This is 3ABN Now
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with John and
Rosemary Malkiewycz.
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Hello and welcome to 3ABN Now.
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3ABN is one of those
Christian television networks
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that goes right
across the world.
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In fact, if you are watching
somewhere in South Africa
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for example, you'll be
very interested in this program
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because we are
interviewing two people
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who come from
that part of the world.
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What's interesting is
when you're young you wonder
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how God actually
leads people in their life.
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Well today we're going to have
the testimony of Cornelius and
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Ulna Keet. Welcome
Cornelius and welcome Ulna.
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Thank you. They're going
to tell the story of how God
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has led them
throughout their life.
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And it's exciting!
And I know for a fact
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as I'm getting older
and I start to look back
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I can see that God is leading.
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Oh, they had some very
SERIOUS leading at the time!
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That's right.
And it's good to know
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God takes care
of you all the time.
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But before we
start the interview
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Rosemary, Cornelius and
Ulna have chosen a text.
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Would you like to read it?
Yes. They've chosen Jeremiah
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chapter 29 and verse 11.
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This is a very popular
verse around the world.
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It says... God says:
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"For I know the thoughts
that I think towards you
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saith the Lord. Thoughts
of peace and not of evil
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to give you an expected end. "
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Cornelius: you like that verse.
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I like it very much! I
think the background to me
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for that is what I believe
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has played a part in my life.
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I also like the two
verses that come after that:
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verse 12 and 13.
"Then shall ye call upon Me
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and you shall
go and pray unto Me
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and I WILL hearken
unto you. " That's right.
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"And ye shall
seek Me and find Me
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when you shall search
for Me with all your heart. "
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That's right! So those 3
verses go beautifully together.
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Yes. And they
explain each other.
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Yes. But we are to pray
to God and He promises that
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He will hear. Yes.
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You know the thoughts that
God has towards you, don't you
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Ulna? Yes, I know.
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And you've experienced
it throughout your life.
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All of my life really
the Lord was good to us.
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You know, you cannot
believe how the Lord led us.
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It is just... I mean, when I
was a little girl on the farm.
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It just can't come in my
mind what the Lord has done
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and how He led us, you
know. It is just wonderful! Yes.
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So when you discovered the Lord
how many years ago was that?
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Many? Oh, that's many years ago.
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Yes, many years ago
on the farm already.
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Yes. And you mustn't forget
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how I had the best
mother in the world.
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That's good to know you
come from a very good family
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and you love your
mother. My mother was a SDA
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from her birth
till the day she died.
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Um-hmm. But not my father.
My father became an Adventist
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afterwards. Uh-huh. But
I've had the best mother
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in the world
that looked after me.
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And you know one
of the main things is
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she taught you about Jesus.
That's right; that's right.
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The same with me. I had the
most wonderful parents really.
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My dad was a wonderful person
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and mom... both my mom and dad.
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Yeah, but he's saying that his
was the best and you're saying
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that yours were? Mine was also!
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I know he had a very
good mother and a good father.
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So did you get the best
and did you get the best?
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I got the best and I
hope he got the best.
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She can... she just told you now
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what she said, and
I'm saying the same thing.
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Very good. We should all think
that our parents are the best.
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My daughter-in-law here Monique,
she always when introduces us
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to people she says:
"You know, I've never seen
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people... they never fight. "
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She said: "They never fight.
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Never! " That's
a good testimony.
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That's a good testimony really.
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He knows the
wife is always right.
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It's the good Lord that
looks after us every day
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of our lives...
EVERY DAY... He is with us.
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Now I'm just going to
ask you to do something
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Cornelius, because
there may be people watching
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in So. Africa. English is
not your first language, is it?
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No. You started out with
Afrikaans, is that right?
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With Afrikaans, yes,
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which is a language
derived out of the Dutch
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and a little bit of German.
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But in general that
comes from... out of the Dutch.
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Now I understand
Dutch I would say 90%. OK.
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And so with the Dutch people
when I speak they understand me
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but I cannot speak it. Aah!
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It's a bit
annoying, isn't it? Yes!
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Anyway, we are happy.
And then I thank the Lord
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that I went to our
college therein South Africa.
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Helderberg? Helderberg College
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and there I
learned to speak English
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more and better than what I
would've if I didn't go there.
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Well, I
understand you very well.
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Now I would like to... I
don't know if you are going to
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talk in tongues or some other
jibber, but would you like to
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greet the people in So. Africa
and give them a little comment?
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You can tell me
afterwards what you said
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but I'm sure somebody
would have understood you.
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Ulna at least.
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You know, I'm very
interested. You said you grew up
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in an Adventist home, is
that right? That's right.
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My mother was a
full-time Adventist.
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So we'll start with
you, Cornelius. Tell us a bit
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where you grew up.
Where you were born;
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where you went a
little bit to school.
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We lived nearby the city
of Cape Town. Not too far:
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approx. 130 km. away from
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the city of Cape Town - um-hmm -
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where my father had
a general dealer's shop
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on a farm there.
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And my mother was the
Adventist part of it. Um-hmm.
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And I grew up as a child there
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and went to the government
school that was there.
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But in my younger years, of
course. You know what I'm saying
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there? In the years
that I was only from
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year six through about 10, 12.
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Then my mother said: "No...
oh no. Not here any longer. "
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"You... " I was...
when I got up to the grades
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of 8th she said: "No!
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You are going to
Helderberg College.
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You're going to go to our school
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not the government school. "
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Well, which I appreciated
because she wanted me to stay
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within the run of
the SDA church you know.
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So that's what
happened and I went there.
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And I thank God in this
very day that she did that to me
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because it did a lot to me.
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I'm just wondering...
just backing up to when you
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were 10 or 12. You
said your mother was the SDA
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and your dad wasn't.
Did you find a bit of a pull
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by your dad's way? No! No!
No, my dad was very very...
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he was a very good
man in this respect:
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that he
respected my mother and us.
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Oh good! He
didn't... he didn't go -
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try to pull you away? Pull
away from that? None of that.
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How old were you when
your father became a SDA?
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We were already in years; we
were married already I think.
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So it was late in his
life? Late in his life, yes.
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He became a SDA
because of a series of meetings
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that were held by one of
our people there in that area.
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Like evangelistic meetings? Yes.
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Evangelistic
meetings. Then he became a SDA
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and you wouldn't believe
it but... I WILL believe it:
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you tell it. Then the
place where we went to
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was nearer to Cape Town
because it was in a place called
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Wellington - OK -
Wellington... which is a name
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that I think you can appreciate.
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And in that place he
also had a very very big
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general dealer
shop... you know, shop.
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And would you
believe it that before
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and after he became
an Adventist... before
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he had his shop open on
Sabbaths, Saturdays - yes -
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and then he decided
when he became the Adventist
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he would close the shop.
And so the business went broke?
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The business was
better than before.
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You wouldn't believe
that. I don't know how it worked
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but I think... I
KNOW how it worked.
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I've heard that same
story many times. Yes.
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And it was a better business
after he became an Adventist
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than before. He
admitted himself before he died.
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Now when you went
to Helderberg College
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what did you study?
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No... I was in the
business spot. OK. Yes, I didn't
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go for... One person said to me:
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"But you can become
a theology student. "
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Yeah. I said:
"No, no, no... I'll
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go for business...
I'm not a pastor. "
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Well, you know we don't...
The interesting thing is
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God uses everyone in
different areas of life.
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You don't have to
be a pastor. No. No.
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You can be someone
who's a faithful worker
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in any profession.
Even if you preach...
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Even if you go to preaching
doesn't mean you have to be
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a pastor. No, no. But anyway God
looked after me there as well.
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You did
accounting? Yeah, accounting.
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And then you wouldn't believe...
You believe me, but I went
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when I finished
there at Helderberg
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I went and worked
outside. That's good experience.
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Yeah. I went and worked
outside for a big company
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in Cape Town. Umm. And then
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one morning my boss said to me
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"Go down to the reception.
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There's somebody
that wants to see you. "
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Hmm. I said: "Is that so? "
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"Yes. " So I went down there.
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Lo and behold,
there was the treasurer
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of the South African Union
offices sitting down there.
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And I had to go and
have a chat with him.
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And he said to
me... he said to me:
00:12:09.16\00:12:11.29
"We want you in our office. "
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Hmm. That's at the Union office.
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So they must have heard some-
thing good about you, Cornelius.
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Most probably yes!
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And so I had to...
I said to him: "Look,
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thank you very much. I
think we both accept your call
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at go. " My
parents weren't too happy
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because now I'm
moving away from them.
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We lived right
next to each other.
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Ah yes.
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We had to go to the
city called Bloemfontein.
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Bloemfontein. Yeah!
I'm putting it so that you
00:12:47.30\00:12:51.60
understand that. Yes.
So we were to go there
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and then we stayed
there for four years.
00:12:54.24\00:12:57.27
Then another call for me.
00:12:58.27\00:13:00.84
I'm going to just stop you
here because you said "we. "
00:13:01.04\00:13:04.25
You would have met this lady and
you were married, is that right?
00:13:04.45\00:13:07.02
We married on the
first of January 1964.
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Oh, what an easy date? No
wonder you remember the date.
00:13:12.25\00:13:15.52
You must have chosen
it so he wouldn't forget.
00:13:16.32\00:13:18.49
Yes. This is a
wedding photo with you.
00:13:18.69\00:13:21.90
Who's there Cornelius?
In the middle, of course,
00:13:22.10\00:13:25.40
you know who the
two in the middle are.
00:13:25.60\00:13:27.17
Me and my wife.
And then on my side
00:13:27.37\00:13:31.07
it's my sister and her husband.
00:13:31.27\00:13:34.38
Um-hmm. At that time it
was still her fiancé. Yes.
00:13:34.58\00:13:39.45
And on the other
side - on her side -
00:13:39.65\00:13:41.72
is her own sister
00:13:41.92\00:13:43.52
and also a friend of mine.
00:13:43.72\00:13:49.19
OK. And who's the little girl?
00:13:49.39\00:13:50.89
My youngest sister.
Oh, isn't that lovely!
00:13:51.09\00:13:53.63
She's getting ready and she's
still got a sister that's old.
00:13:53.83\00:13:57.13
What year? She
was only 5 years old.
00:13:57.33\00:14:01.60
And this is your actual
wedding photo? That's right.
00:14:01.80\00:14:04.37
And does it seem long ago?
00:14:04.57\00:14:07.28
Yes! Only yesterday
you're saying, isn't it?
00:14:07.48\00:14:11.25
Yes. You wish.
And believe it or not
00:14:11.45\00:14:13.62
we are married now in the
first of January of this year
00:14:13.82\00:14:18.65
fifty-five years. Fifty-five
years! That's a good age.
00:14:18.85\00:14:24.29
That's a very good age. Yeah.
00:14:24.49\00:14:25.83
So... And I'm just going
to go to Ulna for a moment
00:14:25.86\00:14:29.06
because we want to know
about the lady he married.
00:14:29.26\00:14:31.30
Where did you grow up,
Ulna? I grew up on the farm.
00:14:31.50\00:14:35.00
It's called the long
cluff. It's a long valley -
00:14:36.54\00:14:42.21
OK - with mountains on
the sides, and it's just
00:14:42.41\00:14:44.75
fruit wherever you look.
All those farms it's just fruit.
00:14:44.95\00:14:48.48
Good fruit? What sort of fruit?
00:14:48.68\00:14:50.22
Apples and pears
were the main fruit
00:14:50.42\00:14:54.69
and then we had lots of
apricots, lots of peaches,
00:14:54.89\00:14:58.39
plums, and we had
figs... LOTS of figs.
00:14:58.59\00:15:02.93
And then prickly pears.
I don't know if you know
00:15:03.13\00:15:06.43
what the prickly pear is.
00:15:06.63\00:15:08.54
And we grew all
kinds of vegetables:
00:15:09.90\00:15:15.84
beans, peas,
potatoes, beet root, cabbage.
00:15:16.04\00:15:19.88
Very fertile area? Very fertile!
00:15:20.08\00:15:21.78
All kinds... but we
never knew broccoli.
00:15:21.98\00:15:25.29
They didn't grow
that but otherwise...
00:15:25.69\00:15:28.39
And we had all our
cattle, all our own milk,
00:15:28.59\00:15:32.63
cream, and everything.
And we were big meat eaters
00:15:33.03\00:15:37.90
at that time... at that time.
00:15:38.10\00:15:40.64
And you had how many sisters?
00:15:40.84\00:15:42.94
I've got me seven sisters.
00:15:43.34\00:15:45.37
I am the eldest.
And no boys? No boys.
00:15:45.57\00:15:47.98
And my dad was a farmer.
00:15:48.18\00:15:49.74
No sons to take over the farm.
00:15:49.94\00:15:52.35
Oh, so you girls had to learn
like... We were on the farm
00:15:52.55\00:15:53.88
all the time,
never in the house.
00:15:53.92\00:15:55.58
Is that right? Yes. So
where did you do your schooling?
00:15:55.78\00:15:58.99
I'm in public school. In
public school we did it, yes.
00:15:59.39\00:16:02.59
So where did you two meet?
00:16:02.79\00:16:05.39
At Camp
Meeting. We used to go to
00:16:05.59\00:16:08.26
Camp Meeting every year
and this is where we meet.
00:16:08.46\00:16:11.03
I find a lot of people go to
Camp Meeting to find a spouse.
00:16:11.23\00:16:14.60
Yes, yes. Sometimes it's
the only reason they're there.
00:16:14.80\00:16:18.41
So you said you went to a
public school? Public school.
00:16:19.21\00:16:21.54
What about your mom and
dad... were they Adventists?
00:16:21.74\00:16:24.18
My dad was an Adventist.
My mom came as a teacher there
00:16:24.38\00:16:28.58
and she was not an Adventist...
but when they got married
00:16:28.78\00:16:32.05
she became an Adventist.
So I grew up with very very
00:16:32.25\00:16:35.72
strict parents...
very very strict parents.
00:16:35.92\00:16:38.66
Well, it can be the other
way. I think I'd rather have
00:16:38.86\00:16:41.20
strict parents.
VERY strict parents.
00:16:41.40\00:16:43.13
You met... you met
at the Camp Meeting.
00:16:43.33\00:16:46.70
At Camp Meeting, yes. And
you decided to... Did you...
00:16:46.90\00:16:49.90
did you court together
for very long, Cornelius?
00:16:50.11\00:16:52.94
How many years? About two years!
00:16:53.14\00:16:55.44
But we were far apart
because he's in Cape Town
00:16:55.64\00:16:59.05
and I'm in Port Elizabeth.
00:16:59.25\00:17:00.92
No e-mail then. No!
00:17:01.12\00:17:03.42
And we used to call now
and then because it was very
00:17:03.62\00:17:06.69
expensive you see. And he
even when he asked to marry me
00:17:06.89\00:17:11.43
he called my... no, he
wrote a letter to my dad.
00:17:11.63\00:17:14.53
Oh! But my dad
was very fond of him
00:17:14.73\00:17:18.73
so there were no problems.
00:17:18.93\00:17:21.24
Have the blessing of
the father you're OK.
00:17:21.74\00:17:24.94
I like that idea. You went
to consult with your parents
00:17:26.54\00:17:29.84
and ask. I think it's a
very good thing. Very good!
00:17:30.05\00:17:32.31
So you got married and
where did you first go?
00:17:32.51\00:17:35.32
You mentioned a government
job. We went to Cape Town.
00:17:35.52\00:17:39.75
We lived in Somerset West
00:17:39.95\00:17:41.39
in that town where
Helderberg College is.
00:17:41.59\00:17:45.89
You see, we lived there.
00:17:46.09\00:17:47.43
And then we went to as he said
00:17:47.63\00:17:51.97
then I worked at a big company.
00:17:52.17\00:17:55.80
And that I told you
that the secretary/treasurer
00:17:56.00\00:17:59.54
of that company
was an Adventist.
00:17:59.74\00:18:02.28
And that was him that
recommended my husband
00:18:02.48\00:18:05.65
to the treasurer at the
Union office. That was him.
00:18:05.85\00:18:09.62
And so we were there for 4 years
00:18:10.02\00:18:13.96
and then we
went to Bloemfontein.
00:18:14.16\00:18:17.03
And I worked also
there. I first was secretary
00:18:17.23\00:18:21.93
to the
Publishing Dept. secretary
00:18:22.13\00:18:26.07
and then to the youth,
and then they brought me down
00:18:26.27\00:18:28.20
to the Accounts
Department. You see,
00:18:28.40\00:18:30.41
and that's where my
first... We were married 7 years
00:18:30.61\00:18:34.34
before we had children.
00:18:34.54\00:18:36.38
And my first
son... he was born there.
00:18:36.58\00:18:40.78
And then we got a
call back to Somerset West
00:18:40.98\00:18:43.55
in Cape Town. And then my
second boy, he was born there.
00:18:43.75\00:18:48.92
You know, Cornelius,
when I think of both of you.
00:18:49.12\00:18:52.49
You meet, you get
married. You're SDA both of you.
00:18:52.69\00:18:55.96
Where do you place God at
the beginning of your marriage
00:18:56.16\00:18:58.73
and in your early life?
Where did you place God?
00:18:58.93\00:19:01.04
I don't know about my wife
but as far as I'm concerned
00:19:02.44\00:19:07.11
I had no other
options: number one.
00:19:07.51\00:19:12.41
Number one. And you?
Yes, definitely! Definitely.
00:19:12.61\00:19:15.08
So you're both together
starting out at the same
00:19:15.28\00:19:19.35
understanding of
God. On the same page.
00:19:19.55\00:19:21.39
Especially...
especially with the father,
00:19:21.59\00:19:25.29
parents that she
had. You know, he was a
00:19:26.39\00:19:29.36
qualified. He was an ordained.
Not ordained, he was a graduate
00:19:29.56\00:19:35.44
theology student. It was only
a few years that he pastored
00:19:35.64\00:19:41.01
because then his dad got sick
and he had to go to the farm.
00:19:41.21\00:19:44.45
So only in his later years
he went into the ministry again.
00:19:44.65\00:19:49.18
OK... and so my thought is
00:19:49.38\00:19:53.25
did you start to ask God
to lead you right back then?
00:19:53.66\00:19:57.13
Well, you know what it's like.
00:19:58.29\00:20:02.16
Remember, we're not saints. Yet!
00:20:05.47\00:20:10.24
We are also
human beings, you know.
00:20:10.64\00:20:13.84
And you do make mistakes
here and there and so on.
00:20:14.04\00:20:17.25
But on your knees
every evening, every morning
00:20:17.65\00:20:22.52
to say: "Sorry Lord,
we made a mistake today
00:20:22.72\00:20:27.26
or this or that
but we love You. "
00:20:27.46\00:20:30.69
Hmm. That's how we live.
00:20:30.89\00:20:34.23
And then of course
being in the organization
00:20:34.43\00:20:38.83
when we were called to come
in it makes a big difference
00:20:39.03\00:20:44.37
because you are every day
busy with the Lord's work.
00:20:44.57\00:20:48.38
We've got some photos
that I want to have a look at.
00:20:48.58\00:20:51.21
The first one is
you with your two sons
00:20:51.41\00:20:54.32
'cause you only had the two sons
00:20:54.52\00:20:55.88
and this is a
picture. Now who are they?
00:20:56.08\00:20:58.79
Tell us their
names. The one on my lap
00:20:58.99\00:21:01.56
is my eldest son Gillum.
00:21:01.76\00:21:04.69
He is in South Africa still.
00:21:04.89\00:21:09.00
The other one... the
little one on her lap
00:21:09.56\00:21:11.83
that's our... this is
François. François lives here.
00:21:12.03\00:21:16.14
Yes he does. Lives
here, yes. So we know him.
00:21:16.47\00:21:18.94
And the couple in the middle?
I presume it's Cornelius & Ulna.
00:21:19.14\00:21:23.31
Cornelius and Ulna... yes.
00:21:23.51\00:21:25.05
And we've got another photo of
when the boys... they're a bit
00:21:25.25\00:21:27.55
older here. That's right.
00:21:27.75\00:21:29.18
That's a lovely family portrait.
00:21:29.38\00:21:31.25
Yeah. Now they are grown up here
and you can see the two of us
00:21:31.45\00:21:35.82
have also grown older.
00:21:36.02\00:21:38.63
The interesting thing
is that both of your boys
00:21:38.83\00:21:42.06
went into
accounting. That's right.
00:21:42.26\00:21:44.23
So you're all in accounting.
They both have jobs as
00:21:44.43\00:21:46.67
accountants, yes. All
of us - the whole family -
00:21:46.87\00:21:49.80
is an accounting family.
00:21:50.01\00:21:52.71
I hope you're counting well.
00:21:53.11\00:21:55.44
You're counting well because
you're getting more and more
00:21:56.75\00:21:58.65
grandchildren.
Well, as you know we have
00:21:58.85\00:22:02.25
gone through a lot as
far as this is concerned.
00:22:02.45\00:22:06.05
And we've got another picture
I want to look at, and it's
00:22:06.25\00:22:07.99
a specific house. You
told us about this house.
00:22:08.19\00:22:12.76
This is in South Africa.
This is in South Africa, yes.
00:22:12.96\00:22:15.80
We lived on almost you
can say was sort of a compound
00:22:16.20\00:22:21.17
that the church has got there.
00:22:21.37\00:22:23.94
It's in Johannesburg itself
00:22:24.71\00:22:28.41
but a little bit towards the
southern part of Johannesburg.
00:22:28.61\00:22:33.92
Anyway, it's a big
house that many many
00:22:34.12\00:22:39.02
visitors from
overseas came and stayed there.
00:22:40.29\00:22:44.76
That's traditional, isn't it?
00:22:44.96\00:22:46.70
I always had to take
all the people every time.
00:22:46.90\00:22:50.60
Well, they gave
you a big house! Yes.
00:22:50.80\00:22:52.13
And there were five
houses on the compound
00:22:52.27\00:22:54.74
and then the church
office and the home health
00:22:54.94\00:22:57.24
and education service office.
00:22:57.44\00:22:59.74
So it was really good.
And my children grew up there.
00:22:59.94\00:23:03.61
They finished their
university there, you know.
00:23:04.01\00:23:08.08
Everything. That's a special
place for you guys, isn't it?
00:23:08.28\00:23:12.55
And my brother-in-law became
the president of the conference.
00:23:12.75\00:23:15.46
They lived there;
they had three boys.
00:23:15.66\00:23:18.69
And so those five boys
00:23:19.09\00:23:21.76
that was their friends
00:23:21.96\00:23:24.27
so they didn't actually
have other friends coming there.
00:23:24.47\00:23:27.47
So that was just
too wonderful for them.
00:23:27.67\00:23:30.41
You mentioned that that place
was owned by a mining company.
00:23:30.61\00:23:33.58
Is that right?
Before. And then tell us
00:23:33.78\00:23:36.28
how God blessed the purchase
of that and what happened.
00:23:36.48\00:23:38.71
Well we had a president there...
00:23:38.91\00:23:41.25
he was a VERY suave guy.
00:23:41.45\00:23:44.29
He had a little bit of
business in him, too. Yes!
00:23:44.49\00:23:46.96
And he saw this old
place and I still remember
00:23:48.02\00:23:52.83
that they bought that place
00:23:54.13\00:23:56.26
for something like 70,000 rand.
00:23:56.46\00:24:01.40
Um-hmm. Now
70,000 rand in those days
00:24:01.60\00:24:04.54
was a lot of money. Yes.
00:24:04.74\00:24:07.28
I may be out a little bit
but you know it's too long ago.
00:24:07.48\00:24:12.61
And that place
was sold afterwards
00:24:13.01\00:24:16.45
for... I'm not going to
give you the precise... but
00:24:16.65\00:24:19.85
for millions. For millions! Yes.
00:24:20.06\00:24:21.86
So that enabled the conference
then or the union was it?
00:24:22.06\00:24:24.89
Which one was it? The
conference... the conference
00:24:25.09\00:24:26.86
then to buy a new
place. A new, fully, properly
00:24:27.06\00:24:32.97
built up office block.
00:24:33.27\00:24:37.27
Completed; ready-to-use.
It was a beautiful building!
00:24:37.47\00:24:40.18
Ready to move in and
it was a beautiful place.
00:24:40.38\00:24:42.78
So did you work in that place?
00:24:42.98\00:24:44.31
Oh yes, we worked in there.
00:24:44.48\00:24:46.21
I was in there
as the accountant.
00:24:46.41\00:24:49.55
A little later on I
became the treasurer. OK.
00:24:49.75\00:24:54.26
And a very good time
that we were together there.
00:24:54.46\00:24:58.49
We've got a couple of pictures
of you two in the office.
00:24:58.89\00:25:01.33
Is it the same
office or another office?
00:25:01.53\00:25:03.50
That's the same. This is where
you're working in the new bldg.
00:25:03.70\00:25:06.53
New building. Yes,
that's the new building.
00:25:06.74\00:25:08.30
Ulna... a busy desk
and the man on the phone.
00:25:08.50\00:25:11.87
I see you have a computer there;
I can see an adding machine
00:25:12.07\00:25:15.21
you know for
adding manually. Yes.
00:25:15.41\00:25:17.91
It's interesting
how times have changed.
00:25:18.11\00:25:20.25
You're telling me! Yes,
yes. Umm... very much so.
00:25:20.45\00:25:24.05
So I know that you both
- Cornelius in particular -
00:25:24.75\00:25:27.86
has a story that I'm sure
the viewers would love to hear
00:25:28.06\00:25:31.19
how God really protects you
when you're on God's errands.
00:25:31.39\00:25:34.86
Tell us the story about
your journey and then...
00:25:35.06\00:25:38.33
Well, you see what happened was
00:25:38.53\00:25:40.40
that the conference
had a ministerial meeting
00:25:40.60\00:25:44.44
not in the
conference office itself
00:25:44.64\00:25:48.21
but I would say approximately
00:25:48.41\00:25:52.05
170 to 180 kilometers away
from there at a certain spot
00:25:52.25\00:25:58.05
where they could have
this ministerial meeting.
00:25:58.25\00:26:01.52
And, of course,
being the treasurer
00:26:01.72\00:26:04.96
I had to be there,
00:26:05.16\00:26:06.83
and any financial things
that needed I was the one to
00:26:07.03\00:26:12.57
stand in and make sure
that... everything was OK.
00:26:12.77\00:26:17.11
And also all the equipment
that needed to be there
00:26:17.31\00:26:21.31
it was my duty to put it
in my car and take it there.
00:26:21.51\00:26:25.91
And then after that
meeting was finished -
00:26:26.11\00:26:30.82
it was... for a
week... for a week, yes.
00:26:31.02\00:26:34.86
And then after that of course
you want to go home quickly.
00:26:35.06\00:26:39.33
Yes. Packed the gear
into the car and I left.
00:26:39.53\00:26:44.93
You had all this equipment to
take back. All the equipment...
00:26:45.33\00:26:48.20
all the equipment in
my car and I had to...
00:26:48.40\00:26:50.51
And he put it all on the
back seat and started moving.
00:26:50.71\00:26:55.54
That's why he
stopped along the road.
00:26:55.74\00:26:57.68
And I stopped
next along the road.
00:26:57.88\00:26:59.21
I didn't see any
people around there.
00:26:59.28\00:27:02.22
I learned a lesson
that day, too. Tell you now
00:27:02.42\00:27:05.15
what the lesson was.
But there I stopped, and
00:27:05.35\00:27:08.59
the next thing... You
got out to shift the load.
00:27:08.79\00:27:11.93
I beg your pardon?
Re-arrange the load.
00:27:12.13\00:27:13.73
Yes, he was standing like
at the back seat... busy...
00:27:13.93\00:27:17.97
yeah but with my back toward
the side of the road, you know.
00:27:18.17\00:27:20.87
And all of a sudden I felt
an arm coming around my neck
00:27:21.07\00:27:25.21
and I saw a big knife
coming to my... and just
00:27:25.41\00:27:29.81
I said to myself: "Is
this where I die today?
00:27:30.01\00:27:34.98
Or what will it be? " They
pulled me into the bush there
00:27:35.18\00:27:38.62
and they threw me on the ground.
00:27:38.82\00:27:40.36
Yes. There were two of them.
00:27:40.56\00:27:42.46
Didn't have a chance to
fight them... not in the least.
00:27:42.66\00:27:46.26
And there I was
lying on the ground
00:27:47.53\00:27:50.10
and of course they
started looking in my pockets
00:27:50.30\00:27:52.83
and money that I
have for the church -
00:27:53.03\00:27:56.57
not a lot, fortunately
- was in my pocket here.
00:27:56.77\00:27:59.67
They look that;
they took my wallet.
00:27:59.87\00:28:01.81
They took every
penny that I had in there.
00:28:02.01\00:28:04.91
They took that out and they made
sure that they got everything.
00:28:05.11\00:28:09.62
Then they took
my watch. Now it was
00:28:09.82\00:28:14.32
a fairly expensive watch.
00:28:14.52\00:28:16.69
They don't like
silver... they want gold. Gold!
00:28:16.89\00:28:20.93
And I told them a
little bit of a lie
00:28:21.13\00:28:24.83
which I should... A
little bit of an untruth? Yeah.
00:28:25.03\00:28:28.24
I said: "That's a cheap old
watch. " He took a look at it
00:28:28.44\00:28:31.57
and he threw it back at
me. Can you believe that?
00:28:31.77\00:28:35.18
He threw it back
at me and then...
00:28:35.38\00:28:37.08
It wasn't a funny
situation, was it?
00:28:37.28\00:28:39.45
It was quite serious. But
in the meantime, all the way
00:28:39.65\00:28:43.55
he stood with his
knife right against my neck.
00:28:43.75\00:28:46.62
They would... I
said: "Please take it away!
00:28:46.82\00:28:48.62
I won't run
away... take it away. " No,
00:28:48.82\00:28:51.63
no... he kept it just like that.
00:28:51.83\00:28:54.13
So the one took my car keys. He
went to our car and he checked
00:28:54.33\00:28:58.13
in my car to see if I
don't have a gun - yes -
00:28:58.33\00:29:02.20
and any more money
or something in the car.
00:29:02.40\00:29:05.31
And lately came back.
00:29:05.71\00:29:08.08
Now we had bedding because
they had to take their own
00:29:08.28\00:29:11.81
bedding, and stole some
food because they had to
00:29:12.01\00:29:15.05
prepare, somebody there
that prepared their meals.
00:29:15.25\00:29:19.05
There were some
things... we had it in the car.
00:29:19.25\00:29:20.76
So he took some of the food
and he took bedding, you see,
00:29:20.96\00:29:24.83
and came back. Yeah,
he came back and then
00:29:25.03\00:29:27.50
I said: 'Lord, please, please...
00:29:27.66\00:29:33.30
protect me. " But I
said it quietly to myself.
00:29:33.50\00:29:36.91
And but then... I became sort of
00:29:37.11\00:29:42.71
calmed down... after
you asked God to? Yes.
00:29:42.91\00:29:46.98
HE gave you some peace.
00:29:47.18\00:29:49.25
As if I said to
myself: "Well if it's my day
00:29:49.45\00:29:53.02
it's my day. "
But you know what?
00:29:53.22\00:29:55.99
And all of a sudden that one guy
00:29:56.99\00:30:00.96
his eyes got that big.
00:30:01.16\00:30:04.00
He looked and he
threw the car keys down
00:30:04.20\00:30:10.07
and he ran. And the
other one with the knife
00:30:10.27\00:30:14.14
he took the knife away
and his eyes were like this.
00:30:14.34\00:30:18.31
They saw something
which I didn't see.
00:30:18.51\00:30:21.12
We're sure it's an angel. Yeah,
it must have been an angel.
00:30:21.32\00:30:23.82
And he ran away
too? And he ran away too!
00:30:24.02\00:30:25.95
That doesn't normally
happen, does it? Never! Never!
00:30:26.15\00:30:29.12
No, no! Because those
were troublous times then
00:30:29.32\00:30:31.79
in Cape Town. That's
usually what happens:
00:30:31.99\00:30:34.53
they will kill you.
00:30:34.73\00:30:37.50
They'll take everything
and kill you before they leave.
00:30:37.70\00:30:39.67
Because if they don't do that
00:30:39.87\00:30:42.10
you're a witness to them
for when they are in trouble.
00:30:42.30\00:30:47.58
So they ran away completely
00:30:47.78\00:30:50.85
and here I'm sitting.
I said: "Thank you, God!
00:30:51.05\00:30:54.82
You looked after me. Thank
you, thank you, thank you! "
00:30:55.02\00:30:59.35
Did you spend very
much time sitting there?
00:30:59.55\00:31:01.32
No! I got up; got in my car.
00:31:01.52\00:31:04.96
He said he couldn't get
the key in the ignition.
00:31:05.16\00:31:07.46
I couldn't get the key...
Couldn't get away fast enough!
00:31:07.66\00:31:11.23
And then eventually I drove off.
00:31:11.43\00:31:14.97
And then I got on
the highway between
00:31:15.17\00:31:19.37
Pretoria, the city of
Pretoria, and Johannesburg
00:31:19.57\00:31:22.74
which is a very
busy highway - um-hmm -
00:31:22.94\00:31:24.85
and lo and behold
it started raining.
00:31:25.05\00:31:28.62
But not rain... it's
a cloud- burst - yes -
00:31:28.82\00:31:34.79
that came down. I
couldn't see. Now all traffic
00:31:34.99\00:31:39.69
came to a standstill
on that road. Not again!
00:31:39.89\00:31:45.20
What more for this day?
00:31:45.40\00:31:48.34
And I drove off to...
later on drove off to the office
00:31:48.74\00:31:54.18
with all the equipment.
And then she was there
00:31:54.38\00:31:57.91
at the office. She's: "Where
did you go? Where did you go?
00:31:58.11\00:32:01.72
Look at you! " He was so dirty
00:32:01.92\00:32:04.09
because those people...
00:32:04.29\00:32:05.92
He sat down. When he told
the story what did you think?
00:32:06.12\00:32:09.02
I thought "what on earth?
" because didn't know what...
00:32:09.89\00:32:12.66
I said: "Where have
you been? Look at you! "
00:32:12.86\00:32:15.00
He said: "Don't
talk to me like that. "
00:32:15.20\00:32:16.90
He said: "You don't know
what happened to me you know. "
00:32:17.10\00:32:20.07
Well, it was God that
looked after me that day.
00:32:21.10\00:32:25.17
There is no other answer to this
00:32:25.61\00:32:28.91
than God looked after me
that day. He protected me
00:32:29.11\00:32:32.68
completely. Amen! Yeah.
00:32:32.88\00:32:36.69
But that set a different
course in your life, didn't it?
00:32:36.89\00:32:39.89
Because... tell us a
little bit about that.
00:32:40.09\00:32:41.96
Then I said to myself:
00:32:42.16\00:32:44.99
"If this is what's
going to happen to us
00:32:45.19\00:32:48.96
in future years, what... " I
got a little bit worried because
00:32:49.16\00:32:54.84
she's here, the two of us.
00:32:55.04\00:32:58.77
Are we going to
stay here in this country
00:32:58.97\00:33:01.78
or are we going to move off?
00:33:01.98\00:33:03.65
And you wouldn't believe it...
Now I'm going to say something
00:33:04.85\00:33:09.35
you may laugh
about it... somebody
00:33:09.55\00:33:14.26
Les Ralian said to him
because they worked together.
00:33:14.46\00:33:18.13
He said to me: "Why don't
you? It was in the newspaper...
00:33:18.33\00:33:20.56
"Why don't you
try the American? "
00:33:20.76\00:33:24.27
Because a lot of people...
Green card... green card.
00:33:25.73\00:33:28.44
And Les also try
to, you know. Yeah.
00:33:28.64\00:33:31.37
Well Les came to Australia
but he first tried there.
00:33:31.57\00:33:34.74
He didn't get in there. The
card... what do you call that?
00:33:34.94\00:33:38.25
Green card. It was a
green card lottery. Lottery.
00:33:38.58\00:33:40.95
But a lottery
now... this is the thing.
00:33:41.15\00:33:43.25
It wasn't a lottery
because I didn't buy here
00:33:43.45\00:33:46.96
one penny to get it.
00:33:47.16\00:33:49.69
It wasn't gambling money.
00:33:49.89\00:33:53.33
You put your name in
and then they choose it out.
00:33:53.53\00:33:55.03
Yeah, you send your name in.
00:33:55.23\00:33:56.56
I sent my name in
and nothing happens.
00:33:56.60\00:33:58.57
I said: "Well, that's
the luck that I have. "
00:33:58.77\00:34:00.84
"I never get any...
there's no luck for me. "
00:34:01.00\00:34:03.71
And I said to
myself: "Wait a minute!
00:34:03.91\00:34:07.38
I'm going to send her name
in and my name the next year. "
00:34:07.58\00:34:12.31
And I sent our names in
and lo and behold she got it.
00:34:12.51\00:34:15.85
If one gets it and
you're married, the other one...
00:34:17.15\00:34:19.92
We're married
and then we get it.
00:34:20.12\00:34:21.56
But unfortunately our
children couldn't go with us
00:34:21.76\00:34:24.39
because they were
overage. Overage...
00:34:24.59\00:34:27.06
they couldn't go.
That was very hard.
00:34:27.26\00:34:29.80
Of course, both of them got
married over there in So. Africa
00:34:30.00\00:34:34.70
and that made it a
bit more easy for us.
00:34:34.90\00:34:38.34
But when we left
it was... And then...
00:34:38.54\00:34:42.31
then one day about 3 months
00:34:42.51\00:34:46.01
we had gone through everything
that we needed to go through
00:34:46.21\00:34:49.68
and I said to her:
"Please call the people
00:34:49.88\00:34:53.46
and let's hear what they say. "
00:34:53.66\00:34:55.49
And she called them. You
know what the woman said?
00:34:55.69\00:34:58.66
She said: "You know, madam,
00:34:58.86\00:35:01.46
we are just busy now with
yours at this very moment! "
00:35:01.66\00:35:07.64
So when you called?
Yes. Can you believe that?
00:35:07.84\00:35:10.41
When she called she says:
"I am busy at this very moment
00:35:10.61\00:35:14.28
with yours. " And of
course we got our papers,
00:35:14.44\00:35:18.58
on the plane, and we landed
on the other side in America.
00:35:18.78\00:35:23.05
Now you must remember:
I'm leaving the country
00:35:23.25\00:35:26.62
without a job. You're
both leaving your jobs behind.
00:35:26.82\00:35:30.86
Because I... You
did this on your own.
00:35:31.06\00:35:34.40
It wasn't a call.
I wasn't called. Yes.
00:35:34.60\00:35:37.83
I left South Africa
without a job because I went
00:35:38.03\00:35:42.40
over there and "we'll see if
we can get a job over there. "
00:35:42.60\00:35:45.37
And... That was a step of faith!
00:35:45.77\00:35:48.38
But before that
I can tell you that
00:35:48.58\00:35:51.01
because somebody told me:
"Ulna, take your furniture with.
00:35:51.21\00:35:55.78
If you go there you
will feel more at home
00:35:55.98\00:35:58.59
if you have
your own furniture. "
00:35:58.79\00:36:00.76
So then Monique, my daughter-
in-law, and my son François,
00:36:00.96\00:36:05.49
they were still
dating. And she was working at
00:36:05.89\00:36:08.76
a shipping agent
00:36:08.96\00:36:11.73
and she worked
very high up there.
00:36:11.93\00:36:16.17
She's a very good worker.
00:36:16.37\00:36:17.84
And he was just joking with
her. I mean, how can you expect?
00:36:18.04\00:36:21.98
And he said: "Monique,
ask your boss if he won't
00:36:22.18\00:36:25.28
send our goods over there...
send your container wholesale. "
00:36:25.48\00:36:31.19
Wholesale, you call
the word for a discount.
00:36:31.39\00:36:34.76
They know, and he
was just joking. I mean
00:36:34.96\00:36:37.89
about three weeks later I
was sitting at the office -
00:36:38.09\00:36:41.20
it was a Friday -
and Monique called.
00:36:41.40\00:36:44.10
"Auntie Ulna, my boss
said 'It's on the house. ' "
00:36:44.50\00:36:49.84
I'm telling you... That's
not bad! They brought the...
00:36:50.04\00:36:53.68
You can't get any
"wholesaler" than that!
00:36:53.88\00:36:56.08
They brought the
container to our house.
00:36:56.28\00:36:58.88
They packed it; they loaded it;
00:36:59.08\00:37:01.55
they took him and
he had to seal it.
00:37:01.75\00:37:03.59
They took it down to
Durbin where the harbor is
00:37:03.79\00:37:06.42
and it was sent to
Savannah without one cent.
00:37:06.62\00:37:10.26
We couldn't believe it.
00:37:10.46\00:37:12.36
Yes. You know, I'm interested
to know: how did your fellow
00:37:12.56\00:37:15.46
workers... You were up and
you were going to be going.
00:37:15.66\00:37:18.77
What were they?
They were very upset.
00:37:18.97\00:37:20.90
They couldn't believe
it... they couldn't believe it.
00:37:21.10\00:37:24.31
They were very upset. They did-
n't want us to leave, you see.
00:37:24.51\00:37:28.11
They were very upset! But
anyway, we had gone over to
00:37:28.31\00:37:32.05
there and here we
are: no house, no nothing.
00:37:32.25\00:37:37.62
And you have lots of
people you know. Is that right?
00:37:37.82\00:37:39.79
I had a sister and her
husband. They were living there
00:37:39.99\00:37:42.96
where we went. But
they're the only ones, though.
00:37:43.29\00:37:45.49
The only ones... so we
could stay with them you see.
00:37:45.69\00:37:48.46
And so I... we stayed with them.
00:37:48.66\00:37:52.50
Where were they living?
In Chattanooga in Tennessee.
00:37:52.70\00:37:56.57
In Tennessee. This is
where Southern University is.
00:37:56.77\00:37:59.31
What's the first thing
you noticed about from where
00:37:59.51\00:38:02.01
you were living to
you're now arrived in America?
00:38:02.21\00:38:05.25
What's the first
thing you noticed?
00:38:06.61\00:38:08.48
The other way driving.
00:38:09.45\00:38:12.45
Other side of the road? On
the other side of the road!
00:38:12.65\00:38:14.92
That's one thing. And then
the first... to get a vehicle
00:38:15.12\00:38:19.96
to drive on
that side of the road
00:38:20.16\00:38:23.06
we had to get our
license to do that. Yes.
00:38:23.26\00:38:25.47
And once we'd
gone through that...
00:38:25.67\00:38:27.67
Fortunately,
didn't take a lot of...
00:38:27.87\00:38:32.04
I'm thinking more the ability
just to do what you want to do.
00:38:32.24\00:38:35.44
Yeah, yes. But we still
had in mind, of course...
00:38:35.64\00:38:41.18
It was still in my
mind: "Shall I get a job
00:38:41.38\00:38:44.52
into the church work again? "
00:38:44.72\00:38:47.89
We wanted to go... We wanted
to work for the church again.
00:38:48.09\00:38:51.93
We don't want to
go and work outside.
00:38:52.13\00:38:54.50
And the Georgia
Cumberland Conference -
00:38:54.90\00:38:59.23
um-hmm - which is
not far from there, about
00:38:59.43\00:39:03.30
sixty miles I would say.
00:39:03.51\00:39:05.64
We are in mind: "Shall we
go there and see if we can get
00:39:05.84\00:39:11.21
a job? " Anyway, we... You
don't have a place to live!
00:39:11.41\00:39:16.22
No, that's the biggest... And
we didn't want to rent a house.
00:39:16.42\00:39:20.69
You have all household things!
And we didn't have a place
00:39:20.89\00:39:23.26
waiting! That was the
problem. There was a man that
00:39:23.73\00:39:25.06
started building
an area near a suburb
00:39:25.09\00:39:30.10
with new houses
there and we met him.
00:39:30.30\00:39:33.70
And I said to him,
I said: "Would you be
00:39:34.57\00:39:38.34
able to? Could I
rent a house from you
00:39:38.54\00:39:42.64
for two years and
then after two years
00:39:42.84\00:39:46.45
I will buy it from you.
How's that for a deal? "
00:39:46.65\00:39:51.95
"Sure, " he said,
"that's no problem. "
00:39:52.15\00:39:55.36
He said: "Give me
a thousand dollars"
00:39:55.76\00:39:58.83
which I had of course because
I sold my house in So. Africa
00:39:59.03\00:40:02.70
and he said: "Sure,
I'll give it to you. "
00:40:02.90\00:40:05.57
And he says: "Come and
see me on Monday morning
00:40:05.77\00:40:09.30
and we can do the paperwork. "
00:40:09.50\00:40:12.87
Monday morning I came there.
00:40:13.27\00:40:16.24
He threw my check back at me.
00:40:16.64\00:40:19.01
I said: "What's wrong? Don't
you want to do business with me?
00:40:20.28\00:40:23.79
Am I that bad? " He laughed.
00:40:23.99\00:40:27.32
He says: "No, I spoke to my bank
00:40:27.52\00:40:29.72
and they are going to
give you a loan for a house
00:40:29.92\00:40:32.83
so you can get a
house immediately. "
00:40:33.03\00:40:35.23
When have you heard this
that you don't even have a job
00:40:35.43\00:40:39.90
but you get a
loan from the bank?
00:40:40.10\00:40:42.00
You're from another country.
I'm from another country.
00:40:42.20\00:40:44.47
You've just
arrived; you have no job;
00:40:44.67\00:40:46.14
you have no credit
rating. Yeah! You have nothing
00:40:46.34\00:40:49.24
nothing... yet the
bank will give you a loan.
00:40:49.44\00:40:51.18
In two weeks we had
a key for the house!
00:40:51.38\00:40:53.15
Key for the house
before the house is... Now
00:40:53.35\00:40:55.08
what do you think?
How did that come along?
00:40:55.28\00:40:58.62
And we've got a
picture of the house.
00:41:00.02\00:41:02.09
Yes. That's a big house.
00:41:02.29\00:41:04.09
That's OURS... that's our house.
00:41:04.29\00:41:06.53
That's our Father up
there that looked after us.
00:41:06.73\00:41:10.47
He was such a
good to me and my wife.
00:41:10.67\00:41:15.17
He looked after us all the way.
00:41:15.37\00:41:17.34
Then I had to go
and look for a job.
00:41:17.54\00:41:20.38
Before that you had to
bring your furniture. And so
00:41:20.58\00:41:23.08
how did that all work together?
00:41:23.28\00:41:24.61
We went there the
beginning of August.
00:41:24.65\00:41:28.65
Our furniture I remember
arrived the 18th of September.
00:41:28.85\00:41:32.95
But all the time
we stayed with my...
00:41:33.15\00:41:35.52
um-hmm... with my sister.
Yeah. And you know, we...
00:41:35.72\00:41:39.46
we couldn't take electrical
stuff because there they
00:41:39.66\00:41:43.06
the currents are different
and all. So we went and we
00:41:43.26\00:41:46.03
bought the fridge and washing
machine and dryer and things.
00:41:46.23\00:41:50.87
It had a dishwasher and a
stove in all houses there.
00:41:51.07\00:41:54.78
When you buy it it had...
00:41:54.98\00:41:56.31
So we did that you
know. Do little things there
00:41:56.34\00:41:58.61
and buy little
things. We were so excited.
00:41:58.81\00:42:01.02
Yeah. But you had to wait
for? We had to wait for...
00:42:01.22\00:42:03.82
Our agreement
came the 18th also.
00:42:04.02\00:42:07.32
So you could go out in
your car. Did you notice
00:42:07.52\00:42:10.89
a difference? You
could stop on the roadside!
00:42:11.09\00:42:13.13
Oh yes! What was that like?
00:42:13.33\00:42:15.30
That was fantastic and...
and what I couldn't get used to:
00:42:15.50\00:42:19.30
there's no walls
around the houses.
00:42:19.50\00:42:21.77
And we've got walls
and these security things:
00:42:21.97\00:42:27.41
electric fencing on... in
South Africa. I was so scared
00:42:27.61\00:42:31.18
in the beginning
to work in my yard
00:42:31.38\00:42:33.38
because I was
always looking, you know,
00:42:33.58\00:42:35.85
and later on because there
was no walls around you know.
00:42:36.05\00:42:39.65
It was really fantastic.
00:42:39.85\00:42:41.66
Then I said to myself, I said:
00:42:41.86\00:42:45.93
"We must get a job because...
" You've got a loan to pay!
00:42:46.33\00:42:49.63
"We can't sit
here and do nothing. "
00:42:49.83\00:42:52.13
"I didn't come over
here to do nothing. "
00:42:52.53\00:42:55.07
Hmm. So we went over to the
Georgia Cumberland Conference
00:42:55.27\00:43:00.74
there. Oh, they are the
most fantastic conference
00:43:00.94\00:43:04.95
I have ever worked for.
00:43:05.15\00:43:07.45
And you've worked for a few.
00:43:07.65\00:43:09.62
And... But anyway, we went there
00:43:09.82\00:43:12.29
and I just made a bit of a joke,
you know. I said to the one guy
00:43:12.49\00:43:17.66
that I spoke to... Be
careful, don't joke, eh?
00:43:17.86\00:43:19.46
Yeah. I said to him: "Listen,
do you have work for me here?
00:43:19.86\00:43:23.93
I am coming... " And I told
him where I come from and so on.
00:43:24.13\00:43:27.70
I said: "Do you have
work? " I said: "I'll be willing
00:43:28.44\00:43:30.67
to be your tea
man - the "tea boy" -
00:43:30.87\00:43:33.51
in the morning
and the afternoon. "
00:43:33.71\00:43:35.94
So you were prepared
to do anything. Anything!
00:43:36.14\00:43:37.51
I said: "Anything.
What do you have for me? "
00:43:37.71\00:43:39.71
He laughed. They had a
very good laugh about that
00:43:39.91\00:43:43.02
and he said to
me: "Come and see us
00:43:43.22\00:43:45.52
in two weeks' time. "
00:43:45.72\00:43:47.36
But in the meantime...
That's right; only two weeks...
00:43:47.56\00:43:50.53
the president was in So. Africa;
they invited him for a Camp Mtg.
00:43:50.73\00:43:55.73
OK. And that was in
that Bloenfontein area
00:43:55.93\00:43:59.23
and the treasurer of
the Union office there
00:43:59.43\00:44:03.81
were best friends, and he told
the president about us, too.
00:44:04.01\00:44:08.61
And of course,
he was you know...
00:44:08.81\00:44:11.41
He knew a little bit about us.
What amazes me: United States
00:44:11.61\00:44:13.88
has got many states.
00:44:14.08\00:44:15.42
You could have
been in any other state.
00:44:15.45\00:44:17.19
Any one! We went there... Yeah,
we call that is it coincidence?
00:44:17.39\00:44:20.52
Or do we call
that divine providence?
00:44:20.89\00:44:22.82
Divine providence, I'm
sure. Divine providence,
00:44:23.02\00:44:24.56
that's for sure. And so
when he went the 2nd time
00:44:24.76\00:44:27.73
when they called us to come in
00:44:27.93\00:44:29.60
the president knew
everything about us
00:44:29.80\00:44:32.57
and they knew everything
so we got the job... a job.
00:44:32.77\00:44:35.80
But when we went...
Is this as a team, then?
00:44:36.00\00:44:38.54
So then after two weeks I
went there and the president,
00:44:39.57\00:44:44.15
the treasurer, and the
secretary were sitting on
00:44:44.35\00:44:47.82
one side of the table.
They looked at me and they said:
00:44:48.02\00:44:50.29
"Sell yourselves. "
00:44:50.49\00:44:53.15
"Sell yourself to us. "
00:44:53.36\00:44:55.32
And so of course I had to
tell them who I am, what did I
00:44:55.52\00:44:58.19
do and so on
and so on and so on.
00:44:58.39\00:45:00.36
And then they said: "Look,
00:45:00.76\00:45:04.57
we've got three auditors. "
00:45:04.77\00:45:09.10
It's a big
conference there. Um-hmm.
00:45:09.90\00:45:11.87
I'm taking my hat
off for those people.
00:45:12.07\00:45:14.08
I think they are the
most fantastic place I've ever
00:45:14.28\00:45:18.11
worked for, and they
have got 40,000 members.
00:45:18.31\00:45:21.55
That's a lot of people. It is!
00:45:21.75\00:45:23.69
And over 200 churches. Um-hmm.
00:45:23.89\00:45:28.72
And that... What now? It was
in the 40.. about 40 schools.
00:45:29.82\00:45:35.80
Hmm! So it's a big organization.
00:45:36.00\00:45:39.43
And he said to me:
"Look, we've got three auditors.
00:45:39.63\00:45:44.14
Two of them: one retired;
00:45:44.34\00:45:47.44
unfortunately,
the other one died. "
00:45:47.64\00:45:52.08
They were all
retired people, see.
00:45:52.28\00:45:54.48
The third one that was
doing auditing for them
00:45:54.68\00:45:58.39
was the conference
had their own plane - OK -
00:45:58.59\00:46:02.12
and he was the pilot.
00:46:02.32\00:46:03.66
He was the pilot of
that plane. And he was
00:46:03.86\00:46:05.59
more interested in
pilot than in auditing.
00:46:05.79\00:46:08.96
More interested in pilot than
the auditing. I don't blame him!
00:46:09.16\00:46:11.13
And so they
said: "We want you. "
00:46:12.20\00:46:17.71
And they said: "You are now
the head of the auditing dept. "
00:46:17.91\00:46:22.28
That's for me. So you
just arrived from Africa.
00:46:22.48\00:46:25.11
You said Africa. I'm sorry...
in USA from Africa. Yes.
00:46:25.31\00:46:28.62
And at the right
time. At the right time!
00:46:28.82\00:46:31.42
It's amazing! You know,
the Lord was really good to us.
00:46:31.82\00:46:34.52
The Lord was
looking after us AGAIN!
00:46:34.76\00:46:36.09
So you are the head
auditor, what about Ulna?
00:46:36.22\00:46:38.79
I said to them:
00:46:38.99\00:46:42.33
"Now what about my wife be-
cause... " You couldn't do this
00:46:42.53\00:46:45.63
work on our own!
You're replacing both.
00:46:45.83\00:46:48.20
It's impossible. I
said: "What about? "
00:46:48.40\00:46:50.11
"No... she's
got a job already. "
00:46:50.31\00:46:52.04
She's also doing...
she's got to be with me
00:46:52.24\00:46:55.34
in the auditing department. "
00:46:55.54\00:46:57.01
I said: "Thank you very much. "
00:46:57.21\00:46:59.11
And then they had a problem.
00:46:59.31\00:47:01.62
Then they had a
problem. They said to me:
00:47:01.82\00:47:04.09
"You know we don't
have an office here.
00:47:04.29\00:47:06.45
Our office is
getting... it's expanding.
00:47:06.65\00:47:09.76
Things are expanding too such
00:47:09.96\00:47:11.33
right that we don't have
an office for you here. "
00:47:11.53\00:47:14.36
Do you have a
place at your home? "
00:47:14.56\00:47:16.30
I said: "Well, the new
house that we just... "
00:47:16.50\00:47:18.83
And we immediately
started working on it
00:47:19.03\00:47:22.70
and there was a lovely basement.
00:47:22.90\00:47:27.01
And they put...
00:47:27.21\00:47:29.08
We started working
and finishing it off.
00:47:30.55\00:47:33.68
So you put an office
down in your basement!
00:47:33.88\00:47:36.42
In our basement.
A nice big office!
00:47:36.62\00:47:39.02
Yes, but in a few days
00:47:39.22\00:47:40.79
they delivered all the
equipment that we needed
00:47:40.99\00:47:43.73
for that office:
computers and file cabinets
00:47:43.93\00:47:48.30
and so on and
installed it for us there.
00:47:48.50\00:47:50.97
And there we have our
office right in our house.
00:47:51.13\00:47:53.84
How good is that!
You don't have to drive
00:47:54.04\00:47:56.91
60 miles there and
60 miles back every day.
00:47:57.11\00:47:59.94
Once we started
doing the auditing work
00:48:00.14\00:48:03.35
we get into our car
and we drive off to where
00:48:03.55\00:48:06.01
we were to go. We had to
go all over the conference.
00:48:06.21\00:48:09.08
You will be
surprised that in that time
00:48:09.28\00:48:12.22
that we worked for them
00:48:12.42\00:48:14.52
again I say: "The good
Lord looked after us. "
00:48:16.56\00:48:19.89
We done approximately
00:48:20.10\00:48:24.23
1,100,000 miles.
00:48:24.43\00:48:29.40
Miles! Are you serious? Really?
00:48:29.60\00:48:31.71
We drove a lot. I
was really tired of it.
00:48:31.91\00:48:35.71
Well let me give you
the size of the conference:
00:48:35.91\00:48:37.25
it's half of
Tennessee, the full of Georgia,
00:48:37.81\00:48:41.92
and a part of North Carolina.
00:48:42.12\00:48:44.89
Umm! So it's a big area.
00:48:45.09\00:48:47.39
It's a big area
and we've done...
00:48:47.59\00:48:50.39
And then they said to
me: "Listen... sorry...
00:48:50.59\00:48:53.50
we are a little bit
behind. There's one year that we
00:48:53.70\00:48:57.03
are behind in
our auditing services
00:48:57.23\00:49:01.57
when we started there because
of the chaps that got us... "
00:49:01.77\00:49:06.47
So they said: "Sorry...
" And in the first year
00:49:06.68\00:49:10.58
we made up everything in
that auditing that was behind
00:49:10.78\00:49:14.72
and we told them:
"It's up-to-date now. "
00:49:14.92\00:49:18.22
And so from there
on... That is good to hear!
00:49:18.42\00:49:20.69
You know, you must
have worked very hard.
00:49:20.89\00:49:22.99
Yes! And every month
we had to report to them
00:49:23.19\00:49:28.20
what we did. Uh-huh.
And they wanted a meeting
00:49:28.40\00:49:30.90
to ask him how...
Yeah, that's right.
00:49:31.10\00:49:33.74
They asked me... I had to
go to the executive commtitee
00:49:33.94\00:49:38.61
once a year. And the
treasurer was very good with me.
00:49:38.81\00:49:44.18
He liked me very much.
00:49:44.38\00:49:45.91
And he said to
me: "Can you tell us
00:49:47.08\00:49:49.18
do you have any problems...
any problems there? "
00:49:49.38\00:49:53.09
I said: "Yes I do. " I
said: "I'm very happy but I do
00:49:53.29\00:49:57.53
have a problem. " He
said: "What's that problem? "
00:49:57.69\00:50:00.30
I said: "The problem is
I cannot speak Hispanic.
00:50:00.50\00:50:03.77
The Hispanic
people don't understand me
00:50:03.97\00:50:06.57
and vice versa. We
don't understand each other. "
00:50:06.77\00:50:10.14
And they didn't
understand Afrikaans! No!
00:50:10.34\00:50:12.34
No. You see, what happened
there in the country is a lot of
00:50:12.54\00:50:17.58
these Hispanic people came over
and work on the farms there.
00:50:17.78\00:50:21.88
Uh-huh. And then the
Adventist part of that
00:50:22.08\00:50:26.76
is that they are
there and they don't learn
00:50:26.96\00:50:32.73
the English language you see.
00:50:32.93\00:50:34.96
And so I said:
"Look, this is my problem.
00:50:35.16\00:50:38.07
I don't understand
Hispanic and the Hispanics don't
00:50:38.27\00:50:40.47
understand me. And
they laughed about it
00:50:40.67\00:50:43.41
and they said: "No, you are very
right. " And there was a guy
00:50:43.61\00:50:46.68
in the church
there at the university -
00:50:46.88\00:50:50.38
right next to the university
there is a church there,
00:50:50.58\00:50:53.05
a Hispanic church. And
I said to them: "Listen,
00:50:53.25\00:50:56.55
there is a person there
that we know is very good "
00:50:57.79\00:51:01.92
He said: "Very
well-spoken. English speaking
00:51:02.12\00:51:05.46
but he's Hispanic too.
00:51:05.66\00:51:07.23
And what about
us having him... "
00:51:07.43\00:51:10.27
because he was
all retired sort of.
00:51:10.47\00:51:12.40
"What about him? Can't
we teach him what to do? "
00:51:13.03\00:51:16.77
He says: "You've
got him already! "
00:51:16.97\00:51:19.37
Right there at the
executive committee they said:
00:51:19.57\00:51:23.04
"You've got him already!
00:51:23.24\00:51:24.58
He's part and
possible of you people. "
00:51:24.61\00:51:27.65
And we trained him and he
did our Hispanic churches.
00:51:27.85\00:51:32.22
There are thirty four
of them. Thirty four! Umm!
00:51:32.42\00:51:34.72
Thirty four Hispanic churches.
You know, I'm just thinking:
00:51:34.92\00:51:37.76
so once you got everything up to
date they said bye bye to you?
00:51:37.96\00:51:41.26
How many years
did you work there?
00:51:41.46\00:51:43.20
We worked for 15 years there.
00:51:43.40\00:51:45.80
Fifteen years!
Together? Yeah, together.
00:51:46.00\00:51:48.37
Together. And then I told them:
00:51:48.57\00:51:51.84
"It's time for
me to retire too. "
00:51:52.04\00:51:54.94
And of course... They
were very happy for that?
00:51:56.14\00:51:58.78
Oh no. I walked
off one morning...
00:51:58.98\00:52:02.68
I went to the treasurer's
office and I wanted to speak
00:52:02.88\00:52:05.99
to him about something.
And I knocked at his door.
00:52:06.19\00:52:09.49
He looked up and he
said: "You can come in
00:52:09.69\00:52:12.36
if you... on one condition:
you decide to stay longer. "
00:52:12.56\00:52:16.67
We were sixty-nine already,
you know, and we thought" -
00:52:18.17\00:52:20.94
sixty-nine, yes, yes -
"it's time to retire. "
00:52:21.14\00:52:23.71
Time to retire, you know.
00:52:23.91\00:52:25.37
Well, I can tell you: your
story, their story, has been
00:52:25.57\00:52:28.51
a real amazement that
God has led them in this way.
00:52:28.71\00:52:31.31
And I'm sure that you would
be thinking the same thing.
00:52:31.51\00:52:35.75
You can see how God has
led up until the age of 69.
00:52:35.95\00:52:39.09
We're just going to
take a break for a moment.
00:52:39.29\00:52:41.19
We're going to have
our details on the screen.
00:52:41.39\00:52:43.83
3ABN is a faith-based
ministry and it relies upon
00:52:44.03\00:52:47.23
people like you to
keep this ministry going.
00:52:47.43\00:52:49.76
If you want to
support us OR if you want to
00:52:49.96\00:52:53.34
get in touch with Cornelius
or Ulna about things that
00:52:53.54\00:52:57.01
they have said you
can do so at this address:
00:52:57.21\00:53:00.28
If you would like to
contact 3ABN Australia
00:53:04.28\00:53:07.05
you may do so in
the following ways:
00:53:07.25\00:53:08.75
Thank you for all you do
00:53:55.10\00:53:56.53
to help us light the world
with the glory of God's truth.
00:53:56.73\00:53:59.57
I hope you wrote those details
down because we love to hear
00:54:02.27\00:54:05.11
from you... so
contact us so that we can hear
00:54:05.31\00:54:08.24
how you are going and how
much you enjoy the programs.
00:54:08.44\00:54:10.55
I know a lot of
people enjoyed listening or
00:54:10.95\00:54:12.88
watching this program because
they tell us they love listening
00:54:13.08\00:54:16.08
to peoples' stories.
And we are talking with
00:54:16.28\00:54:19.19
Cornelius and Ulna Keet
00:54:19.39\00:54:21.59
from South Africa, USA,
and now we're up to the point
00:54:21.79\00:54:25.13
that you were just retiring.
We've only got a little bit of
00:54:25.33\00:54:28.76
time left unfortunately
because I know there's a lot
00:54:28.96\00:54:31.27
more story. What did
you do when you retired?
00:54:31.47\00:54:33.74
Did you... obviously
you didn't stay in the US.
00:54:33.94\00:54:36.20
No, I talked to
my son that's here.
00:54:36.40\00:54:39.87
He's here. He's an
Australian citizen.
00:54:40.08\00:54:42.71
I said to him: "We're
going to retire now. "
00:54:42.91\00:54:45.25
He says: "On one condition:
you are not going to stay
00:54:45.45\00:54:48.58
in South Africa... you
are coming over here. "
00:54:48.78\00:54:51.32
And he applied for us
00:54:51.52\00:54:53.52
and we are here in
Australia at this point.
00:54:53.72\00:54:56.39
So it's really
amazing, isn't it?
00:54:57.49\00:54:59.46
You've lived in Africa, America,
and now you're in Australia.
00:54:59.66\00:55:05.10
I became an American
citizen on top of that. OK! Umm!
00:55:05.30\00:55:09.50
OK. So after being there
for 15 years I think you're
00:55:09.70\00:55:12.97
probably entitled. You know
as we've listened to your story
00:55:13.17\00:55:16.04
I'm sure there's some
young people out there deciding:
00:55:16.24\00:55:18.35
"Do we follow God or not? "
00:55:18.55\00:55:19.91
You know,
Cornelius, what would you say
00:55:20.12\00:55:21.88
to the folk out
there or even older ones
00:55:22.08\00:55:24.45
about shifting to another...
What would you say to them?
00:55:24.65\00:55:26.76
I would say to them:
"Make God your first person
00:55:27.16\00:55:32.69
in your life... your
first God in your life.
00:55:32.89\00:55:35.96
He is the One that
will lead you all the way. "
00:55:36.16\00:55:42.07
He will lead you
in amazing ways! Yes!
00:55:42.27\00:55:44.37
As your testimony has told us.
00:55:44.57\00:55:46.94
It is just... I
have never ever...
00:55:47.14\00:55:49.94
I will never
ever look back again.
00:55:50.15\00:55:51.91
And Ulna, what about
you? What would you say to the
00:55:52.11\00:55:53.85
people out there? I
would tell them to...
00:55:54.05\00:55:55.75
really to hang onto God.
00:55:55.95\00:56:00.62
Look what He's done for
us. Look what my husband
00:56:00.82\00:56:02.96
went through, and
look how He led us.
00:56:03.16\00:56:05.19
He is just fantastic really.
00:56:05.39\00:56:07.80
I don't know how we
can ever ever leave Him.
00:56:08.20\00:56:13.47
Really, He was
just amazing to us.
00:56:13.67\00:56:16.54
I know that the story
of how you got to Australia
00:56:16.74\00:56:19.47
was just as amazing
as what happened when you
00:56:19.67\00:56:21.68
went to the US, but unfortu-
nately we haven't got the time
00:56:21.88\00:56:24.25
to talk about it. But
God has continued to lead.
00:56:24.45\00:56:27.18
That's right... that's
right. And the other thing
00:56:27.38\00:56:29.35
I want to say, too,
is that you know God...
00:56:29.55\00:56:31.45
It's not just about living
here, is it Cornelius and Ulna?
00:56:31.65\00:56:33.86
No. God is offering us
something more precious.
00:56:34.06\00:56:37.33
Oh yes. What is that,
Ulna? What is God offering us
00:56:37.53\00:56:39.86
if we remain faithful to Him?
00:56:40.06\00:56:41.56
Yes! When He comes,
He'll take us with Him.
00:56:41.76\00:56:45.07
That's what it is... that's
what I'm looking forward...
00:56:45.27\00:56:48.07
He is blessing you
every day with good health
00:56:48.27\00:56:51.37
and other things in this life
00:56:51.57\00:56:54.01
and protect you from all your...
00:56:54.21\00:56:55.71
He's really very
good to us really.
00:56:57.15\00:56:59.25
And I... Every time I
pray "Help me to be ready;
00:56:59.45\00:57:03.82
take my hand and lead me. "
00:57:04.02\00:57:05.55
Because I want to be ready
when He comes on the clouds
00:57:05.75\00:57:09.22
of heaven and I want my
family also to be ready.
00:57:09.42\00:57:11.99
That's right! That's right!
00:57:12.19\00:57:13.76
James 1:17 says:
"Every good gift,
00:57:13.96\00:57:16.77
every perfect
gift, is from above. "
00:57:16.97\00:57:19.67
That's right. "Cometh
down from the Father of life
00:57:19.87\00:57:22.40
with whom is no variableness
00:57:22.60\00:57:24.71
neither shadow of
turning. " God does not change.
00:57:24.94\00:57:27.11
He blesses. No, He does
not change. That's right.
00:57:27.31\00:57:29.34
We just need to stand in
that blessing. That's right.
00:57:29.54\00:57:31.21
That's right. There's
no other God like this one.
00:57:31.41\00:57:34.68
Amen! That's a good
thought to finish on:
00:57:34.88\00:57:36.72
there's no other God. And
you know, until we meet you
00:57:36.92\00:57:39.49
next time remember:
God is willing to lead
00:57:39.69\00:57:42.16
but we have to be
willing to ask Him.
00:57:42.36\00:57:44.16
So God bless you
till next time. Amen!
00:57:44.56\00:57:46.93