All right, Revelation 11...
we've done the introduction,
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we've left off
with that cliffhanger
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we're right there,
ready to jump in to this...
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this verse that
describes these two olive trees,
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these two candlesticks,
these two witnesses
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and all that
they're doing in the earth
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and it is very symbolic,
the symbols here have meaning
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that's going to be
brought out through the Bible,
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different Bible
verses are going to tell us
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what the meaning of this is,
so it's going to be really easy
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once we get this symbolism
identified with the Bible
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and then we're going to
see how it applies in history.
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That's how we work,
that's our modus operandi...
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so, that's where
we need to be going.
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Before we go to the
Bible though, Jason,
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can you give a
word of prayer for us?
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Jason: Sure,
"Dear Heavenly Father,
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we thank you for
blessing us with the opportunity
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to study your Word,
we wouldn't dare study it
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without asking
for the Holy Spirit
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to be in our midst and
to lead us into all truth,
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please also fill our Viewers'
and Listeners' homes as well
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with the presence
of your Holy Spirit
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lead them into
all truth as well,
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in Jesus' name we
pray, amen. " All: "Amen. "
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All right,
what's with this verse,
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"These are the two olive trees,
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and the two candlesticks
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standing before the
God of all the earth. "
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Olive trees... candlesticks...
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candlesticks sounds
like sanctuary language,
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olive trees... what is this?
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Ivor: So we're in verse 4,
let's turn back to verse 3,
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just for a moment
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and I think it would be
good for us to talk about
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what's out there...
concerning these two witnesses.
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So when you read verse 3,
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"I will give power
unto my two witnesses,
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and they shall prophesy
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a thousand two
hundred and threescore days,
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clothed in sackcloth. "
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I think that's an important
verse we need to unpack,
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there are a lot of
people... a lot of Christians
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that believe that
at the end of time
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there are going to be...
these two special witnesses
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that are going
to have power to...
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James: Bring
plagues on the earth...
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Ivor: Yeah, bring
plagues on the earth...
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and this will happen at the end
of a so-called seven-year period
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these three and a half years
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they'll be
turning water to blood,
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they'll be calling
fire down from heaven...
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some people think
because we're going to see
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that Elijah called
fire down from heaven,
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Moses turned water to blood
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and they think that
there will be Moses and Elijah
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that return...
Yvonne: Yeah, yeah.
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Ivor: So, there
are various views
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on who these two
witnesses actually are,
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in terms of... at
the end of time...
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this is why, I said
in the earlier program
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that understanding time
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in the book of
Revelation is crucial.
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Yvonne: Hmmm...
James: Hmmm... hmmm...
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Ivor: When we see that
this is the time period...
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the same time
period as the Dark Ages,
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that a day in Bible
prophecy equals a year,
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that there really is
only one time prophecy
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in the entire book
of Daniel and Revelation
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and it's the 2,300-Day prophecy,
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a day equals a year...
all the other time prophecies
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are sub-sections
of these prophecies,
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which means that by nature,
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because we know the 2,300
days are actually 2,300 years
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by nature... these other
prophecies will equal years.
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This is 1,260 years...
nobody lives for 1,260 years
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therefore, we cannot...
that automatically rules out
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that these are two
individuals, right?
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Yvonne: Well, unless
it's Elijah who was translated
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and Moses who was
raised from the dead
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I mean, because I was
going to ask about that.
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James: That's a good
question. Yvonne: So...
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James: Because they
appeared to Jesus once.
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Ivor: Right.
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Yvonne: Yeah, yeah, at the
Mount of transfiguration, so...
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James: But I think
Ivor's point is still good,
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Ivor's point is
still good, let's just say,
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this was Moses and Elijah,
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are they coming
back for a 1,260 years?
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Ivor: Exactly...
so... they are on the earth
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okay, you're going to see
that these... that these...
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James: Yvonne still has a
question... so what is it?
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Yvonne: They
would be coming back
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at the end of the
1,260-year period, right?
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Not, for a thousand and...
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James: "I will give
power unto my two witnesses,
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and they shall prophesy a
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thousand two hundred
and threescore days... "
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Yvonne: Oh, so they would
actually... okay... prophesy...
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James: The whole
time... but you know what?
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I just want to make a point here
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so, Yvonne, that was
a really good question
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and then what do we do?
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We went back to the Bible
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to get
clarification for that question
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and the Bible kind of
says, "Wait a minute...
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in order for us to identify
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these symbols and
who these guys are,
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or who these witnesses are,
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they have to
meet every criteria,
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they have to meet all of the...
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the characteristics
that are identified here,
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they could meet...
they could actually qualify
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because Moses... yeah and Elijah
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both brought
down fire from heaven,
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they both turned water into...
that's... that's a qualification
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but they're missing
another qualification
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and that is this
1,260-year period,
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they got to prophesy
for the whole time...
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ah! that excludes
them, well then, who is it?
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And so, when we
study Bible prophecy,
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that's what we have to do,
we want to look for Bible verses
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and stories and
illustrations that would fit
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but if they don't meet
all the characteristics,
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we have to keep looking...
examine it and keep looking.
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Yvonne: So, what would
you say to people who would
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say, oh you have a point?
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Ivor: Let's go to verse 7
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and I'm going to show
you something right here.
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Yvonne: Okay, okay.
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Ivor: To make it
definitive, right.
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Yvonne: Okay...
Ivor: Okay, verse 7...
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"When they shall have
finished their testimony... "
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that means...
towards the 1,260 years,
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"the beast that ascendeth
out of the bottomless pit
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shall make war against them,
and shall overcome them... "
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and... what? All: "Kill them. "
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Yvonne: Hmmm... James: Hmmm...
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Ivor: Yeah, they're immortal,
right? They already have...
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James: Another
characteristic they can't meet.
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Ivor: Right. Yvonne: Right.
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Ivor: So, now we know that...
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okay, we know it can't
be two living individuals,
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you know, people
that have not died...
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James:
Especially Moses and Elijah.
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Ivor: Right, we know it can't
be Moses and Elijah... why?
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because, even if it
were Moses and Elijah,
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they can't die...
you see what I'm saying?
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Yvonne: Right, right...
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Ivor: So, we eliminated
the possibility of this being
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any normal, you know,
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any prophet that
is born among men,
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a human being that
has not gone to heaven,
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we've eliminated the fact that
it can't be Moses and Elijah
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who ascended...
because they die.
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All: Hmmm... hmmm...
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Ivor: So, one of the
things we were talking about
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in the previous
program is how the temple...
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I'm sorry, the Holy
City... is spiritual...
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it's not the literal Holy City,
it's spiritual Jerusalem, right?
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It's the church... okay,
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so, again, understanding
the book of Revelation,
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is highly symbolic,
we have two options,
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either these two
witnesses are literal people,
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or it is something
symbolic and once we exclude
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any normal person because
normal people don't live...
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any human being
doesn't live 1,260 years...
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once we exclude Moses and
Elijah because they don't die...
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then we are... what are we
left with? We've got to turn to
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"Well, this must be
symbolic" makes sense?
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Yvonne: Hmmm...
hmmm... Ivor: So...
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Jason: I have a
question... Ivor: Yeah.
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Jason: Okay, so
going back to verse 4,
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these are "the two olive
trees and the two candlesticks
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standing before
the God of the earth. "
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Are these two of
the seven churches?
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Is that what
the... candlesticks?
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Ivor: Let's come to
that, let's come to that,
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I want to show you something
else... back in verse 3,
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we're going to
answer this question,
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in verse 3, it says,
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"they prophesy... and
they're clothed in sackcloth"
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James: "Clothed
in sackcloth," yeah.
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Ivor: Clothed in sackcloth, so,
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what does sackcloth
represent in the Bible?
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Yvonne: Mourning...
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Ivor: It represents
mourning, so you'll remember...
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James: Esther
3:13... talks about that.
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Ivor: Yeah... when
Jacob... when they told Jacob,
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"Hey, Joseph
died... " the Bible says,
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"He put sackcloth on
himself and he mourned. "
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So, sackcloth... you look
over and over in the Bible
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it is a symbol of
mourning, of like, just...
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a dark experience...
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and so, whatever
these two witnesses are,
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they are going...
during this 1,260 years,
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it is a period of
mourning, it is...
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they're doing their work under
great distress, if you will.
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James: Yeah, let me get
a couple of verses on this,
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real quick... just so
our Viewers have these,
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this is Esther 3:13, it says,
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"And the king's
letters were sent by courier
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into all the king's provinces,
to destroy and to kill,
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and to
annihilate all the Jews. "
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We're not going to
look at the whole story here
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but basically, this is the
time when the Jews are basically
00:09:03.97\00:09:07.11
slated for death,
they're just going to be killed,
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"And both young and old,
little children and women,
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in one day, on the thirteenth
day of the twelfth month,
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which is the month of Adar,
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and to plunder their possessions
and to every province
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where the king's
command and decree arrived,
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there was great
mourning among the Jews
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with fasting, weeping, wailing,
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and many lay in
sackcloth and ashes. "
00:09:24.69\00:09:26.80
So, sackcloth and ashes indicate
mourning, weeping, wailing
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because there were
great calamities taking place
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persecution is taking
place according to Esther 3:13
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and chapter 4 and verse 3.
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Ivor: Right, so these then,
this would again point us to...
00:09:37.91\00:09:43.71
parallels perfectly with
00:09:43.75\00:09:45.31
what's going on
during the Dark Ages, okay,
00:09:45.35\00:09:48.02
so, we're looking
for these two witnesses,
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they're not humans...
00:09:50.72\00:09:52.09
we're looking for them doing
their work under great distress
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it's a time of persecution
and so what are our options?
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I mean, like, these
are His Two Witnesses,
00:10:02.30\00:10:06.84
right, so let me
ask you a question,
00:10:06.87\00:10:08.60
what do witnesses do?
00:10:08.64\00:10:11.31
James: Testify...
00:10:11.34\00:10:13.94
Ivor: They testify... you
call a witness to the stand,
00:10:13.98\00:10:17.31
what's the witness
going to do? Testify, okay,
00:10:17.35\00:10:20.15
so whose witnesses are these?
James and Yvonne: God's...
00:10:20.18\00:10:22.48
Ivor: These are God's
witnesses, Christ's witnesses,
00:10:22.52\00:10:24.75
so, we would ask
the question then,
00:10:24.79\00:10:26.15
we can ask Jesus
Himself, maybe... like,
00:10:26.19\00:10:28.96
"Hey, Jesus, who...
who are your witnesses?
00:10:28.99\00:10:32.26
Who testifies of you?"
00:10:32.29\00:10:34.10
Ivor: So, let's see that Jesus
actually gives us an answer.
00:10:34.13\00:10:37.73
Yvonne: Oh... I know where
you're going but I love it.
00:10:37.77\00:10:40.54
Ivor: Chapter 5 and verse 39,
let's see what it says there.
00:10:40.57\00:10:44.24
John chapter 5...
00:10:44.31\00:10:45.64
James: We don't need to
turn there do we, Yvonne?
00:10:45.67\00:10:49.04
we've got that verse
right... right... right...
00:10:49.08\00:10:51.31
"Search the scriptures... "
00:10:51.35\00:10:53.65
Ivor: "Search the scriptures. "
James: "Search the Scriptures. "
00:10:53.72\00:10:55.42
Yvonne: "for in them...
" Ivor: "Them... " what?
00:10:55.45\00:10:56.89
"Ye have eternal life: and these
are they which... " do what?
00:10:56.92\00:10:59.92
"testify of me. "
00:10:59.95\00:11:01.66
So, Scriptures... Old
Testament... New Testament,
00:11:01.69\00:11:06.76
the job of both of
these Testaments...
00:11:06.80\00:11:10.80
is to testify of Jesus
Christ. Yvonne: Hmmm... hmmm...
00:11:10.83\00:11:12.90
James: And it's
important because...
00:11:12.93\00:11:14.67
we know the New Testament...
we kind of accept that...
00:11:14.70\00:11:16.47
"oh yeah... New Testament"
00:11:16.50\00:11:17.84
but when Jesus says,
"Search the scriptures... "
00:11:17.87\00:11:19.77
in John 5:39... He's
talking about the Old Testament.
00:11:19.84\00:11:21.58
There is no New
Testament then...
00:11:21.61\00:11:23.45
He's talking
about the Old Testament
00:11:23.48\00:11:24.81
so let's put both together,
00:11:24.85\00:11:26.18
because New Testament is
00:11:26.21\00:11:27.55
what? 75 percent or 70 percent
of it is... the Old Testament
00:11:27.58\00:11:30.29
so, these two
witnesses testify of Jesus.
00:11:30.32\00:11:33.46
I love that,
that's good stuff, yeah.
00:11:33.49\00:11:36.56
Ivor: So Christ... is
in all the Scriptures,
00:11:36.59\00:11:39.46
not just the New
Testament Scriptures
00:11:39.49\00:11:42.43
and... now I think this is
super important to understand
00:11:42.46\00:11:45.07
because, guess what?
00:11:45.10\00:11:46.43
Most... as we've been going
through the book of Revelation,
00:11:46.47\00:11:50.31
where we've been going to
get almost all of our answers
00:11:50.34\00:11:54.34
as to understanding
what it's talking about?
00:11:54.38\00:11:56.18
We've been going
back to the Old Testament.
00:11:56.21\00:11:57.91
Ivor: And the reason why so many
people have a difficult time
00:11:57.98\00:12:01.38
understanding the
book of Revelation,
00:12:01.42\00:12:03.65
is because we have so
many, "New Testament Christians"
00:12:03.69\00:12:06.92
"I'm a New Testament...
yeah the Old Testament, hey,
00:12:06.96\00:12:10.19
but the New
Testament... " right?
00:12:10.23\00:12:11.56
Yvonne: Right, ah ha...
00:12:11.59\00:12:13.16
Ivor: And the book of Revelation
00:12:13.19\00:12:14.86
is based so heavily
upon the Old Testament
00:12:14.90\00:12:19.60
and those stories
of the Old Testament...
00:12:19.63\00:12:21.80
James: Because it's
based on Scripture...
00:12:21.84\00:12:23.51
Ivor: Yeah...
00:12:23.54\00:12:24.87
James: When it was
written, that was Scripture...
00:12:24.91\00:12:26.24
Ivor: Absolutely.
00:12:26.27\00:12:27.61
James: Here's another thing that
I think is really significant
00:12:27.64\00:12:29.58
on these two witnesses,
00:12:29.61\00:12:30.95
they have power to call plagues
down on this earth, okay,
00:12:30.98\00:12:36.28
when Elijah said,
"It's not going to rain... "
00:12:36.32\00:12:39.22
he said, "By the
word of the Lord"
00:12:39.25\00:12:40.92
it wasn't his word...
00:12:40.96\00:12:42.29
Ivor: Let's go there
real quick. James: okay.
00:12:42.32\00:12:44.13
Ivor: 1st Kings
18... James: You got it...
00:12:44.16\00:12:46.90
Ivor: And... I was
just looking at that verse,
00:12:46.93\00:12:49.20
something just
jumped out at me...
00:12:49.23\00:12:50.93
James: Here we go... here we go.
00:12:50.97\00:12:52.63
Ivor: You know, it
just... just really...
00:12:52.67\00:12:54.17
1st Kings 18 and verse 1.
00:12:54.20\00:13:01.44
Yvonne: "And it came
to pass after many days,
00:13:01.48\00:13:06.58
that the word of
the Lord came to Elijah
00:13:06.61\00:13:08.55
in the third
year, saying... Go... "
00:13:08.58\00:13:10.49
Ivor: Stop right there...
do you see that just now?
00:13:10.52\00:13:13.05
James: Hmmm...
hmmm... "the third year. "
00:13:13.09\00:13:14.42
Ivor: Do you see that?
No, no, no, not "third year. "
00:13:14.46\00:13:17.76
Ivor: "the word of the Lord
came to Elijah and said... "
00:13:17.79\00:13:21.03
"the word of the
Lord... came to Elijah... "
00:13:21.06\00:13:27.04
so, imagine, the
word of the Lord,
00:13:27.07\00:13:30.21
is His
witness... comes to Elijah
00:13:30.24\00:13:33.34
and says... it doesn't say,
"The Lord, the Lord came... "
00:13:33.38\00:13:36.71
it says, "the word of the
Lord came to Elijah saying... "
00:13:36.75\00:13:40.02
so when Elijah... when it goes
on to say in the third year,
00:13:40.05\00:13:43.45
"saying, Go, shew
thyself unto Ahab;
00:13:43.49\00:13:46.12
and I will send
rain upon the earth. "
00:13:46.15\00:13:48.72
Okay, he's talking about now...
they had just gone through
00:13:48.76\00:13:52.83
these three years of famine,
00:13:52.86\00:13:55.13
no rain... and
then... the Word of the Lord,
00:13:55.16\00:13:57.20
now, we go back to
the book of Revelation,
00:13:57.23\00:13:59.20
what are the two witnesses?
They are the Word of the Lord,
00:13:59.23\00:14:02.14
right, the Old
Testament... and New Testament,
00:14:02.17\00:14:04.67
here you have...
it's almost like...
00:14:04.71\00:14:06.94
it's God... but
the way that it puts it
00:14:06.98\00:14:09.78
"the word of the
Lord comes to Elijah"
00:14:09.81\00:14:12.55
as a witness and says,
00:14:12.61\00:14:14.68
"Okay, Elijah, this
is what I want you to do"
00:14:14.72\00:14:16.28
so Elijah caused it
not to rain by what?
00:14:16.32\00:14:21.76
Yvonne: "The Word of the Lord. "
00:14:21.79\00:14:23.63
Ivor: So when the
book of Revelation says,
00:14:23.66\00:14:25.39
"by these... they have
power to stop it from raining"
00:14:25.43\00:14:28.33
Yvonne: Hmmm...
00:14:28.36\00:14:29.70
Ivor: "they have power
to turn water to blood"
00:14:29.73\00:14:31.77
and the other story is Moses...
00:14:31.80\00:14:33.50
James: I got it, chapter 4,
You want me to read the verses?
00:14:33.54\00:14:37.91
"Moses says unto the Lord... "
00:14:37.94\00:14:39.54
so God calls Moses
to be His spokesman...
00:14:39.57\00:14:42.34
to deliver His people out
of Egypt in Exodus chapter 4
00:14:42.41\00:14:45.68
and I'm just picking up...
just a couple of verses here,
00:14:45.71\00:14:48.98
in Exodus chapter 4
verse 11... 10 and 11...
00:14:49.02\00:14:53.19
"And Moses said until the Lord,
O my Lord, I am not eloquent,
00:14:53.22\00:14:56.66
neither heretofore,
nor since thou hast spoken
00:14:56.73\00:15:01.83
unto thy servant: but I am
slow of speech, and of tongue. "
00:15:01.86\00:15:04.63
And I love this
because basically,
00:15:04.67\00:15:06.00
what Moses is
saying, "I can't do this... "
00:15:06.03\00:15:08.07
and so God responds to
him, and this is what God says,
00:15:08.10\00:15:11.11
"And the Lord said unto
him, Who hath made man's mouth?
00:15:11.14\00:15:14.08
or who maketh the
dumb, or deaf, or the seeing,
00:15:14.11\00:15:17.21
or the blind?
have not I the Lord?
00:15:17.25\00:15:19.45
Now therefore go, and
I will be with thy mouth,
00:15:19.48\00:15:24.02
and teach thee
what thou shalt say. "
00:15:24.05\00:15:26.19
It's my word... when we
get to Revelation 11, we say,
00:15:26.22\00:15:30.23
"Oh, this must
be Moses and Elijah"
00:15:30.26\00:15:31.86
we've just bypassed the
whole point of the entire Bible
00:15:31.89\00:15:35.36
it's never Moses or Elijah,
00:15:35.40\00:15:37.13
in fact, when Moses got a little
bit impatient with the people
00:15:37.17\00:15:41.30
and he said, "Must we
fetch water from this rock?"
00:15:41.34\00:15:44.34
That's when his ticket to
the Promise Land was canceled.
00:15:44.37\00:15:48.41
"It's done, because you've just
taken the glory to yourself,
00:15:48.44\00:15:52.45
it's my word... "
it's always God's word...
00:15:52.51\00:15:55.18
so the reason I love
Revelation 11 here is because
00:15:55.22\00:15:58.42
it's not just about identifying
00:15:58.45\00:16:00.72
who these witnesses are,
but it's about clarifying...
00:16:00.76\00:16:03.69
it's about clarifying the
Old Testament... testimonies
00:16:03.73\00:16:06.63
it's about clarifying the fact
00:16:06.70\00:16:08.03
that human beings
are simply channels
00:16:08.06\00:16:09.90
through which God works,
00:16:09.96\00:16:11.30
it's about giving
the glory back to God
00:16:11.33\00:16:12.87
and that all comes
back to measurement,
00:16:12.90\00:16:14.50
because when we
bypass the human,
00:16:14.54\00:16:17.87
then as we measure God,
we see human imperfections
00:16:17.91\00:16:20.74
and we bypass them and
we keep our focus on Jesus
00:16:20.78\00:16:23.55
and we get the
right measurement.
00:16:23.61\00:16:24.95
Yvonne: That's good.
00:16:24.98\00:16:26.31
Ivor: Well,
verse 4 brings us to...
00:16:26.35\00:16:28.18
Jason... you have a
question about the olive tree
00:16:28.25\00:16:31.32
right, the olive trees
and the candlesticks...
00:16:31.35\00:16:34.39
so, let's see, I
mean, we're going to...
00:16:34.42\00:16:37.03
the way we progress now is,
00:16:37.06\00:16:38.39
we say, "Okay,
it looks like so far
00:16:38.43\00:16:40.13
the Word of God is
fitting these characteristics,
00:16:40.16\00:16:44.63
do they also... do
they fit as we move on
00:16:44.67\00:16:47.24
right... in the verses, so,
the first thing in verse 4 is
00:16:47.30\00:16:50.81
it says, "these are
the two olive trees"
00:16:50.84\00:16:53.54
so the two olive
trees, like, "What's that?"
00:16:53.58\00:16:56.01
You think of any
place in the Bible
00:16:56.04\00:16:57.91
that talks about olive
trees? Maybe two of them.
00:16:57.95\00:17:00.78
"Ah... wait a minute, what's
the name of that book again?"
00:17:00.82\00:17:03.79
Zechariah... oooh...
yeah, Zechariah chapter 3
00:17:03.82\00:17:07.26
so let's go there... or, I think
it's Zechariah chapter 4...
00:17:07.29\00:17:10.49
Ivor: Zechariah
chapter 4 and let's see...
00:17:10.53\00:17:15.16
let's look at...
00:17:15.23\00:17:17.73
James: Verse 1 and
2 are good I think...
00:17:17.77\00:17:19.67
Ivor: Yeah, go ahead.
00:17:19.70\00:17:21.04
James: Just to get the context.
00:17:21.07\00:17:22.40
"And the angel that talked with
me came again, and waked me,
00:17:22.44\00:17:27.01
as a man that is
wakened out of his sleep... "
00:17:27.04\00:17:28.84
and verse 2... "He said unto me,
00:17:28.88\00:17:30.41
what seest thou? And
I said, I have looked,
00:17:30.45\00:17:32.41
and behold a
candlestick all of gold,
00:17:32.45\00:17:34.22
with a bowl upon the top of it,
00:17:34.25\00:17:36.55
and his seven lamps thereon,
00:17:36.58\00:17:38.79
and seven pipes
to the seven lamps,
00:17:38.85\00:17:40.96
which are upon
the top thereof...
00:17:40.99\00:17:43.06
And two olive trees by it,
00:17:43.09\00:17:45.39
one upon the
right side of the bowl,
00:17:45.43\00:17:47.63
and the other upon
the left side thereof.
00:17:47.66\00:17:49.33
So I answered and I spake to
the angel that talked with me,
00:17:49.36\00:17:52.13
saying, What are these?"
00:17:52.17\00:17:53.50
Jason, "What are these, my lord?
00:17:53.54\00:17:55.80
What are these, what
are these two lampstands,
00:17:55.84\00:17:59.57
what's this lampstand...
what are these two olive trees?"
00:17:59.61\00:18:02.18
"Then the angel
that talked with me
00:18:02.21\00:18:03.75
answered and said unto me,
00:18:03.81\00:18:05.15
Don't you know what these
are? And I said, No, my lord.
00:18:05.18\00:18:09.45
Then he answered and
spake unto me, saying,
00:18:09.48\00:18:11.95
This is the word of the
Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying,
00:18:11.99\00:18:16.49
Not by might, nor by
power, but by my spirit,
00:18:16.52\00:18:19.66
saith the LORD of hosts. "
00:18:19.69\00:18:21.56
Ivor: So, here's
the way it happened...
00:18:21.60\00:18:24.20
first of all... what
is he identifying here?
00:18:24.27\00:18:26.80
He says, he sees this vision...
there's that candlestick...
00:18:26.84\00:18:31.77
seven-branched
candlestick, or seven bowls,
00:18:31.81\00:18:34.34
and on either side of it
there are two olive trees
00:18:34.38\00:18:37.01
and the olive
trees are emptying oil
00:18:37.05\00:18:39.41
into the seven-branched
candlestick, right,
00:18:39.45\00:18:43.42
the lampstand... now remember
that Jesus, Himself, said
00:18:43.49\00:18:46.99
in the book of Matthew,
I believe it is, chapter 5,
00:18:47.02\00:18:50.53
"You are the light of the world,
00:18:50.56\00:18:52.46
A city set on a
hill cannot be hid.
00:18:52.49\00:18:54.33
Neither do men light a candle,
and put it under a bushel. "
00:18:54.36\00:18:58.10
A city... a city set on a hill
and that's interesting because
00:18:58.13\00:19:02.10
I'm thinking back to
Revelation chapter 11,
00:19:02.17\00:19:04.11
the Holy City being persecuted,
00:19:04.14\00:19:05.94
that represents
the people of God
00:19:05.97\00:19:07.68
right, so the candlestick...
we've already seen...
00:19:07.74\00:19:10.05
"Oh yeah, that
represents the people of God,
00:19:10.11\00:19:11.85
it represents
the Holy City" okay,
00:19:11.88\00:19:15.28
but what's
keeping the light burning?
00:19:15.35\00:19:16.99
It's the Holy Spirit,
so, okay, what represents...
00:19:17.02\00:19:21.42
the oil is
symbolic of the Holy Spirit,
00:19:21.46\00:19:23.29
that still doesn't really
answer our question though,
00:19:23.32\00:19:24.99
right, the oil is
the Holy Spirit, okay,
00:19:25.03\00:19:27.70
so, thus, in the
vision the angel says,
00:19:27.73\00:19:30.37
oh God says, "Not by might... "
00:19:30.40\00:19:32.53
in other words, you don't...
the fire doesn't burn by might
00:19:32.57\00:19:36.91
nor by power but by my Spirit...
00:19:36.94\00:19:40.08
okay, so, the oil
represents the Spirit,
00:19:40.11\00:19:43.04
but the trees...
00:19:43.08\00:19:45.21
we still don't know what
that's talking about right?
00:19:45.25\00:19:46.82
So let's go a
little bit further down
00:19:46.85\00:19:48.58
and let's see here, verse...
00:19:48.62\00:19:55.66
verse 12... verse
11, yes, verse 11.
00:19:55.69\00:20:00.06
Jason: In Zechariah 4?
00:20:00.10\00:20:01.73
Ivor: Yeah, 11... let's go
ahead and read till verse 14.
00:20:01.76\00:20:04.23
Jason: Okay, "Then
answered I, and said unto him,
00:20:04.27\00:20:06.60
What are these two olive trees
00:20:06.63\00:20:07.97
upon the right
side of the candlestick
00:20:08.00\00:20:09.67
and upon the left side thereof?
00:20:09.70\00:20:11.17
And I answered
again, and said unto him,
00:20:11.21\00:20:13.34
What be these two olive branches
00:20:13.38\00:20:15.34
which through
the two golden pipes
00:20:15.38\00:20:17.28
empty the golden
oil out of themselves?
00:20:17.31\00:20:19.21
And he answered me and said,
Knowest thou not what these be?
00:20:19.25\00:20:23.65
And I said, No, my lord.
00:20:23.69\00:20:26.49
Then said he,
00:20:26.52\00:20:28.99
These are the two anointed ones,
00:20:29.02\00:20:31.33
that stand by the
Lord of the whole earth. "
00:20:31.36\00:20:33.33
James: Hmmm...
00:20:33.36\00:20:34.70
Ivor: Okay, so here we have...
it gets right to Revelation,
00:20:34.73\00:20:38.83
these are the two
olive trees, okay,
00:20:38.87\00:20:41.57
so these olive trees
are what allows the oil
00:20:41.60\00:20:47.28
to get to His people,
00:20:47.34\00:20:49.78
James: to the lights...
Ivor: to the lights... exactly.
00:20:49.81\00:20:52.58
So, in essence, the
candlestick is supported
00:20:52.61\00:20:58.42
by oil and by these two trees,
00:20:58.45\00:21:01.79
two things... oil and the trees,
00:21:01.82\00:21:05.09
now, we have seen
that... we're looking at,
00:21:05.13\00:21:08.53
"Does the word fit
this, does the word fit this?"
00:21:08.56\00:21:10.83
Jesus said,
"Search the Scriptures;
00:21:10.87\00:21:12.90
for in them ye think
ye have eternal life:
00:21:12.93\00:21:14.27
these are they
which testify of me. "
00:21:14.30\00:21:15.74
Okay, the candlestick is
supported by these two witnesses
00:21:15.77\00:21:23.78
does the Word of God... in fact,
00:21:23.81\00:21:26.72
how do we even know
about the Holy Spirit?
00:21:26.75\00:21:28.55
James: By the word of God.
00:21:28.58\00:21:29.92
Ivor: By the word of God, right,
00:21:29.95\00:21:31.29
and very interesting in
the book of John it says,
00:21:31.32\00:21:34.06
"Sanctify them
through thy truth,
00:21:34.09\00:21:36.59
thy word is... " what? "Truth. "
00:21:36.62\00:21:39.33
Jesus says,
"They that worship me,
00:21:39.36\00:21:42.06
must worship me in... " what?
00:21:42.10\00:21:44.60
"Spirit and in truth"
00:21:44.63\00:21:47.07
it is the Bible that
opens up our understanding
00:21:47.10\00:21:50.94
of who the Holy
Spirit is, in other words,
00:21:50.97\00:21:53.34
what kept the church
alive during the Dark Ages?
00:21:53.38\00:21:58.01
The Bible... two witnesses.
00:21:58.05\00:22:01.85
James:
Verification... Ivor: Go...
00:22:01.88\00:22:03.49
James: "He that hath an ear,
00:22:03.52\00:22:05.39
let him hear what the
Spirit says to the churches. "
00:22:05.45\00:22:08.96
Ivor: Yes. James:
"He that has an ear,
00:22:08.99\00:22:10.33
let him hear what the
Spirit says to the churches. "
00:22:10.36\00:22:12.29
That is written
to the seven churches
00:22:12.33\00:22:14.30
which are the
seven candlesticks.
00:22:14.33\00:22:15.70
Jason: Hmmm... hmmm...
00:22:15.73\00:22:17.07
James: So the Spirit is
speaking to the churches
00:22:17.10\00:22:19.27
through the Word.
Ivor: That's right.
00:22:19.30\00:22:21.07
James: So
Revelation chapters 2 and 3
00:22:21.10\00:22:22.50
just verify the whole thing,
00:22:22.57\00:22:23.91
it gives the
pictures, verifies...
00:22:23.94\00:22:25.47
Jason: So, the two candlesticks
00:22:25.51\00:22:27.21
are two of the
churches, right, or no?
00:22:27.24\00:22:29.88
Ivor: No, no,
there's a seven... okay,
00:22:29.94\00:22:32.51
Jason: It seems like, I
mean, when you go back to
00:22:32.55\00:22:35.98
where was that
found? That was...
00:22:36.02\00:22:38.22
James: Revelation chapter 1,
00:22:38.25\00:22:39.75
yeah, "seven candlesticks
are the seven churches. "
00:22:39.79\00:22:42.66
Jason: Yes, so that's
why I would think that...
00:22:42.69\00:22:45.09
Ivor: Do this...
00:22:45.13\00:22:46.46
go to Psalm 119:105...
00:22:46.49\00:22:48.50
Jason: 119:105...
00:22:48.53\00:22:53.03
"Thy word is a... "
what? "lamp unto my feet,
00:22:53.07\00:23:00.18
and a light unto my path. "
00:23:00.21\00:23:01.54
Okay, when we're looking
at these two candlesticks
00:23:01.58\00:23:04.85
in their context, okay,
00:23:04.88\00:23:06.78
they... they are described
00:23:06.82\00:23:09.18
differently than the
seven churches are described,
00:23:09.22\00:23:12.35
okay, the seven
candlesticks, you look...
00:23:12.39\00:23:14.79
you go into each
church... it does this...
00:23:14.82\00:23:17.19
it's a certain period of time,
00:23:17.23\00:23:19.06
these two candlesticks
are separate from the seven
00:23:19.09\00:23:23.30
because they have
power to do things that
00:23:23.33\00:23:25.43
the seven churches...
00:23:25.47\00:23:27.47
it doesn't say anything
about the seven churches,
00:23:27.50\00:23:29.10
you see what I'm saying,
so these are two separate...
00:23:29.14\00:23:32.17
it's kind of like
this... the lion...
00:23:32.21\00:23:35.14
what is it a
symbol of in the Bible?
00:23:35.18\00:23:38.11
James: Christ.
00:23:38.15\00:23:39.48
Ivor: Symbol of
Christ. James: But also...
00:23:39.51\00:23:41.38
Ivor: But also, you
go to Daniel chapter 7,
00:23:41.42\00:23:43.32
and you have a lion right,
in this vision of four beasts,
00:23:43.35\00:23:47.59
the lion in Daniel chapter 7
00:23:47.62\00:23:49.26
does not represent Jesus Christ,
00:23:49.29\00:23:50.73
it represents Babylon.
00:23:50.79\00:23:52.19
James: Neither
in Peter where it's,
00:23:52.23\00:23:53.56
"a devouring lion
seeking whom he may devour. "
00:23:53.60\00:23:55.16
James: The context is important,
that's what he's saying.
00:23:55.20\00:23:57.80
Ivor: Exactly... you want
to look at the context and say,
00:23:57.83\00:24:00.44
"Well, just because it's
a candlestick doesn't mean
00:24:00.47\00:24:02.57
it's the same
candlestick," yeah.
00:24:02.60\00:24:04.47
James: It's really important,
we did that with the incense too
00:24:04.54\00:24:06.81
you remember
that? Ivor: Exactly.
00:24:06.84\00:24:08.18
James: The incense in
Revelation 4, Acts 5...
00:24:08.21\00:24:10.08
represents the
prayers of the saints
00:24:10.11\00:24:11.45
but in Revelation 8,
it actually represents
00:24:11.48\00:24:12.98
the merits of Christ and
the Righteousness of Christ,
00:24:13.01\00:24:15.48
so you get a
symbol from the Bible
00:24:15.52\00:24:17.45
but it also has to fit the
context of where it applies.
00:24:17.49\00:24:19.85
Ivor: Right.
00:24:19.92\00:24:21.42
James: So, what
verifies this symbol,
00:24:21.46\00:24:23.26
I think is so beautiful is
that the seven candlesticks
00:24:23.32\00:24:25.99
do represent our witness,
the witness of the church
00:24:26.03\00:24:28.70
and the Spirit is what
keeps that witness alive,
00:24:28.73\00:24:31.17
the Spirit... listen
to what the Spirit says,
00:24:31.20\00:24:33.57
"Well, how does the Spirit
say that to the seven churches?"
00:24:33.64\00:24:36.10
"Do the work... do the
work... do the work... "
00:24:36.14\00:24:37.47
because every one of those
churches is given these words,
00:24:37.51\00:24:39.91
"I know your
works... I know this,
00:24:39.94\00:24:41.71
I know that...
you need to do this,
00:24:41.84\00:24:43.18
you need to do that"
that's the Spirit speaking
00:24:43.21\00:24:44.58
but when you get
to Revelation 11,
00:24:44.61\00:24:46.88
you have this...
this consummate picture...
00:24:46.92\00:24:49.98
this zenith of reality that
the word that is being spoken
00:24:50.02\00:24:55.02
actually comes from the
Old and the New Testament,
00:24:55.06\00:24:57.36
that's the source...
that's the ultimate source
00:24:57.39\00:24:58.79
of the witness
of all the churches.
00:24:58.83\00:25:00.23
Ivor: Let me share
something else and I know
00:25:00.26\00:25:02.30
I'm running out of time
but we're going to come back,
00:25:02.33\00:25:04.33
we're going to
complete these two witnesses,
00:25:04.40\00:25:06.00
but I'm going to
show you something...
00:25:06.03\00:25:07.60
go to Revelation 11 and
look at verse 11 and 12.
00:25:07.64\00:25:12.51
It says, "After
three days and a half
00:25:12.57\00:25:14.64
the spirit of life
from God entered into them,
00:25:14.68\00:25:18.11
and they stood upon their feet;
00:25:18.15\00:25:19.78
and great fear fell
upon them which saw them.
00:25:19.81\00:25:22.18
And they heard a
great voice from heaven
00:25:22.22\00:25:23.99
saying unto
them, Come up hither,
00:25:24.02\00:25:25.65
And they ascended up
to heaven in a... " what?
00:25:25.69\00:25:27.52
All: "Cloud... "
00:25:27.56\00:25:28.89
Ivor: "cloud and
their enemies beheld them. "
00:25:28.92\00:25:30.26
Okay, so, we're going to
point out that this, you know,
00:25:30.33\00:25:33.29
was occurring at the
end of the 1,260 years,
00:25:33.33\00:25:37.10
and these two
witnesses ascend up into a cloud
00:25:37.13\00:25:40.87
right, do you
remember what we covered
00:25:40.90\00:25:44.64
in Revelation chapter 10?
00:25:44.67\00:25:46.01
We saw this angel and...
James: Clothed with a cloud.
00:25:46.04\00:25:50.01
Ivor: Yeah... what
is he clothed with?
00:25:50.05\00:25:51.75
James: Clothed with a
cloud... Ivor: A cloud...
00:25:51.78\00:25:53.11
What does he have in his hand?
00:25:53.15\00:25:54.48
Yvonne: A book. James:
A little book... hmmm...
00:25:54.52\00:25:55.85
Ivor: A book,
okay, what is he doing?
00:25:55.88\00:25:57.79
He's giving his church, right,
00:25:57.82\00:25:59.92
the understanding
of the Word of God.
00:25:59.95\00:26:02.12
So, when you
actually look at it,
00:26:02.16\00:26:04.26
right after the Dark
Ages, the book ascends
00:26:04.33\00:26:07.86
in the cloud... and
now you have the angel
00:26:07.90\00:26:10.97
in Revelation
chapter 10, with a cloud..
00:26:11.00\00:26:14.07
"Here's the
book... " so as we...
00:26:14.10\00:26:18.34
as we're looking
at this, we're saying,
00:26:18.37\00:26:20.34
"You know what, the Bible
appears to be fitting so far,
00:26:20.38\00:26:23.28
most of these characteristics,
00:26:23.31\00:26:25.25
we haven't finished but as
we go through, we will see... "
00:26:25.28\00:26:28.05
James: Wait till we
get to the historical part
00:26:28.08\00:26:29.88
where we have to
see if the Bible fits
00:26:29.95\00:26:31.35
the historical application...
00:26:31.39\00:26:32.99
Ivor: What actually happened.
00:26:33.02\00:26:34.56
James: Yeah, and that's
really going to nail it for us,
00:26:34.59\00:26:36.93
because I'll say... I'll
say this as we go through this,
00:26:36.96\00:26:39.29
even as we meet all
these characteristics
00:26:39.33\00:26:41.76
and even as we look at history,
00:26:41.80\00:26:43.33
we're still going to
have some wiggle room,
00:26:43.37\00:26:44.90
there has to be
room for faith...
00:26:44.93\00:26:46.67
you can't just
nail this down and say,
00:26:46.70\00:26:49.10
"Okay, good, now
it's solid, proof... "
00:26:49.17\00:26:51.47
proof, you know, I want to say,
00:26:51.51\00:26:53.78
"waterproof, watertight...
there's no wiggle room,"
00:26:53.81\00:26:56.98
there has to be
some wiggle room.
00:26:57.05\00:26:58.38
God has to leave
some wiggle room, why?
00:26:58.41\00:26:59.98
Because we have
to exercise faith...
00:27:00.02\00:27:01.82
ultimately, we have
to exercise faith...
00:27:01.85\00:27:03.18
but I love the journey
you've taken us on, Ivor,
00:27:03.22\00:27:06.55
because I really think this
has laid it out very powerfully,
00:27:06.59\00:27:09.99
very Biblically and very simply
00:27:10.03\00:27:11.36
and setting us up, the
thing I like about this is
00:27:11.39\00:27:13.90
we start out with
this basic summary,
00:27:13.93\00:27:16.40
then we get into the symbols,
00:27:16.43\00:27:17.77
identify them Biblically and
then we get into more symbols,
00:27:17.80\00:27:19.67
identify them... and
pretty soon it's just...
00:27:19.70\00:27:21.84
there's just this
insurmountable mountain of faith
00:27:21.87\00:27:25.27
based on the Word
of God... evidence...
00:27:25.31\00:27:26.71
that just nails it...
00:27:26.74\00:27:28.34
and then we
just have to exercise
00:27:28.38\00:27:30.15
just a little bit of faith and
boom! we're there, I love that,
00:27:30.18\00:27:32.88
all right, so we're
going to leave off right here,
00:27:32.91\00:27:37.25
if folks want to
get ahold of us...
00:27:37.29\00:27:39.69
they have questions or
want to share those questions
00:27:39.75\00:27:41.76
how would they get ahold of us?
00:27:41.79\00:27:43.12
Jason: They could just
send it to: sss@3abn. org
00:27:43.16\00:27:46.39
James: sss@3abn. org so
we'll leave off right here,
00:27:46.43\00:27:50.70
we'll pick up...
right here where we left off
00:27:50.77\00:27:52.60
in our next program
00:27:52.63\00:27:53.97
as we continue to
study Revelation chapter 11.
00:27:54.00\00:27:56.91
Yvonne: Great...
00:27:56.94\00:27:59.24