What do we do when
we're sinned against,
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and how do we deal with
rejection and bitterness.
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I'm Kathy Matthews and
this is Thinking About Home.
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Today we have Pastor
Evangelist Rick Kuntz
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with us and he is
going to be sharing
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some of the grace of God and how
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it ministered to his
family in dealing with
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some of these
problems, I'm sure that
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you will be able to
relate to some of the pain
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that he's gone
through and before it's over
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I think that he
can share with you
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from the word of
God and from his own
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experience the hope
that we have in God's grace.
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Rick, thank you for
being with us today.
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Great to be with you,
I'm really grateful for
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the opportunity of
sharing with you and those
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who are watching
some of the precious
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experiences that
God has given to me.
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You've had a lot of
experiences with your
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family, haven't you?
And that's what we're
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gonna talk
about, is some of those,
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you had an
adoption, right? Yeah.
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Couple of boys, yeah.
And some experiences that
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you had with your
daughter and all of that.
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So how did God's
grace really minister to you
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in this, just
start from the beginning,
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give us a little background.
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Sure, just as I began
to share some of these
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experiences,
probably one of our greatest
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discouragements in
life is when we live in
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an imperfect environment
especially in our homes,
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if we've received
Christ into our heart and
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we begin to
walk with him because
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we begin to
sense his love for us.
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We want everything to
be good in our home. Right.
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You know we want
there to be joy and peace
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all the time and when
there are struggles and
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failures and difficulties,
it's so easy to get
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discouraged, because
Satan is the accuser of
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the brethren, he
works very hard to beat us
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down to
discouragement so we'll give up.
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And I just thank
God that he is the God
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who restores in
imperfect environments.
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And I think that's a
message that he wants us
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to understand so
much in our homes that
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he's working with us
through the process of
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restoring and
redeeming all of us in our
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fallen condition
and it's a process,
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it doesn't
happen overnight. Right.
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Well my wife and I,
we're married in 1983 and
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we just had a
desire as we were looking
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forward to having
a family of adoption,
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we had wanted to help children
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who are already in the world.
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And so we began to
look. Were you not able to
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have children on
your own or is it just,
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you just wanted to add
to it by having adoption?
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That's a good
question. We were able
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but we had more
of a burden to help
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children who are already here.
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And so what happened
we were in a process of
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adoption and then my
wife got pregnant and
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we had our first little son,
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his name was
Elisha. And we had a tragedy
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right in the beginning of our,
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beginning of our
family because he died
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at eight days old
crib death, crib death.
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One morning we
woke up and he was gone,
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and it was the hardest
time in our whole life.
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But again God is one
who is there for us in our
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greatest heartaches.
What was your age then?
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We were in our early 30s.
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Were you strong in the Lord yet?
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Well we were
stronger than we had
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been in our
beginning, neither my wife nor I
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were born into a
Christian home. Oh I see.
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And we received
Christ and you know
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as we got older in
our early 20's I thank God
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for my mother who
began to study the Bible
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when I was just 7 years old,
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I was in a troubled home.
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My father was an alcoholic,
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but my mom planted
seeds, but I wasn't very opened,
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but God was still planting those
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seeds in my heart, right.
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So we were new
Christians but we weren't brand
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new Christians and so
we knew God as best as
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we were able at
that time we were really
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in our early 30's both
my wife and I were born
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again when we
were in our early 20's.
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So we went through
a process of months of
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pain and heartache over
the loss of our firstborn.
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And so we started the
process of adoption again
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and as we were
nearing a time we had the
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privilege of having
another birth child,
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her name is
Hannah. And she is 13 now.
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All these Bible
names. Yeah, amen.
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She is a real precious girl.
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She is 13 now, 13 now.
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But when she was 2 and
half years old we were able to
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adopt a couple of
boys. And our oldest son was
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10 years old at
the time Carlos and our
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youngest son, they
were four brothers,
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our youngest son
was Rocky, he was
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6 years old at the
time. When you got him?
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When we got them,
when you got them, yeah.
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And we were about
as unprepared for the
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reality of what we
were entering into as we can
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imagine and yet God
saw that we were prepared
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for this new
adventure. And where did you say
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you got them from? They
were from Guatemala, okay.
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They were in an
orphanage down there.
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And the only
thing we knew about them
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they told us that
Carlos liked Bible stories
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and Rocky was all mischievous.
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And so we thought
well this will be pretty
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exciting they all
really be happy to have a
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home and things
are just go over really
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good and we had
quite an awakening
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in our experience.
I bet you've learned
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since then that if
you're gonna help somebody
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with explanations
about something that you go
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into a little
more detail then that.
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Little more detail.
So anyway I could realize
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after about a few
hours I went down to,
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flew down to Guatemala to get,
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pick the boys up I
realized with in a few
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hours that we
were in for some great
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and awesome experiences.
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And within two
weeks I was scheming in my
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mind how to get
rid of these boys.
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It was that intense,
it was, they were like
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vicious animals. I'll
tell you just a few of
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the experiences
that we went through in
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those first months,
our youngest son Rocky
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and we didn't know
it at that the time,
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we learned years
later by experience and
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studying that
he had like autism,
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that's actually
called Aspergers disease.
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And you're gonna
explain to us what that is?
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Yeah. Okay I don't
understand then that.
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Most people know what autism is,
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it's where you're not
able to reason very well,
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you have a
tremendous memory often
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but you are very introverted.
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Well Aspergers is
more of a high functioning
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autistic experience. Is
it more of a fantasy world?
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Yeah, exactly. Okay.
And our son Rocky who was 6
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years old and all
he could was basically
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curse at us in
Spanish, he would take,
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when he was angry, he
was angry most of the time,
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our boys, both of them,
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because they've been
abused. Rocky had been
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sexually abused,
they both been physically
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abused and they were
really bitter and angry.
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We tried to peace
together their past,
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their mother died
when Rocky was just
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an infant of cancer,
and they had a sister
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between them in
age and she disappeared
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shortly after that,
probably into slavery,
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there's a lot of that goes on
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in these other
countries. Oh yeah.
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Actually I think there
is a lot in this country
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as well, more then we may know,
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probably more and more. Yes.
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And so they were
hurting and their father was an
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alcoholic and so
going through the traumas
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that they went through
and there was a time of
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basically living
from hand to mouth,
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living on the
streets maybe we don't know
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all the details but
through the pain and the
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heartache of rejection, abuse,
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emotional trauma of
losing their family at
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young ages these boys
were in a lot of pain.
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And we didn't
understand what that was gonna
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be like to help
them work through.
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So you know in the
beginning and it was like
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Rocky would just,
he would take his feces
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and smear it all over the wall,
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when he was angry with us,
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or urinate all over
his floor just because
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he was so angry at
us. 'Cause he didn't know
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any better, it was
like just kind of a survival
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mechanism on how to, to live in.
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Carlos, our older son
began to do everything in
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his power through
speaking to destroy my wife.
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He just constantly,
was just condemning her and
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putting her down
and tearing her apart.
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So what's going
through your mind and
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her mind during these incidents?
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Well we were just struggling
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terribly after the
first, questioning God?
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Not so much questioning
God I think it was more,
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my wife struggle was
questioning whether it
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was God's will, maybe
that's questioning God.
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I never struggled
with that. My struggle was
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whether I was going to be
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to be willing to
accept God's will.
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I remember after
two, the first two weeks,
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it was a Friday
night and we were up in our
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room, after two
weeks? Yeah, after two weeks.
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And I was scheming
already how to get rid of
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you know these boys
and it wasn't their fault.
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Were you verbalizing
it, did you tell your
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wife that you were
thinking it? Probably not.
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I've come a long
way in being able to
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express my feelings.
Yes. And probably not
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as much as I've learn to do now.
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But I was verbalizing
it to God. That's one of
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the gifts that
God gave me as even
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as a new
Christian. I used to tell God
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how I felt and God's
big enough to listen,
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to handle that. To what we feel,
00:10:03.94\00:10:05.44
and when we were angry with God,
00:10:05.45\00:10:06.74
its very health healing for us
00:10:06.75\00:10:08.85
to express that to him,
00:10:08.86\00:10:10.06
'cause he can take anything,
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his love is unconditional.
00:10:11.62\00:10:12.90
But that night
after two weeks God lead
00:10:13.68\00:10:16.04
me to this promise in
Psalm 61 and verse 1-3
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and I like to share
that, leave it to the rock,
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yeah, it says,
Hear my cry, O God;
00:10:21.99\00:10:24.53
Attend unto my prayer.
00:10:24.54\00:10:25.75
From the end of the
earth will I cry unto you,
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and I was at the end
of my earth that night.
00:10:28.85\00:10:31.68
And then, when my
heart is overwhelmed lead me
00:10:31.98\00:10:35.52
to the rock that is
higher than I, for you
00:10:35.53\00:10:37.91
have been a shelter
for me. God had been
00:10:37.92\00:10:39.74
a shelter for me year
after year, experience
00:10:39.75\00:10:42.68
after experience,
I mean he had done so
00:10:42.69\00:10:44.42
much major heart work in me.
00:10:44.43\00:10:46.77
So he was
reminding you. Yeah, you know
00:10:47.44\00:10:49.10
bringing me back
again to that point of
00:10:49.11\00:10:51.28
surrender and so
was that night, it was a
00:10:51.29\00:10:53.40
Friday night and I
just had the joy, I didn't
00:10:53.41\00:10:56.66
feel like joy but
the joy in my heart,
00:10:56.67\00:10:58.63
was totally
releasing and accepting God's
00:10:58.64\00:11:01.96
presence in that
difficult circumstance
00:11:01.97\00:11:05.66
and that night
was another watershed,
00:11:05.67\00:11:07.79
I've had thousands of
them in my experience.
00:11:07.80\00:11:09.99
There was another
watershed in my life and
00:11:10.37\00:11:11.90
I just praised God
that he just brought me
00:11:11.91\00:11:15.84
again to Jesus
over and over again.
00:11:15.85\00:11:17.69
You know that's
what he does to all of us
00:11:17.70\00:11:19.05
if we're willing, he
brings us back to himself.
00:11:19.06\00:11:21.34
His loving self, he
is there to help us.
00:11:21.77\00:11:23.75
This was my mission
I didn't give up. Amen.
00:11:23.76\00:11:26.09
That's right. And so
we continue to go on.
00:11:26.10\00:11:28.74
My wife after a
couple of months lost about
00:11:28.75\00:11:30.85
20 pounds I mean
she was near a nervous
00:11:30.86\00:11:32.91
breakdown because you know
00:11:32.92\00:11:34.49
this thing didn't led up.
00:11:34.50\00:11:35.80
Probably for the first
three years it was like
00:11:36.56\00:11:38.61
a torrent of rain and hurricane
00:11:39.58\00:11:43.21
just for three years.
00:11:43.22\00:11:44.20
I mean the abuse didn't stop;
00:11:44.21\00:11:47.33
it just kept
coming because again these
00:11:47.69\00:11:49.80
boys were hurting.
And our little girl
00:11:49.81\00:11:51.96
was only 2 and half
years of age at the time
00:11:51.97\00:11:54.52
when we adopted them. Okay.
00:11:54.53\00:11:55.90
I was gonna ask you
how was it affecting
00:11:57.01\00:11:58.17
your daughter. Well
she was so excited when
00:11:58.18\00:12:00.53
they came you know
she was just, you know
00:12:00.54\00:12:02.94
she share about
how she wanted to.
00:12:02.95\00:12:04.55
You know, have these
little brothers, these
00:12:05.21\00:12:07.20
new brothers and it
wasn't like having a
00:12:07.21\00:12:08.75
little baby
brother. And these two boys
00:12:08.76\00:12:11.51
came in like a raging
storm, and she is only
00:12:11.52\00:12:14.49
2 and half years of
age and they rejected
00:12:14.50\00:12:16.85
her in many ways, in many times.
00:12:16.86\00:12:19.00
So her heart was
wounded and you know
00:12:19.86\00:12:23.01
through God's grace
over and over again.
00:12:23.02\00:12:24.95
Hardly a one time
event. That's right.
00:12:25.28\00:12:27.53
She was willing,
she didn't understand
00:12:27.54\00:12:30.10
God's grace but she
was willing to allow
00:12:30.11\00:12:32.30
God's grace to
forgive them and to try again
00:12:32.31\00:12:36.03
and to offer, you
know again, they can be
00:12:36.04\00:12:39.82
resilient, can't
they? Try and try again.
00:12:39.83\00:12:42.27
Yeah it's amazing.
So you know we went
00:12:42.28\00:12:44.84
through and then the
few months after that
00:12:44.85\00:12:47.67
my wife said to
me, she says, see Rick,
00:12:47.68\00:12:50.99
I just I don't know, you
know, I don't know I Just,
00:12:51.00\00:12:54.88
I'm really struggling,
can I go on and she says
00:12:55.26\00:12:58.34
I just don't know if
I can love these boys.
00:12:58.35\00:13:00.42
This was just a few
months into it now. Yeah.
00:13:00.92\00:13:03.28
Okay. And, you know
God had been teaching me
00:13:03.29\00:13:06.23
for years before the
concept that he can create
00:13:07.21\00:13:12.28
in us his love and
his patience and his
00:13:12.29\00:13:15.71
forgiveness, we
can't originate any thing
00:13:15.72\00:13:17.92
that's good ourselves.
It does not come naturally,
00:13:17.93\00:13:19.98
does it? It does, no
and we don't have any of
00:13:19.99\00:13:22.11
it within us of ourselves.
It's all gonna be some
00:13:22.12\00:13:24.87
connecting with
God through faith.
00:13:24.88\00:13:26.50
And so I shared with
him and I said you know God
00:13:26.83\00:13:28.86
can create his love
in our hearts for these
00:13:30.83\00:13:33.58
boys and I said these
boys may never change.
00:13:33.59\00:13:35.85
And here you know at
this time I was working
00:13:36.63\00:13:39.38
as a pastor. And you
know. A well ordered family.
00:13:39.39\00:13:43.16
Yeah. And the
expectations of people in
00:13:43.17\00:13:46.28
the religious
community is that the pastor
00:13:46.76\00:13:48.82
and his family are
perfect or pretty close to it.
00:13:48.83\00:13:51.84
It should be. You
know there are, first time
00:13:51.85\00:13:54.03
I remember, the
first time we took our boys
00:13:54.04\00:13:55.60
to church and they
just, they couldn't sit still.
00:13:55.61\00:14:00.35
They were like
vicious wild animals.
00:14:00.82\00:14:02.74
And it was an amazing experience
00:14:03.12\00:14:05.31
but a little by
little God helped us to train
00:14:05.32\00:14:07.82
them, our son Rocky
he liked to do puzzles,
00:14:07.83\00:14:10.12
'cause he's
autistic. And so we would
00:14:10.13\00:14:12.32
bring a puzzle to
church and let him do it
00:14:12.33\00:14:14.81
on the floor on the
aisle, while we were
00:14:14.82\00:14:16.54
doing and so he was
quiet during the service.
00:14:16.55\00:14:19.98
He was able to be
quiet, that's right,
00:14:19.99\00:14:21.37
doing a puzzle.
That's right. And you know
00:14:21.38\00:14:23.54
all these things that
kind of the expectations
00:14:23.55\00:14:28.69
that we put into
each other you know.
00:14:28.70\00:14:30.50
Because in the
Christian community we have
00:14:30.81\00:14:33.24
this tendency, well if
you're really a Christian
00:14:33.25\00:14:36.07
then your kids will,
you know they'll do good or
00:14:36.48\00:14:40.22
if you're really
a Christian parent,
00:14:40.23\00:14:41.56
so you'll train your
children so they're good.
00:14:41.57\00:14:45.98
And I was
struggling with a lot of guilt
00:14:46.43\00:14:48.09
during this time.
Well you were knowing that,
00:14:48.10\00:14:49.98
before you ever
get to Church. Yeah.
00:14:50.77\00:14:52.31
Knowing that these
expectations are going
00:14:52.32\00:14:54.13
to be there and they're
not unusual expectations,
00:14:54.14\00:14:57.71
people are looking to
the Pastor for guidance
00:14:58.10\00:15:00.48
and things of like
that but didn't the local
00:15:00.49\00:15:02.77
community
understand that you had gotten
00:15:02.78\00:15:05.35
them from the
background that they came from.
00:15:05.36\00:15:07.57
Some did and some
chose not to. I see,
00:15:07.58\00:15:10.32
and you know for me
it was such a blessing
00:15:10.33\00:15:12.99
because it showed me how my head
00:15:13.00\00:15:15.37
had been in clouds.
You know because as a
00:15:15.78\00:15:18.37
new Christian I
kind of thought well God
00:15:18.38\00:15:20.18
changed me and I
didn't realize it was
00:15:20.19\00:15:22.25
the beginning of change.
00:15:22.26\00:15:23.44
I've a lot you know, he
was still working on me.
00:15:23.45\00:15:26.23
You know but it's
like, I had this idea if you
00:15:26.24\00:15:29.30
got in trouble you
know, we got trouble
00:15:29.31\00:15:31.72
if your kids will
read this book or you know
00:15:31.73\00:15:34.04
follow these Bible
principles and that'll
00:15:34.05\00:15:35.53
straighten out the
kids. And so I was struggling
00:15:35.54\00:15:38.31
with guilt and I think
in the Christian community
00:15:38.32\00:15:41.47
God is trying to help
us understand what the
00:15:42.08\00:15:44.11
grace works in a
process with each one of us.
00:15:44.12\00:15:47.13
And having good
behavior that people can see
00:15:47.77\00:15:51.70
is not really the issue
here. The real issue was
00:15:52.78\00:15:55.40
letting God work on
the hearts of our children.
00:15:55.75\00:15:57.95
For transformation.
That's right, because until
00:15:57.96\00:15:59.96
the heart is softened
and the heart is moved
00:15:59.97\00:16:02.90
and the heart is
drawn out towards God.
00:16:02.91\00:16:05.07
You know looking
to have good behavior
00:16:06.22\00:16:08.60
is gonna almost work
against that if the heart
00:16:08.61\00:16:11.73
is not open.
Right. We need a God word
00:16:11.74\00:16:13.55
orientation from
inside out. Amen.
00:16:13.56\00:16:16.15
And that's where
God began to help me
00:16:16.51\00:16:18.76
as far as working
with children and how to
00:16:18.77\00:16:21.53
understand you
know how to work things
00:16:21.54\00:16:23.68
that other parents
go through too. Right.
00:16:23.69\00:16:25.61
With the difficulty on
trying to instill in the
00:16:25.62\00:16:28.51
boys and your daughter
the desire to know God.
00:16:28.52\00:16:31.21
Yeah. How did you
get that desire in them?
00:16:31.90\00:16:34.44
Well that's what God
began to challenge me with
00:16:35.10\00:16:38.59
trying to figure
out, 'cause I didn't know.
00:16:38.60\00:16:40.10
You know. I didn't
have any answers anymore.
00:16:40.51\00:16:42.96
All the Bible
promises weren't working.
00:16:43.66\00:16:45.44
You know, I mean all
the grace of God wasn't
00:16:45.81\00:16:48.30
working and
that's where when you're
00:16:48.31\00:16:51.30
that close in a
family you can either run
00:16:51.31\00:16:54.47
away or you can
force submission which is
00:16:54.48\00:16:58.68
only gonna
harden the hearts more.
00:16:58.69\00:17:00.29
Or you can give up
and give up on God.
00:17:00.75\00:17:04.24
You know but none of
those were an option to me.
00:17:05.48\00:17:08.13
Right. Because I
recognize that for
00:17:08.14\00:17:09.74
submission was of
no value. You know
00:17:09.75\00:17:12.18
because their hearts
were hurting, it was a
00:17:12.64\00:17:14.14
heart issue. Well
but you said that the
00:17:14.15\00:17:16.07
God's grace wasn't
working, all his promises
00:17:16.08\00:17:17.69
weren't working,
that's what it looked like.
00:17:17.70\00:17:19.02
'Cause they working in
a process. That's right.
00:17:19.03\00:17:20.46
It didn't work that
way. They weren't working
00:17:20.47\00:17:21.62
in the moment. That's
right. And I began to see
00:17:21.63\00:17:25.06
that and so God
began to open my eyes
00:17:25.07\00:17:29.20
and the eyes of my wife
to understand this thing
00:17:29.21\00:17:32.40
in a bigger
picture that in our homes
00:17:32.41\00:17:35.70
when we're dealing
with difficult circumstances
00:17:36.47\00:17:39.93
because let's face
it, most homes today
00:17:39.94\00:17:41.90
are less in ideal.
You know most homes
00:17:42.36\00:17:45.13
today are you know
single parent families
00:17:45.14\00:17:50.07
or there is a
mixture of children from one
00:17:50.43\00:17:54.12
you know from a step
family situation that's
00:17:54.13\00:17:58.42
mixed together and most
homes have a lot of pain.
00:17:58.43\00:18:01.70
The parents have pain,
and a lot of the children
00:18:02.31\00:18:06.04
are growing up with
the pain of rejection
00:18:06.49\00:18:08.50
and so it was like
God put me in a learning
00:18:08.51\00:18:13.16
environment so I
could begin to understand
00:18:13.17\00:18:15.89
how he works in
situations that seem hopeless.
00:18:15.90\00:18:19.46
Right. And we in a
Christian community
00:18:19.47\00:18:22.35
have a tendency to
write off people and
00:18:22.88\00:18:27.70
families that
don't change quickly and
00:18:27.71\00:18:30.73
we tend to think
well they're not really
00:18:30.74\00:18:32.48
Christians or they're
not really trying hard
00:18:32.49\00:18:34.87
enough or they don't
really have faith and
00:18:34.88\00:18:37.51
through all this
experience God was
00:18:37.52\00:18:39.84
opening me up and helping me to
00:18:39.85\00:18:41.37
understand just the
reality of life, you know
00:18:41.38\00:18:46.11
as God working with his
grace. And so as we were
00:18:46.12\00:18:50.52
going through this
process God began to more
00:18:50.53\00:18:54.72
and more help me to
understand what love
00:18:54.73\00:18:57.58
really is, that's
right. Because God,
00:18:57.59\00:19:00.22
I experienced God
mercy to accept me as a
00:19:00.23\00:19:03.45
rebellious messed
up young person, I mean
00:19:03.46\00:19:07.32
I was out of control, you know.
00:19:07.33\00:19:10.03
And I experienced
his mercy in such an
00:19:10.46\00:19:13.81
awesome way that
I tended to focus on
00:19:13.82\00:19:15.78
love being all
mercy. Yes. And now God
00:19:15.79\00:19:18.94
was showing me that
love still has mercy
00:19:18.95\00:19:21.81
but also has
justice, yes, and I began to
00:19:21.82\00:19:23.94
understand that working with my
00:19:23.95\00:19:26.09
children I had to
have discipline, yes.
00:19:26.10\00:19:29.29
But God was showing
me that I had to be given
00:19:29.30\00:19:32.09
tenderness and
kindness and, and lengthy,
00:19:32.10\00:19:35.58
yeah overtime, long suffering.
00:19:35.59\00:19:37.79
And I begin to
see that I didn't have
00:19:38.23\00:19:41.00
that kind of love.
That kind of patience
00:19:41.01\00:19:43.24
for parents. I didn't
have it. I didn't have it.
00:19:43.68\00:19:46.01
And I failed at times,
you know I am not gonna
00:19:46.02\00:19:47.99
tell anybody that,
you know I sailed through
00:19:48.00\00:19:50.19
this, it was a learning
experience and I failed,
00:19:50.20\00:19:52.93
I was impatient the
times with my children.
00:19:52.94\00:19:54.78
So God was teaching,
00:19:54.79\00:19:55.76
polishing you and
your wife. I tell you what;
00:19:55.77\00:19:58.37
I believe that was
one of the most important
00:19:58.38\00:20:01.56
reasons that God led
us to adopt these boys.
00:20:01.57\00:20:04.39
To change my understanding,
to show me what God
00:20:04.80\00:20:07.69
really is and how we
works in impossible situations.
00:20:07.70\00:20:11.42
Right. Just an awesome, awesome,
00:20:11.43\00:20:13.80
you know experience
that we were having and so
00:20:14.30\00:20:17.48
experiencing
God's love for people
00:20:17.49\00:20:19.63
through his grace,
through his creative
00:20:20.48\00:20:22.14
power, he creates that
love in us and patience.
00:20:22.15\00:20:24.14
In the midst of circumstances
00:20:24.52\00:20:27.06
that seem hopeless.
It's such a powerful tool
00:20:27.07\00:20:30.39
in God's hands
to change people who
00:20:30.40\00:20:32.73
are in rebellion,
who may seem hopeless,
00:20:32.74\00:20:35.75
who may seen totally
closed. God is able to
00:20:35.76\00:20:40.47
work as we allow
him to work through us.
00:20:40.48\00:20:42.78
So often we want God to
change our circumstances
00:20:42.79\00:20:45.65
so we can be
Christians, more comfortable.
00:20:45.97\00:20:47.88
Yeah, that's
right. And God is working
00:20:47.89\00:20:50.01
to change our
hearts so we can be
00:20:50.02\00:20:52.69
something to bless
others in their bad
00:20:52.70\00:20:55.55
circumstances that
we find ourselves in.
00:20:55.56\00:20:57.42
You know Rick we
went through a serious
00:20:57.43\00:20:59.10
thing about five years
ago, and I won't go into
00:20:59.11\00:21:01.37
any details because
this is your story but
00:21:01.38\00:21:03.50
there was a
scripture that came back to us
00:21:03.51\00:21:05.20
over and over after
that and I think it was in
00:21:05.60\00:21:07.76
Second Corinthians
and it had to do with
00:21:07.77\00:21:10.89
comforting others,
amen, as God has comforted us.
00:21:11.84\00:21:14.99
Amen. And that
scripture popped up in
00:21:15.00\00:21:18.45
the most mysterious
ways to me so I can see
00:21:18.46\00:21:21.76
that happening
in your life. Amen.
00:21:21.77\00:21:23.28
Learning that God
has comforted you Rick,
00:21:23.65\00:21:26.89
amen, now you have
to learn through your
00:21:26.90\00:21:29.32
experience as to do
this to others, amen.
00:21:29.33\00:21:31.90
And that's such a
rich experience you know
00:21:32.29\00:21:34.59
I believe the
greatest gift that God can
00:21:34.60\00:21:37.47
ever give to us is to
be able to experience his
00:21:37.48\00:21:40.74
love for those who
are hardened, for those
00:21:40.75\00:21:44.56
that are harsh, for
those that are knurled
00:21:44.57\00:21:47.31
and twisted and
damaged in their situation
00:21:47.32\00:21:52.33
that's a, to me
that's the greatest gift
00:21:52.34\00:21:53.66
that God can give to us.
00:21:53.67\00:21:54.67
We tend to give up too easy.
00:21:54.68\00:21:56.07
Now I have to remind
myself and our family
00:21:57.00\00:22:01.17
we have to remind
each other that expand
00:22:01.18\00:22:03.54
your comfort zone, amen.
00:22:03.55\00:22:04.96
And we all like to do
that. And don't give up.
00:22:06.04\00:22:07.98
Amen. Don't give up.
Amen. And now you had
00:22:07.99\00:22:10.68
something to say about ease.
00:22:10.69\00:22:12.21
I would like for you to expand
00:22:12.22\00:22:13.70
on that just a little
bit. Yeah. Well one of the
00:22:13.71\00:22:16.13
idols, you know we
all struggle the second
00:22:17.19\00:22:19.76
commandment, first
of ten commandments
00:22:19.77\00:22:21.18
says Thou Shalt
Not Have Any other Gods
00:22:21.19\00:22:22.99
before you and then
it says you are not make
00:22:23.00\00:22:24.82
any graving
images. And one of the most
00:22:24.83\00:22:27.39
common idols in
the Christian community
00:22:27.40\00:22:30.70
is the idol of
ease. Many, many people
00:22:31.47\00:22:34.81
want an
experience with God without
00:22:34.82\00:22:37.30
being willing to be
out there in the trenches
00:22:37.31\00:22:40.43
in the world's need,
out there where people
00:22:40.82\00:22:44.39
hurting and struggling
and they feel hopeless
00:22:44.40\00:22:47.24
many people in
Christian community,
00:22:47.62\00:22:49.10
it's our fallen humans
that wants us to distance
00:22:49.87\00:22:53.08
ourselves from jumping
in and getting involved
00:22:53.09\00:22:57.23
because it's painful,
yes it is. And we take
00:22:57.24\00:23:00.38
a lot of rejection
and a lot of abuse,
00:23:00.39\00:23:02.22
that's
inconvenient, that's right.
00:23:02.23\00:23:03.49
It's nerve-racking,
that's right. And our human
00:23:03.50\00:23:06.58
nature doesn't
naturally, it's not naturally
00:23:06.59\00:23:09.71
inclined to be involved.
But if we hold ourselves
00:23:09.72\00:23:13.86
back from being
willing to be out there to let
00:23:13.87\00:23:18.73
God's healing
love flows through us,
00:23:18.74\00:23:20.58
to touch the damaged
people around us then
00:23:20.59\00:23:23.60
we really aren't Christians.
00:23:24.06\00:23:25.44
You know that's a
strong statement but that's
00:23:25.77\00:23:27.65
the reality of God's
love, as it moved him to
00:23:27.66\00:23:30.28
do something.
That's right. And go ahead,
00:23:30.29\00:23:32.93
you want to, I want
you to continue here but I
00:23:32.94\00:23:35.66
want to invite
our audience to do
00:23:35.67\00:23:37.37
something first. While
I'm doing that think of
00:23:37.38\00:23:40.32
an experience that
may be that you can share
00:23:40.33\00:23:43.14
in the last few
minutes that really was
00:23:43.15\00:23:46.09
nerve-racking for
you possibly you were
00:23:46.10\00:23:48.09
going into that
earlier, yeah, and I stopped
00:23:48.10\00:23:50.14
you but I think of that
while I'm doing this, sure.
00:23:50.15\00:23:53.33
And I want to
invite our audience that if
00:23:53.34\00:23:55.84
in the future and you
want to hear about some
00:23:55.85\00:23:58.98
topic that might be
we haven't covered on
00:23:58.99\00:24:01.07
Thinking About
Home to write or call
00:24:01.08\00:24:03.58
3ABN and that's
3ABN, P.O Box 220,
00:24:03.59\00:24:07.67
West Frankfort,
Illinois 62896 and let me give
00:24:07.68\00:24:12.27
you that 800 number
it's 1-800-752-3226,
00:24:12.28\00:24:17.22
that's
1-800-752-3226 and call or write
00:24:17.23\00:24:21.90
3ABN and mention
Thinking About Home
00:24:21.91\00:24:24.43
for some future topic
that you may would like
00:24:24.44\00:24:27.21
to hear us try to
cover, I can't guarantee that
00:24:27.22\00:24:29.88
we'll cover all but
we will try and I hope
00:24:29.89\00:24:33.34
that we can hear from you soon.
00:24:33.35\00:24:35.56
Now Rick have you
thought of anything.
00:24:35.57\00:24:37.00
Yeah I would like to
share a little experience
00:24:37.01\00:24:38.88
that just came
through my mind. Our son Rocky
00:24:38.89\00:24:41.90
was 6 when we
adopted the boys and
00:24:41.91\00:24:44.49
neither of boys can
speak English and we
00:24:44.94\00:24:47.30
didn't know any
Spanish so that was
00:24:47.31\00:24:48.82
interesting in and
of itself. But we began
00:24:48.83\00:24:51.02
to learn few Spanish words and
00:24:51.03\00:24:52.76
communicate a little
bit. Well we didn't know
00:24:52.77\00:24:55.45
that he had Aspergers
disease and for whole year
00:24:55.46\00:24:58.90
he basically lived
in a fantasy world.
00:24:58.91\00:25:00.87
He didn't talk
about anything real,
00:25:01.58\00:25:03.30
but we didn't
understand we thought it might
00:25:03.31\00:25:05.22
have been the
trauma we weren't going,
00:25:05.23\00:25:06.66
we didn't have any
counseling at the time,
00:25:06.67\00:25:08.30
we're living in
West Virginia and
00:25:08.31\00:25:09.81
we're very poor at the
time. So we're just trying
00:25:09.82\00:25:13.04
to survive
really and emotionally,
00:25:13.05\00:25:14.97
you know the whole
thing. So one day I came
00:25:14.98\00:25:19.12
down from upstairs
and some friends of
00:25:19.13\00:25:21.63
ours we're taking care
of their fish and Rocky
00:25:21.64\00:25:23.76
had gotten over to
the aquarium and he taken
00:25:23.77\00:25:26.35
some of the fish out
and of course they died.
00:25:26.36\00:25:29.20
And you know I felt
upset about that and again
00:25:29.95\00:25:33.81
I didn't know, I
didn't understand you know,
00:25:33.82\00:25:36.84
he didn't know any better.
00:25:36.85\00:25:38.26
But God is trying to
help us as we work with
00:25:38.95\00:25:43.06
each other to not
be so sure that we know
00:25:43.07\00:25:46.44
where the other person's at.
00:25:47.52\00:25:48.81
And so you know we
had a little time together
00:25:49.67\00:25:52.18
there and Rocky and
I and the Holy Spirit
00:25:52.19\00:25:55.22
just impressed me,
to just put Rocky on my
00:25:55.23\00:25:57.56
shoulders and go
for a walk with him.
00:25:58.74\00:26:00.60
And so I put him on
my shoulders and we,
00:26:01.48\00:26:03.26
you know went for a
walk together and it was
00:26:03.62\00:26:05.36
like the power of
God just came upon him
00:26:05.37\00:26:10.13
and it was like a
little break, it was like
00:26:10.85\00:26:12.72
somehow he felt
some love, having on my
00:26:13.50\00:26:17.97
shoulder and he
started talking, and he knew
00:26:17.98\00:26:19.65
a little bit of
English by this time
00:26:19.66\00:26:21.17
this is probably
after about a year or so,
00:26:21.18\00:26:22.84
I don't remember
exactly. And he said,
00:26:22.85\00:26:25.06
and he called
me Papi, that's the
00:26:25.07\00:26:27.67
Spanish word
for Daddy. And he go
00:26:28.07\00:26:30.92
Papi, Papi and
then he, you know say a
00:26:30.93\00:26:33.28
few words in English
and it was kind of like
00:26:33.29\00:26:35.54
a magical moment,
because. One of those windows.
00:26:35.55\00:26:38.58
Yeah one of those
windows into his heart by God
00:26:39.91\00:26:42.36
and I think it was the
bonding process of love
00:26:42.77\00:26:45.32
because Carlos, his
older brother told us that
00:26:45.33\00:26:48.09
because they didn't
know down in Guatemala
00:26:48.65\00:26:50.11
they didn't know
that he has this handicap.
00:26:50.12\00:26:53.04
I see. And so he was
a type of person that
00:26:53.45\00:26:55.66
I mean he was just
the most irritating,
00:26:56.11\00:26:58.25
he do everything he
could to smash things,
00:26:59.52\00:27:02.35
he would destroy
things and I mean incredible
00:27:02.36\00:27:05.97
things that he do.
And yet down there in
00:27:05.98\00:27:09.12
Guatemala, Carlos said
that he would just take
00:27:09.13\00:27:11.71
his head and smash,
he didn't, but they would
00:27:11.72\00:27:15.01
smashed his head
against the cement wall down
00:27:15.02\00:27:17.15
there, 'cause
they were so angry.
00:27:17.16\00:27:18.91
And so that little bit
of love him on my shoulder
00:27:19.31\00:27:22.20
you know God was
beginning a little by
00:27:22.95\00:27:25.08
little to heal
his wounded heart.
00:27:25.09\00:27:26.66
And he polished you, didn't he,
00:27:26.67\00:27:28.19
during all of this. And
now I tell people I'm not
00:27:28.20\00:27:30.85
very smooth now but
boy you should have seen
00:27:31.36\00:27:33.09
me before I was a rough stone.
00:27:33.10\00:27:34.43
And Rick we're going
to have to finish now
00:27:35.25\00:27:36.84
and will you have
prayer for us, sure.
00:27:36.85\00:27:38.94
Father in heaven,
we thank you so much
00:27:40.15\00:27:42.03
that you're a God
who delights in mercy and
00:27:42.04\00:27:46.20
that you're a God
that comes near to your
00:27:46.21\00:27:49.89
children even
when we're in rebellion
00:27:49.90\00:27:52.08
against you, you come
near to us, seeking to
00:27:52.09\00:27:54.67
draw our hearts
that we may see how
00:27:55.61\00:27:57.30
much you love us and Father,
00:27:57.31\00:27:58.67
we thank you
that you're healing.
00:27:58.68\00:28:00.07