Participants:
Series Code: TDY
Program Code: TDY018044A
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00:01 I want to spend my life
00:07 Mending broken people 00:12 I want to spend my life 00:19 Removing pain 00:24 Lord, let my words 00:30 Heal a heart that hurts 00:34 I want to spend my life 00:40 Mending broken people 00:46 I want to spend my life 00:51 Mending broken people 01:10 Hello and welcome to 3ABN Today. 01:12 My name is CA Murray. 01:14 And allow me once again to thank you for sharing 01:16 just a little of your day with us. 01:18 To thank you for your love, your prayers, 01:20 your support of this ministry 01:22 as for these three plus decades, 01:25 we have tried to serve the Lord with your assistance 01:27 and your partnership. 01:29 We've attempted to lift up the name of Jesus 01:31 and to carry the good news of the soon 01:34 coming of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ around the world. 01:36 So thank you from the bottom of our hearts 01:38 for being with us. 01:40 Got a very, very special story today. 01:42 So we want you to draw near 01:43 and to receive inspiration from two people 01:46 that I've come to know 01:47 and really respect and love in the short time 01:49 that we've had a chance to communicate 01:50 with each other who have been through tragedy 01:53 but have turned tragedy into ministry, 01:56 ministry and trial into triumph. 01:58 Please meet Tim and Jamie Grindley. 02:02 Good to have you both here. 02:03 Tim, good to have you here too, man. 02:05 It's good to be here. 02:06 They come to us from... 02:07 I don't know this town Tryon, North Carolina. 02:09 Where is that in the state near? 02:11 It's kind of halfway 02:14 between Asheville, North Carolina 02:15 and Spartanburg, South Carolina. 02:18 Little short of Spartanburg in the foothills. 02:20 Right at the North Carolina, South Carolina border. 02:22 Border, yeah. 02:23 Kind of in the southern part of the state. 02:25 Yeah. So good to have you here. 02:28 I can tell you, now 02:29 they've been through a pretty tough tragedy 02:31 but you can see on their beautiful smiling faces 02:34 that God has been with them. 02:36 And we're going to sort of walk our way through that. 02:39 And what I think I want to do 02:40 is just go to our music now because once we get started, 02:43 I don't want to sort of hit 02:44 the pause button to go to a song, 02:45 but we want to go to our song first 02:47 and then I want to come back and walk 02:48 through what they've been walking 02:51 through for the past several years 02:52 and how God has sustained them. 02:54 And as you hear their testimony, 02:56 you can really get courage to know 02:59 that just about anything life throws you away, 03:02 with the power of God in your life 03:03 you can handle it in Jesus Christ. 03:05 And come off more than a conqueror 03:08 through Jesus Christ, our Lord. 03:09 And that's what they're going to be telling you about today. 03:11 They will be quick to tell you the story, 03:13 it's not about them per se as much 03:16 as it is about God's ability to heal, 03:20 to strengthen and to make you stronger 03:22 on the other side of the pretty rough set 03:24 of circumstances that you can go to. 03:26 So thank you for being here. 03:27 Our music today is coming 03:29 from my good buddy, Wintley Phipps, 03:30 we were in undergrad together, grad school together 03:33 and spent a lot of time over the years. 03:37 He's going to be singing a really beautiful song, 03:39 "All the way my savior leads me". 04:12 All the way my Savior leads me 04:17 What have I to ask beside? 04:22 Can I doubt His tender mercy? 04:27 Who through life has been my guide 04:32 Heavenly peace, divinest comfort 04:37 Ere by faith in Him to dwell 04:41 For I know whate'er fall me 04:46 Jesus doeth all things well 04:51 For I know whate'er fall me 04:56 Jesus doeth 05:02 All things well 05:12 All the way my Savior leads me 05:16 Cheers each winding path 05:19 I tread Gives me grace for every trial 05:26 Feeds me with the living bread 05:31 Though my weary steps may falter 05:36 And my soul a-thirst may be Gushing 05:41 From the rock before me 05:46 Though a spring of joy I see 05:50 Gushing from the rock before me 05:57 Though a spring of joy I see 06:14 All the way my Savior leads me 06:18 Oh, the fullness of His love 06:23 Perfect rest to me is promised 06:28 In my Father's house above 06:33 When my spirit clothed immortal 06:38 Wings its flight through the realms of the day 06:42 This my song through endless ages 06:47 Jesus led me all the way 06:52 This my song 06:54 Through endless ages 07:01 Jesus led 07:04 Me all 07:10 The way 07:35 Amen and amen. 07:36 Wintley Phipps, "All the way my savior leads me". 07:38 Wonderfully sung. 07:40 And perhaps Tim and Jamie 07:43 that is kind of emblematic of what you've gone through, 07:46 savior has had to lead you through some, 07:48 can I say rough stuff over these years. 07:52 And we're going to talk about that but before we get into, 07:56 to Caleb and he of course 07:57 is part of the heart of the story. 08:00 Give me just a little background. 08:03 Jamie, we'll start with you Adventist family 08:05 I understand and going back, maybe a few years. 08:08 Yes, my mother and her parents. 08:12 And 08:16 I'm a fourth generation Adventist. 08:19 My mother was from Switzerland. 08:20 And so her family was some of the first Adventist 08:25 in Switzerland from what I understand. 08:29 So you've got little lineage there. 08:30 Yeah, praise the Lord. 08:32 I was Adventist before I was born. 08:35 And grew up with a wonderful promises 08:37 and assurance that we have. 08:38 Praise the Lord. 08:40 And, Tim, same thing Adventist background? 08:41 Yes, yes. It was Adventist background. 08:45 But it's something 08:46 that I take very personal myself. 08:48 I mean, yes, I'm glad 08:50 that my parents and my grandparents 08:52 were Adventist but, 08:55 you know, that just gives me a good start. 08:57 Yeah, can't get it on their quotas. 08:59 Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. 09:00 And so I just love the Bible, 09:02 the Bible is such a wonderful gift to us, 09:07 the stories, the message, the doctrine. 09:10 Praise the Lord. I love it. 09:12 Let me ask, how did you guys meet? 09:15 We met, we both went to Southern... 09:17 Tim is smiling, so... 09:19 We met at Mickey Baking Company, 09:21 we worked together. 09:23 Made, making sweet things. Yes. 09:25 Praise the Lord. 09:26 It's important to know that you are marrying somebody 09:29 that is a good worker and conscientious. 09:34 It is good because in talking with you, 09:36 you've worked together for a great part 09:38 of your working career. 09:39 So it's good to know that you kind of meet somebody 09:41 that kind of matches you and resonates with you. 09:44 In whose mind did it first occur 09:46 that maybe this may be the one? 09:48 Jamie, Tim, who was first? Or who did it occur to first? 09:52 Well, I know I enjoyed 09:55 spending time with him and... 09:59 Yeah. Real quick. 10:03 Real quick let me say after a short time 10:07 I fell madly in love with her. 10:11 But at 18 I'm like is, 10:15 I don't know that I'm prepared 10:17 for the next step of being married. 10:20 And so I did say "Let's take a breather." 10:25 I needed a breather. 10:26 And, but after a couple years I said, 10:31 "My mind is so wrapped up with her." 10:33 I just, let's date again, so we did. 10:37 And then ultimately got married. 10:39 We've known each other for four years. 10:41 At the time. Yeah, yeah. 10:42 So 22 is still fairly early, it's not late in life that's... 10:46 And of course 10:48 if you are kind of smitten and got bit at 18, 10:52 that is a little young. 10:53 You know, you've got other things to do 10:55 to try to get yourself established, 10:56 you're at school, 10:58 you're working for Mickey Foods and doing that kind of thing. 11:00 So you're married now and five children. 11:04 Am I correct? Five. 11:06 Give me their names. 11:07 Kitora, Caleb, Annelise, 11:11 Jens and Marita. 11:14 And you were living 11:15 when all of this we're getting ready 11:17 to talk about in North Carolina or you still in, 11:19 you're in North Carolina at that point. 11:21 Okay. We've been there for 25 years. 11:23 Good little while, good little while. 11:24 But our first was born when we lived in Collegedale. 11:29 And then when we lived in the Marietta area, 11:32 Marietta, Georgia, the next three were born. 11:35 And then when we moved to North Carolina, 11:37 Marita was born. 11:39 But they were all born 11:41 in Chattanooga at Erlanger Hospital. 11:45 We always go back there to the doctor, 11:46 we like to get to the doctor. 11:47 Oh, praise the Lord. 11:49 So well, we praise the Lord for consistency. 11:50 Yes. 11:52 So, of course, everybody's being raised up 11:53 in an Adventist home because you're... 11:56 Tell me the kinds of things you did work wise 11:59 'cause I know you're a nurse, Jamie. 12:02 Well, I was working when we were in Tennessee, 12:06 I worked part of the time 12:09 with when our first child was born. 12:11 Then we moved to and Tim is an accountant, 12:14 we moved to Georgia, 12:17 he had been working first of all 12:19 at BlueCross BlueShield in Tennessee. 12:21 And then we went to Georgia and he transferred down there. 12:24 And the next three were born. 12:25 And by this time 12:27 then I just became a stay at home mom, 12:29 and he was working. 12:31 But we just enjoy being together 12:32 and we wanted to do something that we could work together 12:35 and spend our time together at. 12:37 And we became acquainted with, 12:40 in Georgia it's called personal care homes. 12:42 In North Carolina it was called assisted living. 12:46 But we saw an advertisement in the Southern Tidings 12:49 actually for DDA home for sale, 12:52 which is Developmentally Disabled Adults. 12:55 And so we looked at that place and we bought that. 12:59 And the eight residents lived downstairs 13:02 and we were upstairs with our five children. 13:04 We just, we just enjoyed working together 13:07 and we still do. 13:08 When I pastored in Amityville, 13:12 one of my elders and his wife 13:13 who was also on our end did the same thing. 13:16 In New York that's kind of a big deal. 13:18 If you can provide the facilities, 13:20 you can take as many as you can you can handle. 13:23 And it's nice if you, if you get along together. 13:26 There are some people who will tell you, 13:27 don't ever work with your wife or with your mate 13:31 or but for in your case obviously 13:34 it worked out very, very well, 13:35 you like each other, you like each other's company. 13:37 And you sort of work at the same frequency. 13:39 You know, you kind of resonate at the same frequency. 13:41 And that's a good thing. 13:43 You know, that's a real good thing. 13:45 So we're moving, we're growing, the kids are growing up. 13:49 And let's go now to that night that we walked through. 13:54 And give me some sense of what happened with Caleb 13:56 that whole situation that night? 13:58 Well, I would like to begin, Caleb was around 23. 14:04 And he at this time 14:06 we were not doing assisted living 14:08 but we had the two, 14:10 we had our home and then the assisted living 14:12 facility home behind us. 14:14 And Caleb was living, that was his little area, 14:17 he lived back there. 14:21 And we would see each other daily and talk. 14:24 And there was many times 14:25 as we would talk and I would say, 14:27 "Caleb, I just don't feel comfortable 14:31 with what you're doing 14:32 and that decision that you made. 14:34 And I don't think 14:37 that's what Jesus would want you to do." 14:38 And that decision was? 14:42 Whatever something that I didn't think it was... 14:43 Oh, any particular decision. 14:45 Okay, I got you. Yeah. 14:47 Use of time. Right. Just whatever. 14:49 And so, but then I would lay 14:51 in bed at night and I would think, 14:53 "He is 23 and he's an adult." 14:58 I mean, I was, when I was 23 it's like, boy, 15:00 if my parents would talk to me 15:02 that way I would have felt resentful. 15:04 And so I call him up, I say, 15:07 "Caleb, I'm so sorry that I talk to you that way. 15:10 Will you please forgive me, you're an adult. 15:11 And you have to make your own decisions." 15:12 He said, "Mom, I love you so much, 15:14 it's okay, I forgive you." 15:16 But I found myself four, five or six times having 15:19 the same conversation with him. 15:20 And finally I flung myself on my bed. 15:25 And I slid to the floor and I said, 15:27 "Lord, these five children you gave us, 15:30 they're not really ours, they're Yours. 15:33 And I know that You love them more than I do. 15:38 And You want their salvation, their heart fully to You. 15:43 And so from now on since you're the Father, 15:47 You do the disciplining and just help me to love them 15:50 unconditionally." 15:52 And I said, I really don't want anybody to suffer. 15:58 But if that's what it takes to save them, 16:01 You have my permission. 16:03 And then I wept, I said, 16:04 I really don't want anybody to die. 16:06 And I wasn't thinking of my, any of my children dying, 16:09 I was thinking of myself 16:12 or a friend or some other family 16:15 member something and sometimes when somebody dies it turns 16:20 somebody else around and to the Lord. 16:22 And let me just tap the brakes for a second, Jamie, 16:26 because and we talked about this before, 16:27 your relationship with Caleb 16:29 was such that you could kind of correct him 16:32 and speak to him plainly 16:33 but it didn't destroy the relationship. 16:35 That is the depth of the relationship 16:36 that you had that it certainly could survive and even thrive, 16:40 even though sometimes you saw things 16:42 you didn't like and you address that 16:44 but it didn't destroy what you had together. 16:46 He would listen, he would listen, 16:49 he would make his decisions 16:51 but he was kind and the fact that he... 16:54 He was always respectful. 16:55 He did not ever roll his eyes or say anything, 17:00 you know, unkind to me. 17:01 He was always very respectful to me. 17:04 And we... 17:05 When you apologized, he accepted that. 17:07 Oh, yes, he did. 17:08 Even when it was four or five or six times, 17:10 you know Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 17:13 And praise the Lord for that, the depth of the relationship 17:15 that could thrive in that kind of situation. 17:17 So praise the Lord for that. Yeah. 17:19 It was like 17:20 when you're the parents of young children, 17:21 you pray, 17:23 when you're the parents of adult children 17:24 you really pray. 17:26 Yeah, yeah. 17:28 So anyway, 17:32 a couple of years later 17:35 I was skyping 17:37 with our daughter in Switzerland. 17:39 And it was, it was a rainy morning. 17:43 And I remember rolling out of bed and saying, 17:48 "Lord, I know even though it's raining outside, 17:51 the sun is shining above the clouds 17:52 and you know all about today. 17:54 And nothing's going to happen 17:56 that You won't give us the grace 17:57 and the strength to face whatever it is." 18:01 And so a little later in that morning 18:05 I was skyping with Kitora and Bruce 18:07 in Switzerland. 18:09 And I asked her if she had heard about... 18:14 This was on a Wednesday, on Sunday one of our, 18:17 a family friend that I had grown up 18:18 with was killed in a car accident. 18:22 And I asked Kitora if she had heard about Scott. 18:24 And she said, "Yes, I did." 18:28 She said either these things are happening more often 18:31 or I'm just becoming more aware of it. 18:34 And I said, she said at any rate 18:37 it just kind of takes your, takes your words away. 18:41 I said that's true but Scott is sleeping. 18:44 And the trumpet will sound and we'll see Scott again. 18:49 And she said, "Mom, I have heard all my life 18:51 that Jesus is coming again, 18:53 even the disciples believe that." 18:57 And she says, "It hasn't happened." 18:58 She said, "I'm beginning to think a person 19:01 has to go to sleep for it to happen." 19:03 At any rate, she said, "It doesn't sound so bad. 19:08 So don't worry, Mom, I'm okay." 19:10 Well, I texted back to her, I said, 19:12 "Kitora, they that wait 19:15 upon the Lord shall renew their strength, 19:17 they shall mount up with wings as eagles, 19:18 they shall run and not be weary and not walk and not faint." 19:21 And she said, "I know, Mom. 19:23 I know, thank you for the encouragement." 19:25 Well, it was just a short time 19:27 later Caleb came running into the room, 19:29 to the computer room and he saw his sister, 19:32 he said, "Hey Kitora." 19:33 Bruce said, "Hey Caleb." 19:35 Oh, wow, so great to see you. 19:36 And they were talking and I looked at Caleb 19:38 and I said, "Caleb, this is Wednesday 19:41 and it's your off day 19:42 and you're wearing your NAPA shirt." 19:45 He said, "Well, something had happened 19:47 and they had an emergency 19:49 and they asked if you'd come in and help 19:51 and he said he would. 19:52 And he said I can't talk long. 19:54 So they talked just a few a couple more minutes 19:57 and Caleb left the house. 20:01 And one minute later our electricity went off. 20:04 And... 20:06 So I went out to the living room 20:10 where Tim had been talking to our daughter 20:13 who lives in Canada. 20:14 And the phone went off and I said, 20:18 "Did you hear something when our electricity went off? 20:21 Like somebody hit the telephone pole 20:22 or something fell on the line or whatever." 20:26 And I said, "Man, Caleb just left the house 20:30 and maybe he'll have passed something, I'll call him." 20:34 So I dialed his cell phone number 20:37 and it just rang and rang and rang. 20:39 Called him again, it rang and rang and rang. 20:41 And I've got this kind of this rising going up 20:44 in my gut felling and the third time I called, 20:48 I heard a vibration on the kitchen counter. 20:50 And I went in there 20:51 and he had left his cell phone on the counter. 20:54 And so I thought, 20:55 well, he's going to need this to deliver that parts in. 21:00 And I called NAPA and they said, 21:01 "No, he's not here but we really need him. 21:03 So I said, well, tell him to call me on my cell phone. 21:07 So I told Tim, he says, 21:08 "I'm just going to put his phone 21:09 in my pocket and I'll take it to him." 21:13 So I went out the front door 21:15 and there were these flashing blue lights 21:17 just up the road you could see. 21:20 From the house it was very close. 21:22 Let me ask you this here, Jamie, 21:24 being a mom 21:25 with a pretty good connection with your son. 21:28 At this time was there any anxiety at all, 21:31 were you feeling anything, aware of anything, 21:33 any kind of premonition or sense of anything? 21:36 I would have to say, yes, I felt a little bit anxious 21:39 even though when I found his phone. 21:43 You know, that's why I wasn't getting him. 21:45 So I thought, okay, so anyway we got in the car, 21:49 I got in the car 21:51 and our youngest daughter jumped in the passenger's seat. 21:54 And we pulled out in the driveway 21:55 and turned left and the road was barricaded so... 21:59 And we just live out 22:01 in the country on a country road. 22:04 But you could see 22:05 that there was a blue tarp over a car. 22:08 And I ran up there and it's raining. 22:10 And I said is that a Honda under there. 22:13 And they said, yes, it is. 22:15 And I said, is it a Honda Civic and I was trying to go up 22:17 and they wouldn't let me 22:18 but I could see the bumper of the car 22:20 and I could see 22:21 that it was the bumper of Caleb's car. 22:23 And they said, yes, it is a Civic. 22:26 And said that this guy worked at NAPA. 22:28 I said, "My son works at NAPA and I have to see him." 22:31 And they said we're not going to let you see him. 22:35 And I just, I knelt down 22:38 on the road, put my arm up and I said, 22:40 "Lord Jesus," I said, "Caleb, help him." 22:42 I didn't say save him 22:44 because I just kind of had this feeling 22:45 but a man came and tap me on the shoulder. 22:47 And he said, 22:48 "I'm sorry, ma'am, he's already gone." 22:50 And I got up off my knees and I said, 22:53 "God, I don't understand. 22:55 But I know you see the bigger picture." 22:57 And I remembered 22:58 what I had prayed that morning 22:59 and how my prayers had been going. 23:02 And you know I called Kitora in Switzerland 23:06 and you know told her, 23:08 and about this time Tim came running up the road. 23:11 And this is two blocks from our house. 23:14 So not far at all. 23:15 I said, "Tim, it's Caleb and he's already gone." 23:19 And he got down on his knees and he pounded the road. 23:23 And you know at that point what do you do, 23:27 you know, you just start calling people. 23:29 And I kept just saying, you know, I just, 23:32 I really just want to see him, 23:33 I just want to touch him while it was warm. 23:37 Well, after a little bit the state patrol guy came to me 23:43 and he said, 23:45 "After the paramedics leave, 23:49 you can go into the ambulance and you can see your son. 23:53 I'll be in charge of the scene of the accident at that point." 23:57 And so when they left, one of the ambulance guys 24:00 you know open the door and we went in there. 24:03 And by this time our pastor had come running down the road 24:05 and I asked him to come in the ambulance with us. 24:09 And we went in there and I unzipped the bag 24:12 and I just took Caleb's head in my hand, 24:15 I mean, he looked, he looked beautiful, 24:19 just so happened how the accident had happened. 24:22 And he was on his way back to the house, 24:24 I know 'cause the guy that tapped me on the shoulder 24:26 had been following right behind him. 24:28 And he turned, he said I ran to the corner 24:30 and he was coming back and going this way. 24:33 And I said just a little bit of, 24:36 said he wasn't speeding. 24:38 I'm sure he wasn't. 24:39 Caleb, I'm sure he was going faster 24:41 than he should have. 24:42 But the way that the... 24:44 He hydroplaned 24:46 and ended up the roof of the car hit 24:48 the telephone pole. 24:49 The car was on its side 24:51 just going along side on the side. 24:53 The roof hit the telephone pole right where his head was. 24:55 And so it didn't deface anything up. 24:58 But anyway I asked. 25:00 So that may be what knocked 25:02 the power out in your neighborhood. 25:03 Yes, it was. Knocked the transformer. 25:04 It's only a minute after he left, 25:06 he got up just a short ways and turned around. 25:08 He's trying to come get his phone. 25:09 Yes, and... 25:12 So I asked the pastor, he came on and I said, 25:15 "Would you just say a word of prayer." 25:18 You know, my first reaction was, 25:19 "Would you pray 25:21 because Jesus raise Lazarus from the dead." 25:24 We could pray and even as I said that I said, 25:27 "God, you are in control and for me to, 25:33 you know, I mean, how do you process all this?" 25:36 But Caleb every day was calling me and telling me 25:39 how much he loved me and you know just, 25:42 you know thinking of me and... 25:45 But, so anyway, here we go, we're, we are, 25:50 that night we are laying in bed and tossing and turning 25:53 and Tim said, "I don't know how Job dealt 25:57 with losing all of his children at once." 26:01 And I said, "We still have five children, 26:03 one of them is just sleeping. 26:05 One of them is just sleeping, Caleb is just sleeping." 26:08 And you're then less than 24 hours 26:10 after your child is killed, you're at the funeral home. 26:16 And the lady that her husband on the funeral home knew Caleb, 26:21 he waited on them 26:22 at the restaurant where he had worked. 26:24 And she said, 26:26 "We need to plan a memorial service." 26:28 And from that point it's like... 26:31 And how do you do then? 26:33 You know, and I need to back up 26:35 just a little bit here because in, 26:39 this was in 2012 the accident happened. 26:43 Well, it was in January of 2012, 26:46 Caleb was at the house 26:48 and he was practicing his cello and playing. 26:50 And he said, "Mama." 26:52 He said, "When I played 26:53 at the Hendersonville First Baptist Church 26:56 for the Messiah presentations. 26:58 And that had been eight years before that 27:01 that was the last time they did it, 27:03 and the church had done it for about 30 years. 27:06 But he played in every December for about 30 years. 27:10 And I mean for about three years 27:13 and he said that meant 27:16 so much to me. 27:19 I sure wish we could do that again. 27:20 I said, "Caleb, 27:22 I have the gentleman's name on my phone 27:24 who sang the solo part to the trumpet shall sound 27:27 and the dead shall be raised. 27:28 And I'll call Skip and see if he'll come and sing. 27:31 Well, I called Skip and he said, 27:33 "I'd love to come and sing. 27:34 And we had a trumpeter and two violins. 27:36 And Caleb played his cello. 27:38 And April 7th, Sabbath April 7th, 27:42 wonderful presentation of the trumpet shall sound 27:45 and the dead shall be raised. 27:47 And then here it is 11 days after this happened, 27:53 it was April 18 that this accident happened 27:55 and Caleb is killed. 27:57 And so, when she said, 27:58 "You need to plan a memorial service." 28:00 All I could think about was the trumpet shall sound 28:04 and the dead shall be raised. 28:05 So I called Skip, 28:07 called the trumpeter and two violinists 28:08 and got a lady in the community, 28:10 a professional cellist to come in. 28:11 And so for the memorial service 28:15 we did this music again. 28:17 Praise God. 28:19 And the Lord was just so good how He prepared us 28:22 'cause we were so focused on this. 28:25 And... 28:26 So you chose, 28:28 it was a conscious decision to do a memorial service 28:30 as opposed to a funeral. 28:32 Well... 28:33 We had a viewing just before that at the funeral home. 28:39 Okay. 28:40 Which was... 28:44 As a parent you don't know 28:46 what your 23, 24, 25 year old child 28:50 is how they're influencing. 28:54 And it was both the memorial service 28:57 and right before that the viewing were packed. 29:02 Well, one of the main reasons is our daughter in Switzerland, 29:06 I mean, all the kids were close to Caleb. 29:10 But Kitora had called even just a few minutes 29:15 when we were still at the site there 29:16 and she said, "Mom, whatever you do, 29:18 please don't have him cremated. 29:22 I want to see him." 29:25 And, but they didn't really want 29:28 to have a casket sitting in the front 29:30 while we were doing the service. 29:32 So we had the viewing 29:35 and the place was packed, 29:38 auto mechanics filing through there 29:41 and customers from the restaurant 29:44 where Caleb waited on tables. 29:46 And, anyway, so then after the viewing 29:49 then the church had a meal 29:51 and people from the community came in and just ate, 29:53 then we had the memorial service there. 29:57 And... 30:00 There was... 30:01 Go ahead. 30:02 I was just going to ask 30:04 because what I think is interesting is that 30:05 though there were times when you saw, 30:07 perhaps some movement in his life in directions 30:09 that you would rather have not, 30:12 obviously there was enough Jesus in there 30:14 that he was sprinkling 30:16 that throughout his contacts and relationships 30:19 and seasoning that in those things 30:22 that he was doing, he worked for NAPA, 30:24 he worked in a restaurant. 30:25 And obviously he was taking some of that stuff that, 30:28 that you would put it in him that the Lord had walked him 30:30 through in his growing up years that hadn't left him 30:33 and there were those who were seeing that in him. 30:35 Right. Yeah. 30:37 Well, it was about three weeks after the accident. 30:41 And I met this lady and in town and she said, 30:47 "You are Caleb Grindley's mother." 30:48 I said, "Yes." 30:50 And she said, 30:51 "Well, how come your eyes aren't red 30:52 and you're not crying depressed?" 30:54 And I said, 30:56 "Because the Bible calls death a sleep and it says, 30:58 the trumpet will sound and the dead in Christ 31:00 shall rise first and those," 31:02 and she and her mouth dropped open 31:04 when I finished reading, finished telling her 31:07 that verse about Jesus coming again. 31:09 I said, "Tell me why you gave me that reaction? 31:13 And she said, "Well, on Tuesday night, 31:15 the night before the accident Caleb came into work 31:19 to wait on tables 31:20 and he wasn't scheduled for that night 31:21 but he saw us there 31:23 and we would always ask for him anyway." 31:25 And so he took our order and got our food, 31:27 he set it on the table. 31:29 And he was going to eat with him. 31:31 He sat on the table and he said, 31:33 "May I have the blessing for the food." 31:35 And this is the customer at the restaurant? 31:37 Yes. And they went, "Well, sure." 31:40 I mean, it kind of took him by surprise 31:41 'cause he had never done that before. 31:43 And so she said, "He prayed and asked the Lord to bless us 31:45 and to bless our food and bless our families." 31:48 Just a regular prayer. 31:49 And when he finished, 31:52 the friend that was with me made some kind of a comment, 31:56 I don't know, remember the comment was, 31:59 she couldn't remember the comment but she's a, 32:00 whatever it was Caleb's response 32:02 was the Bible calls death a sleep 32:05 and says the trumpet will sound 32:06 and the dead in Christ shall rise first 32:08 and those that remain would be caught up to meet Him 32:10 in the air and so comfort one another 32:11 with these words. 32:13 And she said, and you just said the same thing right now, 32:14 I can't believe it. 32:16 And I said, 32:17 "Well, I really appreciate you sharing that with me 32:18 'cause that was a gift, you know, to hear that, 32:21 I mean, that was the night before his accident. 32:25 Twelve hours. Yeah. 32:26 And so. That is a little gift. 32:29 And then one of the girls that worked with Caleb 32:32 who also was a member of our church. 32:35 And he had left the restaurant, 32:36 he went up to their house and says he was leaving. 32:40 She said, Caleb's last words to us 32:42 was he said I just really need to decide 32:45 what I want to do with my life and I need to get on with it 32:48 and decide what I'm going to do 32:50 because I just want to make a difference 32:51 in people's life. 32:53 And you know 32:55 and not that having a large memorial service 32:59 or funeral. 33:00 So I think, in fact I told the pastor 33:02 who was a good friend with Caleb, 33:04 I said, "When we have this service. 33:05 I really don't want the service to be focused on Caleb. 33:09 Of course, it is 'cause it's his memorial service." 33:13 But I said, "I really would like it 33:14 to be an evangelistic series on, 33:17 a sermon on the state of the dead 33:20 and on the second coming 33:21 because there may be people from the community 33:25 that are in here 33:26 and that might be the only opportunity 33:27 they have to hear." 33:29 And what a blessing 33:33 to be able to share 33:35 that because I tell people, 33:37 you know, Jesus is coming again. 33:39 That's not our hope, it's our blessed assurance. 33:42 Well said, you have quoted many times 33:44 that obviously Caleb had picked it up first, 33:47 1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17. 33:50 So that was something 33:51 that sort of kept you during this time. 33:53 And obviously it was in Caleb's heart 33:55 to the understanding that this is a sleep 33:57 and that there is going 33:58 to be a grand reunion and resurrection. 34:00 Tim, how are you working your way 34:02 through stuff at this point in time? 34:04 My reaction was different than Jamie's in the fact 34:08 that when Jamie went there to the site, 34:11 of course we're two different individuals 34:13 even though we love to be together 34:15 and work together. 34:16 But when I went to the site 34:20 it was finished. 34:23 There was no doubt in my mind he was dead. 34:29 And it knocks the breath out of you. 34:30 Yeah. 34:32 But my reaction was God is good. 34:38 After the accident I want to scream it, 34:43 I want to holler that 34:45 because I thought this, 34:50 I don't mean to minimize when I say blip in the road, 34:53 bump in the road, okay. 34:55 This is a major event. Oh, sure. 34:57 Yes. 34:58 And major trauma for the family. 35:00 Right. Yes. 35:01 But my statement is what do I have to complain about. 35:06 This is a major problem, 35:09 this is a major event but God is so good. 35:14 First of all He gave us five children 35:16 and we are blessed with that. 35:19 We are blessed 35:20 that we still have five children, 35:22 like Jamie said one is asleep. 35:25 I'm not in a position to question 35:29 why this happened. 35:31 Yeah, I did. Why Lord, why, why? 35:34 And I come back and I say, 35:35 I don't see it from your perspective. 35:39 I accept this as an event, 35:42 we are in the sinful world 35:44 and I just, I say, I choose to go forward. 35:48 Praise the Lord. 35:50 I choose to say, Lord, 35:53 I accept that this happened, 35:56 I accept Your will. 36:01 Now I just want to be able to be a positive witness 36:04 to others to say, you know, the Lord is good. 36:09 You know, in 2005 my father passed away. 36:13 In 2007, my mom passed away, 2008, his dad passed away. 36:19 And in 2010, his mom was killed in a car accident, 36:21 tragic in there. 36:23 And then 2012, 36:24 Caleb was killed in an accident. 36:26 And I would have to say 36:28 that for a while after that even though 36:33 I knew God was in control and I have all the faith, 36:37 I mean I have much faith and belief that, 36:40 you know, God knows what He's doing. 36:42 But there would be times 36:44 if for the next year or two years, 36:47 it's like if I tried to hold, 36:49 get hold of Tim or one of our children, 36:53 you know, especially 36:54 the one that was still living at home at the time. 36:56 And I wouldn't get an answer 36:58 and you know couldn't hear from him. 37:00 You know, and I just I called, I said, "Marita." 37:02 Almost panic. Yeah. 37:03 It was hard for me to not have that anxiety or panic attack, 37:07 I said, you know, just 37:08 if you can't talk at least text me 37:10 just say, "I'm okay." 37:11 And then, you know, I wouldn't bother you. 37:13 But it was, it was a challenge. Yeah. 37:15 A natural response to that. 37:17 Now let me ask you this because when you have 37:19 this kind of drama in your life, trauma, 37:24 it tends to do one of two things. 37:26 My last church I pastored 37:27 I did 117 funerals in the same church. 37:32 And you see the spectrum of responses, 37:34 they tend to fall into two categories, 37:36 there're more subcategories 37:38 but either it brings you closer to God 37:41 or it pushes some people away. 37:44 And the secondary response is in marriages 37:47 it can divide the marriage. 37:49 You know, depending on 37:51 because people grieve very differently. 37:53 You two are admittedly close, you work together, 37:56 you spend a lot of time together, 37:57 you like each other's company but this kind of thing can test 38:01 that kind of relationship, even the strongest. 38:04 Talk to us a little bit about how you held on to each other, 38:10 held on to your sanity and your religion 38:12 and then we can move into how you turn 38:14 this into a ministry. 38:15 Can you kind of walk me through that? 38:21 It did not separate us, it did, 38:24 I would say we laugh together, 38:29 we cry together. 38:34 Our time with Caleb, 38:38 when we have our remembrances, when there's times when you, 38:41 you know, just naturally it's on your thoughts. 38:45 We laugh. 38:47 You know we laugh 38:48 because Caleb represented a happy life. 38:53 Caleb represented fun times. 38:55 He was a fun loving young man 38:59 which we dearly miss. 39:01 But I am very thankful 39:04 it has not caused a crisis 39:09 between the two of us. 39:11 Praise the Lord. 39:14 Because we have both taken so very strongly 39:19 that death is a sleep. 39:20 And, you know, it's just Caleb is sleeping. 39:24 And you know and I don't mean to be just repeating 39:27 that over and over again. 39:29 But it is very comforting to appreciate that. 39:33 And another verse 39:35 that is so helpful, Isaiah 57:1, 39:40 it says that good people pass away many often 39:44 before their time and people wonder why. 39:48 They don't consider that the Lord has laid them 39:50 to rest to spare them from evil to come. 39:54 And I appreciate that so much 39:57 because you know for people 40:01 in our generation, 40:03 this world is a distraction, 40:06 it's a mess for young people. 40:11 It is a huge, huge pulling and distraction 40:14 and you know, Satan can no longer seduce 40:19 my son to go down wrong path. 40:22 He cannot, Satan has lost this battle. 40:28 And, you know, the wonderful hope 40:31 and assurance that we have. 40:33 We live on that. We live on that. 40:35 And you know I would like to say that, 40:38 their moms that have come to me and they say, 40:43 you know that your son loves Jesus 40:45 and you know you'll see him, 40:47 you have the assurance you're going to see him again. 40:49 But my son committed suicide. 40:52 And you know what a grief 40:55 but my first thought is to tell 40:58 that you know Jesus loved your child more than you did. 41:01 Amen. 41:03 And Jesus desired His heart more of an eternal salvation, 41:08 more than you wanted him to have it. 41:11 You can trust Jesus with that child. 41:15 You can trust Jesus. 41:16 That is not something that you have to... 41:19 Yes, you grieve because you miss him. 41:20 And I can say this 41:22 because I didn't go through that, 41:24 Caleb didn't to have that, 41:25 that's not been my experience but... 41:28 So was I. Yeah. 41:30 But we can trust Jesus. 41:32 And as I totally turned our children to the Lord. 41:37 And I do that every day. 41:40 You know, and I don't say this lightly 41:44 but if all my children 41:49 had to die or something happened 41:51 and they died, 41:52 if that had to happen for Jesus to save them, 41:56 I would just have to trust Jesus with that. 41:59 And here again, I don't say that lightly. 42:02 Yeah, yeah. 42:03 Jamie, I've got to say this to you 42:04 because that's a very spiritually mature way 42:08 to look at the mystery, the conundrum 42:11 that it sometimes is life and death. 42:14 Was this something that occurred to you shortly 42:17 after Caleb's passing 42:21 or did you have to grow into that? 42:23 I think I had already, before I came to that, 42:26 I mean losing our family members like we did. 42:30 And when Tim's mom, 42:33 she was just so vibrant and full of life, 42:36 I mean her husband had passed away but she... 42:40 We were just really having a good time together. 42:43 And we, it was very difficult when that happened. 42:49 And somehow between her accident 42:54 and in Caleb's I had just, 43:00 I came to the realization 43:02 that they are sleeping, you know. 43:04 And I don't know, I don't take any of this lightly 43:09 because there are days, 43:11 I mean I miss Caleb and it's like I told him, 43:13 it says, I just feel myself slipping 43:16 or I'm tearing, I'm, you know, weeping. 43:20 But when I have opportunity 43:24 with something as a result of this. 43:27 We'd be in town 43:28 and I see a young man walking along. 43:31 I love this. 43:32 We got to move you to this, too. 43:34 I think this is really great. 43:35 As you turned this trial into triumph 43:38 for making it a ministry. 43:39 I'm sorry, I cut you off but I'm just so excited about 43:41 where you're going 'cause I know where you're heading. 43:42 Yeah. That's really great. 43:43 That's okay. 43:45 But, you know, we were in Walmart one day 43:46 and this young man was walking through 43:49 and I stopped and said, "Hey." 43:51 I just and I put my hand on his shoulders, 43:52 I said, "I know you don't know me 43:55 but I want to tell you something." 43:56 And I've got his full attention and I says, 43:59 "I want you to go home and tell your mother 44:02 how much you love her and appreciate her." 44:05 And he said, "Well, yes, ma'am. Why do you say that?" 44:09 I said, "Because you never know 44:12 when you won't have each other again." 44:15 And I says, "I lost my son, 44:18 however long it was like a year before that in auto accident. 44:22 And he was so loving and kind and he'd always call me 44:24 and tell me how much he loved me, 44:26 I was one cool mama, he would text me or whatever. 44:28 It's like, oh, I've got to save that text, you know. 44:30 And just you know very special. 44:32 And they'll always say, 44:35 "Oh, I'm so sorry that you lost your son." 44:37 And I said, "But it's okay 44:39 because the Bible calls death a sleep 44:41 and says the trumpet will sound and the dead in Christ 44:43 shall rise first." 44:44 And I just go through that and I tell him that, 44:49 you know, Isaiah 57:1, 44:51 when good people passed away and, anyway, 44:54 so I just go through that 44:56 and that's what I like to share with others. 44:58 Great, great. 44:59 I want to just stop you there for a second 45:00 because you've turned 45:02 this actually into an ongoing ministry. 45:04 You've done this several times. 45:05 And somewhat some kind of miraculous, 45:07 God blessed results. 45:09 So walk us through some of that stuff. 45:11 Well, another time at Walmart, 45:14 I was looking for something in the toy section 45:17 and I saw a couple of young men in there. 45:20 And I, they were helping me and then I says, 45:23 "Well, it's okay, I can do without that." 45:26 But I want to put one hand on this one shoulder, 45:29 one hand this one and I said, "I want to tell you something. 45:33 It's really important 45:35 that every day you brothers tell your mother 45:37 how much you love her and appreciate her." 45:40 And I said, "Because you never know 45:43 when you won't have each other." 45:45 And I said, "My son was killed 45:47 in a car accident five years ago 45:49 and he was just always telling me 45:51 how much he loved me." 45:52 And they said, 45:53 "You really need to talk to our mother." 45:56 I said, "Why is that?" 45:57 And they said, "Because our older brother 46:00 was killed in Afghanistan 46:02 and mom's having a really hard time with it." 46:08 In fact there she goes, walking down there. 46:10 And so anyway at some point she came walking up and I did, 46:14 I told her that and she hugged me, 46:17 we hugged each other. 46:19 And I have not had a lot of communication 46:22 I have attempted but I did meet her son. 46:26 Excuse me, at the gym that we joined saw 46:31 the son that I was talking to. 46:33 And I said, "How is your mother doing?" 46:36 And he said, "She's still struggling." 46:38 And I said, "You know I looked at the video 46:40 that she told me about your brother 46:42 that was killed and some of the things 46:45 that she'd shared." 46:46 And I said, 46:48 "Take her on a date, just you and her, 46:50 go on dates with her. 46:52 And as you're taking her out of the car walking into place," 46:54 I said, "Hold her hand as she walked long." 46:56 She had mentioned that the son 46:57 that was killed would hold her hand 47:00 as they would walk into a place. 47:02 And anyway he says, "Do you think 47:04 that would be part of her healing 47:06 that would help her?" 47:07 I said, "I really do." 47:08 And so anyway progressively as I've seen her, 47:11 that's what they were, they were doing that. 47:14 And, you know, I want to back up 47:18 when we were getting ready for the memorial service. 47:23 Tim asked me, "What are you going to wear 47:25 to the memorial service?" 47:27 And I hadn't even thought about that, I said, 47:29 "Well, I tell you what, if you wear your tux, 47:32 I'll wear the dress 47:34 that we wore to our two daughter's weddings." 47:36 I said, "Caleb won't be having a wedding here obviously." 47:40 But I said, "The next thing he knows is we'll be joining 47:44 at the marriage ceremony of the Lamb 47:46 when we get to heaven. 47:47 And so we'll just dress like that." 47:49 Praise the Lord. 47:51 So, I just, 47:54 I am thankful 47:58 for the hope that we have, 47:59 Jesus is coming again that's not my hope, our hope, 48:04 it's our blessed assurance. 48:05 Amen. Amen. Amen. 48:07 Can I say one thing and the fact that, 48:10 you know, we may sound positive 48:13 and we are, we try to be. 48:16 And we do have our struggles, we do have our times. 48:19 And there's things 48:20 that are automatically going to set off emotions. 48:26 But we choose to be positive. 48:32 We can be negative sometime, we can be down, 48:35 something can trigger it but we turn around and say, 48:39 "But we have this wonderful promise. 48:42 We go back to the Bible and say, 48:44 "We're looking forward to Revelation, 48:47 looking for the Lord to come and then we all meet together." 48:51 Praise the Lord. And I will say this. 48:54 We had a little family reunion last week 48:56 with all of our children joining together. 49:00 And we talked very briefly 49:04 because this experience 49:07 that I'm sharing is my experience 49:10 and somewhat Caleb, 49:11 I mean the way we have handled the grief. 49:15 Some of our children, 49:17 they are still, they understand, 49:20 they know that Caleb is sleeping 49:22 and that Jesus is coming again. 49:24 But they struggle with it, you know. 49:29 It's been hard. It's been hard. 49:30 And at the memorial service there was Caleb graduated 49:33 from Mount Pisgah Academy, 2005. 49:36 There were... 49:37 Somebody flew, classmates from California, 49:40 the West Coast to North Carolina 49:42 to be at this memorial service. 49:43 Wow. 49:45 And these kids, 49:46 they were like six or seven kids 49:47 from his class that were there. 49:49 And they said, "Caleb was the guy in our class 49:51 that just kept the class together, 49:54 he was just kind of a, 49:56 you know, that kind of a person." 49:58 And so, we, Caleb 50:04 was a very important person in our family. 50:07 Praise the Lord. 50:08 You know, I'm happy, 50:10 as I listen to your narrative to your story. 50:12 One, because your children are scattered so far, Canada, 50:16 Switzerland, other places, 50:17 that since you have to be alone and together 50:20 that you have developed this positive outlook. 50:24 And not just positive outlook, you've taken God at His word. 50:28 The Bible says, "The Lord Himself shall descend 50:29 from heaven with a shout, 50:31 with the voice of the archangel, 50:32 trump of God, the dead in Christ will rise first. 50:34 Then which are alive and remain," 50:36 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17. 50:39 So you're buying what you're selling. 50:43 You follow what I'm saying? 50:44 In other words, you believe 50:45 that which comes out of your mouth. 50:47 And when you buy what you sell, it does, 50:50 it ends with wherefore comfort one another with these words. 50:54 So they are a comfort when you really believe 50:58 what he's just said in that text. 51:00 And I see that you buy that. 51:02 How do you... 51:03 It's hard for somebody, 51:06 it's easier for us because we do, 51:08 we buy that what the Bible says. 51:12 Yes. Yes. And that's wonderful. 51:14 The Bible is presenting a wonderful hope of, 51:19 wonderful promise to us. 51:21 I am so glad that I have that 51:25 because it would be a hard thing to struggle 51:28 through the loss of our son if we didn't have that. 51:33 And if he was so grounded in that at that time, 51:38 God was so good 51:39 because He brought this whole thing about, 51:44 the special music that we had. 51:46 And we were so focused on that. 51:48 And I will have to say every April since then we, 51:53 I get people together, different musicians, 51:56 but we do the trumpets shall sound 51:57 and the dead shall be raised 51:59 with the instruments and we just did it, 52:01 April the 28th this year. 52:02 Praise God. Praise God. 52:04 I am happy for the smile that is on your faces 52:08 because it bespeaks the Christ that is in your heart. 52:11 And you could not have one without the other. 52:14 We've got to go to a newsbreak now. 52:18 Some information we want to share with you, 52:20 then we'll come back with a closing thought. |
Revised 2018-10-09