I want to spend my life
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Mending broken people
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I want to spend my life
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Removing pain
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Lord, let my words
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Heal a heart that hurts
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I want to spend my life
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Mending broken people
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I want to spend my life
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Mending broken people
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Hello, and welcome to
another 3ABN Today program.
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My name is Jill Morikone.
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And it's such a privilege
that you join us every day
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as we bring you testimonies,
we bring you ministries,
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we bring you what God is doing
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in and around the church today.
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And today is no exception.
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Before I introduce
our special guests,
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and I'm so
excited about this program
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and what God's going
to do, about the topic,
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especially about the
topic we're talking about today.
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But before I
introduce them to you,
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we want to give
a quick disclaimer
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right at the beginning.
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Today's topic is
a sensitive topic.
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It can be a difficult topic.
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We're talking about abortion,
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those who have
been through abortion,
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talking about the silence
that's within the church,
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and how God
calls us to speak up.
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And this special
ministry raises awareness,
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they educate, they teach.
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God uses them to
bring healing to those
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who have been through
abortion, or in the midst
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of making a decision
right now regarding that.
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So it is a needed topic not only
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within the Seventh-day
Adventist Church here
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but many other denominations.
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It's a needed topic in the world
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because it's a human topic.
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And I am excited that at 3ABN
we are addressing this topic,
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and I know if
you are in the midst
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of the valley of decision,
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if you have family
members or friends,
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this program
especially is for you.
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But if you are a parent
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and you have young
children in your home,
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this would not
be the best program
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for them to be watching.
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So we just advice you
to use parental discretion,
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maybe involve them in
something else in the home
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while we have this discussion
on the topic of abortion.
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But I want to introduce
to you our special guests.
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We have Antionette Duck.
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And we're just so grateful
for you having the courage,
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and coming here and sharing.
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And you are the
Founder and Speaker
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for Mafgia ministries.
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Yes. Yes.
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And thank you so much
for coming and for sharing.
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Thank you. Thank you.
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Now you were here
several years ago,
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and did one program
several years ago on 3ABN.
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Yes. Okay.
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This was back in 2014.
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As a ministry, the word
Mafgia, people always ask,
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"What is Mafgia mean?"
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It's a Hebrew
word for intercessor.
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And we are committed to
interceding for the sanctity,
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the value of human
life, but we're also committed
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to interceding
for reconciliation
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and redemption for men and women
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who are oppose to abortive.
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It's very much a
holistic sort of approach.
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We firmly believe in
that there are certain ideas
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that we are held captive by.
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In Jeremiah 29:13-14, it says,
"You will seek me and find me
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when you search for me
with all of your heart,
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I will be found by
you, says the Lord,
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and I will bring you
back from your captivity. "
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There are certain
ideals and mindsets
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that we've been held
captive by as individuals,
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as the church, and
the Lord says in His Word,
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2 Corinthians 10:4-5,
"Take captive those ideas
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and bring them
unto the obedience
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to the lordship of Christ. "
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For us, this
issue isn't necessarily
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just about the
rightness or wrongness,
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that's right and this is wrong
when it pertains to abortion.
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For us, we really
believe that we've forgotten
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what it means to be made
in the image of the Lord,
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to see our value
through the lens of God.
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Amen. Amen.
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So before we go more
into how you got involved
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in the ministry of Mafgia,
how the Lord led you to begin.
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And we have Dianne
Wagner with us as well.
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And you are Speaker
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and part of the
ministry team of Mafgia.
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Yes. Yes.
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And it's just a
privilege and joy
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to have you here too, Dianne.
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Thank you. Thank you.
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It's a privilege and
a blessing to be here.
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We want to thank 3ABN
for addressing this subject.
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Absolutely. It's a needed topic.
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And I know Danny
Shelton's just came out
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with his latest book,
"Spiritual Vigilantes",
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and it addresses
that topic as well.
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And we're receiving
response from people
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who have been blessed
and ministered too by that.
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So tell us,
Antionette, how the Lord led you
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to become
involved in this, because
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you didn't just
wake up one day, and say,
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"I'm gonna start a
program and a ministry to help
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women and men who have
been through abortion. "
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So how did you
get involved? Sure.
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I was not raised Adventist,
I was raised Southern Baptist.
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I myself was
rescued from abortion.
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And it was the
intervention of people
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who believed
not only in my value
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but in the value of my mother
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who in the midst of
her crisis pregnancy,
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they came alongside her.
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So your mom was gonna abort you?
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She was, yes. And she...
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They were willing to
walk in a difficult place,
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have a difficult conversation
because they believed
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in our value together.
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And my life was spared
and her spiritual soundness
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was preserved.
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I came to an understanding
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of the Adventist
truth years later,
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and began
worshipping on Sabbath,
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and eventually was introduced
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to the
Seventh-day Adventist church.
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And encountered certain...
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When I began
studying this issue,
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what Adventists
believe about it,
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there were certain
inconsistencies there,
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a silence that was there
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that was just
very concerning for me.
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And so I was really encouraged,
you don't, not join the church,
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you join it and you
seek to make a difference.
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And so, in 2010 I was baptized
into the Adventist church,
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and then early 2011, the
Mafgia came into existence.
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So the Lord had this
passion in your heart.
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You know what's
incredible to me is that,
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the decision your mom
made to spare your life.
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You know, to give you life
and to not have that abortion.
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Years later, God's
leading you in this ministry
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to reach out to other people.
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That's incredible. Yeah.
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So, Dianne, how did you
become involved in Mafgia?
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Well, my first thought
is, one of her motivations
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for joining the church
was to make a difference.
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And she has certainly
made a difference in my life
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because she
decided to do something.
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In 2011, later that year
at GYC in Houston, Texas,
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is when I met Antionette.
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She had her booth all set up.
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My husband and I,
we sought her out,
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we wanted to hear her story.
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She told us about
how she had been saved
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from abortion.
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And while I was
standing there, I realized that
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if I hadn't had
my first abortion,
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my first born would
have been close to her age.
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And the thing that
really made an impact on me
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was she was not condemning.
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She was approaching the
subject with, I believe,
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she had values and
prioritize correctly.
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And I felt valued by her.
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My experience had
been condemnation,
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and because of that
silence, so I never spoke
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about the two abortions I
had had when I was younger.
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Had you ever told anyone
before you told Antionette?
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Years before I had, but
because of the experiences
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I had had, I clammed up.
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Because there was no
grace and there was no hope.
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And we invited Antionette
actually up to see us.
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She spoke at a couple places,
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and went to a
women's retreat with me.
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And you know, I encouraged
her to share what she was doing,
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and it quickly
became apparent to me
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because of the number
of women who came forward
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and shared their
story of a past abortion.
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These were good
Christian women, you know,
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who love the Lord,
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and this was a
part of their life
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they had put away because
they had never had a place
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to talk about it,
you know, a safe place.
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So for women who
have dealt with abortion,
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they remain silent
because of the shame,
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because people
bring condemnation
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when it's brought
up, there's no grace?
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Well, I can give you an example,
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and this was within the church.
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One of my very dear friends,
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the subject of abortion came up.
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Now, of course, they had no clue
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that I had ever been there.
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But his response
was a, all the women
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who have ever had an abortion
need to be lined up and shot.
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Yeah. You are kidding.
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No. No.
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And that's just one of many.
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So you hear that and it's...
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Yeah, you close up.
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You're not gonna talk
about it when you know
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that's the attitude.
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Of course.
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But you felt something
different with Antionette?
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Oh, yes. She was very...
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And in fact, one
of the other stories
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I share quickly is the...
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There was a time in my
life when I sought help.
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And it was a
Christian radio station,
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and there was an 800
number you could call.
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I called the 800 number because
I wanted to share my story.
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And after I had
shared what I had done,
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her response
was, "Well, you know
00:09:52.69\00:09:54.06
abortion is murder, don't you?"
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There was no hope, no grace.
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It was... So I'm... Yeah.
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And I'm not like a lot of
women who have just decided
00:10:01.83\00:10:04.53
to close up, it's not worth
taking that risk of sharing.
00:10:04.57\00:10:09.30
But as we share,
more and more women,
00:10:09.34\00:10:12.17
when you share your
story, you empower other women.
00:10:12.21\00:10:15.11
Absolutely!
00:10:15.14\00:10:16.48
And they find their voice,
00:10:16.51\00:10:17.95
and the silence is being broken.
00:10:17.98\00:10:19.91
Amen.
00:10:19.95\00:10:21.28
And restoration is occurring.
00:10:21.32\00:10:23.08
Amen. Amen.
00:10:23.12\00:10:24.45
So it's amazing, Antionette,
God called you into the church,
00:10:24.49\00:10:29.46
you accepted the
truth of the Sabbath.
00:10:29.49\00:10:31.09
But yet you said, I want to
go back to that for a moment
00:10:31.13\00:10:33.66
and then we have many
stories that they have to share.
00:10:33.70\00:10:36.06
And we want to make
sure we get to these stories.
00:10:36.10\00:10:38.57
But God called you, but you saw
the silence within the church.
00:10:38.60\00:10:44.27
Why do you think
there is a silence there?
00:10:44.31\00:10:47.14
I think there are
probably many reasons.
00:10:47.18\00:10:49.94
People, there's a
genuine, as Dianne shares,
00:10:49.98\00:10:53.25
when she shares her testimony,
they're afraid of offending,
00:10:53.28\00:10:56.18
they're afraid
of hurting further,
00:10:56.22\00:10:59.25
of wounding further.
00:10:59.29\00:11:00.62
Some people simply don't
know how to dialogue about it.
00:11:00.66\00:11:03.16
As we'll share in our stories,
00:11:03.19\00:11:04.59
pastors even who
simply aren't equipped,
00:11:04.63\00:11:07.73
they don't know,
how do I counsel someone
00:11:07.76\00:11:10.23
in my congregation
to speak about this.
00:11:10.27\00:11:12.33
Other people
perhaps, they aren't sure
00:11:12.37\00:11:15.24
how they would respond
if they were confronted
00:11:15.27\00:11:17.64
with that situation.
00:11:17.67\00:11:19.67
And so they remain silent.
00:11:19.71\00:11:21.58
There are many different reasons
00:11:21.61\00:11:24.28
why we believe
there is a silence.
00:11:24.31\00:11:26.72
What we know though is
that the Lord is saying,
00:11:26.75\00:11:29.58
the time is now, it's
time to lift up your voice.
00:11:29.62\00:11:32.22
It's time to help
set the captive free.
00:11:32.25\00:11:34.56
It's time to point people
to the light and to the cross.
00:11:34.59\00:11:37.33
It's a magnificent opportunity
that we've been given
00:11:37.36\00:11:40.73
as believers when
it comes to this issue.
00:11:40.76\00:11:42.70
Amen. Absolutely!
00:11:42.73\00:11:44.07
And at 3ABN, we
stand with Mafgia ministry,
00:11:44.10\00:11:47.04
with what God is
doing in and through you.
00:11:47.07\00:11:49.80
We stand with
the right for life.
00:11:49.84\00:11:51.81
We stand with...
00:11:51.84\00:11:53.54
God calls even
the baby in the womb,
00:11:53.58\00:11:56.14
from the moment of conception,
it's life, is not a tissue.
00:11:56.18\00:12:00.55
But if, you might be
watching at home, and you said,
00:12:00.58\00:12:03.72
you're like Dianne, "I
went through an abortion.
00:12:03.75\00:12:06.45
I have that pain
and that shame. "
00:12:06.49\00:12:08.16
God forgives, God restores,
00:12:08.19\00:12:11.13
God extends
grace and He loves you.
00:12:11.16\00:12:14.03
We want to get to
many stories today.
00:12:14.06\00:12:16.23
But before we do that,
we have our special music
00:12:16.26\00:12:18.63
from Pastor Wintley Phipps.
00:12:18.67\00:12:20.47
He's with us right now.
00:12:20.50\00:12:21.90
And the song he
will be ministering is
00:12:21.94\00:12:24.14
"All the Way My
Savior Leads Me".
00:12:24.17\00:12:27.01
All the way my Savior leads me
00:12:56.71\00:13:01.84
What have I to ask beside?
00:13:01.88\00:13:06.78
Can I doubt His tender mercy
00:13:06.82\00:13:11.39
Who through life
has been my Guide?
00:13:11.42\00:13:16.73
Heav'nly peace, divinest comfort
00:13:16.76\00:13:21.30
Here by faith in Him to dwell!
00:13:21.33\00:13:26.03
For I know, whate'er befall me
00:13:26.07\00:13:31.07
Jesus doeth all things well
00:13:31.11\00:13:35.81
For I know, whate'er befall me
00:13:35.84\00:13:41.05
Jesus
00:13:41.08\00:13:44.82
Doeth all things well
00:13:44.85\00:13:49.46
All the way my Savior leads me
00:13:56.43\00:14:00.70
Cheers each winding path I tread
00:14:00.74\00:14:05.67
Gives me grace for every trial
00:14:05.71\00:14:10.48
Feeds me with the living bread
00:14:10.51\00:14:15.45
Though my weary steps may falter
00:14:15.48\00:14:20.32
And my soul athirst may be
00:14:20.36\00:14:25.29
Gushing from the Rock before me
00:14:25.33\00:14:30.63
Lo! A spring of joy I see
00:14:30.67\00:14:35.37
Gushing from the Rock before me
00:14:35.40\00:14:41.78
Lo! A spring of joy I see
00:14:41.81\00:14:44.85
All the way my Savior leads me
00:14:58.46\00:15:02.66
Oh, the fullness of His love!
00:15:02.70\00:15:07.67
Perfect rest to me is promised
00:15:07.70\00:15:12.37
In my Father's house above
00:15:12.41\00:15:17.41
When my spirit, clothed immortal
00:15:17.45\00:15:22.35
Wings its
flight to realms of day
00:15:22.38\00:15:27.12
This my song
through endless ages
00:15:27.16\00:15:32.29
Jesus led me all the way
00:15:32.33\00:15:37.07
This my song
through endless ages
00:15:37.10\00:15:42.54
Jesus led me
00:15:45.67\00:15:49.58
All
00:15:49.61\00:15:54.48
The way
00:15:54.52\00:15:57.35
What a fitting song, All
the way my Savior leads me.
00:16:18.07\00:16:21.41
No matter what our past,
00:16:21.44\00:16:22.91
God has a future
for each one of us.
00:16:22.94\00:16:25.01
One of my favorite scriptures,
Jeremiah 29:11, God says,
00:16:25.05\00:16:28.15
"I know the plans I
have for you, says the Lord,
00:16:28.18\00:16:31.75
plans to prosper
you and not to harm you,
00:16:31.79\00:16:33.59
to give you a
future and a hope."
00:16:33.62\00:16:35.69
And God not only
has a hope and a future
00:16:35.72\00:16:37.46
for each one of us,
00:16:37.49\00:16:38.83
for you at home He
has a hope and future
00:16:38.86\00:16:40.73
for the
Seventh-day Adventist church,
00:16:40.76\00:16:42.60
and for each one of the churches
00:16:42.63\00:16:43.97
who are involved right
now in this abortive crisis,
00:16:44.00\00:16:47.87
and in seeking to
break that silence.
00:16:47.90\00:16:51.04
If you're just joining
us and you are a parent,
00:16:51.07\00:16:54.18
this particular
program is a sensitive topic.
00:16:54.21\00:16:56.51
We're talking about
the topic of abortion.
00:16:56.54\00:16:58.41
So you might
involve your children
00:16:58.45\00:17:00.62
in doing something
else during this program.
00:17:00.65\00:17:02.82
But we have Antionette
Duck, and Dianne Wagner with us,
00:17:02.85\00:17:06.65
and Mafgia ministry.
00:17:06.69\00:17:08.36
And you have an
incredible ministry.
00:17:08.39\00:17:09.86
And well, especially, this time,
00:17:09.89\00:17:11.79
we brought you back
to share us stories.
00:17:11.83\00:17:13.80
To share us some of
the stories of people
00:17:13.83\00:17:15.30
who have been through abortions,
00:17:15.33\00:17:16.77
and the hope and the
healing that God's bringing.
00:17:16.80\00:17:19.10
So I think, Dianne,
we're gonna start with you.
00:17:19.13\00:17:21.67
Talk to us about
the number of women
00:17:21.70\00:17:23.51
in Seventh-day
Adventist ministry
00:17:23.54\00:17:25.87
who are dealing with this?
00:17:25.91\00:17:27.74
You know, I mentioned earlier
how for intent of every women,
00:17:27.78\00:17:31.28
the women who have abortions
00:17:31.31\00:17:32.81
who are actually
active in their church.
00:17:32.85\00:17:35.28
Well, I've seen
that in our church,
00:17:35.32\00:17:37.19
and as we go to the
different conferences,
00:17:37.22\00:17:39.22
you know, many
times we'll be with
00:17:39.25\00:17:40.96
many other ministries.
00:17:40.99\00:17:42.92
And there is one that stands out
00:17:42.96\00:17:45.73
and will always stand out
00:17:45.76\00:17:47.20
because this
particular individual
00:17:47.23\00:17:49.03
has been very
active in her ministry,
00:17:49.06\00:17:51.93
beautiful woman.
00:17:51.97\00:17:53.64
And she shared her story with me
00:17:53.67\00:17:56.77
and it was the first
one she had ever shared.
00:17:56.81\00:17:59.61
And she had had
multiple abortions.
00:17:59.64\00:18:02.31
And she was...
00:18:02.34\00:18:06.01
It just humbled me
because it made me realize
00:18:06.05\00:18:09.42
by breaking the silence,
we're freeing up other women.
00:18:09.45\00:18:12.32
Even women in
prominent positions,
00:18:12.35\00:18:14.22
you would think
have it all together,
00:18:14.26\00:18:16.42
spiritually they
still have this wound
00:18:16.46\00:18:19.53
that they have hidden away.
00:18:19.56\00:18:21.60
But by just
breaking that silence
00:18:21.63\00:18:23.63
and finally allowing
herself to go there and weep,
00:18:23.67\00:18:27.94
her ministry is
gonna be blessed.
00:18:27.97\00:18:30.57
It's not a
ministry about abortion.
00:18:30.61\00:18:32.77
But just because she
is getting restored now
00:18:32.81\00:18:36.21
and allowing the
Lord to even use her
00:18:36.24\00:18:39.78
at a deeper level...
00:18:39.81\00:18:41.15
Amen. It's just so important.
00:18:41.18\00:18:44.42
And so many
women who, they'll say,
00:18:44.45\00:18:47.36
"You know, the Lord forgave me,
00:18:47.39\00:18:48.72
why do I still
feel so miserable?"
00:18:48.76\00:18:50.49
We have many women say that.
00:18:50.53\00:18:52.36
Women in all locks,
whether they're in a ministry,
00:18:52.39\00:18:55.03
or home
ministering their children...
00:18:55.06\00:18:57.70
And what's the answer to
that, if the Lord forgave me,
00:18:57.73\00:19:00.20
why am I still miserable?
00:19:00.24\00:19:01.57
What's the answer to that?
00:19:01.60\00:19:02.94
Well, that's why I believe
the retreat is so important
00:19:02.97\00:19:04.74
because, yes, indeed
He has, but a lot of times
00:19:04.77\00:19:07.91
there are consequences
that need to be dealt with.
00:19:07.94\00:19:10.75
There are emotions
that if they're not resolve
00:19:10.78\00:19:13.38
can surface in other areas.
00:19:13.42\00:19:15.82
So if you still
feel pain, or misery,
00:19:15.85\00:19:18.25
or something unresolved,
the devil is gonna use that
00:19:18.29\00:19:21.32
to attack you to think,
"The Lord didn't forgive you,"
00:19:21.36\00:19:24.53
or "you wouldn't be
feeling miserable. "
00:19:24.56\00:19:26.66
So well, I encourage women
to address the consequences.
00:19:26.70\00:19:32.23
There was a loss, you
need to mourn that loss.
00:19:32.27\00:19:35.20
You need to pull that
child out of the statistics
00:19:35.24\00:19:38.07
and claim that as your own.
00:19:38.11\00:19:40.41
And...
00:19:40.44\00:19:42.01
It's really
remarkable because by Dianne
00:19:42.04\00:19:44.65
having the courage to speak out,
00:19:44.68\00:19:47.38
it takes tremendous courage
to do what Dianne is doing.
00:19:47.42\00:19:50.85
But by her having
the courage to do this,
00:19:50.89\00:19:52.85
it's literally
liberating the voices
00:19:52.89\00:19:55.56
of other men and women
to share their stories.
00:19:55.59\00:19:59.39
And that's what we see happen.
00:19:59.43\00:20:00.76
In the scripture, it
says, "Confess your sins
00:20:00.80\00:20:02.86
one to another
that you may be healed."
00:20:02.90\00:20:05.00
And then it says,
"Comfort each other
00:20:05.03\00:20:07.44
with the same comfort
with which you yourself
00:20:07.47\00:20:09.54
were comforted."
00:20:09.57\00:20:10.91
That's what's happening here.
00:20:10.94\00:20:12.27
It's not about
glorifying this horrible past.
00:20:12.31\00:20:15.11
It's about pointing people
to the light and to the cross.
00:20:15.14\00:20:18.15
And for us to understand
that the number of abortions
00:20:18.18\00:20:21.22
that have occurred, they
are approximately a million
00:20:21.25\00:20:23.72
that happen in the
United States every year.
00:20:23.75\00:20:26.19
Every year.
00:20:26.22\00:20:27.56
If even half of those women
and men regret their decision,
00:20:27.59\00:20:32.39
why would we hesitate to
speak light into that darkness?
00:20:32.43\00:20:36.23
Because people are desperate
for the freedom, the hope,
00:20:36.26\00:20:39.77
the forgiveness
that the cross brings.
00:20:39.80\00:20:41.70
In some little way.
00:20:41.74\00:20:43.07
So breaking the
silence as in speaking out,
00:20:43.10\00:20:45.67
sharing what has happened
to you is key in healing.
00:20:45.71\00:20:49.41
And you all do
retreats as in people come,
00:20:49.44\00:20:53.31
or you go to
areas and speak, or...
00:20:53.35\00:20:56.48
I work with the local
crisis pregnancy center,
00:20:56.52\00:21:00.06
and I'm director of the
post abortion recovery program.
00:21:00.09\00:21:03.19
So that's the
retreat that I'm involved in
00:21:03.22\00:21:05.89
and lead out in.
00:21:05.93\00:21:08.33
And we've actually
had Adventist women
00:21:08.36\00:21:10.43
from the West Coast in
Canada, who have contacted us,
00:21:10.47\00:21:13.44
and want to come to
attend one of the retreats.
00:21:13.47\00:21:15.84
Okay.
00:21:15.87\00:21:17.21
So let's move on
to another story.
00:21:17.24\00:21:18.91
Antionette, this is something
to do with pastoral influences,
00:21:18.94\00:21:22.24
pastoral
student who is wrestling
00:21:22.28\00:21:23.91
with counseling a mother.
00:21:23.95\00:21:25.28
Yes.
00:21:25.31\00:21:26.65
In the seminars that we give,
generally weekend seminars.
00:21:26.68\00:21:28.95
Earlier this year,
we are at Heartland
00:21:28.98\00:21:30.62
giving a weekend seminar,
and a pastoral student...
00:21:30.65\00:21:34.09
We'd like to address
the difficult questions,
00:21:34.12\00:21:37.13
and think it's so
important that we understand
00:21:37.16\00:21:39.79
the truth can
stand up to difficulty.
00:21:39.83\00:21:42.56
We don't have to be
afraid of what is difficult
00:21:42.60\00:21:45.03
because the Lord is
sovereign, He is right there.
00:21:45.07\00:21:48.14
Well, we were talking about,
00:21:48.17\00:21:49.57
in particular life of the mother
00:21:49.60\00:21:51.54
versus health of the mother.
00:21:51.57\00:21:52.97
And when you...
00:21:53.01\00:21:57.55
And abortions that are
done to save the physical life
00:21:57.58\00:22:00.25
of the mother, for
example, an ectopic pregnancy,
00:22:00.28\00:22:03.49
if the child is
lodged in fallopian tube
00:22:03.52\00:22:05.55
at that early
stage of development.
00:22:05.59\00:22:08.72
We believe, you seek to
save as many lives as possible.
00:22:08.76\00:22:12.09
Well, with the rise in cancer,
00:22:12.13\00:22:14.30
the way that
cancer is effecting women.
00:22:14.33\00:22:16.23
This pastoral
student was asking,
00:22:16.26\00:22:18.30
"What if she has cancer?
00:22:18.33\00:22:20.00
What if she
needs to undergo chemo?
00:22:20.04\00:22:21.70
What am I going to tell her?
00:22:21.74\00:22:23.10
Do I tell her she
can't undergo the chemo,
00:22:23.14\00:22:25.07
and so she must not
do any of the treatment?
00:22:25.11\00:22:29.54
Or do I say she goes ahead
and should have the abortion?"
00:22:29.58\00:22:33.42
He was really wrestling back
and forth, and I was saying,
00:22:33.45\00:22:35.95
it was a fascinating dialogue.
00:22:35.98\00:22:37.99
And I said,
"Lord, give me wisdom,
00:22:38.02\00:22:39.35
give me wisdom to
know how to answer this."
00:22:39.39\00:22:42.96
And what was really remarkable
is, I think the evil one,
00:22:42.99\00:22:46.09
he attempts to cause
us to see only the crisis
00:22:46.13\00:22:49.80
of the circumstance, and we
see only the A and B scenarios.
00:22:49.83\00:22:54.64
But that's not
how the Lord works.
00:22:54.67\00:22:56.44
The Lord isn't only
A or B, and He's not,
00:22:56.47\00:22:59.87
He doesn't set up
mother versus child.
00:22:59.91\00:23:02.34
The Lord has a thousand
different ways to answer,
00:23:02.38\00:23:06.08
and to provide for our needs.
00:23:06.11\00:23:09.52
If you look through
scripture, how many times
00:23:09.55\00:23:12.25
did the Lord ask someone
00:23:12.29\00:23:16.49
to take the life of their child?
00:23:16.52\00:23:18.09
Well, we have the
story of Abraham and Isaac,
00:23:18.13\00:23:20.50
but what happened
with Abraham and Isaac?
00:23:20.53\00:23:22.46
That was a test.
It was. He stopped it.
00:23:22.50\00:23:24.40
When the Lord said,
take the life of Isaac,
00:23:24.43\00:23:26.30
it was a test to faith.
00:23:26.33\00:23:27.80
The Lord didn't intend that
Isaac's life would be taken.
00:23:27.84\00:23:30.71
And when in
scripture do we have the Lord
00:23:30.74\00:23:33.14
asking a parent to
take the life of their child
00:23:33.17\00:23:35.91
in order to save their own life?
00:23:35.94\00:23:37.98
That doesn't happen.
00:23:38.01\00:23:39.41
What we would love
to see in a situation
00:23:39.45\00:23:43.39
where someone's wrestling
with something like that,
00:23:43.42\00:23:45.75
would our pastors,
00:23:45.79\00:23:47.12
would our
laypeople get in the trenches
00:23:47.16\00:23:50.09
with these people
and say, "You know what?
00:23:50.13\00:23:51.49
I'm going to fall on my face
before the Lord for 10 days,
00:23:51.53\00:23:54.93
20 days, 30 days, and
together we will seek Him.
00:23:54.96\00:23:58.43
We will pray for healing,
we will pray for an answer."
00:23:58.47\00:24:01.30
There are so many different ways
00:24:01.34\00:24:03.04
that a woman can approach
that particular situation.
00:24:03.07\00:24:05.81
It doesn't have to
be mother versus baby,
00:24:05.84\00:24:08.48
or child versus baby
because the Lord is sovereign,
00:24:08.51\00:24:11.85
He is able to
restore, redeem, to save.
00:24:11.88\00:24:15.08
And when we approach this issue,
00:24:15.12\00:24:17.39
will we approach it
with that kind of faith,
00:24:17.42\00:24:20.16
not because the
situation is easy
00:24:20.19\00:24:22.76
but because we know
who our God really is.
00:24:22.79\00:24:25.39
Amen. Absolutely.
00:24:25.43\00:24:26.76
What I love in what
you shared many things,
00:24:26.80\00:24:29.06
but one thing that
stood out to me was
00:24:29.10\00:24:30.43
coming alongside the person.
00:24:30.47\00:24:32.10
Instead of saying,
"Okay, you're wrestling
00:24:32.13\00:24:33.54
with a very
difficult decision here,
00:24:33.57\00:24:35.64
you go home and
wrestle with it."
00:24:35.67\00:24:37.01
But this was leadership.
00:24:37.04\00:24:38.41
And you talked
about pastors and others
00:24:38.44\00:24:40.48
going in the trenches with them,
00:24:40.51\00:24:42.74
getting on their
face, praying with them,
00:24:42.78\00:24:44.88
or fasting with them, or
whatever it is with them.
00:24:44.91\00:24:48.45
It helps to know
that someone is walking
00:24:48.48\00:24:50.29
through this with
you and you're not alone.
00:24:50.32\00:24:52.05
Yeah. Absolutely. We want...
00:24:52.09\00:24:54.72
Normally in our
programs we would put up
00:24:54.76\00:24:56.26
your contact information at
the very end of the program.
00:24:56.29\00:24:59.23
But what we want to
do through this program
00:24:59.26\00:25:00.76
is several times
throughout the program
00:25:00.80\00:25:02.86
because we know that
many of you need help,
00:25:02.90\00:25:05.70
need hope, need
healing, want someone
00:25:05.73\00:25:08.74
to reach out to right now.
00:25:08.77\00:25:10.47
So even as you're
watching this program,
00:25:10.51\00:25:12.61
we want to put up the
website for Mafgia ministry.
00:25:12.64\00:25:16.04
You can go to is www.mafgia.com.
00:25:16.08\00:25:18.91
That's M-A-F-G-I-A.com.
00:25:18.95\00:25:23.25
Or you can email
them at info@mafgia.com.
00:25:23.28\00:25:27.99
Or you can call them,
00:25:28.02\00:25:31.16
706-527-4882.
00:25:31.19\00:25:36.67
That number once again is
00:25:36.70\00:25:38.33
706-527-4882.
00:25:38.37\00:25:43.71
And we want to do
this several times
00:25:43.74\00:25:45.54
throughout the
program, so you make sure
00:25:45.57\00:25:47.44
you can reach out and
get in touch with Mafgia.
00:25:47.48\00:25:50.08
Now going back to
Dianne, you have story for us
00:25:50.11\00:25:52.55
about a woman whose
child had birth defects.
00:25:52.58\00:25:55.62
One of the places
we spoke at, you know,
00:25:55.65\00:25:57.92
it's not uncommon to
have several people come
00:25:57.95\00:26:00.99
that want to share story.
00:26:01.02\00:26:02.56
This particular
woman came up to me
00:26:02.59\00:26:04.93
and brokenhearted.
00:26:04.96\00:26:08.73
She had had a
pregnancy and there had been
00:26:08.76\00:26:11.23
a deformity in her unborn child.
00:26:11.27\00:26:14.80
And the physician had
asked her to, or had told her,
00:26:14.84\00:26:18.24
advised her to abort.
00:26:18.27\00:26:20.21
And so she went to
her pastor, the thing
00:26:20.24\00:26:23.85
that broke this woman's
heart was her pastor's advice.
00:26:23.88\00:26:28.28
Her pastor told
her you would be crazy
00:26:28.32\00:26:30.65
not to have an abortion.
00:26:30.69\00:26:32.85
The fact that he gave
her that kind of counsel
00:26:32.89\00:26:36.93
broke her heart
more than the fact
00:26:36.96\00:26:39.46
that she had
gone through with it
00:26:39.49\00:26:41.20
because she was looking to
him for spiritual guidance.
00:26:41.23\00:26:45.40
And, you know, this
story is just one story of many
00:26:45.43\00:26:50.71
and it needs to compel
us to examine our faith.
00:26:50.74\00:26:54.68
Do I have the faith
enough to say, trust God.
00:26:54.71\00:27:00.02
And by doing that,
00:27:00.05\00:27:01.38
you're not
dictating a conscience,
00:27:01.42\00:27:03.28
and you're not
trying to co-verse,
00:27:03.32\00:27:05.09
they can still
make their own decision.
00:27:05.12\00:27:08.39
But you are exercising faith,
00:27:08.42\00:27:10.99
and you're walking
alongside that person.
00:27:11.03\00:27:13.86
And if we're gonna trust God,
00:27:13.90\00:27:16.87
that's where the
rubber meets the road.
00:27:16.90\00:27:18.63
We need to trust God.
00:27:18.67\00:27:20.84
I always tell people
that, how can we make people
00:27:20.87\00:27:23.77
jealous for our God
if we don't even give God
00:27:23.81\00:27:26.98
the opportunity to
show what He can do for us.
00:27:27.01\00:27:31.05
Yes. We're afraid.
00:27:31.08\00:27:32.98
So we as
Christians, as we approach
00:27:33.01\00:27:35.78
the subject need
to really examine
00:27:35.82\00:27:38.42
our own faith.
00:27:38.45\00:27:40.02
Do I have faith enough
to trust, to trust God?
00:27:40.06\00:27:44.69
Especially in leadership...
00:27:44.73\00:27:46.46
Amen. As pastors.
00:27:46.49\00:27:48.33
That story just
astounds me 'cause you think
00:27:48.36\00:27:50.53
someone in spiritual leadership
00:27:50.57\00:27:53.07
and they give
that type of advice.
00:27:53.10\00:27:56.00
Obviously, education is key.
00:27:56.04\00:27:57.77
We need education
of those in ministry,
00:27:57.81\00:27:59.67
those in leadership.
00:27:59.71\00:28:03.24
Does your
ministry work with that,
00:28:03.28\00:28:04.88
with educating
the pastoral ministry
00:28:04.91\00:28:07.22
with others or you focus more
on the, not the victim side,
00:28:07.25\00:28:11.29
but those who have
gone through abortions?
00:28:11.32\00:28:14.72
Well, we did,
00:28:14.76\00:28:16.09
we had the
opportunity at one camp meeting
00:28:16.12\00:28:17.76
where we spoke at
to speak to pastors.
00:28:17.79\00:28:20.36
And of course, we would love
to get our foot in more doors
00:28:20.40\00:28:23.83
as the Lord opens
them because we believe
00:28:23.87\00:28:26.43
that's one of
the starting points.
00:28:26.47\00:28:28.74
You educate pastors
on how to deal with this,
00:28:28.77\00:28:31.44
specifically this, and
to go into the hard places.
00:28:31.47\00:28:36.71
I like it because it causes them
00:28:36.75\00:28:39.61
to examine their experience.
00:28:39.65\00:28:41.65
Yes. So, yes...
00:28:41.68\00:28:44.29
That's good. Okay, absolutely.
00:28:44.32\00:28:45.99
Well, and we
absolutely would seek to go
00:28:46.02\00:28:48.82
wherever the
Lord opens the door.
00:28:48.86\00:28:51.59
The majority of
abortions are occurring
00:28:51.63\00:28:53.90
between 18 and 24 years
old, that's the key demographic.
00:28:53.93\00:28:57.30
And so getting in
front of that age, frankly,
00:28:57.33\00:29:00.24
getting in front of
them much earlier for,
00:29:00.27\00:29:03.30
because as we said,
this issue is bigger than
00:29:03.34\00:29:05.97
this is right and this is wrong,
00:29:06.01\00:29:07.34
so don't do that.
00:29:07.38\00:29:08.84
When we are to finding ourselves
00:29:08.88\00:29:10.55
through the lens
of God, we're valuable
00:29:10.58\00:29:12.58
because we're made in
the image of the Lord,
00:29:12.61\00:29:15.28
it changes
everything, it literally does.
00:29:15.32\00:29:18.95
We're gonna change the
way that we value ourselves,
00:29:18.99\00:29:21.89
we value others, the way
we interact with other people
00:29:21.92\00:29:25.09
much earlier from
the very beginning.
00:29:25.13\00:29:27.33
And so being able to
start these dialogues
00:29:27.36\00:29:30.47
early on is so critical.
00:29:30.50\00:29:32.40
Amen. Amen.
00:29:32.43\00:29:34.14
What about a young
woman who hid her pregnancy?
00:29:34.17\00:29:40.24
This is such a perfect
example of what Antionette
00:29:40.28\00:29:43.08
was just saying.
00:29:43.11\00:29:44.45
When we don't
address this issue,
00:29:44.48\00:29:46.95
this is the kind of
story we end up hearing
00:29:46.98\00:29:49.72
when we're not
talking to our young people,
00:29:49.75\00:29:51.69
and educating our young
people, and our parents.
00:29:51.72\00:29:54.52
This was a story,
actually it was shared,
00:29:54.56\00:29:58.13
it was a pastoral family
00:29:58.16\00:30:00.20
and this young
woman got pregnant,
00:30:00.23\00:30:02.86
young teenager.
00:30:02.90\00:30:04.43
And she went
her entire pregnancy
00:30:04.47\00:30:07.30
binding herself
because she did not want
00:30:07.34\00:30:10.01
to share with her parents.
00:30:10.04\00:30:12.24
And it was a tragic story.
00:30:12.27\00:30:15.51
It was a very tragic
story because she ended up
00:30:15.54\00:30:18.58
losing that baby.
00:30:18.61\00:30:20.48
How far long was she?
00:30:20.52\00:30:21.85
She was term. And the very...
00:30:21.88\00:30:25.95
When you see a father
who realizes his daughter
00:30:25.99\00:30:29.46
was not able to come to
him, and was that afraid
00:30:29.49\00:30:33.63
to come to him...
00:30:33.66\00:30:35.00
That would
break you as a father.
00:30:35.03\00:30:36.36
Break his
heart, break his heart.
00:30:36.40\00:30:41.10
When we went to the
ministerial meeting,
00:30:41.14\00:30:43.20
it was really, really
good because we realized
00:30:43.24\00:30:45.54
how many pastors
are confronted with this
00:30:45.57\00:30:48.51
within their own homes.
00:30:48.54\00:30:50.18
And because of,
trying to keep an image
00:30:50.21\00:30:53.25
or all this
pressure they're put under,
00:30:53.28\00:30:56.18
and even if
they are not verbally
00:30:56.22\00:30:57.72
saying it to
their kids, you know,
00:30:57.75\00:30:59.79
march the straight line,
the kids are picking up on it.
00:30:59.82\00:31:02.72
So if they trip up, the
pressure to hide, hide it,
00:31:02.76\00:31:08.26
that was very
heartbreaking story
00:31:08.30\00:31:10.17
and very typical of what we see
00:31:10.20\00:31:13.77
because of the silence,
the silence in our schools,
00:31:13.80\00:31:16.87
and...
00:31:16.91\00:31:18.24
How far long was she
when her parents found out?
00:31:18.27\00:31:20.38
Term. Full term.
00:31:20.41\00:31:21.74
So she went full term. Yeah.
00:31:21.78\00:31:24.05
She actually, they had been out
on a event and they came home,
00:31:24.08\00:31:28.15
and she went up to the restroom,
00:31:28.18\00:31:29.58
and they heard a
thud on the floor.
00:31:29.62\00:31:31.49
And when they went up,
they went up to the restroom,
00:31:31.52\00:31:34.12
they saw, there
was blood on the floor.
00:31:34.16\00:31:36.29
They thought she
was hemorrhaging.
00:31:36.32\00:31:37.69
So they took
her to the hospital,
00:31:37.73\00:31:39.39
and they get to the
hospital, and the doctor says,
00:31:39.43\00:31:42.10
"Where is the baby?"
00:31:42.13\00:31:43.47
They literally had no idea
that she had been pregnant.
00:31:43.50\00:31:46.53
And what was really
striking about the story is,
00:31:46.57\00:31:50.91
what is it saying
about our church culture,
00:31:50.94\00:31:54.98
about us as families,
00:31:55.01\00:31:56.68
and we don't speak
this in condemnation.
00:31:56.71\00:31:58.68
There's no
judgment here. Right, right.
00:31:58.71\00:32:00.38
We're saying,
there is a better way.
00:32:00.42\00:32:03.18
When we are valuing ourselves,
again, as the Lord does,
00:32:03.22\00:32:08.19
we won't base our
value on performance,
00:32:08.22\00:32:10.43
we simply won't.
00:32:10.46\00:32:11.79
And we won't love other
people based on performance.
00:32:11.83\00:32:14.00
And as believers, we
really tend to do that.
00:32:14.03\00:32:17.00
We tend to think
the Lord loves us
00:32:17.03\00:32:18.63
based on our performance,
00:32:18.67\00:32:20.00
we tend to love others
based on their performance.
00:32:20.04\00:32:22.64
That's not the
standard of the Lord.
00:32:22.67\00:32:24.81
And will we choose no
matter what, I will love you,
00:32:24.84\00:32:29.44
no matter what, I
will walk alongside you.
00:32:29.48\00:32:32.71
What's really remarkable
is we've shared this story
00:32:32.75\00:32:35.88
multiple times during
seminars that we've given.
00:32:35.92\00:32:39.75
On more than one
occasion someone has asked,
00:32:39.79\00:32:44.66
"Aren't you afraid that if...
00:32:44.69\00:32:48.86
We come alongside
these women in crisis,
00:32:48.90\00:32:51.57
and we throw them a baby shower,
00:32:51.60\00:32:53.57
and we celebrate this life.
00:32:53.60\00:32:55.20
Aren't you afraid
that it will cause women
00:32:55.24\00:32:58.34
to treat the baby like a trophy?
00:32:58.37\00:33:00.28
Everyone will
think you're just allowed
00:33:00.31\00:33:01.88
to get pregnant and have sex,
and do whatever you want to."
00:33:01.91\00:33:05.05
And our answer
is, "Absolutely, no.
00:33:05.08\00:33:07.42
We are not
afraid of that at all."
00:33:07.45\00:33:09.22
"And why not?"
00:33:09.25\00:33:10.59
"Because we're
addressing the entire problem."
00:33:10.62\00:33:13.56
A woman who is having
sex outside the bounds
00:33:13.59\00:33:17.59
the Lord has established,
00:33:17.63\00:33:18.96
she is telling you
something about the value,
00:33:18.99\00:33:21.43
the way that she values herself.
00:33:21.46\00:33:22.93
A young man or older man,
00:33:22.96\00:33:24.80
however old
these people might be
00:33:24.83\00:33:26.17
who are having sex
outside the boundaries
00:33:26.20\00:33:28.27
the Lord has established,
00:33:28.30\00:33:29.80
they're telling you something
00:33:29.84\00:33:31.17
about what's
going on in their soul.
00:33:31.21\00:33:33.27
We don't act that way because
we're satisfied in our souls.
00:33:33.31\00:33:36.51
We act that way
because we're empty
00:33:36.54\00:33:38.21
and we're looking to be filled.
00:33:38.25\00:33:39.85
And so any situations,
if a young woman truly knows
00:33:39.88\00:33:45.79
I'm loved because I exist,
because I'm made in the image
00:33:45.82\00:33:49.02
of the Lord, not
because I perform well.
00:33:49.06\00:33:51.46
It's going to
cause her to choose well,
00:33:51.49\00:33:54.00
it's simply will.
00:33:54.03\00:33:55.36
It's the same way for young men,
00:33:55.40\00:33:56.73
it's the same way for
older men and older women.
00:33:56.77\00:33:59.67
So instead of pushing
away someone in crisis,
00:33:59.70\00:34:04.47
it's our job to get
alongside in the trenches
00:34:04.51\00:34:07.41
as we talked about and
say, I will walk beside you,
00:34:07.44\00:34:11.55
I'm a living
testament to people saying,
00:34:11.58\00:34:14.85
I will walk beside you,
00:34:14.88\00:34:17.02
having the
courage to walk beside.
00:34:17.05\00:34:19.49
My mom, who was in
crisis, but I can say honestly,
00:34:19.52\00:34:22.99
were it not for their
willingness to do that,
00:34:23.02\00:34:26.36
our lives would
have been very different.
00:34:26.39\00:34:28.10
Yes. That's incredible.
00:34:28.13\00:34:30.27
God has called
you to be a preacher.
00:34:30.30\00:34:31.97
I just want you to
know that. I can hear that.
00:34:32.00\00:34:34.14
She starts to talk and
just the Holy Spirit comes out,
00:34:34.17\00:34:36.47
that's powerful, both of you.
00:34:36.50\00:34:37.84
Praise the Lord. Thank you.
00:34:37.87\00:34:39.21
God calls us to walk alongside.
00:34:39.24\00:34:41.08
And if you are in
crisis like that young girl
00:34:41.11\00:34:43.65
you told the story about.
00:34:43.68\00:34:45.01
If you are a family that's
just broken apart right now
00:34:45.05\00:34:47.52
and not even
knowing where to turn,
00:34:47.55\00:34:49.28
we encourage you to
contact Mafgia ministry.
00:34:49.32\00:34:52.45
You can... Their
website is mafgia.com.
00:34:52.49\00:34:58.33
You can email
them, info@mafgia.com.
00:34:58.36\00:35:02.10
That's info@mafgia.com.
00:35:02.13\00:35:05.10
Or you can give them a call,
00:35:05.13\00:35:07.30
that's 706-527-4882.
00:35:07.34\00:35:13.11
That number once again is
00:35:13.14\00:35:14.48
706-527-4882.
00:35:14.51\00:35:19.01
Now we got to move
on to the next story.
00:35:19.05\00:35:20.92
We have, you've
seen the Word of God
00:35:20.95\00:35:23.22
to advocate for abortion?
00:35:23.25\00:35:25.65
Yes.
00:35:25.69\00:35:27.52
Now that just seems like,
00:35:27.56\00:35:28.89
how could that
even happen, right?
00:35:28.92\00:35:30.39
Well, you know, we
share these stories
00:35:30.43\00:35:33.43
because we are,
we firmly believe
00:35:33.46\00:35:35.83
the Lord is saying,
00:35:35.86\00:35:37.20
"There is a better
way, choose My way."
00:35:37.23\00:35:39.77
We encountered a
story of a young woman who,
00:35:39.80\00:35:41.90
she was in her 30s,
and she had written to us,
00:35:41.94\00:35:44.64
and she was experiencing
a lot of family pressure
00:35:44.67\00:35:47.81
to have an abortion.
00:35:47.84\00:35:49.91
And the thing that her
father used to convince her,
00:35:49.94\00:35:55.18
to have an abortion was
the Word, it was Scripture.
00:35:55.22\00:35:59.05
And that was heartbreaking.
00:35:59.09\00:36:02.29
You think of Jesus, He
was the word made flesh.
00:36:02.32\00:36:06.39
He literally came to earth
and died a sacrificial death
00:36:06.43\00:36:09.76
so that we could live.
00:36:09.80\00:36:11.90
There is no...
00:36:11.93\00:36:13.54
There are no
scriptures in the Word
00:36:13.57\00:36:16.37
that either explicitly
say or implicitly imply that
00:36:16.40\00:36:19.84
we're allowed to take the
lives of our unborn children.
00:36:19.87\00:36:22.38
That principle
simply is not there.
00:36:22.41\00:36:24.91
What is there is a
story of the God who loves us.
00:36:24.95\00:36:29.45
It's the story of a God
who established our value
00:36:29.48\00:36:32.75
at creation, and He
fortified, He entrenched it
00:36:32.79\00:36:36.16
forevermore with
His blood at the cross.
00:36:36.19\00:36:39.73
That's the story that's
being told in Scripture.
00:36:39.76\00:36:43.33
And the tragedy
is not just the way
00:36:43.37\00:36:49.80
that this was used in
this particular woman's life,
00:36:49.84\00:36:52.61
but what might have been
possible if her spiritual head,
00:36:52.64\00:36:57.98
her spiritual
authority had chosen to stand
00:36:58.01\00:37:01.28
on the truth of this word
00:37:01.32\00:37:03.79
because imagine if he had...
00:37:03.82\00:37:09.62
He'd been willing to
make the hard choice,
00:37:09.66\00:37:11.56
to have the
difficult conversation
00:37:11.59\00:37:13.80
and say, do you know, daughter,
that the Lord of glory,
00:37:13.83\00:37:18.13
He crafted you
with love and design,
00:37:18.17\00:37:21.27
that literally once upon
a time, you did not exist,
00:37:21.30\00:37:24.87
and now you do because
you are brought into existence
00:37:24.91\00:37:28.21
by the finger of God,
00:37:28.24\00:37:30.35
not just you but
your unborn child.
00:37:30.38\00:37:33.15
Think of the
difference it would have made
00:37:33.18\00:37:35.58
not just in her particular story
00:37:35.62\00:37:37.59
but in all of her future.
00:37:37.62\00:37:40.22
Absolutely, that's incredible.
00:37:40.26\00:37:41.86
You know what I keep hearing
the thread running through
00:37:41.89\00:37:44.53
is, who we are in Jesus.
00:37:44.56\00:37:46.73
If we can catch a
glimpse of who am I in Jesus,
00:37:46.76\00:37:50.77
the value that God has
placed on each one of us,
00:37:50.80\00:37:54.20
what a difference it would make,
00:37:54.24\00:37:55.70
and what a difference it
would make in the choices
00:37:55.74\00:37:58.11
and the decisions we would make,
00:37:58.14\00:38:00.41
and the decisions
maybe we've made in the past
00:38:00.44\00:38:02.41
that we regret.
00:38:02.44\00:38:03.78
We still have
value in God's eyes,
00:38:03.81\00:38:05.45
and so what a
difference that makes
00:38:05.48\00:38:06.82
in the healing process.
00:38:06.85\00:38:08.18
That's beautiful.
00:38:08.22\00:38:09.55
What about walking
alongside a child in crisis?
00:38:09.58\00:38:14.22
We, Dianne and I both
met, have met many couples
00:38:14.26\00:38:18.76
who are just talking
from a real place of pain.
00:38:18.79\00:38:22.90
And a couple years
ago, we met a couple who,
00:38:22.93\00:38:26.67
they had just discovered
their daughter was pregnant,
00:38:26.70\00:38:30.27
and they were
raw in that honesty.
00:38:30.31\00:38:35.04
"What is, what are
people going to say about me,
00:38:35.08\00:38:37.95
about my parenting?
00:38:37.98\00:38:39.38
Are they going to
say I was a bad parent
00:38:39.41\00:38:41.05
that I didn't raise
her to love the Lord?"
00:38:41.08\00:38:42.92
Just very raw with us.
00:38:42.95\00:38:45.02
And it was remarkable
because if we would be willing
00:38:45.05\00:38:48.49
to be that honest with ourselves
00:38:48.52\00:38:50.06
and with the Lord.
00:38:50.09\00:38:51.43
Well, we have the
opportunity to dialog with them
00:38:51.46\00:38:53.53
over the next couple of days.
00:38:53.56\00:38:55.26
And out of the corner of my eye,
00:38:55.30\00:38:58.33
it was the last
day of the convention,
00:38:58.37\00:39:00.50
I saw the father
in the situation.
00:39:00.54\00:39:03.20
He was talking to
Dianne, and he said,
00:39:03.24\00:39:05.81
"I'm the granddad."
00:39:05.84\00:39:08.64
He took ownership of it. He did.
00:39:08.68\00:39:11.38
And what just blessed
us, this was a pastor.
00:39:11.41\00:39:14.78
And he had just
moved to a new church,
00:39:14.82\00:39:18.55
they didn't know
their congregation,
00:39:18.59\00:39:20.69
and so they were faced
with that embarrassment.
00:39:20.72\00:39:23.46
But to see the
value they were preserving
00:39:23.49\00:39:26.86
the dignity of their daughter,
00:39:26.90\00:39:29.30
and they were
telling their daughter,
00:39:29.33\00:39:31.50
you are more valuable
than the opinions of others.
00:39:31.53\00:39:35.67
And the rest of her life,
that daughter will grow up
00:39:35.70\00:39:39.67
feeling that kind of love.
00:39:39.71\00:39:43.68
It was such a
beautiful thing to see.
00:39:43.71\00:39:45.71
Now of course, they
cried, those parents,
00:39:45.75\00:39:47.88
they were heart
sick for their daughter,
00:39:47.92\00:39:49.98
and the mother wept.
00:39:50.02\00:39:52.02
But they didn't
abandon her. Yes.
00:39:52.05\00:39:54.76
And by not abandoning her
00:39:54.79\00:39:56.73
and by choosing
to stick with her,
00:39:56.76\00:39:59.23
the message was profound,
00:39:59.26\00:40:01.46
the message
they were giving her.
00:40:01.50\00:40:03.87
And by speaking out
and by breaking the silence
00:40:03.90\00:40:07.37
on this issue, we can
give that same message
00:40:07.40\00:40:11.21
to our young daughters
and sons within our church.
00:40:11.24\00:40:14.78
What a difference that
girl has as opposed to the girl
00:40:14.81\00:40:17.75
who was trying to bind herself.
00:40:17.78\00:40:19.28
Yes. Exactly.
00:40:19.31\00:40:20.65
That just tears me up,
and hide that pregnancy,
00:40:20.68\00:40:22.92
and what a
difference, and realizing that
00:40:22.95\00:40:25.35
her parents still value
her, and still lover her,
00:40:25.39\00:40:27.89
and she can grow up in that.
00:40:27.92\00:40:29.49
That's beautiful.
00:40:29.52\00:40:30.86
Now you have a poem I think,
and a story behind a poem.
00:40:30.89\00:40:34.30
Dianne, why don't
you share that with us?
00:40:34.33\00:40:35.96
This was a young woman we
met at one of our retreats.
00:40:36.00\00:40:40.14
Actually they had asked
us if we would stay over
00:40:40.17\00:40:43.24
and have one
more program for those
00:40:43.27\00:40:46.37
who could not
make it to the retreat.
00:40:46.41\00:40:48.61
And we were
willing, of course, so.
00:40:48.64\00:40:52.05
But no one showed.
00:40:52.08\00:40:53.52
Not one person showed
except for this one young lady.
00:40:53.55\00:40:57.59
And we just knew
immediately it was ordained
00:40:57.62\00:41:00.59
and she had had an
abortion, and we encouraged her
00:41:00.62\00:41:04.53
to go through the retreat,
00:41:04.56\00:41:05.99
Rachel's Vineyard is the retreat
00:41:06.03\00:41:07.86
that I went through.
00:41:07.90\00:41:09.33
So that's the one
that at this point
00:41:09.36\00:41:10.97
I encourage
people to go through.
00:41:11.00\00:41:12.53
And where is that located?
00:41:12.57\00:41:13.90
Well, you can their 1800
number and they have them all
00:41:13.94\00:41:17.07
throughout the country.
00:41:17.11\00:41:18.71
And I was in North
Carolina, so of course,
00:41:18.74\00:41:22.68
I went to the one
that was closest to me.
00:41:22.71\00:41:25.18
And she was in the North East,
so she found one close to her.
00:41:25.21\00:41:31.29
So she did, she
went through the retreat
00:41:31.32\00:41:34.52
and had just a
tremendous experience.
00:41:34.56\00:41:36.46
And then she wrote this
poem and I'm just gonna read
00:41:36.49\00:41:38.73
part of it, but I just love it.
00:41:38.76\00:41:44.07
"Twice a year I mourn
for you as any mother would.
00:41:44.10\00:41:48.60
Twice a year I think of you
and dream of all that should.
00:41:48.64\00:41:53.61
The tiny hairs that curl around,
00:41:53.64\00:41:56.21
your tiny ears and face,
00:41:56.24\00:41:58.78
eyes that should
have seen the world
00:41:58.81\00:42:01.08
another time and place.
00:42:01.12\00:42:03.42
I dream of all
the things you dream
00:42:03.45\00:42:05.69
and all the things you'd play,
of little squeals of laughter
00:42:05.72\00:42:10.36
if I'd only let you stay.
00:42:10.39\00:42:13.16
I dream of tiny fingers
how they wrap around my hand
00:42:13.19\00:42:17.10
and all the
love I'd give to you,
00:42:17.13\00:42:19.13
the perfect love so grand.
00:42:19.17\00:42:21.80
I think about your little
eyes if they'd be blue or brown.
00:42:21.84\00:42:26.24
I wish I could have seen
you smile or even cry or frown.
00:42:26.27\00:42:31.61
I wish you had the
chance to live the life
00:42:31.65\00:42:34.82
I know you should.
00:42:34.85\00:42:36.75
For if you had you wouldn't
be a should, or would, or could.
00:42:36.79\00:42:42.32
I think about your little legs,
all the places you would run.
00:42:42.36\00:42:46.70
The things I
could have taught you
00:42:46.73\00:42:48.80
so full of life and fun,
00:42:48.83\00:42:51.67
like, why the
clouds can't hold you up,
00:42:51.70\00:42:54.60
or why the sky is blue,
or how to build a snowman,
00:42:54.64\00:42:59.24
or how much your mom loves you.
00:42:59.27\00:43:02.44
I tell you that
the world is round,
00:43:02.48\00:43:04.65
the sun above, the moon,
the stars and all the universe,
00:43:04.68\00:43:08.68
they all exist for you.
00:43:08.72\00:43:11.42
Twice a year I mourn for you.
00:43:11.45\00:43:14.26
This year you would be three,
00:43:14.29\00:43:16.66
and I never will forgive myself
for not allowing you to be."
00:43:16.69\00:43:21.86
That is such a
powerful, powerful poem,
00:43:21.90\00:43:24.10
but there is so much
healing in that because like,
00:43:24.13\00:43:27.27
I think I mentioned earlier,
she had embraced the child,
00:43:27.30\00:43:32.01
her child, to get
out of the statistics
00:43:32.04\00:43:36.24
and claimed it as her own.
00:43:36.28\00:43:38.18
And now she has the
hope of knowing that
00:43:38.21\00:43:40.32
she'll hold that
baby again some day.
00:43:40.35\00:43:43.79
So there is great healing.
00:43:43.82\00:43:45.95
And I encourage
every woman I encounter
00:43:45.99\00:43:48.09
who has been through an abortion
00:43:48.12\00:43:50.16
to go through an
abortion recovery program
00:43:50.19\00:43:53.26
because of this.
00:43:53.29\00:43:54.73
That's powerful. It's huge.
00:43:54.76\00:43:56.36
It's huge to
think to write that down
00:43:56.40\00:43:58.60
and to own that
loss, you could say.
00:43:58.63\00:44:02.70
My husband Greg and I,
we've been open about this.
00:44:02.74\00:44:07.04
We can't have
children, so we've walked
00:44:07.08\00:44:09.08
in infertility
journey for 15 years.
00:44:09.11\00:44:11.71
And as you read that
poem, I resonated with that
00:44:11.75\00:44:14.28
because I'm more
infertile than I ever had,
00:44:14.32\00:44:17.92
where this woman is
mourning for the children
00:44:17.95\00:44:19.65
that she had and then she lost.
00:44:19.69\00:44:23.36
But that's powerful,
that healing that God can do.
00:44:23.39\00:44:27.80
What about mental barriers?
00:44:27.83\00:44:29.86
I know we just
have a few moments left.
00:44:29.90\00:44:32.17
People who say, we
don't have that problem.
00:44:32.20\00:44:37.67
No, right, both of us.
00:44:37.71\00:44:39.51
What is, really we have,
it's been really remarkable
00:44:39.54\00:44:42.84
as when someone
attempts to bring a sin.
00:44:42.88\00:44:46.45
Sometimes there's push
back, and someone might say,
00:44:46.48\00:44:49.48
we don't have that problem here.
00:44:49.52\00:44:51.59
It is a problem.
00:44:51.62\00:44:53.52
The Lord is
asking us to be honest,
00:44:53.56\00:44:55.99
simply to be honest.
00:44:56.02\00:44:57.53
Not to pretend, and
not to put up a facade,
00:44:57.56\00:45:00.96
but just to say,
this is who I am.
00:45:01.00\00:45:03.40
And the thing about being honest
00:45:03.43\00:45:04.93
about this issue is we liberate.
00:45:04.97\00:45:08.60
The evil one keeps people
bound in shackles and chains.
00:45:08.64\00:45:12.44
And the Lord has
called us forward to be people
00:45:12.47\00:45:16.11
who liberate by the
power of the Holy Spirit.
00:45:16.14\00:45:18.25
That's what we do, we
help to set captives free.
00:45:18.28\00:45:21.22
Well, if we pretend
that this isn't a problem,
00:45:21.25\00:45:24.62
and if we say, we
don't deal with that,
00:45:24.65\00:45:28.36
or we don't need to address it,
00:45:28.39\00:45:30.19
we're standing as a barrier
between the post abortive
00:45:30.23\00:45:34.16
man and woman, and the cross.
00:45:34.20\00:45:36.80
That's profound,
that we're literally
00:45:36.83\00:45:40.14
not allowing people
to experience the hope,
00:45:40.17\00:45:43.84
the healing, the
freedom, the forgiveness
00:45:43.87\00:45:45.87
that the Lord has
invited them into.
00:45:45.91\00:45:48.04
We must be honest
with Him about who we are,
00:45:48.08\00:45:50.91
about what we've done.
00:45:50.95\00:45:52.38
That's where the
freedom is. Amen.
00:45:52.41\00:45:55.55
I think it's a huge awakening
when people who have invited us
00:45:55.58\00:46:01.89
to their church,
and then after we left,
00:46:01.92\00:46:05.16
we share with them, yes, indeed,
00:46:05.19\00:46:07.03
there's five or six
people in your congregation,
00:46:07.06\00:46:10.83
you know, that have...
00:46:10.87\00:46:12.20
And they're
saying, I didn't know any.
00:46:12.23\00:46:13.80
Exactly.
00:46:13.84\00:46:15.17
Or they might, their
preface might have been,
00:46:15.20\00:46:16.54
well, we don't
really have that problem.
00:46:16.57\00:46:18.17
And then of course,
00:46:18.21\00:46:19.54
we give our
information to schools...
00:46:19.57\00:46:22.71
Yes, that's good.
You speak to schools?
00:46:22.74\00:46:25.71
If they invite us.
00:46:25.75\00:46:27.08
If they invite us, but
unfortunately we hear that too,
00:46:27.12\00:46:29.32
we don't have that problem here.
00:46:29.35\00:46:31.32
Right.
00:46:31.35\00:46:32.92
We're Christians. Yes, right.
00:46:32.95\00:46:35.42
As if to say
Christians don't have issues,
00:46:35.46\00:46:38.03
and Christians
don't deal with stuff,
00:46:38.06\00:46:39.66
and we don't
deal with stuff within
00:46:39.69\00:46:41.20
the Seventh-day
Adventist church.
00:46:41.23\00:46:42.56
We want to put up their
contact information again.
00:46:42.60\00:46:45.37
If you are a school, if you
are a principal of the school
00:46:45.40\00:46:49.54
and you might be
in that condition
00:46:49.57\00:46:51.24
and be saying,
well, I'm not even sure
00:46:51.27\00:46:53.17
we have that issue 'cause
we are Seventh-day Adventists,
00:46:53.21\00:46:55.81
we follow the truth.
00:46:55.84\00:46:57.18
This is the pervasive
issue because it's human.
00:46:57.21\00:46:59.91
It's our humanity.
00:46:59.95\00:47:01.78
And so it is so important
to raise awareness, to educate,
00:47:01.82\00:47:06.89
to work to bring healing
to those who are in pain,
00:47:06.92\00:47:11.16
and to work to bring
prevention for the future.
00:47:11.19\00:47:14.00
So if you are a principal,
00:47:14.03\00:47:15.83
if you are a
teacher of the school,
00:47:15.86\00:47:17.40
we want to encourage you
to contact this ministry.
00:47:17.43\00:47:21.37
If you are a
pastor of a congregation,
00:47:21.40\00:47:25.07
we want to encourage
you to have them come in
00:47:25.11\00:47:26.94
for a weekend at your church.
00:47:26.98\00:47:29.54
If you are a local conference
00:47:29.58\00:47:31.98
within the
Seventh-day Adventist church,
00:47:32.01\00:47:33.35
or even another denomination,
00:47:33.38\00:47:35.08
and you want them
to come into your area
00:47:35.12\00:47:37.09
to speak about these issues,
00:47:37.12\00:47:40.76
and to educate, and
to train the pastors,
00:47:40.79\00:47:42.76
we just encourage
you to go to mafgia.com.
00:47:42.79\00:47:45.56
Or you can call
them, 706-527-4882.
00:47:45.59\00:47:51.97
Or you can
email, info@mafgia.com.
00:47:52.00\00:47:55.54
I know we have
a few moments left
00:47:55.57\00:47:56.91
before we go to the news break.
00:47:56.94\00:47:58.54
What would be some of
the needs in your ministry?
00:47:58.57\00:48:02.04
Is there some needs
that you have in the ministry
00:48:02.08\00:48:04.31
that we can help with,
00:48:04.35\00:48:06.11
that our 3ABN viewers
at home can help with?
00:48:06.15\00:48:08.45
What are some of the things
00:48:08.48\00:48:09.82
that you are
looking for the future?
00:48:09.85\00:48:11.19
Maybe some goals you
have, and then you say, oh,
00:48:11.22\00:48:13.56
but we have these needs.
00:48:13.59\00:48:14.92
What would be some things?
00:48:14.96\00:48:16.39
Well, the number one
absolutely would be prayer.
00:48:16.42\00:48:18.96
This issue from top to
bottom, it's a spiritual issue
00:48:18.99\00:48:21.66
because it attacks
the people who are made
00:48:21.70\00:48:24.33
in the image of the Lord.
00:48:24.37\00:48:25.70
And the evil one has deceived us
00:48:25.73\00:48:27.30
and he's tricked
us into accepting lie
00:48:27.34\00:48:29.54
and believing it as truth.
00:48:29.57\00:48:31.44
And so truly people
praying, that is what is moving.
00:48:31.47\00:48:36.75
It's moving people's hearts,
it's awakening people's minds.
00:48:36.78\00:48:40.25
And people who
before were silent,
00:48:40.28\00:48:42.48
they're coming to life again.
00:48:42.52\00:48:44.49
And it's absolutely
phenomenal and glorious.
00:48:44.52\00:48:49.22
We are hoping that bigger venues
00:48:49.26\00:48:52.73
in terms of the
message been able to get
00:48:52.76\00:48:54.96
in front of women,
get in front of men,
00:48:55.00\00:48:56.97
get in front of
pastors will open up.
00:48:57.00\00:48:59.17
And we see the Lord
doing that more and more.
00:48:59.20\00:49:01.40
Now you're doing,
women's retreats you've done...
00:49:01.44\00:49:03.61
You've done ASI,
spoken to ASI, GYC...
00:49:03.64\00:49:07.18
What are some
of the other venues
00:49:07.21\00:49:08.54
that you've been to?
00:49:08.58\00:49:09.91
AMEN, we spoke at AMEN.
00:49:09.94\00:49:11.88
Adventist Medical
Evangelism Network, okay.
00:49:11.91\00:49:14.98
That's right.
00:49:15.02\00:49:16.35
At camp meeting last year,
00:49:16.38\00:49:18.75
different
churches giving seminars.
00:49:18.79\00:49:20.56
We just went to Canada
which was exciting for us.
00:49:20.59\00:49:22.82
Yeah. Yeah, that was real good.
00:49:22.86\00:49:25.23
And you know, you were talking
about request and prayer,
00:49:25.26\00:49:29.33
pray for the
pastors and the teachers
00:49:29.36\00:49:32.17
that are wrestling
with whether or not
00:49:32.20\00:49:33.70
to bring the
subject into the school
00:49:33.74\00:49:36.00
because like Antionette
says, so many times we hear,
00:49:36.04\00:49:39.51
if I'm bringing
something about abortion,
00:49:39.54\00:49:42.38
isn't it a
condoning sexual activity?
00:49:42.41\00:49:45.78
And it's not that at all because
00:49:45.81\00:49:47.32
when you incorporate value,
it's gonna effect the decisions
00:49:47.35\00:49:52.45
you make as a young teenager,
or, you know, a young man,
00:49:52.49\00:49:56.83
how he treats a young
woman, and vice versa.
00:49:56.86\00:49:59.83
So it's not
condoning sexual behavior
00:49:59.86\00:50:03.00
outside of God's plan.
00:50:03.03\00:50:05.27
If anything discourages
that and look more of yourself,
00:50:05.30\00:50:09.30
protect the dignity of
the woman you're dating.
00:50:09.34\00:50:11.67
Amen. Or the dignity of the man.
00:50:11.71\00:50:14.14
Don't put him in a position
where he's gonna be temped.
00:50:14.18\00:50:17.58
Yeah, absolutely.
00:50:17.61\00:50:20.02
I want to give each
one of you an opportunity,
00:50:20.05\00:50:21.88
and if we don't have
before we go to the news break,
00:50:21.92\00:50:24.22
we'll do some of
this afterwards as well.
00:50:24.25\00:50:26.49
But let's start
with you, Antionette,
00:50:26.52\00:50:27.86
I want to give
you an opportunity
00:50:27.89\00:50:29.22
to look into the
camera right over there,
00:50:29.26\00:50:30.99
and to make an appeal
to someone maybe right now
00:50:31.03\00:50:33.76
who's in the valley of
decision, I don't know,
00:50:33.80\00:50:35.86
should I abort, should
I not, what should I do?
00:50:35.90\00:50:38.10
What would you tell her?
00:50:38.13\00:50:40.57
I would say that
you are so loved,
00:50:40.60\00:50:44.97
and my deepest desire is that
you would come to understand
00:50:45.01\00:50:48.84
how magnificently you're loved,
how incredibly valuable you are
00:50:48.88\00:50:55.82
not because of what you
do, or achieve, or posses,
00:50:55.85\00:50:59.15
but simply because you are
made in the image of the Lord
00:50:59.19\00:51:02.26
that His hand
literally crafted you
00:51:02.29\00:51:04.69
and brought you into existence,
that you would come to see
00:51:04.73\00:51:08.66
not only your value but also
the value of that unborn child,
00:51:08.70\00:51:13.03
and that I pray that
He would bring people
00:51:13.07\00:51:15.04
alongside you.
00:51:15.07\00:51:16.40
Contact us who will
be able to walk with you
00:51:16.44\00:51:20.04
through the
difficulty of that circumstances
00:51:20.08\00:51:22.48
so that you and
your unborn child
00:51:22.51\00:51:25.68
can be preserved.
00:51:25.71\00:51:27.05
Amen.
00:51:27.08\00:51:28.42
Dianne, what would you
say, if someone's struggling
00:51:28.45\00:51:30.49
with that decision
right now, what would you say?
00:51:30.52\00:51:32.39
Well, my burden
would be for those of you
00:51:32.42\00:51:35.46
who are
struggling with a decision
00:51:35.49\00:51:38.09
to abort your past
that if this is something
00:51:38.13\00:51:41.56
that is keeping you cripple,
or you're afraid to go there,
00:51:41.60\00:51:45.37
I can tell you
I have been there,
00:51:45.40\00:51:49.40
and I have felt that shame,
00:51:49.44\00:51:52.17
and I have felt that
darkness where there is no hope.
00:51:52.21\00:51:55.48
And now I'm smiling,
and I can cry and smile
00:51:55.51\00:51:59.05
at the same time
because you can live again
00:51:59.08\00:52:02.82
like you thought you
never would be able to.
00:52:02.85\00:52:05.39
You can experience
wholeness and restoration
00:52:05.42\00:52:08.32
like you never
thought you could.
00:52:08.36\00:52:10.26
And it's because of
Jesus, not just His redemption
00:52:10.29\00:52:14.03
but His restoration.
00:52:14.06\00:52:15.80
And if you need to
contact us, please do
00:52:15.83\00:52:18.40
because I can put
you in touch with people
00:52:18.43\00:52:20.84
that can help you
go there 'cause I know
00:52:20.87\00:52:23.20
it's a very scary
place to go sometimes.
00:52:23.24\00:52:25.51
Amen. Thank you both so much.
00:52:25.54\00:52:28.01
What an incredible ministry,
00:52:28.04\00:52:30.25
how God is using
you, and I'm so excited.
00:52:30.28\00:52:32.58
We're going to go to
our news break at this time,
00:52:32.61\00:52:34.45
and then we'll be back
with some closing thoughts.
00:52:34.48\00:52:37.12