The following program
discusses sensitive issues.
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Parents are
cautioned that some material
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may be too candid
for younger children.
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Welcome to Pure Choices.
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I'm Wayne Blakely
from Coming Out Ministries,
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and I'm here with all
of my colleagues today,
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Ron Woolsey, Danielle
Harrison and Mike Carducci.
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I welcome to each
and every one of you.
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Thank you. Thanks, Wayne.
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You know I suddenly had a
conversation with some people
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that had a different view
about homosexuality than I did.
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And one the questions
that I ended up asking them,
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if we're fine just the way
we are with same sex attraction
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and finding
someone who we want to love
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and have a
monogamous relationship.
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What do we need
to redeem it for?
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If the word of God says
something completely different,
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how can I settle in the idea
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that I'm fine just the way I am.
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And, you know, I couldn't
get a response to that question,
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and today as we
share our testimonies
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and we talk to
people in churches
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and as many
places as will invite us.
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We're seen as some,
like something different,
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something that set apart.
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And I found in
John 15:19, it says,
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"If you belonged to the world,
it would love you as its own.
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As it is, you do
not belong to the world,
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but I have chosen
you out of the world,
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and that's why
the world hates you."
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So I want to talk today
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about how it is
that we're set apart
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and what can we
say to the person
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who may be never ventured
out into a life like ours,
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may be they
never left the church,
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but they come to us
and they say, you know,
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I want to have
what you guys have.
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What is it that you have?
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And as we explore this,
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I want to talk
to you individually
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about your relationship outside
of Coming Out Ministries.
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So today, Ron,
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what would you say it
means to you as been set apart?
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Well, I have been redeemed
from the life that I was living
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which I
discovered was total bondage.
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When I... And
who showed you that?
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What?
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Who showed you that
that it was total bondage?
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Well, I realized
it was total bondage
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when I tried to come out of it.
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First of all
when in going into it,
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I went into the gay
life and I left the Lord,
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because I wanted to,
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I was just tired of
all the thou shalt not.
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So I wanted
freedom from the law.
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But we're told in the Bible
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that the law of God
is the law of liberty.
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So in getting freedom
from the law of liberty,
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I was really
finding freedom from freedom
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which equals bondage.
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And after years of
living in that life,
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I realized that I
wanted out of the bondage.
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And it wasn't until I
started trying to come out of it
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that I realized
how entangle I was.
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And it was
absolutely impossible for me
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to come out of that on my own.
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A lot of people who read just
certain portions of the Bible
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see it as restrictive like,
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oh, God doesn't
want me to be happy
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because I can't do
what is natural to me.
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And so, we get the idea
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that what's natural
to us must be right,
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and then in that I think
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it's where so many
people adopt the idea
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that they don't even think
that it's coming from Satan,
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they don't recognize it,
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and so the church
didn't come and get us.
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And I think a little
bit about the church today
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in terms of being like
Israel are or being a little bit
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like Laodicea that
they're sleeping a bit
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and not recognizing the
true value of God's word
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and His great love for us.
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And why He would ask us
to give up some of the things
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that do come natural to us.
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Danielle, I mean, your
life was much different
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than it is today,
and people can see that
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by looking at a
contrast picture of you
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from how you used to dress,
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as to how you
would wear dress now.
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And some people would say,
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oh, look at her,
she is so modest,
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she doesn't have the personality
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and the flash and
the flair that she had.
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You know, why?
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Why?
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Well, you know, I will
answer through an illustration.
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I went to a youth conference
and I had been praying
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as I did every time I went
to mea that God would give me
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a divine appointment
their at the lunch table.
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And as I came and I
sat down at this table,
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there were a few younger
girls and then an older lady,
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and all the girls
were sitting around
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talking to this older woman.
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And they were just
chatting amongst themselves
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and they acknowledged me
when I came and sat down,
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but they just continued
on with their conversation,
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and our meal was almost over
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and I was just
kind of like okay, Lord,
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well, you know, so
much for, you know,
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a divine
appointment at this lunch table,
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because it just seem that
they were kind of involved
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and I wasn't going to be
brought in at the conversation.
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Well, the Lord
did bring it around,
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and I started talking
with those young girls,
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and to make a long story short,
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I ended up giving
them a little flyer
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that I had printed up
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to share with some
universities and academies
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to hopefully have opportunity
to speak to the students.
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But I just fell
inspired to give them
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one of my little flyers,
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and one of the
girls at the table,
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when she saw that
before and after picture,
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she looked at it
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and she looked up at me
with this look on her face,
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and I'll never
forget the expression
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and she could not believe
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that I used to be
the person that I was.
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She said, when you
came and you sat down,
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I saw this piece
and this just joy
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that was shining out of you,
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and she said
when I looked at you,
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and I just saw this
atmosphere around you,
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I thought to myself,
that's what we can have
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when we truly walk with Jesus.
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And so for her to see that in me
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and then to see
who I used to be,
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she was utterly dumfounded
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and I think that is
really the essence of why,
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you know, because
before I came to the Lord,
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I thought that I was liberated
in walking in my own way
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and making my own decisions.
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But I realized very quickly
that I was enslaved in that,
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I wasn't happy that my
depression only got worse,
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my anxiety attacks got worse.
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I started struggling with
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eating disorders
and multiple addictions,
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and my life just spiraled
completely out of control.
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And I think that's why God
is calling us to be set apart,
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and to walk in a new way
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because He wants us to
experience life the way
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that He designed
it to be experienced.
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And when we walk in
the ways of the world,
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that's what we
are losing out on.
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And what we're receiving
in exchange is not the picture
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that Satan has so masterfully
painted us to think it is.
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And, you know, I know you today,
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and I didn't know you then.
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But in the pictures that
I've seen, I see a flair.
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The only word that
comes to my mind is,
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it's a bit of a demonic
flair because it just had that,
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you know, a little
bit of an evil twinge,
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like looking out of
the corner of your eye.
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And yet today, I
see you and I know you,
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and a little about
your walk with God,
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and I see a sparkle in your eye
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and I see genuine love
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that transcends to the
person that you're speaking to.
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And sometimes that
I'm fortunate is me.
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And I'm blessed by how
you interact with God today
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and a little bit
about how close that walk is
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and I'll come back to that.
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Mike, there is a verse
in God's word that says,
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it's Jeremiah 1: 5, this says,
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"Before I formed you
in the womb, I knew you."
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Do you really believe that?
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Absolutely, one of the things
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that I find so
intimated about God now,
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I didn't understand Him before,
I couldn't relate to Him,
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because I related to God
as I related to my father.
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I rejected my father
before I was even conscious,
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so I wanted
nothing to do with him
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and nothing he did
even interested me.
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So, as I grow up, I thought,
well, God must be like my dad
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indifferent,
arbitrary, judgmental.
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And so it wasn't until
after I begun this journey,
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an intimate
journey with Jesus Christ,
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that I, as I saw
Jesus' longsuffering,
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as I saw Jesus love
for me and His compassion.
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And then I also
read in John 14:9,
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it says, "If you've seen
Me, you've seen the Father."
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So it was like, it took
until I was 47 years old,
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before God could introduce
Himself to me as my father,
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but now that I read the word
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and now that I understand
a greater picture of the God
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that I thought I knew,
that I knew nothing about.
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I can understand that,
yeah, before the earth was made,
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He knew me and
He saved me to live,
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you know, during this time.
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And again, I didn't know
you, none of us know each other
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when we lived in a life that
was much different than this.
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But today, I see you share
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and I see the contrast of
the relationship that was,
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that you
struggled with your father,
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and then I see you
interact with people
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that are drawn
to your testimony.
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And people that contact you,
you know, often to get counsel,
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and you're so patient with them,
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and so loving, and so
kind, and so articulate,
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and you help people understand.
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I see God working through you,
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that they begin
to see the values
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that God has for them.
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You have a
presentation that I always,
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when we're doing
something, group together,
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I never get tired of hearing,
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and that's
called the lost father.
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And so can you tell
me that at one point
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you were a part of the world
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and how you see yourself
set apart from the world,
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and how did you came to
love that heavenly Father?
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Wow, Wayne, you
know, if we had more time,
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I could probably elaborate more,
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but just of the top of my head,
I wanted only what I wanted.
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And living in that
life I'd learned that
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because of all the
rejection that I'd experienced
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that it was a doggy dog world,
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and you've got to
sink your teeth in
00:11:12.87\00:11:14.74
and get
everything that you can get
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because you will get nothing.
00:11:16.27\00:11:18.07
And so then coming
into a relationship
00:11:18.11\00:11:20.28
with Jesus
Christ and then learning
00:11:20.31\00:11:21.64
that I'm supposed
to view myself as least
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and to put other people first.
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You know, thanks, Wayne,
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for all those
glowing attributes,
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but it's taking
the whole long time
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to learn to be more patient
and to learn to be more loving
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because I was only in
it for what I could get.
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And so as I...
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Here comes, as I
behold who Jesus Christ was,
00:11:40.33\00:11:44.80
and as I see His unlimited
supply of patients for me
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and His love for me
00:11:49.84\00:11:51.17
and as that
draws in me into Him,
00:11:51.21\00:11:54.68
then I realized
that He says in His word,
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He says. I'm faithful and just.
00:11:56.78\00:12:00.18
I wasn't faithful or just.
00:12:00.22\00:12:02.38
But His faithfulness and
His justification drew me to Him
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and help me to desire to
even want to be more like Him.
00:12:06.39\00:12:11.03
But while, Wayne, it,
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it's taken years
and I'm not there yet.
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I'm familiar with it.
00:12:15.70\00:12:17.70
The process it seems long,
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I think it seems long
to each of us individually
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and we don't
recognize the changes
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to people from the outside,
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you know, and I noticed this
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when I was
younger, and I would go
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to various presentations
or specialty groups
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that would come to
our church or something,
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I would go, I just
want to be like them,
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that's just so wonderful.
00:12:43.22\00:12:44.76
And it looks
like that, you know,
00:12:44.79\00:12:46.70
that everything is
just, it's just perfections.
00:12:46.73\00:12:50.33
And yet each of us
know that we struggle,
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we have struggled along the way
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as we have
walked with each other,
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that it's like a family.
00:12:58.94\00:13:01.44
And there are
various attributes,
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and there are
various things in families
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that some things you like
and some things you don't like.
00:13:06.88\00:13:10.59
And it is been interesting to me
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how God has walked with us,
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and how He hasn't let us down,
00:13:19.13\00:13:22.53
and that He holds us together.
00:13:22.56\00:13:24.90
And we have hit some
hills and some valleys
00:13:24.93\00:13:29.20
and, you know we, I
know the enemy is totally
00:13:29.24\00:13:33.14
after our ministry like this.
00:13:33.17\00:13:34.61
It's really one of may be two,
00:13:34.64\00:13:37.38
that I know in
this denomination.
00:13:37.41\00:13:40.98
For the great length of
time that they were set silence,
00:13:41.02\00:13:44.32
all of the sudden God
raises up this little army,
00:13:44.35\00:13:47.66
you know, it's like
the mod squad for Jesus,
00:13:47.69\00:13:51.59
and we go together and we share,
00:13:51.63\00:13:55.33
and we do so joyfully.
00:13:55.36\00:13:57.20
But at times there
have been tensions,
00:13:57.23\00:13:59.63
and yet God has
personally shown me that
00:13:59.67\00:14:06.04
if my focus is on myself,
00:14:06.07\00:14:10.11
I'm going to miss
out on the real gift,
00:14:10.15\00:14:14.45
the real value of what
he wants to do in my life,
00:14:14.48\00:14:18.65
and I think He has
revealed that on to each
00:14:18.69\00:14:22.02
and everyone of us.
00:14:22.06\00:14:23.39
So I do believe that we
are called to be separate
00:14:24.69\00:14:28.13
and to come apart.
00:14:28.16\00:14:29.50
I know that we've
struggled to get to some places
00:14:30.27\00:14:32.73
where we would like to go.
00:14:32.77\00:14:34.20
And that's to speak
with people that are young,
00:14:34.24\00:14:39.34
that when we were young,
00:14:40.78\00:14:42.11
we so desperately wanted
to hear from people like us
00:14:42.14\00:14:45.11
that got some
answers and some solutions.
00:14:45.15\00:14:48.48
And so today we
have on campuses,
00:14:49.52\00:14:52.05
on many Christian campuses,
00:14:52.09\00:14:53.72
you know, these
straight gay alliances,
00:14:53.76\00:14:56.26
and the people
have come out on campus
00:14:56.29\00:14:59.09
and identified as gay,
00:14:59.13\00:15:01.26
but I think
what's missing is that,
00:15:01.30\00:15:02.83
while they have a love for God.
00:15:02.86\00:15:06.00
In many cases, this
is certainly the truth.
00:15:06.03\00:15:08.80
They do love God,
00:15:08.84\00:15:10.17
but what they haven't
been able to come to grips with
00:15:10.21\00:15:14.21
is their feelings
versus God's word.
00:15:14.24\00:15:18.71
And for some reason
00:15:18.75\00:15:20.48
it seems like many
of our institutions
00:15:20.52\00:15:22.78
have either feared or
failed to go forward and say,
00:15:22.82\00:15:29.16
here is who you
really are in Jesus Christ,
00:15:29.19\00:15:31.69
while you attempted it,
00:15:31.73\00:15:33.06
it doesn't make you
as though you are someone
00:15:33.09\00:15:37.20
who lived in this
00:15:37.23\00:15:38.57
an that simply did
the temptation itself
00:15:38.60\00:15:40.87
doesn't have to identify you.
00:15:40.90\00:15:42.50
Each of us identify
00:15:42.54\00:15:44.01
as new
creatures in Jesus Christ,
00:15:44.04\00:15:45.71
and for some
reason in certain places
00:15:45.74\00:15:47.81
that holds us at arms distance.
00:15:47.84\00:15:50.21
And what I so
desperately want to do,
00:15:50.25\00:15:53.52
and I pray that God
will open the doors,
00:15:53.55\00:15:55.58
so that we can do is
to go into these places
00:15:55.62\00:15:59.12
and say Jesus is the
safe place, you know.
00:15:59.15\00:16:03.22
It's all about finding out
00:16:03.26\00:16:05.39
the fact that Jesus
loves you so very, very much.
00:16:05.43\00:16:08.40
He knows what you struggle with,
00:16:08.43\00:16:10.10
and He has solutions.
00:16:10.13\00:16:11.57
Are you
interested in the solution?
00:16:11.60\00:16:13.74
Are you
interested in finding that?
00:16:13.77\00:16:15.67
While you have
same sex attraction,
00:16:15.70\00:16:18.64
or while you might be
immersed in pornography,
00:16:18.67\00:16:21.24
or while you might be
having pre-marital sex.
00:16:21.28\00:16:26.51
You don't have to
identify on these things
00:16:26.55\00:16:29.28
that there is
actually a way out.
00:16:29.32\00:16:31.49
God is true to His
word, He provides a way out,
00:16:31.52\00:16:35.82
and that we can all become
new creatures in Jesus Christ.
00:16:35.86\00:16:39.03
And as James 5:16 says that
00:16:39.06\00:16:41.23
we can go to
somebody else and say,
00:16:41.26\00:16:43.03
you know I really
struggled with something,
00:16:43.06\00:16:45.27
and I need you to pray for me,
00:16:45.30\00:16:46.63
because here James 5:16
says that "healing is mine."
00:16:46.67\00:16:50.97
I know in your
conversion, Mike, that you said,
00:16:51.01\00:16:53.98
"It is up to you God
to reveal Yourself to me.
00:16:54.01\00:16:56.48
I have come to you.
00:16:56.51\00:16:58.08
Fine, I'm
giving my heart to You,
00:16:58.11\00:16:59.88
I repent, but now
You got show me You.
00:16:59.91\00:17:02.75
And I find that
Jesus will do that,
00:17:02.78\00:17:05.35
when we hold Jesus to a promise
00:17:05.39\00:17:07.86
that He has given to us,
00:17:07.89\00:17:09.22
He will not let us down.
00:17:09.26\00:17:10.73
Wayne, He delights to
reveal His promises, doesn't He?
00:17:10.76\00:17:14.76
He is just looking for
an opportunity to bless us,
00:17:14.80\00:17:17.93
to bestow those things on us.
00:17:17.97\00:17:19.80
He is not wanting to
withhold anything good from me.
00:17:19.83\00:17:23.24
But the thing that He
waits for as Danielle says,
00:17:23.27\00:17:25.87
He is a gentleman.
00:17:25.91\00:17:27.24
You know, He is
waiting for the opportunity
00:17:27.28\00:17:29.01
or the invitation,
00:17:29.04\00:17:30.38
or maybe the
response to the invitation
00:17:30.41\00:17:32.28
because whenever we
open up our heart to God,
00:17:32.31\00:17:34.78
it's because He
invited us first.
00:17:34.82\00:17:36.62
Right.
00:17:36.65\00:17:37.99
I came to the
person who is suffering.
00:17:38.02\00:17:41.32
I was talking to
someone recently,
00:17:41.36\00:17:44.43
who is dedicated to God
00:17:44.46\00:17:46.53
and we were
talking about failure,
00:17:46.56\00:17:49.26
and if someone falls,
00:17:49.30\00:17:50.93
and how devastating
that can be sometimes,
00:17:50.97\00:17:54.14
because the enemy
makes you feel worthless.
00:17:54.17\00:17:56.10
You know that now
you need just to go back
00:17:56.14\00:17:58.44
and live the life
that you once lived,
00:17:58.47\00:18:01.14
and that there
is no hope for you.
00:18:01.18\00:18:02.78
But the words of God
tells us, wait a minute hold on,
00:18:04.61\00:18:07.88
I love you
00:18:07.92\00:18:09.25
and that I even
advised to forgive 70 times 7.
00:18:09.28\00:18:13.39
And so God is
showing that in His ways,
00:18:13.42\00:18:18.13
is He is always
there ready to forgive
00:18:18.16\00:18:21.60
if we will just
seek His forgiveness,
00:18:21.63\00:18:23.97
He will help us get
back up on our feet,
00:18:24.00\00:18:26.47
and walk with Him
00:18:26.50\00:18:28.07
that He is our
biggest fan, you know.
00:18:28.10\00:18:31.57
So it's absolutely amazing.
00:18:31.61\00:18:34.34
I was considering
with this wave of ISIS,
00:18:34.38\00:18:40.28
and you know, and
like the racial cleansing,
00:18:40.32\00:18:43.18
and all the different
things that they tried that,
00:18:43.22\00:18:45.32
you know, people get
upset with each other about,
00:18:45.35\00:18:47.86
and people start
killing each other over it.
00:18:47.89\00:18:50.63
That we began to,
have seen how much
00:18:50.66\00:18:54.33
we and our
message is much different
00:18:54.36\00:18:58.23
than the trend
of the world today.
00:18:58.27\00:19:00.27
And actually a
little bit different than
00:19:00.30\00:19:02.00
the trend in some
00:19:02.04\00:19:03.81
of our larger
denominations today
00:19:03.84\00:19:05.94
who are just saying,
"Ah, it just doesn't matter."
00:19:05.97\00:19:08.24
So as we become more peculiar,
00:19:08.28\00:19:11.61
and we began to think
about some of the persecutions
00:19:12.65\00:19:16.79
that are even
coming from within.
00:19:16.82\00:19:20.06
Can you tell me
how you see that, Ron?
00:19:20.09\00:19:23.53
What did...
00:19:23.56\00:19:24.89
You know, persecution is coming,
00:19:24.93\00:19:26.53
how are you
gonna respond to that?
00:19:26.56\00:19:29.16
To persecution?
00:19:29.20\00:19:30.53
Let for instance,
00:19:30.57\00:19:32.37
you claim to be a new
creation in Jesus Christ,
00:19:32.40\00:19:35.90
you don't live by
your feelings anymore.
00:19:35.94\00:19:37.44
You're saying that gay
behavior is sinful behavior,
00:19:37.47\00:19:40.38
that's just warped.
00:19:40.41\00:19:42.84
Well, if you're talking
about feelings and emotions
00:19:42.88\00:19:46.95
you were talking early about.
00:19:46.98\00:19:49.08
Letting feelings and
emotions identify who we are.
00:19:49.12\00:19:52.85
You know, a murderer that
comes to Jesus has to learn
00:19:52.89\00:19:56.66
to overcome his
feeling and emotions,
00:19:56.69\00:20:00.43
and a thief has to overcome
his feelings and emotions,
00:20:00.46\00:20:05.00
and an adulterer
needs to get control
00:20:05.03\00:20:07.60
of his feelings and emotions,
00:20:07.64\00:20:09.87
it's same with the pedophiler
or any other sinful behavior.
00:20:09.90\00:20:15.21
But with the gay issue,
00:20:15.24\00:20:16.58
it seems that
feelings and emotions
00:20:16.61\00:20:19.41
are supposed to identify us.
00:20:19.45\00:20:22.28
But when you're
talking about persecution,
00:20:22.32\00:20:23.65
we know that all
who will live godly
00:20:24.99\00:20:27.36
in Christ Jesus
shall suffer persecution.
00:20:27.39\00:20:30.33
And persecution comes
in many different forms,
00:20:30.36\00:20:33.90
and some times we
meet up with opposition.
00:20:33.93\00:20:36.67
We don't think of
it as persecution,
00:20:36.70\00:20:38.67
but it's kind of a
beginning of that thing,
00:20:38.70\00:20:41.50
when you are meeting up
00:20:41.54\00:20:42.87
with slander and false reports,
00:20:42.90\00:20:46.61
misrepresentations
of who you are.
00:20:47.34\00:20:49.61
Those are forms,
00:20:49.64\00:20:50.98
they are light
forms of persecution.
00:20:51.01\00:20:54.62
But how we deal with that now
00:20:54.65\00:20:56.22
I think will
determine how we will deal with
00:20:56.25\00:20:58.25
greater
persecution as it comes later.
00:20:58.29\00:21:01.22
And we must love our
enemies and pray for them,
00:21:01.26\00:21:05.59
and just like Jesus prayed,
00:21:05.63\00:21:07.23
"Father forgive them
00:21:07.26\00:21:08.60
for they know not what they do."
00:21:08.63\00:21:10.47
We need to have
that same attitude
00:21:10.57\00:21:12.50
when we are being wronged,
00:21:12.53\00:21:14.50
misrepresented and slandered,
and yes, even persecuted.
00:21:14.54\00:21:18.04
How about you, Danielle?
00:21:19.07\00:21:20.71
You know I...
00:21:20.74\00:21:22.08
As I look at the
political climate,
00:21:22.11\00:21:24.05
as it surrounds
the all LGPT wave,
00:21:24.08\00:21:29.12
that's been moving
across our country.
00:21:29.15\00:21:33.22
You know, we already have seen
00:21:34.32\00:21:35.86
a level of
persecution with the, you know,
00:21:35.89\00:21:39.49
the bakery is the one
that always comes to my mind
00:21:39.53\00:21:42.20
that was closed down
00:21:42.23\00:21:43.73
because they wouldn't
do the gay wedding cake,
00:21:43.77\00:21:46.33
and now basically everything
00:21:46.37\00:21:48.40
that family owned
has been taken from them.
00:21:48.44\00:21:50.57
And, you know,
00:21:50.61\00:21:51.94
we see anything other
than complete acceptance
00:21:51.97\00:21:56.31
considered bigotry and hate,
00:21:56.34\00:21:58.81
and so we no longer have
00:21:58.85\00:22:02.48
really the freedom
to hold our own views.
00:22:02.52\00:22:05.62
I think that religious freedoms
00:22:05.65\00:22:07.12
are being taken away from us.
00:22:07.16\00:22:09.56
In the storm
00:22:09.59\00:22:12.06
that we are facing
here on this topic,
00:22:12.09\00:22:15.60
and so, we've seen the
persecution began already,
00:22:15.63\00:22:17.73
and I think it's
only going to continue.
00:22:17.77\00:22:20.10
And I really feel that
ourselves and ministry,
00:22:21.14\00:22:24.37
the voices like us
that hold to these beliefs
00:22:25.64\00:22:29.48
were really on the
frontlines of a greater war
00:22:29.51\00:22:32.65
that's I believe
going to lead into,
00:22:32.68\00:22:34.95
into greater persecution,
00:22:34.98\00:22:36.75
but I believe that
00:22:36.79\00:22:38.99
we won't see the end concluded,
00:22:39.02\00:22:42.22
and Christ come
00:22:42.26\00:22:43.59
and tell the
persecution is rekindled,
00:22:43.63\00:22:46.43
because as we
stand for the right,
00:22:46.46\00:22:50.27
as we're willing to be set apart
00:22:50.30\00:22:53.37
and stand for the
right of the heavens fall,
00:22:53.40\00:22:55.94
it's only when that happens
00:22:55.97\00:22:57.41
that the persecution will come,
00:22:57.44\00:23:01.24
and I think that needs to happen
00:23:01.28\00:23:02.61
so that Jesus can come.
00:23:02.64\00:23:03.98
So I really love what Ron
said in the documentary about,
00:23:04.08\00:23:08.05
you don't hate gays,
00:23:08.08\00:23:09.45
you know, that's
where we came from.
00:23:09.48\00:23:11.29
Ron, would you say
that again, the part, right.
00:23:11.32\00:23:13.46
Well, we are not
homophobic, we are homoagapic.
00:23:13.49\00:23:17.36
That's why we are
doing what we are doing
00:23:17.39\00:23:18.89
and set up our love
00:23:18.93\00:23:20.26
for people that
are where we used to be
00:23:20.30\00:23:22.86
that don't have the
answers we now have.
00:23:22.90\00:23:25.23
What you said
though, as you said,
00:23:25.27\00:23:27.90
we don't hate gays.
00:23:27.94\00:23:29.30
If I hated gays, I
wouldn't talk about it,
00:23:29.34\00:23:31.67
I wouldn't even
care what happen to them.
00:23:31.71\00:23:33.07
Just leave it alone.
00:23:33.11\00:23:34.44
That, leave it
alone, that's right.
00:23:34.48\00:23:35.81
And, you know, I
think that really,
00:23:35.84\00:23:37.25
it sums it up,
if we didn't care,
00:23:37.28\00:23:39.48
you know, we
wouldn't even address it,
00:23:39.51\00:23:41.95
I just go home and
wait for Jesus to come.
00:23:41.98\00:23:43.89
So, Mike, if a president
of a Christian university
00:23:45.15\00:23:49.72
came to you and said,
00:23:49.76\00:23:51.26
you know, there is just no way
00:23:51.29\00:23:52.69
that we are gonna
allow you speak here,
00:23:52.73\00:23:54.73
because you guys
have extremist views,
00:23:54.76\00:23:57.50
and that's damaging.
00:23:57.53\00:23:59.57
And so,
00:23:59.60\00:24:01.64
I mean that's
kind of persecution too
00:24:01.67\00:24:04.74
in not being able
to get the word out
00:24:04.77\00:24:09.54
that young people so
desperately need to hear.
00:24:09.58\00:24:11.91
How does that affect you?
How does that fall on you?
00:24:11.95\00:24:14.48
You know, Wayne, what?
00:24:15.48\00:24:16.82
How it really...
00:24:16.85\00:24:18.19
I guess affects
me is the fact that
00:24:18.22\00:24:20.42
I think of when
somebody does come to me,
00:24:20.46\00:24:23.26
and says, you know,
00:24:23.29\00:24:26.26
I don't know what to
think, I don't know where to go.
00:24:26.29\00:24:27.63
You know, I hear the world
telling me that this is okay,
00:24:27.66\00:24:29.96
and then I hear the
word of God telling me
00:24:30.00\00:24:31.83
that it's wrong,
00:24:31.87\00:24:33.20
you know, and
there is no resources.
00:24:33.23\00:24:35.74
I think about that child
because that person was me.
00:24:35.77\00:24:39.04
You know, I walked
right out of Christian culture
00:24:39.07\00:24:41.14
at 20 years old
00:24:41.18\00:24:42.51
because I
couldn't get my sexuality
00:24:42.54\00:24:44.15
and my religion
to come together.
00:24:44.18\00:24:45.78
And because I found no resources
00:24:45.81\00:24:47.88
or even an open ear
00:24:47.92\00:24:49.25
that I felt that I could trust.
00:24:49.28\00:24:50.69
You know what they
did is that plunged me
00:24:50.72\00:24:52.55
into a world of experience
00:24:52.59\00:24:54.46
that God had
never intended for me.
00:24:54.49\00:24:57.06
And while it took a long time
00:24:57.09\00:24:58.69
that because of what
I have been put through,
00:24:58.73\00:25:02.23
that my sadness actually comes
00:25:02.26\00:25:04.50
when a university
is unwilling to even
00:25:04.53\00:25:07.17
just consider the options
00:25:07.20\00:25:09.34
that the word of God
expresses are available.
00:25:09.37\00:25:12.11
I remember reading
00:25:13.41\00:25:14.74
and believe it's in 1
Peter that tells me that
00:25:14.78\00:25:19.21
God doesn't
00:25:19.25\00:25:20.58
smile on even the slightest
tint of sexual immorality,
00:25:21.62\00:25:27.46
and it reminds me again that
00:25:27.49\00:25:28.86
His word is very definitive
about this topic of sexuality,
00:25:28.89\00:25:33.26
and how God who
created us wants to uphold
00:25:33.29\00:25:37.73
His perfect plan for us,
00:25:37.77\00:25:39.37
that really does
mean an awful lot to Him,
00:25:39.40\00:25:42.14
and it should mean an
awful lot to us as well.
00:25:43.24\00:25:46.21
For somebody who
contemplates their life
00:25:47.48\00:25:50.15
and their destiny today,
00:25:50.18\00:25:52.15
I find that
there was great power
00:25:52.18\00:25:54.12
in 1 Peter 1:14-16,
Ron, do you have that?
00:25:54.15\00:25:58.79
Yes, I have it here,
00:25:58.82\00:26:00.76
"As obedient children,
00:26:00.79\00:26:03.22
not fashioning yourselves
according to the former lusts
00:26:03.26\00:26:06.53
in your ignorance.
00:26:06.56\00:26:07.90
But as he which
hath called you is holy,
00:26:08.20\00:26:11.17
so be ye holy in all
manner of conversation,
00:26:11.20\00:26:15.30
Because it is written,
Be ye holy, for I am holy."
00:26:15.34\00:26:20.08
To me that for a long time
00:26:22.38\00:26:24.71
I thought while
be holy like God,
00:26:24.75\00:26:27.78
and I couldn't
hold a candle to that.
00:26:29.08\00:26:31.32
And yet when I...
00:26:31.35\00:26:33.29
And I found some other people,
00:26:33.32\00:26:35.26
I got to mention this too,
00:26:35.29\00:26:36.62
they were even offended by that,
00:26:36.66\00:26:38.16
to that being drawn, be holy.
00:26:38.19\00:26:40.40
You know, that was
like something that
00:26:40.43\00:26:41.76
we certainly couldn't attain.
00:26:41.80\00:26:43.13
But when I went and
I looked up the word,
00:26:44.53\00:26:46.50
one of the definitions
for holy meant set apart.
00:26:47.54\00:26:51.71
Doesn't it just mean follow me,
00:26:51.74\00:26:54.14
just follow me, be like me.
00:26:54.18\00:26:55.51
Yes.
00:26:55.54\00:26:56.88
Try, you know, to stay with me.
00:26:56.91\00:26:58.25
Yeah.
00:26:58.28\00:26:59.61
So, as we each
one walk with God,
00:26:59.65\00:27:02.72
I know that every single one
of us have personal devotions.
00:27:02.75\00:27:06.86
Time away with God when,
00:27:08.19\00:27:10.09
when we're not
even speaking together.
00:27:10.13\00:27:12.96
In fact sometimes
speaking together,
00:27:12.99\00:27:14.36
I find distracts
from our devotion time.
00:27:14.40\00:27:17.23
We get wrapped
up into a schedule.
00:27:17.27\00:27:19.33
But when I come back
00:27:19.37\00:27:20.74
and I have all that
precious time with God,
00:27:20.77\00:27:23.37
and I recently
had that privilege,
00:27:23.41\00:27:25.94
that God really
does speak to our hearts
00:27:25.97\00:27:28.41
and He does tell us
that we are set apart.
00:27:28.44\00:27:31.05
And it gives new meaning
to my experience with Him,
00:27:31.08\00:27:34.38
I reflect on His promises.
00:27:34.42\00:27:37.22
It gives me
inspiration and motivation
00:27:37.25\00:27:39.85
as to why He has set me apart
00:27:39.89\00:27:41.92
for I believe
preserving me and preserving us
00:27:41.96\00:27:45.59
for such a time as this.
00:27:45.63\00:27:47.16
Find your true
meaning in Jesus Christ,
00:27:48.20\00:27:50.83
and find that He
has set you apart.
00:27:50.87\00:27:52.90
Thank you so much
00:27:52.93\00:27:54.27
for joining us
again in Pure Choices,
00:27:54.30\00:27:56.91
and God bless you.
00:27:56.94\00:27:58.27