This is 3ABN Now
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with John and
Rosemary Malkiewycz.
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Hello, and welcome
to today's program.
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We know that,
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but don't we that they're
going to enjoy today's program.
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I'm sure we're
going to enjoy it.
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Yes, we have
someone here who, you know,
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there's retirement
and there's retirement.
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Some people live
and work to retire.
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It's what they dream of,
it's what they waiting for.
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And some people
retire and they retire,
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and they retire.
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And they don't
seem to quite know
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what retirement is
or to even get there.
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And today, we have someone
who doesn't know how to retire.
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It's Manuel Escorcio, hello.
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I'm afraid of retirement.
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Ready to get bored, you know.
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So you've mentioned
something interesting
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in your opening statement.
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I actually retired to
start living and starting.
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So we just reverse
the presence in that.
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Very nice to be here in
Australia with you again.
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Yes, it's good to
see you back here again.
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We did introduce
Manuel to many people
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about two, three years ago?
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Yeah, about three years ago.
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On this program.
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I got to learn a
little bit about him.
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A lot.
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But there's still a lot
more to learn, isn't it?
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And one of the
things we're going to do
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is there will be
people, viewers I know
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who do not know who you are.
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So we're going to go through
some of your history again.
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And then we're
going to come on to today.
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And what you're doing
now in your non retirement?
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How many times have
you tried to retire?
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This is going to be fun.
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This is gonna, I
can just hear them.
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I'm ready for it.
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I remember a few years ago up
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at the South
Queensland Conference,
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you brought some other
men with you from South Africa
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and that's where Manuel is from,
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even though it's
a different name.
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And you brought a few of them,
one was Pierre van Westhuizen.
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And you said
that you were retiring
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and handing the torch to him.
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So called the
mantle, the mantle.
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The mantle. The mantle.
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Yes.
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And that was a
number of years ago,
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and you still haven't retired.
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Because I've been
for 42 years busy,
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you know, on stage, you know.
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It's part of
your life, isn't it?
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It is my life because I started
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as a young singing lecturer
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at the
University of Stellenbosch
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outside of Cape Town.
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So when I finished
my master's degree,
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I actually
finished theology first,
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realized that
something interesting
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and weird happened.
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There were five
of us that graduated,
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four were married,
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and I was the
Benjamin of the whole lot.
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And so, because our
church is not so very big inside
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at that stage as well.
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They gave the full
course to the married men.
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They had priority, obviously.
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And so there was no call for me.
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Now what do you do?
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And I went to my singing
teacher Mrs. Wilh Dunbar.
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And I said, "Aunty
Wilh, what do I do now?"
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And she said
something interesting.
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When God closes one door here,
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just look for the
other one that He will open.
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That's a good thought.
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Good philosophy.
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And by the way, I
was a poor student.
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I lived with my, with
the Dunbars for four years
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I didn't have anywhere to go.
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I hitchhiked all
the way 16 kilometers
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to go to university every day.
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I didn't have money
for a car, you know,
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hitchhiked back and Aunty
Wilh took me to Stellenbosch
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and it was
already late in January.
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And mercifully I got the bursary
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from the State University
for an immigrant students.
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Because as you
know, I'm Portuguese,
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I'm cosmopolitan.
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My mom is from Mauritius.
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My dad from little
island called Madeira
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out in the
middle of the Atlantic,
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a very beautiful island.
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And they named the
cake after your island.
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You bet.
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Did they name the
island after the cake?
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Madeira cake,
Madeira, very, very,
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a lot of sugar
but very beautiful.
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And then, of course, my
dad immigrated all the way
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to Africa to the
Portuguese colony
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of Mozambique, as you know,
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Portugal had
colonies, you know, all over.
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If you talk about East Timor,
that was a Portuguese colony.
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Timor-Leste, if
you talk about Macau,
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there was a Portuguese colony.
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I met the other day a gentleman
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and I looked at his
surname Mascarenhas.
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I said, "You're an Indian,
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but you are from
Portuguese origin from Goa."
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He said, "How
did you know that?"
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And I said,
"Because that's a very
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Portuguese Indian name
from the times of the..."
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So anyway, I came
out of the colonies,
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I was born in East Africa,
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couldn't speak
a word of English.
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I had to come to South Africa
because of the border war,
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the freedom war in those days.
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And something
horrible happened that here,
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my mom's sister's eldest
son got killed up at the border.
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And my dad said,
"You getting out there,
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and you don't return home."
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So I never ever saw my
home until about 32 years later,
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when I become somebody.
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And the Portuguese Ambassador
actually called me and said,
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"I have a
knighthood from Portugal.
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It's called Comendador.
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It's for your services
to music and my government
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just gave me the
medal, whatever and the title.
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So I went back and saw my home,
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saw my little Adventist
Church where I'd been baptized
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when I was 16 years of age.
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It was weird to go back
and to relive the memories
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and you know, kind of like,
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look back at what my life
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would have been if I
had not left Mozambique,
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if I'd stayed over there.
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And the Lord had plans for
me, you see how things work.
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So once again, to be
within the plan of the Lord
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is the most amazing thing.
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So did you have any
brothers and sisters?
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My dad was married
to a lady in Madeira.
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She died, you know,
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at 25 and my dad
lost the baby boy,
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and lost his wife.
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And he left his
five-year-old daughter,
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my sister in Madeira.
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And saw her 13 years later
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when she came
then to Mozambique,
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obviously, so my
sister is 20 years old than I.
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When I was born,
she already had a child.
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So and then my brother
the same thing, you know,
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my brother, my
dad was a Catholic
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so he became an Adventist.
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So from my father's side, they,
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although my dad
obviously was baptized,
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gave his heart to
the Lord completely
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and became a
Seventh-day Adventist.
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And beautiful one at
that, he baptized at 65.
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Is that right?
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Can you believe it?
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There's still hope.
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There's still hope.
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So did you
have... After you retire.
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What about, no, you
mentioned your brother?
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So my brother is my
mom, my mom's child,
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because my
mother was a widow at 20
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and her husband
died tuberculosis 24.
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My brother was
a year and a half.
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And so my dad brought him up
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when my mom and my dad married.
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There was one condition,
you have a daughter Manuel,
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his name was Manuel.
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Maria, you have a son.
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No more children.
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Bang Oh, sorry
about the microphone.
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So I was born so
there's that's why there's a age
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difference of 20,
10 and then one, me,
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you know when I was one
when they were big already.
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Yes.
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You were the spoilt, unexpected.
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You know, we have a
Bible text that you had chosen,
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and we haven't even said it yet.
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John is going to read it.
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I'm going to write it.
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Because you love
this is, it's from Psalms
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and you love this Psalm.
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You know, I like
the Book of Psalms.
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It's a very uplifting book.
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Absolutely.
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And I find that in Psalms 23.
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And you've chosen
Psalms 23:1, it says,
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"The Lord is my shepherd.
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I shall not want."
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Ain't that
encouraging statement?
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It envelops everything
about the human being, isn't it?
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And the reason why I
like it is that in my language
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in my mother
tongue Portuguese...
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Or you can say it
in your mother tongue,
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someone out
there will understand.
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Nada milfoltara.
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Nada, nothing, I
shall not want anything.
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But the wonderful
thing is that the word pastor
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in Portuguese is
the word for shepherd.
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So we call a pastor,
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but a pastor is I'm
actually saying Pastor John,
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I'm saying shepherd John.
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Isn't that amazing?
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Maybe we should
start doing that.
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Yeah.
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Pastor John, shepherd John.
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Wonderful.
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The Lord is my shepherd.
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Because these
sheep are in the pasture.
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Absolutely.
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Pastor and pasture.
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Correct.
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You're good at languages. Yeah.
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No, no, that's interesting.
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You know, it's interesting,
you've lived through many.
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I just want to make
comment about that verse
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that when I was a little
girl, "The Lord is my shepherd,
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I shall not want."
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To me it meant the
Lord is my shepherd,
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but I don't want him.
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Oh I shall not want Him.
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I shall not want, I
shall not want the shepherd.
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So it was only when I got older
that I realized that saying,
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The Lord is my shepherd,
so I don't need anything else.
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He supplies it all.
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Correct.
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And, but I didn't have
that understanding as a child.
00:10:03.16\00:10:05.13
But that seems so interesting
because in Portuguese
00:10:05.17\00:10:06.90
Nada milfoltara it means "I
shall not lack of anything."
00:10:06.94\00:10:12.34
It's a different the...
00:10:12.37\00:10:14.54
There's a lovely push there.
00:10:14.58\00:10:16.18
It should actually say,
I shall not want anything.
00:10:16.21\00:10:18.75
Yeah.
00:10:18.78\00:10:20.58
But I suppose saying
00:10:20.62\00:10:21.95
they thought it was
a given, understood.
00:10:21.98\00:10:23.35
Correct.
00:10:23.39\00:10:24.72
You have lived a life and you,
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and you know God
and you know Jesus.
00:10:26.12\00:10:28.82
Is it true?
00:10:28.86\00:10:30.19
Do you lack anything?
00:10:30.23\00:10:32.93
Let me be very honest with you.
00:10:32.96\00:10:35.46
I used to pray,
"Lord, I want this,"
00:10:35.50\00:10:39.57
and God never
gives you what you want.
00:10:39.60\00:10:43.77
God gives you what you need.
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There's a vast difference.
00:10:46.51\00:10:48.11
So when you have what
you need, you lack nothing.
00:10:48.14\00:10:50.58
Good answer.
00:10:50.61\00:10:51.95
That's a good answer.
00:10:51.98\00:10:53.31
But sometimes he does
also give you what you want.
00:10:53.35\00:10:54.68
Yes, he does.
00:10:54.72\00:10:56.05
Because it says, it
will be good for you.
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Correct.
00:10:57.45\00:10:58.79
And as I told you before,
00:10:58.82\00:11:01.52
for 17 years there
was no music in my life.
00:11:01.56\00:11:04.66
For 17 years while you grew up?
00:11:04.69\00:11:06.59
Nothing, nothing.
00:11:06.63\00:11:08.43
So where did it come from?
00:11:08.46\00:11:09.80
I learned up at
Helderberg College
00:11:09.83\00:11:11.43
in South Africa.
00:11:11.47\00:11:13.17
And music is like
everybody singing,
00:11:13.20\00:11:15.60
there's a choir,
there's a male choir,
00:11:15.64\00:11:17.41
everybody, there's quartet.
00:11:17.44\00:11:18.94
You didn't have music in
your church in Mozambique?
00:11:18.97\00:11:21.08
We did but I
never sang in a choir.
00:11:21.11\00:11:24.45
Not in primary school,
not in high school, nothing.
00:11:24.48\00:11:28.48
You know, all of a
sudden I hear this male choir.
00:11:28.52\00:11:32.05
And I go crazy.
00:11:32.09\00:11:34.06
Now I want to talk,
but I can't speak English.
00:11:34.09\00:11:37.53
And then somebody
played a record of Mario Lanza.
00:11:37.56\00:11:42.53
Do you remember the
student prince Mario Lanza,
00:11:42.56\00:11:45.73
the American tenor,
American-Italian tenor,
00:11:45.77\00:11:49.00
you know, and I
go, oh, my goodness.
00:11:49.04\00:11:52.27
So I go to while I'm
showering in the queue
00:11:52.31\00:11:54.91
because there's nobody
there in the dormitory.
00:11:54.94\00:11:57.95
And I go and one of
the prefect comes and says,
00:11:57.98\00:12:04.69
shut up.
00:12:04.72\00:12:06.05
This is not an opera house.
00:12:06.09\00:12:07.42
Keep quiet, people are studying.
00:12:07.46\00:12:09.02
So I replied sorry,
sorry, me no sing, me no sing,
00:12:09.06\00:12:12.39
me no sing.
00:12:12.43\00:12:13.80
And he had the
sense of going to tell
00:12:13.83\00:12:16.77
Mrs. Dunbar the singing teacher.
00:12:16.80\00:12:19.93
This short boy, he
comes from Mozambique,
00:12:19.97\00:12:22.40
he's Portuguese,
he speaks nothing.
00:12:22.44\00:12:24.17
All he can say is
me hungry, me hungry.
00:12:24.21\00:12:28.34
Ma'am, you got to call him.
00:12:28.38\00:12:30.85
So I thought I was in trouble.
00:12:30.88\00:12:32.88
So I go and I say sorry
and I took a Portuguese guy
00:12:32.91\00:12:35.58
John, I'll never forget.
00:12:35.62\00:12:37.49
I say, "Tell
her, I will not sing,
00:12:37.52\00:12:38.99
I will not make noise anymore."
00:12:39.02\00:12:40.66
Says, "She now
want you to sing."
00:12:40.69\00:12:42.46
So now I'm confused.
00:12:42.49\00:12:43.83
So what must I sing?
00:12:43.86\00:12:45.19
He says, "Well sing
La-la La-la worked in English
00:12:45.23\00:12:47.50
and in Portuguese, whatever.
00:12:47.53\00:12:50.07
So I said, Okay.
00:12:50.10\00:12:51.80
La-la la-la la-la,
pompom, la-la la-la.
00:12:51.83\00:12:55.90
But I'm singing softly she says,
00:12:55.94\00:12:57.31
"No, sing, like
when you at the shower,
00:12:57.34\00:12:59.67
making a noise."
00:12:59.71\00:13:01.18
So I said, I'm gonna let it rip.
00:13:01.21\00:13:03.55
And so I opened up, you know,
00:13:03.58\00:13:05.35
and the jaw dropped
and dropped and said,
00:13:05.38\00:13:07.98
"You don't know what you got.
00:13:08.02\00:13:09.78
Next year when you
speak English better,
00:13:09.82\00:13:11.99
you come for singing lessons."
00:13:12.02\00:13:13.59
This is how I started singing.
00:13:13.62\00:13:15.29
Praise the Lord.
00:13:15.32\00:13:18.69
It took someone to tell someone?
00:13:18.73\00:13:20.06
Yeah.
00:13:20.10\00:13:21.43
Well, you know...
00:13:21.46\00:13:22.80
You see what you
said, pardon me, John.
00:13:22.83\00:13:24.17
You said sometime God
gives you what you want.
00:13:24.20\00:13:26.63
But in this case, I
didn't even ask him.
00:13:26.67\00:13:29.40
Was the biggest present
He gave me, biggest present.
00:13:29.44\00:13:32.47
Sorry John.
00:13:32.51\00:13:33.84
So you used, you
actually went and studied and...
00:13:33.88\00:13:37.61
Got a theology,
finished theology degree.
00:13:37.65\00:13:41.18
No call for me,
00:13:41.22\00:13:42.55
I go back to first
year university at 24.
00:13:42.58\00:13:45.55
I did my baccalaureate in music.
00:13:45.59\00:13:47.46
And then I did my Licentiate
of Royal Schools of Music.
00:13:47.49\00:13:50.89
And then I did my fellowship
in Trinity College of London
00:13:50.93\00:13:53.60
and I did my UNISA,
University of South Africa,
00:13:53.63\00:13:56.23
performance
diploma so all I can do now
00:13:56.26\00:13:58.27
and I'm planning now ask
me, what are you going to do?
00:13:58.30\00:14:02.67
This is a great
interview for the listeners,
00:14:02.70\00:14:04.67
because I'm telling them all.
00:14:04.71\00:14:06.74
What are you going to
do after you've learned?
00:14:06.78\00:14:08.28
Thank you.
00:14:08.31\00:14:09.64
Oh, she is so pretty.
00:14:09.68\00:14:11.01
I haven't finished.
00:14:11.05\00:14:12.38
What are you going to do
after you've learned Russian?
00:14:12.41\00:14:14.58
So I'm trying to
learn because I'm a linguist
00:14:14.62\00:14:16.69
and I just play, John...
00:14:16.72\00:14:21.46
Yeah, he knows what it is.
00:14:21.49\00:14:22.82
Yeah...
00:14:22.86\00:14:24.19
How are you?
00:14:27.53\00:14:28.86
Got a shock? Got a shock.
00:14:28.90\00:14:30.23
Little bit of Russian,
00:14:30.27\00:14:31.60
I just love
languages and I just...
00:14:31.63\00:14:33.84
That's what it goes
with music, doesn't it?
00:14:33.87\00:14:37.11
Languages are just...
00:14:37.14\00:14:38.51
Music is language.
00:14:38.54\00:14:39.87
He told me that he's currently
00:14:39.91\00:14:41.54
learning
Russian on the internet.
00:14:41.58\00:14:43.35
I go slowly, but it's difficult.
00:14:43.38\00:14:45.21
It's difficult but I can
read, I can write, you know,
00:14:45.25\00:14:49.08
I don't know what
I'm writing, you know,
00:14:49.12\00:14:51.12
but once you
learn the characters,
00:14:51.15\00:14:53.56
it's a very phonetic
language, it's not difficult.
00:14:53.59\00:14:56.49
You see, it just goes to show
00:14:56.52\00:14:57.93
that it's true that
the brain is plastic.
00:14:57.96\00:15:00.73
Even when you're old,
you can still do new things.
00:15:00.76\00:15:05.00
Now ask me, what am I
going to do now when I retire.
00:15:05.03\00:15:08.30
Ask me.
00:15:08.34\00:15:09.67
What are you
going to do when you...
00:15:09.70\00:15:11.04
No wait, that's we're going
to talk about that later on.
00:15:11.07\00:15:13.04
Okay.
00:15:13.07\00:15:16.18
You are trying to
drag me into something
00:15:16.21\00:15:18.98
that we're going
to talk about later.
00:15:19.01\00:15:22.18
So you ended up singing,
00:15:22.22\00:15:23.55
you didn't have
a job as a pastor,
00:15:23.59\00:15:24.92
you're going to
be a singing pastor?
00:15:24.95\00:15:26.29
Yes.
00:15:26.32\00:15:27.66
I couldn't understand and
I was a little disappointed
00:15:27.69\00:15:29.02
with the Lord.
00:15:29.06\00:15:30.39
Because when you study and
then there's no call for you,
00:15:30.43\00:15:31.76
what do you do?
00:15:31.79\00:15:33.13
You feel rejected, or whatever.
00:15:33.16\00:15:35.63
But God knew exactly
what was going to happen.
00:15:35.66\00:15:38.20
By the way,
that's a natural response
00:15:38.23\00:15:41.24
what you just said now.
00:15:41.27\00:15:42.60
It is. But God's got other plan.
00:15:42.64\00:15:44.14
He can say, wait, wait Manuel,
or, you know, just be patient.
00:15:44.17\00:15:50.85
But we always want
everything right away, don't we?
00:15:50.88\00:15:53.95
John, wait is
for patient people,
00:15:53.98\00:15:56.02
not for
impatient people like me.
00:15:56.05\00:15:58.19
Well, sometimes
God has to say wait,
00:15:58.22\00:16:00.32
so we can learn patience.
00:16:00.36\00:16:01.69
You are right.
00:16:01.72\00:16:03.06
You are right.
00:16:03.09\00:16:04.43
Absolutely. I agree.
00:16:04.46\00:16:05.79
So when you were
learning music that was,
00:16:05.83\00:16:09.30
it was giving
you a basis to sing
00:16:09.33\00:16:11.63
Christian songs and any songs?
00:16:11.67\00:16:13.00
Not at all.
00:16:13.03\00:16:14.37
I sang Christian
songs at college.
00:16:14.40\00:16:16.20
But when I went to university,
00:16:16.24\00:16:17.77
you are plunged
into what is required,
00:16:17.81\00:16:20.81
which is I sang over 400 leader
00:16:20.84\00:16:24.88
because I could speak
French, I could speak Italian.
00:16:24.91\00:16:27.72
I could speak Portuguese,
I could speak English.
00:16:27.75\00:16:30.59
And your three basic
languages for leader is German.
00:16:30.62\00:16:35.72
You know, Schubert, Schumann,
Brahms, all those composers.
00:16:35.76\00:16:39.29
So and then the French
repertoire Pulang, Duparc,
00:16:39.33\00:16:42.90
Faure you know,
00:16:42.93\00:16:44.27
so I found that
they never had a student
00:16:44.30\00:16:46.20
that could speak
all those languages
00:16:46.23\00:16:48.04
at Stellenbosch University.
00:16:48.07\00:16:49.40
So you finished your
course at Helderberg?
00:16:49.44\00:16:53.07
Yes, in December,
November-December.
00:16:53.11\00:16:56.71
You didn't get a call
and so then you got a bursary
00:16:56.75\00:17:00.12
to go to university to study...
00:17:00.15\00:17:01.68
In January. To study?
00:17:01.72\00:17:03.25
Yes. What?
00:17:03.28\00:17:04.62
The Baccalaureate in
music, four years of BMus.
00:17:04.65\00:17:07.56
So you're doing a second degree?
00:17:07.59\00:17:09.06
A second degree,
another four years, yes.
00:17:09.09\00:17:11.59
And when I finished,
I did another two years
00:17:11.63\00:17:13.40
to my master's degree
at University of Cape Town
00:17:13.43\00:17:16.30
where I had to
write my dissertation.
00:17:16.33\00:17:19.23
And then I was
appointed as a lecturer
00:17:19.27\00:17:22.07
at the music faculty.
00:17:22.10\00:17:23.44
So I gave class at university
for 3 years, '77, '78, '79.
00:17:23.47\00:17:29.04
And then what
happened I was catapulted
00:17:29.08\00:17:32.08
onto the national stage
00:17:32.11\00:17:35.18
because I
started my first opera,
00:17:35.22\00:17:37.92
[inaudible],
00:17:37.95\00:17:39.69
and I won the National prize.
00:17:39.72\00:17:42.22
And that was, you
see, we spoke before,
00:17:42.26\00:17:45.76
the day was very
clever, because all of a sudden,
00:17:45.79\00:17:49.03
I embarked in
on an opera career.
00:17:49.06\00:17:51.53
I did 36 operas.
00:17:51.57\00:17:53.13
How did you get into
that from being a lecturer?
00:17:53.17\00:17:56.00
All day they pestered me,
00:17:56.04\00:17:58.87
they pestered
me, they begged me.
00:17:58.91\00:18:01.11
And I said, "No,
no, I'm lecturing."
00:18:01.14\00:18:02.78
But then I was married.
00:18:02.81\00:18:04.38
I had my first child,
my wife had my first child,
00:18:04.41\00:18:07.55
I beg your pardon.
00:18:07.58\00:18:08.92
We had.
00:18:08.95\00:18:11.35
The good Lord knew
to give you the job
00:18:11.39\00:18:14.19
to have but because I
think the good Lord knew
00:18:14.22\00:18:16.02
that we men would,
we just die on the spot.
00:18:16.06\00:18:20.66
We wouldn't have the
guts like you girls have.
00:18:20.70\00:18:23.06
And that was the
beginning of my, listen to me,
00:18:23.10\00:18:27.44
compromise is a
very dangerous thing.
00:18:27.47\00:18:31.77
Because it goes a
little bit, you say,
00:18:31.81\00:18:34.08
I'll do this just once,
00:18:34.11\00:18:36.04
you know and then
it becomes a habit
00:18:36.08\00:18:39.68
and then and then
the rehearsals come,
00:18:39.71\00:18:42.52
and you start
forgetting about Sabbath.
00:18:42.55\00:18:44.82
Once you get on
that, that slippery slope
00:18:44.85\00:18:48.12
and no matter what it
is, it could be doctrinal,
00:18:48.16\00:18:50.33
it could be in your
work, in a relationship.
00:18:50.36\00:18:54.53
Once you start on
that slippery slope,
00:18:54.56\00:18:57.57
there's only one place to
go and that's further down.
00:18:57.60\00:19:01.57
And it gets
complicated, Rosemary.
00:19:01.60\00:19:03.57
I'll tell you why.
00:19:03.61\00:19:04.94
Because what happens
is that you're not only...
00:19:04.97\00:19:08.51
John, you not only
start getting loose
00:19:08.54\00:19:13.75
with your principles,
00:19:13.78\00:19:15.55
but other
things start adding on,
00:19:15.58\00:19:17.49
then you start taking a
drink here on the social.
00:19:17.52\00:19:20.39
Do you
understand what I'm talking?
00:19:20.42\00:19:22.06
It develops on a multi-level
and then the next thing is,
00:19:22.09\00:19:27.30
you say, so I can't go to church
00:19:27.33\00:19:28.73
because I've got a rehearsal.
00:19:28.76\00:19:30.77
You see, it gets complicated.
00:19:30.80\00:19:32.33
The devil knows
if he gets you on one
00:19:32.37\00:19:35.04
simple little thing that
you finally give on that,
00:19:35.07\00:19:39.67
then he's got you.
00:19:39.71\00:19:41.84
Because you've put
God aside, you say,
00:19:41.88\00:19:44.15
I'm not following you, God,
I want to do what I want to do.
00:19:44.18\00:19:47.98
And the other thing is sometimes
00:19:48.02\00:19:49.45
you begin to
think, if I don't do this,
00:19:49.48\00:19:52.12
you know, if I don't do this,
00:19:52.15\00:19:53.96
then my career is finished.
00:19:53.99\00:19:56.06
But you know what God does?
00:19:56.09\00:19:57.53
If you do what God says,
00:19:57.56\00:19:59.76
He opens up something totally
different that is better.
00:19:59.79\00:20:04.20
But we, we're
just like most of us,
00:20:04.23\00:20:06.74
we, once we get into that level,
00:20:06.77\00:20:08.44
we get some popularity
00:20:08.47\00:20:10.31
and people start
to express your good,
00:20:10.34\00:20:13.98
you know, you adjust that
and then reinforces, well,
00:20:14.01\00:20:17.91
maybe this is
what I should be doing.
00:20:17.95\00:20:20.48
You are right.
00:20:20.52\00:20:21.85
You are right.
00:20:21.88\00:20:23.69
Another interesting thing
00:20:23.72\00:20:26.09
is that you are not quite aware
00:20:26.12\00:20:30.16
what's happening.
00:20:30.19\00:20:31.86
It's in precept,
you're perceptibly naive,
00:20:31.89\00:20:34.93
would you say in English,
00:20:34.96\00:20:36.30
you know, that
things start going.
00:20:36.33\00:20:38.03
And the next thing that happens,
00:20:38.07\00:20:39.97
you find yourself all
out in the ocean, you know,
00:20:40.00\00:20:44.04
and that's exactly
what happened to me.
00:20:44.07\00:20:45.77
So that in 1990 when
I came back to the Lord,
00:20:45.81\00:20:49.74
remember before 1990,
00:20:49.78\00:20:51.85
I wasn't recording sacred music.
00:20:51.88\00:20:54.48
What for?
00:20:54.52\00:20:55.85
I was doing well,
00:20:55.88\00:20:57.22
I'd won all the
national prizes, you know.
00:20:57.25\00:20:59.19
And so all of a sudden,
the guy comes to the studio
00:20:59.22\00:21:01.79
and says, "Excuse me."
00:21:01.82\00:21:03.63
Bless His soul.
00:21:03.66\00:21:05.19
He's already passed on.
00:21:05.23\00:21:07.16
And Lain said to me, "Manuel,
00:21:07.20\00:21:10.37
you have three pieces of
music, sheet music, you know.
00:21:10.40\00:21:13.40
Please go and
have a look at that."
00:21:13.44\00:21:14.87
And he walked out,
00:21:14.90\00:21:16.24
that was it while
00:21:16.27\00:21:17.61
I was recording
all of those, you know.
00:21:17.64\00:21:18.97
So who is he?
00:21:19.01\00:21:20.34
He was the leader
of the beautiful group,
00:21:20.38\00:21:22.84
the Jubilatum singers, who were,
00:21:22.88\00:21:26.28
was the very first
big group in South Africa,
00:21:26.31\00:21:29.82
very much molded
after the Heritage singers.
00:21:29.85\00:21:33.36
Every time I go
to the United States,
00:21:33.39\00:21:35.99
I have supper with Maxmase,
00:21:36.02\00:21:38.89
because I live 45
minutes from where he lives.
00:21:38.93\00:21:43.57
So we always get together
and sometimes I sing with them
00:21:43.60\00:21:46.37
when they visit,
concert, whatever.
00:21:46.40\00:21:50.24
And this man brought
this piece of music called,
00:21:50.27\00:21:52.64
"I have returned to
the God of my childhood
00:21:52.67\00:21:55.74
to the same simple
faith as a child I once knew,
00:21:55.78\00:22:00.32
like the prodigal son,
00:22:00.35\00:22:01.68
I longed for my loved
ones for the comforts of home.
00:22:01.72\00:22:05.82
And the God I outgrew."
00:22:05.85\00:22:11.13
Isn't that powerful,
00:22:11.16\00:22:12.69
and immediately
recognized myself in this
00:22:12.73\00:22:14.80
and I look who's a composer,
00:22:14.83\00:22:16.50
Mary John Wilkin that
wrote one day at a time.
00:22:16.53\00:22:20.77
Never imagining that
when I got the United States.
00:22:20.80\00:22:24.07
As you know, I was
the international singing
00:22:24.11\00:22:26.68
soloist for Mark Finley.
00:22:26.71\00:22:28.94
For four years I
traveled with him
00:22:28.98\00:22:30.58
all over the country
at the late '96 with him
00:22:30.61\00:22:33.82
and I decided to send
some CDs to Mary John Wilkin
00:22:33.85\00:22:38.55
got to regress in
Nashville and I sent it.
00:22:38.59\00:22:41.46
And the week
later, she found and said,
00:22:41.49\00:22:43.02
"I'd love to meet you."
00:22:43.06\00:22:44.39
I said, "Excuse me, ma'am."
00:22:44.43\00:22:45.79
Says, "You've
got a special unction
00:22:45.83\00:22:47.66
on your voice."
00:22:47.70\00:22:49.56
And so I then visited
00:22:49.60\00:22:50.97
her number of
times in Nashville.
00:22:51.00\00:22:53.03
I got letters
that she wrote to me
00:22:53.07\00:22:55.54
personally with
a hand and recorded
00:22:55.57\00:22:57.91
some of the
songs that she gave me.
00:22:57.94\00:23:00.31
And so the Lord
knew, isn't it amazing
00:23:00.34\00:23:03.35
when you can trust God
enough to know that your map,
00:23:03.38\00:23:08.85
the map of your life, you know,
00:23:08.88\00:23:11.25
you can see the way
He directs you and so on.
00:23:11.29\00:23:13.92
And so God is
bringing you back...
00:23:13.96\00:23:15.99
Yes.
00:23:16.02\00:23:17.36
To where He really
wanted you in the first place?
00:23:17.39\00:23:18.73
Correct.
00:23:18.76\00:23:20.10
But you mentioned
that when you were given
00:23:20.13\00:23:22.13
this music you were recording
something else, what was that?
00:23:22.16\00:23:24.80
Of course, the normal...
00:23:24.83\00:23:27.07
Secular?
00:23:27.10\00:23:28.44
Secular music, yes.
00:23:28.47\00:23:29.80
So how many CDs
have you recorded?
00:23:29.84\00:23:31.27
I have recorded
now 56 CDs productions.
00:23:31.31\00:23:35.18
How many of them would
have been Christian CDs?
00:23:35.21\00:23:37.75
Oh, only from 1990
00:23:37.78\00:23:40.65
the first
Christian one came out,
00:23:40.68\00:23:43.52
and then I've
done one every year,
00:23:43.55\00:23:45.65
every second year, it
depends, you know, although,
00:23:45.69\00:23:49.76
let me be very frank with you.
00:23:49.79\00:23:52.59
I do not want to
rely on gospel music
00:23:52.63\00:23:56.43
for my daily bread.
00:23:56.46\00:23:58.17
You know, it doesn't work.
00:23:58.20\00:23:59.87
Let's be very honest
and before any, you know,
00:23:59.90\00:24:03.61
young people,
prospective singers, whatever,
00:24:03.64\00:24:07.58
let me tell you it's
better to not to rely on that.
00:24:07.61\00:24:12.21
So you keep that as a ministry.
00:24:12.25\00:24:14.02
So now you asked me,
how do I make my living?
00:24:14.05\00:24:17.75
Well, I do a lot of dinners.
00:24:17.79\00:24:21.36
I do concerts with choirs.
00:24:21.39\00:24:25.39
Schools will call me,
00:24:25.43\00:24:26.90
would you perform with the kids?
00:24:26.93\00:24:28.26
You know, I said
yes, I will do that.
00:24:28.30\00:24:30.40
And then there's nothing
wrong in doing a lovely evening.
00:24:30.43\00:24:33.70
I'm not going to go
there to proselytize.
00:24:33.74\00:24:36.14
Ladies mornings,
ladies teas, they love it.
00:24:36.17\00:24:39.34
But we never end the
concert without a prayer.
00:24:39.37\00:24:43.04
And I tell them, sorry, I know,
00:24:43.08\00:24:44.61
all the other
artists don't pray.
00:24:44.65\00:24:46.85
Well, I do pray at
the end of my concerts,
00:24:46.88\00:24:49.42
whether it's, you
know, whatever the nature.
00:24:49.45\00:24:51.85
You know, I'd like you
to know that I'm a Christian
00:24:51.89\00:24:53.32
and I witness, then I witness.
00:24:53.36\00:24:55.66
And amazing
enough God has placed us,
00:24:55.69\00:24:59.43
I wish it to
myself, why did God allow me
00:24:59.46\00:25:02.16
to become well
known in my country?
00:25:02.20\00:25:04.40
I was flying here to Australia.
00:25:04.43\00:25:07.44
And when I connected
from Sydney to Brisbane,
00:25:07.47\00:25:10.57
plane stopped and this
man tapped me on the shoulder,
00:25:10.61\00:25:12.71
"Excuse me.
00:25:12.74\00:25:14.08
Are you?
00:25:14.11\00:25:15.44
I think you are."
00:25:15.48\00:25:16.81
And I did note the
South African accent,
00:25:16.85\00:25:18.18
immediately said, "Yes, I am."
00:25:18.21\00:25:19.85
"I grew up with your music,
00:25:19.88\00:25:21.22
my mom played."
00:25:21.25\00:25:22.58
I mean, he had just finished
two rows in front the man
00:25:22.62\00:25:25.79
he hears and
says, "Are you Manuel?"
00:25:25.82\00:25:28.39
I say "Yes, I am Manuel. Yeah."
00:25:28.42\00:25:30.43
And so the Lord puts
us into certain places.
00:25:30.46\00:25:33.86
Why did he?
00:25:33.90\00:25:35.36
Daniel could
have looked and said,
00:25:35.40\00:25:37.27
but this is bad
things happening to me.
00:25:37.30\00:25:39.13
Do you know what
I'm trying to say?
00:25:39.17\00:25:40.50
Oh, this is negative, you know.
00:25:40.54\00:25:42.40
Hey, in God,
there's never a negative.
00:25:42.44\00:25:46.68
There's always a positive.
00:25:46.71\00:25:48.11
He knows what He's doing.
00:25:48.14\00:25:50.01
It might...
00:25:50.05\00:25:51.81
May I remind you that
roses also have thorns, not you,
00:25:51.85\00:25:54.82
but roses have thorns,
00:25:54.85\00:25:57.12
yet the beauty of the
roses smell the color.
00:25:57.15\00:26:00.19
Yeah, praise the Lord.
00:26:00.22\00:26:01.62
Say God puts you in
a place for a purpose.
00:26:01.66\00:26:03.29
Yes.
00:26:03.32\00:26:04.66
And so, you know,
that's something to remember
00:26:04.69\00:26:06.13
when we have opportunity,
00:26:06.16\00:26:07.50
we need to not be afraid
to tell people about God,
00:26:07.53\00:26:11.13
not to be afraid that we pray,
00:26:11.17\00:26:13.44
that gives courage to
others to do the same.
00:26:13.47\00:26:16.47
Not to be afraid to say
grace in a public place.
00:26:16.50\00:26:19.01
Absolutely.
00:26:19.04\00:26:20.38
And to witness for Him.
00:26:20.41\00:26:21.84
I am not ashamed of
the gospel of Christ.
00:26:21.88\00:26:25.11
You must understand
00:26:25.15\00:26:26.48
that I got
catapulted into a place
00:26:26.51\00:26:28.35
where I knew
most of the ministers
00:26:28.38\00:26:30.09
of the previous,
you know, government.
00:26:30.12\00:26:34.19
I did a lot of function
for the State President,
00:26:34.22\00:26:36.26
had dinner with him, you know,
00:26:36.29\00:26:37.99
the long tails and
the gloves and whatever.
00:26:38.03\00:26:41.40
So we had a lot of influence
in those days in South Africa.
00:26:41.43\00:26:44.63
And because I've done
over 200 television programs,
00:26:44.67\00:26:48.30
I have done in those
times we did full length operas,
00:26:48.34\00:26:52.51
full length
shooting for a month,
00:26:52.54\00:26:55.44
talking about television,
00:26:55.48\00:26:57.01
I have done television left
and right, you know, whatever.
00:26:57.05\00:27:00.02
We shot three full
length operas for television.
00:27:00.05\00:27:04.35
And besides the
national did the chat shows,
00:27:04.39\00:27:07.72
and then I had my own program
television in South Africa,
00:27:07.76\00:27:10.83
where I had my
guest on the show.
00:27:10.86\00:27:12.56
We were catapulted into
a place where, you know,
00:27:12.59\00:27:17.33
but you see, at
the end of the day,
00:27:17.37\00:27:19.33
God was still
calling all the time.
00:27:19.37\00:27:22.44
God never gives up on me,
00:27:22.47\00:27:24.51
I'm going to say
this to the people,
00:27:24.54\00:27:26.57
no matter what
happens, I got news for you.
00:27:26.61\00:27:30.21
God will never,
never give up on you.
00:27:30.25\00:27:33.21
You might give up on God. Yeah.
00:27:33.25\00:27:34.98
You may be in the wrong place...
00:27:35.02\00:27:36.38
You may be in the wrong place.
00:27:36.42\00:27:37.75
You may not be following God.
00:27:37.79\00:27:39.75
But He has a
plan and He will work
00:27:39.79\00:27:43.36
to bring you back
to it if you cooperate,
00:27:43.39\00:27:45.99
He can't force you.
00:27:46.03\00:27:47.36
But if you cooperate,
00:27:47.40\00:27:48.80
and if He can
get your attention,
00:27:48.83\00:27:50.77
He'll bring you back to
where He wants you to be.
00:27:50.80\00:27:53.30
I was witnessing on
couple of Sundays ago.
00:27:53.34\00:27:57.67
With the Sunday
church because 98% of my work
00:27:57.71\00:28:00.74
is that I go and
witness Sunday churches.
00:28:00.78\00:28:03.71
And we careful
because of the logical issues,
00:28:03.75\00:28:06.82
you know that they
don't dump you out and so on.
00:28:06.85\00:28:08.65
But they know pretty well
I'm a Seventh-day Adventist.
00:28:08.68\00:28:11.75
Either the Dutch Reformed Church
00:28:11.79\00:28:13.32
or the Pentecostals,
00:28:13.36\00:28:14.69
I've got a lot of
friends amongst them.
00:28:14.72\00:28:17.23
And I mentioned that sometimes
I might have a conversation
00:28:17.26\00:28:22.06
with the devil
and they went, hmm.
00:28:22.10\00:28:25.67
Yeah, I say yeah, I get
up and I go to my study,
00:28:25.70\00:28:28.47
I make my study at 9
o'clock every morning.
00:28:28.50\00:28:32.14
And I go, I just want
you to know that I, today,
00:28:32.17\00:28:38.41
I want to make known to
you that I am serving the Lord.
00:28:38.45\00:28:42.18
By the way, I'm a slave of His.
00:28:42.22\00:28:44.25
I don't want to
be a slave of you,
00:28:44.29\00:28:45.85
because in Him I've got freedom.
00:28:45.89\00:28:49.09
And I want you to understand
00:28:49.12\00:28:50.69
that I now give
him the authority
00:28:50.73\00:28:53.06
to deal in my life,
according to His will.
00:28:53.09\00:28:57.37
Therefore, He is binding you
00:28:57.40\00:29:00.67
that you have no
power in my life.
00:29:00.70\00:29:03.14
You not turn around
the Lord, say, Lord,
00:29:03.17\00:29:04.51
did you hear what I say to Him?
00:29:04.54\00:29:06.34
Now I want to be Yours, please,
00:29:06.37\00:29:09.34
because God and the
devil have an agreement.
00:29:09.38\00:29:13.45
And the
agreement is very simple.
00:29:13.48\00:29:14.82
The devil reminded
God, like your wife said,
00:29:14.85\00:29:17.62
you will never force anybody.
00:29:17.65\00:29:20.02
You will never
force anybody to serve me.
00:29:20.06\00:29:24.03
I mean, do you...
00:29:24.06\00:29:25.43
We're going to force
our children to love us
00:29:25.46\00:29:27.50
or the love come from...
00:29:27.53\00:29:28.86
You will love me,
00:29:28.90\00:29:30.23
it is your duty
as a son to love me
00:29:30.27\00:29:32.80
and to hug me and to kiss me.
00:29:32.83\00:29:34.50
Goodness me.
00:29:34.54\00:29:35.87
And so God expects us
to give Him the authority,
00:29:35.90\00:29:40.48
verbally,
mentally and in the heart.
00:29:40.51\00:29:42.38
Submit.
00:29:42.41\00:29:43.75
Submit.
00:29:43.78\00:29:45.11
Thank you, sir.
00:29:45.15\00:29:46.68
That's right.
00:29:46.72\00:29:48.05
Very good.
00:29:48.08\00:29:49.42
What you were talking
about before being somewhere
00:29:49.45\00:29:50.95
where you can witness you know,
00:29:50.99\00:29:53.96
even when you go
singing in a secular place.
00:29:53.99\00:29:56.99
It reminded me when
we're on an airplane
00:29:57.03\00:29:58.86
one time, and John had a
copy of Antichrist Agenda,
00:29:58.89\00:30:04.50
which is a 3ABN book.
00:30:04.53\00:30:06.77
And he decided he was
going to take it with him.
00:30:06.80\00:30:09.24
We're flying
from Perth to Sydney,
00:30:09.27\00:30:10.61
and then on to 3ABN in the US.
00:30:10.64\00:30:14.08
And he started reading the
book on the flight from Perth.
00:30:14.11\00:30:19.65
And then he had
the book upside down
00:30:19.68\00:30:22.18
on his little
table, and he's saying,
00:30:22.22\00:30:25.45
and a steward came along.
00:30:25.49\00:30:28.49
And he said, "Oh,
what are you reading?"
00:30:28.52\00:30:31.73
And it was, uh-huh.
00:30:31.76\00:30:34.63
So John turned
around, and he said,
00:30:34.66\00:30:36.56
it's called the
Antichrist Agenda.
00:30:36.60\00:30:38.27
It said about the beast.
00:30:38.30\00:30:41.80
And the steward
just talked and talked.
00:30:41.84\00:30:43.97
And he was so excited.
00:30:44.01\00:30:45.41
I've just started
reading the Bible.
00:30:45.44\00:30:47.74
And I, I'd love to
have a book like that.
00:30:47.78\00:30:50.28
And so we ended up giving him,
00:30:50.31\00:30:51.65
but he just talked and
talked for ages, didn't he?
00:30:51.68\00:30:54.18
And then when we're
getting off the plane,
00:30:54.22\00:30:55.85
someone a couple
of rows back said,
00:30:55.88\00:30:58.79
it was so nice to know,
00:30:58.82\00:31:00.36
there are other
Christians on this flight.
00:31:00.39\00:31:03.06
So people were all
listening to this conversation.
00:31:03.09\00:31:07.00
He wasn't talking quite, Manuel.
00:31:07.03\00:31:08.73
No, he wasn't.
00:31:08.76\00:31:10.10
Everybody could hear him.
00:31:10.13\00:31:11.80
He was so
excited to see this book,
00:31:11.83\00:31:13.84
and to actually
be given the book.
00:31:13.87\00:31:16.27
You see, sometimes
God takes negative things
00:31:16.30\00:31:18.61
like my son's
death 10 years ago.
00:31:18.64\00:31:21.68
What came out of
that, one start singing,
00:31:21.71\00:31:24.25
Why did you allow
the beautiful, strong,
00:31:24.28\00:31:27.15
healthy
29-year-old man, young man
00:31:27.18\00:31:30.25
who jumped into
save the other guy,
00:31:30.29\00:31:32.55
and both of them were...
00:31:32.59\00:31:33.92
What good came out of that?
00:31:33.96\00:31:35.86
Let me tell you,
00:31:35.89\00:31:37.23
the amount of
people that we witness,
00:31:37.26\00:31:42.10
people that write to me
must remember my number is,
00:31:42.13\00:31:44.83
you know, in all the
CDs, you know, and all the,
00:31:44.87\00:31:47.14
whatever, you know,
emails, can you please help me?
00:31:47.17\00:31:52.24
God has not given
me another function,
00:31:52.27\00:31:55.31
another ministry,
whatever you want to call it,
00:31:55.34\00:31:57.51
it makes no
difference, you know,
00:31:57.55\00:31:59.01
because now all of a sudden,
00:31:59.05\00:32:00.65
I understand that
throughout the negative thing
00:32:00.68\00:32:04.09
that happened, so much
positive can come out of.
00:32:04.12\00:32:08.02
And so, I praise the
Lord because my ministry.
00:32:08.06\00:32:11.69
So I never went to the ministry.
00:32:11.73\00:32:15.10
I never went to the ministry?
00:32:15.13\00:32:16.50
No, you have a ministry.
00:32:16.53\00:32:17.87
Thank you, ma'am. Thank you.
00:32:17.90\00:32:19.33
But you see the thing
is that devil does things
00:32:19.37\00:32:21.24
in our lives to
bring us to negativity.
00:32:21.27\00:32:23.71
Correct.
00:32:23.74\00:32:25.07
Whereas that's where he dwells.
00:32:25.11\00:32:26.51
Correct.
00:32:26.54\00:32:27.88
God dwells in the positive.
00:32:27.91\00:32:29.58
You look at the verses
in the Bible, and you know,
00:32:29.61\00:32:32.41
in Ephesians Chapter 4,
the old things are passed away,
00:32:32.45\00:32:37.02
give up the anger, the theft,
and all these negative things.
00:32:37.05\00:32:42.22
Give up the malice,
00:32:42.26\00:32:43.69
the bitterness
and all those things
00:32:43.73\00:32:45.59
and be kind,
tenderhearted, forgiving.
00:32:45.63\00:32:49.46
Our church and I'm so
glad you brought that up.
00:32:49.50\00:32:52.67
I was going to ask you,
00:32:52.70\00:32:54.04
what do you
think is the greatest
00:32:54.07\00:32:56.24
need of our church today?
00:32:56.27\00:32:57.77
I'm interested.
00:33:00.81\00:33:02.14
Our relationships
with each other through God
00:33:02.18\00:33:05.55
and the character of God in us.
00:33:05.58\00:33:07.82
I see, we are so
right in our doctrines.
00:33:07.85\00:33:10.55
Boy, we are perfect.
00:33:10.59\00:33:12.52
And yet I look, I go
to Israel very often.
00:33:12.55\00:33:17.19
I've been four times,
00:33:17.23\00:33:18.56
I'll be going in
March back again next year.
00:33:18.59\00:33:21.20
Take a group of people always.
00:33:21.23\00:33:22.80
I've seen people
wouldn't didn't even dream
00:33:22.83\00:33:25.00
about getting baptized in
that trip making, you know,
00:33:25.03\00:33:28.97
the decision for the Lord,
you know, because I, what I do,
00:33:29.00\00:33:31.81
I advertise my trips
every year at my concerts,
00:33:31.84\00:33:35.31
and my fans come with
me and they pay for me.
00:33:35.34\00:33:38.15
And they give me a bit
of money for pocket money,
00:33:38.18\00:33:40.52
and they just
want to be with me.
00:33:40.55\00:33:42.98
And so, that's another
big opportunity to witness
00:33:43.02\00:33:46.89
you know, to walk
there where Jesus walked.
00:33:46.92\00:33:49.16
I walked today where
Jesus walked in there.
00:33:49.19\00:33:52.39
It is like things
come sort of alive.
00:33:52.43\00:33:55.36
But at the end of the
day, going back to the church,
00:33:55.40\00:34:00.14
when the church is not united,
00:34:00.17\00:34:02.47
when there's so
much struggle and so much
00:34:02.50\00:34:05.54
what do you call
this in English Friction.
00:34:05.57\00:34:07.28
Friction.
00:34:07.31\00:34:08.64
This is a denial of the gospel.
00:34:08.68\00:34:12.35
I don't care how right you are,
00:34:12.38\00:34:14.98
how many
Sabbath's perfect you kept
00:34:15.02\00:34:18.35
and how much tithe you've paid.
00:34:18.39\00:34:20.82
The essential thing
is that what Christ said,
00:34:20.86\00:34:24.29
so that they can be
as one as I am with you.
00:34:24.33\00:34:28.76
If the church does
not get that right,
00:34:28.80\00:34:32.80
we have a serious
problem in our church.
00:34:32.83\00:34:35.57
That's right.
00:34:35.60\00:34:36.94
That's a very
difficult situation we are
00:34:36.97\00:34:38.37
and part of because
there's so much polarization.
00:34:38.41\00:34:43.98
But, okay, they
were, all right, Rosemary.
00:34:44.01\00:34:46.51
There was polarization
also in Jesus' time.
00:34:46.55\00:34:49.25
I mean, those guys, you know...
00:34:49.28\00:34:50.69
But not in the early church.
00:34:50.72\00:34:52.05
No, no.
00:34:52.09\00:34:53.42
So this is, I keep on
saying, do we need more light?
00:34:53.46\00:34:56.73
Do we need more? No.
00:34:56.76\00:34:58.16
We need to get
back to that state
00:34:58.19\00:35:01.33
where this church is known,
00:35:01.36\00:35:03.67
firstly, for its Christianity,
00:35:03.70\00:35:06.77
for its love, and for its unity.
00:35:06.80\00:35:10.41
Those are non-negotiables
as far as I'm concerned.
00:35:10.44\00:35:14.71
So I go and I tell a
guy about the Sabbath.
00:35:14.74\00:35:18.28
And I go, don't
go from a legal way,
00:35:18.31\00:35:20.68
you have to keep the
Sabbath because the law says
00:35:20.72\00:35:22.88
you have to keep the Sabbath.
00:35:22.92\00:35:24.32
You know what?
00:35:24.35\00:35:25.69
I wanted to ask John
last night to submit me proof.
00:35:25.72\00:35:28.32
We slept at your place.
00:35:28.36\00:35:29.69
Thank you so much
for your hospitality,
00:35:29.72\00:35:31.06
and for the good
food and the love.
00:35:31.09\00:35:33.70
John proved to me
that you love this woman.
00:35:33.73\00:35:36.00
So John goes to the
drawer and picks out your legal,
00:35:36.03\00:35:41.20
your legal documents,
you know, that you signed.
00:35:41.24\00:35:45.71
How many years
you've been married?
00:35:45.74\00:35:47.28
Twenty six.
00:35:47.31\00:35:48.64
Twenty six. And 26.
00:35:48.68\00:35:50.08
And this John, you know,
00:35:50.11\00:35:52.41
with this Ukrainian background
comes with proofs to me
00:35:52.45\00:35:56.18
that he loves his wife,
00:35:56.22\00:35:57.59
by holding out a legal document,
00:35:57.62\00:35:59.92
this is, I love my wife.
00:35:59.95\00:36:01.89
And I'll go John, John.
00:36:01.92\00:36:04.66
I got it right, you know.
00:36:04.69\00:36:06.03
You got legal right,
but show me that you love.
00:36:06.06\00:36:09.56
You see, this is the difference.
00:36:09.60\00:36:10.97
The Seventh-day
Adventist should be known
00:36:11.00\00:36:13.13
as the most loving church.
00:36:13.17\00:36:15.64
And this is why we do ADRA.
00:36:15.67\00:36:17.94
We don't do it
because we want to try to,
00:36:17.97\00:36:20.14
you know, prove to the world
00:36:20.18\00:36:21.71
what a great
organization we are.
00:36:21.74\00:36:23.91
We do it because we love people,
00:36:23.95\00:36:26.21
because we care people.
00:36:26.25\00:36:27.58
And that's the
decision I've also made.
00:36:27.62\00:36:29.88
So I don't care about that.
00:36:29.92\00:36:31.62
I am going to try to
be a loving Christian
00:36:31.65\00:36:34.16
and just to show
the love of Jesus
00:36:34.19\00:36:36.86
through my
songs, and bless them.
00:36:36.89\00:36:40.00
This world is
rotten, my country is rotten.
00:36:40.03\00:36:43.70
My country is full
of hatred and violence.
00:36:43.73\00:36:47.00
After 25 years down the road,
00:36:47.04\00:36:50.01
when things
have been made right,
00:36:50.04\00:36:51.81
things would come good.
00:36:51.84\00:36:53.74
But do you see any other
country very much different?
00:36:53.78\00:36:56.34
We're living in a time
where evil is called good
00:36:56.38\00:36:59.15
and good is called evil.
00:36:59.18\00:37:00.52
You are right.
00:37:00.55\00:37:01.88
And so we're
seeing a change in society
00:37:01.92\00:37:04.15
and how they react.
00:37:04.19\00:37:05.65
And really, the
Bible is, I believe,
00:37:05.69\00:37:08.09
is the stabilizing influence.
00:37:08.12\00:37:10.66
It teaches the
principles of loving someone,
00:37:10.69\00:37:13.80
being kind to him,
showing care for them.
00:37:13.83\00:37:16.90
These are the
things, by the way,
00:37:16.93\00:37:18.27
which Jesus did when
He came to this earth.
00:37:18.30\00:37:19.70
Correct. Yeah.
00:37:19.73\00:37:21.07
I agree with you.
00:37:21.10\00:37:22.44
I agree 100% with you.
00:37:22.47\00:37:23.81
And as we're told,
when Jesus did all that,
00:37:23.84\00:37:26.44
He then said, "Follow me."
00:37:26.47\00:37:28.14
Thank you.
00:37:28.18\00:37:29.51
He said, "Now do what
I do, live like I live,
00:37:29.54\00:37:33.45
believe like I believe."
00:37:33.48\00:37:35.32
And that people show a
difference between Jesus
00:37:35.35\00:37:38.69
and the
establishment of the day.
00:37:38.72\00:37:40.56
Now the establishment
of the day says, Jesus,
00:37:40.59\00:37:43.93
He has a prostitute.
00:37:43.96\00:37:45.73
Now the law says kill him.
00:37:45.76\00:37:47.63
Now, Rosemary, do you know
00:37:47.66\00:37:49.46
what feeling it
is for a dozen of men
00:37:49.50\00:37:52.63
to take stones and
stone a woman going through
00:37:52.67\00:37:56.00
the brain going
through the eyes,
00:37:56.04\00:37:59.54
and yet they were
so perfectly righteous
00:37:59.57\00:38:02.14
with God because they
were doing what the law said.
00:38:02.18\00:38:05.48
Jesus comes and
says, You know what?
00:38:05.51\00:38:07.52
Lift up the law.
00:38:07.55\00:38:09.68
underneath here, there's
love, forgiveness, forbearance.
00:38:09.72\00:38:14.56
So He turns around
to the woman, said,
00:38:14.59\00:38:15.96
"Go and sin no more,
your sins are forgiven."
00:38:15.99\00:38:19.06
And that is
what you spoke about,
00:38:19.09\00:38:20.90
the way Jesus acted,
00:38:20.93\00:38:23.16
and the way the
church of the day acted
00:38:23.20\00:38:26.30
'cause that was
the church of the day.
00:38:26.33\00:38:27.77
And that's where
we get Romans 13:8-10,
00:38:27.80\00:38:32.94
that love is the
fulfilling of the law...
00:38:32.97\00:38:37.05
Thank you, ma'am.
00:38:37.08\00:38:38.41
Because the Ten
Commandments are all about love.
00:38:38.45\00:38:39.98
Absolutely.
00:38:40.02\00:38:41.35
They're not about,
you have to obey me.
00:38:41.38\00:38:43.28
It's all about what
you do to other people.
00:38:43.32\00:38:46.52
And when you
look at those verses,
00:38:46.55\00:38:48.42
you cannot
misunderstand because it quotes
00:38:48.46\00:38:50.73
the Ten Commandments,
00:38:50.76\00:38:52.19
that they are the
fulfilling of the law,
00:38:52.23\00:38:55.10
that love is the
fulfilling of those verses,
00:38:55.13\00:38:57.83
of those commandments
to not steal, to not kill,
00:38:57.87\00:39:01.00
to not commit adultery, to
not be a false witness, etc.
00:39:01.04\00:39:04.87
Because if we love God,
00:39:04.91\00:39:07.84
we will love to do what He says.
00:39:07.88\00:39:09.81
Absolutely.
00:39:09.84\00:39:11.18
You look at the fundamental
doctrines of our church.
00:39:11.21\00:39:13.92
Go and look at
them at the close range.
00:39:13.95\00:39:18.09
They all have to do with love.
00:39:18.12\00:39:22.29
If they're not
intrinsically bound and,
00:39:22.32\00:39:26.09
you know, as a chain
to love, they are useless.
00:39:26.13\00:39:29.83
If you love someone, you
will not steal from them.
00:39:29.86\00:39:32.30
You will not steal.
00:39:32.33\00:39:33.67
If you love some,
and if you're the one
00:39:33.70\00:39:35.04
that someone's going to
steal from you really wish
00:39:35.07\00:39:36.97
that they'd love you.
00:39:37.01\00:39:38.97
They wouldn't do it.
00:39:39.01\00:39:40.34
If you love
someone, you won't kill them,
00:39:40.38\00:39:41.78
you won't take their
wife or their husband.
00:39:41.81\00:39:44.68
You won't take
away the good name
00:39:44.71\00:39:47.02
that they have
and try and slander it
00:39:47.05\00:39:49.38
and smear it in the dirt,
00:39:49.42\00:39:50.92
you won't want what they've got.
00:39:50.95\00:39:53.39
And if you really love God,
00:39:53.42\00:39:54.86
you want to do
the things He says,
00:39:54.89\00:39:56.52
you won't want to
take His name in vain,
00:39:56.56\00:39:58.46
you won't want an idol,
00:39:58.49\00:39:59.83
you want to
keep the day he says,
00:39:59.86\00:40:01.40
and you will want
to honor your prayers.
00:40:01.43\00:40:02.76
Why do I keep Sabbath?
00:40:02.80\00:40:04.97
Because you love God.
00:40:05.00\00:40:06.33
That's exactly.
00:40:06.37\00:40:07.70
It's a love moment.
00:40:07.74\00:40:09.44
What a brilliant day,
that God stops and says,
00:40:09.47\00:40:13.88
"I'm willing to come with you."
00:40:13.91\00:40:15.91
This is about the relationship.
00:40:15.94\00:40:17.78
You know, why must I pay,
00:40:17.81\00:40:19.58
think of money
about paying tithes?
00:40:19.61\00:40:21.28
That is got
nothing to do with money,
00:40:21.32\00:40:23.25
comes at the end,
you know, at the end,
00:40:23.28\00:40:25.49
it's got to do
with the relationship.
00:40:25.52\00:40:27.42
It's got to do
with the God that says,
00:40:27.46\00:40:29.92
"Would you like
to be my partner?"
00:40:29.96\00:40:32.36
Yes, John, I want
to start the business
00:40:32.39\00:40:34.60
with you in Australia,
only one condition, please,
00:40:34.63\00:40:38.63
the profits I take
90 and you can have 10.
00:40:38.67\00:40:42.40
You see the wonderful garden,
00:40:42.44\00:40:44.07
I'll give you
90, my boy, you know,
00:40:44.11\00:40:46.78
let me bless you, test me.
00:40:46.81\00:40:49.41
And this is the wonderful God,
00:40:49.44\00:40:51.11
I pray for our church every day.
00:40:51.15\00:40:53.72
One thing, Lord
help this church,
00:40:53.75\00:40:56.18
every member to be
more loving every day,
00:40:56.22\00:41:00.76
more loving every day.
00:41:00.79\00:41:02.92
With that 9% or
90% and that 10%.
00:41:02.96\00:41:07.93
He says, "If you keep
the 90% and give me the 10,
00:41:07.96\00:41:11.57
I'll give you even
more," Even more, even more.
00:41:11.60\00:41:15.40
Praise the Lord.
00:41:15.44\00:41:16.77
That's a very good subject.
00:41:16.81\00:41:18.14
Well, I'm glad we
got under those things.
00:41:18.17\00:41:19.51
But I want to just come
back to your music career.
00:41:19.54\00:41:22.01
You know, I think
about Christian music.
00:41:22.04\00:41:25.98
And I'll use the
word secular music
00:41:26.01\00:41:27.62
that's non-Christian music,
00:41:27.65\00:41:29.08
whether it be
operator or whatever,
00:41:29.12\00:41:31.65
as a performer, as a performer,
00:41:31.69\00:41:35.42
when you're singing
non scriptural music,
00:41:35.46\00:41:38.86
who's singing
and for what purpose
00:41:38.89\00:41:40.83
do you sing that, Manuel?
00:41:40.86\00:41:42.56
I will answer that.
00:41:42.60\00:41:44.57
It's easy answer to do.
00:41:44.60\00:41:46.67
In life, we have
different aspects of life,
00:41:50.27\00:41:55.78
you know, whether it's
eating, whether it's whatever.
00:41:55.81\00:41:58.58
But the Bible gives us a
very, very straightforward.
00:41:58.61\00:42:03.35
Everything you do may be
done to the glory of God.
00:42:03.39\00:42:08.19
1 Corinthians 10:31.
00:42:08.22\00:42:09.92
Now I don't feel
anything by singing love,
00:42:09.96\00:42:14.16
love changes everything.
00:42:14.20\00:42:16.43
Do you understand?
00:42:16.46\00:42:17.80
Although it was
written by Andrew Lloyd Webber,
00:42:17.83\00:42:19.43
what is the subject?
00:42:19.47\00:42:21.10
So when I choose my material,
I don't go and choose...
00:42:21.14\00:42:24.37
Let me choose.
00:42:24.41\00:42:26.04
Do you understand?
00:42:26.07\00:42:27.41
If I sing for the...
00:42:27.44\00:42:28.78
I go sing every
time in the village,
00:42:28.81\00:42:30.61
and I sing pearly
shells from the ocean.
00:42:30.65\00:42:35.15
Is it bad?
00:42:35.18\00:42:36.65
Is it or if I sing my Nat
King Cole fascination it was,
00:42:36.69\00:42:41.19
because the old people
00:42:41.22\00:42:42.56
if I sing true
love I give to you.
00:42:42.59\00:42:46.23
So I make sure that my
program is the sort of program
00:42:46.26\00:42:51.57
that there's not...
00:42:51.60\00:42:55.17
You know, most of the music
today is horrible, it's really,
00:42:55.20\00:42:59.21
and the nature of
the music is not good.
00:42:59.24\00:43:02.34
And the words are so bad.
00:43:02.38\00:43:03.71
And the words and the swearing.
00:43:03.75\00:43:05.45
What we're actually saying.
00:43:05.48\00:43:06.82
And then we know people like
Lady Gaga, you know, Madonna,
00:43:06.85\00:43:11.09
they have made
pact to the devil.
00:43:11.12\00:43:14.36
Make me famous, give me
money, give me, make me...
00:43:14.39\00:43:17.69
So what I was
alluding to secular world music
00:43:17.73\00:43:20.66
leads to self-exaltation,
and gaining the benefit
00:43:20.70\00:43:24.17
of the glory to you.
00:43:24.20\00:43:26.30
Scripture music does
not do that, does it?
00:43:26.33\00:43:28.30
No, it doesn't.
00:43:28.34\00:43:29.67
No, it doesn't.
00:43:29.70\00:43:31.04
Although, although,
all right, I will tell you,
00:43:31.07\00:43:33.58
you should be eating good food,
00:43:33.61\00:43:35.34
but you should
not eating dessert,
00:43:35.38\00:43:38.31
because it's sugar.
00:43:38.35\00:43:39.68
It's poisonous.
00:43:39.71\00:43:41.05
So, you know, I'm
not talking about meat,
00:43:41.08\00:43:42.42
but you pick yourself on sugar.
00:43:42.45\00:43:44.09
Right.
00:43:44.12\00:43:45.45
It's both are evils, you
know what I'm trying to say?
00:43:45.49\00:43:47.72
But now, at the end of the
day, we still eat the dessert,
00:43:47.76\00:43:51.53
you know, although thinking
you know, or the other good,
00:43:51.56\00:43:54.86
good food is good.
00:43:54.90\00:43:56.23
And to me, that's not the issue.
00:43:56.26\00:43:57.90
The issue is, I'm
not going to go to heaven
00:43:57.93\00:43:59.63
by what I eat.
00:43:59.67\00:44:01.60
Not by my works,
00:44:01.64\00:44:03.30
but simply the grace
of God that is there.
00:44:03.34\00:44:08.61
My hand of faith that
says, I need you so much.
00:44:08.64\00:44:11.95
And that hand of faith
00:44:11.98\00:44:13.31
which is not
mine is given to me,
00:44:13.35\00:44:15.28
grab His grace and
makes me a saved person.
00:44:15.32\00:44:18.85
At the end of the day,
00:44:18.89\00:44:20.82
I realized that if I had to live
00:44:20.86\00:44:25.69
by what the church
gives me, I'll be dead.
00:44:25.73\00:44:29.60
I'll be dead in
terms of financial,
00:44:29.63\00:44:31.53
you know what I mean?
00:44:31.57\00:44:32.90
So one is obliged to do,
00:44:32.93\00:44:35.50
another to go and
do ladies morning.
00:44:35.54\00:44:38.34
If I sing these beautiful songs,
00:44:38.37\00:44:41.28
being love, what a difference
being in love can make.
00:44:41.31\00:44:46.31
Are you too in
love here? Yes, you are.
00:44:46.35\00:44:47.85
Does make a difference? Yes.
00:44:47.88\00:44:49.28
So why not, why
not talk about it,
00:44:49.32\00:44:51.32
you know what I mean.
00:44:51.35\00:44:52.69
You go to a wedding ceremony.
00:44:52.72\00:44:54.06
You have the church ceremony
and you go to reception.
00:44:54.09\00:44:57.53
Why should you go to reception?
00:44:57.56\00:44:58.89
You don't need a reception
00:44:58.93\00:45:00.26
You gonna feed a
whole bunch of people.
00:45:00.30\00:45:01.90
You know what I'm trying to say,
00:45:01.93\00:45:03.26
but it's part
of the whole thing.
00:45:03.30\00:45:04.67
So to me, and then I
lead them to the end.
00:45:04.70\00:45:08.20
I never end any concerts
whether they are ladies morning
00:45:08.24\00:45:13.11
or a dinner without
doing the gospel at the end.
00:45:13.14\00:45:17.05
So I say, I want you to
know that I love the Lord.
00:45:17.08\00:45:18.98
Yeah, so you music is just...
00:45:19.01\00:45:21.25
Be careful of what
sort of song you sing.
00:45:21.28\00:45:24.12
You don't sing songs about
00:45:24.15\00:45:25.49
how your wife ran off
with another man you know.
00:45:25.52\00:45:27.26
But, of course,
what's the other one, Mack,
00:45:27.29\00:45:30.83
that Mack Mack
Deni for whatever?
00:45:30.86\00:45:32.19
Yeah.
00:45:32.23\00:45:33.56
How can I go and
I'll sing about Mark Deni
00:45:33.60\00:45:34.93
and I fell out.
00:45:34.96\00:45:36.30
Or Tom Jones, I saw
the light on the night
00:45:36.33\00:45:39.07
that I passed by her window.
00:45:39.10\00:45:40.60
Why? Why?
00:45:40.64\00:45:42.00
Delilah, my goodness me.
00:45:42.04\00:45:44.27
I can't, I can't.
00:45:44.31\00:45:46.17
That is, so you
screen the stuff that you do.
00:45:46.21\00:45:49.74
You do some golden
oldies, we see them smiling,
00:45:49.78\00:45:52.21
saying the words.
00:45:52.25\00:45:53.68
And then at the end,
00:45:53.72\00:45:55.25
I say I want to
close off my program
00:45:55.28\00:45:57.59
with three or four gospel songs.
00:45:57.62\00:46:00.49
And then you witness
and you leave the seed.
00:46:00.52\00:46:03.63
The Holy Spirit
does the work, not you.
00:46:03.66\00:46:05.89
Yeah.
00:46:05.93\00:46:07.26
So really what
you use the gospel is,
00:46:07.30\00:46:09.60
you use the music to present
the gospel to the people.
00:46:09.63\00:46:12.73
Yes. Yes.
00:46:12.77\00:46:14.10
That' what, that's what...
00:46:14.14\00:46:15.47
Absolutely.
00:46:15.50\00:46:16.84
So the take home
message there is for people
00:46:16.87\00:46:19.11
who want to do music,
it's have a second job?
00:46:19.14\00:46:22.34
Or don't rely on
the music as your job?
00:46:22.38\00:46:25.25
I don't know, if
it is in Australia,
00:46:25.28\00:46:27.98
in South Africa,
it's very difficult to,
00:46:28.02\00:46:32.25
I'm lucky.
00:46:32.29\00:46:33.62
You spoke about Pierre
the other day, you know,
00:46:33.66\00:46:36.83
we were chatting last night
as well, you know, I'm lucky.
00:46:36.86\00:46:40.70
I'm well known, you
know, and so on for somebody
00:46:40.73\00:46:43.00
who's not known.
00:46:43.03\00:46:45.33
And wants to break
through makes make a living
00:46:45.37\00:46:47.97
out of it professionally
to earn your is very hard.
00:46:48.00\00:46:52.34
So I'd say have
a second job, yes.
00:46:52.37\00:46:54.48
Yes. Definitely.
00:46:54.51\00:46:56.14
Yes.
00:46:56.18\00:46:57.51
Especially in country like ours.
00:46:57.55\00:46:58.88
Yeah, in Australia, yeah, yeah.
00:46:58.91\00:47:00.68
Doesn't work.
00:47:00.72\00:47:02.05
I want to just
go on a little bit
00:47:02.08\00:47:04.42
with what you've been doing
00:47:04.45\00:47:06.35
over the last
three or four years.
00:47:06.39\00:47:10.06
We spoke to you
about three years ago,
00:47:10.09\00:47:11.99
and take us
through what you did?
00:47:12.03\00:47:13.90
Yes, I thought I was
really contemplating retirement,
00:47:13.93\00:47:18.73
you were making a
joke just now here.
00:47:18.77\00:47:21.44
But I say to myself,
"What do I retire for?
00:47:21.47\00:47:25.67
What am I going to do?"
00:47:25.71\00:47:27.48
And so the opportunity
came to do another CD,
00:47:27.51\00:47:30.31
another two CDs
as a matter of fact,
00:47:30.35\00:47:32.61
I went to the South African
Broadcasting Corporation.
00:47:32.65\00:47:36.02
And I dug out
because I had done,
00:47:36.05\00:47:39.15
I'm one of the very few artists,
00:47:39.19\00:47:41.52
where's recordings
00:47:41.56\00:47:42.89
with the full
symphony orchestra.
00:47:42.92\00:47:44.26
Remember, in the olden days,
00:47:44.29\00:47:45.63
we had symphony
orchestras, you know.
00:47:45.66\00:47:47.20
So I have
recorded three complete CDs
00:47:47.23\00:47:49.60
one of all my opera arias
00:47:49.63\00:47:52.13
with the South African
Broadcasting Corporation,
00:47:52.17\00:47:55.30
you know, which I
can't find, I can't trace.
00:47:55.34\00:47:58.27
I'm talking about the
days that I used to be really
00:47:58.31\00:48:01.68
contemplating going to
Europe and sing and so on.
00:48:01.71\00:48:03.85
And again,
again, let me tell you,
00:48:03.88\00:48:05.85
God closed the door.
00:48:05.88\00:48:07.22
I did go to mansion,
00:48:07.25\00:48:08.78
I did audition at
[inaudible] agency,
00:48:08.82\00:48:12.35
and God vetoed it.
00:48:12.39\00:48:14.16
He didn't accept me.
00:48:14.19\00:48:15.56
When I was at
the top of my career,
00:48:15.59\00:48:17.56
I flew to Lisbon auditions
with the state opera house
00:48:17.59\00:48:19.86
and there's been God accepted
and God keep the intent down
00:48:19.89\00:48:24.33
to the director of the
opera so that my contract
00:48:24.37\00:48:26.87
did not materialize.
00:48:26.90\00:48:28.60
Because God knew
if I'd gone to Europe,
00:48:28.64\00:48:30.47
you must remember
00:48:30.51\00:48:31.84
I have done
every single auditorium
00:48:31.87\00:48:33.27
that exists our
soloist Messiah 51 times,
00:48:33.31\00:48:37.11
Beethoven's Ninth Symphony.
00:48:37.15\00:48:38.58
There's not an
oratorio, Samson, the creation,
00:48:38.61\00:48:42.12
Mendelssohn's
Elijah, I did it all,
00:48:42.15\00:48:44.29
400 leader and so my
incredible experience
00:48:44.32\00:48:48.32
on every aspect,
audiorial, leader and opera
00:48:48.36\00:48:51.63
was an equal in South Africa.
00:48:51.66\00:48:53.86
That's the reality
even if I have to admit,
00:48:53.90\00:48:56.50
and to say that, plus the fact
00:48:56.53\00:48:58.17
that I could speak
all those languages.
00:48:58.20\00:49:00.00
So I would have done well
in Europe and God closed it
00:49:00.04\00:49:02.20
because He knew if I'd
gone out I'd been swallowed,
00:49:02.24\00:49:05.84
never ever come back to the Lord
00:49:05.87\00:49:07.61
and I thank him For it today.
00:49:07.64\00:49:10.48
It's inexplicable
because I was doing an opera
00:49:10.51\00:49:13.15
in Cape Town and the
partner heard me sing
00:49:13.18\00:49:16.08
and invited me to go to mansion,
00:49:16.12\00:49:18.25
so off way you your
door was already open, John,
00:49:18.29\00:49:21.39
you know what I mean.
00:49:21.42\00:49:22.76
And yet, this
big, tall German guy,
00:49:22.79\00:49:25.36
boy, he was, he was
horrible, you know...
00:49:25.39\00:49:28.50
I said...
00:49:29.83\00:49:31.23
I don't speak, but I speak.
00:49:31.27\00:49:32.90
And I took an immediate
dislike to the man and I said,
00:49:32.93\00:49:37.87
I don't want to go.
00:49:37.91\00:49:39.24
I don't want to sing.
00:49:39.27\00:49:40.61
And then he just said,
don't call us, we'll call you.
00:49:40.64\00:49:42.54
We'll call you.
00:49:42.58\00:49:44.05
And the call never
came, thank God for that.
00:49:44.08\00:49:46.85
But I know that the Lord
worked things out through thin
00:49:46.88\00:49:52.09
and thick that I
eventually would be where I am.
00:49:52.12\00:49:55.42
So I'm beginning
to write my book.
00:49:55.46\00:49:57.63
I'm already on
page 50-60 whatever.
00:49:57.66\00:50:00.53
My memoirs which was,
00:50:00.56\00:50:01.90
they are absolutely unbelievable
00:50:01.93\00:50:03.63
how the Lord guided me.
00:50:03.67\00:50:06.03
And I'm intending next
year to do my doctors in music.
00:50:06.07\00:50:09.70
Why not?
00:50:09.74\00:50:11.07
I'm challenged
and I want to do it
00:50:11.11\00:50:12.94
and I feel I can
keep my brain occupied.
00:50:12.97\00:50:16.04
What for?
00:50:16.08\00:50:17.41
I don't know.
00:50:17.45\00:50:18.78
Are you going to
do it in Russian?
00:50:18.81\00:50:20.15
No, no, ma'am, no.
00:50:20.18\00:50:21.92
That's from the
opera Eugene Onegin
00:50:30.86\00:50:34.10
by Ilyich
Tchaikovsky is terrible stuff.
00:50:34.13\00:50:37.57
I can tell you, you're
nowhere near ready to retire.
00:50:37.60\00:50:40.90
And I want to
say because you know,
00:50:40.94\00:50:43.14
there are times in our life
00:50:43.17\00:50:44.84
when we do come
to retirement age
00:50:44.87\00:50:46.61
and by the way, I'm there now.
00:50:46.64\00:50:48.38
But I'm not saying...
00:50:48.41\00:50:49.74
Oh, not quite.
00:50:49.78\00:50:51.11
Not quite another few months.
00:50:51.15\00:50:52.48
But anyway, what I'm saying is,
00:50:52.51\00:50:54.42
it can be a very
depressing moment, can't it?
00:50:54.45\00:50:56.99
Sure, I have seen men,
00:50:57.02\00:50:58.85
we men don't do
our old retirement.
00:50:58.89\00:51:01.19
Not good.
00:51:01.22\00:51:02.56
We feel now useless.
00:51:02.59\00:51:04.36
And this is
advice for all you men.
00:51:04.39\00:51:06.93
Whatever you do,
don't let the brain stop.
00:51:06.96\00:51:10.53
You retire, you can
do whatever you like,
00:51:10.57\00:51:12.63
don't let the brain
stop because that's exactly
00:51:12.67\00:51:15.34
where you start
dying, the brain tells you.
00:51:15.37\00:51:18.14
There is always something to do.
00:51:18.17\00:51:20.78
Think about doing
something for the Lord.
00:51:20.81\00:51:23.38
Well, I keep thinking,
think about doing something
00:51:23.41\00:51:25.88
for your children
and your grandchildren,
00:51:25.91\00:51:28.78
and your neighbor.
00:51:28.82\00:51:30.19
And like if, you know
if you can sing like you,
00:51:30.22\00:51:34.42
you don't have to
go to a performance,
00:51:34.46\00:51:35.96
you can sing for
someone by their bedside.
00:51:35.99\00:51:39.03
And you know, I don't
know whether, you know,
00:51:39.06\00:51:41.66
we had an
experience not too long ago
00:51:41.70\00:51:43.26
where our neighbor
00:51:43.30\00:51:44.63
who had just
recently passed away.
00:51:44.67\00:51:46.63
We had some of 3ABN
people staying at our home.
00:51:46.67\00:51:50.41
And we went across
to her home on a bed.
00:51:50.44\00:51:53.14
She's been in a wheelchair,
she had been for 65 years,
00:51:53.17\00:51:56.81
most positive woman,
and they came in there
00:51:56.85\00:51:59.41
and they sung to her.
00:51:59.45\00:52:00.78
You know, after they
left, she told me, John,
00:52:00.82\00:52:02.22
that was the most
wonderful thing in her life
00:52:02.25\00:52:05.75
to have the 3ABN
singers come and sing
00:52:05.79\00:52:08.19
in her home beside her bed.
00:52:08.22\00:52:10.36
You see, it's
those little things,
00:52:10.39\00:52:12.89
you don't have to
do the big things,
00:52:12.93\00:52:15.13
it's the little
things just showing
00:52:15.16\00:52:17.47
you care for someone else.
00:52:17.50\00:52:19.03
And that's what you
can do in retirement.
00:52:19.07\00:52:20.40
Making someone happy
00:52:20.44\00:52:21.77
and showing
them the love of God.
00:52:21.80\00:52:23.84
Encouraging someone.
00:52:23.87\00:52:25.21
Encouraging somebody.
00:52:25.24\00:52:26.88
And if you sing like you,
you will encourage everyone
00:52:26.91\00:52:29.58
and bring a smile to their face.
00:52:29.61\00:52:31.01
But some people when
they did it, would not.
00:52:31.05\00:52:33.01
Yeah.
00:52:33.05\00:52:34.42
I was very lucky last year
00:52:34.45\00:52:36.25
the Federation of
African's Culture honored me
00:52:36.28\00:52:41.26
as a foreigner for my recordings
00:52:41.29\00:52:46.76
with the Cape Town Symphony
Orchestra of Afrikaan songs.
00:52:46.80\00:52:50.70
And it was quite amazing to me
00:52:50.73\00:52:52.73
that at this
late stage of my life,
00:52:52.77\00:52:56.04
they still found
something to say thank you for.
00:52:56.07\00:53:01.21
I was very
privileged, very privileged,
00:53:01.24\00:53:03.61
but at the end of the day,
when the chairman also spoke,
00:53:03.65\00:53:07.52
he said your work in
the Afrikaans language
00:53:07.55\00:53:10.32
is not finished yet.
00:53:10.35\00:53:11.69
We appreciate everything
you've done as a foreigner,
00:53:11.72\00:53:14.86
as a foreigner you
know what you've done
00:53:14.89\00:53:16.32
for our culture.
00:53:16.36\00:53:17.76
So I think at
the end of the day,
00:53:17.79\00:53:19.29
you two are quite correct.
00:53:19.33\00:53:21.13
Find something to do.
00:53:21.16\00:53:24.00
There's a song in our operator
00:53:24.03\00:53:28.74
and it says find
yourself something to do dear,
00:53:28.77\00:53:32.01
find yourself something to do.
00:53:32.04\00:53:33.88
Choose a niche a niche
in which you can nestle
00:53:33.91\00:53:37.05
and know that
it's you, you know...
00:53:37.08\00:53:38.41
Oh that's cute.
00:53:38.45\00:53:39.78
I'm sorry, it was to a young men
00:53:39.81\00:53:41.15
but it can be
the old ones as well.
00:53:41.18\00:53:43.55
Just right now we're going to go
00:53:43.59\00:53:45.05
to our address roll.
00:53:45.09\00:53:46.42
So write down the
details so you can contact us
00:53:46.45\00:53:48.42
we'd love to hear from you.
00:53:48.46\00:53:49.99
If you would like to
contact 3ABN Australia,
00:53:54.60\00:53:56.83
you may do so in
the following ways.
00:53:56.87\00:53:58.77
You may write to 3ABN Australia,
00:53:58.80\00:54:01.14
PO Box 752, Morisset,
00:54:01.17\00:54:03.84
New South Wales 2264, Australia.
00:54:03.87\00:54:07.18
That's PO Box 752, Morisset,
00:54:07.21\00:54:10.91
New South Wales 2264, Australia.
00:54:10.95\00:54:14.05
Or you may call 02-4973-3456.
00:54:14.08\00:54:18.82
That's 02-4973-3456
00:54:18.85\00:54:22.96
from 8:30 am to 5
pm Monday to Thursday,
00:54:22.99\00:54:26.59
or 8:30 am to 12 pm
Fridays, New South Wales time.
00:54:26.63\00:54:31.90
You may also email us at
mail@3abnaustralia.org.au.
00:54:31.93\00:54:37.67
That's
mail@3abnaustralia.org.au.
00:54:37.71\00:54:44.98
Thank you for
all you do to help us
00:54:45.01\00:54:46.88
light the world with
the glory of God's truth.
00:54:46.92\00:54:49.25
I hope you got those details.
00:54:52.09\00:54:53.52
We've been talking
to Manuel Escorcio.
00:54:53.56\00:54:55.69
Manuel.
00:54:55.72\00:54:57.06
Manuel, I like that,
00:54:57.09\00:54:58.43
it's even better and
more pronounced correctly.
00:54:58.46\00:55:00.83
Manuel has a new CD, it
is called My Father's Care,
00:55:00.86\00:55:05.73
My Father Cares.
00:55:05.77\00:55:07.24
And you know,
00:55:07.27\00:55:08.60
I think that the
words in that are very,
00:55:08.64\00:55:11.47
very precious, aren't they?
00:55:11.51\00:55:12.84
God really does care about you.
00:55:12.87\00:55:14.74
And there's the CDs
also got his photo on it.
00:55:14.78\00:55:17.15
That's right.
00:55:17.18\00:55:18.51
And I think the arrangements
or the wording in particular,
00:55:18.55\00:55:21.62
where the words
come from, Manuel?
00:55:21.65\00:55:23.12
You won't believe
me, I heard the song
00:55:23.15\00:55:25.55
when I was in Australia,
called my father cares.
00:55:25.59\00:55:28.66
I inquired about it,
Britt found the person.
00:55:28.69\00:55:31.89
We visited the
lady quite accidentally
00:55:31.93\00:55:34.86
going after that bought two CDs.
00:55:34.90\00:55:36.87
And I play the song and he says,
00:55:36.90\00:55:38.93
"This is Richard Audi song."
00:55:38.97\00:55:41.00
I said, "You know the man."
00:55:41.04\00:55:42.44
she says, "You
want to speak to him,"
00:55:42.47\00:55:44.11
picked up the phone.
00:55:44.14\00:55:45.47
And I called Richard and Britt
and I went down to Brisbane
00:55:45.51\00:55:50.25
and we had a
quick, lovely cuppa.
00:55:50.28\00:55:53.72
And I asked him
permission to record the song.
00:55:53.75\00:55:56.52
Isn't that amazing?
00:55:56.55\00:55:57.99
My father cares,
an Australian song.
00:55:58.02\00:56:01.69
That is really good.
00:56:01.72\00:56:03.06
You know, if you want to get
00:56:03.09\00:56:04.43
some of Manuel Escorcio's CDs
here in Australia, there's a,
00:56:04.46\00:56:10.10
an email address
there, bandr@bigpond.com.
00:56:10.13\00:56:15.00
You can contact Britt
00:56:15.04\00:56:16.71
and he will be
able to supply this one
00:56:16.74\00:56:18.31
and a few others that you have.
00:56:18.34\00:56:19.67
Yes. That's right.
00:56:19.71\00:56:21.04
And for those on
radio, it's B-A-N-D-R,
00:56:21.08\00:56:25.45
the letter B, the
word and the letter R.
00:56:25.48\00:56:28.85
And that stands
for Britt and Rose.
00:56:28.88\00:56:31.99
B and R, ain't that good?
00:56:32.02\00:56:33.76
Bigpond.com.
00:56:33.79\00:56:35.12
Very, very good.
00:56:35.16\00:56:36.49
I want to say thank
you to Britt and to Rose
00:56:36.52\00:56:38.56
for hosting me for bringing
me all the way down to Morisset.
00:56:38.59\00:56:42.30
How many times?
00:56:42.33\00:56:43.67
Oh, you see he believes
in the ministry as well.
00:56:43.70\00:56:47.34
But how many times have
you been to Australia now?
00:56:47.37\00:56:49.20
Oh, about 13 times.
00:56:49.24\00:56:52.24
Can't keep you away.
00:56:52.27\00:56:54.54
Just in a very brief...
00:56:54.58\00:56:56.01
You should have
migrated Just in a brief moment
00:56:56.04\00:56:57.91
a closing thought,
00:56:57.95\00:56:59.28
those who are looking
at doing music as an art.
00:56:59.31\00:57:01.52
You know, as a ministry,
00:57:01.55\00:57:02.88
what would you
say to them, Manuel?
00:57:02.92\00:57:04.59
I will tell you right
now time is very short.
00:57:04.62\00:57:06.76
Now you know if
you do, don't be,
00:57:06.79\00:57:10.19
either world
calls you and you know,
00:57:10.23\00:57:13.56
just stick to the Lord.
00:57:13.60\00:57:15.06
Stick to the
Lord, time is short.
00:57:15.10\00:57:17.50
The Lord is coming very soon
and I cannot wait to go home.
00:57:17.53\00:57:21.37
Don't you miss
going home with us.
00:57:21.40\00:57:24.57
That's a really
important point, Manuel,
00:57:24.61\00:57:27.11
because too many people
get caught up in the world
00:57:27.14\00:57:30.05
and they want to do the music.
00:57:30.08\00:57:31.88
But they do the world's
music instead of God's music
00:57:31.91\00:57:34.58
and that takes them away.
00:57:34.62\00:57:36.25
Well, we've been
talking with Manuel Escorcio.
00:57:36.28\00:57:38.75
And that's the end
of our time with you.
00:57:38.79\00:57:40.96
But we pray that
you're blessed by the program
00:57:40.99\00:57:43.36
and we look forward
to seeing you next time.
00:57:43.39\00:57:44.86
God bless.
00:57:44.89\00:57:46.23