I want to spend my life
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mending broken people,
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I want to spend my life
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removing pain...
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Lord, let my words
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heal a heart that hurts,
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I want to spend my life
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mending broken people...
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I want to spend my life
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mending broken people.
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Music...
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Hello and welcome to 3ABN Today.
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My name is C.A. Murray
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and allow me once
again to thank you
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for sharing just a
little of your, I suspect,
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very busy day with us
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we thank you as
always for your love,
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your prayers and
your support of 3ABN
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as together... for
these three decades plus
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we have partnered
to share the good news
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that Jesus is coming again,
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I'm excited today yea verily
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because of our subject
matter and because of my guest
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who feigns being an
introvert but he is not...
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by any stretch can this
man be called an introvert,
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this is a face
you've seen on 3ABN
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and if you're in the
Adventist fraternity,
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you've seen it around
for many, many years...
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this is Shawn Boonstra,
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Shawn, good to have you here.
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Yeah, not that many
years... not that many years...
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I'm getting there but...
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Speaker/Director
of Voice of Prophecy
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currently he's had many
incarnations... dare I say...
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of what the
Lord's called him to do.
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I can't keep a job...
I think that's the issue.
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Done a lot of
things for the Lord
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but in what he's doing now,
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we were talking
just a little bit...
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doing some wonderful
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forward-thinking
things for the Lord,
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we're going to sort of
mine that in just a little bit,
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but Shawn, first of
all, it's good to have you
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and your lovely wife here...
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She's in the back
and she'll give me a list
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of what I did wrong
after the... after the show...
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no, she was actually
here doing another Program
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because she's got a ministry
going in her own right now
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and it's gone gangbuster, so...
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Yeah, praise the Lord,
we're so happy about that,
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hey, man, I want to
spend just a little time
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before we get into our music
and some of the other things,
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talking about you as a person,
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we know the face and
we've heard the message...
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Yeah, unfortunately
everybody knows the face...
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I feel like I owe everybody
an apology for that... I...
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Lo these many, many years...
not that many years but...
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but they may not
know you as an individual
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you kind of just
appeared on the scene
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several years ago
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and have been going sort
of great guns ever since,
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you move at kind of a rapid pace
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but give us a little background,
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you weren't born in
an Adventist home...
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No, I was not... I was
born in a Christian home though,
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I was born to Dutch immigrants
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so that would give you a
Protestant-Calvinist background
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then I went to
Christian schools as a kid,
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yet they say, "God
doesn't have any grandkids"
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and so, oh He doesn't...
God doesn't have grandchildren
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you've got to buy their...
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hey, I've got to
say, "If you were relying
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on your parents' faith
to get you into the Kingdom,
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it doesn't work that way,
it just doesn't work that way.
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Murray: It does not.
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So, cut loose a little bit,
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I don't rehearse what happened
in my teenage life and so on
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because why would you
give the devil airtime
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for the way he ruined your life,
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I'm not going to
give him free advertising.
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Murray: I just call
them "Wilderness years. "
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Yeah, I had some of those, I
really did have some of those
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and then found
the Adventist Church
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about the age of 22, I think,
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through a series of
public evangelistic meetings
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and the Adventists
were the first ones
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who ever really
helped me feel for sure...
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it was Bible
Prophecy really that did this,
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I knew for
certain God was real...
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Were you a searcher or a seeker?
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Oh yeah, at that point I was,
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at that point I had
actually become a Christian
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and I was looking
for a place to call home
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and I had actually
read some Bible prophecy...
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I had read some Revelation
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and trying to make sense
out of that on your own...
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come to think of
it... "What in the world
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all these beasts
and candlesticks...
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so, what in the world?"
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But some of it did make sense
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just enough that I
started looking for...
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and I made a bargain with God,
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I said, you know... and
that's a dangerous thing to do
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make a bargain with God...
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but, "I'll tell you
what... I'll go into ministry"
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because I felt this nudging,
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"Hey, you're
going to be a minister"
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well, I wanted to
run for public office,
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I didn't want to be a minister,
I wanted to be in politics...
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I wanted that life
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and I... one night finally...
I was under conviction,
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"No, you're going
to go into ministry"
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this voice kept saying that
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and I said, "All right, you
show me where the people are
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who believe the things that
I'm reading here in Revelation
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and in other parts of the Bible,
I'll go into the ministry. "
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I got invited to an
Evangelistic Meeting...
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an Adventist Evangelistic
Meeting the next day
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yeah, my brother got
a handbill in the mail,
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he called me,
"Hey, I got a handbill. "
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"What's a handbill?"
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Now I know what a handbill is,
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I've mailed out
millions of them.
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"It's a handbill. "
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"Who puts it on?"
00:05:04.27\00:05:05.60
He said, "Let me
look... Seventh-day Adventists"
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"Oh, they're a whole
bunch of wack-a-doodles
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you don't want to go
to a meeting like that...
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they're a bunch of... Adventists
you should see what they eat"
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because I've seen
what the Adventists eat...
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fake meat out of a can...
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I said, "Oh, I can't
go to a meeting like that"
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he says, "It will be fun, go...
we can heckle the preacher"
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"Okay... " well,
now I'm in, you know,
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and I... I couldn't
believe what I was hearing
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everything that I had
discovered in Scripture
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was there...
they were preaching it
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and I had asked
like, the day before...
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"God, if you show
me where the people are
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who believe what
I find in this Book,
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I'll go into the
ministry" it was done.
00:05:33.66\00:05:35.40
Yeah, praise the Lord...
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it's interesting that in your
studies at the very beginning,
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you had connected
the dots enough to know
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that there's got to
be a people out there
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somewhere... who buy this.
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Yeah, when you look at
Revelation 14 in particular,
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you see the end
of Revelation 12,
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I love in hindsight to
pretend that I understood
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all the nuances of those
chapters, no, I didn't...
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but there seemed to be a
clear dividing up of people
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especially when you get
to chapters 12, 13 and 14
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of Revelation... in 13
you've got the beast power...
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the 2nd beast power...
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and everybody who kind
of follows in their wake...
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you've got one
side of the equation...
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one side of this controversy...
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the controversy is
introduced in chapter 12
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and in chapter 13, you see
the devil's side of the equation
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but then in 14...
you've got these people
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standing on Mount
Zion with the Lamb...
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with a decisive
last-day message for the world.
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Did I understand that
message in its entirety then?
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No... but it was clear to me,
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there'd be a
polarization of the human race
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and that there
had to be a people
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who had that specific message
that you find in Revelation 14,
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they had to be
out there somewhere.
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Murray: Hmmm...
hmmm... hmmm... hmmm,
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now, you're in Canada...
you're a Canadian citizen.
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I am still a Canadian citizen,
I became an American as well
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so, I've got the
whole continent covered,
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except, I need
Mexican citizenship...
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then I've got the whole thing.
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Well, you've got Bermuda...
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Is Bermuda Commonwealth though?
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because Canadian passport
is a Commonwealth passport,
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I mean, it's
good as you've got...
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I'm already in...
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are they still
under the Queen are they?
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I think so.
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Oh, there you go,
so, I'm already in...
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I'm a Bermudan too...
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Okay, praise the Lord
and a citizen of heaven.
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There you go... every nation,
kindred, tongue and people
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so I'm in.
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Amen and amen, you're there,
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you're... you're...
you're connecting the dots,
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you're looking for a church,
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you obviously found that church,
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were you married...
had you met Jean yet?
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We were dating...
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I don't know, 3, 4, 18 years...
however long we'd been dating
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and... and... it
probably felt like that to her
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I was slow... we were young...
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so, I waited three...
four years before I proposed
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then we were
looking for a church home
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and we'd settled on one
that was kind of a compromise
00:07:30.55\00:07:33.18
between our
different religious backgrounds
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and I'm not sure
we were entirely happy
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and if I were
going to be in ministry,
00:07:37.39\00:07:39.05
I couldn't be in a church that
couldn't believe certain things
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and so, I
discovered by happenstance
00:07:41.56\00:07:44.16
the church that I was
considering doing ministry in
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didn't even believe the
book of Genesis was true
00:07:46.90\00:07:49.50
and so, I said, "Okay God... "
00:07:49.53\00:07:51.23
and that's the
bargain I made with God,
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"You've got to show
me where these people are
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because this isn't it. "
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"The Bible is the pillar
in the ground of the truth"
00:07:55.44\00:07:57.64
we read in the letter to Timothy
00:07:57.67\00:07:59.01
and I said, "If they're
rejecting portions of Scripture
00:07:59.04\00:08:01.68
then, where are they?
00:08:01.71\00:08:03.24
You've got to
show me where they are,
00:08:03.31\00:08:04.65
I'll go... if they're
serious about Scripture
00:08:04.68\00:08:06.61
then I'll go into ministry. "
00:08:06.65\00:08:07.98
Actually it was smug...
the truth is, I was smug...
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"I'm going to run for public
office I have it all figured out
00:08:09.92\00:08:11.99
I'll be working
on that this summer"
00:08:12.02\00:08:13.42
and God answered
that day... in 24 hours.
00:08:13.46\00:08:17.49
Wow, wow... had Jean sort
of bought into this bargain
00:08:17.53\00:08:19.19
or had you even
shared this with her?"
00:08:19.23\00:08:20.56
You know it's interesting,
00:08:20.60\00:08:21.93
I had told her when
I came under conviction
00:08:21.96\00:08:23.60
that I was going
to go into Ministry,
00:08:23.63\00:08:25.43
which... I thought
I'll test the waters,
00:08:25.47\00:08:27.24
my girlfriend's going
to think this is nuts...
00:08:27.27\00:08:28.80
I phoned her up and
said, "You know what?
00:08:28.84\00:08:30.77
I don't think I'm
going to run for office. "
00:08:30.81\00:08:32.67
she said, "What
are you going to do?"
00:08:32.71\00:08:34.04
I said, "Well, I'm
going to go into Ministry. "
00:08:34.08\00:08:35.91
And what she said was,
00:08:35.94\00:08:37.41
"I've known that
since I met you. "
00:08:37.45\00:08:39.78
Murray: You're kidding.
00:08:39.81\00:08:41.15
Yeah and... well girls are a
lot smarter than guys, right?
00:08:41.18\00:08:42.95
We've been married now
about 25 years at this point
00:08:42.98\00:08:46.25
and dated for four...
no, we're almost 30 years
00:08:46.29\00:08:49.49
I'm still figuring her out,
00:08:49.52\00:08:51.26
guys aren't that smart...
00:08:51.29\00:08:52.93
Murray: Yeah, she's got
you booked from early on.
00:08:52.96\00:08:54.30
Shawn: Two minutes...
two minutes... and we're
00:08:54.33\00:08:55.66
guys are simple creatures right,
00:08:55.70\00:08:57.10
I mean, if we're fed
and... we're pretty good, yeah.
00:08:57.17\00:09:01.07
So, she bought it... she
had no problem with that.
00:09:01.10\00:09:05.01
And we both went...
00:09:05.07\00:09:07.08
I actually went to the
Evangelistic Meetings myself
00:09:07.11\00:09:09.38
first night...
came back and said,
00:09:09.41\00:09:10.75
"I found them, you
got to come hear this. "
00:09:10.78\00:09:12.15
Murray: In one hour
you knew. Shawn: Oh yeah.
00:09:12.18\00:09:13.68
They started, I think with
Daniel 2... which is the reason
00:09:13.72\00:09:16.79
that's the first time
I had absolute certainty,
00:09:16.82\00:09:18.65
there is no way... I mean,
00:09:18.69\00:09:20.02
you could be as
skeptical as you want,
00:09:20.06\00:09:21.49
there's no way to get
through Daniel chapter 2
00:09:21.52\00:09:24.06
and explain that
away. Murray: Yeah.
00:09:24.09\00:09:25.59
Shawn: And I
know the skeptics say,
00:09:25.63\00:09:27.10
"Oh, Daniel 2 must have
been written after the fact
00:09:27.13\00:09:29.63
because it's so accurate"
00:09:29.66\00:09:31.57
but even in that
case, it still got Rome
00:09:31.60\00:09:34.17
and the division of
the Western Roman Empire
00:09:34.20\00:09:36.30
entirely accurate,
00:09:36.37\00:09:37.71
so even if we were to say...
and I don't believe this...
00:09:37.74\00:09:39.67
I don't believe this
but even if we were to say
00:09:39.74\00:09:41.58
that it was
written at a later date,
00:09:41.61\00:09:43.75
it still got so much right
00:09:43.78\00:09:45.58
that the odds are against
that being a human document.
00:09:45.61\00:09:47.55
Yeah and it wasn't written in
the 300s, we know that so right.
00:09:47.62\00:09:50.09
No, it wasn't
and Jesus quoted it,
00:09:50.12\00:09:52.05
I've every conviction
Daniel's the author of that...
00:09:52.09\00:09:54.46
he got it right ahead of time,
00:09:54.49\00:09:55.86
even naming people
and naming empires and...
00:09:55.92\00:09:57.86
Murray: Yes. Shawn:
There's no way around it.
00:09:57.89\00:09:59.79
there's no... I've seen in my
own Evangelistic meetings now,
00:09:59.83\00:10:02.60
skeptics come to me and say,
00:10:02.66\00:10:04.00
"All right, I still
don't know everything...
00:10:04.03\00:10:05.83
I still don't know
if I believe everything
00:10:05.87\00:10:07.70
but I can't explain that...
00:10:07.74\00:10:09.27
I can't explain Daniel"
00:10:09.30\00:10:10.74
so, to this day, I
still open with that
00:10:10.81\00:10:12.61
all over the world and... and...
00:10:12.64\00:10:14.18
because you can be the
biggest skeptic in the world
00:10:14.21\00:10:16.71
but it's like a
bucket of cold water,
00:10:16.75\00:10:18.08
how do you explain
that, there is a God...
00:10:18.11\00:10:19.68
it's... God doesn't
ever argue for His existence
00:10:19.71\00:10:23.15
but He does demonstrate it.
00:10:23.18\00:10:24.52
Sure He does... sure He does
and prophecy is one of the most
00:10:24.55\00:10:26.89
succinct and powerful and
irrefutable ways to do that.
00:10:26.92\00:10:30.09
Yeah absolutely
and to this day...
00:10:30.13\00:10:32.23
to this day, I
still sit there and marvel
00:10:32.26\00:10:34.86
because the
nuances never run out,
00:10:34.90\00:10:36.63
you get to
Daniel 11 and it's like,
00:10:36.67\00:10:38.30
"Oh, wow, it describes
Tiberius Caeser's funeral
00:10:38.33\00:10:42.04
he wasn't given State honors
00:10:42.07\00:10:43.84
how did he get that right?
00:10:43.87\00:10:45.21
How did you get all that right?"
00:10:45.24\00:10:47.58
And so, it's mindboggling
to me to this point,
00:10:47.61\00:10:50.05
any time that I... you know and
everybody's got little doubts,
00:10:50.11\00:10:54.15
"Is this really something?"
00:10:54.22\00:10:55.55
Go right back and it's
like, "Yeah, absolutely...
00:10:55.58\00:10:57.82
this... God's there... He
speaks through those books"
00:10:57.85\00:11:00.26
it's not just, "Wow,
this is amazing information"
00:11:00.29\00:11:02.46
it's not like a magic
trick, "How did he do that?"
00:11:02.49\00:11:04.29
Murray: Yes.
00:11:04.33\00:11:05.69
No, there's somebody
speaking behind that and it's...
00:11:05.73\00:11:07.26
it's unmistakable.
00:11:07.30\00:11:08.63
Murray: Praise the
Lord, Praise the Lord,
00:11:08.66\00:11:10.57
you have now this
call... this feeling...
00:11:10.60\00:11:12.43
you want to go into ministry,
00:11:12.47\00:11:13.80
how did that begin... how
did you begin to exercise that?
00:11:13.84\00:11:17.37
Well, the church
that baptized me...
00:11:17.41\00:11:20.34
the Victoria
Seventh-day Adventist Church,
00:11:20.38\00:11:23.01
hello folks, if
you're out there...
00:11:23.04\00:11:24.45
I know there's
still some folks there
00:11:24.48\00:11:25.81
I got hired as an
Associate Pastor in that church
00:11:25.85\00:11:29.05
like a year
after I was baptized,
00:11:29.08\00:11:30.45
the Conference hired me because
I was out giving Bible Studies
00:11:30.49\00:11:33.32
and preaching and
doing everything I could
00:11:33.36\00:11:35.79
so they just hired me
as the Associate Pastor
00:11:35.82\00:11:37.86
then I pastored in
that Conference for a bit,
00:11:37.89\00:11:39.89
I went to the
Seminary... I won't...
00:11:39.93\00:11:41.73
well, I call it the Cemetery...
00:11:41.76\00:11:43.16
but that's not... I
don't mean that and all...
00:11:43.20\00:11:44.93
it was a good experience
00:11:44.97\00:11:46.30
I went to the
Seminary and so on...
00:11:46.33\00:11:47.77
pastored in the
British Columbia Conference
00:11:47.80\00:11:49.74
and then, "It Is Written Canada"
00:11:49.77\00:11:51.34
was being run at that time
00:11:51.37\00:11:52.71
by a guy by the
name of Henry Feyerabend
00:11:52.74\00:11:54.38
yeah... a lot of you know him
00:11:54.44\00:11:56.08
and he was
getting ready to retire
00:11:56.11\00:11:58.41
and was looking for
somebody who loved evangelism,
00:11:58.45\00:12:01.25
who loved our message
and... and approached me
00:12:01.28\00:12:04.05
and so I went to
"It Is Written Canada"
00:12:04.09\00:12:05.95
then Mark
Finley wanted to retire
00:12:05.99\00:12:07.46
from "It Is
Written International"
00:12:07.49\00:12:08.89
so he called me and
I moved over the line
00:12:08.92\00:12:11.09
and then... now I'm
at the Voice of Prophecy
00:12:11.13\00:12:13.19
because I get fired at one
job after the other, right...
00:12:13.26\00:12:15.90
So you got to be
Replacement Jockey
00:12:15.93\00:12:18.73
as guys are being
signing off then you...
00:12:18.77\00:12:20.50
I'm a Substitute
Teacher that's what I am.
00:12:20.54\00:12:22.24
Laughter...
00:12:22.27\00:12:23.94
No, I eventually did lay
down my arm... so to speak...
00:12:23.97\00:12:29.64
at "It Is Written International"
because I got sick back at 2010.
00:12:29.68\00:12:32.31
It was a mysterious illness,
we still don't know what it was
00:12:32.35\00:12:34.95
but it was serious, I
thought I was a goner...
00:12:34.98\00:12:37.39
and... so I survived that
and I did go back to work,
00:12:37.45\00:12:40.26
now I'm at the
Voice of Prophecy.
00:12:40.29\00:12:41.62
Yeah, so they never... because
we were all praying for you
00:12:41.66\00:12:44.56
that went around the world.
00:12:44.59\00:12:46.26
Yeah, I appreciate the prayers,
00:12:46.29\00:12:47.86
I know that all of you were
praying for me, I do know that,
00:12:47.90\00:12:50.93
but the truth is...
rumor mills filled in...
00:12:50.97\00:12:53.34
"What's wrong...
what happened to Shawn?"
00:12:53.37\00:12:55.50
We really don't
know, we really don't know
00:12:55.54\00:12:57.61
but it appears
to be in the past,
00:12:57.64\00:12:59.31
I still suffer with
some lingering after effects,
00:12:59.37\00:13:03.24
I have some Neuropathy in
my feet... my feet will burn
00:13:03.28\00:13:06.25
and I'll get numbness
in weird parts of my body
00:13:06.28\00:13:08.12
but my energy really came back,
00:13:08.15\00:13:10.62
I went to Eden
Valley for a little bit
00:13:10.65\00:13:13.69
it's a health
retreat in Colorado
00:13:13.72\00:13:16.36
they helped me feel better
00:13:16.39\00:13:18.53
and I started
going back to work slowly
00:13:18.56\00:13:20.23
it was about a
three-year process
00:13:20.26\00:13:21.60
and then in 2013
00:13:21.63\00:13:24.30
I was asked if I'd
consider the Voice of Prophecy
00:13:24.33\00:13:27.00
so I went there and
haven't looked back yet
00:13:27.04\00:13:29.70
I guess it's been five years now
00:13:29.74\00:13:31.11
just about that
I've been there and...
00:13:31.14\00:13:33.31
Has it been five?
Time goes by so fast.
00:13:33.38\00:13:35.48
I saw you shortly after
you were making your recovery,
00:13:35.51\00:13:39.15
we had some
meeting in California
00:13:39.18\00:13:40.52
I don't remember what
it was out near Ontario
00:13:40.55\00:13:42.95
because I flew into Ontario.
00:13:42.98\00:13:44.32
Oh they had some big
media stuff about there.
00:13:44.35\00:13:45.99
Yeah, yeah, we
were there for that
00:13:46.02\00:13:47.39
and you were smaller and...
but your color was coming back
00:13:47.42\00:13:50.16
and you were starting
to feel a little stronger.
00:13:50.19\00:13:52.43
Yeah, it was starting
to come back at that point.
00:13:52.46\00:13:54.66
Yeah... I went
down to skin and bones,
00:13:54.70\00:13:57.13
lost motor
control... it was a scary time.
00:13:57.17\00:13:59.30
Yeah, I'm sure... I'm sure...
00:13:59.33\00:14:00.70
family... wife...
lovely wife... two daughters...
00:14:00.74\00:14:03.10
Shawn: I hope so... I
hope she's still there
00:14:03.14\00:14:05.51
when I get out of the Studio
00:14:05.54\00:14:06.88
and hasn't left but Jean...
we've been 25 years this year,
00:14:06.91\00:14:10.58
Natalie is at Southern,
00:14:10.65\00:14:13.05
she'll be a
Sophomore this coming year
00:14:13.11\00:14:15.15
in the Communications Program
at Southern Adventist University
00:14:15.18\00:14:18.15
the youngest one is now 16
00:14:18.22\00:14:21.29
and she is a Junior at
Campion Academy I think,
00:14:21.32\00:14:24.93
I think that's
where my kid goes...
00:14:24.96\00:14:26.49
Laughter...
00:14:26.53\00:14:28.13
So, one's in high
school... one's in college
00:14:28.16\00:14:30.57
so, here's the light at
the end of the tunnel...
00:14:30.60\00:14:32.97
I'm already mapping out
their bedrooms for an office...
00:14:33.00\00:14:35.27
it's like... they're
going to be leaving soon, right?
00:14:35.30\00:14:37.57
I'm kidding kids,
that's not true, I love you.
00:14:37.61\00:14:39.84
Laughter... and praise the Lord.
00:14:39.87\00:14:41.61
We want to go and
we'll go to our music
00:14:41.64\00:14:43.68
and then we want to talk about
some of the new innovations...
00:14:43.71\00:14:47.65
some of the things
that are on your heart
00:14:47.68\00:14:49.28
for Voice of Prophecy...
00:14:49.32\00:14:50.65
some of the new
directions you're taking them in
00:14:50.69\00:14:52.85
and before I do that, I
got to ask you a question.
00:14:52.89\00:14:55.19
It occurred to me,
00:14:55.22\00:14:57.13
I happened to see you
at a funeral some time ago,
00:14:57.16\00:14:59.89
and I had never
picked this up before
00:14:59.93\00:15:01.96
but the way you were walking...
00:15:02.00\00:15:03.37
just looking at the
camera following you
00:15:03.40\00:15:05.40
people walk a different
way when they have shoes on
00:15:05.43\00:15:07.74
and when they don't...
00:15:07.77\00:15:09.10
I think, "He's planting
his foot awful light... "
00:15:09.14\00:15:11.57
so I just waited until we got a
beauty shot when they showed...
00:15:11.61\00:15:14.21
Shawn: That's impossible with
me beauty shot... come on...
00:15:14.28\00:15:16.91
Laughter...
00:15:16.95\00:15:18.28
Anyway... we got the whole shot
00:15:18.31\00:15:19.71
and I said, "He's
got no shoes on. "
00:15:19.75\00:15:21.08
Shawn: That's right.
00:15:21.12\00:15:22.45
Murray: Then I marked
you several other times
00:15:22.48\00:15:23.82
you always preach
without... without shoes.
00:15:23.85\00:15:26.02
Now I... when I got
into the Recording Studio,
00:15:26.05\00:15:28.29
I sing without
shoes... I know my reason,
00:15:28.32\00:15:31.66
I'm very curious what yours is.
00:15:31.69\00:15:33.16
I actually don't
have shoes on now,
00:15:33.19\00:15:34.63
I won't show your audience
00:15:34.66\00:15:36.00
because that will offend
some cultures if I plop up on...
00:15:36.03\00:15:37.80
I don't wear them now,
00:15:37.83\00:15:39.17
there are a number of reasons,
00:15:39.20\00:15:40.54
number one is I hate
shoes, I just hate them,
00:15:40.57\00:15:42.70
grew up Canadian, we
don't wear our shoes inside
00:15:42.74\00:15:44.87
it feels weird to wear your
shoes inside... I hate them,
00:15:44.91\00:15:48.18
number two, I'm a little bit
clumsy... more than a little bit
00:15:48.21\00:15:51.25
I like to feel where the edge
of that platform is with my toe
00:15:51.28\00:15:54.25
because I have fallen
off the platform preaching
00:15:54.32\00:15:56.62
and I know it's a...
00:15:56.65\00:15:58.09
funny thing is... one time I
was actually reciting that verse
00:15:58.12\00:16:00.76
"Thy Word is a lamp unto my... "
00:16:00.79\00:16:02.52
and I didn't get
the word "feet" out
00:16:02.56\00:16:03.93
and I fell right
off the platform.
00:16:03.96\00:16:05.39
Somebody said, "You
did that on purpose"
00:16:05.43\00:16:06.86
"Oh no... that hurt too
much to plan that... I... "
00:16:06.90\00:16:08.76
so, I like feeling
the edge of the platform,
00:16:08.80\00:16:11.17
I also have two
different-sized feet...
00:16:11.20\00:16:13.54
I won't pull them out here
00:16:13.57\00:16:14.90
but one's
nine-and-a-half one's eleven
00:16:14.94\00:16:16.44
caught one in a
piece of equipment
00:16:16.47\00:16:18.87
and it wasn't
quite right after that
00:16:18.94\00:16:21.48
and so, shoes are
terribly uncomfortable
00:16:21.51\00:16:23.85
and so I buy an
eleven and never wear them
00:16:23.88\00:16:26.15
but the number one reason
00:16:26.18\00:16:28.98
and you made reference to it
at the beginning of the show,
00:16:29.05\00:16:30.92
I really truly am an
off-the-charts introvert...
00:16:30.95\00:16:34.09
I didn't know the word
for that in the beginning...
00:16:34.12\00:16:35.66
I'm terrified of
public speaking...
00:16:35.69\00:16:37.26
this is comfortable...
00:16:37.33\00:16:38.66
you know a few
people in a TV Studio...
00:16:38.69\00:16:40.83
very comfortable for me
00:16:40.86\00:16:42.20
to get up front... to
this day is agony for me,
00:16:42.23\00:16:45.07
on opening night if I'm
holding an Evangelistic Meeting,
00:16:45.10\00:16:47.17
I want to throw up...
00:16:47.20\00:16:48.54
I am so terrified of
public speaking and crowds,
00:16:48.57\00:16:51.61
I don't like it...
00:16:51.67\00:16:53.01
but there's something
about taking your shoes off
00:16:53.04\00:16:55.74
that grounds you...
I'm home among friends...
00:16:55.78\00:16:58.85
and it relaxes me...
and so off they go...
00:16:58.88\00:17:01.92
now the saints...
00:17:01.95\00:17:03.28
they're pretty sure there's
got to be a spiritual reason
00:17:03.32\00:17:04.92
"the only way you take it...
00:17:04.95\00:17:06.29
is it because after you
pray you're on holy ground?"
00:17:06.32\00:17:08.79
I wish I had thought of that,
I wish I had thought of that...
00:17:08.82\00:17:10.49
Murray: That's the
reason I was expecting
00:17:10.53\00:17:11.86
that kind of answer to that.
00:17:11.89\00:17:13.43
Shawn: Yeah... no... I
hate shoes and I'm really...
00:17:13.46\00:17:14.80
it takes a lot of
the stage fright away.
00:17:14.83\00:17:16.53
Murray: Hmmm... Shawn: Yeah...
00:17:16.56\00:17:18.07
Murray: Well I'd never think so
00:17:18.13\00:17:19.53
it cured me of that...
and last story from me...
00:17:19.60\00:17:22.04
when I was playing
basketball in college
00:17:22.07\00:17:23.61
I would play good in practice...
00:17:23.64\00:17:26.34
get in the game and
get totally terrified
00:17:26.37\00:17:28.44
the Coach told me one day,
00:17:28.48\00:17:29.81
he said, "You know what, Murray,
nobody cares about you. "
00:17:29.84\00:17:31.85
Laughter...
00:17:31.88\00:17:34.28
he said, "What are you getting
nervous about... it's the team
00:17:34.32\00:17:35.92
they want to see the
team, nobody cares about you"
00:17:35.95\00:17:37.79
and from that
time on, I'm fine...
00:17:37.82\00:17:39.45
it's not you... it's the
message it's what you're doing.
00:17:39.49\00:17:42.22
Shawn: That's it... I do this
because people come to Christ,
00:17:42.26\00:17:45.13
I do not do it... I can't...
00:17:45.19\00:17:46.90
to this day, if
I'm sitting in church
00:17:46.93\00:17:48.30
and you see me
there, "Hey Shawn's here,
00:17:48.33\00:17:49.76
come up and tell
us what's going on. "
00:17:49.80\00:17:51.13
I have a little panic attack,
"Oooh, I didn't prepare...
00:17:51.17\00:17:53.94
I'm not ready for this"
00:17:53.97\00:17:55.30
I don't even
like my birthday party
00:17:55.34\00:17:56.87
because if people
sing "Happy Birthday"
00:17:56.91\00:17:58.51
they're going to look
at me for three minutes
00:17:58.57\00:18:00.11
and I can't handle that.
00:18:00.14\00:18:01.48
So, it's true, the only
reason I ever get up front...
00:18:01.51\00:18:03.85
I don't like being on TV, I
don't like being on the radio,
00:18:03.88\00:18:06.41
I don't like
getting up front to preach
00:18:06.45\00:18:08.05
there's only one
reason to do it...
00:18:08.08\00:18:09.78
it works...
people find Christ...
00:18:09.82\00:18:11.15
and they're
looking for something...
00:18:11.22\00:18:12.55
and... somebody did it for me
so I'm going to do it for them.
00:18:12.59\00:18:16.66
Murray: For
them... yeah... yeah...
00:18:16.76\00:18:18.09
praise the Lord
praise the Lord, well done...
00:18:18.13\00:18:19.56
well said... and thank
you for de-mythologizing it
00:18:19.59\00:18:22.66
or de-mystifying that
because I thought it was,
00:18:22.73\00:18:25.53
"Take off thy shoes
from off thy feet for... "
00:18:25.77\00:18:27.87
that kind of thing, yeah.
00:18:27.90\00:18:29.27
Shawn: That would be lying but
it would be such a nice thing
00:18:29.30\00:18:31.07
to say, wouldn't it?
00:18:31.11\00:18:32.44
Murray: It really would...
00:18:32.47\00:18:33.81
our music today is
coming from Ben and John
00:18:33.84\00:18:37.05
The Burchfield Brothers...
they're going to be playing,
00:18:37.08\00:18:39.21
"Be Still My Soul. "
00:18:39.25\00:18:42.65
Be still, my soul:
00:18:42.68\00:18:46.05
the Lord is on thy side;
00:18:46.09\00:18:53.63
Bear patiently
00:18:53.66\00:18:57.13
the cross of grief or pain;
00:18:57.17\00:19:05.81
Leave to thy God
00:19:05.84\00:19:11.38
to order and provide;
00:19:11.41\00:19:19.42
music...
00:19:19.45\00:19:21.72
In every change
00:19:21.76\00:19:24.86
He faithful will remain.
00:19:24.89\00:19:31.63
Be still, my soul:
00:19:31.67\00:19:35.70
thy best, thy heavenly friend
00:19:35.77\00:19:45.31
Through thorny ways
00:19:45.35\00:19:51.59
leads to a joyful end.
00:19:51.62\00:20:01.06
Guitar strumming...
00:20:01.10\00:20:09.37
Be still, my soul:
00:20:09.40\00:20:17.61
the hour is hastening on
00:20:17.65\00:20:24.39
When we shall be
00:20:24.42\00:20:28.96
forever with the Lord,
00:20:29.02\00:20:35.13
When disappointment,
00:20:35.16\00:20:41.20
grief, and fear are gone,
00:20:41.24\00:20:47.58
Sorrow forgot,
00:20:47.61\00:20:55.88
love's purest joys restored.
00:20:55.92\00:21:03.93
music...
00:21:03.99\00:21:06.80
Be still my soul:
00:21:06.83\00:21:13.13
When change and tears are past,
00:21:13.20\00:21:20.28
All safe and blessed
00:21:20.31\00:21:29.92
we shall meet at last...
00:21:29.95\00:21:39.33
We shall meet at last.
00:21:39.36\00:21:41.70
Music.
00:21:41.73\00:22:01.88
The Burchfield
brothers, thank you gentlemen,
00:22:01.92\00:22:05.65
Be still my soul...
00:22:05.69\00:22:07.02
my guest is Shawn Boonstra.
00:22:07.06\00:22:08.39
You are the Speaker/Director
for Voice of Prophecy,
00:22:08.42\00:22:11.36
I want you to get into...
00:22:11.39\00:22:12.73
Shawn: Until they fire me...
00:22:12.76\00:22:14.10
until they fire
me... I'll... I'll... yeah.
00:22:14.13\00:22:16.06
And there is some
history of you moving around.
00:22:16.13\00:22:18.27
Yeah... yeah... third media
ministry... you never know...
00:22:18.30\00:22:19.63
Murray: Praise the Lord for that
00:22:19.67\00:22:21.00
but you're thinking
of some new things...
00:22:21.04\00:22:22.67
moving in some new directions,
00:22:22.70\00:22:24.04
let's walk
through some of that stuff
00:22:24.07\00:22:25.41
because you've got some
good things that you're doing.
00:22:25.44\00:22:27.24
Well, we're going
right back to the roots
00:22:27.28\00:22:28.61
of the Voice of Prophecy.
00:22:28.64\00:22:29.98
Look, there's only one
reason to be on the radio,
00:22:30.01\00:22:32.41
we are not interested
in just being on the air
00:22:32.48\00:22:35.38
for the sake of being on the
air and getting some notoriety,
00:22:35.42\00:22:37.92
for me, as a sort
of a wired introvert
00:22:37.95\00:22:41.12
there has to be a
reason for me to go on the air.
00:22:41.16\00:22:43.59
To put myself out
there in the public
00:22:43.63\00:22:45.56
it's about people... it's
about people coming to Christ
00:22:45.59\00:22:48.30
and the radio gets into
homes or television too...
00:22:48.33\00:22:50.97
I mean, we do
documentaries and things now,
00:22:51.00\00:22:52.60
but it gets into the home...
00:22:52.63\00:22:55.17
they might not open
the door when I knock...
00:22:55.20\00:22:57.37
but on their
time... in their turf
00:22:57.41\00:22:59.81
they turn on the
program you guys know that here,
00:22:59.84\00:23:02.44
you turn on the
program and it's safe
00:23:02.48\00:23:04.65
and so, that was the reason
it went on the air in 1929
00:23:04.68\00:23:07.48
HMS Richards... making
shows in a chicken coop
00:23:07.52\00:23:09.85
I want to say it was
on tape, but I don't know,
00:23:09.88\00:23:12.09
did they use wax
cylinders in '29... I don't know
00:23:12.12\00:23:14.16
and then he
delivered the recording
00:23:14.19\00:23:15.96
to KNX Radio in Los Angeles
00:23:16.02\00:23:17.73
and before you know
it, it went worldwide.
00:23:17.76\00:23:19.56
By 1942, they had opened
the Bible School of the air
00:23:19.59\00:23:22.23
and we still have the
world's biggest Bible school
00:23:22.26\00:23:24.83
that we run internationally,
00:23:24.87\00:23:26.20
now we have more
than a million graduates
00:23:26.23\00:23:27.90
from the Discover Bible
School so, the roots though
00:23:27.94\00:23:32.07
were... not to get on the air
00:23:32.11\00:23:33.78
I mean, in the glory
days of Christian Broadcasting
00:23:33.81\00:23:36.24
there were only four
personalities on the air,
00:23:36.31\00:23:38.08
there was HMS Richards,
we had Bishop Fulton Sheen,
00:23:38.11\00:23:41.05
we had Billy Graham...
00:23:41.08\00:23:42.55
there was one
more... I can't remember...
00:23:42.58\00:23:44.25
I guess Martin Luther King
might have been the other one,
00:23:44.29\00:23:46.86
that was sort of a
prominent personality
00:23:46.89\00:23:48.32
even though he didn't
have a regular broadcast,
00:23:48.36\00:23:50.79
in the glory days,
the dial was pretty empty
00:23:50.83\00:23:53.26
and now the dial
is really crammed full
00:23:53.29\00:23:56.13
but we've taken it all
the way back to its roots.
00:23:56.16\00:23:59.00
I want people to end up
00:23:59.03\00:24:00.67
walking through
the doors of a church
00:24:00.70\00:24:02.94
because we've been on the air,
00:24:02.97\00:24:04.31
I want them to connect with
real churches... real Christians
00:24:04.34\00:24:06.54
and experience
Jesus in Community
00:24:06.57\00:24:08.84
because the entry point was us,
00:24:08.88\00:24:11.08
we're not there to attract
them to the Voice of Prophecy,
00:24:11.11\00:24:13.28
I want to attract
them to your church,
00:24:13.31\00:24:14.65
I want to them to
end up at your church
00:24:14.68\00:24:16.02
and so, we're taking it
all the way back to the roots
00:24:16.05\00:24:19.12
and to that end what
we're really doing is
00:24:19.15\00:24:21.49
going to
decentralize the whole ministry,
00:24:21.52\00:24:24.03
there's kind of an
unspoken assumption
00:24:24.06\00:24:26.06
with a lot of
Christian Broadcasting
00:24:26.09\00:24:28.00
that the saints exist to support
what's going on the air...
00:24:28.03\00:24:32.10
they will pay
and they will watch
00:24:32.13\00:24:33.50
and you give a good
report on what happened.
00:24:33.54\00:24:35.40
That's not the New
Testament model at all,
00:24:35.44\00:24:37.24
the New Testament model is not
a handful of media personalities
00:24:37.27\00:24:40.78
running around,
holding Evangelistic Meetings
00:24:40.81\00:24:42.74
and winning the world for
Jesus... you won't find that
00:24:42.78\00:24:44.81
even though there were
some notable personalities
00:24:44.85\00:24:46.45
in the New Testament
00:24:46.51\00:24:47.85
the work wasn't
all done by Paul,
00:24:47.88\00:24:49.55
he's a key feature... but he
doesn't even have a radio show,
00:24:49.58\00:24:54.29
he can't show up... but
once in a while at your church
00:24:54.32\00:24:57.33
it's all members on deck,
00:24:57.39\00:24:59.19
I mean, the
Bible is crystal clear.
00:24:59.23\00:25:00.66
When you read 1st
Corinthians chapter 5,
00:25:00.70\00:25:03.37
it talks about the fact that
God reconciled us to Himself
00:25:03.40\00:25:07.47
through Jesus Christ
00:25:07.50\00:25:08.84
but in the next breath it says
00:25:08.87\00:25:10.21
He's given us the
ministry of reconciliation.
00:25:10.24\00:25:11.81
Yes... right.
00:25:11.84\00:25:13.17
So, all members are on deck,
00:25:13.21\00:25:16.11
it's a
priesthood of all believers
00:25:16.14\00:25:17.61
so, we're turning the
whole ministry on its head,
00:25:17.65\00:25:19.41
we don't talk about ourselves as
a media ministry at all anymore
00:25:19.45\00:25:22.58
we are an Evangelistic Ministry
00:25:22.62\00:25:24.39
and we eat, sleep and
breathe helping your church
00:25:24.42\00:25:27.36
win your community to Christ.
00:25:27.39\00:25:28.79
So you exist to
sort of franchise out...
00:25:28.82\00:25:31.13
Franchise is exactly
the word we're using,
00:25:31.16\00:25:33.40
I will be... yeah... I will
be the national spokesperson
00:25:33.43\00:25:36.53
for the Voice of Prophecy.
00:25:36.56\00:25:37.90
I'll say, "I'll
be the Dave Thomas,
00:25:37.93\00:25:39.27
you be the local Wendy's
00:25:39.30\00:25:40.64
because I don't
want to say McDonald's
00:25:40.67\00:25:42.00
because that would
make me Ronald McDonald,
00:25:42.04\00:25:44.24
that's not the
model I want at all,
00:25:44.27\00:25:46.44
but there's a
national spokesperson,
00:25:46.47\00:25:48.21
we can take
advantage of the fact
00:25:48.24\00:25:50.05
that there's a
national, trustworthy brand
00:25:50.08\00:25:51.78
that people are
used to on the air
00:25:51.81\00:25:53.31
and then what I want
to be able to do is say,
00:25:53.35\00:25:55.88
"Hey, if you've
really enjoyed this,
00:25:55.92\00:25:57.65
if you've enjoyed
what you've been hearing,
00:25:57.69\00:25:59.79
not only do we have the
Discover Bible School... "
00:25:59.82\00:26:01.86
which we plug all the time,
00:26:01.89\00:26:03.32
that's the whole
reason I go on the air...
00:26:03.36\00:26:04.69
is to get people
taking Bible Study
00:26:04.73\00:26:06.06
"we also have in your community
a local Discovery Center,
00:26:06.09\00:26:09.06
go to DiscoveryCenters. com
00:26:09.10\00:26:10.57
and you can find my local office
and see what's going on there"
00:26:10.60\00:26:13.64
when they go there,
based on their IP address
00:26:13.70\00:26:16.77
click... up
comes the local pastor
00:26:16.81\00:26:18.54
here's what we've got
going on Tuesday night
00:26:18.57\00:26:20.58
"Hey, to register for
our Healthy Lifestyle Seminar
00:26:20.61\00:26:23.55
or our Bible Study
Class or our Prophecy Seminar
00:26:23.61\00:26:26.41
click here to
register" and it's all handled
00:26:26.45\00:26:28.38
and I'm sending people
directly to the churches
00:26:28.42\00:26:30.29
which we now
call Discovery Centers
00:26:30.35\00:26:31.99
for the public's use.
00:26:32.02\00:26:33.36
I love it... so as...
as... as... as franchises
00:26:33.39\00:26:35.42
for what you're brand is then
00:26:35.46\00:26:36.89
they've got a...
you've got to make sure
00:26:36.93\00:26:39.29
that they're sort of onboard
00:26:39.33\00:26:40.66
with the direction that
you lead... that kind of thing.
00:26:40.70\00:26:42.46
Absolutely, so, if you
were to open a Wendy's,
00:26:42.50\00:26:44.67
and I do not advocate Wendy's,
00:26:44.70\00:26:46.37
I do believe in the
Bible's health message
00:26:46.40\00:26:48.30
I'm not sending
people to Wendy's
00:26:48.34\00:26:49.67
but it's the only one that
popped into my head right now,
00:26:49.70\00:26:51.27
and fortunately I don't
eat at Wendy's, I don't...
00:26:51.31\00:26:53.38
well, once I had
fries but other than that...
00:26:53.44\00:26:56.75
but when you go
there, look at what happens
00:26:56.78\00:26:59.51
the reason people
driving across the country
00:26:59.55\00:27:02.28
pull into a fast-food place
00:27:02.32\00:27:03.65
like a Taco Bell or
one of these places,
00:27:03.69\00:27:05.25
they know exactly what to expect
when they walk through the door.
00:27:05.29\00:27:07.19
Murray: Precisely.
00:27:07.22\00:27:08.56
And when you walk
into a Discovery Center,
00:27:08.59\00:27:10.33
I want people to know
exactly what to expect
00:27:10.36\00:27:12.49
and so, we're
creating as in a restaurant...
00:27:12.53\00:27:14.53
a Taco Bell or
some fast-food place,
00:27:14.56\00:27:16.60
they provide you the menu,
they provide you the decor,
00:27:16.63\00:27:18.97
they provide you the experience
00:27:19.00\00:27:20.50
and we're going to provide
that to our Discovery Centers
00:27:20.54\00:27:22.60
so we're creating what we call
00:27:22.64\00:27:24.17
the Discovery Suite
of Evangelistic Tools
00:27:24.21\00:27:27.51
the Discovery Suite rather...
00:27:27.54\00:27:28.91
Discovery is: Discovery Mountain
Jean's children's program
00:27:28.94\00:27:31.48
and so, that's the
whole range of things,
00:27:31.51\00:27:33.21
first of all, we've got
the Discover Bible School
00:27:33.25\00:27:35.18
it's the worlds' oldest
and biggest Bible School
00:27:35.22\00:27:37.15
Correspondence Bible School,
00:27:37.19\00:27:38.52
but we want people to
interact with those folks,
00:27:38.55\00:27:41.39
we don't want to mail
in the lessons and so on
00:27:41.42\00:27:43.89
so we'll teach you and show you
00:27:43.93\00:27:45.26
how you can interact with the
people who want Bible Lessons
00:27:45.29\00:27:47.60
and maybe even go to their home
and give them a Bible Study,
00:27:47.63\00:27:50.07
we've had more
than a million people
00:27:50.10\00:27:51.97
graduate from the
Discover Bible School
00:27:52.00\00:27:53.77
and all around the
world I go people say,
00:27:53.80\00:27:55.40
"I found my way to Jesus through
the Discover Bible School"
00:27:55.44\00:27:58.34
so we've just re-written it,
00:27:58.37\00:27:59.84
there's a brand new
Discover Bible School
00:27:59.87\00:28:01.91
that we've just completed
00:28:01.94\00:28:05.45
that sort of dovetails with
all of the other evangelistic
00:28:05.48\00:28:08.18
sort of outreach
tools and Bible Study tools
00:28:08.22\00:28:10.79
that we're creating
00:28:10.82\00:28:12.19
so, that's the
Discover Bible School
00:28:12.22\00:28:15.12
on the heels of that
we're also creating a...
00:28:15.16\00:28:17.89
oh, let me say this
too, I nearly forgot
00:28:17.93\00:28:20.60
one of the
reasons I'm a big believer
00:28:20.63\00:28:22.63
in the Discover
Bible School is this,
00:28:22.66\00:28:24.63
I will not go into a city
and hold an Evangelistic Meeting
00:28:24.67\00:28:27.50
unless I start
Discover Bible Schools
00:28:27.54\00:28:29.07
in that city two
years in advance.
00:28:29.10\00:28:30.44
Murray: That makes sense.
00:28:30.47\00:28:31.81
Any city that I've gone to...
00:28:31.84\00:28:33.17
I know that Christians
today are all despondent,
00:28:33.21\00:28:34.84
they say, "We live in
the post-modern secular world
00:28:34.88\00:28:36.88
and nobody's ever going to
be interested in Bible Study. "
00:28:36.91\00:28:38.91
We've proven them
wrong over and over
00:28:38.95\00:28:40.35
I think the lowest
number of Bible Studies
00:28:40.38\00:28:42.78
we've been able
to start in a week
00:28:42.82\00:28:44.29
in seven days in an
urban center is 1,000
00:28:44.32\00:28:47.06
we usually range from
2- to 3,000 in a week.
00:28:47.09\00:28:49.42
Your neighbors are
dying to study the Bible,
00:28:49.46\00:28:51.39
they know something's up
00:28:51.43\00:28:52.76
and they want to
know what that is.
00:28:52.79\00:28:54.13
So, Discover Bible School...
00:28:54.16\00:28:55.50
let me pull up my Cheat
Sheet so I don't forget stuff.
00:28:55.53\00:28:56.87
This is my iPad but
I turned down this...
00:28:56.90\00:28:59.53
the bright... so it
doesn't light up my face,
00:28:59.57\00:29:01.97
so, we've got a
Discover Bible School,
00:29:02.00\00:29:04.14
we've got the Discover Seminars,
00:29:04.17\00:29:06.31
the Discover Seminars
are short entry events
00:29:06.34\00:29:08.54
that you can put
on in your church
00:29:08.58\00:29:09.91
that are just three or four
meetings that attract the public
00:29:09.94\00:29:12.75
and then we invite them
to stay for Bible Study.
00:29:12.78\00:29:14.12
Murray: Ah ha.
00:29:14.15\00:29:15.48
So, for example, I
usually do ancient history
00:29:15.52\00:29:17.42
and tie it to prophecy,
00:29:17.45\00:29:19.12
we did "Shadow Empire"
00:29:19.15\00:29:20.76
and we did that... that's
the life and rise of Constantine
00:29:20.79\00:29:24.29
everybody's got the sense
there's something wrong...
00:29:24.33\00:29:26.33
amiss... with organized religion
and instead of arguing with them
00:29:26.36\00:29:29.33
we justify their feelings,
00:29:29.36\00:29:31.27
we said,
"You're absolutely right
00:29:31.30\00:29:32.63
something did go wrong with... "
00:29:32.67\00:29:34.00
I think we've got
a trailer for that.
00:29:34.04\00:29:35.37
Shawn: We could run that trailer
are we allowed to run a trailer?
00:29:35.40\00:29:37.64
Can I do that... can I just like
00:29:37.67\00:29:39.01
command the show
and run a trailer or...?
00:29:39.04\00:29:40.38
Murray: Sure you can.
00:29:40.41\00:29:41.74
Shawn: All right, let's run
that one... "Shadow Empire. "
00:29:41.78\00:29:43.65
Music...
00:29:43.68\00:29:48.92
Born under the
cloud of illegitimacy...
00:29:48.95\00:29:51.15
music...
00:29:51.19\00:29:55.16
his real father
00:29:55.19\00:29:58.89
far more powerful
than anyone could imagine
00:29:58.93\00:30:02.33
music...
00:30:02.36\00:30:04.30
the unlikely king who
ignited a global movement
00:30:04.33\00:30:09.80
music...
00:30:09.84\00:30:13.64
the world forever changed.
00:30:13.68\00:30:19.98
His legacy: an empire
reaching across centuries...
00:30:20.02\00:30:24.39
his name: Constantine...
00:30:24.42\00:30:29.92
music...
00:30:29.96\00:30:32.23
Shadow Empire...
00:30:32.26\00:30:40.14
it's not what you've been told.
00:30:40.17\00:30:44.44
Well done and a great tease.
00:30:44.47\00:30:46.24
Shawn: It is a
pretty good tease, right?
00:30:46.27\00:30:47.61
Murray: Really,
yeah, it was a great tease.
00:30:47.64\00:30:48.98
So, what we're doing is...
everyone knows something's amiss
00:30:49.01\00:30:50.61
in the world of
organized religion
00:30:50.65\00:30:51.98
so instead of arguing with them,
we tell them, "You're right"
00:30:52.01\00:30:53.35
because they are,
00:30:53.38\00:30:54.72
something did go south
in about the 4th century
00:30:54.75\00:30:57.59
and... but we hold
out as the alternative,
00:30:57.65\00:31:00.42
that's not your only alternative
00:31:00.46\00:31:01.79
there's a Biblical Christianity,
00:31:01.82\00:31:03.16
there's a real Jesus
He has a real message
00:31:03.19\00:31:04.66
and yeah, it
isn't what you've heard
00:31:04.69\00:31:06.49
and we packed out auditoriums
all across... people came.
00:31:06.53\00:31:10.57
We wanted to provide something
00:31:10.60\00:31:11.93
you could be proud to
bring your friends to...
00:31:11.97\00:31:13.30
Murray: Yes. Shawn: Right...
00:31:13.34\00:31:14.67
Murray: Quality... Shawn: Yeah
00:31:14.70\00:31:16.04
it looked like something they
would see on the History Channel
00:31:16.07\00:31:17.41
and you don't
have to be embarrassed,
00:31:17.44\00:31:18.77
it doesn't look like somebody
cobbled it together with felts
00:31:18.81\00:31:20.41
back in the... you know...
00:31:20.44\00:31:21.94
Laughter...
00:31:21.98\00:31:23.31
Shawn: No... but...
but... we wanted to be...
00:31:23.35\00:31:24.75
so, budgets mean that we
can only do like four episodes
00:31:24.78\00:31:27.62
but it was enough
00:31:27.65\00:31:28.98
and what would happen is,
00:31:29.02\00:31:30.42
I would give 30 minutes of
high-quality documentary style
00:31:30.45\00:31:33.72
"Here's what happened
in ancient history... "
00:31:33.76\00:31:35.26
and then we'll segue
straight into a Bible Study
00:31:35.32\00:31:37.33
that the Pastor
gives to that same audience
00:31:37.36\00:31:39.13
and we're inviting
them into Bible Study...
00:31:39.16\00:31:40.86
packed out audiences all over,
00:31:40.90\00:31:42.76
we've had entire congregations
change their opinion
00:31:42.80\00:31:45.50
about the way they
worship as a result of that.
00:31:45.53\00:31:48.00
Murray: Now, that's fabulous.
00:31:48.04\00:31:49.37
Shawn: Yeah, it's
gone gangbusters...
00:31:49.40\00:31:50.91
it's three
nights... it's four nights...
00:31:50.97\00:31:52.61
it's easy to do...
Murray: Hmmm... hmmm.
00:31:52.67\00:31:54.01
Shawn: We did "Pale Horse
Rides" which was the story...
00:31:54.04\00:31:56.08
"Well, if something
went wrong with Constantine,
00:31:56.11\00:31:57.78
where did
Biblical Christianity go?"
00:31:57.81\00:32:00.05
And we uncovered the
stories of ancient barbarians
00:32:00.08\00:32:02.55
who had nothing but the copy of
the... a copy of the Scriptures
00:32:02.58\00:32:04.79
and lived a
completely Scriptural
00:32:04.82\00:32:06.65
Christ-centered Christianity
in the midst of the Dark Ages
00:32:06.72\00:32:09.42
so, the ancient
Celts and I've got...
00:32:09.46\00:32:11.76
I brought trailers like crazy...
00:32:11.79\00:32:13.13
can we watch that
one: The Pale Horse Rides?
00:32:13.16\00:32:14.50
Pale Horse Rides...
00:32:14.53\00:32:15.86
let's run: The Pale Horse Rides.
00:32:15.90\00:32:17.23
Words on screen.
00:32:17.27\00:32:26.51
For 1,200 years, a pact between
political forces and the church
00:32:26.54\00:32:32.11
committed atrocities
in the name of Christ
00:32:32.18\00:32:34.48
today, people are leaving
the church at alarming rates
00:32:34.52\00:32:38.95
with a sense that
something went wrong
00:32:38.99\00:32:41.12
with the evolution
of organized religion.
00:32:41.16\00:32:43.56
Many scholars
have even predicted
00:32:43.59\00:32:46.06
the death of
Christianity as we know it
00:32:46.09\00:32:48.46
did something go
wrong in early Christianity
00:32:48.50\00:32:51.43
that affects the church today?
00:32:51.47\00:32:53.20
Are people's fear of
organized religion justified?
00:32:53.23\00:32:57.04
Yes, and the Bible
predicted that it would happen
00:32:57.11\00:33:00.88
join Shawn Boonstra
00:33:00.91\00:33:03.11
from the Voice of Prophecy
00:33:03.14\00:33:04.58
as he explores
the untold stories
00:33:04.61\00:33:07.22
and visits
awe-inspiring locations
00:33:07.25\00:33:09.78
for the 1,200-year
journey of the church
00:33:09.82\00:33:12.05
that paved the way to
Martin Luther's Reformation.
00:33:12.09\00:33:15.26
Find out what went wrong
00:33:15.29\00:33:17.23
at the beginning of the
world's largest religion
00:33:17.26\00:33:19.79
then watch as
Bible prophecy unfolds
00:33:19.86\00:33:22.56
at the birth of the church
00:33:22.60\00:33:24.20
and culminates in
predictions for our world today.
00:33:24.23\00:33:27.64
The story hidden in history,
00:33:27.67\00:33:31.67
the church on the
brink of destruction,
00:33:31.71\00:33:34.98
of hope born out of
the ashes of a vast empire.
00:33:35.01\00:33:39.38
Discover the history
that may be the best chance
00:33:39.41\00:33:43.75
for the church's future.
00:33:43.79\00:33:45.15
A Pale Horse Rides.
00:33:45.19\00:33:49.99
Music.
00:33:50.03\00:33:54.76
Here's the nuance that I
like in your presentation,
00:33:54.80\00:33:58.40
you admit that
something went wrong
00:33:58.43\00:34:00.14
which gives you a
platform to tell what that is
00:34:00.17\00:34:02.80
as opposed to starting
from a defensive position,
00:34:02.84\00:34:05.41
"Everything is
fine... everything is fine,
00:34:05.47\00:34:06.84
oh yeah, we got this little... "
00:34:06.88\00:34:08.21
Shawn: You're right...
Murray: Yeah, you're right.
00:34:08.24\00:34:09.88
Shawn: Well, we
may as well admit it,
00:34:09.91\00:34:11.25
we did some awful
things in the Dark Ages
00:34:11.28\00:34:12.61
as Christians we did
00:34:12.65\00:34:13.98
why don't we admit it,
everyone knows we did it
00:34:14.02\00:34:15.48
so, what are we
trying to hide it for?
00:34:15.52\00:34:17.19
Murray: Yeah. Shawn:
Israel went off base,
00:34:17.22\00:34:18.79
all of the Old Testament
prophecies pointing toward it
00:34:18.82\00:34:21.22
were when Israel went off base,
00:34:21.26\00:34:22.66
New Testament Prophecy...
the book of Revelation
00:34:22.69\00:34:24.13
predicts
Christianity goes off base,
00:34:24.19\00:34:25.66
why don't we admit we
did and point to Jesus
00:34:25.69\00:34:27.50
instead of defending ourselves,
00:34:27.53\00:34:29.13
it's an approach
that fills auditoriums
00:34:29.16\00:34:31.30
because people are... people
don't want God not to be real
00:34:31.33\00:34:34.80
they would love
there to be a loving God,
00:34:34.87\00:34:36.91
it's just the
Christians they can't handle...
00:34:36.94\00:34:39.24
Yeah, yeah, and that's
an important point Shawn
00:34:39.27\00:34:41.61
because they look
around, they look at churches,
00:34:41.64\00:34:43.95
they see the dysfunction
00:34:43.98\00:34:45.31
why pretend that it's not there
00:34:45.35\00:34:47.65
but the God that
you want to serve
00:34:47.68\00:34:49.95
that is beyond all of
this... above all of this
00:34:49.98\00:34:51.95
is true and faithful and loyal
00:34:52.02\00:34:53.49
so don't look at the...
00:34:53.56\00:34:54.89
the people per
se... look at God.
00:34:54.92\00:34:56.26
One of my favorite passages
is Ecclesiastes 3 verse 11,
00:34:56.29\00:34:58.53
"God has put
eternity in the heart. "
00:34:58.56\00:34:59.89
Everybody you know has
some inkling that God is there,
00:34:59.93\00:35:04.07
He does... Acts chapter 14,
00:35:04.10\00:35:06.94
"God has not left
Himself without witness. "
00:35:07.00\00:35:08.34
He's speaking to your neighbors,
00:35:08.37\00:35:09.70
we're not always the
best representative of Jesus,
00:35:09.74\00:35:12.31
so, I like to admit
that we're not perfect
00:35:12.34\00:35:15.44
and then point them Christ
00:35:15.48\00:35:16.85
and people make
decisions that... so...
00:35:16.88\00:35:19.38
those are the Discover Seminars
00:35:19.41\00:35:20.75
we're going to
release a new one every year
00:35:20.78\00:35:22.25
every year for
our Discover Centers
00:35:22.28\00:35:24.42
you can invite
people... they take Bible Study
00:35:24.45\00:35:26.29
then the next
thing we've done is
00:35:26.32\00:35:28.29
"Revelation Speaks Peace"
00:35:28.32\00:35:29.66
it's a public Prophecy Seminar
that I've done for 25 years
00:35:29.69\00:35:32.59
I've taken the whole thing,
00:35:32.63\00:35:34.00
I'm calling it:
Discovering Revelation
00:35:34.03\00:35:35.73
so that it's branded alike
with the Discover Bible School,
00:35:35.76\00:35:38.20
I'm packaging it
00:35:38.23\00:35:39.57
for any church that becomes
a Discovery Center... to use
00:35:39.60\00:35:41.67
I'm giving everything away
that God has blessed me with
00:35:41.70\00:35:43.84
over the years,
it's all going away
00:35:43.87\00:35:45.41
because it worked so well for us
around the world for 25 years,
00:35:45.44\00:35:48.38
that... I want to share that...
00:35:48.41\00:35:50.11
I want to share
that with every church
00:35:50.15\00:35:51.48
so, Bible School...
we've got the Discover Seminars
00:35:51.51\00:35:54.48
we've got a full message
campaign on Bible prophecy
00:35:54.52\00:35:57.49
that has worked... it's
worked for me every time,
00:35:57.52\00:36:00.46
once or twice...
it almost didn't work
00:36:00.49\00:36:02.26
but overall... hey,
as Christians we give up
00:36:02.29\00:36:04.89
if something does not work once.
00:36:04.93\00:36:06.26
"Oh, I give up... "
00:36:06.29\00:36:07.63
we would have lost World War 2
00:36:07.66\00:36:09.00
if the first bullet
fired over our head...
00:36:09.03\00:36:10.37
"Go home... it's pointless. "
00:36:10.40\00:36:11.73
If you work it... it works
00:36:11.77\00:36:13.74
and that's one of
the things we're showing,
00:36:13.77\00:36:15.10
it all comes with training...
00:36:15.14\00:36:16.47
we've got
resources for children...
00:36:16.50\00:36:18.41
Jean's show: Discovery Mountain
for children... radio drama,
00:36:18.44\00:36:21.08
we're developing a Vacation
Bible School to go with it,
00:36:21.11\00:36:23.04
we're developing
Children's Evangelistic Meetings
00:36:23.08\00:36:25.55
and a Bible
Study Set to go with it
00:36:25.58\00:36:26.92
so that if you're preaching
"Discovering Revelation"
00:36:26.95\00:36:28.85
your Kids' Department
has got Discovery Mountain
00:36:28.88\00:36:30.75
they've heard it
on the radio anyway.
00:36:30.79\00:36:32.12
Murray: Talk a
little bit about that
00:36:32.15\00:36:33.49
you're actually allowed
to talk about your wife.
00:36:33.52\00:36:34.86
Oh absolutely, she put
together a radio drama for kids,
00:36:34.89\00:36:37.19
it's based on a little
town called "Discovery Mountain"
00:36:37.23\00:36:40.00
up in the Rocky
Mountains, oddly enough...
00:36:40.03\00:36:41.60
we live at the base
of Rocky Mountains...
00:36:41.63\00:36:43.57
it's loosely built
on Glacier View Ranch,
00:36:43.60\00:36:45.50
as far as its look and feel
00:36:45.53\00:36:47.47
and it's gone gangbusters,
00:36:47.50\00:36:49.40
there's a radio drama
in the current day and age
00:36:49.44\00:36:51.24
where the kids are
dealing with real situations
00:36:51.27\00:36:53.04
but it always
ties to a Bible story,
00:36:53.07\00:36:55.08
there's a theme
every season that Jean does
00:36:55.11\00:36:57.05
like Esther and Moses
or something like that,
00:36:57.08\00:36:58.91
kids are learning the Bible
and it's gone gangbusters...
00:36:58.95\00:37:01.48
it's all over the place,
you can find it in iTunes,
00:37:01.52\00:37:03.42
you can find it on... I think
iHeart Media is carrying that
00:37:03.49\00:37:06.72
if not, I know they're carrying
a number of our shows already
00:37:06.76\00:37:09.79
and it will end up there.
00:37:09.82\00:37:11.16
It's on radio
stations all over the country
00:37:11.19\00:37:12.96
and the demand went through
the roof in three months,
00:37:12.99\00:37:14.86
we found a niche where kids...
and especially with grandparents
00:37:14.90\00:37:18.17
whose kids don't
take their kids to church
00:37:18.20\00:37:20.14
and they're, "What
can I give my kid?"
00:37:20.20\00:37:22.10
"What can I give my child?"
00:37:22.14\00:37:23.51
"Discovery Mountain"
00:37:23.54\00:37:24.87
go to discoverymountain. com
00:37:24.91\00:37:26.44
and you can see... you can
download the resources there,
00:37:26.47\00:37:28.94
that's gone huge,
so, children's resources,
00:37:28.98\00:37:31.35
Discover Seminars
00:37:31.38\00:37:33.01
Full-message Campaigns
00:37:33.05\00:37:34.72
Training
00:37:34.75\00:37:36.08
what we want to do is,
pull everybody together,
00:37:36.12\00:37:37.65
churches that are interested
in becoming a Discovery Center,
00:37:37.69\00:37:39.65
pull them
together in March of 2019,
00:37:39.69\00:37:41.02
we're going to have roll out,
00:37:41.06\00:37:42.39
"Here's all the
tools that we use
00:37:42.42\00:37:43.99
that have worked for
me for the last 25 years,
00:37:44.03\00:37:46.39
in a format that you can use. "
00:37:46.43\00:37:48.40
We have support systems,
00:37:48.43\00:37:49.76
"Hey, you have a
problem, give me a call"
00:37:49.80\00:37:51.13
I have an
Evangelist on the line,
00:37:51.17\00:37:52.50
"Hey, I've got this
going on in my meeting...
00:37:52.53\00:37:54.30
I've got a guy
half-way through a sex change
00:37:54.34\00:37:56.10
and he wants to come
to Jesus, what do I do?"
00:37:56.14\00:37:57.57
And then, I say,
"Call C.A. Murray. "
00:37:57.61\00:37:59.97
Laughter...
00:38:00.01\00:38:01.48
No... but that happens,
00:38:01.51\00:38:02.84
let's be honest about the
world we live in, it happens...
00:38:02.88\00:38:04.45
and so, we're going to
hold each other's hands.
00:38:04.48\00:38:06.18
We're going to
develop resources together
00:38:06.21\00:38:08.08
eventually, every pastor
that has a Discovery Center
00:38:08.12\00:38:11.05
gets his own
Sunday Morning Show,
00:38:11.12\00:38:12.45
I've got five radio shows now,
00:38:12.49\00:38:13.82
we've got: Disclosure
which is my Talk Radio Show
00:38:13.86\00:38:16.32
I do that once a week
and that's picking up...
00:38:16.36\00:38:18.69
I think we just picked
up another 138 Stations
00:38:18.73\00:38:21.03
that we're on...
00:38:21.06\00:38:22.40
so, we brought
that back from the dead,
00:38:22.43\00:38:23.77
Discovery
Mountains is a radio show...
00:38:23.80\00:38:25.23
all of these are
designed to drive people
00:38:25.27\00:38:26.80
straight to your
Discovery Center,
00:38:26.84\00:38:28.17
"The Bull Pen" is a
show I'm going to do for men
00:38:28.20\00:38:30.31
it's kind of like men are
the biggest missing demographic
00:38:30.34\00:38:33.27
in churches
especially middle-age guys
00:38:33.31\00:38:35.31
so, this is going
to be a radio show
00:38:35.34\00:38:37.28
that's going to be... I
hate to use the analogy,
00:38:37.31\00:38:39.75
I'm going to get letters...
00:38:39.78\00:38:41.12
address your
complaints to Jean Boonstra,
00:38:41.15\00:38:42.72
Box 999 Loveland, Colorado...
00:38:42.78\00:38:44.55
but this is like the closest
analog on TV: The Sports Center
00:38:44.59\00:38:49.66
it'll be four guys
talking religion and issues
00:38:49.69\00:38:51.56
and they can argue all they want
00:38:51.59\00:38:53.19
as long as I get
the last ten minutes
00:38:53.23\00:38:54.73
and I wrap it off
00:38:54.76\00:38:56.10
and invite people
to take Bible Studies
00:38:56.13\00:38:57.47
and visit a Discovery Center
00:38:57.50\00:38:59.10
and that one will be
geared specifically for men.
00:38:59.13\00:39:01.50
Jean is working on one
that's called: Believers
00:39:01.54\00:39:03.87
it will be like a
15-minute radio show
00:39:03.91\00:39:05.74
on great heroes of the faith,
00:39:05.77\00:39:07.21
kind of like Paul Harvey Style
00:39:07.24\00:39:08.61
we've got a website
which is in a radio show
00:39:08.64\00:39:11.31
bibleinfo. com
00:39:11.35\00:39:12.68
which now gets, I believe,
1.1 million people a month
00:39:12.71\00:39:15.12
coming for Bible
Study... you need visitors.
00:39:15.15\00:39:17.05
Murray: Praise the Lord.
00:39:17.09\00:39:18.42
So, these are all... all these
resources are all tied together
00:39:18.45\00:39:20.46
to open a Discovery Center,
00:39:20.49\00:39:21.86
you get your deep
fryer, you get your table,
00:39:21.89\00:39:23.66
you get your menu, you get...
00:39:23.69\00:39:25.03
and the public
knows because I said,
00:39:25.06\00:39:26.66
"I have a Discovery
Center in your town...
00:39:26.70\00:39:28.26
this is a safe place to go"
00:39:28.30\00:39:29.90
and they show up there,
00:39:29.93\00:39:31.27
we'll have post work,
00:39:31.30\00:39:32.63
I think we'll have a Bible
Marking Course for new believers
00:39:32.67\00:39:34.47
and discipling
resources for believers
00:39:34.50\00:39:36.37
and then again, eventually,
if you have a Discover Center,
00:39:36.40\00:39:39.87
I'm going to put
that Pastor on the radio
00:39:39.91\00:39:41.54
on their local
Talk Radio Station
00:39:41.58\00:39:43.81
Sunday morning
with a half-hour sermon
00:39:43.85\00:39:45.71
like the old Voice of Prophecy
00:39:45.75\00:39:47.12
that will be the Voice
of Prophecy presents...
00:39:47.15\00:39:48.48
like the old school...
00:39:48.52\00:39:50.25
because why in the
world would I be on the air
00:39:50.29\00:39:52.62
in Billy-Cook Junction, Arkansas
00:39:52.65\00:39:54.22
when there's a
pastor working hard there
00:39:54.26\00:39:55.72
and he's the one who
needs to meet the people.
00:39:55.76\00:39:57.39
So, we'll do it all together
00:39:57.43\00:39:59.23
then... then...
and here's the...
00:39:59.26\00:40:00.76
here's the piece that
I'm really excited about
00:40:00.80\00:40:03.37
once we've rolled
out all these things
00:40:03.40\00:40:04.77
and we're just about done,
00:40:04.80\00:40:06.13
in March of 2020,
we're going to open with
00:40:06.17\00:40:08.64
public evangelistic
meeting in 1,000 locations
00:40:08.70\00:40:11.24
with 1,000 Speakers
00:40:11.27\00:40:12.61
and I brought a trailer
for that can I show that one?
00:40:12.64\00:40:14.44
Rev 2020 is that
one... let's run that one.
00:40:14.48\00:40:17.01
What if...
00:40:17.05\00:40:22.45
music...
00:40:22.48\00:40:26.86
you have everything you
needed to finish the work?
00:40:26.89\00:40:29.42
music...
00:40:29.46\00:40:33.06
What if instead
of one city per year
00:40:33.09\00:40:36.46
music...
00:40:36.50\00:40:39.33
music...
00:40:42.87\00:40:46.27
What if instead of 1,500 guests
00:40:46.31\00:40:50.55
a 150,000
00:40:50.58\00:40:58.25
in 1948 Ellen White
saw streams of light
00:40:58.29\00:41:02.69
gripping the whole planet.
00:41:02.72\00:41:04.16
Did she see the possibilities
of the 21st century?
00:41:04.19\00:41:09.83
Music...
00:41:09.86\00:41:14.70
All new streams of
light... did she see?
00:41:14.74\00:41:16.81
Music...
00:41:16.84\00:41:21.01
What if she saw you?
00:41:21.04\00:41:22.71
read screen...
00:41:22.74\00:41:30.29
before God.
00:41:30.32\00:41:37.79
Music.
00:41:37.83\00:41:52.87
Well, powerful stuff
00:41:52.91\00:41:57.88
I want to just back up and tap
the brakes a little bit, Shawn
00:41:57.91\00:42:00.65
these four trailers are...
00:42:00.68\00:42:02.45
are... teasers to
four presentations
00:42:02.48\00:42:06.65
that lead to Bible
Studies... what are...
00:42:06.69\00:42:08.12
This last one... this
last one was Revelation 2020
00:42:08.16\00:42:10.63
that's what we're
kind of calling the project
00:42:10.69\00:42:12.19
as we open a
1,000 Discovery Centers,
00:42:12.23\00:42:14.13
we're going to run a
1,000 Evangelistic Meetings
00:42:14.16\00:42:16.77
with a 1,000 Speakers that
we have all gotten together
00:42:16.80\00:42:19.83
used the same resources...
00:42:19.87\00:42:21.20
we're branded
alike across the nation
00:42:21.24\00:42:23.10
that one there...
Revelation 2020...
00:42:23.17\00:42:25.17
we're going to
open in March of 20
00:42:25.21\00:42:27.24
so that's not...
that's a full-message campaign
00:42:27.28\00:42:29.28
you know that often
when I do Bible Prophecy
00:42:29.34\00:42:31.31
I go five weeks... this is...
00:42:31.35\00:42:32.75
people say, "Really five weeks,
five weeks in this day and age?"
00:42:32.78\00:42:35.85
Yeah... yeah we will...
00:42:35.88\00:42:37.22
people not only
come this day and age
00:42:37.25\00:42:38.79
in the Western
World, they stay...
00:42:38.82\00:42:40.16
Altar Calls are bigger than I've
ever seen them in my whole life,
00:42:40.19\00:42:42.96
I'm telling you
that at this moment
00:42:42.99\00:42:44.39
I sometimes get into a
meeting and I'm preaching
00:42:44.43\00:42:46.73
and 30 minutes in...
you know I preach an hour,
00:42:46.76\00:42:48.90
30 minutes in... I watch
people get out of their seats
00:42:48.93\00:42:51.23
and walk to the front to
make a decision for Christ
00:42:51.30\00:42:53.57
because they want an Altar Call,
00:42:53.60\00:42:55.50
"That's enough
sermon, we're convinced...
00:42:55.54\00:42:56.97
let's do this. "
00:42:57.01\00:42:58.37
I want every
church to experience that,
00:42:58.41\00:43:00.88
we've allowed
ourselves to become convinced
00:43:00.91\00:43:03.48
that proclaiming that
the everlasting gospel
00:43:03.51\00:43:06.25
has become
impossible in the 21st Century
00:43:06.28\00:43:08.95
too post-modern... too
secular... it doesn't work
00:43:08.98\00:43:11.05
that's a bunch of nonsense
00:43:11.09\00:43:13.15
it's not true at all...
00:43:13.22\00:43:15.22
I've watched it work
time and time and time again,
00:43:15.26\00:43:17.63
Jean and I have had
the privilege of watching
00:43:17.66\00:43:19.03
almost a 100,000 people
make a decision for Christ
00:43:19.06\00:43:21.13
at this point in our ministry,
00:43:21.16\00:43:22.50
100,000...
00:43:22.53\00:43:23.87
and it's not because
we're unusually gifted...
00:43:23.90\00:43:25.43
it's because the message works,
00:43:25.47\00:43:26.80
the Bible's
powerful and God is not dead,
00:43:26.84\00:43:29.30
He saw the whole world lighting
up with the glory of Christ
00:43:29.34\00:43:31.71
before Jesus
comes, Revelation 18,
00:43:31.74\00:43:33.68
we're headed for good times,
00:43:33.71\00:43:35.48
it's not getting
tougher, it's getting better
00:43:35.51\00:43:37.55
and so, I want every
church to experience that.
00:43:37.58\00:43:39.51
Now, the other ones...
yeah... the Discover Seminars...
00:43:39.55\00:43:41.65
A Pale Horse Rides
00:43:41.68\00:43:43.12
Shadow Empire 3... 4... nights
00:43:43.15\00:43:45.79
and then invite people
to stay for Bible Study,
00:43:45.82\00:43:48.29
and we've got one
more of those coming up...
00:43:48.32\00:43:50.73
October of '18
00:43:50.76\00:43:52.76
"The Appearing" on the
Second Coming of Christ
00:43:52.79\00:43:54.80
now, I did this
Series some years ago
00:43:54.83\00:43:58.07
and we packed 1,400 auditoriums,
00:43:58.10\00:44:00.14
we couldn't
believe the response,
00:44:00.17\00:44:02.14
and every time we
run a Discover Seminar
00:44:02.20\00:44:04.07
people are telling us,
00:44:04.11\00:44:05.44
"We got three times the number
of visitors than we prepared for
00:44:05.47\00:44:07.31
we can't believe
how hungry people are. "
00:44:07.34\00:44:09.54
This one... I've
completely re-written,
00:44:09.58\00:44:11.28
there's a brand-new book
and it's a brand-new Series
00:44:11.31\00:44:13.05
and guess what.. I
brought a trailer for that too.
00:44:13.11\00:44:14.82
Let's run that
one... The Appearing.
00:44:14.85\00:44:16.48
Murray: Got to take
a look. Shawn: Yeah...
00:44:16.52\00:44:17.85
Screen...
00:44:17.89\00:44:37.21
Music...
00:44:37.27\00:44:56.69
Are you ready?
00:44:56.73\00:44:59.79
Pause.
00:44:59.83\00:45:01.93
Great voice, very well done.
00:45:01.96\00:45:03.37
Yeah, that's not more of
my voice... you can tell right
00:45:03.40\00:45:05.43
that's actually a guy
in Hollywood who loves us
00:45:05.47\00:45:07.70
and does that for us.
00:45:07.74\00:45:09.24
Shawn... just to sort of paint
out with very broad strokes here
00:45:09.27\00:45:14.74
I was going to say, nuance...
00:45:14.81\00:45:17.41
but this is not a
nuance change in VOP...
00:45:17.45\00:45:20.12
this is a whole
new set of clothes.
00:45:20.15\00:45:22.88
Well, it is what
VOP was born to do
00:45:22.92\00:45:25.62
we're now pushing 90
years old not me... not me...
00:45:25.65\00:45:29.62
but the ministry is pushing
90 it was born to do this,
00:45:29.66\00:45:32.83
but I don't want to
be the only one out there
00:45:32.86\00:45:35.53
reaping souls for Jesus,
00:45:35.56\00:45:37.00
if every church member
could see it for themselves,
00:45:37.03\00:45:39.83
just once in their
life, somebody come to Christ
00:45:39.87\00:45:42.64
because they
allowed God to use them
00:45:42.67\00:45:44.67
and here's what I teach
00:45:44.71\00:45:46.27
you can't convert people
00:45:46.34\00:45:47.68
we're too scared of this,
00:45:47.71\00:45:49.04
you can't convert people,
00:45:49.08\00:45:50.71
1st Corinthians 2 tells
us that this carnal minds...
00:45:50.75\00:45:53.58
you know, can't be...
00:45:53.62\00:45:55.02
it doesn't
understand spiritual things,
00:45:55.05\00:45:56.65
we've shifted people's thinking,
00:45:56.69\00:45:59.12
if... I mean,
God speaks to people,
00:45:59.15\00:46:01.29
our job is not to convert people
00:46:01.32\00:46:03.39
but to find those that God's
in the process of converting,
00:46:03.43\00:46:05.53
and if you look back,
00:46:05.56\00:46:07.26
everybody over their
own experience can see
00:46:07.30\00:46:09.53
God got to them long before
the Preacher or the Bible Worker
00:46:09.56\00:46:12.23
or anybody else got to them,
00:46:12.27\00:46:13.60
the church didn't speak to them,
00:46:13.64\00:46:14.97
God woke them up and
made them interested.
00:46:15.00\00:46:16.40
If we could take away the fear
00:46:16.44\00:46:18.97
and have very church member
lead one person to Christ,
00:46:19.01\00:46:21.48
they'll keep doing it
the rest of their lives
00:46:21.51\00:46:22.84
because there's
nothing more rewarding
00:46:22.88\00:46:24.28
and we can't rely on this idea
00:46:24.31\00:46:26.75
that there's going to be...
as much as I would love to,
00:46:26.78\00:46:28.62
there's a number of
Evangelist friends of mine
00:46:28.65\00:46:30.22
that run around... we
hold big meetings and...
00:46:30.25\00:46:31.75
I would love to pretend that
that's how the work is finished,
00:46:31.82\00:46:34.46
it's not... that will... there
will always be a need for that
00:46:34.49\00:46:37.13
there's always
going to be a need
00:46:37.16\00:46:38.49
for a big splash in the city
00:46:38.53\00:46:39.86
to sort of make it a
dent in the devil's armor,
00:46:39.89\00:46:41.30
but every member
could be a soul winner
00:46:41.33\00:46:43.87
and they can use exactly the
same tools that I've have had
00:46:43.90\00:46:46.07
at my disposal for 25 years,
00:46:46.10\00:46:47.67
I've given the
store away so to speak,
00:46:47.70\00:46:49.70
I really am...
00:46:49.77\00:46:51.11
because everybody deserves
to see somebody come to Christ,
00:46:51.14\00:46:53.41
so we're opening
these Discovery Centers.
00:46:53.44\00:46:55.61
I think that was HMS'
intent in the beginning...
00:46:55.64\00:46:57.75
to lead people to Christ,
00:46:57.78\00:46:59.11
he realized... I can get into
that home and get them to church
00:46:59.15\00:47:01.15
I think over the years
00:47:01.18\00:47:03.15
we've probably
drifted from that a little bit
00:47:03.18\00:47:04.72
and the media became the
point, it's not the point
00:47:04.75\00:47:07.92
the point is... people coming
into the community of faith
00:47:07.96\00:47:10.93
becoming believers in Christ,
joining God's remnant church,
00:47:10.99\00:47:13.93
getting ready for Jesus to come,
00:47:13.96\00:47:15.80
that happens at the church
00:47:15.83\00:47:17.20
so, we flipped
everything on its head
00:47:17.23\00:47:18.87
and we're directing
all of our attention...
00:47:18.90\00:47:21.20
all of our
attention to the local church
00:47:21.27\00:47:23.51
to help your church
win people to Christ.
00:47:23.54\00:47:25.74
Praise the Lord and I'll
tell you what that is, Shawn,
00:47:25.77\00:47:27.11
it's freeing...
00:47:27.14\00:47:28.58
you don't have to start
with a defensive posture,
00:47:28.61\00:47:30.68
you don't have to
start with the mindset
00:47:30.71\00:47:33.48
that I've got to avoid failure
00:47:33.52\00:47:35.02
because if
they're in front of you...
00:47:35.05\00:47:36.58
if they're in that building...
00:47:36.62\00:47:37.95
they already got
a toe in the water.
00:47:37.99\00:47:39.32
That's right... that's
right and you will fail...
00:47:39.35\00:47:41.02
hey, that's one of the things
that we're going to teach too,
00:47:41.06\00:47:42.79
you're going to mess up,
00:47:42.82\00:47:44.19
if you're scared
you're going to mess up,
00:47:44.23\00:47:45.69
let me assure you, you
will... you're going to...
00:47:45.73\00:47:47.90
I've done some colossally stupid
things in the past 25 years
00:47:47.93\00:47:50.60
but Jesus loves me...
00:47:50.63\00:47:52.33
He picks me up and says,
00:47:52.37\00:47:53.97
"Next time,
Shawn, don't do that"
00:47:54.00\00:47:56.34
and that's part
of growing in it too
00:47:56.37\00:47:58.67
but you will watch people
come to Christ... you will...
00:47:58.71\00:48:00.74
everybody deserves to see that,
00:48:00.78\00:48:02.11
it is ministry of all... a
priesthood of all believers.
00:48:02.21\00:48:04.88
Yes indeed, yeah that...
once you find that happening,
00:48:04.91\00:48:07.55
you will find that
that is an addictive thing,
00:48:07.58\00:48:09.85
just the...
00:48:09.88\00:48:11.22
just a little success is enough
to send you back out there
00:48:11.25\00:48:13.92
because you know that it has
happened... it can happen again
00:48:13.96\00:48:16.69
and God will be with
and you're not on your own,
00:48:16.73\00:48:19.29
I really like the
direction that you're moving in,
00:48:19.33\00:48:21.86
it's much more user-friendly
but it's much more current,
00:48:21.90\00:48:25.73
it's... it's what
will work here and now
00:48:25.77\00:48:27.60
given what we're...
what we're dealing with
00:48:27.64\00:48:29.44
The idea that you still do
00:48:29.47\00:48:32.54
and that you're
very susceptible to
00:48:32.57\00:48:35.38
five-week meetings...
00:48:35.41\00:48:37.68
six-week meetings... that's...
00:48:37.71\00:48:39.05
that's... that's...
that's still on the table, man,
00:48:39.08\00:48:40.75
it hasn't gone away...
00:48:40.78\00:48:42.12
People... people will come...
we've talked ourselves out of it
00:48:42.15\00:48:44.59
but actually in the
Western world, I insist,
00:48:44.62\00:48:46.19
no less than
four-and-a-half weeks
00:48:46.22\00:48:48.16
that's the bare
minimum that I'll do,
00:48:48.22\00:48:50.13
they'll come... they'll stay...
00:48:50.16\00:48:51.49
some cities are
harder than others,
00:48:51.53\00:48:52.86
I've had some places
where the crowds aren't as large
00:48:52.89\00:48:54.50
as in other cities,
00:48:54.53\00:48:56.10
that's a fact of life
00:48:56.13\00:48:57.47
but, you know, I
keep telling myself,
00:48:57.50\00:48:59.17
Noah preached for a 120
years and only baptized his kids
00:48:59.20\00:49:01.87
and we all know he would have
been sinning... had he stopped.
00:49:01.90\00:49:05.51
Murray: Yes, yeah... yeah...
00:49:05.57\00:49:06.91
Had he stopped, he
would have been sinning,
00:49:06.94\00:49:08.98
God told us to go
and preach the gospel
00:49:09.01\00:49:11.11
as a witness to all nations,
00:49:11.15\00:49:12.48
and if the results were
zero, you'd still have to do it
00:49:12.51\00:49:15.32
the good news is,
the results are not zero,
00:49:15.35\00:49:17.39
they're not even close to zero,
00:49:17.45\00:49:19.29
Paul would love to be around now
00:49:19.32\00:49:21.12
because it's better
now than it was back then
00:49:21.16\00:49:23.29
it really is... I wish...
00:49:23.32\00:49:25.66
if our people
could only see that
00:49:25.69\00:49:27.50
they'll be soul
winners full time.
00:49:27.53\00:49:29.00
Murray: Praise the Lord.
00:49:29.03\00:49:30.37
If they could see that...
00:49:30.40\00:49:31.73
that your neighbor is
dying to come to Christ,
00:49:31.77\00:49:33.10
the problem is... we
haven't even met them,
00:49:33.13\00:49:34.47
they're dying to come to Christ.
00:49:34.50\00:49:36.00
Yeah, yeah, I really like that
and you don't mind, dare I say,
00:49:36.04\00:49:39.07
wading into kind of deep water
00:49:39.11\00:49:40.48
the size of the city
00:49:40.51\00:49:42.31
or the suspected secularism
of that town... doesn't...
00:49:42.34\00:49:46.41
No, I never know
what I'm going to get,
00:49:46.45\00:49:48.15
I actually tend to pick
the most secular cities...
00:49:48.18\00:49:49.98
I just did Seattle... we filled
the Agriplex there in Seattle,
00:49:50.02\00:49:53.42
I think we got a
photo somewhere in the files
00:49:53.46\00:49:56.79
back in the control room,
00:49:56.83\00:49:59.26
that shows an Altar
Call in Puyallup, Washington,
00:49:59.29\00:50:01.36
it's... it's... it's...
00:50:01.40\00:50:02.73
you wouldn't believe
the size of the responses
00:50:02.76\00:50:04.10
it's the most secular city...
00:50:04.13\00:50:05.47
I tend not to go
to the places I know
00:50:05.50\00:50:06.84
are really Bible-Belt places,
00:50:06.87\00:50:08.84
I want to go somewhere
where it can't be done.
00:50:08.87\00:50:11.17
And it always works
there too because God said...
00:50:11.21\00:50:13.48
God didn't get this wrong,
00:50:13.51\00:50:14.84
God did not look down
through the corridors of time
00:50:14.88\00:50:16.58
see the whole world being
lit up for the glory of Christ
00:50:16.61\00:50:18.41
He did not give His
church the Three Angels Messages
00:50:18.45\00:50:21.08
found in Revelation 14 for
the end time and get it wrong
00:50:21.15\00:50:24.12
He didn't get it wrong,
00:50:24.15\00:50:25.49
God didn't...
isn't caught by surprise
00:50:25.52\00:50:27.02
by the
post-moderns and the seculars
00:50:27.06\00:50:28.76
He's not calling a meeting right
now with the angels saying,
00:50:28.82\00:50:31.76
"I got it so wrong... I just
didn't see those people coming"
00:50:31.79\00:50:34.73
He got it exactly right
00:50:34.76\00:50:36.10
and what I want is for
your church to experience that,
00:50:36.13\00:50:38.03
to see the God it right
00:50:38.07\00:50:39.40
and that this world's
ready for Jesus to come.
00:50:39.43\00:50:41.50
Praise the
Lord... praise the Lord.
00:50:41.54\00:50:42.87
I remember several
years ago when it came out
00:50:42.90\00:50:44.91
that you were going to Rome
00:50:44.94\00:50:46.27
and people were saying,
"Hey, Shawn's going to Rome. "
00:50:46.31\00:50:48.68
Laughter...
00:50:48.71\00:50:51.41
That's a tough town...
00:50:51.45\00:50:52.78
that is a tough town,
yeah, that is a tough town
00:50:52.81\00:50:55.02
but even there it worked.
00:50:55.05\00:50:56.69
All I was asking for was
ten decisions for Christ...
00:50:56.75\00:50:59.55
I think we saw 140 by the time
we were done with the meetings
00:50:59.59\00:51:02.39
but the thing that
touched my heart the most
00:51:02.42\00:51:03.76
were the church members,
00:51:03.79\00:51:05.13
one lady in
particular was crying one night.
00:51:05.16\00:51:07.16
I said, "What's the matter?"
00:51:07.20\00:51:08.53
She said, "I can do this,
I can lead people to Jesus,
00:51:08.56\00:51:10.43
nothing's wrong,
I'm just that happy. "
00:51:10.47\00:51:11.93
That summer, she went
through her apartment building,
00:51:11.97\00:51:13.74
knocked on every
door and met everybody,
00:51:13.77\00:51:15.47
led eight people
to Christ that summer.
00:51:15.50\00:51:16.87
Murray: Praise the
Lord, praise the Lord.
00:51:16.91\00:51:18.24
That's why I do what I do,
00:51:18.27\00:51:19.61
it's not so I can say,
00:51:19.64\00:51:20.98
"Hey, VOP baptized
X number of people"
00:51:21.01\00:51:22.41
I don't care about that,
00:51:22.44\00:51:23.78
I want your church
to grow and succeed,
00:51:23.81\00:51:25.31
I want every member
to lead someone to Christ
00:51:25.35\00:51:27.58
because, I'm convinced that's
the only way you grow personally
00:51:27.62\00:51:30.42
anyway... it's the one
thing Jesus asked us to do,
00:51:30.45\00:51:32.62
He did not ask us to
have a Nominating Committee
00:51:32.65\00:51:34.79
or a Building Committee
or... those are important...
00:51:34.82\00:51:36.62
but that's not the
mission of the church
00:51:36.66\00:51:38.36
and everybody's involved
in the mission of the church
00:51:38.39\00:51:41.00
we've lost sight of that in
some corners of Christianity
00:51:41.03\00:51:43.63
and it's time to recapture it.
00:51:43.67\00:51:45.03
We can turn the
world upside down again,
00:51:45.10\00:51:46.80
we can be like that
first-century church.
00:51:46.84\00:51:48.24
Praise the
Lord... praise the Lord,
00:51:48.27\00:51:49.60
so by any conceivable
measure having someone go out
00:51:49.64\00:51:52.51
and do that on their own...
00:51:52.57\00:51:53.91
that has got to be
the definition of success.
00:51:53.94\00:51:56.31
Shawn: Yeah... Murray: Yeah...
00:51:56.34\00:51:57.68
But that's how we grow so we're
going to give you everything...
00:51:57.71\00:51:59.55
we're just providing everything.
00:51:59.58\00:52:00.95
"I don't know how to put
together this Resource Center"
00:52:00.98\00:52:02.65
don't worry... we'll
do the heavy lifting,
00:52:02.68\00:52:04.02
I've got all the resources,
00:52:04.05\00:52:05.39
they're adaptable
to your own situation
00:52:05.42\00:52:06.76
I'll give you
everything you need
00:52:06.79\00:52:08.62
so, there's no excuse,
I'll even hold your hand,
00:52:08.69\00:52:10.13
we'll even go to
that first door together.
00:52:10.16\00:52:11.49
Praise the
Lord... 101... love it.
00:52:11.53\00:52:13.29
We've got to go to
our newsbreak just now
00:52:13.36\00:52:15.13
then we're going to come back
00:52:15.16\00:52:16.50
and have Shawn sort of
put a little bow on this
00:52:16.53\00:52:18.37
and sort of wrap this up,
00:52:18.40\00:52:19.73
we'll be back in
just a couple of minutes.
00:52:19.77\00:52:21.67