The following program
discusses sensitive issues.
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Parents are
cautioned that some material
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may be too candid
for younger children.
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Hello and thank you for
joining us on Pure Choices.
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My name is Danielle Harrison
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and I'm an associate
member of Coming Out Ministries.
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And today, here,
joining me is my colleague,
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Pastor Ron Woolsey.
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Thank you for joining us, Ron.
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Yeah, it's good to be
with you today, Danielle.
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Amen. Amen.
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Now, Ron, I've heard
you list out the ways
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that the Lord really stepped
in and intervened in your life
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when you were
living as a gay man.
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And he stepped in and
He started to convict you
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and to convert you,
as He got your attention,
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and He really redirected you
on a new path through victory.
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And that's what I
want to talk about.
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Can you share
that with us today?
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Okay, yes.
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You've heard me talk
about how in the beginning,
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when I was trying to study
my way out of the gay life,
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how I sat down
with the Word of God,
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with the Margarita in one hand,
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and a cigarette in
the other trying to relax
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to be able to even concentrate
on what I was reading.
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And the Lord
worked through that.
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He got my attention all right,
and He held it, convicted me.
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As I look back
now on the journey
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the Lord has led me through,
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I put together a
list of what I call,
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a list of realizations, in
the order in which the Lord
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was able to hold my attention
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and lead me out of the gay life.
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And I found that it
has been very helpful
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to a lot of people.
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The first thing
that I've realized,
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as I was reading
that marvelous book,
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Steps to Christ, was
it, God really did love me.
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It didn't matter who I
was, what I was, where I was,
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He loved me very, very much.
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Amen.
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He is the
perfect essence of love.
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So everything He asks of us,
His commandments, His warnings,
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His threatenings, His
reproves, corrections,
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even His punishments
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are from our
loving Heavenly Father.
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And as I realized
how much God loved me,
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that instilled in me a
sense of worth and value
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that I really didn't
have up to that point.
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And so the next thing
that I realized was that
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I needed to really face myself.
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Just step up to the
mirror and take a good look,
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because truth can
bear a scrutiny, can't it?
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And so I
decided to just honestly
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take a look at
myself and evaluate.
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And when you are
standing in the presence of God
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or you are beholding
Christ through His Word,
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and then you see yourself,
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you can really see
your great need of a savior.
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And so I came to the
point that I stopped blaming
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because up to that
point I was blaming God
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for who I was,
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and other
people for molesting me
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and wronging me throughout life,
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but you know,
Jeremiah 3 tells us,
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Gods says, "Only
acknowledge thine iniquity,"
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not someone else's,
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"only acknowledge thine iniquity
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and I will heal
your backsliding."
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So I began to acknowledge,
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you know, this is
a sin issue with me.
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It's not
something, it doesn't matter,
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you know, how or
why I'm this way.
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This is a sin issue and
as I began to acknowledge
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that it was a sin
issue, I began to realize
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that Jesus came to
save me from my sin,
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just like anyone else.
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And so things began to click.
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Amen. Amen.
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Well, that sounds like
a fascinating beginning
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to a journey
towards discipleship.
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What happened from there?
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I had grown up
with the understanding
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that
homosexuality was abomination.
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But I really felt like
it was the abomination,
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like it was the
unpardonable sin,
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and I felt so badly about myself
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because of this abomination.
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And so I went through the Bible
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and I found all
the abominations listed
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in the Bible.
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I put them all
together in one little basket,
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in a paragraph and you know,
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that made me
feel so much better,
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not about my sin
but about my chances,
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you know, for
overcoming as well.
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So if God could
make a liar honest,
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and humble the proud,
if He could save Ruth,
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the idolatrous, you
know, from her idolatry,
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and there is just a long list.
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Adultery itself is considered
abomination, cross-dressing,
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certain remarriages,
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and so it's not
just homosexuality,
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of course, in the
Leviticus 18 and 20,
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we read that, "If a man lie
with mankind as with a woman,
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he has," they both, both of them
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have committed abomination.
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So I knew that, but as
I put that all together,
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I began to realize,
God's plan should be
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able to work for me as
well as for anyone else.
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Amen.
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And so also, all my life
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I had bought into this,
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of my gay life, I
should say, during my gay life
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I had bought into this
myth that I was born gay,
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and once gay, always gay.
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And people couldn't really
talk to me about the issue
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because I had
all kinds of excuses,
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because I was born gay.
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But then, I began to
realize another realization
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that the cause of homosexuality
is totally irrelevant.
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If someone is
drowning in the sea
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and you've heard me
say this many times,
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it doesn't matter why, does it?
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If the lifeguard comes out,
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he's not going
to interrogate you
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as how you got out there.
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What matters is the lifeguard.
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So people can argue about
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the causes of
homosexuality indefinitely,
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but the Bible
doesn't seem to focus
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upon the causes for
addiction, or bondage, or sin.
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The Bible is
all about solutions.
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And so I began to
focus on solutions
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rather than excuses
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and that was a
very big help for me,
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it propelled me forward
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and then the next thing
was learning to forgive.
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I had grown up in a
very bad relationship
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with my father, just
a terrible relationship.
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I mean, it got
better over the years,
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but I was holding on to
all kinds of resentments
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which left me, I call
it emotionally retarded,
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but I had a psychiatrist
correct me at one point
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and say, we
have a term for that,
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it's called emotional
arrest, not retardation.
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When I started
facing my resentments,
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and when I confronted my father
with a spirit of forgiveness,
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and he was just weeping,
asking me to forgive him
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for all the ways he had
wronged me in my childhood
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and it was a mutual discussion
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and our hearts just melted,
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you know, as we
confessed to each other,
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we forgave each other.
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And I'll have to tell
you, Danielle, from that point,
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I mean, it was like this huge
load just rolled off my back.
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I was...
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I felt such a sense of freedom
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just by being able
to forgive and let go.
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When you do
that, it doesn't mean
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you are struck with amnesia,
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my father and I
didn't forget the past.
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In fact, from that day
forward, if things came up
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from the past, we could
laugh about these things,
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we could talk openly, it
just didn't matter anymore.
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We remembered
that it didn't matter
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because we had the
spirit of forgiveness
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and that to me was just
a major, major milestone
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in my journey was
learning to forgive
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and I urge
people, if you are dealing
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with these kinds of
issues in your life,
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learn to forgive and let
go, whether the other person
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is asking for
forgiveness or not,
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it sets you free if
you can learn to forgive.
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That, right. That's right, wow.
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You know, how
important it really is to learn
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how to forgive and I
think that's a freedom
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that we all really
need on a certain level,
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each one of us.
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And it's not only is easy to
do but there is so much freedom,
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like you said, it's freeing
and there is a lot of liberty
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there in that
place of forgiveness.
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So where did your journey go
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from there to towards wholeness?
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When I went into the gay life,
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I had wrestled against
homosexuality all my life
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since my molestation
when I was four years old.
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My mind was
just totally confused
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and I resisted that in my life
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but I never told a
living soul about it.
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And so I went
through all of my young life,
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I even got
married and thinking that
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marriage was a
solution to this whole problem,
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and I can assure you
marriage is not the solution
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to any problem.
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And in fact, it can
be the beginning of woes
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if you are not
married to the right person,
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for the right reason,
and with God's blessing.
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And I just, I thought,
"Well, if I'm just married,
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it will take
care of all of these."
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And it didn't, you know,
surprise, surprise, it did not,
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and so eventually,
I just gave up on God
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and I just felt
headlonging into the gay life.
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Well, then people came to me
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and they were trying to tell me,
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"Well, this is
just all about choices."
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And I go through this
whole list of good choices
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I have made all of my
life and I don't have time
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to enumerate those
now, but I mean I just,
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I grew up as a
spiritual young person
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and I made many,
many good choices
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but what I would say is this.
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I've made a habit, all my
life, of making good choices.
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This is not about choice.
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This is just who I
am and I don't know why,
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but this is who I am.
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I have just
decided to accept who I am.
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It didn't dawn on me
that when I said that
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I decided to accept
that I was admitting
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that I had made the choice.
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I'd never made that connection
but I have learned that
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it is a matter of
choice for this reason.
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If you are
confronted with a way out,
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which the Word of God
is, now it's a choice.
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You can choose the way out
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or you can choose to stay in it.
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And you may feel
like you had no choice,
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all along the way,
00:11:32.25\00:11:33.76
but when God
steps into your life
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through some person,
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or the word, or
some circumstance,
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and He offers you a way out,
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and you don't take it,
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now it's a matter of choice.
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So it really came down on me,
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very clearly that
I did choose this,
00:11:51.34\00:11:54.34
I didn't choose the temptations,
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but I chose to give
in to those temptations.
00:11:56.85\00:12:00.25
So that was a major
epiphany for me to admit
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that I was wrong about
this whole thing about choices.
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It's hard for us to
admit we are wrong sometimes,
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sure all the time, isn't it?
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From there, I realized
that I need to walk with God
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as I chose to accept Him
and come out of that life.
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Now I needed to walk with God,
00:12:25.51\00:12:27.74
I need to spend time
with Him in the Word,
00:12:27.78\00:12:30.08
I need to spend
time with Him in prayer,
00:12:30.11\00:12:32.28
I need to spend
time with Him in nature,
00:12:32.31\00:12:34.68
and learning to walk with God
00:12:34.72\00:12:39.25
helped me realize I'm
not in this all alone.
00:12:39.29\00:12:42.19
There is someone
with me that can help me
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and encourage me along the way.
00:12:45.19\00:12:47.26
If I stumble and fall,
He is right there to say,
00:12:47.30\00:12:50.67
"Ron, get up. You can do better.
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And let's
continue this journey."
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So walking with God
00:12:56.97\00:12:58.31
became a very
important part of my life,
00:12:58.34\00:13:00.38
with morning and evening
devotions throughout the day
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and I actually uprooted
myself from Southern California
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and moved into the
Ozark Mountains of Arkansas.
00:13:06.95\00:13:09.68
That was like
whiplash... Big change.
00:13:09.72\00:13:11.92
Oh, it was like whiplash for me.
00:13:11.95\00:13:13.69
In three days, I
was going stir-crazy
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and all those trees with bugs,
00:13:16.36\00:13:17.99
crickets, and frogs,
and mites and all of that
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but I love living there now
where I'm surrounded by nature.
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And so, God is
just all around me
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in a place like that.
00:13:30.14\00:13:31.97
And then the next realization
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which is number nine
in my list of realizations
00:13:37.41\00:13:41.62
was that I needed to
protect my environment.
00:13:41.65\00:13:44.32
And that's another reason
00:13:44.35\00:13:45.69
that I moved out of
Southern Californian
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where I was a sales
manager over five counties
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and every day of the week,
I was in a different county,
00:13:54.30\00:13:56.77
and Southern California,
00:13:56.80\00:13:59.13
I knew all of the
major gay hangouts
00:13:59.17\00:14:02.50
in all of those counties.
00:14:02.54\00:14:04.11
Every day when I got off work,
I knew where to go to indulge,
00:14:04.14\00:14:09.58
you know, my addictive life.
00:14:09.61\00:14:12.61
And so it came to my realization
00:14:12.65\00:14:18.52
that I needed to
really protect my environment.
00:14:18.55\00:14:21.72
I needed to be
careful with what I watch.
00:14:21.76\00:14:24.36
I learned how
to flip the switch,
00:14:24.39\00:14:26.26
and turn the page,
and change the channel,
00:14:26.29\00:14:28.83
and turn my head,
and change the subject.
00:14:28.86\00:14:33.07
Music, and I know, Danielle,
you relate to the music issue.
00:14:33.10\00:14:36.17
Music was a big part of my life
00:14:36.20\00:14:37.57
because I was a dancer
and a dance instructor,
00:14:37.61\00:14:40.24
and I was always
involved in music.
00:14:40.28\00:14:43.51
And I'll just
throw this out there,
00:14:43.55\00:14:46.28
kind of as a
little side issue here,
00:14:46.31\00:14:51.45
but I think you
can relate to it.
00:14:51.49\00:14:53.36
In church, if
there is the wrong music,
00:14:53.39\00:14:57.63
and we have had
cases where you and I
00:14:57.66\00:14:59.06
have had to get up and walk out
00:14:59.09\00:15:01.30
because we have to
protect our environment.
00:15:01.33\00:15:04.23
And music is just one example,
it pulls us back in our minds,
00:15:04.27\00:15:08.34
it brings back memories,
it brings back feelings,
00:15:08.37\00:15:11.31
it brings back emotions,
00:15:11.34\00:15:14.14
strong
temptation to get back into,
00:15:14.18\00:15:19.08
in our minds to
think about things
00:15:19.11\00:15:20.75
we shouldn't be thinking about.
00:15:20.78\00:15:22.48
So it's very important
to protect the environment.
00:15:22.52\00:15:27.02
And so this is
one of those things,
00:15:27.06\00:15:29.86
you know, Philippians 4:8 says,
00:15:29.89\00:15:31.43
"Whatsoever
things are true, honest,
00:15:31.46\00:15:33.83
just, pure, lovely, of
good report and so forth,
00:15:33.86\00:15:38.37
think on these things."
00:15:38.40\00:15:39.73
And I'm kind of a news addict,
00:15:39.77\00:15:41.84
I mean I like watching the news,
00:15:41.87\00:15:43.30
and it's hard
sometimes to watch the news
00:15:43.34\00:15:46.37
if you are
thinking about, you know,
00:15:46.41\00:15:49.04
what's true, and honest,
just, and pure, and lovely.
00:15:49.08\00:15:52.51
But these are
very important things,
00:15:52.55\00:15:54.32
and James 4:7 says,
00:15:54.35\00:15:56.85
"We ought to
submit ourselves to God,
00:15:56.89\00:15:59.92
resist the devil, and
then he will flee from us."
00:15:59.95\00:16:02.99
And so this is all
a part of protecting
00:16:03.02\00:16:04.63
our environment which is very,
00:16:04.66\00:16:06.29
very important in
our type of situation,
00:16:06.33\00:16:09.33
well, with any person.
00:16:09.36\00:16:11.10
Yeah, I
definitely agree, you know,
00:16:11.13\00:16:13.34
and I can relate to
what you are sharing
00:16:13.37\00:16:15.47
because I had to go
through that process of...
00:16:15.50\00:16:18.11
Yeah, I just realized
00:16:18.14\00:16:20.08
there is someone
that came to me once
00:16:20.11\00:16:22.94
and said, "So do you
think that you are cured,
00:16:22.98\00:16:26.25
I mean can you go
now into a gay bar
00:16:26.28\00:16:28.18
and not be tempted?"
00:16:28.22\00:16:30.42
I said, "My momma
didn't raise a fool, you know."
00:16:30.45\00:16:35.29
Satan is supernatural,
00:16:35.32\00:16:37.03
I know where he
hangs out in many places,
00:16:37.06\00:16:40.16
why would I go try to
tempt him to tempt me.
00:16:40.20\00:16:44.27
That's not the way you
protect your environment.
00:16:44.30\00:16:47.07
You realize that
he is a formidable foe
00:16:47.10\00:16:50.34
and you don't willingly give him
00:16:50.37\00:16:53.58
any advantage over you.
00:16:53.61\00:16:55.04
That doesn't mean
you are not converted,
00:16:55.08\00:16:56.91
it doesn't mean
you are a new creature.
00:16:56.95\00:16:58.71
It just means that you
now are wise to his antics,
00:16:58.75\00:17:03.05
to his tactics, and
you don't place yourself
00:17:03.08\00:17:05.72
where he will have
an advantage over you.
00:17:05.75\00:17:08.32
So we have to guard our senses,
and also the places that we go,
00:17:08.36\00:17:11.16
and the
associations that we keep,
00:17:11.19\00:17:13.26
and lot of
different things like that.
00:17:13.29\00:17:15.16
Exactly.
00:17:15.20\00:17:16.53
So if we are at point 10, or 11,
00:17:16.56\00:17:18.47
I mean, in your
journey, you said there were 14,
00:17:18.50\00:17:21.77
what else comes
next in your journey
00:17:21.80\00:17:24.24
away from the addictive
lifestyle of homosexuality?
00:17:24.27\00:17:28.68
It became important to
me in reading Scripture,
00:17:28.71\00:17:32.68
to personalize Scripture,
00:17:32.71\00:17:34.92
and I have a
collection of promises,
00:17:34.95\00:17:39.05
I call it a rainbow of promises.
00:17:39.09\00:17:41.79
I like the idea of
reclaiming the rainbow,
00:17:41.82\00:17:44.59
I'm gonna write a
book about that someday.
00:17:44.63\00:17:47.10
Oh, oh, I've just
revealed what I planned to do,
00:17:47.13\00:17:50.07
someone's gonna take that away.
00:17:50.10\00:17:51.63
You better hurry
up then. That's right.
00:17:51.67\00:17:53.67
But you take all
of these promises,
00:17:53.70\00:17:56.77
these exceeding great
and precious promises of God
00:17:56.81\00:18:00.08
and you insert
yourself into the context and,
00:18:00.11\00:18:03.31
you know, just as an
example with 2 Corinthians 5:17,
00:18:03.35\00:18:07.12
which I think is one of
your favorite texts and mine.
00:18:07.15\00:18:09.82
And Coming Out Ministries
is kind of a theme text for us.
00:18:09.85\00:18:13.69
Therefore, if any man,
especially Ron Woolsey,
00:18:13.72\00:18:17.69
be in Christ, Ron
is now a new creature.
00:18:17.73\00:18:21.96
Old things are passed away,
00:18:22.00\00:18:24.07
in Arkansas that means
we have a funeral, you know?
00:18:24.10\00:18:26.80
Old things are passed away,
all things have become new,
00:18:26.84\00:18:31.44
and when I put myself
in that, if I am in Christ,
00:18:31.47\00:18:38.21
then I am a new
creature in Christ.
00:18:38.25\00:18:40.22
I personally, my
old self is gone,
00:18:40.25\00:18:44.02
I starve that, I bury
that, then I become new
00:18:44.05\00:18:49.09
and I really
like the commentary,
00:18:49.12\00:18:51.36
I have a study Bible,
00:18:51.39\00:18:52.93
a commentary
Bible, and the commentary
00:18:52.96\00:18:54.70
on that says that
the new birth consists
00:18:54.73\00:18:57.57
of having new motives,
00:18:57.60\00:18:59.97
and new tastes,
and new tendencies.
00:19:00.00\00:19:02.64
I read that as a gay
person and I got excited
00:19:02.67\00:19:05.77
because I was
looking for a way out
00:19:05.81\00:19:08.28
and then it goes on to say that
a genuine conversion changes,
00:19:08.31\00:19:12.41
hereditary, and
cultivated tendencies to wrong,
00:19:12.45\00:19:16.79
and I got excited all over again
00:19:16.82\00:19:18.92
realizing that if I
factored into my experience
00:19:18.95\00:19:23.12
the miracle
working power of God,
00:19:23.16\00:19:26.09
anything is possible.
00:19:26.13\00:19:29.16
With human reasoning,
psychology, psychiatry,
00:19:29.20\00:19:32.67
and so forth, apart from
God, change is impossible.
00:19:32.70\00:19:36.07
We are fallen human beings,
00:19:36.10\00:19:37.81
but what is so often left
out of that whole field of study
00:19:37.84\00:19:41.78
is the miracle
working power of God.
00:19:41.81\00:19:44.65
And so in
personalizing Scripture,
00:19:44.68\00:19:48.45
it just brings it alive.
00:19:48.48\00:19:49.82
1 Corinthians
6:9-11, is another one.
00:19:49.85\00:19:52.82
We'll list all these behaviors
that will not be in heaven.
00:19:52.85\00:19:57.29
I found myself in
there multiple times.
00:19:57.33\00:20:00.00
I was going to be
lost multiple times
00:20:00.03\00:20:01.73
and then, verse 11 says,
00:20:01.76\00:20:03.60
"And such were some of
you, Ron, but you are washed,
00:20:03.63\00:20:09.97
you are
sanctified, you are justified,"
00:20:10.01\00:20:12.44
and when you put
your name in those texts,
00:20:12.47\00:20:16.04
it really pops, it
really becomes meaningful
00:20:16.08\00:20:21.18
and so doing that,
00:20:21.22\00:20:23.12
the next step was, I realized,
00:20:23.15\00:20:24.92
I need to start
acting upon God's Word.
00:20:24.95\00:20:28.76
When I read a
promise, I just accept it.
00:20:28.79\00:20:32.09
And I incorporate
into my life, I believe it,
00:20:32.13\00:20:34.86
and I just act as
though I really believe
00:20:34.90\00:20:37.20
what I am reading
00:20:37.23\00:20:38.57
because there is
power in the Word.
00:20:38.60\00:20:40.97
You know, I was
talking about how I was reading
00:20:41.00\00:20:42.80
the Word with a Margarita
00:20:42.84\00:20:44.21
and a cigarette in
the very beginning,
00:20:44.24\00:20:46.64
and when I got
to a certain point,
00:20:46.68\00:20:48.98
I found myself
snuffing out the cigarettes,
00:20:49.01\00:20:51.71
I just couldn't do that anymore,
00:20:51.75\00:20:53.52
and it's because, Danielle,
00:20:53.55\00:20:54.88
there is power
in the Word of God.
00:20:54.92\00:20:57.99
"By the word of the
Lord were the heavens made,
00:20:58.02\00:21:00.46
all the hosts within by
the breath of his mouth,
00:21:00.49\00:21:02.22
where He spake, He was done,
00:21:02.26\00:21:04.63
He commanded and it stood fast.
00:21:04.66\00:21:06.76
That same creative power is
right here, in written form.
00:21:06.80\00:21:11.27
And as we read the Word of
God, and we access that power,
00:21:11.30\00:21:16.24
we are beholding
Christ and we become changed
00:21:16.27\00:21:19.41
and you know, when
Jesus said to Lazarus,
00:21:19.44\00:21:21.84
"Lazarus, come forth."
00:21:21.88\00:21:23.28
That's re-creative power
00:21:23.31\00:21:26.31
and that's what
we have access to.
00:21:26.35\00:21:30.09
"If the Son
therefore shall make you free,"
00:21:30.12\00:21:32.19
Ron, Danielle, "Then
you are free indeed."
00:21:32.22\00:21:36.89
That word indeed, free indeed,
00:21:36.93\00:21:39.43
that's the inspiration
for this whole study.
00:21:39.46\00:21:43.67
We don't have to keep, you know,
00:21:43.70\00:21:46.13
dragging around
the ball and chain,
00:21:46.17\00:21:48.37
we can be set free.
00:21:48.40\00:21:50.27
And we shouldn't
pick up that chain
00:21:50.31\00:21:51.74
and drag it around
as an identity either,
00:21:51.77\00:21:53.78
but that's another
subject for another day.
00:21:53.81\00:21:57.01
The 12th point that
00:21:57.05\00:21:59.38
I want to stress is
that of being grateful.
00:21:59.41\00:22:02.68
Yes.
00:22:02.72\00:22:04.05
An attitude of gratitude.
00:22:04.09\00:22:05.42
You know, God created us
man, and woman for each other.
00:22:05.45\00:22:11.66
And we need to be
grateful for what He gave us
00:22:11.69\00:22:14.60
and when He created
this institution of marriage,
00:22:14.63\00:22:17.70
with that institution,
00:22:17.73\00:22:19.57
He instilled the wonderful
gift of sexual intimacy.
00:22:19.60\00:22:24.34
That gift goes
with that package,
00:22:24.37\00:22:26.47
it goes with institution only,
00:22:26.51\00:22:30.11
and we need to be
grateful for that.
00:22:30.15\00:22:33.55
Outside of the
marriage institution,
00:22:33.58\00:22:36.35
it is a violation of
God's will and His law.
00:22:36.38\00:22:39.45
And so when a...
00:22:39.49\00:22:43.12
Now this is kind
of the way I think
00:22:43.16\00:22:44.66
and some people think that
00:22:44.69\00:22:46.03
I think in a
strange way sometimes,
00:22:46.06\00:22:48.46
but if I, a man, am
lusting after another man,
00:22:48.50\00:22:54.20
am I not coveting
what God really has
00:22:54.24\00:22:56.37
for someone
else, like for a woman?
00:22:56.40\00:22:58.77
Sure. If I am lust...
00:22:58.81\00:23:01.08
If a woman is
lusting after a woman,
00:23:01.11\00:23:03.68
is she not coveting,
is she not ungrateful
00:23:03.71\00:23:08.08
for what God has created
00:23:08.12\00:23:10.79
and we just need to
accept that God is love
00:23:10.82\00:23:16.02
and that everything
that He has created is
00:23:16.06\00:23:20.50
for our own well-being,
our own fulfillment and joy,
00:23:20.53\00:23:24.67
and happiness,
and success in life,
00:23:24.70\00:23:27.97
and so we need to go
forward with a grateful heart
00:23:28.00\00:23:31.77
and not look at the law
of God and the will of God
00:23:31.81\00:23:35.01
as a restrictive fence
but as a protective hedge.
00:23:35.04\00:23:41.48
That's right.
00:23:41.52\00:23:42.85
And I think what you are sharing
00:23:42.88\00:23:44.22
makes so much
sense and I know it,
00:23:44.25\00:23:45.59
in my experience,
00:23:45.62\00:23:46.96
as I was really
struggling with depression,
00:23:46.99\00:23:48.72
and anxiety
attacks and all of these.
00:23:48.76\00:23:50.83
That key point right
there was revolutionary for me
00:23:50.86\00:23:54.00
and just focusing my mind
00:23:54.03\00:23:56.03
on the things I
could be grateful for,
00:23:56.06\00:23:57.60
really started to
bring me out of those clouds
00:23:57.63\00:24:01.60
and the pit that I
was in for a lot of years.
00:24:01.64\00:24:04.61
Exactly, yeah.
00:24:04.64\00:24:05.97
And the Bible tells us to
rejoice in the Lord always,
00:24:06.01\00:24:08.01
even when the times are dark.
00:24:08.04\00:24:09.81
There's always something
there that we can be grateful
00:24:09.84\00:24:12.55
for so much that we
have to be grateful for.
00:24:12.58\00:24:16.02
So is there some secret to,
00:24:16.05\00:24:19.25
you know, to
wrap these things up
00:24:19.29\00:24:21.06
and to bring a conclusion,
there must be the crowning,
00:24:21.09\00:24:25.69
the crowning part.
00:24:25.73\00:24:27.06
Well, there is
a two part secret,
00:24:27.10\00:24:29.56
and I had up to
this point in my life,
00:24:29.60\00:24:35.17
identified
myself by my thinking,
00:24:35.20\00:24:37.74
by my, you know,
00:24:37.77\00:24:39.11
"As a man thinketh
in his heart, so is he,"
00:24:39.14\00:24:42.88
and I just thought of myself as,
00:24:42.91\00:24:46.68
well, let's put it this way,
00:24:46.72\00:24:48.05
I identified with the
nature of my temptations.
00:24:48.08\00:24:52.35
But through my
study, I began to realize
00:24:52.39\00:24:55.16
that temptation is not sin,
00:24:55.19\00:24:59.16
because Hebrews 4 says that
00:24:59.19\00:25:00.80
Jesus was tempted in
all points like as we are,
00:25:00.83\00:25:04.03
there again, in all
points like Ron Woolsey.
00:25:04.07\00:25:06.74
I shared that
with a professor once
00:25:06.77\00:25:08.44
and he was startled and he said,
00:25:08.47\00:25:09.80
"Well, you don't think
Jesus was tempted like that,
00:25:09.84\00:25:11.87
do you?"
00:25:11.91\00:25:13.24
I said, "Well, how do you
think He was tempted, like you?"
00:25:13.27\00:25:16.48
Well, that's not fair. Sure.
00:25:16.51\00:25:18.85
Personalizing scripture,
temptation is not sin.
00:25:18.88\00:25:22.12
Jesus was
tempted, yet without sin.
00:25:22.15\00:25:25.15
Not only that, in Hebrews
2, "He suffered being tempted."
00:25:25.19\00:25:28.46
So He struggled,
and in Hebrews 12,
00:25:28.49\00:25:30.99
"He resisted unto
blood, striving against sin."
00:25:31.03\00:25:35.06
And so we know that
00:25:35.10\00:25:38.17
Jesus was not the
chiefest of sinners,
00:25:38.20\00:25:40.80
and He was
tempted in all points,
00:25:40.84\00:25:42.17
like as we are.
00:25:42.20\00:25:43.54
When I realized, Danielle,
00:25:43.57\00:25:44.91
that temptation does
not need to define who I am,
00:25:44.94\00:25:47.48
that, like the
forgiveness thing,
00:25:47.51\00:25:49.24
that was a very
liberating moment for me,
00:25:49.28\00:25:52.41
to realize that I
don't need to identify
00:25:52.45\00:25:54.85
with Satan's plan for my life...
00:25:54.88\00:25:57.52
I can identify with
God's plan for my life.
00:25:57.55\00:26:00.86
And then the final
thing that I came to,
00:26:00.89\00:26:03.53
was realizing that the
secret to overcoming sin,
00:26:03.56\00:26:09.10
the real secret
is helping others
00:26:09.13\00:26:12.00
to overcome sin. That's right.
00:26:12.03\00:26:13.87
And I think that's one reason
the Lord put me in ministry,
00:26:13.90\00:26:17.07
maybe you too,
because He knows that
00:26:17.11\00:26:19.41
it's the only way He
can get me to heaven,
00:26:19.44\00:26:20.88
is to keep me
involved in helping others,
00:26:20.91\00:26:23.78
the secret to overcoming
00:26:23.81\00:26:25.15
is helping
others to overcome, how?
00:26:25.18\00:26:27.72
Revelation 12:11,
"By the blood of the lamb
00:26:27.75\00:26:31.25
and the word of our testimony."
00:26:31.29\00:26:33.25
As we tell the story of Jesus,
00:26:33.29\00:26:36.42
we are helping
others to overcome sin,
00:26:36.46\00:26:39.19
and then as we
live the life of Jesus,
00:26:39.23\00:26:42.50
and we share our testimonies
00:26:42.53\00:26:44.07
of what He has
done in our lives,
00:26:44.10\00:26:45.90
that's positive
reinforcement for ourselves
00:26:45.93\00:26:49.30
and it's also a
blessing to others.
00:26:49.34\00:26:51.61
And that to me is the
secret to overcoming sin,
00:26:51.64\00:26:55.01
helping others to do so.
00:26:55.04\00:26:56.68
Amen, excellent.
00:26:56.71\00:26:58.05
Thank you so
much for sharing, Ron.
00:26:58.08\00:26:59.41
So can you just give us a
recap of all of those 14 points?
00:26:59.45\00:27:02.28
Okay.
00:27:02.32\00:27:03.95
Number one,
realize God's love for you.
00:27:03.99\00:27:08.46
Number two, face yourself,
be willing to face yourself.
00:27:08.49\00:27:11.83
Number three,
acknowledge that this issue,
00:27:11.86\00:27:14.60
your issue is a sin issue.
00:27:14.63\00:27:17.10
Jesus came to save you from sin.
00:27:17.13\00:27:19.50
Number four,
salvation is for you too,
00:27:19.53\00:27:22.17
no matter who you are.
00:27:22.20\00:27:23.91
Number five, the
cause of homosexuality,
00:27:23.94\00:27:26.44
or whatever the issue
is totally irrelevant.
00:27:26.47\00:27:30.25
Number six, learn to
forgive, a big point.
00:27:30.28\00:27:34.28
Learn to forgive, number seven,
00:27:34.32\00:27:36.18
it is a matter of choice.
00:27:36.22\00:27:37.55
Number eight, walk with God.
00:27:37.59\00:27:39.65
Number nine,
protect your environment.
00:27:39.69\00:27:42.12
Number ten,
personalize scripture.
00:27:42.16\00:27:44.86
Eleven, act upon God's Word.
00:27:44.89\00:27:47.53
Twelve, be grateful.
00:27:47.56\00:27:49.96
Thirteen, temptation is not sin.
00:27:50.00\00:27:52.37
And fourteen, the
secret to overcoming sin
00:27:52.40\00:27:54.74
is helping others to overcome.
00:27:54.77\00:27:56.50
Amen. Amen.
00:27:56.54\00:27:58.37
Well, thank you for joining
us on Pure Choices today.
00:27:58.41\00:28:00.48
Until next time,
may God bless you.
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