The following program
discusses sensitive issues.
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Parents are cautioned
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that some
material may be too candid
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for younger children.
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Hello, and
welcome to Pure Choices.
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I'm your host
Pastor Joshua Nelson,
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and I'm so excited again
that you decided to join us.
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We have a really
good one for you today
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as you can tell I'm
kind of casual today.
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We are gonna talk about
a good subject on dating,
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talking, courting
what's the difference.
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But before we go
into our topic for today,
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I'm gonna introduce
to you our panel again.
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To my left here we
have Miss Kimberly Pearson,
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the assistant
chaplain of Oakwood University
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and a good friend of mine.
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And we also have
Pastor Kory Douglas,
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who is the pastor in Missouri
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and he is
pastoring the Grand Avenue
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in New Life SDA church.
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We also have Miss Jeanne Mogusu,
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she is the president of
the blasting Association
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in the seminary,
happy to have you here.
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And we have
Pastor Marquis Jackson,
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who is the pastor in the Marian,
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no I'm sorry, Manning and...
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You already passed it
now, something Maranatha, boy.
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He's my friend, he's
my friend, he's my friend,
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it's like something
Manning in South Carolina.
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So we're happy to
have this panel here today
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and we're talking about dating.
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That's a really important topic.
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Talking, courting, you
know, what's the difference?
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But before we
get into our topic,
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I wanna read this letter that
came in about this individual.
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So let's read this here.
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Yeah, all right.
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He says, "I'm a
sophomore in college
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and I've been with
a few girls so far.
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I like to say, I'm just talking
but they say we're dating.
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I get tired of
labeling my relationships
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because they always end
badly and then people get hurt.
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Is it okay to just
have some casual dates?
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I mean, I'm not trying
to get married right now.
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What do you think?"
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That's what we
have to talk about.
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Who wants to address it first?
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Sounds like a lot, man. Yeah.
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Go ahead.
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I think the first
thing to decide is,
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"What is dating?"
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like, we like to
put all these labels
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to relationships
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but we haven't
defined or communicated
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what these labels are?
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I don't even know if we are sure
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'cause even in
the letter he said,
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"I'm talking to somebody.
We have been on a few dates.
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Is it just okay to date people?
I just want to date casually."
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But he just said,
he was talking, I mean,
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what's the difference
between, you know, each one.
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I mean, he even sounds
a little bit confuse about
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what they might be, so.
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He sounds like he
really understands.
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That, yeah, the girls
who are not understanding,
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he like some people.
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They are cool.
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He just wants to
get to know them.
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The end.
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Okay, let's just
define, what he's talking?
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I mean he says, he's
just talking to them,
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you know, what
does that really mean?
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Jackson, do you
want to take that?
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It depends on
the person, you know,
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you can be someone
who's in a situation
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where you're talking with people
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but you're talking
so many different people
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but the level of
talking is so great
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that it may seem
to the other person
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that it's really building up
more into what they're thinking
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rather than what
you might be thinking.
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So I guess, was it
ever a line established
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of where they are going in
this talking-dating situation.
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Okay.
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I think any
time, I think any time
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you're in a relationship
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and one person is not
clear on what is going on,
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then someone is not
being straight or forward
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about what is really going on
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because I think as long
as you're two mature adults
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because in my opinion
dating, talking, courting
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is for mature people.
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As long as you're
two mature adults,
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you have to
define what is going on.
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If you don't define, you know,
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we define that
you're my brother,
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you're my sister,
and you're my father
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every other relationship has
definitional boundaries to it.
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Why is it so, why is it that
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when you want to
get to know someone,
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we try to be as
ambiguous as possible.
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Okay. It does not reflect well.
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Okay, well, let me challenge,
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let me just put
out a little definition
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of what I think it is.
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You all challenge me
if you think I'm wrong.
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Okay, so talking, I
would think talking is more of,
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you're just in a relationship
with this person possibly,
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but you may be in relation
with other people as well.
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You're just
getting to know them,
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you're just kind of
building a relationship
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but it's no commitment.
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Okay.
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Dating would be
where there is a commitment
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and it's probably
exclusive commitment
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where you just being
telling with that person.
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You all are an item, okay,
and then courting would be,
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well, now you're saying
yes with this exclusive person,
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now we're looking
forward to marriage, okay.
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So, so...
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Now would you agree
that that's pretty much
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the general understanding
of what those terms are
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or are they different
understandings you think?
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I would say that,
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that is kind of the
overarching understanding.
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Oh, we are just
talking that kind of means
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we kind of like each other
but there's nothing serious.
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While I agree that may
be the general terminology.
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I think that, that is part
of what creates the ambiguity
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about where are we, you know.
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What Jeanne said is that
dating is for mature people.
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I think we need to put
some more definition to that
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because everybody
thinks they're mature.
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"I'm mature enough to date."
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Fifteen year
olds, twelve year olds
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are mature enough to date.
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Yeah.
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Dating is for people
who want to get married.
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If you are not
ready to get married,
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you don't need to be dating.
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Okay, so...
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And so what I
want to say to that
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is I think that
talking is what initially
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we should all be as friends.
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Talking is
friendship. We are all friends.
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Then the dating process
is getting to know people,
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you know, in a more I guess,
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"I'm checking
you out kind of way"
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but not exclusively,
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you're not spending
lots of time alone together.
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Your group
settings, you're hanging out,
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they are meeting parents,
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you're coming around
family and friends together.
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Then once you decide
this is the kind of person
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I want to marry, I
feel like God is leading,
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then you court them.
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Okay, I'm still a
little confused because,
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and I don't know
if I totally agree
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because a date changes.
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You know, today is a certain day
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and then tomorrow it changes
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so why wouldn't it be the
same when I'm in a relationship?
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Why should I have to be,
you know, labeled as dating?
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Just the terminology
kind of seems weird to me,
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you know, but yet now it's not,
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"I'm suppose to be exclusive
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but I'm just kind of exploring,"
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I'm just trying to kind of
see, you know, who's out there?
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When do I ever do that,
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and if I say, I'm
talking then I look,
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"Oh, you don't
wanna make commitment."
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Yeah.
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But I think that's
the reason for talking.
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I'm gonna be honest.
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This character has
got me in a lot of trouble
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and it probably will
in the near future until,
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you know, I have
finally checked marriage
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on my tax form
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but, you know, talking to me
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is just that
exploring an option,
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seeing who's out
there, getting to know people,
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you know, seeing if are
we compatible, you know,
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if we spend five minutes
together, do I feel like,
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you know, I want to,
you know, just strangle you.
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Do you make me
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the happiest
person in the world,
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you know, within that time,
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you know, but I
don't see any reason
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why we can't be doing
that with more than one person,
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you know, just
getting to know you,
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having a phone
conversation here or there.
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Seeing how the
chemistry works, you know,
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you don't wanna date somebody
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who after talking to
them three or four times
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you have nothing to talk about,
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you know, going forward is like,
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"Okay, well, you know,
maybe we should not date"
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you know, but that's
what I think talking is for.
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Just like she says
like being friends,
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but you at least you know
I'm interested a little bit
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in the fact that I wanna
kind of get to know you better.
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Okay, I see,
Jeanne, shaking her head
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because I feel
like there's something
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that you may disagree with that.
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I totally disagree
with this talking business
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and this is, this is
why I disagree with it.
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I just feel like some, most,
a lot of times talking for men
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has been used to have
relationship benefits.
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Yeah, relationship
benefits without the commitment.
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So you have someone
who says you're talking
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but literally treats you
like he's your girlfriend,
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you know, I mean, no,
no, you're his girlfriend.
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Yeah, so he does not
want you seeing other people.
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He does, so,
whereas he would, of course,
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he is exploring his options,
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he wants to see
you with only him.
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He has issues with whatever
he sees you with somebody else
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or whenever you're
getting close to someone,
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I think the whole
talking thing is, is, you know.
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Trouble. Yeah, trouble in a bag.
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We're talking about
the definition on mature.
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So if two people mature
then that sort of something
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that should be
spoken about, you know,
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I find you on a male
to female perspective,
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I find you as
attractive young lady.
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We have good conversation.
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I'm enjoying our conversation
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so that can let her
know that it's conversation,
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but if it's all
boo'd up and, you know,
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yoked up and stuff like that
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and you just
saying you are talking,
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then that can
bring a misperception
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to the young lady
which is dangerous,
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so that's where the
communication kicks in.
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One thing I've
learned in my relationship
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with my
girlfriend is communication
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is very important
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because once you don't
have that communication,
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misperceptions kick in,
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and that's where the whole thing
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starts to get really cloudy.
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And I wanna say, I think
that's a huge part of it.
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A person who is ready to
date needs to also be a person
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who is ready to communicate,
they need to be able to say,
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"Hey, you know, I
like getting to know you,"
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or "hey, I'm
not cool with that."
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Because dating, okay,
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so if I go buy
a cell phone right
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or buy something,
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usually there's a
term of agreement contract
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that you have to sign.
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Most of the
time, let's be honest,
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you like flip the
pages, get to this line
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and you sign it
until something happens
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and all of a sudden you're like,
00:09:59.33\00:10:00.66
"I didn't agree
to that and I guess
00:10:00.70\00:10:02.03
it's in the
terms of the contract.
00:10:02.06\00:10:03.40
So dating is the process
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of reading the
terms of agreement
00:10:05.13\00:10:07.90
to a life long contract
00:10:07.94\00:10:09.90
or marriage, you know, marriage.
00:10:09.94\00:10:11.71
But I wanna challenge that
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'cause I think
that in some cases,
00:10:13.21\00:10:16.48
you know, when a
guy says to a girl,
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"Will you be my
girlfriend," she hears,
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"Will you be my wife."
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And I would add
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and I've been
on this experience,
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I've been in a situation
where I've expressly said,
00:10:28.32\00:10:31.36
you know, "Let's
get to know each other,
00:10:31.39\00:10:32.99
let's be friends,
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" and we'll talk for three weeks
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and I promise you at
the end of three weeks
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I'll get the phone
call and you always know
00:10:37.73\00:10:39.40
what is coming
because they're like,
00:10:39.43\00:10:40.77
"You know, I really think
00:10:40.80\00:10:42.14
we should talk about something."
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And I'm like "Oh, man,"
00:10:43.67\00:10:45.01
and they're
like, "Well, you know,
00:10:45.04\00:10:46.37
what are we now?
00:10:46.41\00:10:47.74
And I'm like, "Well,
three weeks ago we just said,
00:10:47.78\00:10:49.11
we were gonna talk and
be friends and, you know,
00:10:49.14\00:10:51.51
it's only three weeks
later, you know," or, you know,
00:10:51.55\00:10:54.65
you say, you know, "let's
talk, let's be friends and then,
00:10:54.68\00:10:57.02
you know, in the background
you're hearing parents saying
00:10:57.05\00:11:00.02
or whispers though, you want
to Skype with that boy again?
00:11:00.06\00:11:03.09
You know, you want
to phone him again?
00:11:03.12\00:11:04.49
And what are the
cases and, you know.
00:11:04.53\00:11:06.03
They're adult later on.
00:11:06.06\00:11:07.40
Yeah, and see
that's why I like talking
00:11:07.43\00:11:08.76
'cause the thing
about talking is,
00:11:08.80\00:11:10.13
you know, there's
no pressure, you know,
00:11:10.17\00:11:11.63
you don't, there's no meeting
of parents, there's no all,
00:11:11.67\00:11:14.04
you know, this
is my dad, you know,
00:11:14.07\00:11:16.04
we're just
getting to know each other
00:11:16.07\00:11:17.41
but I have experience
00:11:17.44\00:11:18.77
where even though you
have communicated well,
00:11:18.81\00:11:21.24
you have let them know the terms
00:11:21.28\00:11:23.55
for that period of time
that a lot of women have babies
00:11:23.58\00:11:26.72
because of the
pressures of finding a good man
00:11:26.75\00:11:29.05
that they're so quick
to jump on it and say,
00:11:29.08\00:11:31.35
"Well, this is a relationship
00:11:31.39\00:11:32.72
and when can we
go to the next level?
00:11:32.75\00:11:34.46
I'm ready to go to next level.
I think I know you enough.
00:11:34.49\00:11:36.02
It's been three weeks."
00:11:36.06\00:11:37.39
Okay, so we're
going hard on the girl.
00:11:37.43\00:11:39.36
Yeah, you are right.
00:11:39.39\00:11:40.73
I'm gonna let you
off the fingers up there
00:11:40.76\00:11:42.10
because from my point
of view we see, you know,
00:11:42.13\00:11:43.83
that you all just can't wait,
00:11:43.87\00:11:45.20
can't let the talking
just be talking, you know.
00:11:45.23\00:11:46.97
No, but the question is,
no the question then becomes,
00:11:47.00\00:11:49.90
"Okay, fine, you have
expressly communicated
00:11:49.94\00:11:52.41
that you want
to be just friends,
00:11:52.44\00:11:53.98
you want to just,
you know, explore,
00:11:54.01\00:11:57.05
you know, where this
could be you're interested in
00:11:57.08\00:11:59.41
and all of that stuff.
00:11:59.45\00:12:00.78
But the question is,
"How have you been acting
00:12:00.82\00:12:03.39
in those three weeks?
00:12:03.42\00:12:04.75
Yeah, yeah, yeah, hallelujah.
00:12:04.79\00:12:06.12
Because you can't tell me,
you know, actions, you know,
00:12:06.15\00:12:09.59
a little wise man
wherever he may be,
00:12:09.62\00:12:11.76
I don't even know
who he is said, you know,
00:12:11.79\00:12:13.80
"Actions speak
louder than words."
00:12:13.83\00:12:15.60
So if your
actions are demonstrating
00:12:15.63\00:12:18.87
something different to me,
00:12:18.90\00:12:20.40
then I'm gonna go
much more by your actions
00:12:20.44\00:12:23.44
than what you tell me.
00:12:23.47\00:12:24.81
You can tell me all
day long we're friends,
00:12:24.84\00:12:26.71
but if you're constantly
holding my hand, you know,
00:12:26.74\00:12:29.74
yeah, I was trying to
hold your hand, you know.
00:12:29.78\00:12:32.51
What are you
trying to say to me?
00:12:32.55\00:12:36.08
Let me communicate, you know.
Free choices, free choices.
00:12:36.12\00:12:38.59
Yeah, but, you know,
00:12:38.62\00:12:40.69
you are
constantly holding my hand,
00:12:40.72\00:12:42.06
we are on the phone for hours
late into the night, you know,
00:12:42.09\00:12:45.59
we're talking about
marriage commitment issues,
00:12:45.63\00:12:49.30
you know, instead of
just, "I want to know you.
00:12:49.33\00:12:52.27
What is your favorite color?"
00:12:52.30\00:12:53.64
You know, if we're
delving into intimate knowledge
00:12:53.67\00:12:58.04
of one another
00:12:58.07\00:12:59.41
then what you're communicating
and what you're doing
00:12:59.44\00:13:02.94
are two totally different things
00:13:02.98\00:13:04.48
and that's where
you get confused.
00:13:04.51\00:13:05.98
But I think part of the
issue is the older you get,
00:13:06.01\00:13:09.05
the less you want to do,
"What's your favorite colors,
00:13:09.08\00:13:11.95
what kind of food do you like?"
00:13:11.99\00:13:14.52
You know, you get to
the point where you're like,
00:13:14.56\00:13:16.16
"Listen, what are you
about, this is what I'm about,
00:13:16.19\00:13:18.93
less, you know, move forward."
00:13:18.96\00:13:21.16
If you're talking to
somebody for six months,
00:13:21.20\00:13:23.70
you know what that means.
00:13:23.73\00:13:25.07
Like, what point do
you have you decided that,
00:13:25.10\00:13:28.20
okay this is
what I'm looking for,
00:13:28.24\00:13:30.14
how long does it
take you to figure out
00:13:30.17\00:13:32.04
that this is such a,
and generally speaking like
00:13:32.07\00:13:34.11
they think I'm pretty fast.
00:13:34.14\00:13:35.48
Oh, no, that's not it.
00:13:35.51\00:13:36.85
But I think in addition to that,
00:13:36.88\00:13:38.58
there is this perception
that when you're talking
00:13:38.61\00:13:40.58
you're on display.
00:13:40.62\00:13:42.05
I have to show you
00:13:42.08\00:13:43.42
how wonderful of a woman I
am so that you will marry me.
00:13:43.45\00:13:47.16
So we turn into like the
"Wifey" that's, you know,
00:13:47.19\00:13:49.99
we have these
titles, "Oh, that's my wifey,
00:13:50.03\00:13:52.13
that's my boo,"
you know, "that's hubby
00:13:52.16\00:13:54.53
and we're not married
00:13:54.56\00:13:55.90
and we put
ourselves into these roles
00:13:55.93\00:13:58.77
before we're ready
and we're acting married
00:13:58.80\00:14:01.50
when we are really
just still dating."
00:14:01.54\00:14:03.84
So all the
perspective gets to you,
00:14:03.87\00:14:05.67
"We're talking
00:14:05.71\00:14:07.04
but I'm bringing
you a plate at potluck,
00:14:07.08\00:14:08.58
" you know what I mean.
00:14:08.61\00:14:09.94
And, you know, all
those different things.
00:14:09.98\00:14:11.68
Okay, so let's now, that's
good what you're all saying
00:14:11.71\00:14:14.18
and I think it's a lot of it
00:14:14.22\00:14:15.55
is really addressing
our age group and our issue
00:14:15.58\00:14:18.85
because, you know,
00:14:18.89\00:14:20.22
we're looking
towards marriage, you know,
00:14:20.26\00:14:21.59
but what about the young
person who's 15-16, you know,
00:14:21.62\00:14:24.56
and they're just saying,
"Well, we're just dating,
00:14:24.59\00:14:27.06
" but the actions like
you're saying maybe a little...
00:14:27.10\00:14:29.26
What do you say to them?
00:14:29.30\00:14:30.63
Is that a necessary step
or should they even be dating
00:14:30.67\00:14:32.53
if you're that young?
00:14:32.57\00:14:34.27
I don't believe and
maybe I am older cake
00:14:34.30\00:14:38.97
whatever you call it,
I'm kind of old school,
00:14:39.01\00:14:40.98
but I honestly believe
that by the time you're 15
00:14:41.01\00:14:44.78
you have absolutely no business
00:14:44.81\00:14:47.92
with spending one on one
00:14:47.95\00:14:50.52
intimate
knowledge of one another,
00:14:50.55\00:14:52.32
"I want to get to
know you," kind of time
00:14:52.35\00:14:54.32
with somebody
of the opposite sex
00:14:54.36\00:14:56.12
and that is
because what it does is,
00:14:56.16\00:14:59.29
it starts to breed in you this,
you barely know who you are,
00:14:59.33\00:15:04.63
and so if your identity
is constantly attached to,
00:15:04.67\00:15:08.44
"I am not a person unless
00:15:08.47\00:15:10.71
I have a man attached to my arm,
00:15:10.74\00:15:13.11
" you know, or, "I
don't even know who I am,
00:15:13.14\00:15:15.88
I don't know who,
you know, where I begin
00:15:15.91\00:15:18.21
and where they start,"
00:15:18.25\00:15:19.68
you know, where I
end and where they begin,
00:15:19.71\00:15:23.49
then there's a problem in that
00:15:23.52\00:15:26.62
because then how do
you get to the point
00:15:26.65\00:15:28.66
where you're mature
enough to know this is who I am.
00:15:28.69\00:15:32.49
If you don't know yourself,
00:15:32.53\00:15:33.86
how do you expect
somebody else to know you?
00:15:33.90\00:15:35.23
Right.
00:15:35.26\00:15:36.60
And that's basically
the crux of the matter.
00:15:36.63\00:15:37.97
Well, you know,
back when I was teaching
00:15:38.00\00:15:39.33
and I say this to
my little brothers,
00:15:39.37\00:15:41.10
my cousin all the time,
00:15:41.14\00:15:42.47
you know, you say it just
like your parents said to you,
00:15:42.50\00:15:44.64
you know, the people who
you loved in high school,
00:15:44.67\00:15:47.51
you're probably not going
to marry that person, you know,
00:15:47.54\00:15:49.54
the person who
you dated, you know,
00:15:49.58\00:15:51.31
my first "love"
was in eighth grade.
00:15:51.35\00:15:53.38
You know what I'm saying,
now she's happily married,
00:15:53.42\00:15:55.38
you know, we're not together.
00:15:55.42\00:15:56.75
It's okay.
00:15:56.79\00:15:58.12
But how you view
relationship, love,
00:15:58.15\00:16:02.92
intimacy changes over time,
you know, and I think that,
00:16:02.96\00:16:06.29
you know, this is why
it's so important to educate,
00:16:06.33\00:16:08.50
you know, the younger generation
00:16:08.53\00:16:09.86
of what is dating,
what exactly is love.
00:16:09.90\00:16:12.10
I did a thing at a camp one time
00:16:12.13\00:16:13.77
and I asked these
kids about 12 years old,
00:16:13.80\00:16:15.20
what is love and
they were defining love
00:16:15.24\00:16:16.97
by holding hands.
00:16:17.01\00:16:18.34
It's that when you get to
the point where, you know,
00:16:18.37\00:16:20.24
you really want to just
kiss them on their cheek,
00:16:20.28\00:16:21.81
you know, you
wanna hold their hands
00:16:21.84\00:16:23.18
and walk to the park
or the case and I'm like,
00:16:23.21\00:16:25.05
you know, that is
not love, you know,
00:16:25.08\00:16:26.75
but that's what we
have associated relationship
00:16:26.78\00:16:29.48
with even if
you look at society,
00:16:29.52\00:16:31.02
and I know we're
talking about 15-16
00:16:31.05\00:16:33.62
but when we look at
dating on television,
00:16:33.66\00:16:35.66
dating means sex, it
means living together,
00:16:35.69\00:16:38.96
you know, at some point
or you going to get a key.
00:16:38.99\00:16:40.86
You know, it means these
things that look like marriage
00:16:40.90\00:16:44.27
that it doesn't
look like dating,
00:16:44.30\00:16:46.30
it looks like
marriage, you know,
00:16:46.33\00:16:47.67
and so, you know, we have to
be more clear of how we define,
00:16:47.70\00:16:50.51
how we define dating.
00:16:50.54\00:16:51.87
Okay, so what's really
wrong with doing like that?
00:16:51.91\00:16:53.88
You know, what's
really wrong with them dating?
00:16:53.91\00:16:57.08
What is gonna transpire
if they continue in this way?
00:16:57.11\00:17:00.85
I'm gonna ask Jackson on that.
00:17:00.88\00:17:02.22
Well, stipple back on what
you all were saying is that...
00:17:02.25\00:17:06.15
Look, what I'm saying is that
when you look at a relationship
00:17:06.19\00:17:10.26
with younger people, the
biggest challenge is this,
00:17:10.29\00:17:12.89
and my mom one time told
me about some people at church
00:17:12.93\00:17:15.76
and how they were
together for two years
00:17:15.80\00:17:17.80
and she said, you know,
"They are probably having sex."
00:17:17.83\00:17:19.47
I was like, "Mom,
why do you say that?"
00:17:19.50\00:17:20.84
She said, "People just
can't hold hands that long."
00:17:20.87\00:17:23.57
When you're
talking about teenagers,
00:17:23.61\00:17:26.27
when you're talking about
early teenager still forming,
00:17:26.31\00:17:29.11
still find themselves,
and media and finances
00:17:29.14\00:17:32.05
and various things,
it's gonna be hard for them
00:17:32.08\00:17:34.58
from the age of 15-16
00:17:34.62\00:17:36.69
till graduation
of 22 years of age
00:17:36.72\00:17:40.56
and now we live in a society
00:17:40.59\00:17:41.96
where you have to
start to pursue a masters
00:17:41.99\00:17:44.06
so you're now
looking around 24-25
00:17:44.09\00:17:45.93
and for that 8 years
just to be in a relationship
00:17:45.96\00:17:49.60
without that will cause a
lot of priming of emotions
00:17:49.63\00:17:53.64
that they had to
hold it back down
00:17:53.67\00:17:55.14
and in their timeframe
00:17:55.17\00:17:56.67
emotions,
hormones, testosterone.
00:17:56.71\00:17:59.77
When I was a teenager,
00:17:59.81\00:18:01.14
my testosterone was
strong and so it's like...
00:18:01.18\00:18:07.18
Testify.
00:18:07.22\00:18:11.42
And for eight years
it's gonna be tough.
00:18:11.45\00:18:13.79
Yeah.
00:18:13.82\00:18:15.16
And so it's
gonna cause eventually.
00:18:15.19\00:18:16.83
They are young men
or young women teenagers
00:18:16.86\00:18:21.16
to hopefully we
don't want it to happen
00:18:21.20\00:18:24.07
but it's
unfortunately leading that way.
00:18:24.10\00:18:27.44
I think part of the problem
is we've created a culture
00:18:27.47\00:18:29.80
of secret dating
where if I like you,
00:18:29.84\00:18:32.74
I pass you a note
maybe inbox on Facebook,
00:18:32.77\00:18:35.28
we talk, we go alone
moments together often.
00:18:35.31\00:18:39.31
And if you look
at old school dating
00:18:39.35\00:18:40.92
when you were
dating it was called,
00:18:40.95\00:18:42.28
you were caught,
someone was calling for you.
00:18:42.32\00:18:44.15
They came to your house,
they sat in your living room
00:18:44.19\00:18:47.19
with your family, you know,
00:18:47.22\00:18:48.72
and you got to know
each other in a setting,
00:18:48.76\00:18:50.89
you know, where
there were other people.
00:18:50.93\00:18:52.26
If you look at marriages,
especially biblical marriages,
00:18:52.29\00:18:54.76
there were other people involved
00:18:54.80\00:18:56.67
than just those two people.
00:18:56.70\00:18:58.07
There was family,
there was community,
00:18:58.10\00:18:59.87
you know, but there were
other people involved inside,
00:18:59.90\00:19:02.10
think if we take
dating out of this exclusive,
00:19:02.14\00:19:05.17
"I just want to
be up under you,"
00:19:05.21\00:19:07.18
type of mentality,
Josh, why you move?
00:19:07.21\00:19:10.61
I'm just saying.
00:19:10.65\00:19:11.98
That's up here. Hey, no.
00:19:12.01\00:19:14.88
I'm using you as an example.
00:19:14.92\00:19:16.82
You know, if you
take it out of that,
00:19:16.85\00:19:19.65
"I want to be alone with
you all the time," mentality,
00:19:19.69\00:19:21.86
it removes some of
the heaviness of dating
00:19:21.89\00:19:25.63
and you got a lot to
get to know each other
00:19:25.66\00:19:27.30
at like socials and
game nights and those things
00:19:27.33\00:19:29.76
which make dating fun and
there's a less heartbreak,
00:19:29.80\00:19:32.87
there's a less early attachment,
00:19:32.90\00:19:35.10
you know, there
so I really think
00:19:35.14\00:19:37.04
that if we start
to take the shame,
00:19:37.07\00:19:40.18
take the
secretiveness off of dating,
00:19:40.21\00:19:43.21
it will really help to open
up the lines of communication
00:19:43.24\00:19:45.55
for everybody involved.
00:19:45.58\00:19:46.92
Okay, well, that is
a little tough though,
00:19:46.95\00:19:48.48
but I think Kory want to
add something to that before.
00:19:48.52\00:19:50.49
Well, I'm actually glad
that she said heartbreak
00:19:50.52\00:19:52.65
because, you know, I
think one of the things
00:19:52.69\00:19:54.69
that we wanna save them from,
one thing is that, you know,
00:19:54.72\00:19:58.16
they have this danger of falling
00:19:58.19\00:19:59.76
into is experiencing
heartbreak at such a young age
00:19:59.79\00:20:03.33
and having to go
through it so many times,
00:20:03.37\00:20:05.93
you know, when I can
say the amount of people
00:20:05.97\00:20:07.70
I've dated in
high school till now
00:20:07.74\00:20:09.60
and even the
fact that, you know,
00:20:09.64\00:20:11.31
I feel like I've been married
00:20:11.34\00:20:12.97
at least three times in my life,
00:20:13.01\00:20:14.48
you know, like I had
relations that were that deep
00:20:14.51\00:20:16.64
and I feel like I've even
been divorced that many times.
00:20:16.68\00:20:19.45
You know, there is no
reason why at a young age
00:20:19.48\00:20:21.68
I should have to go
through the divorce process
00:20:21.72\00:20:23.89
of grieving,
I've lost a loved one,
00:20:23.92\00:20:26.39
and this person was
such a major part of my life.
00:20:26.42\00:20:28.92
Now been taken out of my life.
00:20:28.96\00:20:30.43
Somebody I was so
dependent on, you know,
00:20:30.46\00:20:32.69
now no longer been around,
00:20:32.73\00:20:34.40
and I think we can say there's
been a lot of heartbreak, man,
00:20:34.43\00:20:37.03
if they would just date
00:20:37.07\00:20:38.40
a little bit later in
life and not so early.
00:20:38.43\00:20:40.44
Okay.
00:20:40.47\00:20:41.80
And I think another
thing that we need to recognize
00:20:41.84\00:20:43.17
is that we're not saying that
if you are 15-16 you shouldn't,
00:20:43.20\00:20:47.84
that you cannot spend time
00:20:47.88\00:20:49.91
with people of the opposite sex,
00:20:49.94\00:20:51.78
you know, we are
created for relationships.
00:20:51.81\00:20:54.02
God created us so that
way we crave it, you know,
00:20:54.05\00:20:58.32
it's almost like an
innate part of ourselves
00:20:58.35\00:21:01.29
and so to tell
someone, you know, don't, don't,
00:21:01.32\00:21:04.73
don't spend time with
that, it's unrealistic
00:21:04.76\00:21:06.66
and so what we're saying
00:21:06.70\00:21:08.86
is spend time with
people of the opposite sex
00:21:08.90\00:21:12.57
in a more informed
manner, in a more open way,
00:21:12.60\00:21:16.74
and it's not a matter
of exclusivity, in fact,
00:21:16.77\00:21:19.81
it's a matter of inclusivity.
00:21:19.84\00:21:21.54
You wanna include other
people in that learning to grow,
00:21:21.58\00:21:26.01
because if you're 15 or 16
00:21:26.05\00:21:27.85
you need to not just
learn about who you are,
00:21:27.88\00:21:30.05
but you need to learn about
00:21:30.09\00:21:31.42
how you interact with
people of the opposite sex,
00:21:31.45\00:21:34.26
you know, and that will save you
00:21:34.29\00:21:36.19
a lot of trouble, you
know, when you're older
00:21:36.22\00:21:38.89
and you are now, you
know, ready to get into marriage
00:21:38.93\00:21:42.03
it'll save you from
having that awkwardness
00:21:42.06\00:21:44.43
if you can't talk to guys
or you can't talk to girls,
00:21:44.47\00:21:47.50
you know, so it is a
natural process of growth
00:21:47.54\00:21:51.17
but we're saying go through
the natural process of growth.
00:21:51.21\00:21:55.58
Don't try to
hurry it up, you know,
00:21:55.61\00:21:57.41
don't try to be grown up
and mature when you're just 15
00:21:57.45\00:22:00.92
because you lose a lot of,
00:22:00.95\00:22:03.22
a lot of lessons in
their hurrying up, you know.
00:22:03.25\00:22:07.96
Well, that will be true
but it's also pretty tough
00:22:07.99\00:22:10.53
and a lot of the
15-16 year olds now
00:22:10.56\00:22:12.73
or even 13 year olds
00:22:12.76\00:22:14.10
are actually
having to grow up faster
00:22:14.13\00:22:15.46
than maybe they did before.
00:22:15.50\00:22:16.83
Yeah.
00:22:16.87\00:22:18.20
You know, so what, I
mean, if they're watching now
00:22:18.23\00:22:19.57
what were they really
be able to say this is,
00:22:19.60\00:22:21.07
these are the steps
that I need to take,
00:22:21.10\00:22:23.10
you know, at this age, you know,
00:22:23.14\00:22:25.97
this is what I
need to do, you know.
00:22:26.01\00:22:27.88
As a child my
parents, my parents divorced
00:22:27.91\00:22:30.61
when I was like five years old.
00:22:30.65\00:22:33.01
So there was a
television show that I saw
00:22:33.05\00:22:35.68
that the way they live,
00:22:35.72\00:22:37.52
it was really
something that in my mind
00:22:37.55\00:22:39.55
I tried to I want to
replicate a model after,
00:22:39.59\00:22:42.59
but it's a TV show
that lasts only 30 minutes
00:22:42.62\00:22:44.83
and I'm not even
talking about commercial breaks.
00:22:44.86\00:22:46.63
So when those things
happen, you put a falsification
00:22:46.66\00:22:50.17
and with television so powerful,
00:22:50.20\00:22:52.20
they call it
the one eye monster,
00:22:52.23\00:22:53.84
and we find ourselves watching
00:22:53.87\00:22:55.40
and based on gross
with it, it's dangerous.
00:22:55.44\00:22:57.77
That's my passion, you
know, as a pastor of the church
00:22:57.81\00:23:01.84
to combine with
younger people have energy,
00:23:01.88\00:23:03.85
older people have wisdom.
00:23:03.88\00:23:05.31
With the younger
people they can finish,
00:23:05.35\00:23:06.68
they're gonna finish the work,
00:23:06.72\00:23:08.05
older people need to
infuse to them wisdom.
00:23:08.08\00:23:09.58
Right.
00:23:09.62\00:23:10.95
And with that also
we're infusing to them
00:23:10.99\00:23:12.32
not only with biblically
00:23:12.35\00:23:13.69
but we also
infusing to them wisdom
00:23:13.72\00:23:15.36
or how to carry
the affairs of life
00:23:15.39\00:23:17.89
and that's also biblical
because if not the case,
00:23:17.93\00:23:20.73
then young
people, younger generation
00:23:20.76\00:23:22.60
are gonna find
themselves watching television
00:23:22.63\00:23:24.57
rather than being
comfortable at home,
00:23:24.60\00:23:26.43
and if there is no
mother and father in the home
00:23:26.47\00:23:28.64
then why not the church?
00:23:28.67\00:23:30.01
Okay.
00:23:30.04\00:23:31.37
And so we have to
do stuff like that.
00:23:31.41\00:23:32.74
All right.
00:23:32.77\00:23:34.11
You know, the question was,
00:23:34.14\00:23:35.48
"How do young
people practically date,
00:23:35.51\00:23:39.11
talk, court and I think...
00:23:39.15\00:23:41.35
And what's
gonna be the sequence?
00:23:41.38\00:23:42.72
I think the first
part is intentionality.
00:23:42.75\00:23:46.22
What is your
intention in dating?
00:23:46.25\00:23:48.36
Why do you wanna date?
00:23:48.39\00:23:49.99
Are you wanting to
date because you feel like
00:23:50.03\00:23:52.03
God has called
you into marriage?
00:23:52.06\00:23:53.60
Are you wanting to
date 'cause you're lonely
00:23:53.63\00:23:55.16
'cause all your
friends got boyfriends
00:23:55.20\00:23:57.10
or you want to date because you,
00:23:57.13\00:23:59.40
you know you, you
need to fulfill a void.
00:23:59.43\00:24:01.74
Is it you feel like
something's missing,
00:24:01.77\00:24:03.74
there's no mom or dad or
I want to do it different
00:24:03.77\00:24:06.14
than my parents did
00:24:06.17\00:24:07.51
or I want to be
just like my parents
00:24:07.54\00:24:08.94
or you know, why
the intentionality?
00:24:08.98\00:24:11.11
Why are you trying to date?
00:24:11.15\00:24:12.78
Then if you really
believe that you were in a place
00:24:12.81\00:24:15.55
where you're now
ready to date, to marry,
00:24:15.58\00:24:18.15
then the second
thing is the impact.
00:24:18.19\00:24:19.99
What is the impact of dating
00:24:20.02\00:24:21.82
gonna have on my life right now.
00:24:21.86\00:24:23.63
Am I in a place where I'm doing
what God is calling me to do?
00:24:23.66\00:24:26.70
If I'm gonna be
involved in ministry,
00:24:26.73\00:24:28.50
am I focusing on ministry,
am I focusing on school,
00:24:28.53\00:24:32.20
is it gonna
distract me from the goals
00:24:32.23\00:24:34.90
that God has for my life?
00:24:34.94\00:24:36.27
If dating is gonna
cause a negative impact,
00:24:36.30\00:24:38.14
you probably shouldn't do it.
00:24:38.17\00:24:39.51
And the last one is inclusion.
00:24:39.54\00:24:41.74
When you're now ready to
date, include your friends,
00:24:41.78\00:24:44.25
include your family
in what you're doing
00:24:44.28\00:24:46.18
because they know you well,
they know you better than...
00:24:46.21\00:24:48.75
And I know sometimes
your friends know you better
00:24:48.78\00:24:50.42
than your family, you know,
00:24:50.45\00:24:51.79
you spend so
much time with them.
00:24:51.82\00:24:53.15
So go out with
friends, go out with people,
00:24:53.19\00:24:55.56
don't spend so much
time boo'd up on the couch,
00:24:55.59\00:24:58.29
you know, take in and
love in and, you know,
00:24:58.33\00:25:00.90
just spending
time with each other.
00:25:00.93\00:25:02.83
Include other
people, get out there,
00:25:02.86\00:25:05.03
do things together,
get to know each other,
00:25:05.07\00:25:07.14
and have very
open honest dialogue
00:25:07.17\00:25:09.64
about the direction
of the relationship.
00:25:09.67\00:25:11.44
Okay.
00:25:11.47\00:25:12.81
And the church
really needs to play a part
00:25:12.84\00:25:14.18
in really
creating those environments
00:25:14.21\00:25:15.54
for younger people.
00:25:15.58\00:25:16.91
They need to really showing
them hey, we're obviously,
00:25:16.95\00:25:18.28
you know, we're
always trying to find
00:25:18.31\00:25:19.65
that one person kind
of get boo'd up whatever,
00:25:19.68\00:25:21.02
you know, with that person
but if the church is saying,
00:25:21.05\00:25:22.42
"Look that's not
the best way to do it.
00:25:22.45\00:25:23.85
This is the best
way for you to do it,"
00:25:23.89\00:25:25.29
and that's kind
of what I want us
00:25:25.32\00:25:26.65
to really nail down here,
00:25:26.69\00:25:28.02
so if I'm about between
what 10 to 15 or something
00:25:28.06\00:25:30.59
and I'm looking at girls
now or I'm looking at guys now,
00:25:30.63\00:25:33.40
this should be the
phase where I'm just
00:25:33.43\00:25:35.40
getting to know people, right?
00:25:35.43\00:25:36.77
I'm just in a group...
00:25:36.80\00:25:38.13
Friends.
00:25:38.17\00:25:39.50
Yeah, I may like you but
I'm not going to really go
00:25:39.53\00:25:40.87
exclusive with you,
00:25:40.90\00:25:42.24
we're just gonna
be friends, okay.
00:25:42.27\00:25:43.81
There's this one church
I read about in the city
00:25:43.84\00:25:47.54
and they have some call like
a purity call and they have,
00:25:47.58\00:25:49.84
you know, young men, young women
00:25:49.88\00:25:51.38
they are in an environment
00:25:51.41\00:25:53.35
where they are around each other
00:25:53.38\00:25:54.78
but it's also monitored.
00:25:54.82\00:25:56.72
So it's a way
that they can learn
00:25:56.75\00:25:59.25
how to interact male and female,
00:25:59.29\00:26:01.12
but also how to
respect each other
00:26:01.16\00:26:04.23
and it's not
something that's very,
00:26:04.26\00:26:06.09
it's not gonna build
up compromising situation.
00:26:06.13\00:26:08.93
Okay, that's so
true. Kory, go ahead.
00:26:08.96\00:26:11.13
Well, you know, just to
kind of bring it all together
00:26:11.17\00:26:13.30
and now you're back to the top
00:26:13.34\00:26:14.67
where we were distinguishing
between what's dating,
00:26:14.70\00:26:16.34
what's talking, what's courting.
00:26:16.37\00:26:18.27
You know, I believe
that's important that
00:26:18.31\00:26:19.77
after these young
people get to that age
00:26:19.81\00:26:21.51
where they believe
they're mature enough,
00:26:21.54\00:26:23.01
you know, they can
finally go one on one
00:26:23.04\00:26:25.28
that they have to be open
and they have to communicate,
00:26:25.31\00:26:27.68
you know, we've learned today
00:26:27.72\00:26:29.05
that there're
different definitions.
00:26:29.08\00:26:30.42
People who call talking
one thing, dating one thing,
00:26:30.45\00:26:32.25
courting, you know,
00:26:32.29\00:26:33.62
and so it's
important to distinguish
00:26:33.66\00:26:35.69
and to be able
to tell each other,
00:26:35.72\00:26:37.43
"This what I think it
is, this what, you know,
00:26:37.46\00:26:38.89
what do you think it is?"
00:26:38.93\00:26:40.26
And to figure out
together where they are
00:26:40.30\00:26:42.56
and to move forward
communicating all the time,
00:26:42.60\00:26:45.40
you know, well,
we're just friends now,
00:26:45.43\00:26:46.77
you know, we're talking now
00:26:46.80\00:26:48.14
but that
communication is important.
00:26:48.17\00:26:49.60
Okay, and,
Jeanne, real quick? Yeah.
00:26:49.64\00:26:51.31
I was just, there's something
that we need to make sure
00:26:51.34\00:26:54.04
we don't forget.
00:26:54.08\00:26:55.41
As long as you're
treating the person
00:26:55.44\00:26:56.78
that you're getting
into a relationship with
00:26:56.81\00:26:58.55
as if they, not as if
00:26:58.58\00:27:00.32
because they are
made in the image of God,
00:27:00.35\00:27:02.85
you need to give them
the same level of respect,
00:27:02.88\00:27:05.72
that identity, you know, demands
00:27:05.75\00:27:10.36
so if you're constantly aware
that this is someone in the,
00:27:10.39\00:27:13.63
maybe in the image of God,
you want to treat them as such,
00:27:13.66\00:27:16.13
you want to give them
that level of respect.
00:27:16.16\00:27:18.77
I'm not gonna, if I know
00:27:18.80\00:27:20.14
you're made in the image of God,
00:27:20.17\00:27:21.50
I'm not going to necessarily
put you in situations
00:27:21.54\00:27:24.84
that are going to compromise
our relationship, you know,
00:27:24.87\00:27:29.41
because I am always
aware that, you know,
00:27:29.44\00:27:31.85
God's image is
replicated in our relationship.
00:27:31.88\00:27:34.58
All right, that's beautiful.
00:27:34.62\00:27:35.95
And that wraps it up
for our program today.
00:27:35.98\00:27:37.39
I just wanna end with
this quote from Solomon,
00:27:37.42\00:27:39.42
"I charge you do not
arouse or awaken love
00:27:39.45\00:27:41.86
until it is time."
00:27:41.89\00:27:43.22
Remember that you
are a child of the king,
00:27:43.26\00:27:45.33
you have to just wait for God
00:27:45.36\00:27:46.90
and He will bring you
that love when it is time.
00:27:46.93\00:27:49.33
Well, thank you, guys, so much.
00:27:49.36\00:27:50.77
Until next time
remember to make pure choices.
00:27:50.80\00:27:53.54