Participants: Jim Gilley (Host), C.A. Murray (Host), Dr. Leslie Pollard, Pr. James Doggette, Jason Ferdinand
Series Code: NLLB
Program Code: NLLB012704
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00:10 Nightlight is coming to you from Oakwood University,
00:13 the beautiful campus and C.A., 00:16 we have just been treated royally 00:18 since we've been here. We have. 00:19 I made a mistake when Dr. Paula said-- 00:21 I called it Oakwood College and I must ask for forgiveness-- 00:24 When I went to school here, it was Oakwood College and, 00:28 you know, you think back to those days. 00:30 I'm so glad of the University and doing such a very, 00:32 very fine job educating and encouraging 00:35 and inspiring young people. It really is. 00:38 And we've run into the Oakwood graduates everywhere we go. 00:43 I mean, you can go around the world 00:44 and you're gonna run into Oakwood graduates. Right. 00:47 And we find that so many of the ministers 00:50 who are trained here have really, 00:53 have made an impact upon God's work 00:55 and one of those that trains these young people 01:00 is Pastor James Doggette. 01:02 Doggette, Pastor, we welcome you. 01:04 It's good to be here. Glad to see you. 01:08 Now see, we both C.A. and I know this gentleman 01:12 and I've known him for quite a while. 01:14 He and I became first acquainted, oh, 01:17 back in the late '80s 01:19 and out in California. That's right. 01:21 And Valley Fellowship church-- Remember those days, yeah-- 01:24 I went there to work with you 01:27 on a capital stewardship program. 01:30 That's right and we were successful-- 01:31 Lord blessed, He really did. 01:33 And that's when we become acquainted with your ministry. 01:37 Now you say capital stewardship, 01:38 you mean you went out there to raise some money? 01:40 Well-- Yeah-- 01:41 We were trying to build a new church and in the process, 01:47 he found a church that had already been built 01:49 and the Lord provided the funds to buy it. 01:51 Absolutely right-- Through the membership. 01:53 Yeah, and that program the way it went, 01:55 I knew you were a man of God 01:56 because the way everything fell into place, 01:59 it was supernatural. praise God. 02:01 It was and I still believe in the Lord, 02:03 in supernatural things. And I do too-- 02:06 Even helping people find keys. 02:08 Last night, we lost some keys here 02:10 and I really do believe the Lord helped us find those keys. 02:14 Were there any car keys on with the other keys? 02:17 Were they car keys? They were car keys, yes. 02:20 It was the Lord. 02:21 It was the Lord who helped you find those keys. 02:22 I'm not kidding you. I believe it was. I really do. 02:26 But listen, tell us a little bit about now your background. 02:30 You were--did you go to school here at Oakwood? 02:33 I did. I graduated from Oakwood University 02:36 College back in 1982. All right. 02:39 This is a special place to me and I was so happy 02:42 to have the opportunity to come back like a tribute 02:44 because I took away from here so much. 02:46 So you went to California in ministry-- 02:48 you went to Texas first, didn't you? 02:50 I went down in that area. Yeah. In that neck of the woods. 02:52 I pastored in Louisiana. I pastored in Arkansas. 02:56 And didn't make it into the great state of Texas. 02:58 No, that's all right. Yeah. 02:59 I then went on to California. 03:01 And then-- and by the way Arkansas 03:04 and Louisiana are two places very dear to my heart. 03:07 And then you went to California 03:09 and then came back here as a teacher. I did. 03:12 One stop between California and Oakwood 03:15 and that was Cleveland, Ohio. Oh, really? 03:18 That was a great year of ministry for me 03:19 with some of the most loving people on the face of the earth. 03:22 Then I came down here to Oakwood back in 1993. Yes. 03:27 I want to backup just little bit because 03:29 you are a son of a preacher. 03:30 I knew your dad... conference president? 03:32 Yes, that's right. In... Southeastern. 03:34 Southeastern. Down in Florida. 03:36 In fact, I felt like ministry was in my genes. 03:40 My grandfather was a minister. In fact, he was the secretary 03:43 of the Southwest union many years ago. 03:44 Oh, is that right? That's correct. 03:46 My uncle was a minister. 03:48 My father, my brother, my son, so ministry is all around me. 03:55 That's right, it is. Praise God. All right. 03:57 And you have children? I do. 03:59 I have four sons. Okay. Four sons. 04:02 And thank God for them, tough guys. 04:04 Oh, yeah. Real men. Yeah. 04:06 Well, one of them is in ministry? That's correct. 04:09 James Jr., the one who's named after me. All right. 04:11 From the time he was a small child 04:13 we used to call him Samuel. Okay. 04:15 Because we would see him there in his bedroom on his knees. 04:18 Reading the scriptures and he milked me for everything 04:21 I knew about the Bible. Loving the Lord. 04:23 Had opportunity later right here at Oakwood 04:25 to actually have evening classes. 04:27 And I'm so excited about what God's doing with him 04:30 in ministry right now. Where is he now? 04:32 He's in the South-central conference. 04:33 He's not very far away. 04:35 He's pastoring right there 04:36 in the shadow of the University of Alabama. 04:40 Crimson Tide, yeah. All right. 04:41 In Tuscaloosa. He's got two churches there. 04:44 Loving those churches and loving ministry. 04:46 Tuscaloosa has been hit hard with that storm 04:49 that came through there. 04:51 How are they rebounding? 04:52 They're rebounding quite nicely 04:54 because of the University there. 04:55 There are resources, there's a lot of attention 04:58 that's been given to that area. 04:59 So they're rebounding quite nicely. 05:00 In fact, faster than some of the other areas of Alabama 05:03 that did get hit. Okay. 05:06 And was the church damaged at all? 05:08 The church was not severely damaged. 05:11 There are two buildings they have there, 05:12 two different churches, and both of those churches 05:14 survived quite nicely-- Praise God. Praise God. 05:16 God put His hand over those buildings 05:18 and the people really got away. 05:20 Now some of the individuals in the churches got hit 05:23 very, very hard but their faith is strong 05:25 and they've all gotten back on their feet. 05:27 Now what areas do you teach? 05:30 Oh, teaching, now that's a whole subject 05:35 that I can go into and spend a lot of time. 05:37 I've taught at Oakwood for some-- 05:40 how many years will it be 20, 05:41 this is year 20 teaching here. 05:43 And I've taught so many classes. I forgot so-- 05:45 But you're mostly homiletics and-- 05:47 That's correct. Practice. 05:49 I'm in Practice. I'm in applied theology 05:51 and the courses I teach 05:52 have a lot to do with hands on stuff. Right. 05:55 How you do things? Right. 05:57 That's a natural for me. 05:59 Now there are a lot of professors 06:00 who teach from theory. 06:03 They read it in books or they learned it somewhere 06:07 but you took these things 06:09 and went out here and started a mission. 06:13 Tell me a little about the church that you've started. 06:15 Yes, no problem. I always felt that, 06:18 especially, in the area of practice. 06:21 By the time it reaches a book it's probably already old. 06:24 So I didn't think I could teach well from books alone. 06:28 Books give you a lot of good history. sure. 06:30 But in terms of the latest, 06:32 that's available in the realm of ministry, 06:34 I, kind of, believed 06:35 I needed to be out there active in ministry. 06:38 Yes. It's also the way I'm wired. 06:39 So when we got here, we were given permission 06:41 by the conference and school administration 06:43 to start a churchout in the Madison area, 06:46 that's a suburb of Huntsville. 06:48 And we've been going strong now for 17 years. 06:50 It's called Madison mission and God's blessed it 17 years. 06:53 17 years, praise God. Yeah. 06:55 And that has grown from-- you started out where? 07:00 Well, we started out-- 07:01 it's an unusual development of a church. 07:04 Usually church plan start very small 07:06 and they grow over time 07:08 but I have to say the very first Sabbath 07:10 we had a service we were in a very large facility. 07:13 I thought we'd be swallowed up. 07:15 And there was standing room only. 07:16 Again that was the Lord. 07:18 I remember going in there on Friday night, 07:19 looking at that building. 07:21 The only one that we could find 07:22 that was available to use. 07:24 And it was so large. 07:25 I said okay, we're gonna be swamped. 07:26 We're gonna need to move everybody down front, 07:28 lope off a lot of these aisles but it didn't happen that way. 07:31 So from the very beginning, we've had a full house 07:34 and God's been good. Yes. Yes. 07:36 Well, now what's the membership 07:39 roughly of that congregation? 07:40 The membership at our church is roughly 500. 07:43 The attendance is approximately twice that. 07:46 That's what I was gonna say because you asked me to speak 07:49 there back in September and I was there. 07:52 And, man, it was two or three times 07:54 as many people as that. Yeah. 07:56 In that particular--and you have a nice big family life center. 08:01 And now you are moving rapidly 08:04 towards building a new sanctuary. 08:05 Absolutely. That's the plan. 08:07 The plan was for us to have a facility 08:09 we could use seven days a week. Yeah. 08:11 And start with that. 08:13 I know so many churches, even some I've pastored, 08:15 that built their sanctuary first and they're still 08:18 talking about building a family life center. That's right. 08:20 Church got a little comfortable in their sanctuary. 08:22 We decided to flip it around. 08:24 And our church can't possibly be comfortable 08:26 in the family life center because 08:28 the deacons have to take the chairs on the racks, 08:31 put them up every week, 08:32 take them down, put them up, take them down. 08:35 It's always a reminder every week 08:36 that we're not home yet. Right. 08:38 You know I looked at it on a map. 08:41 You know, one of the maps that you see from the satellite 08:45 and they evidently took the picture for that 08:48 on a Sabbath because you can sit 08:52 in the outline of your plant there. 08:55 I think it's on the Shelton drive. 08:57 That's right, Shelton road. 08:58 Danny told me he thought that was named after him but it's-- 09:02 Just let him believe that. There's no problem. 09:05 And Shelton drive and how many acres do you have there? 09:10 We've got approximately 26 acres, 09:13 between 26 and 27 acres. 09:14 Amazing plant. Beautiful family life center. 09:18 You've got your office complex 09:21 and then you have a kindergarten type, 09:24 child care type facility there and then you showed me 09:28 where you were gonna build that new sanctuary. 09:30 and Camille and I got excited 09:33 when we saw what is happening there in that particular church. 09:37 The impact you've made on this community, 09:39 God has just really poured out His spirit 09:42 in that congregation. 09:44 God is amazing. Yes. 09:46 The thing that I've learned and I learned this early 09:48 especially that church when you came and visited me 09:50 years ago is that God's plans are so much above, 09:54 so far above our plans. It's amazing. Absolutely. 09:57 And He has ways of putting the pieces together 10:00 and when you see it develop, 10:02 you often get credit as a human 10:04 but any credit that I get for the building 10:06 of Madison mission or the other churches I've been at, 10:09 I'm not being humble in a fake way when I tell you, 10:13 I really don't deserve credit, God does-- 10:15 I understand exactly what you're saying because 10:17 Camille and I've many times made this statement 10:19 that we were just excited to be a part of ministry 10:23 and to be able to go and see what God was gonna do. 10:26 Because that's really what it comes down to. 10:30 What are some of the community outreach programs 10:32 that you've got going on there and helping the community? 10:36 We feel blessed. We are in a unique community. 10:39 It's not like most of the urban places 10:41 I've pastored before. 10:43 You have a lot of engineers, young families. Yeah. 10:46 So I think that it was ideal 10:47 that we built a family life center first 10:49 because we have an opportunity to open it up 10:52 for athletic activities and the kind of activities 10:55 that the community in fact needs. 10:57 They're looking for some things for their young people to do 11:00 and we can provide that. 11:01 So we opened up our facility a lot 11:03 and allow leagues to come in, play sports in a Christian way. 11:08 We're open two nights a week and we do that. 11:10 They start with worship. Yeah. 11:12 And we are very clear what our goals are 11:14 but it's an attractive place in that way. 11:17 I was really impressed with your congregation. 11:21 You mentioned you've engineers and people of that stature 11:24 and I was very impressed with that congregation. 11:28 But also you have entrepreneurs. 11:30 You--we got acquainted with a lady who has a restaurant. 11:34 That's absolutely right. 11:36 And today Pastor Bradford, Charles Bradford said to me 11:42 I want to take you out for lunch 11:44 and he took me to Mangos, Caribbean restaurant. 11:49 And if you want good vegetarian Caribbean food, 11:52 you can get it there. Without a question. 11:54 And I will guarantee you, 11:56 we enjoyed eating at Mangos today. 11:59 And I appreciate Dr. Bradford treating us 12:04 because we were his guests and he took care of us. 12:07 But getting acquainted with that-- 12:09 with so many members of your congregation, 12:11 I have really been impressed 12:15 that God is reaching people of all strata. 12:19 And you have people of all strata there. 12:22 I met--I met what I felt like those financially elite people, 12:26 people that could drop $100,000 in the plate. 12:30 And then I met people from almost from the streets 12:35 and they felt comfortable to be there. 12:38 So it was exciting to be at that particular location 12:44 and to get acquainted with those members. 12:48 I can tell you, Elder Gilley, one of the things 12:50 that God has really been pouring into me 12:53 is that the realities of the world are one thing. 12:57 It's what it is, 12:59 all the challenges we have with society and culture. 13:02 But what the church is supposed to represent 13:04 is a little bit of heaven on earth. Yeah, yeah. 13:06 And we're supposed to really reflect the ideal. 13:09 And if that's true, 13:11 then our churches probably should show 13:13 a lot more diversity. Yes. 13:14 Then we have often showed. Yes. 13:17 We tend to coagulate or join together 13:19 based on those things that we hold in common 13:21 but I found that we are better community of faith, 13:24 we are more effective in our outreach 13:26 and we also have an opportunity to develop real character 13:30 when, in fact, we have a mix of people 13:32 that are at various levels different. Yes. 13:35 And I'm striving for them. 13:37 I want to just take a scoop out of humanity 13:40 and I want to see all of that 13:42 represented inside of that church-- Exactly. 13:44 And we are seeing that more and more. 13:45 It's just supposed to be a reflection of heaven on earth. 13:49 We understand the challenges today. Yes. 13:52 But given the challenges, we also know the resources. Yes. 13:55 And God is well able for churches 13:58 to reflect the reality of heaven. 14:00 The text that I think about is "Thy kingdom come, 14:03 Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven." Yeah. 14:07 And He's counting on us to do that. 14:09 That's why I love fellowshipping with people 14:11 who have more money than me, less money than me. 14:15 More brains than me, 14:17 fewer brains-- is it fewer brains? 14:20 Just a big mix, I love it. I love it. Yeah. 14:24 Well, that's what our church 14:26 historically has been made up of. 14:28 People of all strata where they can come together and, 14:32 you know, someone has said 14:34 the ground is level at the foot of the cross. 14:36 We are all sinners saved by grace 14:39 and it is so wonderful to actually come together 14:46 and see people of all status getting along together, 14:51 loving each other, and enjoying the gospel 14:56 and salvation together. Absolutely. It really is. 15:00 I can tell you even working with the students 15:02 it's been a education for me. 15:03 Being here at Oakwood, 15:04 I had an opportunity to do some teaching 15:06 but I have done a whole lot more learning than I have taught. 15:11 And one of the things that young people taught me-- 15:13 I came--I grew up during the Civil Rights era, 15:16 lived in Memphis when King was shot. 15:18 I've seen some terrible things happening in the world 15:21 but what the young people have shown me, not just told me, 15:24 is that we live in a day and time 15:26 when it is possible for walls to come down, 15:30 for there to be a type of brotherhood 15:32 and friendship amongst various groups 15:35 that historically have had issues, 15:38 unlike any other time and the young people 15:39 aren't satisfied with anything less than that. 15:42 They're tired of hearing those rehearsed some of the problems 15:44 of the past and they're ready to hear some solutions 15:47 and see some settings where in fact 15:49 what we claim to believe can be lived out. 15:52 And I am loving it and I'm doing all I can do 15:55 to not be on the back end of that move. Absolutely. 15:58 Now you talk about doing all you can do. 16:00 Now you--you know, obviously, this is the Lord's doing 16:03 and it's marvelous in our eyes 16:04 but given that you do teach practicum 16:08 so there are methods, 16:09 methodologies that a pastor can use to try to 16:12 be a more effective tool in the hands of the Lord. 16:17 Madison mission was such and I use this term 16:19 for one of the better term 16:21 overnight success and grew so rapid. 16:22 I remember coming here years ago 16:24 and getting into Huntsville on Saturday night--Friday night, 16:29 getting to church a little later, 16:30 I got there maybe 10 o'clock, couldn't get a seat, 16:34 couldn't get a parking lot, that was years ago. 16:37 So there's something going on there that is attracting 16:40 and holding young and old. 16:43 What is it about the methodologies 16:46 that have been put in place 16:47 that makes it such an attractive place to worship 16:50 and to meet the Lord? Yes. 16:51 There are probably, are a lot of answers 16:53 and I'm sure some of the answers I'm not even aware of. 16:56 I will say that my basic philosophy of ministry 16:59 that I think is consistent with our times is that 17:03 I am essentially conservative in theology 17:07 which means that God has blessed us with some truths 17:10 that have stood the test of time and will continue to do that. 17:14 But at the same time, 17:15 I'm very liberal with my methodology. 17:18 That simply means that we're living in a day of change, 17:21 rapid change and the same methods of delivery don't work. 17:26 What really was cutting edge years ago is obsolete 17:30 very quickly and everything has a short shelf life 17:34 if I can put it that way. 17:35 So I'm very, very clear 17:37 about the theology that I promote 17:39 which is something that seems to be very acceptable 17:42 to the young people in that they may not have heard it 17:45 at the worships, at their home like 17:47 I did growing up because 17:49 they raised themselves to a larger--younger people. 17:52 So they're hearing some of the old teachings 17:54 but they're getting it in new ways 17:56 wrapped in modern or post modern clothing. 17:59 And I think that it's one of the reasons 18:01 that it's worked to be quite honest with you. Yeah. 18:03 In fact, most don't even know I'm theologically conservative. 18:07 They're very surprised. 18:08 So you haven't sold out to orthodoxy 18:10 to try to draw people. 18:12 You just put some new clothes on it or give it an-- 18:15 I don't want to say spin because that's such a secular term 18:17 but you've adjusted it to meet the demands 18:19 of the target demographic. Without a question. Yeah. 18:23 That's my core philosophy as it relates to ministry. 18:26 I love the life we've been given. 18:28 I'm not gonna fool with that at all. 18:30 And you're gonna get that from what we deliver at that church 18:33 which you're gonna see some really cutting edge 18:36 technologies being used. 18:38 This is a media age. Yes. 18:39 And we try to stay up with 18:41 what is available in terms of delivery. 18:44 And I think that does have some attraction today. 18:48 You know, when you are training young people, 18:51 are you finding that you can teach 18:54 some of these things to them? 18:55 Or do they catch them more than being talked? 18:59 Is it something that is part of their personality? 19:02 Or is it something that they can learn in sharing the gospel 19:06 with some of these cutting edge 19:08 and maybe some different worship styles 19:10 than we have normally had? 19:12 Yeah, I think--I think that it's both caught and taught. 19:16 I will say this-- I will say this that 19:20 usually we're a day late with what we believe 19:24 in terms of how to reach people. 19:26 I'm hearing a lot, for instance, 19:28 now about post modernism but we're really in the post, 19:31 post modern age. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. 19:33 People have started to read books 19:34 about what was yesterday. 19:36 Right now and the pendulum tends to swing historically. 19:39 Right now, we're dealing with young people 19:42 who want to hear the old stuff 19:45 because the old stuff to them is new stuff. 19:48 Yeah. It's new stuff-- I want to just put a pin there 19:50 because we also heard the same thing from Leslie Pollard. 19:55 There seems to be this harking back. 19:57 I mean, we've had no moorings, no guide, 20:00 nothing to hold on to for so long. 20:01 Folk are looking for something to anchor themselves. 20:03 We went swinging free much too much 20:05 and it seems like that the young people-- 20:07 and not only have we been swinging, 20:10 people have been catering to that swinging. 20:11 Right. You know, we've been just drifting to it. 20:14 So all of a sudden there's this harking back to, 20:16 I want something that I can, kind of, anchor myself to 20:20 and you're seeing that in your pastoring. 20:21 Without a doubt, I mean, 20:23 if you think about it, post modernism, 20:25 to me it's the equivalent of living at Disneyland. 20:29 You know, nothing is real. 20:30 It's all pleasant looking but nothing's real, 20:33 nothing's really solid. 20:34 And I think that's a nice place to visit 20:37 and we visited that for a few years. 20:39 But where we are now, they're looking for something solid 20:42 that they can hold on to. 20:44 The void is some intellectual content that's been missed 20:48 because people have been so excited about being free enough 20:52 to experience some emotion in their worship. 20:54 Yes. And right now, 20:56 the pendulum's swinging back 20:57 and people are saying, "I'm not excited 20:59 about all the noise anymore." Yeah. 21:01 "Give me something of substance. I want some nutrition. 21:04 I want it to taste good." Yes. 21:06 "But can you give something that can keep me strong?" 21:08 We--Jim and I were talking about that it, 21:09 because we're saying, you know, 21:11 it's nice to have a little frosting on yourcake. 21:13 But all frosting on cake, you got to have some vegetables, 21:17 you got to have some substance 21:18 and we have had frosting for so long. 21:20 And when you turn on your television sometimes, 21:21 all you hear is frosting. Yeah. 21:23 But you can't live on sugar. 21:25 No, you can't. You got to have some vitamins. 21:26 No, you can't. Yeah. 21:28 We have talked a little about the pendulum going 21:34 back and forth on things of this nature and when you talk 21:38 about the frosting on the cake and emotionalism and so forth, 21:43 different people react different ways. 21:46 Adventists are different than other people. 21:50 For instance, I was feasting with some Pentecostal friends 21:54 and when Pentecostals get-- 21:57 when they get moved, they get excited. 22:02 When Adventists get moved, they get quiet. 22:05 Now this isn't true for all groups but it is true for, 22:09 it is definitely true for the group 22:10 obviously preaching too. 22:12 If they get real quiet, that means the Holy Spirit's 22:15 really speaking to their heart. 22:17 If they get very still-- now you go to some groups 22:22 and when the Holy Spirit is moving in their hearts, 22:24 they're standing up, see? 22:26 So you got to know your congregation. 22:29 Without a question. 22:30 And you have to understand your congregation. 22:33 Some people come to, well, for instance, 22:35 when I was pastoring in Dallas or even in Arlington, 22:39 when they got quiet that meant the spirit of God 22:43 was really moving on their hearts. 22:45 And, so many times a visiting preacher 22:47 might misinterpret that. 22:49 He might not understand that he's actually really getting 22:54 through at that particular point. 22:57 And again, as I mentioned, some groups when they get 23:00 really moved emotionally then they react differently. 23:04 Without a question. 23:06 I think that's one of the challenges though. 23:07 We talk a lot about diversity and churches 23:10 being a reflection of a scoop of what is real in terms of 23:14 society and heaven on earth, every nation, kindred, 23:17 tribe, tongue, people, we talk about it. 23:19 But that requires a humility beyond what sometimes 23:22 we're willing to exhibit because, 23:24 you are absolutely right, 23:26 there is one culture that I know that at end of a good meal, 23:29 you're supposed to burp if you like it. 23:31 Yeah. Just a real big burp. 23:33 And if you don't they think you don't like the meal. 23:34 Exactly. But there're other cultures that would be-- 23:37 I don't know what culture that is 23:38 but I think I'd make it out there. 23:39 You want to be there. 23:41 There are other cultures where you're supposed 23:43 to finish the food on your plate. Right. 23:45 We live in that kind of culture. Right. 23:46 But there are some others-- 23:48 You're supposed to leave a little there. 23:49 You're supposed to leave--yeah, okay, so if that's true, 23:50 if that's true then the significance, 23:53 isn't just in the act but in the meaning of the act. 23:55 Right. True. 23:56 And we've got to take a little time to learn others. 23:58 You're saying that you know of those who get quiet. 24:01 Oh, yes. I know of some, 24:02 if they're quiet, they've gone to sleep already. 24:04 Yes, they are. And they're disinterested. 24:06 So there're different reactions that may mean 24:08 the same thing and we tend to focus on the reaction 24:11 as being right or wrong, the act, 24:13 what in reality, it's what that represents. 24:16 And so that requires a little bit of humility 24:19 so that I give room for people to be 24:21 somewhat authentic in their expressions. 24:23 In teaching practices, are you in teaching-- 24:27 and some of this is just something you don't teach, 24:30 that people just know. 24:32 But are you teaching these young preachers 24:33 how to read people? Without a question. 24:36 Because in many cases, if in sales for instance, 24:41 if you're a salesperson and you cannot read the prospect, 24:44 you'll starve to death. Right. 24:46 You will never make the sale. 24:48 An evangelist, if you cannot read your audience and if you 24:51 cannot read the interest when you're visiting with them, 24:54 you will never get decisions. 24:56 So they have to learn body language. 25:00 They have to learn-- because 92% of all 25:03 communication is non-verbal. 25:07 Somebody can be saying I love you and at the same time 25:10 their body is not saying that. 25:12 Yeah, their body's saying, but you better not go to sleep. 25:15 Or, you better not come close to me, right? 25:18 And somebody else can be saying well, the words may not 25:22 be exactly what they're saying and I think it's so important 25:26 for us to teach young people to be observant. 25:30 That is so true. 25:31 And to understand this type of, what's going on? 25:35 What is the real reaction of a person? 25:37 Or what's the reaction to the person 25:38 who is saying nothing? 25:40 But you've got to read their face on what is saying, 25:45 are they saying, continue talking, 25:47 are they saying shut up? Right. 25:49 And by the way, one of the things that 25:51 we found in visitation is that you reach your maximum level 25:57 in about eight minutes and if you have not hit 26:03 certain things by about eight to ten minutes 26:06 and if you're not getting in there, 26:08 you're probably not gonna make it. 26:09 So... this is something I learned from Ferris Thurman 26:12 more than anybody else. 26:14 And when you get beyond that point--and especially 26:17 the hospital visit, that's about a maximum hospital visit. 26:22 We do teach that concept though. 26:23 I think our curriculum actually has embraced that 26:26 as a very important concept. Yeah. 26:28 In several classes that I teach, one of them being homiletics, 26:31 or preaching, biblical preaching. 26:33 We have--spend a little time telling the students 26:36 or teaching the students to not just exegete scripture 26:40 but to also successfully exegete their audience. 26:43 Then in Christian ministry where we teach those who're 26:46 going to be pastors how to pastor. 26:49 We spend time as well teaching them to read temperaments 26:53 and personality types so that they can figure out 26:56 what people mean and not just what they're saying. 26:59 And by the way this is not manipulating. 27:01 We're not talking about a manipulative type thing. 27:04 We're talking about understanding people, 27:06 these are things that the school of hard knocks teaches you. 27:10 For instance, in the old days, 27:13 particularly canvassing was a big thing. 27:16 Well, I want to tell you, if you didn't learn 27:18 to read people when you were canvassing, 27:20 selling Christian literature, I will guarantee you, 27:24 you'd never sell a book. You would never sell anything. 27:26 You had to know when you're wasting time, 27:29 when you need to say hey, listen and pack up 27:32 and leave or when you're needed to go ahead 27:34 and ask for the order or what. 27:37 So you learned so many of those things in that type of-- 27:41 and that was the greatest experience for canvassing 27:44 was learning to deal and work with people. 27:48 And these are the kind of things that--I don't know that 27:51 you can totally teach them but some guys you could never 27:55 get it through to them and they'll never be successful 27:57 but those that are successful and pick up on this 28:01 and learn it, they can really be utilized. 28:04 I know there're some people gonna misunderstand me 28:06 and think, that's manipulation but those people 28:09 simply never have worked with people. Right. 28:12 And had to get--get them to help them to make decisions 28:15 for Jesus and things of that nature. 28:17 Whatever you don't know, I think that you can 28:19 always cross a line and take a thing. 28:21 That's good too far. Absolutely. 28:23 But clearly we need to read each other. 28:25 I think that just intuitively we know that, 28:27 a husband and wife have learned that. 28:30 Yeah. That you know? 28:31 I learned for instance, in studying temperaments 28:33 and some of the tools that are used that there are certain 28:36 temperament types that when they really care, 28:40 they're gonna criticize you. Yeah. 28:41 Because they want you to get it right above all people. 28:44 They want you to look good and get it right. 28:47 So their contribution to you is a criticism 28:50 and if they don't care, they're not gonna say anything. 28:52 They're not gonna say anything. No. 28:53 And if you're married to one of your preacher by the way, 28:56 they're gonna tell you that 28:57 you've used that illustration before. 28:58 They will. They will. 29:01 But you learn to interpret it when you understand a person's 29:05 temperament and what they really mean. 29:07 You can then say, "they're not putting me down, 29:09 they don't just like me. 29:10 They care about me so much. 29:12 They want me to just get it better," it as a gift. 29:15 Of course it takes a heaping helping of humility 29:18 to be able to pull that off. 29:19 Yeah. But it does happen. 29:22 We've talked about ministering to your flock, per se, 29:25 but I want to get back to something because 29:27 you talked about building your community services center 29:30 or your service center before your sanctuary because obviously 29:33 you had in your mind, 29:34 which is something that's close to my heart, 29:36 reaching out to the community as well as reaching out 29:39 and pastoring your flock. 29:41 Talk about some of the kinds of things, 29:43 besides the basketball and the other things, 29:44 that your church does to reach out to Madison and to that 29:47 community that surrounds your church? Absolutely. 29:49 There're so many ministries that we get involved in. 29:52 There're some ministries I learn that in the course 29:55 of church programming, we sometimes set up ministries 29:57 as permanent that are really temporary. 30:00 There are issues that come up every year that are times 30:03 sensitive and we have ministries to address that. 30:05 There are certain kind of at risk groups that need 30:08 help in certain ways and the programs, 30:10 aren't necessarily written up, we have to create them. 30:13 We actually have an arm of community activism 30:18 and that term just simply means our focus is in being 30:21 a blessing out in the community around. 30:24 We have Jody Thompson who works 30:26 with the Ellen White estates. Oh, yes. 30:28 Who actually helps to give some leadership in that area. 30:30 And we do things like, we connect with the drug court 30:35 in Huntsville and Madison. 30:36 There is a judge who has a lot of confidence in us, 30:39 she was at our church very recently. 30:41 And she asks us to provide Bibles for the persons 30:45 who are involved in drug court trying 30:46 to get over that problem. 30:48 We have an opportunity to have persons sent our way, 30:51 I actually stood in front of the judge a few weeks ago 30:54 and helped with a young man, who in fact had a problem. 30:59 And that young man needed someone to vouch for him 31:02 and say that I will be there to be beside him. 31:04 And I was there. 31:06 And the judge really gave him a wonderful word. 31:09 And gave him some additional freedoms because of that. 31:11 So, we try to be a blessing in areas like that. 31:13 We have a food bank. 31:15 Right now, economics. 31:16 It's a big problem. Oh, yeah. 31:18 We have people who are very trained, 31:20 they're not lazy but they cannot find work. 31:23 And we have a commitment that everyone needs 31:25 to be able to eat and have a roof 31:27 over their heads. Yes. 31:28 So we exhaust our resources as much as we can to make sure 31:31 that people have needs met in that area. 31:33 And we have a good number of people 31:35 from the community that come in 31:36 and they get food on a weekly basis. 31:39 We do tutorial programs. 31:41 We even have a program that we ran that we call bounce back. 31:45 That's for individuals again, tough economic times, 31:48 who've written bad checks and get in trouble. 31:51 And when they get in troubled the kind of program that 31:53 we put together and we actually worked with one of the colleges 31:56 in the area not Oakwood but another college. 31:59 People were sent to us to get training on how to manage 32:02 their finances better and that included 32:05 a moral dimension. Yeah. 32:06 And that is right up our alley. Yeah. 32:08 Talking about honesty. 32:10 And we are able to do things like that because 32:12 we're always trying to analyze what the community 32:15 needs not looking for the latest program 32:17 that's been drawn up from a distanceplace. 32:20 And then we're going out there trying 32:21 to design what can meet that need. 32:23 Yeah, see that's the kind of rubber meets the road stuff 32:25 that gives you standing and credibility in the community 32:29 and turns the evangelism into a process not just an event. 32:32 Absolutely. I like that, yeah. 32:33 And that's something that you cannot just teach from books, 32:37 you have to be out there. 32:38 And I was speaking to our head of religion department, 32:42 one of our major universities in the church 32:46 and I was telling him that I felt like, 32:48 every member of this religion staff should also be 32:53 pastoring a church, it may be a small church or whatever. 32:55 Oh, he said there's just no way we could do that. 32:58 Well, you've proven that they can do it. 33:01 There're others that have also proven that. 33:04 We found as I've looked at major seminaries 33:07 around the nations, from other denominations, 33:10 many of those men pastor churches. 33:13 This way they stay in touch. Yes. 33:17 With what's going on. 33:18 They're on the cutting edge. 33:19 They're saying what will work by working 33:22 or saying what doesn't work 33:25 by failing with it. Yeah. 33:26 And this way--it's not just a brain thing. 33:30 It's not just a-- and many times we've seen that 33:33 young people would go to an educational institution 33:37 to study for the ministry and loose their zeal. Right. 33:41 For evangelism and just want to study and parse verbs. Right. 33:45 And get to know Hebrew better than anybody else. Right. 33:49 And look at some archeological discovery 33:51 and dig around in a cave somewhere. Yeah. 33:53 And that's okay. Sure. 33:55 But the main reason we're there is to touch people's lives, 34:00 to win souls to Jesus and to help them. 34:03 And this is what excites me about your program 34:06 more than any that I've seen. 34:08 Because you're in the classroom but you're in the field. 34:12 And you're reaching out to people and want to applaud 34:16 the ministry that God has given you here at Oakwood University. 34:21 And we appreciate what's you're doing, Pastor Doggette, 34:23 I want you to know--Doctor Doggette-- 34:25 I want to know, allright? 34:26 I'm Jimmy to you. All right. 34:28 I definitely do appreciate that my model 34:31 for ministry--I have some earthly persons I look up to, 34:35 my dad, and my brother, and you, 34:37 Elder Murray. I look up to you all. 34:39 I really, really do. I'm not just saying that 34:41 but in addition to that and greater than that 34:43 I look to Jesus. Oh, yes. 34:45 As the gold standard in all areas of life 34:48 and ministry as it relates to preaching 34:50 he told stories, parables. Yeah. 34:53 So I promote that you even exegete your text 34:56 and when you've got it right you see 34:57 it as a story that can be told. 34:59 Yes. Jesus told stories. 35:01 Yes Absolutely. 35:02 And he trained his disciples, the whole issue 35:03 of discipleship was Jesus said we're not going to stay 35:07 in a backroom of the sanctuary temple. 35:10 We're gonna go there on the road and we're gonna spend 35:12 some time touching lives and we'll comeback 35:15 together debrief, we'll go into the intellectual content 35:19 of the faith, we'll do that. 35:20 That's important, too. 35:22 But we're not going to do it while 35:23 we're separated from service. Yeah. 35:25 And I think you really find your stride in ministry, 35:28 you learn how to use your tools and sharpen 35:31 them when engaged in ministry. 35:34 Obviously, when you leave school 35:36 you have more time to do it everyday. 35:38 But even while you're in school or while you're teaching in one 35:41 of our schools I think you have to be engaged in ministry. 35:44 We got to follow the model of Christ. 35:46 Amen, Yeah, I really do. Very, very positive. 35:48 Well, listen, we really appreciate you coming 35:51 and by the way, when the guest leaves 35:54 I'm gonna have to go with him. 35:55 Because, I--Southwest Airlines and I have deal 35:59 and that is that if I'm there I get to go on the plane 36:03 and if I am not there they leave without me. 36:05 And if I don't leave right now for the airport 36:09 there is no way that I'm gonna be able to catch 36:12 this next plane to my next appointment. 36:14 But I want to read this next part of this to you before 36:17 I leave and I think our next guests is going to be-- 36:20 is it Timothy McDonald maybe with us? 36:22 Sure he is, he's coming in just a little bit. 36:24 And he is the vice president of Oakwood University. 36:28 But I want to read this to you 36:29 'cause I do want you to get this. 36:32 Keep about your work, He has not sent you to make money. 36:36 He has not commanded you to get rich. 36:39 He has not bidden you to defend your character. 36:42 He has not set you at work to contradict falsehood 36:45 with Satan and His service may start to peddle. 36:48 If you do these things you would do nothing else. 36:52 You will be at work for yourself and not for the Lord. 36:57 Well, I'm gonna-- I tell you, 36:59 I wanted to send this to you and we do. 37:01 And so call us at 618 627 4651 37:07 or freeoffer@3abn.org 37:12 And we wanna send it out to you just 37:14 as soon as we possibly can. 37:16 And by the way, if you do call and you're able to contribute 37:20 something tonight we can use your help. 37:23 It's by your prayers 37:25 and financial support that 3ABN continues. 37:29 And it's only by that. 37:31 It's a miracle that 3ABN is in existence of all. 37:35 It really is Jim. 37:37 And it continues to be a miracle. 37:38 It continues to be a miracle that you took the words, 37:40 as they say, out of my mouth. Right. 37:41 That it continues to be a miracle. 37:43 I want to just talk about something because we are right 37:44 in the midst of--we mentioned this in the first hour. Right. 37:47 We're in the midst of our anchors of truth series. 37:50 This is an anchors away--I'm gonna hold out this flier 37:53 and perhaps one of the cameras can get in tight on this. 37:57 Can you see that? 37:59 It's the flier that Oakwood University has been 38:02 passing out in the neighborhood and gives a list of speakers 38:05 and we just try to get this in kind of tight. 38:08 Really a wonderful wonder of advertisement 38:10 for this special anchors away. 38:14 Last night, we had Carlton Burt and of course 38:17 this is being shown on Thursday night. 38:19 Tonight, Pastor Debleaire Snell, 38:21 he's a pastor of the first church, 38:23 first church here in Huntsville followed by 38:26 Doctor James Doggette on tomorrow. 38:27 Sabbath morning is Doctor Lesley Pilot 38:31 who is the president of this very fine institution 38:34 we had him in the first hour and then another 38:37 pastor/teacher/professor 38:40 Doctor Jesse Wilson who assists 38:43 Doctor James Doggette at Madison mission. 38:46 So we've got a great week of preaching. 38:49 We're excited to be here in Huntsville, 38:50 Alabama and we know that you are, also. 38:53 I'm gonna take a moment while we're waiting 38:55 for our next guest, come to read this last little section 38:59 of our "Keep about your work" because I think its 39:02 such a wonderful work and a wonderful reading. 39:07 It says, "Keep about your work. 39:09 Let your aim be as steady as a star. 39:13 Let the world brawl and bubble. 39:16 You may be assaulted, wronged, insulted, 39:20 slandered, wounded and rejected. 39:23 You may be abused by friends and despised and rejected 39:30 of men but see to it with steadfast determination, 39:34 with unfaltering zeal that you pursue the great purpose 39:38 for your life and the object of your being until 39:42 at last you can say, 'I have finished the work 39:47 which thou gaveth me to do.' 39:50 " This is the kind of thing that you 39:51 can put on your refrigerator. 39:54 As we said, it is suitable for framing. 39:55 This is a cardstock it's not just a simple paper. 39:58 But it's a cardstock, frames very, very well 40:01 and I've seen a number of people frame this in fact 40:04 we're gonna do this at my house. 40:05 But this is something that 3ABN 40:07 will be more than pleased to send to you. 40:09 And its something you can rehearse 40:10 to yourself, to your friends, 40:13 you know, you get those times when you're down. 40:15 You got those times when you're sad. 40:16 You get those times when you're stressed. 40:19 And you can read yourself into peace. 40:22 We'll be glad to send this to you, 40:24 more than happy to do so. 40:25 If you will call us 618 627 465i 40:29 or email us at free offer. 40:31 One word freeoffer@3abn.org 40:36 and we will get this in the mail to you. 40:38 And as I've said in the first half 40:39 if it takes a day or too longer to come 40:42 it's on the way but this has been responded to 40:45 with great enthusiasm 40:46 and our call center is getting it out 40:48 just as fast as they possibly can. 40:50 Call us email, us we'll get it to you 40:52 and we'll be glad to do so. 40:54 Well, Timothy McDonald is here 40:55 we're gonna ask him to come and join me. 40:58 Vice President here at Oakwood University, 41:01 you know--Elder I am back in a days 41:04 when this was Oakwood college. Every now and again 41:06 I flip and call Oakwood College. 41:08 But it is Oakwood University 41:10 good to have you here. Thank you very much. 41:11 Yeah, you've been here a little while. 41:13 Its okay if you could say Oakwood College. Thank you. 41:16 We have a past we correct everybody. Yeah. 41:19 The wrong way... and just take it-- 41:22 I appreciate it. Now I've remembered-- 41:24 oh, you got to grab your microphone. There you go. 41:27 There you go. Yeah. 41:29 I remember back in the days when I had hair 41:31 and the hair you had with was black. 41:33 So we've been we've been here a longtime. 41:35 You have a good memory. 41:38 Give us a little history of how you came to this school. 41:42 Infact let's back before that. 41:44 Grew up in Adventist home? 41:45 No, no, my family became Adventist 41:49 while when I was teenager. 41:51 I'm from Pittsburg Pennsylvania 41:54 and there was a local church 41:56 was conducted at tenderfoot on Valley Avenue 41:59 in the Hill district of Pittsburgh 42:01 for those of you who know Pittsburgh. Uh-huh. 42:03 And my family attended 42:05 and we were convinced that this is the church to join 42:08 and it's interesting that my mother had, 42:10 had studies years before 42:12 because when we joined the church 42:14 and we started studying 42:15 and learning about the Adventists message 42:17 I remember seeing those beasts on the wall of my house. 42:21 When I was a child and we were always, of course, 42:24 engrossed by that fascinated by it. 42:27 So when we learned about the beast 42:29 we said that's the church that we knew about years ago 42:31 and when we joined I was 14 years old. 42:34 It's like how people respond to those beasts 42:36 because actually the beast kind of delayed 42:38 my mother coming to church for about five years. 42:40 Because those beast kind of scared 42:41 her to death. I understand. 42:42 She said I don't know I if I want to go to that church 42:44 or meeting that has all those beasts--but when she came in, 42:46 of course, and she was delighted to do so. 42:48 It is one thing for your family to join the church 42:50 when did Christ become personal for you. 42:54 Probably not until I actually came to Oakwood. 42:56 I joined as soon as I was 14 and we were having a party, 43:02 I remember very well. 43:03 This is a couple of years later for some young man 43:06 from the church who were going away 43:07 to Oakwood college in those days. Oh, yes. 43:10 And of course we didn't know any much about Oakwood 43:13 and there was a party on Saturday night 43:15 and they were giving them gifts 43:17 and they were talking about 43:19 all the wonderful experiences that they were gonna have 43:21 and what they were gonna major in 43:23 and my mother was so impressed with this. 43:25 This was Saturday night. 43:27 On Monday morning I was in the car 43:30 with them on my way to this place. 43:31 Are you kidding? 43:32 Yes, four young men and we came down 43:35 in the one car to Oakwood College. Yeah. 43:37 And I've never been to the south before. 43:39 I had never attended 43:41 an Adventists institution before. 43:43 So it was all new. It was all fascinating 43:45 and it was just a wonderful experience. Yeah. 43:48 And that's when I really began to know 43:50 what Christ meant to me in those days. 43:53 Once you got to the campus was it an easy settle in for you 43:56 or kind of tough making that adjustment. 43:58 It was relatively easy I didn't have any problems. 44:03 It was a big adjustment 44:04 getting use to the south in those days. Oh yes. 44:06 If you remember that was the south in 1958. 44:10 That was more than 50 years ago. Yes. 44:12 And Huntsville like much of the south was segregated. 44:16 Even though, it's very interesting 44:18 we learned that even segregation 44:21 in Huntsville, Alabama was different 44:23 from segregation in other places-- 44:25 Yes, it's always been a different sort of the town. 44:27 Always different. Yes, yes. 44:28 There was much more congenial relationships between the races. 44:33 And it's very interesting to have gone through that 44:35 and experienced it because 44:36 that's one of the reasons why Ellen White-- Yes. 44:38 Back in 1890s said that the church 44:43 should establish a school in Huntsville. Yes. 44:46 Because the relationship between the races 44:49 was more tolerable than it was in other parts. 44:52 In another places, yes, yes. 44:53 So I certainly experienced that in my experience of coming here. 44:56 But it was kind of unsettling to go downtown 45:01 and to see white and a black or white 45:03 and colored water fountain or white and a colored bathroom. 45:08 Those kinds of things were very unsettling to me. 45:10 And into go into a restaurant and be denied service 45:13 because of what color you are. Yes. 45:15 I had not experienced those things in Pennsylvania. 45:17 So those were difficult to get over 45:20 but we were able to do it. 45:21 Plus in those days the college provided 45:26 the kind of support that we really didn't have 45:28 to go in town for many things. Yes, yes. 45:30 In fact they really didn't want us to go in town. Hmm. 45:34 That's why they provided 45:35 a lifestyle more conducive to. Yes. 45:38 Christian Adventist lifestyle here on the campus. 45:40 Uh-huh. Everything was in the campus. 45:42 What did you study when you were here? 45:43 I started education. 45:45 I was influenced by a gentleman 45:47 that I know, you know, Gaines Patrice. Oh, yes. 45:50 Who was a long time teacher in the education department? 45:54 And I didn't have any idea 45:55 where I really wanted to major in college remember. 45:57 I only had two days notice to even come. Yeah. 46:00 So when I got here Gaines was one of the first persons 46:04 that I met on the campus 46:06 and there were as I said four of us and three of us 46:10 three of us where influenced by Gaines Patrice 46:13 to go into teaching. 46:15 Can I name them, is that all right? You may? 46:17 Herb Nelson, Elbert Peterson 46:19 and myself we've all studied education, 46:21 elementary education under Gaines Patrice. 46:24 And Gaines, kind of got us under this idea that 46:28 schools need young men. 46:30 We need strong young men. Yeah. 46:32 Into to handle 46:34 especially African American young men in the school system. 46:38 They're encountered women all the time 46:40 so we need you young men to come and be teachers 46:43 and become principals and then superintendents 46:45 and work your way through. 46:47 So that's one reason why I got into education 46:49 and the three of us have had education 46:52 our entire careers. Wow. 46:54 And we still collaborate on those 46:55 same kinds of things. Praise God. 46:56 Now when you when left here did you go away from Oakwood 46:58 and then comeback or did you stay pretty much in this area. 47:00 I stayed pretty much, 47:02 well, when I graduated from Oakwood I guess in 1963. 47:06 I guess I did kind of do a wide circle. 47:08 I had my first teachings job 47:10 at the DuPont Park School in Washington D.C. Yes. 47:13 And guess who my principal was. Couldn't have been-- 47:16 You don't have any idea. No. 47:18 J.L. Moran, Oh my-- 47:20 J.L. Moran who had been 47:22 the first African American President. Yes. 47:25 At Oakwood University at in the 30s, 47:28 had, of course, had a very illustrious career 47:31 here at Oakwood and in the prime forge 47:33 and then I think he actually retired in the D.C. area 47:37 they brought him out of retirement, 47:39 when they started the dupoint park school. 47:40 And he was the principal, Bless his heart. 47:42 So when I went there 1963 and he was my principal 47:45 and serving as a role model for me. 47:47 I met my wife there 47:49 and she was also teaching there. Great. 47:51 Of course, she wasn't my wife then we, 47:52 of course, dated and became, you know, 47:55 a couple there and got married 47:57 right in the dupoint park church as teachers. Yeah. 48:00 Both in the school. Before our time gets away. 48:03 Of course you're getting good. You cut me off so soon. 48:06 Oh, we are not going yet. Okay. 48:08 But as vice president here talk to us a little bit 48:10 about your duties and what you're doing here at Oakwood. 48:13 My job for the last year 48:15 little more than a year now 48:17 has been provost and senior vice president. 48:21 At Oakwood, the provost, unlike at many institutions 48:25 has administrative responsibilities 48:27 but I am not responsible for the academic programs. 48:31 So I serve as a second command to our president, 48:33 Doctor Lesley Pilot. 48:35 And I have other administrative duties 48:36 that cut across the entire campus. 48:39 Things like information technology the switchboard. 48:43 The service learning program that was starting 48:46 that was actually rolling out this year. 48:48 That will cover the entire institution. 48:51 Aspects, of faculty and staff development. 48:55 We're conducting workshops were 48:58 middle manage staff members can learn more about leadership 49:04 and making decision, making and consensus building 49:07 and those kinds of things. 49:09 So those kinds of administrator duties are cut across 49:11 the campus come under my responsibility as, 49:13 well, as one of the larger federal programs 49:16 that we organize in the campus. I see, I see. 49:18 You've had a long history with this school. 49:21 Talk to us a little bit about the kinds of young people 49:26 that you're getting today. 49:28 Doctor Pilot we spoke before 49:29 he said he's very encouraged, as he looks at. 49:32 You know, there's chaos in the world 49:33 but it seems like Oakwood is attracting 49:35 a committed kind of young people 49:36 and our future is in good hands. 49:38 Do you see that from your vantage point? 49:40 I do, I do, I really do. 49:42 And I think a lot of it has to do with what I believe 49:47 our president has done to set the stage. 49:50 Doctor Pilot came in with the idea 49:53 that the spiritual life of the student had to lead, 49:56 that was the most important that was the foundation. 49:59 The foundation even a good academic career is built. Yes. 50:03 To get the spiritual part of the campus established first. 50:07 So for instance, this school here 50:09 we started out with a theme "God first." 50:13 In our first chapel we started out with God first. 50:16 And doctor Pollard was able to roll out 50:19 the idea of having four chaplains. 50:21 He probably, talked about that in your interview with him. 50:23 Four chaplains, for student enrolment 50:26 that was little more we have a little more than 2000. 50:27 That, puts the priority 50:29 where we think it belongs. Yes. 50:31 On the spiritual dimensions. 50:32 We want to students to know that there are people 50:35 that they can pray with they can be counseled with. 50:38 They can go to when they have problems. 50:40 Of course, it happens with the all 50:42 of the faculty and staff. Yes. 50:43 But, they have four chaplains dedicated 50:45 to the spiritual life of the campus. Praise God. 50:47 It's the significant thing. 50:49 So I think when the president established 50:50 that foundation he laid that foundation 50:53 for--we're going to be a spiritual campus. 50:56 All of our research, all of our surveys 50:59 show that our students even students in 2012, 51:03 they would look for and need that spiritual foundations. 51:07 We learned so much from those surveys 51:08 that what they're looking for. Yes. 51:10 In a good Christian seventh-day Adventists education. 51:13 The spirituality is first 51:15 and foremost in everything we do. 51:16 And then we follow that up with 51:18 our faculty and staff colloquium. 51:19 God first--so we had the students, 51:22 then the faculty and the staff. 51:24 God for us laying that foundation 51:25 that we what really want in our faculty 51:27 and staff to do with curriculum 51:29 and with the spirituality of the campus. 51:31 Yeah and I wanna follow up on that 51:33 because it is one thing for faculty staff, 51:36 president, vice president, to set this culture 51:38 to build this platform. 51:41 Do you see buy in by the student population? 51:44 I do--we have discovered for instance 51:48 that the most important service of all the services 51:54 that we conduct on a campus. 51:56 From Sabbath schools on Sabbath to church service, 51:59 to worship programs throughout the week. 52:03 Chapel, the program that the students felt 52:08 was the most important for them 52:10 was the Friday night AY. Friday night AY. 52:13 Just it was jus the fascinating thing to see them 52:16 all say that was the service 52:18 that they felt was most important 52:20 for their spiritual foundation. 52:22 Now the interesting thing about this is when you back 52:25 to the Oakwood might day and somewhat even your day. 52:28 If you remember, we always loved Friday Night Vespers. 52:32 We did. Yes. Yes. 52:33 Friday Night Vespers was so important. 52:35 So even though the name has changed-- 52:38 and even the style of music has changed, 52:41 it's still the important spiritual foundation 52:43 that our students want to get. Indeed, yeah. 52:44 So even though they have a lot of new ideas about life 52:47 and exaggerated by, of course, the society in which we live. 52:52 I think they still value 52:53 and appreciate the spiritual foundation. 52:56 Even today, even today in chapel 52:59 one of our four chaplains spoke today. 53:01 The female chaplain and the students were captivated 53:06 by her representation and what it takes to be spiritual. 53:10 And the discussion and the examples that she gave 53:13 as to how God can come into our life 53:16 and affect our life's on a daily and a realistic basis. 53:20 Now and just to see that in fact I was hoping 53:22 you guys even recording 53:23 that today it would have been a great program. 53:24 It would have been. But, I even those students are different 53:27 I still think they look for those same basic things 53:30 that we try to make sure that they receive 53:32 with an Adventists institution. Yeah. 53:34 Let me ask to you one of those kind of high concept 53:35 on to logical questions we toss out every now and again. 53:39 You've been here a good while 53:41 and put a lot of your life 53:42 into this institution. Twenty years. Twenty years. 53:43 What gets you up each morning? 53:45 What motivates you, what about this thing 53:50 that we call Oakwood University 53:51 and Christian education excites you each day 53:54 to get a put on your shirt and tie. 53:55 Put on your shoes and come out and do your jobs. 53:57 That's a great question. 53:59 I ask myself that every morning. Yeah. 54:01 Especially now I mean I'm in my seventies now. Yes. 54:04 And I say to my wife and to myself, is this the day 54:09 that may be I should you know step aside 54:11 and let one of the other younger guys take it over. 54:13 And by the way we're looking for the younger guys 54:15 to take my place. 54:17 Because that's a part of succession planning. Yes. 54:20 But you know everyday first something happens 54:24 and I just feel energized to keep doing it. 54:28 And I believe and I am really sincere about this 54:31 I believe the Lord will let me know 54:32 when its time to stop he will tell me that, okay. 54:36 I think you've done your job. 54:37 You've done your duty now its time to let it go. 54:40 But I also feel that as long as I have 54:42 that good feeling to get up and go, 54:43 the will to get up and do it. 54:46 And the students and my colleagues 54:48 and my boss still feels that I have a contribution 54:52 to make and I am gonna keep doing this. Amen. 54:55 I want you just and we got the about a minute in change 54:57 to look into that camera there and complete this question. 55:02 Working parent? When you sacrifice to send your son 55:08 your daughter to Oakwood college 55:11 here's what we pledge we will try to do for that job. 55:16 I love what our President had said just recently, 55:20 coming to Oakwood University, 55:22 sending you child to Oakwood University, 55:24 he knows that incorrect when you said college. 55:26 It's not just a four year proposition, 55:30 coming to Oakwood University where you're going to get 55:32 a quality Christian education is a forty year life commitment. 55:38 And we make sure that it happens while they're here 55:41 and that'll last all through their life's. 55:43 Not just for four years 55:44 but for the next forty years of their lives. 55:46 Praise God. We have spent some time on this campus. 55:52 Of course, a graduate of this campus 55:54 and every time we come here we're impressed 55:55 with the continuing commitment to excellence. 55:59 A spiritual excellence. 56:02 The young people come out with the three hours. 56:05 They know what they're doing but they also come out 56:07 with a working relationship with Jesus Christ. 56:09 And I don't suspect there's any finer compliment 56:12 that could be given to an institution. 56:14 Then the fact that when I leave here 56:17 I know what I am going to do. 56:19 But I also have a working relationship with Jesus Christ 56:22 and I am sure that's part of your lexicon 56:24 every single day. Every day. 56:26 That's the only way to do it. 56:28 That's the really the only reason why we are here. 56:30 Yes. That same mother. 56:32 That same student can probably get 56:34 and that I may even get in trouble for saying this. 56:37 They may be able to get just as good an education 56:40 in those three hours that you mentioned. Yes. 56:42 At the state university even other private institution. 56:45 But they're not going to get 56:47 the same walk with Jesus Christ. Yes. 56:49 That's they're going to get at Oakwood University. 56:51 That's the reason why we are here. Yeah. 56:53 Last night we listened to the choir sing. 56:56 They were fabulous. And you could see. 56:57 Yes. The love of God on those young faces. 57:00 Yeah. They weren't faking that thing. 57:01 Right. That was real in their heart. 57:03 And that was just one of the many choirs 57:04 that we have here. Just one--fabulous. 57:07 Well, during our stay here we're going to here 57:10 and I am glad we get hear choirs every single night. Yeah. 57:12 And on Sabbath morning we get to here the Eearlene 57:15 and so you wanna stay by for Friday 57:17 which is tomorrow and then Sabbath. 57:19 Two services we got choirs at each of the service 57:22 and we're just very, very, excited 57:23 to be on the campus Oakwood University 57:26 that is all for now. 57:27 Our time is fast slipped into eternity. 57:29 We'll see you soon on another Night Light. God bless. |
Revised 2014-12-17