 24:12 very significant to the segue of where the unfolding of the future 24:17 things kind of laying the groundwork for the liberty of 24:20 conscience that's threatened. 24:22 When you think about the French Revolution, we've read about that 24:25 and it's just a time where there was a great attempt to get rid of 24:29 it and extinguish God's Word, just burn it in the streets. 24:34 And we can see that happening in society again today. 24:36 So certainly maybe not as openly aggressive as that but there's been 24:41 a... 24:42 A covert shift. 24:47 Rather underlying but obvious, we see. 24:51 But now on the issue of liberty of conscience threatened. 24:53 We want to go to that video now because for those of you in America 24:57 and even in different parts of the world you may be in a society where 25:01 we travel quite a bit and some of the things we can say in America 25:04 you can't say around the world. 25:05 You can't say political things around the world like you can in 25:08 America. 25:11 starting to get to the place where you can't say things here either. 25:14 Because what you believe and what you can say is being challenged. 25:17 And this is what this video is about. 25:19 Liberty of conscience threat. 25:38 Liberty of conscience is something to be treasured for the opposite is 25:41 always tyranny. 25:43 Any time in history within a given nation or region that church and 25:47 state have combined forces it has always led to a decline in 25:50 religious liberty and the freedom for individuals to act according as 25:54 their conscience guides them. 25:55 In this chapter we look at the history of this subject from the 25:59 Dark Ages through to the Reformation and how even today it's 26:02 at threat and perhaps more so than ever before. 26:05 At the heart of the great controversy is the freedom to 26:08 worship, to love him freely and yet as time draws to a close these 26:13 rights will be unceremoniously stripped away. 26:23 The Constitution of the United States guaranteed liberty of 26:28 conscience and this is what made the United States unique as a 26:31 nation in that when it was formed these principles were enshrined in 26:35 the founding documents. 26:37 This was not something copied from Western Europe or any other nation. 26:41 Europe had in fact during the Dark Ages and the Reformation been under 26:45 the control of various religious persuasions that did not hold this 26:49 as a cherished value. 26:59 Roman Catholicism in the Middle Ages did not like any competition 27:03 and ruled supreme in most countries in Europe where the state was under 27:07 the influence and control of the church. 27:10 Those who opposed the dominant belief were marginalized and often 27:14 persecuted in an attempt to bring them into line. 27:18 Such a strategy is not like Christ. 27:21 He never forces anyone to worship and only accepts worship that is 27:26 freely given. 27:34 This caused a response and in the 16th century Europe underwent a 27:39 time of great upheaval and change. 27:42 Religious reformations in England, Scotland, Switzerland, France, 27:46 Germany, Sweden and Denmark changed the landscape of those countries 27:50 both in the spiritual sphere and also in civil life. 27:54 Each of these countries' reformations was closely tied to 27:57 political independence and while most of the change was good, some 28:02 things remained unchanged. 28:04 Even though these nations broke away from the rule of the Holy 28:08 Roman Empire, each church was often still influenced by the state. 28:20 Any time the church has sought the long arm of the state for support, 28:25 the end result has always seen religious legislation enforced. 28:30 Most significantly this took place in the early centuries from the 28:33 time of Constantine onwards as Sunday legislation was gradually 28:38 enforced. 28:43 superstition and false claims until it became widespread with only 28:48 small pockets of believers such as the Wardensians in Europe or the 28:51 Abyssinians in Ethiopia holding out. 28:54 The end result of both of these groups is a sad and painful one. 29:07 Revelation 13 outlines two beasts or two nations and we see this 29:11 fulfilled with the United States of America and also with papal Rome. 29:16 Papal Rome, it was prophesied, would receive a deadly wound and go 29:19 into captivity around 1798 and we see this fulfilled with the capture 29:24 of the pope and also more importantly, the stripping of 29:27 Rome's civil power. 29:28 It was prophesied though that the deadly wound would be healed as 29:32 Revelation 13 verse 3 says, all the world would wander after the beast. 29:36 As the U.S. 29:41 significance, the Bible outlines a time when she would unite with Rome 29:45 in forcing religious practices. 29:55 Today we can see liberty of conscience under threat, freedom of 29:59 speech and laws that protect it have slowly been eroded away. 30:03 We see this coming from both the overreach of government powers, but 30:07 also from the prevailing culture in society whereby it lends itself to 30:11 group think and cancel culture where anyone who does not accept 30:14 the view of the majority can be cut off. 30:18 May we fight for the preservation of liberty of conscience even while 30:22 we're seeing it eroded away but also remember that one day we'll 30:25 have to stand for what's right whilst the whole world is against 30:28 us. 30:40 Wow! 30:41 That was good. 30:45 That is a significant topic. 30:47 When you, and I know you pray over all the programs that you tape, but 30:53 just revisiting the whole idea of liberty of conscience threatened, 30:55 we see it all around the world. 30:57 It's a present issue. 30:58 I think the idea of other people thinking different to you and you 31:04 being okay with that increasingly in society, we're not seeing that. 31:07 I mean one of the modern things is cancel culture. 31:09 I just, I'll cancel you because you believe differently. 31:11 And this idea that we can't even engage with people that disagree 31:14 with us anymore and it's going to get worse and worse I think. 31:17 And we have to treasure the principle, the biblical principle 31:22 of freedom of where God gives us freedom and we give freedom to 31:26 other people as well. 31:28 Yeah, and there are certain topics that are just becoming almost, 31:30 there were hot issues, we used to call them hot issues in the past, 31:34 but now they're like hot topics, there you go. 31:37 But now it's like don't talk about that because you'll instantly be 31:40 ostracized and maligned unjustly. 31:43 And politically correct. 31:44 Right, and the whole thing about being politically correct. 31:47 You make a statement that's scripturally correct but all of a 31:50 sudden it's not politically correct. 31:51 It's like the cry against you is amazing. 31:54 Time to a living in. 31:56 Now let's talk about the Suki School in Australia. 32:01 Oh, I mentioned that story. 32:02 It did, he mentioned it. 32:03 That was the one about the... 32:05 Did I mention that? 32:06 Yeah, you did. 32:06 That was one of the students who kissed. 32:08 Oh, that miracle. 32:09 That's right. 32:10 Last year we were at a Christian festival. 32:15 It wasn't Adventist, it was just a Christian evangelical music 32:19 festival actually, it's called Big Church Day Out in England. 32:21 And so we thought let's go there, and broaden our reach outside of 32:26 our immediate community. 32:27 And we had some interesting stories there. 32:29 Some of the people who came up to the stand, one of them was a... 32:33 he was a former atheist who became a Christian through his self-study. 32:41 He then was given a book, Great Controversy by some Adventists who 32:44 were handing it out on the street in the city that he was in. 32:47 He read The Great Controversy, he was really deeply impacted by it, 32:51 and he passed it on to one of his friends, and then he decided to go 32:54 and study for the ministry in the Church of England, to be a Church 32:57 of England Reverend or Pastor. 33:00 And so then he was at this music festival and then he sees our 33:04 stand, but he didn't know about the book Great Controversy, but he saw 33:06 some of our T-shirts. 33:11 they nailed it and things like that. 33:12 He came over because of the T -shirts and then he saw the book 33:14 Great Controversy, he's like, oh, I've read this book. 33:18 And then he started talking with the team and they started sharing 33:21 about the Sabbath and sharing with him about that and he was studying 33:25 for the ministry and he said, oh, I'd love to share this with my 33:28 professors. 33:32 talk to them. 33:33 So it just enabled this opportunity for witnessing with them and 33:36 sharing with the professors. 33:37 Obviously they disagreed, but they got a chance to share about the 33:41 Sabbath with them. 33:45 study and, you know, just those doors open, opportunities for 33:49 conversations, for building relationships and questions and 33:52 seeing where the seeds may fall outside. 33:55 Amen, planting the seeds, I like that. 33:57 There's another quick story that we have where, you know, season one 34:00 was all about the Reformation and we kind of continued the 34:03 Reformation into Adventist history. 34:06 We had someone comment at the end of our season two, which is 34:09 Adventist history, she commented on the very last video and she said, I 34:12 actually started watching you guys in season one and I was not an 34:17 Adventist, I was just a Christian who was seeking truth. 34:20 She watched through all of season one on the Reformation and she was 34:23 like, well, I should continue watching season two. 34:25 So she went through Adventist history and she saw how Adventist 34:29 history came after the Reformation. 34:31 It was like a continual journey. 34:32 She ended up finding a local Adventist church and she ended up 34:36 getting baptized after study and she wrote the whole testimony in 34:39 one of our videos at the end. 34:40 And I thought that was powerful that, you know, the reason their 34:43 structure is that, is that people can go on this journey, you know, 34:46 every single week and just, you know, build upon one story from 34:49 another story and they're all connected and you get to this point 34:51 where you're like, wow, this is the true church. 34:53 Amen. 34:54 That's beautiful. 34:56 This is a question that goes with, okay, what we're talking about. 35:00 It says, this is from Michelle in Tennessee. 35:03 What were both of your thoughts when you filmed on Ascension Rock? 35:09 Also the filming of the field where Hiram Edson received the most holy 35:15 place vision. 35:17 So they want to know, what were your thoughts, both of you? 35:20 I let Adam go because I just had a baby so I missed that trip. 35:23 You've been to Ascension Rock. 35:27 probably... 35:28 It's a special place. 35:29 I've been there before that time. 35:30 It wasn't my first time when I filmed there. 35:33 But yeah, it holds a special place in Adventist history. 35:36 And you know, we're just, what, a few days past the 180th anniversary 35:40 of it. 35:44 And you read the stories of people weeping and crying for days on end. 35:49 But yet God had a purpose in that pain. 35:52 And he had an appointment with his people. 35:54 And so it was a special place to film. 35:56 It's one of my favorite places. 35:58 It's isolated. 35:59 It's in the countryside. 36:00 And you can just imagine, you try and imagine what it would have been 36:03 like to have that great hope. 36:07 And then the disappointment. 36:08 But then the words of Revelation 10 verse 11 that says, Thou must 36:12 prophesy again. 36:14 And those words echo to us today. 36:16 And really from when I stood there, I'm thinking of those words, Thou 36:21 must prophesy again. 36:22 And that's kind of the added impetus for us to keep doing that 36:25 today. 36:29 Tell the World. 36:29 Tell the World. 36:30 The Hopeful, yeah. 36:31 The Hopeful, that's called. 36:33 But yeah, this was 180 years, right? 36:37 Yeah, just yesterday or two days ago. 36:39 Two days ago. 36:45 And I'm walking through Adventist history. 36:47 The formation, I did a worship here at 3ABN on that just Tuesday past. 36:52 But it's interesting when you could follow your lineage. 36:55 When you could look at the path of how God leads and how he has led 37:01 and how he continues to lead. 37:02 It gives you confidence to say, for example, if you're driving from 37:07 here to California and you're looking at your map, you say, well, 37:11 I'm not sure that where we're headed is that direction, but based 37:14 on the map, we're moving in the right place. 37:17 The footsteps of the pioneers, the footsteps of our journey are 37:21 significant. 37:22 Here's another question before we... 37:23 We're going to talk about A.I. 37:24 in just a moment here because A.I. 37:25 is the generation we're living in. 37:27 It says, when Constantine merged Christianity with the Roman Empire, 37:31 Catholicism became the Church. 37:32 Then, Protestants from that. 37:36 But were there any Christians from first century Christians that 37:41 survived without going through this path? 37:45 Good question. 37:46 I think where the question is coming from... 37:48 Terry, thank you for the question. 37:48 Thank you, Terry from Ohio. 37:51 When Constantine merged with Christianity, Christianity really 37:54 became corrupted and compromised and lots of practices came in that 37:58 weren't biblical and Christianity becomes watered down. 38:02 And the question says, were there any true... 38:04 essentially were there any true... 38:05 Were there any Christians that survived? 38:06 Any Christians that survived. 38:08 I read that as were there any like Christians that never got sucked up 38:11 into that compromise? 38:12 And I think, yes, there were. 38:13 Historically, there were. 38:14 And some of those groups that... 38:17 I mean, biblically, Ellen, I mean the Bible talks about the Church in 38:21 the wilderness. 38:21 That's right. 38:26 It was literally in the wilderness because they were being persecuted 38:30 a lot of time. 38:30 Some of those groups are the Waldensians. 38:32 There was also the Celtic Church in Scotland and Ireland and the 38:36 western part of England. 38:37 These were some pockets of believers that were often 38:40 persecuted but still maintained a pure biblical truth as they knew 38:45 and maintained that in often isolation and in the wilderness. 38:49 And so if Terry's not familiar or people aren't familiar, check out 38:53 some of the lineage episodes on the Waldensis, on the Celtic Church. 38:57 And those are some of the groups that maintained the faith during 39:00 the Dark Ages when Christianity had to become corrupt and compromised. 39:06 And you know, the good thing about that as a pastor, you read 39:08 Revelation 12 where it says, the earth opened its mouth and helped 39:12 the woman. 39:13 When the serpent poured water out of his mouth like a flood to cause 39:16 the woman to be washed away by the flood, we understand that was the 39:20 persecution that was pursuing the Church but the earth opened its 39:24 mouth and helped the woman and swallowed up the flood that was 39:27 being poured out after her. 39:31 her to this particular point. 39:34 Now, looking at the evolution of technology, let's talk about AI and 39:38 we're going to look at a snippet of that. 39:40 Artificial intelligence. 39:42 Yeah, so you know, probably in November last year I got a message 39:45 from a professor that I was a good friend with and he sent me this 39:50 message and he said, have you seen this new technology? 39:53 And I was like, no, I hadn't seen it and I watched a demo and it was 39:56 this guy speaking English but then his language changed and he was 39:59 speaking in a different language and then it changed again and he 40:02 ended up speaking like nine different languages in like the 40:05 space of 30 seconds. 40:06 So I started experimenting with this stuff and I got some snippets 40:10 of Adam and I was just doing 30 second videos and in like 20 40:14 different languages and I started sending it to people all around the 40:17 world like, hey, does this sound accurate? 40:20 People would come back to me and say, yeah, there's some slight 40:22 errors but it's 90% there, 95% there, which is pretty good. 40:27 Now, for our Advent message, we can't deal with 95%. 40:30 We have to deal with 100% accuracy. 40:33 So we started working with translators who are helping us and 40:37 they're checking these videos before we generate them and 40:40 basically turning Adam's voice into a different language. 40:44 So we did some tests. 40:45 I created a whole video in Portuguese and I put it on a 40:49 YouTube channel and we went off filming in Europe in I think April 40:52 or May and I didn't check the YouTube channel and I came back and 40:57 all of a sudden one of our videos had 35,000 views in Portuguese and 41:02 it was actually on the wall densies and I was thinking, wow, there's a 41:06 real desire and need and hunger around the world for this stuff and 41:10 we can use this technology to start translating especially the great 41:14 controversy. 41:17 languages. 41:22 Russian, Ukrainian, Hindi, Mandarin and the list goes on. 41:27 We're growing as we go. 41:29 As a matter of fact, I went to your website and there's a tab you click 41:32 down and you start choosing the different languages. 41:34 You can choose the language and you can donate to that specific 41:36 language. 41:40 reach out to your fellow people, you can support that particular 41:43 project. 41:44 It's very inexpensive compared to the traditional way of doing it. 41:48 Compared to nowadays. 41:49 We can do an episode and about one episode for about $100. 41:54 Well, if you take that episode, rent out a studio, hire out someone 42:01 to record it, translate it, the cost is exponential, right? 42:05 So we've been able to do a much cheaper way and for a very good 42:09 quality and checked by Adventists to know that it's accurate is 42:13 what's really important. 42:14 Now go ahead, tell them 3ABN is doing that, aren't we? 42:17 Right, 3ABN is using AI on some of the sermons and you can see that in 42:21 some of the camp meetings you can see the same person preaching in 42:24 different languages. 42:25 Even you. 42:25 Even I. 42:27 And we just did a series in New York City with Pastor Bachelon, 42:30 amazing fact, but he had 17 simultaneous translations through 42:34 AI. 42:36 And that was, I mean, the Lord is giving us a technology that we can 42:39 use to advance the Gospel. 42:41 So when people say be careful with AI, there's some positive benefits 42:45 to technology that we are responsible for using. 42:47 And we should use. 42:48 We need to use that. 42:49 Now you have a snippet of that. 42:50 Let's look at this 48-second clip. 42:52 Yeah, so we've got Adam speaking in a number of different languages, so 42:55 yeah, you can check it out. 42:57 3ABN is using some groundbreaking translation technology to get this 43:01 message. 43:44 Wow, wow, so not only is it in a different language, but your mouth 43:49 is moving with it. 43:50 Yeah, it's the same. 43:56 and even some still, is that it takes the, whatever, you know, when 44:01 you do scanning, your phone or whatever, it takes and it re-jigs 44:06 your face and it syncs the lips. 44:10 Not like the old Chinese karate movies. 44:15 I know, speaking in Chile, speaking in English. 44:21 Exactly, no, it's really accurate. 44:23 It's come a long, long way. 44:24 In some of the languages, the lip syncs better than others, but 44:26 generally it's pretty good. 44:28 So how many languages did you go through here on this one? 44:30 In this video, I think we went through five or six, maybe seven, I 44:33 don't remember the top of my head. 44:39 that would hit, say, the 1040 window. 44:42 So we could put the episodes into Arabic. 44:45 We could put them into some Tamil or Hindi, Mandarin, and we could 44:50 put it into some of those languages and hit parts of the world that we 44:53 can't hit, and also other languages that would hit, you know, the 44:56 Spanish speaking world or French and so on. 44:58 So that's really our goal with that, is to evangelistically spread 45:03 it around the world. 45:03 It's in Spanish too. 45:04 And Spanish, yeah. 45:06 Into all the world, oh, we're going. 45:09 Into all the world, and the confidence is, and this Gospel of 45:12 the Kingdom will be preached in all the world. 45:15 Now your website, we're going to mention this again, is 45:17 LineageJourney.com, as it sounds, Lineage Theater is on the screen, 45:21 LineageJourney.com. 45:23 You'll get a chance to visit that website and save it, book market, 45:28 because it's going to be a place where you'll see resources that 45:31 will just grab you and guide you through the Word of God in powerful 45:35 ways. 45:35 Those books are on there? 45:36 The books are on there, T-shirts, and other resources. 45:39 And T-shirts too. 45:40 And on the website we have, I mean, some people can go to the YouTube 45:43 channel as well, with just the videos, but on the website, in 45:45 addition to the videos and the resources, there's a lot of 45:48 articles on there that we've written. 45:49 There's probably about 400 different articles on there. 45:52 So if you're at home as a mother or a father with your child and you're 45:55 studying through something, or maybe home school, home education, 45:58 if you're a teacher and you're looking for resources, there's a 46:01 lot of articles that mirror every episode we've done in addition to 46:04 extra ones as well. 46:06 So there's a lot of written materials there that can help you 46:09 personally learn or help teach someone else as well. 46:11 And some people often say to us, oh, can you make the videos longer? 46:14 Well, the whole point for us is that we're trying to grab your 46:18 attention and give you the most important information to then go 46:21 and study for yourself. 46:25 We have book references, we have photos, more archaeological 46:28 information to kind of get someone who really wants to study into more 46:32 detail. 46:33 That's really, really good. 46:34 Now, two things I want to accomplish. 46:35 Let's just show also the English reformers in Portuguese is the one 46:39 in the 20s. 46:39 An example of the AI, yeah. 46:41 So this is an example of once we put the episode together, what it 46:46 looks like in terms of changing the graphics, changing the language, 46:48 changing everything into that language. 46:50 Okay, let's look at that. 47:14 The British islands also went through a great change in the 47:18 Switzerland and Scandinavia. 47:24 Several leaders that God used to bring changes emerged, such as 47:28 William Tyndale, John Knox, Thomas Cranmer, Hugh Lettimer and Nicholas 47:32 Ridley, to name just a few. 47:35 Each one of them is unique and has its own history, but a common 47:39 thread unites all. 47:41 Each one of them is unique and has its own history, 48:02 but a common thread unites all. 48:14 Each one of them is unique and has its own history, but a common 48:15 thread unites all. 48:21 Now, I know you're listening, but if you look at the intonations, 48:26 look at the inflections, the way your mouth is moving, it's all... 48:30 Everything's synced. 48:31 It's pretty amazing. 48:32 Yeah. 48:32 It's pretty amazing technology. 48:33 Pretty amazing. 48:34 Who would've known this? 48:35 Two years ago, you could do this. 48:35 Yeah. 48:36 I know. 48:41 might say, well, what's your future plans? 48:43 You've got over 300 episodes. 48:45 Oh, yeah. 48:49 added to that, that's gonna be quite a project, quite an 48:52 engagement. 48:53 That takes finances. 48:55 Talk about some of the future projects, and then let our audience 48:57 know ways that they could sponsor and how they could participate 49:01 financially. 49:02 I mean, one of the future projects is the AI, is to continue 49:05 translating that into various language. 49:07 We wanna start with great controversy, and then go to some of 49:10 the other ones. 49:11 Another two projects we've got in the immediate pipeline. 49:14 We have a series on 1888, the time before it, 1888, and the time after 49:22 it. 49:25 That's gonna be coming out in November, December, January, be 49:29 released then. 49:34 sure what the exact title's gonna be, but essentially, it's gonna be 49:37 on women in Christian history. 49:38 So we've already done the Reformation, but we really mainly 49:41 covered men and other events. 49:42 So we've kind of gone back over a similar time period, and we're 49:45 covering some of the characters in history that don't get as much 49:49 spotlight. 49:53 Arms, which was, she highlighted eight women of the Reformation. 49:56 And so we kind of took that book, and then we enlarged on that. 50:00 And it's gonna be a 30-part series, is the plan. 50:06 And we're sharing some interesting stories, like Katharina Von Bora, 50:08 who was Martin Luther's wife, and Queen Katharina Empire, which, 50:13 fascinating stories, yeah. 50:15 And she escaped from a nunnery in a fish barrel. 50:19 And then she essentially proposes to him, because she can't be a 50:22 single, any fascinating story. 50:24 Don't spoil it, don't spoil it. 50:26 So that's gonna be our series next year, Women in Christian History, 50:29 and we'll have a podcast. 50:30 You've teased us enough to look forward to it. 50:32 That's really, really good. 50:34 This isn't just the Reformation, we're covering some as far back as, 50:37 I think the early one-hundreds. 50:40 And we're going to a lady called Perpetua in Tunisia, who really 50:42 stood up. 50:43 Another fascinating story. 50:44 So we've got a whole range of different things that we're 50:47 covering. 50:48 I love this women. 50:51 Go ahead. 50:51 I know. 50:55 this into different languages. 50:56 That's gonna be phenomenal. 50:58 Now, let's talk about the way that people that are watching and 51:00 listening to the program can participate financially. 51:03 How? 51:04 And be as specific as you can. 51:05 What are the needs? 51:09 equipment evolves and things that need to be taken, so I'll just kind 51:13 of throw it out to you guys. 51:16 Or how they can participate in some of the things that might be good. 51:20 I mean, the Lord has really blessed us. 51:24 The Lord has impressed people to give over the time period that 51:27 lineage has been going, and for that we're really thankful. 51:29 We've been thankful for the support of people that have given to us. 51:34 And the Lord's impressed people. 51:35 Some people give on a monthly basis. 51:37 They've gone to a website, they've signed up, and they've donated 51:39 monthly, and that's really been helpful. 51:40 It's on the website. 51:45 monthly basis, and that really does help give us a little bit of 51:47 stability. 51:48 And then other people give, you know, one-off donations. 51:51 They go to the website lineagejourney.com slash give, and 51:54 people have donated out, you know, the generosity of their heart. 51:57 Sometimes it's just they've been impressed by it, and they give, and 52:00 other people have given a specific project. 52:03 And it's really helped because we, you know, Clive took the step of 52:07 faith, you know, he's got four children and a wife, and to go full 52:10 -time, and really had a burden and a passion to design myself from 52:15 three -quarter time, and the rest of the team are, you know, they're 52:17 volunteers, they help out, you know, they take holidays to go on 52:20 the trip, on the trips and so on. 52:22 And so we're really supported by the generosity of those who 52:27 appreciate them and recognize the importance of understanding our 52:31 identity and how that connects to our purpose on our mission today. 52:34 So a lot of people, you know, they give through our website, whether 52:37 it goes to our equipment that we need to update on regular times, 52:40 whether it goes to help us, you know, kind of, you know, live from 52:44 day to day. 52:45 Which is necessary. 52:48 aren't cheap when you're flying to the countries and you've got the 52:51 logistics of the flights and the filming and so on. 52:55 Custom clearance. 52:56 All that kind of stuff. 52:58 So when people give it, it goes a long way. 53:01 Even ensuring the equipment that you have. 53:03 Right, exactly. 53:07 overnight. 53:08 Yeah. 53:08 Although that's something. 53:11 Now, generally, what would you say is the average cost if you would 53:14 have put all those factors together of one episode? 53:17 This is just something that I don't know if you plan. 53:18 It's really hard to tell because it depends on the location. 53:21 Right. 53:21 Yeah. 53:23 I mean, if we're doing Adventist history, it's over here in the U.S. 53:25 It's cheap for me to get there or cheaper for me to get there than 53:28 some other people around the world. 53:31 But I can tell you the cost to translate an episode is about one 53:34 hundred dollars into a different language. 53:37 But I don't know. 53:39 It's really a difficult one. 53:40 If you put it together, say, a 15 part series, roughly, it's I don't 53:45 know. 53:46 It's good. 53:47 Be brave. 53:48 Be brave. 53:49 Yes. 53:52 60 or 70,000. 53:54 Sometimes more, sometimes 100,000. 53:55 The logistics costs, the travel costs, the equipment costs, the 54:00 editing costs. 54:01 That's right. 54:02 And the reality of it is nothing is free. 54:05 Right. 54:06 And time is not free. 54:07 The end product. 54:12 but it doesn't have the same effect. 54:14 No, you don't want to insult producers like people that are 54:20 behind the camera. 54:21 They'll say an iPhone does a good job. 54:23 If you're walking through the airport, just quick things. 54:25 You want to give the Lord your best. 54:27 You want to give the Lord your best. 54:28 And so you are a 501C3. 54:30 We are. 54:34 Before that, we had, yeah. 54:36 And the website is lineagejourney .com. 54:40 There are links there. 54:42 Yeah, there's the shop there, there's the watch, there's the 54:45 read, and there's the give section, there's the language section as 54:47 well. 54:49 And we can always send in checks as well. 54:51 We have a postal address. 54:52 Oh, and checks too. 54:54 And that's on the website. 54:55 That's on the website. 54:56 And I think we have a screen for that as well. 54:57 Is there a phone number too? 54:58 There's a phone number too. 55:00 Okay. 55:01 I don't know off by heart, but it should be on the screen. 55:03 There's your phone number right there, 530. 55:05 That's definitely a California number. 55:07 That might be your phone number. 55:08 That might be closely associated with you. 55:10 Yeah. 55:14 listening to the program, what would you say to motivate them to 55:16 really participate in lineage for the future? 55:20 Your camera is right there. 55:21 No, my camera is right there. 55:25 You're coming as well, Clive. 55:26 What would I say? 55:30 Lineage... 55:33 and lineage seeks to help people understand who they are, their 55:36 mission, their purpose, their identity and where they're going 55:39 through understanding where they come from. 55:41 And we're just trying to help create resources to translate the 55:45 written material into a video resource, into a medium that they 55:50 can consume and watch on a readily basis and just help guide people 55:55 today as to understand who they are, their God-given purpose in 55:58 this world and what God has put them in this world to do and where 56:02 to go. 56:08 support in helping us to do that. 56:10 Well, thank you, Adam Ramden, the executive producer, and Clive 56:15 Coutet, which is the media director. 56:17 And we want to thank your team, the entire team. 56:20 Yeah, they would have loved to have been here, all of them, but I know 56:23 they're cheering you on. 56:24 We're scattered around the world. 56:26 And pray that the Lord will impress you. 56:28 This ministry is... 56:29 You can't put a dollar amount to it. 56:31 And those of us who are here at 3ABN know that you can't just say, 56:34 this is the amount. 56:38 lineage because when they will look back and realize the reason why I 56:42 know Jesus better is because of what I've learned through this 56:44 ministry. 56:45 Well, thank you for joining us tonight. 56:46 We've enjoyed you being here. 56:47 Until next time, may God continue to bless you. |
Revised 2024-10-25