Participants: C.A. Murray (Host), Jim Gilley (Host), Enoch Hurd, Kevin Penrod
Series Code: NL
Program Code: NL013002
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00:20 Hello, and welcome to 3ABN Night Light.
00:22 I'm C. A. Murray. My partner, Jim Gilley, is with me. 00:25 And this is a very, very special Night Light program Jim. 00:29 It really is. And each time we try to, we try to address 00:35 current situations, and needs that we feel like are very 00:40 important for God's church, for education, for those things that 00:46 we are facing as Christians. 00:48 And right now tonight, we're going to be talking about a very 00:52 touchy subject with some people. 00:54 But it's something I feel like we have to talk about. 00:58 You know, the Bible tells us, and we will mention this 01:00 a little bit later on the program, that we need to be 01:02 as wise as serpents, harmless as doves. 01:05 And I'm looking at, I've got, Jim, you can see a little map 01:07 here of the United States. 01:08 And I'm looking at the plethora... 01:12 Let me use that big $5.00 word of mass shootings since 1982. 01:16 Yeah. Uh, safety really is an illusion. 01:20 You know, you're really only safe in Jesus. 01:22 You can be behind locked doors, you can go through metal 01:24 detectors, whatever, but the guns are proliferating, 01:30 mass murder is proliferating. 01:34 You know, when we were young, you had a beef with a guy, 01:37 you know, you throw out your school books, and you kind a 01:39 duke it out a little bit. 01:41 That's right. 01:42 But people are now going and getting guns. 01:43 And guns that shoot a lot of bullets really fast, 01:46 and hurting a lot of innocent people. 01:49 And they're settling their disputes with guns, 01:52 not their fists. Not that fists were right, but at least you 01:54 could walk away from the fist fight. 01:56 And, you know, even, to me, something that I worry about 02:00 even more for some people is the fact that there are deranged 02:04 individuals who somehow feel that going into a school, 02:10 or into a church, into a theatre, into a place where 02:14 there are people, and shooting a lot of people, somehow they 02:20 imagine that this is a great heroic deed or something. 02:25 Because we don't know how those minds work. 02:28 I have no idea how they think. 02:30 Sometimes we get the idea that because of video games 02:34 this has increased. 02:36 And that very well could be. 02:38 When we had the situation that took place at Sandy Hook, 02:42 in Newtown, Connecticut, at that time I once again began to 02:48 realize that we had to do a special program on 3ABN talking 02:55 and addressing some of these situations that 02:58 we're facing today. 02:59 And that's, to me that's sort of the basis of what happened. 03:04 Yeah, you know, Jim, here in Illinois, our state is one of 03:07 the last states to pass concealed carry legislation. 03:10 Yes. Where you can just put a gun in your pocket 03:12 and you can carry it. 03:13 The Governor tried to have some special laws added to that one. 03:20 You couldn't bring one to church. 03:21 There were some other things. 03:23 You couldn't have a gun in a place that sold liquor. 03:25 But those laws were defeated. 03:27 And, of course, now we have concealed carry here. 03:31 The fact is that guns are proliferating. 03:34 Even in church people are carrying guns. 03:38 And that has always been, but people are now 03:40 using guns in church. 03:41 And so we need to talk about that. 03:43 We need to kind of address those kinds of things, 03:45 because we need to keep our people safe. 03:47 We really do. We know of a situation that took place 03:51 some time ago here in Illinois, where there was a man who was 03:56 very upset, estranged from his wife. 03:59 He came into the church to shoot her; shot some other innocent 04:04 people; shot the pastor. 04:07 And this makes us realize that when you go to church this is a 04:14 very real possibility today. 04:18 Now some people have gotten the idea that if they have enough 04:21 deacons and elders that are armed, that this will protect 04:26 them, but folks, we found that that may not be the answer. 04:29 In fact we don't recommend that. 04:31 We want you to know that we don't. 04:33 And we're going to be talking in a few minutes 04:36 to some professionals. Yes. 04:38 And I will, I would just be very, very sure that they are 04:44 going to recommend that only professional officers carry 04:48 guns to protect people. 04:50 Yeah. When you've got deacons with guns, elders with guns, 04:52 guns playing church, you don't want a lot of people spraying 04:54 a lot of bullets around even in a church situation. 04:58 So you wonder why are they talking about guns and violence, 05:01 because guns and violence have lift their way into the church, 05:05 and we need to be aware. 05:06 And so we have brought a couple of experts here. 05:09 They are both Adventists, they are both in the security. 05:13 One is in law enforcement enforcement. 05:14 We're going to introduce him in just a little bit. 05:16 But we need you to understand that these are serious times, 05:19 and God's people need to be wise. 05:21 Our schools are open many times. 05:23 We don't have metal detectors at our schools. 05:25 I've been the chairman of the board of a couple of academies. 05:27 You've dealt with schools all of your life; 05:29 put kids through school. 05:30 We don't have metal detectors at our schools. 05:32 But we need to be wise, and we need to be safe in these times. 05:35 Well, we have a responsibility. 05:37 I've been the chairman of the board of a number of academies, 05:39 and schools, and we have a responsibility, folks, 05:45 to protect those that are there. 05:48 I do know that some of you live in places where you don't even 05:52 have to worry about locking your doors in your house. 05:55 You don't have to worry about locking your car. 05:57 But I will tell you this, that that is not true 06:03 all over this country. 06:04 In fact I think you've probably had some experiences with this, 06:10 so we may be talking about some of those a little later on. 06:12 Yeah, I've had three cars taken. 06:13 Right, and I will share some things that have happened 06:19 when I was just going to church, or being the pastor of a church, 06:23 where we had break-ins, where people broke into cars, 06:29 broke into our church, sole the sound system, 06:31 things of that nature. 06:33 These are very real problems today. 06:36 Now we are preparing this program so that it is available. 06:41 It's going to be available. 06:42 I may mention this again later, but it's going to be available 06:45 to schools, and churches, and organizations of any 06:50 denomination, anywhere in this country as a gift from 3ABN. 06:54 You only have to contact us, ask for it, and we will send you 06:59 a copy of this program. 07:01 We also want to try to do the very best to help you have good 07:05 security in your church. 07:07 Not the type of thing, folks, where people are all armed, 07:12 and where you don't feel comfortable in worship. 07:15 That's not the goal. Yeah. 07:17 But the goal is to take precautions so that we are not 07:23 left without any kind of protection in this 07:27 type of a situation. 07:29 And here's another area that we're going to talk about 07:30 in the upcoming video. 07:32 Ah roll in in just a little bit. 07:34 Churches are, excuse me, kind of an easy mark because you're 07:39 handling large amounts of money, particularly on Sabbath morning. 07:42 Yeah. My last church, we were 18 to 20 thousand 07:45 in offerings every Saturday. 07:47 So you need to be aware by getting that money out of the 07:53 church, out of the sanctuary, out of the prying eyes of people 07:56 as quickly as possible, and being very efficient 07:58 in your offering collection. 07:59 Because usually people who pull these kind of capers 08:02 kind of watch how things go a couple of weeks. 08:05 You may have people who you think are visitors. 08:06 They may be looking to see how you handle your money, 08:09 how tightly, or how loosely you handle your money, 08:11 and try to find ways to intercept your money. 08:15 So we're going to talk about some of those things 08:16 in the videos that are coming up. 08:18 Jim if you want to introduce those guys that we're going 08:19 to be interviewing in just a little bit. 08:21 Well, I will, but, you know, one of the things we're going to 08:24 show is a video. Oh yes. 08:26 This video is, it's dramatic. 08:30 It is a, it was put together by Homeland Security 08:35 and I believe the Houston Police Department. 08:37 And they have put this together to show what happens, 08:41 or what your reaction should be if there is an active shooter 08:48 that comes into your place of work, comes into your school, 08:53 comes into your church, or wherever. 08:56 Very important to have a plan, to know, What am I going to do 09:01 if somebody comes in. 09:03 And so this is very important. 09:06 Some of you may not be able to take this video. 09:09 And if it happens, when the time comes, in fact some of you 09:13 may not be able to take this entire program. 09:16 And if that's true I suggest you take your Bible and go study 09:20 your Sabbath School lesson, or do something during this time. 09:24 However, I want, and I'm praying that this program 09:29 will save at least one life. Yes. 09:31 That someday, somewhere, somebody will say to us, 09:35 Because you fellows did that program, my life was saved. 09:40 Yeah. We will give you some tools during this particular 09:44 video that really will teach you what to do in a case of 09:48 an emergency; like the old videos when they set up to the 09:51 fire, stop, drop, and roll kind of thing. 09:53 Well, we want to put some tools in your hand, 09:56 because you're not thinking; you're reacting. 09:58 So we want you to react correctly because your life 10:01 may depend on how you react when somebody comes in. 10:03 And you think, you know, people think, 10:04 It's never going to happen to me. 10:06 And it does happen to people. 10:07 We're looking at hundreds of incidences of people who 10:10 probably never thought that they'd be facing something like 10:13 this, but they are. 10:14 So we want you to be prepared, and ready to do the right thing 10:17 at the right time to save your life or someone else's. 10:20 And we are praying that it never happens to you. 10:22 We're praying that this is very unnecessary information. 10:26 But you know if you take a precaution, and you are careful, 10:29 and you are prepared, then usually 10:35 you don't have to use it. 10:37 But if you have to use it it's available to you. 10:41 Well, the gentlemen that we are going to be visiting with, 10:43 Enoch Herd is the head of the Collegedale Police Department, 10:50 and the director of campus safety for Southern Adventist 10:57 University is Kevin Penrod. 11:00 These gentlemen have been a great help to us here at 3ABN. 11:04 They've come here, they've looked at our entire situation, 11:09 gave us safety counsel on preventing fires, 11:14 preventing injury in case there was, roots of escape, 11:20 things of that nature. 11:21 We really have appreciated their technical ability. 11:26 And these are men that love the Lord. 11:30 They are born again Christians. 11:32 Seventh-day Adventists, both of them. That's right. 11:35 And um, I'm sorry Jim. 11:36 No they, Go ahead. 11:37 Ha! We shot this over on our Today show set, 11:41 so we're going to be going over there in just a little bit 11:43 just for space and time constraints. 11:46 But we really want you to pull out pen, paper; listen to these 11:49 things, because we're going to talk about a number of things, 11:51 including fire safety and mental health. 11:52 All of this is in this package. 11:54 Yes, and so right now get a pen and paper, and we will see you. 12:00 We're going to the other set. 12:04 Our guests are Kevin Penrod, Enoch Hurd. 12:07 He's the director of safety for Southern Adventist University. 12:12 Big school, a school that we love and know quite well. 12:15 And then we move to the Collegedale Police 12:18 Department, Enoch Hurd. 12:19 Gentlemen, good to have you here. 12:21 Thanks for having us. 12:22 Kevin kind of looks like a banker, lawyer, you know, 12:25 that kind of thing, but he's a safety guy, 12:28 and we're going to talk about that. 12:29 On a college campus in particular you've got people 12:33 coming and going, and students moving, gong to and fro. 12:35 Safety is a big concern. 12:38 People send their children and put them in the hands of the 12:41 school, and expect those kids to be safe. 12:43 And we find, many times, that they are not. 12:45 So you've got big shoes to fill, and a big job. 12:48 Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. 12:50 And we began to really think about this program 12:53 several years ago, particularly when there was an incident at 12:57 a church here near St. Louis. Uh huh. 13:00 And Kevin came down here and helped us. 13:04 They were, he and Officer Hurd were here for a camp meeting 13:09 with some other individuals, and helped train our people for just 13:15 basic safety and security type situations. 13:19 But then after recently, in recent months, 13:24 we had the incident that took place in Connecticut. 13:28 I once again contacted you and said, We've got to do a program 13:33 on safety for our churches, and for our 13:38 schools, and on security. 13:41 I don't know if you ever had any incidents there, but one morning 13:46 I got a telephone call at our church that there was an 13:54 intruder in the church; that the janitor called and said, 13:58 Somebody's in this church other than me. 14:01 And so I immediately called our Associate Pastor, 14:07 James Buckmaster; who, James is a big old boy, and I said, 14:11 James, get over there and see what you can do. 14:13 I said, Probably by the time you get there they'll be gone. 14:17 That's not true. When James got there he thought they were gone. 14:21 He called the police. 14:22 The police drove up and the police said to James, 14:26 as he drove up he rolled his window down. 14:27 He said, Are you all unloading things out the back? 14:30 And James said, No! 14:33 Well, somebody was unloading our sound system; 14:36 close to $30,000.00 worth of sound system that they had 14:40 destroyed in the incident that was taking place. 14:45 They weren't careful in taking it out. 14:47 They didn't even unplug it. 14:48 They just cut the wires. 14:50 And so they did catch the man out in the back in the alley. 14:55 He was unloading all of our sound equipment at that time. 15:00 Broad open daylight; 8:00 o'clock in the morning, 15:03 and this is taking place at our church. 15:07 It made us realize how important it was to have security there. 15:11 And to have, to take measures with the alarm system. 15:16 We then made a... It was so hard to keep the church alarmed 15:21 that we finally ended up alarming the sound room, 15:24 because that's the room that had been hit so many times. 15:27 The church has a general alarm, but it's hardly ever set, 15:31 to be honest with you. 15:32 But we did arm that. 15:34 Now I know you've had incidents there, 15:36 and you took security precautions. 15:38 Oh yeah. We've had. 15:40 Every church that I've pastored we put in a full alarm system. 15:42 Not to take much time, but I remember that the pastor before 15:46 me at the Ephuses church was walking down the street one day, 15:49 and saw somebody walking down in one of his suits 15:51 that they had taken from the Pastor's office. 15:53 Ha ha! He said, I know that suit; that's my suit man! 15:56 Right! Well, I bought it off a guy over there, you know. 15:58 So, I mean, we don't want to be naive, because people tend 16:02 to prey on churches. 16:04 They go for electronics. 16:05 They go for a lot of the stuff that's in churches. 16:07 So when we talk about general safety, Gentlemen, 16:10 what are we envisioning? 16:12 How does a church begin to protect itself, or a school? 16:15 What are some of the basic steps? 16:16 This is kind of like safety 101. 16:18 Okay, well we would first start out; we tell people that 16:21 your safety is your own responsibility. 16:24 We can be here to handle certain issues, and to be able to be 16:28 grounds patrol and personnel safety, but you have to take 16:31 matters into your own hands at the very beginning. 16:34 And the easiest way to do that is to become aware of your 16:37 surroundings, and what's happening to you. 16:39 We have a tendency as humans, to go around in 16:42 an auto pilot state where we're functioning, and we're paying 16:47 attention, but yet we're not really zeroed in on what's 16:50 happening around us. 16:51 So the first step is to make people personally aware, 16:53 so when they wake up in the morning and they step outside 16:56 on the porch the first time take a look around. 16:58 Don't just go straight to the car. 17:00 Just take a look around. 17:02 And when they go to the shopping mall, to the grocery store, 17:05 or any of those types of things, it's the exact same situation. 17:08 Is just make sure that you're aware of your surroundings, 17:10 and make sure you look around. 17:12 Look people in the eye. 17:13 Predators don't like to be recognized, or to be able to be 17:16 identified at a later time, so making eye contact is another 17:19 good way of at least sending a message that you're paying 17:22 attention to your surroundings, and that you're capable 17:26 of identifying them. 17:27 So those are good areas to begin. 17:31 The other general safety is locking doors. 17:34 They're there for a reason, so lock the doors, 17:38 lock the windows on your cars. 17:40 Don't leave things in plain sight. 17:42 Put things in the trunk if you are going to be parked. 17:46 We've had other incidents at churches where people use 17:49 the service time to actually break into cars. Yes. 17:52 They'll use the spring loaded center punch, pop out the side 17:55 window, grab whatever they can get, and be gone. 17:58 So we do things during church services; 18:00 put patrols through there. 18:02 Evening meetings, such as when you folks have been on 18:05 the campus of Southern, we've done the exact same thing 18:07 just to keep that from happening. 18:09 Um huh. You know, I suppose most of us have either pastored 18:14 churches, or been... 18:15 I actually had a car parked at a church once, and they broke in 18:19 and stole my radio right during the eleven o'clock hour. 18:23 My radio was taken out of my car. 18:26 Can you beat that? 18:27 The pastor, they stole his whole dashboard. 18:29 He went to put his key in; hand right through the firewall. 18:32 While during church service, entire dashboard; took it out. 18:36 You know, you also had an incident at a Conference office, 18:39 wasn't it? Yeah, they stole my... 18:41 Well, I've had three cars stolen. 18:43 And this was off the parking lot of the Conference office. 18:47 Twenty seconds. Twenty seconds; wow! 18:49 So we're living in a real world where these 18:53 kind of things happen. 18:54 Can't prevent all of them, but we can take precautions, 18:57 and be alert, and some of these things. 19:01 Kevin, just real quick, you say look around. 19:03 What am I looking for? 19:04 Strange people? Things out of the ordinary? 19:07 When I come out in the morning, I'm scanning. 19:08 What am I trying to perceive or pick up? 19:10 You hit the nail on the head. 19:12 That's exactly what you're looking for: something that 19:13 doesn't normally, isn't normally there. 19:15 Something that seems out of place. 19:17 It just helps you bring in the entire scope of what is around 19:21 your home, and around your vehicle. 19:23 The other thing, it gives you an opportunity to look at your 19:25 vehicle if it's parked outside, if there's glass, 19:27 if there's a flat tire, something on that line that 19:30 would be a possible indicator that somebody was still around, 19:33 or that something had been done. 19:35 And that's why it's so important to partner with the local law 19:38 enforcement so that, like our churches, and our schools, 19:42 it's imperative that we do partner with our local law 19:45 enforcement personnel, so they can come in and give a 19:47 perspective from what their job, and how they're going to handle 19:50 things if we do have an incident in, and or around our home. 19:53 Uh huh, uh huh. Does lighting around the house at night 19:57 deter? Does that really help? 19:58 The money you put into, to put in spotlights or flood lights; 20:02 is that money well spent? 20:04 It depends on what expert you speak to. 20:05 Some say, Absolutely, because crooks like the dark. 20:08 Others say, Well, it's just an opportunity that allows me 20:10 to use my tools in a better fashion. Yeah! 20:12 So it depends on which side you're going to. 20:15 Generally I would say that lighting's probably a good 20:19 thing, because most of them are going to be deterred. 20:21 I mean most of the break-ins that we see are not 20:24 in a well lit area. 20:25 It's going to be around the back, or it's going to be in an 20:26 area that's, you know, shaded, and would have some cover, 20:30 some time to work. 20:33 You know, I went to a church not long ago and one of the younger 20:38 members and I were talking. 20:40 I don't know how the subject actually came up, 20:42 but he let me know... 20:44 I guess we had heard about a national incident 20:48 involving a church, and someone had gone in and started firing. 20:51 And he said to me, If that ever happens in our church, 20:56 he said, two of our elders, and one of our deacons are packing. 21:01 They actually carry guns. 21:04 Do we have guns in our churches today? 21:07 Has it actually come to that, that people are 21:10 actually carrying guns in churches? 21:12 And if so, is that legal? 21:15 It absolutely is happening. 21:18 They do exist in churches, and the amount of weapons that are 21:22 finding their way into the churches are going up 21:24 on a consistent basis. 21:26 People want to feel safe in church. 21:28 There are some who feel like it is my responsibility to guardian 21:32 after other congregational members that may not be able 21:35 to protect themselves. 21:36 And so they go obtain a weapons permit to carry, 21:39 and they're carrying to church. 21:41 We've had several conversations with people where we've been 21:45 guarding against, unless the church adopts that as a policy, 21:50 that is don't take matters into your own hands, 21:52 because there's an array of things that could end up 21:55 happening in that type of an event. 21:57 It comes down to your judgment skills, your marksman skills. 22:01 And if a critical event does happen responding 22:05 law enforcement, if they don't recognize you, 22:07 you're another threat with the gun. Right. 22:09 And if anything else, you're taking away from that officer 22:12 potentially working the threat because you're not known. 22:17 So there are a lot of variables that work into this, 22:19 and so I think churches need to be careful, but they need to 22:23 step up at this point in time right now and say, We're making 22:26 a ruling as a church policy, to say, You are, or you aren't, 22:30 or this is how it's going to work, 22:32 and make sure that it's spelled out. 22:33 Now our insurance carriers that we've worked with, 22:35 and talked with have said, We're not covering any type 22:38 of a vigilante, or a person carrying a gun that's not 22:42 authorized by the church in any of those critical incidences. 22:46 Now when you talk about a church authorizing this, 22:49 are you talking about their authorizing a layman 22:54 to carry a gun? or are you talking about their authorizing 22:56 an officer, maybe, a lot of times there are police officers 23:02 that attend a church. 23:03 Are you talking... What are you talking about there? 23:06 Well, to me that's the explanation of the entire policy 23:09 of saying, We're only going to allow bonified sworn law 23:12 enforcement officers to actually carry, and to intercede if some 23:16 thing does happen, until on duty officers are able 23:18 to come and assist. 23:20 That way you're taking out of play of everybody else. 23:23 I've spoken to one church where they've said, If you want to 23:26 bring a gun to church, leave it in the car. 23:28 That's close enough. 23:29 That's as far as we're going to be willing to go. 23:31 But I think each church needs to take a look at it, 23:33 until we hear something from the General Conference or 23:35 North American Division, if there's going to be a blanket 23:37 policy that comes out that each church is going to have to look 23:40 at what their needs are, how quickly they can get a response 23:43 from law enforcement in the event a critical incident 23:46 happens on their property. 23:49 From a legal standpoint you have a lot to consider in addition 23:53 to just if you have a permit. 23:55 So you have a permit; you're legal to carry that gun, 23:57 and you do get involved in a situation, and you help, 24:00 and you possibly even stop it. 24:01 You're not out of the civil litigation arena at all. 24:06 And you've got a host of things to consider. 24:08 You could accidentally injure somebody else. 24:10 I mean if you're in a church, especially if you think of all 24:12 the people in the pews, you know. 24:13 Somebody comes down the isle and they're shooting 24:15 or something, and you take action and do something to stop 24:17 that, what if you hit somebody else? 24:19 You know, criminally you wouldn't be charged, 24:20 but you could lose everything. 24:21 You know you have a... Right. 24:23 Carrying a gun is a personal responsibility that one has to 24:26 come to terms with on their own. 24:27 And you have to accept the responsibility if you're 24:29 going to carry one. 24:30 Yeah. So we're saying, gentlemen, as it stands now 24:32 if a person pulls a gun in church, even in defensive 24:35 posture, because someone else is aggressive, he's on his own. 24:38 I mean it's on you. 24:40 There's no... The church is not going to go behind you. 24:44 It's you're taking your situation in your own hands. 24:47 Absolutely. Yeah. You know now, I was talking again to a 24:51 young man who's Assistant Principal of a large school, 24:54 but it's located about, in fact the officers from the county 25:00 were recently there, and talked to the faculty. 25:05 And they said, We need some people up here who are legally 25:11 licensed, because he said it takes us 28 minutes to respond 25:16 to this area if there were an emergency that took place. 25:20 And you're talking about a lot of people there in that 25:24 particular area, in that school, and that community. 25:27 He said, But it takes us 28 minutes at our best response, 25:32 to get here, and you have no law enforcement 25:36 at this particular school, and you have no security 25:40 on this particular campus. 25:43 So these are things that need to be taken into consideration, 25:49 that needs to be, you just can't arm everybody and say, 25:53 Now you're deputized sort of things. 25:56 It's not like the old west. 25:58 But we do have to do some type of an organized situation. 26:03 But you are saying guns in churches should only be 26:07 done by professionals. Is that right? 26:09 Absolutely! There's two churches in Tennessee that we've worked 26:13 with right now that actually hire out a third party security 26:16 company that actually provides armed uniformed guards 26:19 that protect the property while services are going on during 26:22 board meetings in the evenings while your senior people 26:26 are present on the property. 26:28 And they've gone that route to send a message, but not getting 26:31 church members involved. Yes. 26:33 So that is an option, or to subcontract with off duty 26:36 law enforcement officers who are prepared to handle 26:40 a situation should it arise. 26:41 I have a question for you. 26:43 Because when I was pastoring the Ephesus church in Manhattan, 26:45 we had a big membership; a million and a half dollars 26:48 tithe a year, $247,000.00 local church budget. 26:52 We averaged $18 to $20,000 per Sabbath. 26:55 I had an undertaker, interesting enough, 26:58 who carried a gun every Sabbath. 26:59 I'll call his name, Willie Bathea. 27:01 He was armed every Sabbath, and an excellent marksman. 27:04 What we did was to... 27:06 I think one of the times you're most vulnerable is during 27:08 tithes and offerings. 27:09 You know, you've got people standing there. 27:10 Everybody's head is bowed to pray. 27:12 You've got money there. 27:13 What we did was have them collect the money, 27:15 get it out of the sanctuary immediately, 27:16 then have your prayer, but not heads bowed, eyes closed, 27:18 and you've got all this money kind of stuff. 27:20 Isn't that kind of a very vulnerable time? 27:22 Shouldn't churches try to protect themselves? 27:24 You've got money floating around, you've got people 27:26 who are walking around, and those kinds of things. 27:28 That seems like a very vulnerable time in the service 27:30 when something could happen that could be disastrous. 27:32 And it's easily, quickly done, because we're 27:35 not prepared for that. 27:36 And another school that I was director of safety at, 27:40 what we did after the offering was taken 27:42 it was taken to a count room. 27:43 And then once it was locked in the bag we actually transported 27:47 it to the bank with the deacon; put it in the overnight, 27:50 so therefore it was off the premises. 27:52 Off the premises, yes. 27:53 This is after we came in and found the safe in the treasurers 27:55 office pried from the wall. Right. 27:58 So that was an indicator; okay it's time to make change. 28:00 Make change, yes, yes, yes. 28:02 So it's a real vulnerable time. 28:04 So you want to get that money off the premises, to the bank, 28:06 as quickly as possible. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. 28:09 Now some of the incidents that we have looked at though over 28:12 history have been maybe an estranged husband coming, 28:17 or someone who had a grudge against someone at the church, 28:22 and those types of people. 28:24 What can you do to protect yourself from 28:27 that type of situation? 28:29 What we've recommended in the past is that if you have, 28:32 or are dealing with a situation like that to get a personal 28:34 order of protection, or to get a, there's a restraining order, 28:41 and then work with the local law enforcement, let your deacons 28:44 know what a person looks like, that says you can't be within X 28:47 amount of feet from this person. 28:48 And then get local law enforcement involved so that 28:51 they're aware that you're attending a certain church 28:53 at a certain time, so they could be prepared. 28:56 And most agencies have a watch list of sorts, and people can 28:59 request to be put on their for different reasons. 29:01 And that comes up. 29:03 You know, this person goes to church here, and they have an 29:05 issue going out with an ex-spouse, and be aware of it. 29:11 And now there's another question that comes up, and as a church 29:16 we're trying to win people. 29:18 We're trying to bring in the lost and help them. 29:21 How would you handle, say for instance, someone who is a 29:28 sexual predator who is on a sexual predator list, 29:32 but they start coming to your church? 29:34 How would you handle that? 29:37 We've allowed that in the past, but they had to have another 29:42 person, such as a guardian, a personal who would be 29:44 responsible for them that would partner with them from the time 29:47 that they entered the property, until after 29:49 the service was over, and then they would escort that person. 29:52 But there was a signed agreement that said, I will be with this 29:55 individual the entire time they are on your property. 29:58 Right, and we likewise in one of the churches that I pastored 30:03 had that very same thing. 30:05 And it worked very well. 30:06 And the person was obedient to the agreement. 30:11 And so that worked out well. 30:13 Yeah. Here's a question then, because you're on a college 30:15 campus. You're dealing with young people. 30:17 Do the rules of engagement vary much when you're dealing with 30:20 a church population, which older more subject to the wrong 30:24 people, and then college campus, you've got young people, 30:27 you've got people who are away from home who don't know, 30:30 I mean we can't send everybody, I guess we could, 30:33 through metal detectors. 30:34 You don't want to do. 30:35 That's kind of a turn off. 30:37 How do you begin to make your population aware of the dangers 30:41 that are around them so that their heads are up 30:44 and their eyes are moving all the time? 30:46 Particularly when you've got young people, 30:47 and you've got so many as on a college campus setting. 30:50 Sure. To put up firearm free zone signs to educate the 30:55 students that the law is clear as far as a student 30:58 on a college campus. 30:59 In the state of Tennessee you cannot have a firearm in the 31:02 dorm, in your car, etcetera. 31:04 You cannot have that. 31:05 So educating them to what the requirements are, 31:07 then partnering with the deans, and anyone else that we can 31:11 partner to reinforce that information to do that. 31:14 And, unfortunately, sometimes people will take advantage of 31:16 that and then they get caught. 31:18 And then that's where local law enforcement comes in, 31:20 and an arrest is made, and charges are filed, 31:24 and we've got to go that way. 31:26 It's difficult for young people to purchase a firearm for the 31:30 amount of money that they cost and not have it close to them. 31:33 It's very difficult, and it's a challenging thing, 31:36 and more and more people are... 31:38 We're finding more and more people... 31:39 I mean look at what the gun sales have happened, 31:42 and how they've soared, and ammunition has been going up in 31:44 price, and harder and harder to find. 31:46 So they're going somewhere. 31:48 So we try to be vigilant in our areas of making sure that we get 31:53 the education out, and then just, like I said, partner with 31:56 as many as we possibly can. 31:57 And if a situation arises deal with it as quickly as possible. 32:01 Let me ask this question, Jim, and forgive me. 32:03 When I send my child to school, off to college, does the school 32:08 maintain or have the right to search their room? 32:13 Can they legally do that if they suspect something, 32:15 or do they fall into kind of the wider set of laws? 32:19 I send my child to Southern; something is suspected, 32:23 they call a general room search. 32:25 Does the school have the right to do that? 32:26 Can they go in and search rooms? 32:28 Yes, they can. When they signed the admittance form to come to 32:33 the school, it says that it can be searched. 32:35 Now we try to do that when there is only probable cause. 32:38 We don't just come and do random searches. 32:40 Now at Southern what we do is we get the dean's to participate. 32:43 So they actually are the ones that go in and do the search, 32:45 and then our officers observe, so that anything that is found 32:49 is not compromised from an evidence standpoint. I see. 32:51 And then if there is an illegal issue there than we contact 32:53 the police department. 32:55 They come in and they take over from there. 32:57 Thank God we have not had any major shooting incident's on any 33:01 of our campuses that I know of. 33:03 But you're saying guns and students, that a no no. 33:06 That's just can't happen. 33:08 Correct, correct. Okay. 33:10 Alright, very, very good. 33:11 One thing to mention with regards to dean's, 33:14 and interaction with students, and with the... 33:17 I'm an Adventist. I've been one my entire life. 33:19 The, you know, the trend is, you know, in the schools 33:23 they try to give everyone a second chance, or look the other 33:25 way, or you deal with things internally. 33:27 But the culture we're getting into now, especially with all 33:30 the violence everyone's exposed to, and video games 33:32 that are very popular that a lot of people play. 33:35 I don't let my kids play any of them, but you get this, 33:39 you've got so much more you have to watch for, 33:42 and things that you might observe as a dean. 33:44 Don't hesitate to make a note of that. 33:47 And you don't have to involve the police with everything, 33:48 but if you see something that seems off, 33:51 bring it to someone's attention. 33:52 Some of these things that have happened in the recent years 33:54 could be avoided if people had just stepped up instead of 33:57 just, Oh, it will be okay. 33:58 I mean it's a different time. 34:00 You know, people are not, a lot of people are not thinking 34:02 good thoughts, and at the student level the deans are the 34:06 one's that are an actor, and to see where they live. 34:07 They see how they conduct themselves when they're not in 34:11 class, and they may be a different person in the dorm 34:12 than when they're in class. 34:14 Things like that keep me on. 34:15 Things like that can be a precursor, 34:16 and something to keep in touch with. 34:18 You know, we talk about this second chance culture, 34:21 and, of course, having a pastoral heart, 34:23 talk to me just a second, gentlemen. 34:25 There are certain things that you don't really have an option. 34:29 They have to be reported. 34:30 What are those kinds of things? 34:32 You know, if I see this, I gotta report this. 34:34 This is not, Oh well, okay, we'll just keep this between us, 34:36 but there are certain things I know that have to be reported. 34:38 What are those kinds of things? 34:40 I know ours vary some from local law enforcement. 34:43 We're bound by Cleary laws, which we have to report on 34:46 several different categories such as rape, 34:48 murder, thefts, etcetera, that type of thing that we have to 34:52 put out there for people to be able to go on the web and look 34:55 and see what our crime rate and base is. 34:57 Now law enforcement obviously has a different... 35:00 It can be a lot less of a standard than the school would 35:03 have, I would think, because unless it's an actual crime 35:05 you're observing you really have no burden to take it 35:07 to law enforcement. 35:08 Okay, okay. If you're getting... 35:10 When a student says someone is harassing me. 35:12 I'm getting innuendos, maybe touching some kind of thing, 35:15 can I just say, Let's bring the two kids together. 35:17 We'll sit down and we'll talk about it 35:19 and just let it end there. 35:20 Does that have to be reported? 35:21 It is to be reported. 35:23 That is one of the Cleary reportable... 35:24 And we have to report it as it's given to us. 35:27 So, therefore, if a person comes in and says, 35:29 This just happened to me. 35:31 We have to take that at face value. Okay. 35:32 Now what we can do, we report that as a statistic. 35:35 We have the police department come out. 35:37 Their criminal investigation division can go back and now 35:39 interview both parties. 35:41 If they find out that the complaint was unfounded 35:43 the statistic can be removed, but it can only come from 35:46 a bonifide police department at this point in time to be able to 35:48 remove that statistic. Okay. 35:50 But there's more of that coming with date situations, 35:53 with date rape, with harassments, 35:55 to even through electronics. 35:57 Yeah. See, that's where I'm going. 35:58 That a professor or an administrator doesn't have the 36:01 privilege to say, Okay, well he's a nice guy. 36:03 We won't say anything. 36:05 We'll just kind of keep this between ourselves. 36:06 We'll pray about it and just let it go. 36:07 But if someone makes an aggressive move 36:09 that's got to be reported. 36:11 It does. Yeah. And we're actually, not just at Southern, 36:13 but across the country universities are reporting 36:17 more and more of the cyber stuff where one person may not 36:21 even be in the same state. Yes. 36:23 And so there is an harassment aspect, and an intimidation 36:26 that's coming from that, which makes a student feel very 36:28 uncomfortable, because they never know 36:29 if they could show up. 36:31 They could walk outside their dorm room 36:32 and here is this person. 36:34 Yeah, yeah, yeah, wow. 36:35 You know, it's amazing that things now that are reported 36:39 when we went to school, or at least when I went to school, 36:43 and these were things that were very definitely handled 36:49 all by the campus itself, and were never reported 36:53 to any law enforcement at all. 36:56 Although I will say that where I went to school my early 37:00 college years was at Southwestern. 37:02 They did have a marshal in the city, which was also 37:07 kind of took care of the school security, so to speak. 37:12 And it was sort of the beginning of what we see now, 37:16 which is far more a full fledged police department 37:20 in that particular area, and also campus security as well. 37:26 So in the old days it was just one of the students was 37:29 a night watchman; went around and plugged 37:31 the different places. 37:33 And we used to try to pull jokes on him and scare him. 37:36 We succeeded a few times. 37:38 But it's such a different world that we're living in now. 37:42 And so many times some of us want to keep thinking in terms 37:48 of the world in which we used to live in, 37:50 and it's really not that way anymore. Yeah. 37:54 And, by the way, Officer Hurd talked about being an 37:57 Adventist all of his life. 37:59 I can vouch for that because his father, I knew his father 38:03 back in New England, and he came to my church 38:08 there in Connecticut. 38:10 And I appreciated him very much, and happy to hear that he's 38:15 still in good health. 38:16 Yep, he's doing good. 38:17 When we talk about, and I remember growing up having 38:23 fire safety drills. 38:24 They kind of annoyed us. 38:25 You have to get up, and line up and, you know, 38:27 file a single file; that kind of thing. 38:28 And I suspect that's something that schools 38:32 should do at all levels. 38:33 Should churches even do that also? 38:34 I, and to be honest with you, I can't remember anyone of the 38:36 seven or so churches I pastored, us ever having a fire drill. 38:40 You know we come to church and pray and sing and go home. 38:43 We never did that. Is that something that schools and 38:45 churches should do even to this day? 38:47 I personally believe that you have an obligation to a 38:50 congregation to be able to do that. 38:52 And that's from personal experiences where we actually 38:55 had a fire at one of the churches that I was attending. 38:57 And when we opened up the doors there was smoke going in. 39:00 And so stood up and said, There's a fire in the building. 39:03 We need to evacuate. 39:05 Everybody kept paying attention to the front. 39:06 Finally, until the Lord blessed me with a good set of lungs. 39:09 I went to the front and said, The building is on fire. 39:12 Move outside. Do it now! 39:14 That grabbed people's attention, and they started moving out. 39:17 But, I mean, the entire basement was full of smoke. 39:19 There actually was a fire in the building. 39:22 And so we don't think about that at church, 39:24 as far as that goes, but how do you have to evacuate people? 39:28 Where are you going to evacuate them? 39:30 A lot of times we want to evacuate them 39:31 to the parking lot. 39:33 That's maybe where our Fire Department's coming. 39:34 So it's important to partner with the Fire Department 39:36 and say, Okay, if you have to do a full congregation evacuation 39:40 where do you want us to go, so therefore we're not in the way? 39:44 Same thing with severe weather. 39:45 If you have tornados or severe thunder storms, if there's a 39:49 basement to the church how are you going to get that number 39:52 of people safely downstairs in the shortest amount of time? 39:55 So a pre-plan needs to be put in place that covers all hazards, 39:59 and then practice that plan. 40:01 That's excellent. I don't know if you've ever been pastoring 40:05 in a church that caught on fire, but we've tried to catch them 40:09 on fire spiritually. 40:11 But I actually, in Dallas the church caught on fire. 40:16 It was an electrical fire. 40:18 And all of a sudden one of the deacons came in and ordered an 40:24 evacuation, and I'm preaching. 40:26 Sometime I'll show you that video. 40:29 It's quite humorous. 40:31 I'm trying to hold them for a little bit longer to finish my 40:34 sermon, and he's trying to get them out. 40:38 But we did have to finally evacuate. 40:41 But it was an electrical fire coming to the building. 40:44 Actually the building itself wasn't on fire, but it burned 40:48 a couple of cars out in the parking lot. 40:50 And it was quite an incident. 40:53 Things like this happen. 40:55 And just because you've gone to church and it hasn't happened 40:59 doesn't mean that it won't. 41:01 And so we have to be prepared for these things. 41:06 We're talking, even this morning, about a fire drill 41:09 here in our office, because we honestly, I believe, 41:14 have some areas of concern here for evacuation. 41:19 And we want to make sure that we're doing that. 41:21 What about the personal safety of individuals at our churches? 41:28 Our personal safety, again it goes back to everybody being 41:32 responsible for their own. 41:33 But some of the concerns that have come to my attention over 41:37 the years is that not necessarily during church 41:40 services, but when church services are being offered 41:43 to people such as 2:00 o'clock in the afternoon and someone 41:46 comes in that's disturbed, or is feeling the need to pray. 41:50 A lot of times the people that they're praying with are tucked 41:52 into a cubby office somewhere way back in the middle of 41:55 nowhere, so to speak, or our office staff is sitting there 41:59 and there's nowhere for them to go. 42:01 So we need to start looking at how we can protect them. 42:04 And it's the balance between being protected and aware, 42:07 but not becoming paranoid before we take things too far. 42:10 So there has to be that balance. 42:12 But there are a lot of times that there may be only one or 42:14 two people in a church. 42:16 And there, unfortunately, have been attacks in churches 42:18 where people have been hurt, you know, things stolen 42:21 even during the day. 42:23 And I know from some of my experience robberies in homes 42:26 have actually changed to where now they're hoping to catch you 42:29 at home, where before they always wanted you out. 42:32 Well, if I catch you at home in a vulnerable position 42:34 you'll give me your valuables. 42:36 I'll be out the door quicker. 42:37 Yeah, there are a lot more of them during hours when people 42:42 are home, nighttime when people are sleeping, 42:44 or just coming home from work, so it's not just 42:47 abandoned houses anymore. 42:49 So it's more of an armed robbery type thing rather 42:52 than just a break in. 42:54 Kind of like a home invasion. 42:55 Home invasion, wow! 42:57 The same things we were talking about the offering. 42:58 It's when it's available, because you're going to give 43:01 that up versus hazarding somebody's life. 43:03 Understood, yeah, yeah. 43:05 When I got here I noticed one thing about the 43:06 principle offices here. 43:08 All of them have windows in it. 43:09 There are no closed offices that don't have windows. 43:12 Even brother Gilley's office has a window in it. 43:15 I think that's a wise thing that there's never 43:17 this total seclusion. 43:18 When I was counseling in New York I always 43:21 left my door unlocked. 43:22 You know, you go in and lock the door kind of thing? 43:24 It sends the wrong message, plus it opens you up to a lot 43:27 of stuff that you don't need. 43:28 So little things like that I think are wise. 43:31 We've got a video. It's got a little strong content, 43:34 so we kind of need to warn our audience that it's coming, 43:36 but I think it's something you wanted to show. 43:38 Before we lose our hour here I think we should go to that, 43:41 and then we can kind of reflect on it after we watch it. 43:44 So let's go to that video just now. 43:53 It may feel like just another day at the office, 43:57 but occasionally life feels more like an action 44:01 movie than reality. 44:07 The authorities are working hard to protect you, 44:10 and to protect our public spaces. 44:23 But sometimes bad people do bad things. 44:30 Their motivations are different. 44:36 The warning signs may vary, but the devastating 44:41 effects are the same. 44:46 And, unfortunately, you need to be prepared for the worst. 45:07 If you are to ever find yourself in the middle of an active 45:10 shooter event your survival may depend on whether 45:13 or not you have a plan. 45:15 The plan doesn't have to be complicated. 45:20 There are three things you could do that make a difference: 45:24 run, hide, fight. First and foremost, if you can get out do. 45:34 Always try an escape or evacuate even when 45:37 others insist on staying. 45:39 Encourage others to leave with you, but don't let them slow you 45:43 down with indecision. 45:49 Remember what's important: you, not your stuff. 45:53 Leave your belongings behind and try to find 45:56 a way to get out safely. 46:00 Trying to get yourself out of harms way needs to be your 46:02 number one priority. 46:08 Once you are out of the line of fire, try to prevent others 46:11 from walking into the danger zone and call 911. 46:35 If you can't get out safely, you need to find a place to hide. 46:51 Act quickly and quietly. 46:54 Try to secure your hiding place the best you can. 46:57 Turn out lights, and if possible remember to lock doors. 47:04 Silence your ringer and vibration mode 47:06 on your cell phone. 47:09 And if you can't find a safe room or closet, try to conceal 47:14 yourself behind large objects that may protect you. 47:18 Do your best to remain quiet and calm. 47:35 As a last resort, if your life is at risk, whether you are 47:40 alone or working together as a group fight. 47:45 Act with aggression. 47:46 Improvise weapons. 47:48 Disarm him, and commit to taking the shooter 47:52 down, no matter what. 48:09 Try to be aware of your environment. 48:12 Always have an exit plan. 48:14 Know that in an incident like this victims are 48:17 generally chosen randomly. 48:19 The event is unpredictable and may evolve quickly. 48:26 The first responders on the scene are not there to evacuate 48:29 or tend to the injured. 48:31 They are well trained and are there to stop the shooter. 48:51 Your actions can make a difference for your 48:54 safety and survival. 48:55 Be aware and be prepared. 49:00 And if you find yourself facing an active shooter, 49:02 there are three key things you need to remember 49:05 to survive: run, hide, fight. 49:29 Excellent! You know the thing that jumps out at you is 49:32 that fight is last. 49:33 Yeah, it's last not first. 49:35 Last, right. Don't go and try to be a cowboy or hero. 49:37 That's last. And I think that's very, very important. 49:40 Yeah, and you know it's too bad that we have to actually look 49:45 at this type of thing today, but we do. 49:48 And I applaud those who put that video together, 49:51 because it is going to save lives. It is. 49:55 You know a plan of action, should the unthinkable take 50:00 place... If enough people can look at this, see this, 50:04 they realize first of all run. 50:07 You've got to know when to hold em, know when to fold em. 50:10 Know when to walk away, and know when to run. 50:12 And there's a time to run. 50:14 And then second was hide. 50:18 And if you can't run then hide. 50:21 And if you can't even then if you can't stay away from them 50:25 resist, because it's amazing how the resistance to some of 50:32 these individuals stops them. 50:34 They are not accustomed to it. 50:36 And they weren't planning on it, I think in many cases. 50:41 So the resistance in many cases pays off for people. 50:47 If they cannot run, cannot hide, then to resist. 50:51 Officer Hurd, you talked about, when we were watching the video, 50:53 you mentioned it's a good thing to invite law enforcement 50:56 into your building, maybe to give seminars, have lectures. 51:01 What would they do when they come? 51:03 Well, most in an active shooter situation, or any type of 51:07 shooting the police are going to get dispatched. 51:09 And if it's something like a shooter on a campus, 51:11 or a larger thing, there's going to be, 51:13 most areas have a team of some sort. 51:16 You know, swat team, sort team, a special 51:18 operations team of some sort. 51:20 We look forward to opportunities to train. 51:23 And if we're invited to a church, or to a school like 51:26 Southern University, we've been very familiar with the campus, 51:29 and it gives us an opportunity to make pre-plans. 51:32 You know, map out the campus, learn your fire safety plans, 51:36 your exit plans, where critical people are. 51:39 If you have the opportunity, if you're the head of the school, 51:43 or Administrator, or the head of a church, 51:45 invite the local law enforcement. 51:46 You'll be surprised most of them will be very happy to come 51:49 see your facility, and become familiar with the procedures, 51:51 so they can better help you in the event of an emergency. 51:53 So call them before you need them. 51:55 Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 51:57 Great idea. Alright. 52:01 We didn't talk about or touch on mental health. 52:04 Walk us through what you have in mind there. 52:10 For us, again, we partner with the local police department 52:13 to make sure that any threat that they perceive from the 52:16 community as well as now on campus, we have a group that 52:19 gets together that looks at behavior 52:22 that could be disturbing. 52:23 And what we're doing, we talked about earlier in the show, 52:26 is that it needs to be, this needs to be brought up, 52:29 then another thing needs to be brought up. 52:31 Because if I act out in my office, 52:33 it's looked at as a single event. 52:34 But then if I'm at another department on campus 52:37 and I act out, and if it's a behavior that continues to 52:39 deteriorate those are indicators. 52:42 And at least we need to get together and look. 52:44 And then we can talk with the police department and say, 52:46 Have you had any interactions with this individual? 52:49 And it helps us at least attempt to isolate potential threats 52:54 prior to them happening. 52:56 We work with our counselors on the campus, as well as going 52:59 back to the dean's, etc. 53:01 Yeah, yeah. I'll tell you what we did when I was in New York. 53:03 We actually adopted the local police precinct. 53:05 We had adoption services. 53:06 We had adoption papers. 53:08 We brought them in to service. 53:09 We had them walk through our building. 53:11 We adopted the local 128 Precinct: 250 guys. 53:15 We had all their birth days. 53:16 We had them in the church a lot. 53:18 And it really worked out well to have them in our building. 53:21 We were in their building a lot. 53:22 And we adopted them. 53:23 We formally adopted the local police precinct. 53:25 I think that's an excellent plan. 53:27 It really is. Well listen, we want you to be able to 53:32 get a copy of this. 53:34 And you can get it from us, or we have an address roll 53:37 if you'd like to contact Kevin Penrod or Officer Hurd 53:43 this is how you can do it: 54:32 Gentlemen, before we just sort of lose you, 54:34 answer this question for me. 54:36 I'm a pastor, I'm a school board chairman, 54:38 I'm a principal of a school. 54:40 What is the one thing, or two things that I can do to be most 54:43 effective to change the culture of my church so that we are 54:46 aware of the things that are going on around us? 54:47 I would say, 1. Be honest with your congregation, 54:52 and get the feedback from them. 54:54 The other thing that has just been put together through 54:57 Dale Hodges at Andrews University. 55:00 He's the founder and president of PASS. 55:02 And that is Professional Adventist Safety and Security. 55:06 It's a group that's now met three years in a row. 55:08 If you go to the General Conference web page and 55:10 type in pass, you'll get led to a web page that describes 55:14 what the entity is, and it is for all Seventh-day Adventists. 55:18 It can be churches, health care, schools, etc., 55:22 and it's the best practices. 55:24 And we've just finished our third conference, 55:26 and we're growing quickly. 55:29 And the idea is to get out the word, and a partnership with 55:33 everybody that we possibly can inside the church, 55:35 or inside the religion, as far as reaching everybody on 55:39 having the best practices possible. 55:40 So that is a brand new thing. 55:43 We're happy that the General Conference has jumped on board 55:46 and supports, and there's information on that webpage too 55:50 that is updated on a consistent basis for that. 55:53 Now there are others that could be a part of that, 55:56 other churches, other denominations, other schools. 55:59 Absolutely, yes. 56:00 It's not limited only to Seventh-day Adventists? 56:01 Correct, at this point. 56:03 Right. So now what are they going to find when 56:06 they go to that site? 56:07 They're going to find talking points, safety tips. 56:11 We're going to be putting out DVD's on best practices, 56:15 a networking of policy sharing with other... 56:19 Right now it's been schools that have been the 56:20 leaders in this so far. 56:22 But like disaster plans, or evacuation plans, 56:25 we'd be willing to share our information with somebody 56:27 so they don't have to re-create the wheel. 56:29 They can also just go ahead and utilize what we've tested, 56:32 and put that in to. 56:33 And that would help, I would think, a lot of our church 56:35 people from their security standpoint of not having to make 56:38 up something if they already have a pre-made plan that 56:40 they can put into place. 56:42 They may have to tweak it some to fit their needs. 56:44 We recommend highly that you go to the site. 56:49 Get that information. 56:51 We also are offering this DVD absolutely free to any church, 56:56 or school that would like to have it. 56:59 Any organization that has people that come and are part of it 57:05 like a school, or church, or fellowship; 57:08 we want you to have this. 57:10 And it's a place to start. 57:12 We realize that this DVD is not the answer; not the end. 57:16 But we are trying to create awareness, so that you do seek 57:21 professional help, professional answers. 57:24 And we're so happy that Kevin, you could be with us, 57:29 and Officer Hurd, you could be with us. 57:31 Thank you so much for coming and sharing. 57:35 Because we believe that this is going to save lives. 57:38 And, by the way, we thank you for supporting 3ABN. 57:43 And we just pray that you will keep on keeping on with Jesus 57:47 Christ our Lord, He's our God, He's our Savior. 57:50 He's the One that sustains us, and He is the One 57:54 that will be with us. 57:55 May God bless you. |
Revised 2016-12-07