Welcome back to the second hour
of 3 aetn Thursday night live.
It is all the way live.
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Yes, it is. You've just
joined us. We're talking about
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something that. >> To some
people may what we have to talk,
but that we're talking about.
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>> The LGBTQ, a community to
talk about. And this is
something that is sweeping the
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nation. The world sweeping the
world. And here we are in
America being challenged on
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levels that parents are not even
aware that the school, whether
private or public some
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churches are resisting the
rising tide, but it's just a
matter of time before a
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society tries to overwhelm those
beliefs that we have held so
dear. And I think a
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lot for our guests tonight has
been talking about that. But if
people have questions, they
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can email us can't pay Kan off K
and tell them where we can get
those questions. Honey.
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>> Live at 3 ABN DOT TV sent
emails and and you can also text
them in at 618-228-3975.
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And I do. >> Have a
question right here, OK?
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>> Wayne besides Council in,
what did you do specifically? To
what did you specifically
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do to live in the 4th column?
Rebuild. >> Well, that is the
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column that I'm seeking to live
in now. And combined with
therapy and talking about things
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of the past that might have
influenced me and and dealing
with those issues. It's also
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important that I would live much
like I did in the renounce The
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where I again was surrendering.
My temptations my desires to
Christ. But being involved in my
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church community, my church
family developing
accountability. I think it's
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important for people to to get
involved. If you're a woman get
involves whether women's group
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are man and man's groups and
churches that are less common,
but they're becoming more
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developed today because this the
world is is encroaching upon us
with all its passions
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and desires. And and, you know,
the things that Satan is waving
at us, there are more
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men's accountability groups
dealing with pornography issues
things like that. I'm
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I'm returning when I go home. A
big, joining in a men's group
who has opened their
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door to me having had same sex
attraction because we're really
in this together or
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not. It's not an independent
thing. We want to be there for
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one another. >> And you
mentioned something that if
you're just joining us, you
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might wonder what is the 4th
column because he's problem has
been on for an hour now and the
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different views on Christian
doctrine, identity and
homosexuality. primarily in 4
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particular categories, wages to
that quick sweep of those 4
categories and more time on
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the rebuild to resist column
again, arming the rebel column
and some people thought it was
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the rebel column and I might as
well be because it someone
actually that reveling in
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their sand. >> Not being
shameful about it, not being
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embarrassed about it, but
actually proclaiming this is who
I am. I don't need to do
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anything about it. God made me
this way. And the resist column
would be those who sort of
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have a sense of morality and a
little bit in the sense that
they don't believe in
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promiscuity a sexual abuse of
any kind. But they will maintain
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the LGBT identity. They may go
as far as saying a monogamous,
same sex relationship would be
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OK with God. But then I present
scripture and say I don't have
any backing for that from The
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renounce column is coming in
agreement with scripture saying
that I surrendered my
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life to Christ. I desire to do
his will and not my own to leave
the flash. The fleshly
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desires and give those to Christ
to surrender. Does iris and
temptations. But even
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those can be considered cent
fall. And just as anyone who
even identifies as a head or a
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sexual, if you contemplate those
for very long, the book of James
tells us yes, those
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things can become sanfl because
they conjure up last and we're
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concentrating on lost in the end
in that position. But it's kind
of a dead stop. That's as well.
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Here I am. I gave everything to
God. And I'm you now I'm just
sitting here waiting and
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I'm not doing a whole bunch
more, whereas in the rebuilt
column puts me on the
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trajectory of further healing in
Christ in transformation that
comes through Christ. As
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I'm walking with him, combining
cycle analysis or mental therapy
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along with Christianity. So you
want to you want to find a good
Christian therapist who it
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agrees with exactly what
scripture does, but is able to
deal with your real life
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situations way have which may
have weighed in heavily on your
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life through and incidents of
abuse or incest or traumatic
episode of some kind. They're
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through psychology and cycle
analysis. There are those who
are trained that can perhaps
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bring you in into a greater
state of healing that God would
desire for you again, entering
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into the sexual integrity that
God designed for man for for all
time rather than the
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substitute that the enemy has so
been. So proliferate about
getting out substitute. You're
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right. >> Sure. The substitute
awful. You know, but they
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wouldn't be substitute. Now.
That's the key. There wouldn't
be substitutes. And the Steelers
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age an UN counteract the count
offense. So this network is
trying counteract counterfeit
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and this is what this problem is
all about. Just to kind of go
over that on a different
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level when Wayne said rebel. We
also he's rebel, but rebel means
this is why am I have K
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partnership? I'm going to stay
here in the resist column. Now
goes to gay identity
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identifying with tech cut with
that. That choice and I'm not
looking for any different
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changes, but then renounce as
with many people got stuck, they
come pence. I repent of
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the way I live like a purse, not
repent of my All the things I've
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done wrong. I repent of that.
But a lot of people get stuck
there thinking that if I burn
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all my books that I read, if I
get rid of all the wrong things
that I watched by empty my
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alcohol cabin and throw my
marijuana butts out. If I change
the way I used to live
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in discontinue those kinds of
practices that I'm good. But
that's not what you're saying
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saying we've got to get to the
place where God gives us beauty
for ashes. And that's
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with the rebuilding comes in.
Correct? Correct? Yeah. >> I'm
there and I want talk
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again about the conversion or
reparative therapy that there's
so concentration from
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the LGBT plus community and
activists today that are wanting
to criminalize this
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and that we spoke. It's criminal
in 14 countries around the
world. There are so
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many people that are saying the
damage that has com by
conversion or reparative
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therapy. But I think that's
mainly coming from people that
don't have and interest in
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what scripture has to say. And
they're upset because scripture
would indicate that
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that guy doesn't place has and
on being transgender or bisexual
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or homosexual. You know, as as
relates to scripture itself. For
a long time, there wasn't
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anything to make refuting this.
But there's a study that was
finished, incomplete, done by
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Carolyn P law and Philip Sutton
that is available online it
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shows they are people that have
done a study with 75
participants that worst getting
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supposedly the conversion and
reparative therapy if that's
what it the Category one would
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want to put them under. And the
study is called Sexual
Attraction, Fluidity and
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well-being in men, a therapeutic
outcomes study that is beginning
to show legislators and the AP A
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today that there is benefits and
there isn't minimal benefits
from people who are
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going through therapeutic
treatment, who are experiencing
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this significance drop and their
same sex attraction in some even
and going to the point of ending
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up and a relationship of
marriage between a man and woman
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and then associate scripture and
the Bible along with that, you
know, that's bringing them to
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great healing in their lives. So
this is very beneficial. >> What
transgender when they
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totally change the natural. So I
understand that from gender
dysphoria and having had that
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Intel, I was 18 years old. >>
There was very much this. I
thought that God had made a
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huge mistake. And without
without an understanding of the
nature of sand and what it
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did to us or let's say you have
a experience a father or a
mother or yeah, are you
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raised only by a single parent
or there so many things that can
contribute to the fact
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that you don't feel comfortable
in the gender of which you were
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born. But if we go back and we
look and see the influences.
Study, those influences. Get
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counseling for those things and
go to scripture. Yes, and and
agree with who cry says that I
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am. Christ gives me purpose and
value and meaning when I see who
I am in and what his
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design for me is. Today, what's
happening even inside of
Christianity today is an
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adaptation that is putting the
scalpel the hands of those who
want to play God. But John
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Hopkins has done research on
this. They used to while they
they did read sexual
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reassignment surgeries. They
stopped for a while they did
some studies on this and then
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they have begun again doing the
sexual reassignment surgeries.
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But one of the statistics that
they brought out was that 49% of
those who have sexual
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reassignment surgeries consider
and 39% are successful. Don't
know. So even as a person who
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who and has the full operation
done upper upper and lower
surgery goes through all of the
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hormone treatments. When you
stand in front of the mirror,
you still know that inside
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your chromosomes have not
changed. You're still the person
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that you tried to escape. It's
only through Jesus Christ that
you're actually going to find
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the true value in true meaning
of who she says has designed you
to be the the negative effects
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of of what you're experiencing.
You can know that in the day
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have this coming. You will be
brought to a position of
perfection in Christ. The man.
00:11:00.72\00:11:05.69
Thank you for that. Here's a
comment. What the sincere and
encourage an appeal. They said.
00:11:05.69\00:11:11.87
>> Please keep up the good
work among us and to the world.
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essence in appreciation, civil
>> thank you, Ice. I appreciate
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that so much because, well, it's
not and it's not always easy
sitting in this position and
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it's a difficult conversation.
And I find that in our own
denomination, we've been
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avoiding these conversations in
churches and on university
campuses today. But if we
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would talk about this from a
redemptive standpoint, we it
seems as though we've made
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God, if a tenant at times
because God is in the business
of miracles, God is in the
00:11:43.57\00:11:47.50
business of healing. Scott is
asking. He got says I'll do my
part. If you also do your
00:11:47.50\00:11:52.37
part. And so we we we're not
going to experience this healing
unless we're actually
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engaging with her eyesight. >>
Another comment absolutely
beautiful. I'm not of the
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LGBTQ community, but you'll
would sauce bought on. And thank
you. Get a heart. Hazel
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are. Here's a question. Please
explain the Greek on the stand
in interpretation of the word
00:12:10.26\00:12:17.20
homosexual. Sure. Thank you
for your testimony and ministry.
00:12:17.20\00:12:22.04
You're welcome. Pastor, you may
have something to say on this
well. The word Hama, sexual was
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not introduced into scripture
and tell the I believe it was
the late 50's or early 60's.
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>> And I am often confronted
with from. >> People in the well
00:12:32.95\00:12:40.42
that would call themselves LGBT
Christians that, well, Jesus
didn't say anything directly
00:12:40.42\00:12:44.89
about homosexuality and that the
word homosexual wasn't even in
the Bible for a long
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period of time. And that what
really the God has a problem
with is men who have sex with
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a young boys and that the
European translations suggest
the idea that that's what
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Jesus has a problem with it. So
I researched that and I I did
the background check on
00:13:01.94\00:13:09.15
that. And in the Hebrew, I in
the Old the word male is in in
the Old Testament. 82 times
00:13:09.15\00:13:18.79
only 2 times are referring to a
male child and that is in on the
8th day of circumcision.
00:13:18.79\00:13:25.13
so I would say this if there are
European translations that are
saying, yeah, you know,
00:13:25.13\00:13:31.01
having man having sex with a
young boy, then that would say
that translation is actually
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what's in error. But to to
address the word in the in the
Greek, the word in the Greek,
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which I can't I can never even
pronounce. It's Malik OCS. And
the other one was starts with
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an a R. Well, this one here,
particularly the passage. I'm
referring to the scripture we
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read earlier. Yes, the talk, but
on the sexual. >> that that's
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the first one will address
moving up the other just a
moment. But the word Malik host,
00:13:59.90\00:14:03.51
if you look at that in the
Greek, it also refers to those
who have effeminate behaviors.
00:14:03.51\00:14:11.68
But it's another word that was
introduced. That takes us back
to the old Greek practice,
00:14:11.68\00:14:13.75
which to find that even more.
Clearly the white Katya might
look that up because a lot of
00:14:13.75\00:14:20.49
people that's not a word we use
nowadays in Larry. But when you
go back to the Greek
00:14:20.49\00:14:24.33
Culture Academy might was a
relationship. And this is kind
of the very hard to explain
00:14:24.33\00:14:31.00
here. But the Katmai was a
relationship younger boy and an
older male. In a sexual
00:14:31.00\00:14:37.87
way, OK? And that's why the word
was later changed to homeless
00:14:37.87\00:14:41.38
sexual because he was, in fact,
an act between 2 men. The in the
cattle might weigh was different
00:14:41.38\00:14:48.65
ages and you may have heard of
N***** the North American
Man-boy Love Association. That's
00:14:48.65\00:14:52.85
what the captain might but
abroad in the Category one. This
practice was Dan practiced
00:14:52.85\00:14:57.53
among people of similar age.
That's why one of the
definitions there was a
00:14:57.53\00:15:01.93
famine. It person who is a catch
to might having a relationship
00:15:01.93\00:15:06.74
between 2 people of the same
sex. >> Starting the and getting
the aid. That definitions been
00:15:06.74\00:15:10.91
a while since I've done this, we
really comes back to the idea of
of what is meant by
00:15:10.91\00:15:17.55
the word homosexual. It is still
2 males that are engaging with
00:15:17.55\00:15:23.79
sex with one another. So I would
say this and I frequently share
this with those. I'm not there
00:15:23.79\00:15:29.09
that they're in my audiences
because they don't generally
come to my audiences. But
00:15:29.09\00:15:32.19
those identifying as LGBT. If
you see God's word is being
sound. And for all time and
00:15:32.19\00:15:42.17
that God knows the beginning
from the from the end and that
his word is truth. And so with
00:15:42.17\00:15:48.08
let's go to scripture, we have
the example that God has given
and his design between a man
00:15:48.08\00:15:51.95
and a woman. And intimacy as
being a gift that's given to the
man and the woman from
00:15:51.95\00:16:01.56
Genesis, 2 revelation. And it
says even there that what God
has ordained that no man, you
00:16:01.56\00:16:04.93
know, separate. So we only have
that example. If you want to
come, let's fast forward 2
00:16:04.93\00:16:13.74
judgment day where you're going
to say to God, all I knew you
would only approve of
00:16:13.74\00:16:17.77
me in a same sex monogamous
relationship of which I have
remained. But there's no
00:16:17.77\00:16:23.85
scripture that backs that
Wouldn't you say that? That's a
tricky evil God. If God is
00:16:23.85\00:16:29.85
not going to give us the same
example of what he honors and
glorifies between a man and a
00:16:29.85\00:16:34.56
woman, how evil, how awful and
how confusing if God didn't gave
the same affirmation or
00:16:34.56\00:16:42.00
approval for those who are
saying gendered that? I have to
go on the word of truth
00:16:42.00\00:16:48.00
because on judgment day, I'm
held to what it was that I that
I came to know from
00:16:48.00\00:16:53.44
scripture and he will use an UH,
oh, this is Satan. Does they
want to confuse people?
00:16:53.44\00:16:58.41
Yeah. And this is a big
confusion that happens nowadays
00:16:58.41\00:17:03.15
and >> let's not even add to it.
The part that social media
plays. That's a very that's
00:17:03.15\00:17:08.36
not the reason for the existence
of this community. But that
00:17:08.36\00:17:14.73
plays a major role able act a
strong impact. A lot of people
think that this is something
00:17:14.73\00:17:17.00
that only the Apostle Paul
mentioned and I heard tennis. So
yes, I heard a documentary done
00:17:17.00\00:17:23.57
on national television where
theologians with trying to
explain that Paul had an issue.
00:17:23.57\00:17:28.91
That's why he was so difficult
on this particular topic. But
Paul was not the first one to
00:17:28.91\00:17:32.65
introduce this by any means. You
found this was talked about in
the book of Leviticus, a chapter
00:17:32.65\00:17:38.95
20, a verse 13 assists if a man
lies with a male as he lies with
00:17:38.95\00:17:45.69
a woman, both of them have
committed an abomination. This
is Paul wasn't even a thought.
00:17:45.69\00:17:50.50
This was thousands of years
before Paul the law to establish
these principles and why. And
00:17:50.50\00:17:54.50
this is something that modern
society wants to make. It seem
odd because nowadays, you
00:17:54.50\00:18:01.01
know, I want marry a woman, a
man marry a man. But in the
Garden of Eden, can you
00:18:01.01\00:18:04.51
imagine if if and just not
cynical by any means, but this
is the point it has to be
00:18:04.51\00:18:11.52
made. made the human race so
that it could be fruitful and
multiply. Yes. And even today
00:18:11.52\00:18:18.06
people have a difficulty
defining. I saw an example. One
person says, well, what is
00:18:18.06\00:18:22.43
a woman? What is the man? And it
almost seems like a question
nowadays that people
00:18:22.43\00:18:28.00
are fearful of answering. Yeah,
exactly. Which seems so. Yes,
because now get that out.
00:18:28.00\00:18:34.81
Now they're looking to that
criminal laws into place that
00:18:34.81\00:18:37.81
say. >> You know, I have to have
the right to be identified by
the gender that I say I am not
00:18:37.81\00:18:42.42
that Scripture says that I am.
And so again, we're competing
with scripture. That's well
00:18:42.42\00:18:48.79
and fine. If you're not trusting
and believing in God. But but
for those who do we
00:18:48.79\00:18:55.50
should, we should still have the
religious freedom that allows us
00:18:55.50\00:18:59.03
to operate in accordance with
the word of God, a man. And
here's another question.
00:18:59.03\00:19:03.51
>> How do you deal with someone
who and who identifies as a gay
00:19:03.51\00:19:10.15
Christian? >> How do you deal
with Let's I want to deal with
everybody from the standpoint of
00:19:10.15\00:19:14.25
compassion and care, giving them
value and importance. but they
come from a different
00:19:14.25\00:19:19.79
position of their understanding.
I had that question actually
00:19:19.79\00:19:24.09
come to me the other day and ice
by somebody who was responding
to an article that I had written
00:19:24.09\00:19:28.76
on this very topic about
conversion or reparative
therapy. And he was talking
00:19:28.76\00:19:33.97
about being LGBT and that he
knows that God loves him. And so
why with Nye? Well, I dude
00:19:33.97\00:19:40.04
love and care about those who
identify as LGBT. Plus. But when
we take the word gay,
00:19:40.04\00:19:45.71
which denoting, the idea that
desire to have relations with
someone sexual relations of
00:19:45.71\00:19:52.69
someone of the same gender,
Christian, it's almost like I'm
putting my son before
00:19:52.69\00:19:59.26
Christ or anybody in my yeah. My
desire which God doesn't condone
before him and saying
00:19:59.26\00:20:03.63
I'm a I'm a person who prefers
this. Christian bank. Okay.
Well, God is going to
00:20:03.63\00:20:10.67
acknowledge that as your choice,
he honors what your choices. But
00:20:10.67\00:20:15.51
we don't see people in the
church identifying as
heterosexual Christians. How
00:20:15.51\00:20:20.38
come we've gone again to first
Corinthians 6, 9.10 and we've
taken homosexuality out of the
00:20:20.38\00:20:24.35
group and we've given its
special rights. But I think
their rights that the LGBT
00:20:24.35\00:20:29.99
community gave themselves and
then they inflicted it and
enforced it and called out our
00:20:29.99\00:20:37.33
entities to concur with them
and actually many denominations
00:20:37.33\00:20:42.20
today are splitting on this
topic. And we we were at risk of
that in our own denomination
00:20:42.20\00:20:48.51
today because we don't have on
our campuses. We don't have any
support groups for someone
00:20:48.51\00:20:53.18
with unwanted same-sex
attraction or feeling that
they're the different gender
00:20:53.18\00:20:57.82
where if we had Bible studies
and we had faculty coming around
those individuals and
00:20:57.82\00:21:01.52
train with imagine the
transformations that could be
happening and are not us, not
00:21:01.52\00:21:07.50
the power of humans, but under
the Holy spirit and the of God.
Thank you. Instead were
00:21:07.50\00:21:13.13
caving in to the social agenda
and we're following what we have
now on all university
00:21:13.13\00:21:17.27
campuses, except for one that I
know of is okay. Straight
alliance that says this is who
00:21:17.27\00:21:21.84
I am. This is how identify and
the church needs to us accept
that and God's fine with it.
00:21:21.84\00:21:27.88
So we're not seeking for a way
out were seeking for a way to
endorse, but human say social
00:21:27.88\00:21:33.99
media says and what I feel
personally, rather, then then
the sovereignty and the
00:21:33.99\00:21:39.43
authority of Jesus Christ. >>
somebody asked a question is has
a I really thank the
00:21:39.43\00:21:47.17
Lord 4 where he has brought me
from. And I decided just came to
him. But I still get into
00:21:47.17\00:21:54.21
my selfishness. So where can I
find the help to break this
chain? that will go ahead
00:21:54.21\00:22:03.85
there. I went there there. There
is hope we don't. And you know
what? You might have
00:22:03.85\00:22:06.19
to stir the help a little bit.
>> But in your church
environment, you should. I
00:22:06.19\00:22:12.76
believe today as as we're seeing
what's happening in the world
today and we're seen
00:22:12.76\00:22:17.40
house and is being elevated and
how we've whitewash so much
other San that the things
00:22:17.40\00:22:24.27
that we have whitewashing
the past like selfishness like
00:22:24.27\00:22:29.41
gossip. >> You know, overeating
on the things in the Bible. The
spoken to all right. That
00:22:29.41\00:22:35.98
there are groups of people,
God's remnant that are coming
together and I see it
00:22:35.98\00:22:41.92
happening even in my own church
on and on and on a daily basis.
00:22:41.92\00:22:45.36
There are meeting at 06:30AM, in
the morning for half an hour
prayer every single day. Those
00:22:45.36\00:22:48.66
from the church who will come
together to pray for one James
5.16, again, come together and
00:22:48.66\00:22:55.50
share your weaknesses. Your
faults with one another and pray
for the healing that is
00:22:55.50\00:23:00.38
promised. And so through fasting
in from prayer and through
prayer and through study, I
00:23:00.38\00:23:04.58
believe that God brings
conviction upon our hearts. That
while one thing is in front of
00:23:04.58\00:23:11.95
me, God may help me and and
getting that pushed aside. But
as soon as it is, he says now
00:23:11.95\00:23:16.59
here's something else that I
would like you to take a look
at. So, you know, actually after
00:23:16.59\00:23:20.53
the evening here shortly or
hereafter, I've recognize that
as Scott is instructed us of
00:23:20.53\00:23:27.47
the danger of our appetites and
passions as it relates to and
time issues and not having
00:23:27.47\00:23:32.27
the strength that we really
need. I want more strength and I
know how week I am. And so
00:23:32.27\00:23:39.95
I'm heading to a lifestyle
center that will help me and
making better choices. I'm not
00:23:39.95\00:23:44.29
crazy about again, I'm not crazy
about other things. You know, it
would be great. I'm a
00:23:44.29\00:23:51.19
vegetarian. But to BB gun for me
is like if the food tasted the
way it did in the Garden
00:23:51.19\00:23:56.06
of Eden, it would be so much
areas and slavery. What I would
want to be big and all
00:23:56.06\00:24:00.94
the time. >> But but this, you
know, when I think about process
00:24:00.94\00:24:06.98
food, there are a lot of things
and chemicals and whatnot that
00:24:06.98\00:24:09.81
are in there that could very
much affect your ability to make
real good choices. The point and
00:24:09.81\00:24:15.42
so, yeah, I think there's a lot
that can be done for even this
was seems to be the smallest
00:24:15.42\00:24:19.95
and least in significant of
sense. >> And, you know, and a
00:24:19.95\00:24:24.16
direct answer, my wife, Tempe,
on the show because I Tyson
called breaking the chain. Yes,
00:24:24.16\00:24:27.73
you did. to make a very
important point, this is this is
huge. This is powerful. If you
00:24:27.73\00:24:34.07
have to get a chance to read the
story and acts chapter 12 and
this the story of Peter being
00:24:34.07\00:24:36.14
bound in chains right? And then
being tied to the guards who
were chained to the wall.
00:24:36.14\00:24:41.58
So p was down to people in
chains to a change to the wall.
So it seemed impossible
00:24:41.58\00:24:45.08
almost to be freed. But the Lord
broke his chains. And this is
something that this is
00:24:45.08\00:24:51.19
what you're talking about. And I
want you to grab this in the
context when Peters chains
00:24:51.19\00:24:56.26
will broken. Hope you're ready
for this. He was still in
prison. His chains will broken
00:24:56.26\00:25:04.30
and he was still in prison. This
is powerful when you read the
story next up to 12, this
00:25:04.30\00:25:08.24
is what happened. The lawyer
didn't leave him in. The Bible,
said the angel tapped
00:25:08.24\00:25:13.91
him on his side will come up.
Yeah. Broke his chains and he
said follow me. And this is
00:25:13.91\00:25:20.68
something that going to take off
on this when you're ready just
start running around the
00:25:20.68\00:25:25.29
Haha, the Lord. Let him past the
first Kate. The second Kate. And
the very last Cape.
00:25:25.29\00:25:32.89
The Lord let him through was
the iron And then the Angel left
00:25:32.89\00:25:39.97
him. So here's my application.
There are many of you whose
chains were broken from whatever
00:25:39.97\00:25:43.67
bound you, but in some way is
still in prison. And God wants
to get you past the gates
00:25:43.67\00:25:47.94
keeping keep holding you in
there. And this is where
conversion, not conversion
00:25:47.94\00:25:56.22
therapy. Yes, but being
transformed by the renewing of
your mind. This is what you're
00:25:56.22\00:26:01.02
talking about. Absolutely. So
people out there, you know,
breaking the chains, Pete was
00:26:01.02\00:26:04.03
still in the prison. Yes, but he
had to get past the case that
holding him in. I think what
00:26:04.03\00:26:07.13
you're talking about tonight is
this is what fighting against
their gates that are being
00:26:07.13\00:26:11.17
erected to keep people in jail
that want their gains to be
broken. So there as we recognize
00:26:11.17\00:26:18.91
brokenness. Yes, we should be
able to do something about it.
There was a psychologist, I'm
00:26:18.91\00:26:25.95
who began a therapy. The
repaired if therapy that gets
associated with conversion
00:26:25.95\00:26:29.88
therapy. >> Again, as a negative
therapy. But there were people
00:26:29.88\00:26:34.09
going this psychologist Joseph
Nicolosi, was developing and and
actually trademarked the
00:26:34.09\00:26:42.60
term repaired if therapy and he
was of the mind that if
something is broken, we should
00:26:42.60\00:26:49.57
be able to help and do something
to repair it. And so they ended
00:26:49.57\00:26:52.54
up calling it repaired if
therapy. It got a lot of
negative backlash from THE L G B
00:26:52.54\00:26:58.18
L G B T plus community. And so
they retired the term he used
the term simply because he
00:26:58.18\00:27:03.35
thought that people would be
more drawn from the LGBT plus
community because they were
00:27:03.35\00:27:08.89
seeking repair. But today the
term has been as Joseph and
Nicholas. He died a few years
00:27:08.89\00:27:13.86
ago. Chuck Joseph Nicolosi
junior still carries the the
therapy, but in a different way
00:27:13.86\00:27:22.64
of reintegrated therapy and in
helping people come to live in
agreement with with what they
00:27:22.64\00:27:30.78
that they want. They they want
sound therapy that will help
bring them into a wholeness.
00:27:30.78\00:27:35.35
And if we had scripture in
Christianity to that, then we
therapist who are identifying
00:27:35.35\00:27:40.52
as Christian therapist that can
help bring you into an wholeness
00:27:40.52\00:27:46.80
with Jesus Christ. Again,
Invitational just like Jesus,
not forceful. So anyone who is
00:27:46.80\00:27:50.90
seeking out such a therapy has
the right to go. What is
listener may want to to know
00:27:50.90\00:27:58.71
today is that while the other
nations, these 14 other nations
have criminalized conversion or
00:27:58.71\00:28:03.28
reparative therapy or
specifically conversion therapy,
it is outlawed in the
00:28:03.28\00:28:07.88
U.S. in 20 4 miners anyone, 17
and younger, even if their
parents want to send them, it
00:28:07.88\00:28:14.06
is it is criminal to send them
and the Equality Act would
continue to make things that
00:28:14.06\00:28:20.40
would make it a criminal to stay
to say that homosexuality is
sinful from from the pulpit
00:28:20.40\00:28:27.10
or 2 to have therapies with with
people who are seeking a way
out. And so, you know, you
00:28:27.10\00:28:33.14
heard Joe Biden said in the
State of the Union address.
Let's get this Equality Act
00:28:33.14\00:28:38.31
passed. Let's give these rights
to the LGBT plus people. Well, I
00:28:38.31\00:28:43.82
think that there still isn't a
quality that is actually taking
place with mankind out there
00:28:43.82\00:28:47.12
today that we seek to treat each
other equal. But it doesn't mean
endorse have to endorse
00:28:47.12\00:28:53.46
the behavior. And it doesn't
mean that I don't care about
you. If I don't endorse your
00:28:53.46\00:28:56.93
behavior. That's right. That's
very well said. The trial said.
00:28:56.93\00:29:00.77
>> This comments. Comment touch
Mom Tis just says Wayne. Your
story has touched me
00:29:00.77\00:29:09.51
deeply. My brother's birthday is
today. He would have been 59
years old if he had not
00:29:09.51\00:29:15.55
ended his life 7 years ago. He
was raised STA and was
tormented. He was a tormented
00:29:15.55\00:29:26.13
soul because he was gay. Yeah.
And desperately wanted to be
healed. But he continuously
00:29:26.13\00:29:32.20
fail. Thank you for Polish ice
in for the church. Thank you for
speaking out in love. It
00:29:32.20\00:29:44.78
was our LGBTQ brothers and You
know, >> I get asked this every
00:29:44.78\00:29:52.85
once in a while. But what about
the people who haven't been
privileged to hear the
00:29:52.85\00:29:58.93
revelations like through my
ministry, which is no his love
ministries. Yeah. And want to
00:29:58.93\00:30:05.30
say to such individuals that
this is what you know, really,
truly God. Tells us not to to
00:30:05.30\00:30:11.74
judge. And so. I know that God
knows the hearts of such
individuals who never got to
00:30:11.74\00:30:19.41
see the light. But new he knows
in their hearts if they would
respond to his love in
00:30:19.41\00:30:25.65
truth message, that brings about
healing and wholeness and him. I
00:30:25.65\00:30:30.43
think there'll be some serious
surprises in the kingdom. a man
and if you like what you're
00:30:30.43\00:30:39.67
hearing, if you think that this
is valuable, I'm at and I
encourage you to day 2 races,
00:30:39.67\00:30:46.04
conversations in your churches
and in your schools today before
conversion or reparative
00:30:46.04\00:30:49.71
therapy is made criminal and we
can't even talk about it
anymore. If you're looking a
00:30:49.71\00:30:56.58
message that is redemptive like
this in and will go into
discussing this and more and
00:30:56.58\00:31:01.96
more further You can though, his
love Ministry. So I have
seminars that I give issue on
00:31:01.96\00:31:08.93
this topic that can rap along
low, but don't Yes, used to be
all over the world and talk
00:31:08.93\00:31:13.90
COVID fun now. things are
opening up a little bit more now
and certainly so you can
00:31:13.90\00:31:17.64
just contact me at know his
love, Dot org or you can email
me hat to the number. The
00:31:17.64\00:31:28.28
number 2 to know his love. At G
Mail dot com beautiful. Now, I
don't know if we highlighted
00:31:28.28\00:31:35.66
this all my life to talk about
something that must have on the
00:31:35.66\00:31:39.43
list who is very phenomenal. >>
But you have a booklet there in
front of you that I
00:31:39.43\00:31:43.37
want you to reintroduce 2 ares
second, our audience and how
because this line by line and
00:31:43.37\00:31:48.10
I know they have a graphic for
it. Talk about that and why you,
00:31:48.10\00:31:52.77
you passions about putting that
together. Sure. So. >> I did an
00:31:52.77\00:31:58.81
interview here in where I talk
more specifically about this.
But the highlight it and this,
00:31:58.81\00:32:06.49
guiding families of LGBT plus
loved ones is a book that's
written for multiple
00:32:06.49\00:32:11.73
denominations. There was an
Adventist edition that was
written. I don't see it that it
00:32:11.73\00:32:17.27
differs too much other than that
at Vance, Adventists comments
have been put in there. But the
00:32:17.27\00:32:25.91
advent news are LGBT activism on
our university campuses. So
that's the edition that I found
00:32:25.91\00:32:28.68
in the ad. Venice for Jen a
approval. Our stamp of approval
00:32:28.68\00:32:36.42
on the guiding Families book.
Now it's misleading because the
guiding families of LGBT plus
00:32:36.42\00:32:41.02
loved ones. certainly not
guiding them in a scripture
format, but it is guiding them
00:32:41.02\00:32:46.56
in a cultural format that says
you're fine just the way you
are. You can identify by any
00:32:46.56\00:32:51.83
gender that you care to. They
shame people in being
discouraged about someone
00:32:51.83\00:32:58.21
coming out as LGBT and that we
should, you know, make it
possible for people to come
00:32:58.21\00:33:03.41
out as LGBT and the church
because the the world makes it
so much easier. Well, the
00:33:03.41\00:33:08.95
world might make it easier when
I came out had the coming out
party, we smoked a joint
00:33:08.95\00:33:14.66
bank, drank beer and ended up
having sex. And that was
rebellion against what the
00:33:14.66\00:33:19.43
church said and what the Bible
said. So I'm not going to
encourage coming out of the
00:33:19.43\00:33:22.73
church. But what I am going to
encourage is that we should have
places that are safe for
00:33:22.73\00:33:27.70
people to say. Here's what I
struggle with. And James, 5.16,
again, that I share my
00:33:27.70\00:33:32.11
faults might weaknesses with you
and that I'm seeking prayer and
00:33:32.11\00:33:37.71
healing to be surrounded by my
brother's ensure sisters in the
church developing accountability
00:33:37.71\00:33:42.78
being said is seen as an equal
at the foot of the cross of
Jesus creating atmosphere of
00:33:42.78\00:33:50.56
embracing and and being
alleviating alone us not putting
somebody down because
00:33:50.56\00:33:56.87
they have feel like there
feeling more feminine than then
masculine our that their
00:33:56.87\00:34:03.87
same sex attracted to, you know,
I'm on this journey, brother. I
00:34:03.87\00:34:07.61
have same sex attraction. I'm
hoping that you can help hold me
accountable that you can pray
00:34:07.61\00:34:10.75
with me that you can walk with
me. Those are the things that I
promote in the in the Line
00:34:10.75\00:34:18.95
by Line and analysis of guiding
families of LGBT plus loved
ones. And I give you 21
00:34:18.95\00:34:24.99
testimonies of individuals who
have walked away from LGBT plus
culture for Jesus Christ.
00:34:24.99\00:34:31.83
They saw that she says is worth
it. They agree with scripture
00:34:31.83\00:34:37.64
and taking instead of taking an
issue with scripture and
promoting it amongst other
00:34:37.64\00:34:42.28
people who are going to college
to get a Christian education.
00:34:42.28\00:34:46.68
All right. >> And I make a point
as the 7 dead in his past. I
want to make this point very The
00:34:46.68\00:34:51.25
book that he's referring to
guide and guiding families about
Gbt. just be too. That's not
00:34:51.25\00:34:56.46
something as a seven-day Venice
past that that Iowa, many other
00:34:56.46\00:34:59.46
avenues passes, don't condone
it. But this is something that
is not a book that's that's The
00:34:59.46\00:35:04.90
voice of the church at large.
That's why this response was
necessary. Many people might
00:35:04.90\00:35:12.41
conclude that a particular
publication that is being
released is the voice of the
00:35:12.41\00:35:16.75
church at large. And that is
not, in fact, the case. That's
why I think the Lord you taking
00:35:16.75\00:35:20.32
the time to put that line by
line because we still teach and
preach the message of redemption
00:35:20.32\00:35:27.29
deliverance from Sen and
rebuilding. And if that if it
had not been the case, there
00:35:27.29\00:35:31.29
would be no place in the church
for anyone regardless of whether
00:35:31.29\00:35:36.53
it is alcohol, whether it is,
you know, and well and I want to
keep San alcohol, whatever the
00:35:36.53\00:35:43.34
proper challenge, election may
be a good the addiction may have
been in 4400 copies were
00:35:43.34\00:35:47.71
mailed out to the North American
divisions, churches, a seven-day
00:35:47.71\00:35:53.62
Adventist churches. >> And the
United States. So if you're in a
00:35:53.62\00:35:56.38
church in the U.S., you might
even ask your pastor, hey, do
you have this book? I'd like to
00:35:56.38\00:35:59.45
take a look at or you can also
go to and there's a graphic
again for this for the book. I'm
00:35:59.45\00:36:06.29
at now. His love Dot Org there
it is on the on the screen yet
it want to remind that toward
00:36:06.29\00:36:12.63
the end of the program about
this information. Also of the
00:36:12.63\00:36:17.64
issues, honey. >> I'd like to
know what is the Trevor Project?
>> So the Trevor Project is
00:36:17.64\00:36:23.88
something that people may have
become aware of. As you go to
look at presentations and
00:36:23.88\00:36:31.02
videos on you tube that have to
do with those of us that are
talking about conversion
00:36:31.02\00:36:36.99
or reparative therapy on a on a
positive level. The Trevor
Project, for whatever reason
00:36:36.99\00:36:43.13
YouTube is found it necessary or
allowed this to take place. It's
an advocacy LGBT plus
00:36:43.13\00:36:47.50
advocacy group. flags, anything
that is scriptural or anything
00:36:47.50\00:36:55.78
that would suggest conversion
therapy reparative therapy is
good. The Trevor Project and
00:36:55.78\00:37:06.99
then made a no ifs says
conversion therapy sometimes
referred to as repaired of
00:37:06.99\00:37:11.36
therapy. Is any of several
dangerous and discredited
practices aimed at changing an
00:37:11.36\00:37:16.90
individual's sexual orientation
or gender identity. Does speaker
who are for many years was the
00:37:16.90\00:37:24.17
speaker for this group and vice
president. What his name was
Brenton Sam Renton. But and
00:37:24.17\00:37:33.58
Sam Brinton make big as speaking
engagements where he would go
and he promotes his
00:37:33.58\00:37:40.56
own idea of sexuality that
included sex slash cake type of
things and he went to group
00:37:40.56\00:37:50.13
where they were seeking
endorsement for a lesbian
organization. He was a speaker
00:37:50.13\00:37:54.30
on the stage for this called a
girl. I'm out of the audience
that he didn't know asking her
00:37:54.30\00:37:59.91
become a volunteer broader up on
stage. Took a carbon with out
and and beat her with that
00:37:59.91\00:38:09.78
and left a welt on that she then
took pictures of it because they
00:38:09.78\00:38:15.96
didn't disappear for many days
and wrote about it in that
universities paper and said what
00:38:15.96\00:38:18.83
on Earth that we just engage
ourselves in and other said,
we're removing our support from
00:38:18.83\00:38:26.03
this organization because here's
somebody who's complaining about
the pain and the harm. Fulness
00:38:26.03\00:38:29.04
of conversion Therapy and then
they turn around and inflict
Hayne. How do you know that
00:38:29.04\00:38:34.54
that woman wasn't a victim of
sexual abuse or our physical
abuse and and could have sent
00:38:34.54\00:38:41.85
her into incredible over this.
There's another analysis that
was take that took place by a
00:38:41.85\00:38:48.96
lady by the name of Susan
Constantine. She's done a many
analysis of behavior analysis
00:38:48.96\00:38:54.10
that has to do with a person's
demeanor the way they're talking
Sam Britton was going
00:38:54.10\00:39:01.34
to organizations. He was telling
them his experience with
conversion or reparative
00:39:01.34\00:39:05.51
therapy and through the analysis
of what he was saying and
because of his stories
00:39:05.51\00:39:09.94
changing from engagement to they
were finding that he was lying
as it related to his
00:39:09.94\00:39:18.55
examples of what it was giving
about his own life as it related
to conversion therapy
00:39:18.55\00:39:21.79
that actually never took place.
Well, now this ideology of
rebuilding. Want to go back
00:39:21.79\00:39:28.30
to that list. I know I've
seen. >> We've seen devastation.
00:39:28.30\00:39:31.73
Devastation happens in
everything of life, by by a car
accident, hurricane
00:39:31.73\00:39:39.44
natural disasters. There social
to just asked us. You are
disasters that affect the
00:39:39.44\00:39:45.48
human life. Yes, what are some
of the ways that you could start
recommending to people
00:39:45.48\00:39:51.12
if you really want to rebuild
your relationship? And I wish we
had this chart available
00:39:51.12\00:39:57.13
because I'm looking at the
rebuilt column, which I thank
you for putting this together.
00:39:57.13\00:40:00.80
And one of the first things that
it lists on that and therein
lies Romans. 12 first
00:40:00.80\00:40:08.50
wanted to says I beseech you,
therefore, brother by the
mercies of God. That you
00:40:08.50\00:40:12.54
present your body has a living
sacrifice, holy and acceptable
to God, which is a reasonable
00:40:12.54\00:40:18.11
service. Now, that's an amazing,
just amazing commitment. I think
00:40:18.11\00:40:21.55
it starts But you think about
that, >> I would agree. And and
I think for a greater more in as
00:40:21.55\00:40:29.39
it relates to the explanation
that I got, I would send you to
where I got. The shot in
00:40:29.39\00:40:36.43
the arm that I needed after 12
years. And if you go to YouTube
and you look up Xk a
00:40:36.43\00:40:43.27
closer look at ex-gay
ministries. It will bring you to
a conversation with Andrew
00:40:43.27\00:40:49.28
Rodriquez and theology. Mom
right Hernandez that Christa
Bontrager. But it is. She's
00:40:49.28\00:40:55.92
called the allergy moms. And if
you go into about the 13 minute
mark and then watch it
00:40:55.92\00:41:00.62
from that point forward for the
that you'll be convinced as I
was and listening to
00:41:00.62\00:41:06.80
definitions of these columns.
And then when you listen to the
explanation as you get to
00:41:06.80\00:41:11.70
the rebuilt column and attacking
the that topic or discussing the
00:41:11.70\00:41:18.27
topic of conversion or
reparative therapy. Again, what
it is, what it what somebody can
00:41:18.27\00:41:24.78
gain through again through
mental health and psychotherapy
combined with scripture in
00:41:24.78\00:41:30.92
Christianity dealing with
traumatic events and that may
have occurred in somebodys
00:41:30.92\00:41:32.92
life it was life changing for
Portland Fellowship. Again,
another out of Portland,
00:41:32.92\00:41:41.53
Oregon, who actually constructed
before columns to begin with
00:41:41.53\00:41:46.03
changed Ministries Allen out of
California, who do a lot of work
by going to will be going again
00:41:46.03\00:41:52.74
this fall to Congress and
telling of circumstances and
situations of people who've
00:41:52.74\00:42:00.25
experienced traumatic events in
their lives and that if they're
not allowed to have conversion
00:42:00.25\00:42:04.39
or reparative therapy, they
couldn't get the healing that
they really desperately That's
00:42:04.39\00:42:08.76
amazing. Because these
categories that are here, my
hope is in Christ for a truly
00:42:08.76\00:42:17.20
transformed life. And what you
brought into some kind of
identity card created found in
00:42:17.20\00:42:22.97
Christ and his transforming work
in us. Talk about that because
you've been down road
00:42:22.97\00:42:29.34
and the transformation, as you
talked about, it's something
that is very real for you. It
00:42:29.34\00:42:34.78
is that it's a difficult topic,
but one that I feel that I have
00:42:34.78\00:42:43.83
to be transparent I my life.
It's not perfect. I believe that
if you come to Christ in your
00:42:43.83\00:42:48.26
converted and you become perfect
club, then we certainly would
both rapture sense that what's
00:42:48.26\00:42:54.80
the point of keeping us here on
Earth? If we've got a ride in
this perfect state, why saying
00:42:54.80\00:42:59.47
that? I don't want to say that
there's an excuse for Sen Butts
and has to play out on
00:42:59.47\00:43:02.38
this earth. God takes our
juices, takes our sins as we
confess them and puts them.
00:43:02.38\00:43:10.59
I'm in the Holy Place and he's
holding them there as as he is a
time for them. But he he is
00:43:10.59\00:43:21.23
position of while we're still
living to see if we are going to
live in agreement with the
00:43:21.23\00:43:27.47
confession that we have made for
him. His blood is certainly paid
00:43:27.47\00:43:31.34
for that. And so. I I am glad
that for his leniency with me
over the years and the
00:43:31.34\00:43:41.68
difficulties that I and caving
into temptations and desires
even having having him come
00:43:41.68\00:43:48.72
having even has coming back as a
believer and a Christian and
Jesus Christ today that that
00:43:48.72\00:43:54.56
she that blood was shed for me
so that I can seek forgiveness.
00:43:54.56\00:43:59.57
But when we make for repentance,
I ask for God to have a genuine
repentance in my life today
00:43:59.57\00:44:04.41
because it is a turning away
from Sen and that's why I
believe that in the
00:44:04.41\00:44:10.41
transformation process that
there needs to be more put in
place for me. There needs to be
00:44:10.41\00:44:16.22
more resources and which I can
go to and seek a biblical way of
which I'm healing in Jesus
00:44:16.22\00:44:22.09
Christ today. I want more then
just having come back and say,
oh, gee says you're right now, I
00:44:22.09\00:44:28.73
I want to I want to know the
fullness of my new life in
Christ today. That's right. A
00:44:28.73\00:44:33.37
man. What can a person do? Who
wants to preserve the power of
00:44:33.37\00:44:38.44
choice? >> And maintained
religious freedom >> that's an
00:44:38.44\00:44:42.84
important question. So yes, if
you want to preserve our choices
that we have today, and then I
00:44:42.84\00:44:48.95
would write your get in touch
with legislators and let them
know that there is value human
00:44:48.95\00:44:55.16
choices and religious freedom,
the right to choose. Get in
touch with organizations like
00:44:55.16\00:45:01.63
the changed organization that is
in California through changed
ministries. That is
00:45:01.63\00:45:08.30
that with Ken Williams and
Elizabeth wanting get in touch
with people like myself on
00:45:08.30\00:45:14.84
that will help you recognize and
that there are putting it
petitions that you can get
00:45:14.84\00:45:20.85
involved with. Get in touch. If
you as a result what's happening
00:45:20.85\00:45:27.46
on university campuses today
that they're not receiving the
gospel as it relates to LGBT
00:45:27.46\00:45:32.53
activism and what's possible
through Jesus Christ should be
writing to your pastors. Your
00:45:32.53\00:45:38.43
conference, presidents and to
the university presidents. When
I was here speaking February, I
00:45:38.43\00:45:45.81
had the privilege of speaking at
your church. Pastor John during
the Q and a time there
00:45:45.81\00:45:52.38
was a reference made to the
prerequisites at a college and
you were talking about the not
00:45:52.38\00:45:59.79
premarital sex and and not
allowing homosexual behaviors
and all these different
00:45:59.79\00:46:06.53
things. And I thought, oh, wow,
which university is it? Because
I I know all of our
00:46:06.53\00:46:10.17
universities and I've been
begging in my mind, you know, of
that. They would put this
00:46:10.17\00:46:16.47
on applications so that people
would know that you can come
here if you're suffering, but
00:46:16.47\00:46:20.44
we don't endorse the behaviors
will help you get out of these
00:46:20.44\00:46:24.95
behaviors. >> Who is putting
this records that on on their
applications and at the end, you
00:46:24.95\00:46:29.85
sure that it was from Oral
Roberts University and what was
the time makes perfect sense
00:46:29.85\00:46:34.02
because it's certainly not one
of our university and this, you
know, that needs to
00:46:34.02\00:46:36.99
change. Honestly, that needs to
change because it's this is
something that let me just
00:46:36.99\00:46:42.20
make a point right But I think
a lot of people wonder, what can
00:46:42.20\00:46:47.30
be done? >> Neutrality, we're
not living in an age when
neutrality is a safe place to
00:46:47.30\00:46:50.61
be. And we're not living in an
age where we're going to be able
to maintain the freedoms
00:46:50.61\00:46:54.41
that God has given to us. I
don't know exactly who said it
exactly. But freedoms are not
00:46:54.41\00:47:00.25
maintained by silence. We have
to be. Literally people
proactive in making decisions
00:47:00.25\00:47:06.76
about our own lives and want to
go back to the fact that yes,
there's a power that's
00:47:06.76\00:47:12.23
available in Christ. Wayne has
made a lot of references to
different organizations. You
00:47:12.23\00:47:16.50
can refer to let me get down to
the brass tacks of and I don't
think you'd be here if
00:47:16.50\00:47:20.80
it were not for Christ. I
absolutely I know I know is not
funding the organizations,
00:47:20.80\00:47:26.47
but the but the transforming
power. And this is something
that we have upheld and still
00:47:26.47\00:47:31.81
believe to this very day, he
cries is able to do exceedingly
00:47:31.81\00:47:38.85
abundantly above all that you
ask or think and everything that
demands our obedience. We have
00:47:38.85\00:47:46.29
to choose to go that route
because nothing takes us by for
us right to say that we are, you
00:47:46.29\00:47:51.57
know, I'm Rob because money for
me rob a bank somebody force me
00:47:51.57\00:47:56.50
to take marijuana, those that
want that long ago. But so far
when it's a lot of practice, we
00:47:56.50\00:48:00.61
have to decide. Yes, and we have
to choose everyday. Joshua, 24
15 choose each day. As one
00:48:00.61\00:48:06.95
person said you have to choose
who you want to be in Christ. He
cries will empower you to become
00:48:06.95\00:48:11.09
3rd in division. Yes, in doing
so. It's important to acquaint
yourself with the issues
00:48:11.09\00:48:18.69
informed from a from a Christian
standpoint. >> About these
00:48:18.69\00:48:23.77
therapies reach while to myself.
You can reach out. I'm happy to
give you more information as it
00:48:23.77\00:48:27.57
relates to this so that when it
comes time when these things
begin to hit the ballots, it's
00:48:27.57\00:48:33.61
important that we preserve
our again, religious freedom and
00:48:33.61\00:48:38.71
human rights. >> I'll tell you,
this is really amazing because a
lot of times, as you think about
00:48:38.71\00:48:42.55
this, somebody may be saying,
well. I want to ask a question,
00:48:42.55\00:48:49.12
but I may not have the how to be
able to do so. We have a few
minutes left in the program. If
00:48:49.12\00:48:53.13
you want to sign a question in
there, yeah, you can text the
261-8228. 3, 9, 7, 5, at 6, 1,
00:48:53.13\00:49:00.64
8, 2, 2, 8, 3, 9, 7, 5, Or you
prefer e-mail. And that is live
at 3 a p n Dot TV as we
00:49:00.64\00:49:07.81
as we wind up a program this
evening and then now, you know,
you know, going forward
00:49:07.81\00:49:12.95
in Christ. What would you say to
a person? This is weighing your
story is great. But I
00:49:12.95\00:49:20.62
don't think I could be possibly
deliver. What do you say that?
00:49:20.62\00:49:26.80
Well, I have. >> I have to refer
you to the verses that have
become iconic for me. And that
00:49:26.80\00:49:32.73
first that that I found God as
trustworthy and that his word is
trustworthy. And when I
00:49:32.73\00:49:37.41
came back to Christ, I grabbed
the Bible. It wasn't this one. I
went to a church had been to
00:49:37.41\00:49:44.31
church in 40 and I walked in. I
sat down in the end, the
pastored directed us to
00:49:44.31\00:49:51.32
Philippians 4.13. yes. And my
friend had written at the top 35
years earlier and having
00:49:51.32\00:49:56.06
given me the Bible and that had
been open since them. He wrote,
Wayne can do all things
00:49:56.06\00:50:02.03
through Jesus Christ. And while
this is not coincidence that I'm
00:50:02.03\00:50:05.93
sitting here today with this
sermon today that God assured me
that I could do all things
00:50:05.93\00:50:15.04
through him. I would later come
to the knowledge of Philippians
1, 6, that says he will finish
00:50:15.04\00:50:18.98
the work that he can in that If
you are LGBT and you are angry
or upset. I understand that
00:50:18.98\00:50:28.02
there's we have not done a good
job as a church in providing
answers or solutions
00:50:28.02\00:50:32.93
or even showing compassion and
help. But today I'm reach out to
2 ministries such as no.
00:50:32.93\00:50:39.87
His love ministries another
coming out. DOT org there's
representation of ways to come
00:50:39.87\00:50:51.48
back to Christ today to live in
alignment with scripture. But
most of all, I'm getting
00:50:51.48\00:50:56.58
in touch with other testimonies
and falling in love with Jesus.
00:50:56.58\00:51:00.69
Because really, if you're just
doing it because it, you know,
you want to become a legalistic
00:51:00.69\00:51:04.73
Christian, you want to become a
believer who is developing into
Missy which ISIS if I'm
00:51:04.73\00:51:10.33
not developing into missing with
Jesus, that I might as well go
00:51:10.33\00:51:13.00
back to what came natural to me
in and live according to what my
flesh called out for. Yes, well,
00:51:13.00\00:51:18.57
here's a question. What is
the difference? >> Between your
00:51:18.57\00:51:25.11
ministry and Michael called du
Chee of coming out Ministries,
which you were a part of and
00:51:25.11\00:51:32.19
what made you start chill own
ministry. >> And to John Loma
00:51:32.19\00:51:35.76
can understand that the wood
previous that is the normal
practice of old a man with
00:51:35.76\00:51:40.83
young boys back in ancient Rome.
>> Coming up ministries. Yes.
00:51:40.83\00:51:47.30
So I retired co-founder of
coming out Ministries ministry
that 11 years old, a 4 and a
00:51:47.30\00:51:54.81
half years ago. I've shared this
before, but I continue to share
I did experience, as I
00:51:54.81\00:52:01.42
mentioned earlier, a moral I did
bring it before my colleagues
00:52:01.42\00:52:08.99
and threw to the board who asked
me for my immediate resignation.
And I spend the next here and a
00:52:08.99\00:52:16.43
half on the sofa binge watching
a crime drama, reality
television and cooking shows.
00:52:16.43\00:52:22.60
And I was like Lord. Take issue
with what your words have
believed, what your word
00:52:22.60\00:52:31.85
says. I'm an advocate for what I
will always hold up the word as
being true. And I've told
00:52:31.85\00:52:37.15
people today if I were to leave
now and returned to the LGBT
plus community, it does
00:52:37.15\00:52:41.96
not change the truth and love
message of Jesus Christ. And so
as I sat there, you know,
00:52:41.96\00:52:47.66
all that time, I was still going
to church, but I wasn't knowing
what God wanted from
00:52:47.66\00:52:51.93
me. And I friend of mine who
lived in New Zealand said when
are you familiar with
00:52:51.93\00:52:59.31
Proverbs? 24 16. And that's as I
shared earlier this evening.
know that a righteous man fall
00:52:59.31\00:53:05.11
7 times, but he says, I don't
think that's finished with you.
And know I think you just
00:53:05.11\00:53:09.58
gave me confirmation of why I
was on this vacation and I was
asking God, what did he want
00:53:09.58\00:53:12.22
me to do? But I got back home. I
immediately had a voicemail that
was asking me to give a
00:53:12.22\00:53:19.03
seminar, which I hadn't had for
the the previous year and a
half. And I also have the
00:53:19.03\00:53:25.17
invitation to write the line by
line to analyze the guiding
families book. And so God, you
00:53:25.17\00:53:31.94
know, put me back in a place of
witnessing for him today. And so
I decided that I had
00:53:31.94\00:53:37.81
it. I had initiated my own
personal ministry again. No, his
love and so I I I just
00:53:37.81\00:53:46.19
brought that back to the
surface. I work agreement with
coming up ministries. Is there
00:53:46.19\00:53:50.99
any difference? I'm not not
They're the only difference
really right now is that I've
00:53:50.99\00:53:56.60
taken off in exploring this new
column of rebuild that about
restoration in Christ.
00:53:56.60\00:54:04.44
Looking for more, I want more
more than what I had. So, but it
is the same biblical
00:54:04.44\00:54:09.08
message that we share. We
support each other on that. >>
You know, and I want to say
00:54:09.08\00:54:13.58
it's the past and I think this
is vitally important. I so
appreciate your approach to
00:54:13.58\00:54:16.45
this and being willing. >> all
noble man and also. Prayerfully
00:54:16.45\00:54:24.23
almost like a one man army
saying, okay, yeah, I'm one
voice but all it takes far to
00:54:24.23\00:54:30.77
get a fire going and even to be
brave enough to apologize for
those who have not had the scale
00:54:30.77\00:54:33.64
understanding of how to deal
with people in the past. And
this is something that we do
00:54:33.64\00:54:37.11
support. That's why here 3 apn
ministry is in fact, supporters
00:54:37.11\00:54:43.98
of is approaching to counteract
the counties that they are
counterfeits as to saying that
00:54:43.98\00:54:48.75
you can't be delivered. But as
let's go back to one of the most
beautiful pairs in the Bible
00:54:48.75\00:54:51.15
and David fell. David pray the
prayer. I believe that Wayne
that got hurt and wanes heart.
00:54:51.15\00:54:57.46
When you fall. Here's what David
said. with its and 51 for 7
purge me with his I
00:54:57.46\00:55:02.86
shall be clean. Wash me and I
will be wider than snow. Make me
hear when you binge
00:55:02.86\00:55:09.44
watching all those things,
feeling depressed and cast out.
Make me here. The joy and
00:55:09.44\00:55:13.78
gladness that the bones, you
have broken, they rejoice. Hi
Joe, face from my sins and
00:55:13.78\00:55:18.98
blot out my iniquities and then
this. The prayer of everyone who
00:55:18.98\00:55:23.49
sense creating the a clean heart
and renew right spirit within
me, do not cast me away from
00:55:23.49\00:55:28.19
your presence and do not take
your holy spirit for me. The
rebuild column is right here
00:55:28.19\00:55:32.76
restored to me. The joy of your
salvation and hold of me. By
your generous spirit. And
00:55:32.76\00:55:40.60
this is what Wayne is doing
right now. Then I will teach us
transgressors your ways and
00:55:40.60\00:55:51.95
sinners shall be converted to
That's your ministry. There that
there were many that said
00:55:51.95\00:55:57.92
in while I was in ministry,
we're just waiting for him to
fall. As know, that would
00:55:57.92\00:56:00.46
invalidate the gospel. >> How
many of you were actually
waiting for me to get
00:56:00.46\00:56:04.13
back up because it was it was
the prayers and encouragement
that he did. So if you fall,
00:56:04.13\00:56:11.10
get back up. That's my. That's
what my dad said to me. Any with
major encouragement.
00:56:11.10\00:56:16.07
>> Any comments and before we
go, I am's I was so encouraged
by this. My heart is just
00:56:16.07\00:56:21.68
Wong. >> Because it gives hope
to those who feel hopeless men.
00:56:21.68\00:56:25.88
>> I think you knew you willing
to go anywhere. 2 share with
00:56:25.88\00:56:31.79
>> That's right. don't call me.
I don't think it no. His love
Dot org, correct? No. His
00:56:31.79\00:56:38.36
love dot org. They get a lot
more information and also invite
Wayne to come and ask
00:56:38.36\00:56:46.37
questions. We've alive said he
asked questions. People have
been been very open, very
00:56:46.37\00:56:49.90
revelatory things that you could
share their that he may not be
able to share here on
00:56:49.90\00:56:52.97
television. But once again,
thank you for staying with us.
We hope that you have found
00:56:52.97\00:56:57.15
what we have hope to
communicate. That's the live
rounds and freedom.
00:56:57.15\00:57:01.72
>> To the blood of Jesus Christ
with a forward to seeing you
00:57:01.72\00:57:06.62
¤ ¤ ¤
00:57:06.62\00:57:21.50
¤ ¤ ¤
00:57:21.50\00:57:46.53