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Series Code: TDYL
Program Code: TDYL220031B
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00:14 Welcome back to a dull program, informative, challenging and rich and rich
00:17 honey. To be here is like Thanksgiving table has been spared this table has full 00:27 sprint, Bull with some solid information that I know many of you who watched the first 00:29 hour probably writing stuff down on Cent O you're thinking about names on a you may be 00:36 that person for whom this information is really a free and in power or are we 00:43 speaking with pass to Steve and Tammy Tamarac. Conway. Yes. And they stamina full 00:50 live. and if somebody just the first hour, don't know how they can make that mistake. 00:55 Maybe time zones. One minute cap of who you are, where just to help them catch up. Yes. So 01:03 we live in southeast Michigan and we passed with Troy Seven-day Adventist Church for 01:11 children. I'm married for 21 years. So to be 22 years. >> stamina for life is is what 01:17 we do trying to help people to deal with grief and they would changes challenges and 01:25 choices. Nation shipment nation. yes, yes. And healing healing. 01:32 >> You know, you have 2 sets of who says because we need a lot of growth. 01:38 >> Age gap. yes, I like that. That was to said that they have their claws. Maya. 01:45 >> With that now we've got one. Yeah, what 20 and. >> Yeah, Israel's 20, will be 01:53 18 next week. And then we the 2 younger ones. Gable is 12. An angel is 11. Whoa. yes. 02:01 >> He's my angel and a lot angel yeah. That's that. That's the challenge in his 02:05 generation where it's hard to fill to what's coming at your children. someone 02:09 psychologists and I think talk to on trouble heart. He talked about a generation that is the 02:13 thrill to death. That book deals for anybody involved with the millennials. Thrilled 02:21 to death is a book. I highly recommend talking too much Ball hot and the digital 02:25 invasion. And, you know, dealing with all these people because something's coming to 02:28 relationships that. get from you know with that. You can read you I. 02:35 >> lot. To his website. And and is is so we have to pray for our children today golden. 02:44 >> kind of go back to some of that, OK? Because I think that what you said in the first 02:49 hour about parenting and the goals and those do with those classical would called to the 02:57 sets 2 sets children. Yeah. They made it through the just about the rain. Talk about 03:02 that a little bit. Hammer. Oh, my goodness. You know, it's all interesting. Not too long 03:06 ago. My oldest >> ready to turn 18? We had a moment. We talk a lot in our 03:12 family. You know, sometimes that happens mostly during family worship. That's why we 03:16 love family worship. This is not just a time for us to read and pray, but that's where we 03:19 actually talk about deep things and then but this particular day, my oldest 03:23 daughter because my younger ones were asking, you know, mom, you know, want to let us 03:27 go. It's over. He was house. And I'm like, you you know, of course, my background, right? 03:33 Thank But also, you know, my older 2, they always knew the answer. But my daughter share 03:38 with me something one day. She said mom late at night were just sitting and talking me in 03:44 her bio sleep. She said, Mom, thank you. Do not understand. You know why he didn't let us 03:50 go. She was I but oftentimes I want you to know. And this is where that that difference in 03:56 what I know. I didn't have the ability to do a Yeah, which is to have that those transparent 04:01 moment of And that was because my mom just didn't know how to mind right. But she said, mom, 04:07 you, I never experience the things you experience. You know, and I feel sometimes 04:12 like parenting me through your trauma, now. And he I literally was like. 04:20 >> Wow, look, goodness, in the hope now reiterate that just to somebody who trying to get 04:25 that I was parenting her right through my trauma. So that meant that the glasses that I 04:28 had on ice on life through. Yeah, I was unfortunately sometimes passing that along 04:33 to my children. But my children didn't come came from. They didn't experience 04:38 the things that I saw. A lot of the way that I saw a life and people was colored by the 04:42 abuse. you know, those types of things. So sometimes on. But most of us, we can parent 04:47 our children through our trauma and we end up passing along to them. Ideas or 04:52 feelings and thoughts about people and things. And some people say, well, that's good 04:57 because that way, you know, they won't have these things that accident is protecting 04:59 them. But that's actually not really true if they're taking on my baggage. You understand 05:06 what I'm saying that I'm the one who lived it, but I can pass along to the top. And 05:12 line said it right that my son and I really appreciate her sharing that with me. That was 05:16 one of those clarifying moment as a parent. When you get to see who you are, your 05:20 children's eyes. >> And as a pastor, I know you could relate to that thing 05:25 because, OK, you've been passengers past Yeah, those are those moments when I was 05:27 trying to say to people that when I first come to a church, don't stop telling the bad 05:32 things about the people haha on the couple cut that Could you give me a chance? 05:39 >> Yeah. That's what you're talking about. Yes, absolutely. And that's what 05:41 you're talking like. That's how a connected on. absolutely. And it's the same 05:44 thing we can in our effort to try to protect them. We are literally giving them trauma. 05:51 You know, instead of walking them along the path. >> All right. And surely 05:56 warning them, you know, about certain things. But there are sometimes because we're 06:00 unhealed in certain areas. We can pass that along. And so them. 06:03 >> Yes, wow. Children. Yes, children. Well, girl, you up. how was it? That was the 06:12 moment that yeah, that was a moment. Yeah. You you working on this devotion right? What 06:19 people expect to find in couples devotion? You working on? Yeah, little bit. Be 06:24 available. Also. Yeah, well, we hope to have that the couple's devotional. 06:29 >> Available at all. So at the end of the year, yeah. by the grace of God, it will be a it 06:33 will be available. So. >> Is it our advice here? A story and this is a story that 06:39 comes out of the out of the we were. Riding along. we were having a discussion and that 06:52 this is going tied to what you just share and 2. But we were having a discussion and it 06:58 became animated. It became so was driving that my wife's volume level. It just it went 07:06 up to higher than it ever gone. In other words, I would allow. 07:14 >> a car with the windows up and >> my response to this I well. 07:22 My response, one of the ways I respond to elevated an animation Why I started being 07:29 sarcastic, which only pushed it up several more notches. >> And not want to get loud is 07:38 not want to buy. He is to to different personalities, So he's more of a calm person. 07:41 Me. So this is you >> I that's what is going on. And all of a sudden were 07:57 interrupted. And our 4 children are are in the vaccine and their cry. Yeah. 08:01 And our oldest son he's like mom. Dad, please, can you guys stop fighting? 08:09 >> And I'm like, it's almost like you forgot. It was in forgot yeah. But my response 08:14 is I find it with this. And when I was just having an animated you you haven't seen 08:23 like we saw and we we we know what fighting. we know this sounds like what it feels 08:28 like. Yeah. but our children were continuing to cry and time and are just like. We're 08:34 silent. I'm and what? And what just happened and why are they why they respond in this way? 08:42 to myself, I'm thinking what is wrong with these kids lesson number one, you know, 08:49 you are fighting and your traumatizing your kids. So you you had an opportunity to to 08:56 demonstrate to them how to a healthy ways to work through conflicts agree that so and 09:03 this agreement was, you know, whose family all we've all spent time. We have spending 09:06 time with my family as much as your family and this that the other and which have been 09:11 building up over time. So there was we apologize to our children for that. But one of 09:19 the things, one of the ways that God actually brought us victory through that. Yeah, 09:23 is. Brought to our attention that our children time was to the point he was making 09:32 earlier. There are children were different than us. Our response to what it looks like 09:39 when a mom and dad are We have a way to define that and describe that on our 09:46 experiences, which was very different from our children, for our children. It's this 09:52 animated discussion with one person, man sarcastic and another person this is for 09:58 them. It is the most one of the most traumatic things that they've they don't know what's 10:03 going to happen with their mom and dad from here. T so one of the one of the things that the 10:08 more reminds is your children are not you. That's right. OK, children are 9. got you and 10:15 your attempts by the grace of God to raise your children. Better than you were raised. 10:24 Yes, you have actually by so there's a lot of times when we experience failure, right? And 10:32 this was one of those times where a guy was able to help us to see that, even though we 10:37 have failed in that moment, yes, he could point us to a broader victory that we 10:43 experience by raising children who didn't need to see and who have never and will never by 10:48 the grace of see their father lay his hands on her mother never hear the mother or 10:55 father call each other out of their names. We will never, you know, be in the hospital 11:01 with the other. You understand they're never going to see that. Never have seen that. 11:05 But there are still things with the way that we've tried to raise them by God's grace 11:09 that. You know, that can take that for them can have the same impact as if they were in 11:17 the hospital as if they were here and their mother father call these other out of the So 11:23 it was a maturing moment for us. It was a moment where we like you said it was a win was 11:26 like, wow, that. >> That that shook them up. But it's like, wow, that shook 11:31 them up. You know, isn't that healthy food children to see parents all you and make up. I 11:39 think I think there's a difference between arguing and in conflict. Okay. But I 11:45 understand our culture. People really don't see that that conflict is a part of life. 11:51 Conflict is and look great controversy for goodness sake. and so that is something that 11:56 I think that we're not raise with a really clear understanding that you have to 12:00 have conflict in order to mature and grow conflict. Brings you into having 12:04 discussions about, OK, how should we do this? Okay, what it would be. You think that's 12:09 that's conflict. We don't necessarily think the same about everything. Yeah. And 12:12 there's a there's a difference between, as we say, there's a difference between tasks 12:20 related and and then there's personal arsenal. Conflict. Personal is where. 12:23 >> You know, you're no good rotten. Not about this, that the other and now this is not 12:31 conflict about has ordered. I want to parent this is not how and the I want to spend the 12:37 finances, but this is now personal attack and assault. you? very personal. And so 12:46 unfortunately, yeah, the craziness is that our disagreements concerning task 12:52 often devolved into personal attacks against one another. And so what what children and 12:59 the Perry is to individuals who are really arguing and fighting and not just 13:09 disagreeing disagreeing. So I agree with you and to the extent that children need to 13:16 see parents disagree, the processes he helped yes, and not what I'm going to call you 13:22 names because we don't agree on this or I'm going to withdraw. You know, 13:28 emotionally and intellectually and physically because I don't like that. You did X Y Z? 13:34 Yeah, true. But some children see their parents cursed at 1, 0, next, know, the children of 13:41 her son in school where become chained Holden. Yeah. Sometimes they they make it 13:47 publicly a little kid once years ago. >> I won't say where but at a 13:51 children's story time that any. And if I want to pray and one little kids not to pray. 13:56 That is pretty mommy and daddy don't fight many more. And everybody who kids that you 14:01 churches, condom form. Yeah, this is a fire in that. How the parent right now want to 14:10 hide in the tie them below >> With the deacons who fire here he is will throw you 14:22 under. Yes, but And don't they do on us, but is, oh, better get it together we've been 14:29 there, right? Oh, my and adhesive. Are that >> All years yeah. If any has 14:42 got a singing friend, while I'm trying to give a last name a bunny with after we have 14:45 done in concert, Lewis sitting haven't been together. 10 has been my wife and me and then 14:54 little he said about 5. so far we He said. Halo me. His mother. that what you sent? 15:01 Haha, he called below me. You know, McCain halo. >> No h****, h****. My h****. 15:07 My h****. And he's a fiveyear term. I would use that. H****. Who you call me maybe as long 15:15 you know, you talk about He but that's what you call him. >> out of the mouth of babes? 15:23 So what you're saying is we have to be reflective there are echo chambers in our 15:28 house, according to vice oh, yeah, a mind? Wow. Let's go to a question, OK, how can I get 15:37 so to fight to help people go through the grieving process. >> This is Jocelyn from West 15:45 Palm Beach. I'll tell Cameron tie just you can actually go on. My Web site has stamina 15:49 for life dot com and I believe half. >> S T a and eat in a the 15:55 number 4 and then L I F E dot com and there are links there that can lead you to the 16:00 places where you need to go to get information regarding grief recovery. 16:03 >> All right. So definitely, you know, go there. And it is worthwhile is a worthwhile 16:08 calls to be able to prepare ourselves to help people process grief. He has one that 16:12 goes. It connects with this. How can you get someone to open up about 16:19 >> One of the things that you know, you discover about anyone who experiences any 16:22 type of losses first being willing to listen, you per availing yourself to be 16:26 someone who safe, right? Create an environment where they know they can be open and 16:33 Oftentimes again, what we want to do is we want to fix. People were willing to listen 16:37 for a little while, right? like, okay. Okay. Now what is it? What is it that you need 16:40 to do? You know, so I would avail yourself to be someone who could be trusted to listen 16:45 without any motive affixing because they don't need to be fixed. Rivers don't need to be 16:48 fixed. I don't want to be fix. They're not broken, right? But their hearts feel as though 16:54 they're broken. So they need to be heard. Let me just add to that a little bit. I think. 16:59 >> The other thing is we don't need to make people feel if we really want them to open up. 17:05 We don't need to make people feel like they're unusual. Yeah. So I've been in settings 17:11 where people are opening up and they're sharing. Somebody will say, for instance, you 17:17 know, you've got a group of people OK, let's get together. Let's share and they were 17:21 prey. Somebody shares and a slight. Okay. Before we go on let's just pray for this 17:27 person, right? Matt, because that's just, you know, I don't know if I've ever heard 17:33 anything like that before, but what I don't want isolating this person's experience yet. 17:39 I'm making it unique so different from everyone else's instead of allowing them to 17:45 just share everyone else share so that they're not made to feel like, OK, you need prayer 17:51 right I we have to we have to get God to intervene in your situation right before any of 17:56 our weight. He needs to step in. And so just understanding that sometimes with good 18:03 intentions. Yeah, we can actually alienate people and cause them to shut down. What 18:08 if they're grieving a loss of trust with God. So you know that that happens is a lot of 18:14 you know, again, that run into and I work with who have a loss of faith. 18:17 >> But I'm a firm believer that a healed heart, their faith can be regained man. You 18:24 know? >> Yes, then let me talk about something for the next 18:26 question because this is something I wanted and I like which is saying about people 18:30 heal the different rates. Yes, >> to picture this. Somebody in Florida said it's raining. 18:40 Some buy in California said it's in Florida. They don't need any more water in 18:45 California. They need a whole lot of water. So they just got. They just got slightly 18:52 damp from the rain California. But the person Florida got soaked. That's how life So my 18:59 rain, may not be the same. And we've got to understand, don't don't equate my rain with the 19:04 R a that's right. If if you really got that far to rein in your life, you need a lot of 19:11 time to dry out. my camera should drying out process. Yes. President California 19:14 like. Just tripping about. Yeah. Well, you haven't been Florida in my life. Yeah. And 19:21 that's how lives are. I want experience not you could be a 9 foot a long time, but each 19:30 person processes. And I'm learning that, yeah, we process things differently and 19:34 sometimes it's raining. It's pouring in her life. Witnesses, drizzling, mine, 19:39 and sometimes the other way around point in my life was drizzling in hers. And we're 19:42 learning. Santa married couples who people in relationships. But how long 19:47 you've been married, you don't always to learn. Always. As life brings you new things. 19:52 How to handle those. And the principle we have is. >> Don't try to win an 19:58 argument. Could you go through the same? And we've learned that to try to win, I want to 20:04 try to win. It was like within both. Lou, thanks try to both of you. When each of you 20:09 together we win >> It is so important to >> when we are in community, 20:17 right? Because a marriage is a community brightest people, children who ever write 20:22 wherein community is so important that we remember how to how to be present without 20:28 trying to fix each other. You know, and I think that like you said, the different areas, 20:33 the pace to which people are feeling and going through their process. We always say 20:37 that we're in process, right? But we are really uncomfortable with being 20:41 around people and process. This is just the truth. You were uncomfortable with with 20:47 sitting as job experience with his friends, they said would out. Yeah, but after a while, 20:51 they can take where they just had to give us their thoughts. You know, and sometimes you 20:54 just got to be quiet. Yes, you know, sackcloth and ashes, you know, and 20:58 >> and just write Rabbit trail out, you know, with the Parsons and another thing, 21:00 too, with that is. >> And I appreciate what you share we don't always but we 21:13 want to. And so when someone says, hey, you my my father just passed away and I know 21:19 what you're going a lost my dad, too. Well, Don't you don't? don't because you don't 21:26 know what my relationship was with. My dad Maybe my dad and I when he died, you know, 21:34 there was still a lot of ground that needed to be made up. And that was that was 21:39 unfinished work and your dad and your relationship were quite different from mine. So 21:46 and good terms of wanting to, you know, I didn't want identify, but we have to allow 21:53 people, you know, their own process, their own walk. I'm the best we can do in a 21:58 situation like that is we can say, you know, I know how I felt when I last year. You 22:05 know your lovely. I love that because that takes you out of there. 22:08 >> And people identify a natural thing I've learned. I've told people don't say I 22:13 know how you unless you've been there, but that's not the case. But not all. We really 22:22 haven't been there in their I'm glad to say that. for those of you that at home. 22:28 >> You know think about it for a moment. We all that we often say we often think the thing 22:35 that qualifies this to say I like, yeah, because we had a similar experience. Yes, but 22:40 the similarity of inexperience. >> On a roller coast, if you 22:43 in the front seat and I'm a back seat. Well, it's a roller coaster, but you know, at last 22:50 he just whips over So let's just not do that. trying to say see that again with 2 22:56 responses. >> At best I know what I felt like when I went through what 22:57 I went through. That's right. Yeah. And the full. Here's another question. What's the 23:04 best support you can give a child from a broken home >> my goodness. I'm so one of 23:10 the first things I want to say. I'm actually currently I'm working on actually a 23:14 certification in helping children with losses. Well, and there are a lot of 23:18 children that is a loss. That is actually what HAP is this a grieving process for children? 23:23 And so if you've been that child before where you've come from a home where people 23:26 divorce or separate, they're grieving, you know, but if they don't have an emotional 23:33 vocabulary, right, if they have been raised in a home where they've been allowed to 23:35 express their thoughts and feelings and emotions about any type of loss. You know, 23:40 normally what ends up happening is if a dog dies, right when you when you hear 23:44 what he would most children here. If they lose a pet. >> Well, I don't know have any 23:52 children. >> Most times what happens is don't worry. We'll get you 23:53 another one. >> Yeah. Oh, yeah. It is. So the idea of lacing, the loss 24:00 follows them throughout their life. I hate to tell you there are a lot of adults who just 24:02 continuously replace losses because that was the image that they were given us 24:06 children. This was what you do when you lose something, I don't worry, you'll be able to 24:10 go to mom and dad's on the weekend. more you what about the holidays? You you have the 24:14 holidays and people are well intentioned in wanting to try to help their children too. I 24:19 would say probably get over, but I don't like the work it over, right? Because no one 24:25 gets over anything. The only way you can do is go through it. And so what I think is 24:29 important that we have children who come from those types of situations is that we 24:33 help the children to develop an emotional vocabulary by also being vulnerable and 24:37 showing them what that looks like. Right? If I'm a parent who is divorcing or has 24:43 divorced, yeah, sit down and have a conversation with that child about that process. And 24:48 if you know your goal, I can't tell you how many times we work. We still working on a e. 24:52 There were people who used to send their children away so they can get divorces. Yes. 24:58 And then when we come back home, the children would be devastating for they would 25:02 find out whether a school and staff members were left to try to help this child pick up the 25:07 pieces of their health, you know, and so our to our children, we all of them debt. 25:12 Yeah, helping to heal, especially we know that that's something that's going to 25:17 happen. So I would say for the person who asked that question start off by being vulnerable 25:20 yourself, show them how to process their emotions. And if you don't know how get some 25:24 help, you know and what with him through that process, right? Because people don't 25:30 children perceptive? Yeah. Not as tense as we think they are sometimes too. So we have a 25:36 lot more experience than they do. They have eyes and use yes, they could tell mom and 25:43 dad treatment. Yes, but they're not being honest with us. Yes, but they're not 25:45 telling us the full story. >> And when you have 4 children, yeah, you have that 25:49 generational. The older ones to school and the younger ones. Let them know what's 25:54 going on. Yeah, but I'm I'm glad you said that. Understand trying to be vulnerable to the 25:58 to the extent that you could build a bridge to them. Yes, and I don't I don't break down 26:03 crying in front of the kids to go through what Trump. Trying to say now. Listen, tell me 26:06 what you feel. Yeah. But it's up like yeah. yeah, this is another one. Thank you. Well, 26:12 those are great answer. What's your number one tip tips for protecting your marriage. 26:22 Someone wants to know who we just one, but a number one. >> I mean, list is Mean, 26:34 definitely. We are, you know, which one of the most favorite, Jesus? You prayer. 26:38 because there are times when. >> You just simply care how good your marriages, right, 26:46 juni God, you know, to be able to carry you through some challenges that neither one of 26:48 you can control. You and I think the other important thing with that. 26:55 >> Because we do we we talk and work with couples who are not believers. and those 27:03 contacts out so well. This is why I am a believer. Yeah, it's there are times when I 27:07 don't see things about myself and I refuse to accept them from her. Yeah. And I need 27:14 someone who I can trust to be able to reveal to me things about unwilling to accept from 27:22 anyone else. And God is the one who does that for me. he's the one who can help me to 27:27 see. Yeah, you know, your wife was right. You got She was right. You know, you 27:37 self-centered. >> And and and those those are profound. A profound the 27:41 opportunities to learn. And Cecil, of course, having having God and the marriage is 27:47 a profound and important thing. I would also say we talk about We talk about often 27:53 this because so many times people are frustrated and upset about things that their 28:02 spouse has done. Or in relationships, not just marriage. Yeah. The 28:09 relationships in general about things that, you know, your children didn't do for you on 28:14 your birthday. You know your your parents didn't do for you on your birthday anniversary. 28:21 And the question is what did you tell them that wanted to do that? You wanted them to do 28:24 that and the re the response in many cases is no or when they should know. Okay. You 28:31 know, we that. You know. Yeah. speaking to the choir. Yeah, I would say don't. 28:41 >> disappointed if you don't get what you want because you did. NASA won the scriptures 28:48 say that ye have not because you asked know. >> And I think it's also and I 28:52 think it's such a good thing to share this thing because in relationships, period, the 28:56 expectation right is it what is on both sides and any relationship, not just 29:02 marriage that when someone expresses see you, you know something or they're talking 29:05 to you. have an experience not too long ago we're going Yeah. >> Idea to have an experience 29:15 steel actually living through. Yeah. And I haven't gotten onto the other side of it yet. 29:21 But there was a person who expressed some something that they desire from me. 29:27 >> I was so. >> So be whatever. know, that's not an excuse. But I 29:37 recently realized that what I should have we talk about one percent most people who 29:45 culture Council and are helping people and conflict resolution. They they they 29:52 know to ask what's your one percent okay? Lets 99% of the other persons, you know, fall. 29:59 But what's your one percent? take ownership of anything. So for me processing was this 30:07 person still upset with me? After all this time when you know their request was was not 30:12 reasonable level law. So I think what the lower so me, yeah, he is that. What I 30:20 should have done as when they first communicated with me. I should have. Reflect it to 30:28 them. Is this what you do want from me? Is this what your expectations are? And then I 30:34 could have let this individual know that it was an T for me to meet or live up to what 30:42 they expected from me that way before we leave and they expect me to do acts. And I 30:52 don't really know what they're expecting me to do or it's not clear. You know, I can say, 30:59 listen, I hear what you want from me, but I'm not able to do that, right? So that was 31:05 for me it. Yeah, I'm that as always pass as but it is growth thing for me to be able 31:11 to own that. And for me to be able to say, no, I it was my responsibility to not allow 31:21 the other person to lead that conversation. Looking for me to do something that you just 31:25 said. I knew that it was not possible for me to do. so I can take ownership of that. So 31:31 expectations it's it's a two-way thing. We need to clarify. Make sure people are 31:35 clear. Whether we can or can't meet their expectations for If you understand what their 31:43 expectations are, you because sometimes expectations become become nothing more than a 31:47 ransom note. >> yeah. I need a million dollars. I can't do that. 31:51 That's right. And they put sometimes people put, I said to someone wants, don't expect 31:56 from someone what even the Lord himself, what next? A man and some people do that they 32:00 want to. They want the Lord that. can a flip that around with a lot as you didn't know 32:06 them by would you make what would you make? >> Yarrow. 32:11 >> Your demands higher than cars so that that's important. So what you're saying that I'm 32:15 here, you can click carefully is don't just say sure. it's what you expect. and then say, 32:22 well, you know. Stuff as is. I. Let me make disappointed, but I can't do that. 32:32 Absolutely. And then they'll say, OK, well, so you come to something negotiations. So 32:37 what else can I do since that's not a possibility. And then it opens dialogue. Yes. 32:41 Yeah. What do you think? And honey? >> from going right along with 32:46 you. it really does different I want to just prime to the Just join second now. How you 32:51 can still have time to send more questions. And the mail, those you have some more 32:55 questions. I appreciate those who have sent them. But if you want to send a question by 33:00 e-mail, go to live at 3ABN, Ott TV. Well, if you want to text them and that a 6, 1, 8, 33:07 2 to 8, 39. 75 6, 1, 8, 2, 2, 8, 3, 9, 7, 5, And we really appreciate this because this 33:16 so much. But about the Conways, his dimensional dimensional. Yeah. You know, 33:24 sometimes people have, you know, 4 sides. This is more Pentagon to octagon. You come 33:30 out from various ways and I appreciate. Yeah. Deep question. You 33:37 >> What's the first step in opening up to your partner about hidden secret art and 33:47 who deep hidden So I will say I know that, you know, acts press. I think 2 guys earlier 33:54 about. >> My background and I remember that. 33:58 >> I was a little nervous getting ready during the process of premier. Oh, yeah. 34:03 Of being able to tell him about I came from. You know, the things that have happened 34:06 to me and let me give them some contests. Okay. Okay. So. Literally. The first time that 34:14 she shares. Yeah context then, you know, outside of maybe her best friend, a what not write 34:23 about what she is experienced. All she's in a suicide prevention class at talk about 34:27 that in the book. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So season a suicide prevention class. One 34:32 of the exercises is for them to You know, and I'll let you take 34:40 >> You know, in order to help, we know that they tell you must first make your cell 34:44 phone bill you can understand where they're coming from right? And that was the first 34:48 time ever. I was probably in my early 20's. I was probably 19 race, turned 20 years old. 34:54 And I have and they access all to share something that we had never shared shared before. 34:57 You know, and that was the first time about ever told anyone that I had experienced 35:03 sexual abuse. Never tell. My parents never taught. And I was the type of kid who no one 35:07 would have ever been. No right. I was, you know, Jonjo Shelvey all wasn't raised in 35:13 an environment where you could even say those things, you sand. So but that day was 35:18 transformative for me because it was the first time that I ever admitted it to anyone. 35:24 And it just kind of went quick around the And, you know, people just got one. That was 35:29 the only one. But you could have told me that day that a switch wasn't turned. It was 35:33 got letting you know that it was time, right? So that began the process of my healing. 35:37 Again. You can read that more in the book, but when it came time on that he was brought 35:41 into my life. I knew that it was an important thing to share with him because you 35:46 don't do that, right? I would say I would advise not to do that. I would advise you don't 35:50 enter into a relationship without making sure the you both are where right certain 35:56 things. You know, ye all things. If you take it right, brain. Yeah. and I told him 36:00 during I'm one of our process of pre marriage counseling that that's my background. You 36:05 know, the various different aspects of experiences that I had she was crying. you know, 36:15 very emotional. As we were talking on telephone high phone haha. 36:22 >> What they were? She was she was talking and she was sharing I appreciate it. The 36:25 way she put it, she said, you know, I didn't feel like it was fair. 36:34 >> To marry without you knowing and giving you an opportunity to make a 36:38 decision, whether or not you still want to marry. now here's what I want to say. 36:42 want to say that, you know, that was a beautiful thing. That she did. However, there's 36:54 no way that we can know. Yeah, what it's like. To be in a relationship in a marriage 36:59 with someone who's experienced, whether it's verbal, emotional, sexual 37:07 physical spirit is spiritual, right? We can't know what it's like to live with that person. 37:11 But the blessing was that she had begun her healing process right? And so because she had 37:20 begun her healing process. She was making me aware that there's a process that I'm 37:26 going through and this is what I'm healing from. Yeah. And so it was for her. It was that to 37:31 answer the question. It was at the beginning, a long relationship a relationship. 37:36 Before we get you and it was a choice in the Re. We talk about this thing. The thing 37:40 about choice right? I felt like it was it was only proper, but I gave him a 37:45 choice because be honest with you. Not to be married to someone. I'm not defective 37:51 doesn't mean that I'm not worth being married to someone make that clear, But 37:54 >> it is a serious thing to marry. Someone who has been I mean, my goodness. If you 37:58 marry someone who has been to war right, they have to go saw Hailey, bright PTSD and why a 38:07 well, listen, it's the same thing with someone who has lived through some 38:09 catastrophic things in their lives because they will show up. They bring your 38:14 relationship if they are not addressed, especially if they're not healed more in the 38:19 process of healing. And so I wanted to give him that choice because I felt like that was 38:22 right. You know, just thought I would maybe I want to make this part clear. Hopefully. 38:28 >> I can you know, whenever the spirit of the lower leads you to share, you do that. But 38:35 I believe and we've talked about this often. One of the most important elements to 38:41 this is begin your healing process. Don't just. Don't just share about being broken. 38:50 Yeah. But share about being on the Potter's him like that to put you back together and as 38:59 time and say, we say about sales, we're in process. Yeah. And know, we're process. I 39:05 don't have it all together. And I don't you I don't understand everything there is 39:08 to understand about myself. But the Lord is, as the kids say, he's still working on me. 39:14 You know, I tell my church we are saints and the country. >> and that is something we 39:19 have to understand because people tend to people tend to magnify brokenness and others. 39:24 Yes, but, you know, there's not a person walking this planet that has not been 39:30 broken first by hereditary. Adam's DNA is enormous and fallen short of the glory of 39:37 God. But the other thing on a bring out is when you are in a broken relationship, don't 39:40 over generalize and you can deal with an issue by Ovid generalized to all centers. I 39:46 mean, we back from show. Yes, that's not going heal. You know, now now cow made 39:52 mistakes, which will need to you. How's that? You know, really some people over 39:56 generalized. Yes, miss their behavior. we actually had someone literally say to a 40:00 person who actually told their parents rightly, listen, you know, this is what happens to 40:05 me. You know, this is how life was being your child, right? I'll get over it. 40:10 >> Everybody's less to everybody's this, It's like all my I tell people all the 40:15 time that especially for parents and I think I sure that before officer repeat or 40:20 something like that, my my mom, I thank God for her even as an adult right, miles 40:29 family, my own children. My mother gave me something that was so powerful. I don't I 40:31 didn't meet her permission to heal. I'm going tell you something. Yeah. About 40:36 somebody willing to take responsibility for the trauma that they impart into your 40:40 life. My mother sat me down one day and she was so got it was the moving of God as she 40:45 came in. She said, you know what time I want to apologize to all. I was in my own 40:50 process and I was so hurt and bubble and me tell you something that my mother 40:57 taking responsibility for the part she played in some of the trauma yet helped me to prep. 41:00 It propelled my healing process. Yes. >> Through the roof, right? So 41:05 you don't need people from But if you're parent tonight and you know that do your children 41:09 who have been a home where they saw some stuff in her, some stuff don't use you 41:13 growing up in the same situation and you made it. All right. First of all, whether 41:16 or not you made it all right. Question this You know, saying give your children the 41:25 blessing of being able to acknowledge the part you play so that they can heal on 41:28 purpose. know me he'll on purple. Yes. >> If you confuse what their 41:34 intentions are and you could make it even more. Yes, and there's some people just had 41:40 this to some really great questions coming up here. Yeah, there's some people that 41:43 don't want to admit Eyre. They're there. Yeah, that they lit the match. And the fire 41:51 burned up so many people. They want to just kind of its just be nice after the fact, 41:57 without even acknowledging their behavioral deficits that brought about this heard. 42:04 Yeah. but then there are people even in families. Yes, that is saying. I don't even 42:11 want to in the same room with that person. Yeah, because I looked at this. So many times 42:17 and it's just there's no nobody's home. You're going to be no, they did anything 42:23 wrong. Yeah. Even acknowledge it. Yeah. So that's why I'm glad you said that. Healing on 42:27 purpose. want to go back to that. Yes, but don't that that person's behavior hold you 42:33 hostage >> As you that people could BP P people to be Haas. 42:36 >> They can make themselves hostages while you're trying to free them. Amen. they want 42:43 somebody to do something to free them. Yeah. And of the free. You have this person 42:52 that said that they need to open up the with the deep hidden secret. Plus, that's 42:56 watching the documentary wants in this. A woman every to a serial killer. 43:00 >> Well, >> he and I watched soon, though, some time ago. And she 43:07 didn't know they know she was married to him. He kept it secret until it was discovered 43:14 that he was I mean, I don't think this person is going know. but this goes right in 43:24 line with what we're talking about. How do you approach to give Nus do you make 43:32 forgiveness? Therapeutic? >> Well, I'm sorry we're right. 43:35 >> From Brooklyn, New York. >> So I want to first say that this person were not laughing 43:40 at you, right? They were laughing because this was one of the things that we said 43:44 tonight that we wanted to address in the rooms of forgiveness and forgiveness is 43:47 a very interesting thing, especially amongst Christians right for many of us. The 43:52 concept of forgiveness that we have is one of the thing we just talked about before, 43:57 which is the person must first have sorrow. They must you know, repentant yet in order 44:03 for me to forgive. And that is front the farthest thing from the truth, that there is a 44:07 difference between forgiveness and reconciliation. >> Almost jumped I men. You 44:12 know what? Okay? Sure. Program, Because and powerful. >> The truth is if it has 44:21 taken me years to really understand that and what really actually drove that 44:25 home for me is working with people, grief really because as a Christian, I felt like, 44:29 well, it's our duty, you know, so forgiving forgiveness means for a lot of people, a lot of 44:35 different things. Forgiveness means if I forgive you that means that we stay together. 44:38 Forgiveness means offer. If I forgive you that you don't have to pay or you don't. Do 44:42 you know what you do? It was OK, we don't bring it. You know, there's a lot of 44:48 different connotations around what forgiveness means right ultimately the forgiveness 44:52 that God has for his people is a divine thing right. And I understand that we are to 44:57 mimic him, but I'm not him come on. My has not been des up at this. You know, able is 45:05 who are disabled, right? So while I may be around someone who's molested me and I can 45:08 forgive them right? I have not forgotten. Those memories are not as painful right as they 45:15 were. But it does not mean I have to be in community. Might that parties Yes, boundaries. 45:24 I'm a person who believes yet that all relationships require boundary. Yes, and so is very 45:28 important for us to understand that forgiveness does not mean reconciliation. In all cases. 45:32 It may happen. All right. For some people, God be with a praise. God, I believe in 45:36 that. But I also know that we have to get some point. We accept that there are some 45:39 people can be forgiven, but they cannot be brought back into community because they 45:43 either are not repentant or they are not safe. Right. And there's consequences to the 45:50 decisions and the choices we make. And we tell people that we deal with this. And you 45:53 know this, Pastor Wright in churches, you have people who have unfortunately does some 45:59 heinous things, right, rather is to a person children or whatever, right. And I can't 46:03 tell you how many people pastors are dealing with this right now where there's a 46:06 person who was a sex offender or who has done something right. And you have turned to 46:11 boards who are voting to allow this person right to be in community where there are 46:18 children always. Are we supposed to forgive? Yes, we are supposed to be gay, but 46:20 let me tell you something. Some people cannot be brought back into that type of 46:26 community. Exactly. You know, the scripture that fits into that pastor and wife, his. 46:31 >> Do not let send rain and your mortal body. Yes, not everybody is going to make 46:34 that conscious decision to not let it. Yeah. And I said to people what's still left? You 46:39 know, the Lord forgave us. He, you know, he delivered us from the penalty of Sen he. Is 46:47 capable willingness to deliver us from the power of Sen. But that's a choice. You got to 46:51 make. One sent presents itself. Remember, you still have this mortal body and all 46:56 that baggage. Just the stuff you didn't perpetrated. You don't know at what level that 47:01 person is and whether they are safe any longer. So it is incumbent on us leaders to 47:08 create any church without safeguards is a dangerous. I have mercy. I don't think that 47:12 the church is by default. All you can trust everybody here. You don't put a child molester 47:20 a 7 school classmate known for being kid in God. >> There's no way. 47:24 >> I think a lot of people come for a lot of times as Christians. We confuse. How 47:31 God treats us. Yeah. With the way that we. Can treat each other, right? What's possible 47:38 for us right now? This side of of heaven and times of the way that we that we treat one 47:43 another week. We feel as though, well, God does this and therefore, so, you know, 47:51 with the Bible talks about the parable of the parable to Jesus told about the unjust 47:57 Stuart, where 10,000 talents. Couldn't is. Give me time time. And the King forgives 48:02 them. Then he goes out and you know, this gentleman owes him a couple. And he grabs him by 48:09 the throat. Yeah. Thrown in jail and so forth and so on. A lot of us, we take that and we 48:13 like to see see if I don't for a know, in the way that God does. Thank God is not going 48:24 to forgive me. And I think one of the things that we probably overlooked and looking at that 48:32 that parable number one. You know, a few Pence. He could actually repay and a few days, 48:39 10,000 talents. You have 100 lifetimes. You still not going to repay that right? And what 48:48 he was, what he was, what the team punish them and 4 was not that he asked. But it was his 48:57 harsh treatment of someone who had a dead. Yeah, right. And the king says if I have 49:05 forgiven you all of this, you ought also to right. In other words, commissioner it to what 49:12 he has done to you. There needs to be forgiveness. So God is not telling us that we 49:17 need to. We need to do you know what he does in an absolute sense with every 49:22 single year person because commensurate to what the person is done there is is he. 49:31 So I think we we confuse that and find that that church members above all are ones who 49:34 are. Who have the most difficult time with differentiating what 49:41 forgiveness actually means for us. And humans fear. And also the church has the protection. 49:45 The conferences place along. We have didn't have a kids disappear, you know, having to 49:49 them. Yeah. >> And you just big churches. But now the comp all the 49:53 savage assault as is shield, the vulnerable that's on than they did do a background check 50:00 on that should well, really not everybody not everybody does and who should be how it 50:07 changes that we do that? And that we could open up children to fall we do a background. 50:15 Check anybody and don't take for granted because you in the country that will have yeah, I 50:21 have so many so have very little time. And these are some powerful questions. 50:27 >> I am a single adult who feels like I have been traumatized through the 50:32 repeated stories about abuse that took place in my family. How can I overcome all the 50:37 fears that I feel light that I feel like have been passed down to me likely with good 50:45 intentions and about relationships. I really want to break free from the belief 50:52 that relationships always end up abuse. >> That is as powerful. And 50:58 unfortunately there's a lot of people to have those type of experiences. You we I don't 51:06 know how to say it, but, you know, there's a there's certain circles where we try 51:10 to protect right. And we actually end up passing along a lot of trauma. And so I 51:17 would say there's a lot. There are other people who are just like you, you know, who are 51:20 out there finding group's safe groups. You know, people that you can be transparent with an 51:24 honest with can walk with you through that process. You know, I happened to pretty 51:29 soon belong to the by counseling dot So there's a lot of those things that are 51:34 available for people who need to walk the processes healing. So that's one avenue that you 51:40 can take, you know, getting actual counseling to give you tools to process through that. 51:44 >> Very, very good. Think you've got a hit this one, OK? >> How do you stop the cycle 51:49 has been taken advantage of his wife. >> By not helping around the 51:53 home. No work in. I'm currently a registered nurse and my spouse hasn't paid any 51:59 bills for 15 years. >> I've prayed foot for it. If it's in God's will, to allow 52:07 him to help me for so very long. He has no health issues. >> How do you stop the cycle? 52:15 He loves the Lord. Carla from Texas. Not not a lot >> he's on the card. 52:30 >> first, let me say at the moment. So let me say this. You know, we don't always know 52:35 when we have questions like this. We're all the details sold. True. You know. Yeah, 52:43 also pay bill for 15 years, but you know that the thing that was said at the end as he 52:47 loves the Lord. You know, these are assumptions that we make. With ow what without 53:03 evidence that says that he loves the And so I think. You know, if we've excepted all I 53:09 know this person loves the Lord. Then it sets the table for us to excuse some 53:16 behaviors yet just because we say, oh, they love the Lord or and you know that they're 53:23 they're not helping with the bills, but they read the 9 volumes of the testimonies. 53:27 And so that must be. But it is got to be of a 9 volumes. yeah. 53:32 >> That you need to help with the okay. I know call that also a neighborly. Sometimes 53:39 we are a bowler's and in. So I want to say that, Karl, if you listen in, sometimes we can 53:44 and able behaviors and make excuses for That may be a good start, right? Telling 53:48 ourselves the truth ourselves, that roofers and then what we can tell ourselves the truth 53:53 about the reality of it. Then we can move to telling other people that you. 53:58 >> The other the other thing about the truth that thank The other is. And then again, we 54:04 without knowing all the details. Do I really want them to change 6 because there's 54:11 there's this thing hold a call that his old Where? >> You know, as long as Person 54:17 X is broken, yes, is that it gives me someone in and someone someone to work on. Do 54:24 really? And so this is we were talking about this earlier. I think in terms of 54:27 >> just before we can share truth with others. there's this phrase speak truth to 54:33 power 0, yeah, they want to speak truth to right. We need to speak it to ourselves 54:39 here's where the power he is. we need to So, yeah, I know he's getting I think this is I 54:46 mean, I'm just I'm just sitting here trying to myself that I know address so we can 54:52 President and I just want to be serious about the matter because you think that. 54:54 >> I don't know what is in hot like you said So factors that has submit questions. Yes, but 55:02 just make sure. Number reiterate, what has it passes? Why said try not to be the one 55:07 in powering this behavior. Yes, because one year. >> I know 2 years, but when 55:14 you said if if they have no health health issues, when you see how these Michael, she 55:20 says script is as husbands, love your wives as Christ loved the church as lord 55:25 saying he loves me, but it's not providing any my needs and he doesn't want to forgive me. 55:29 He doesn't take care of me. There has to be evidence that that love is Jan does say 55:34 Honey, I love you, but I going to work. So that's really we've got a minute. 26 seconds 55:41 to give you most of that to just thank you for coming to join us down a full life. I 55:46 know you've been touch. Do you accept invitations to come to seminars and speak places? 55:52 >> But let me say this one of the reasons why we are trying to, you know, time is both an 55:58 we point people to the website and the folks know we're working on and and online 56:05 media content is where primarily right now because we just can't go everywhere. 56:10 >> Right. But he's up at half full district. Conway, thank you for coming. I'm so glad we 56:16 host I Conway, Tamra Tammy mother and for 2 sets of Yeah, it's been rich has been rich. 56:25 >> And I'm operating site. Great insight. Oh, yeah. And you can only get better as 56:33 Scott continues to guide you and your amazing things. God guides us sometimes through 56:36 the window of our own Thank you, sister. A common for being vulnerable and and house 56:43 before allowing her to do that. Yeah. The next time you argue with the kids in the 56:52 backseat. >> I think already and so on. >> Radio audience on 56:56 television audience, we've appreciated your support continue to remember stamina 56:59 for a live human. Here's what we get from the Lord as well as from those who love the 57:04 Look forward to seeing you. >> Next time, an we've ♪ 57:15 ♪ ♪ ♪ 57:30 ♪ ♪ ♪ 57:45 ♪ ♪ ♪ |
Revised 2022-09-13