Welcome to A
Multitude of Counselors.
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We are so thankful
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that you've come
to our program today.
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We are a show
designed to help us
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all better
understand mental health,
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and point to solutions
where we can find freedom,
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and hope, and healing in Jesus,
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and I have a wonderful
panel of experts here today.
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Every single one of
them is in the field,
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helping people in one way
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or another through counseling
and that type of intervention.
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So I want to
introduce them at this time.
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First we have Jean Wright,
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he's from my
hometown at Philadelphia,
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in fact he goes to my church.
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And he is the director
of the Behavioral Health
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and Justice Services
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in the
Behavioral Health Department
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in Philadelphia.
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He's got the
longest title of anyone.
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He's an author and
travels a lot with that book,
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if I'm correct,
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'cause he's not
in church every week,
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I noticed.
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And he has a
counseling practice,
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and Dr. Jean also
likes to onside work
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in community
forgiveness and restoration.
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We're gonna hear
about some of that today.
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We also have Shelly
Wiggins, she's from Michigan,
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she has a private...
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she's an LPC,
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License Profession
Counselor like I am.
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She has a private practice
called Driftwood Counseling,
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through which she
helps individuals, families,
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couples using both talk therapy
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and equine therapy,
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and we're gonna be talking about
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that a little bit today as well.
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We've also got Paul Coneff,
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he's from the
great state of Texas,
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which I understand
your wife doesn't think
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it's so great.
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But I think it's great,
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and I think it's
great that you're here,
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and Paul is marriage
and family therapist,
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and Paul runs a discipleship
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and prayer ministry
called Straight 2 The Heart.
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He's got a little
logo on his shirt,
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and he does this
amazing type of counseling
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that leads people that
have suffered loss and abuse
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and addiction to the cross
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and helps them come
to terms with their needs
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through seeing
Jesus in need really.
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Beautiful program,
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he's got so deep
and so meaningful.
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And my co-host Rob Davidson,
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who has private
practice in the DC area,
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works with me in
Abide Counseling Network
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and likes to
help all kinds people
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in all kinds of ways
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but he has kind of specialty
in the area of helping men
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built servant leadership
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and biblical
manhood and integrity.
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So, so thankful that
each one of you are here.
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Our subject today is abuse.
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We're gonna be
talking about abuse.
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Let me give just some
bullet point facts here.
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The definition of
abuse very simple,
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it's to treat something
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or someone with
cruelty or violence.
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So there are
different types of abuse
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in which we can engage
or in which we can suffer.
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That includes
physical, sexual, verbal,
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emotional,
financial, and negligence.
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What about the
prevalence of abuse.
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Well, there's lots
of statistics out there,
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let me just give a couple,
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because when we're
talking about abuse,
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it's a very broad subject.
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But one in three
women globally are raped,
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abused, or forced into sex,
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isn't that shocking,
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that's a global statistic.
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What about child abuse?
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Okay, this is
child abuse in the US.
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One study suggests,
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"25 percent of
children are verbally abused,
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15 percent physically abused,
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and 12 percent sexually abused."
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Wow, high stats
there and think about it,
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how many children
don't report abuse,
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because after all the
home of origin is there what,
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they're normal.
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They don't even know
what to label this thing,
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they think
that's just how life is.
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And so very few women...
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Jen, can I just
interject here quickly,
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these statistics that
you're pointing out right now,
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these are the very
things that have propelled me
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to help men to become aware
what's happening to society,
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to families, and
then to be intentional,
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to be intentional
about growing in courage,
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because we knew
that iron sharpens iron.
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So as the good men can
come alongside good men,
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you know, we can do
something about this.
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We can make an impact.
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That's right. Amen.
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I really, really,
really appreciate that.
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Oops.
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Causes of abuse,
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one of the biggest causes
of course is history of abuse,
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people that are abused
are more inclined to abuse.
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However, it's not a
straightforward situation,
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one-third to two-thirds
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of those raised in abusive homes
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do not go on to abuse,
so there are exceptions,
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so that real glowing exceptions,
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and we are thankful for those.
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Other
contributors are substance use,
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overwork,
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lack of social support,
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anything that stresses out
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the family system
is going to create
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greater likelihood for abuse.
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Prognosis,
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what are the hopes on both ends?
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Can people recover
from the effects of abuse?
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And can people recover
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from the habit
of abusing others,
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and the answer to
those questions is what?
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Amen and amen.
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A resounding yes.
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There is hope in
Jesus for both the abuser
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and the abused.
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Treatments for abusers,
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even sex offenders
respond to counseling
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and group
treatment and so forth.
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I heard for years and years,
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sex offenders will never change,
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people with pedophile tendencies
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that act out on children,
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they never change, not true.
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They can be
treated, they can be helped,
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particularly if there
is early intervention.
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So of course
counseling group therapy,
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psycho education can help,
and this brings me to you guys,
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what have you found helps,
either the abuser or abused,
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let's talk about
the abused first.
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Shelly, what
about equine therapy?
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Well, I mentioned
before in previous program
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that equine therapy
really helps assist a client
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that is very non-verbal.
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When they're
fearful of opening up
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and telling their story,
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they know that
something has to get told,
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but they don't
know where to start,
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and quite honestly,
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they're too afraid.
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But in the process of
just being with the horse,
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we might do some
brushing and grooming,
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and during that time,
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myself and my co-facilitator
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we're just to be
there with the client
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and just to listen.
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We might ask one
or two questions,
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and it's amazing,
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the story just starts to unfold,
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because they're
connected to something
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that is there for them,
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not just the horse
but to facilitators too,
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just to help
bring out their story.
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We were talking
about this yesterday
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a little bit how
God didn't create us
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just with human
beings in the garden there.
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It could have
been nice flower garden
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and fruit trees, and humans,
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but he has all
these animals in creation.
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They are there for purpose,
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and you're really
helping us to see that.
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So anything else
that you guys have used
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with people that
have suffered abuse
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that has been effective.
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Paul, I could see you
getting ready to say something.
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So I want to start with people
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being able to
listen to their stories,
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we can have a connection,
because they've been abused.
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And when they have
negative experiences like abuse,
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they often develop negative
thoughts about themselves.
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They also develop
ways to protect themselves
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from pain again,
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which end up in
negative patterns
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of self
protection and addictions.
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So as we begin to
connect and share,
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I want to help them identify
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what their
negative thoughts are,
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I call it Christ centered
cognitive behavioral therapy,
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because we're gonna look at
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what those thought patterns are.
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And then as we identify them,
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we want to share
with them a Jesus,
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who suffered to fulfill prophecy
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to be tempted like them,
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to identify with them.
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So we talk about
how he was alone,
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abandoned, betrayed,
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stripped naked,
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physically, verbally,
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and mentally violated
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by groups of men
empower over him,
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beating him, spitting on him.
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He experienced racial prejudice,
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political prejudice,
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religious prejudice,
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He's going through
all of this abusive...
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The gamut of human experience.
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And then he's tempted
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with numbness pain on the cross.
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Then he is, what
was the last thing?
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Tempted to numbness
pain on the cross and then...
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Numbness pain.
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Yeah, like we're
tempted to numb our pain
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when we're in pain.
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And he cries out,
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"Oh, my God, my
God, why you've forsaken,
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why you've forsaken me?"
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And then the
support system is gone...
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Yeah, so when I'm
able to connect their story
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with Jesus' story,
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it gives them a bigger picture
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and they can kind of
breathe a sight of relief
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and begin to go
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"Oh, somebody understands,
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God is not just up there
in heaven playing a harp,
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he actually has gone
through my experiences,
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he can relate to me
and identify with me."
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That is so powerful.
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So that you
really are effectively
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creating a bond of empathy
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between the abused
and Jesus the abused,
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and helping them realize that
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there's fellowship in
their sufferings really.
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Yes.
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And not only that,
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but they're having
fellowship with the Christ
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in his sufferings,
which is a weighty honor
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from what I understand,
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I think it dignifies
what they went through.
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It doesn't minimize the fact
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that they were
sinned against or abused,
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but it maximizes God's
grace and understanding
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and then when we
take that information
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and we begin praying, dear God,
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thank you that
Jesus was abandoned,
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betrayed, abused,
whatever their experience was,
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I work a lot with sex
abuse, so he was stripped naked,
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physically,
verbally, mentally abused,
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so he could
identify with me in my pain,
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tempted with my
negative thoughts to rise,
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would be risen from the
dead to heal me and set me free,
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so we're praying
scripture, that he heal me,
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set me free,
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so I can receive my
truest deepest identity
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as your son or daughter.
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It begin, the Holy Spirit begins
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to rewire the neurological
pathways of their brain.
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It's a process still
and yet week after week,
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they're dealing
with pain in a way that
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they're getting
hope in seeing themselves
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in a new way through God's eyes.
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Oh, that is so powerful.
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Now you mentioned
Christ centered cognitive
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behavioral therapy,
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can you give us a bullet point
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idea of the
difference between generic,
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cognitive behavioral
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and what you're
calling Christ centered?
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You know, cognitive
behavioral looks at the thoughts
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and behaviors.
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So we want to look
at this thought life
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because
thoughts create feelings,
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and then we have behaviors
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so what we want to do
is bring Christ into that,
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so Christ is the power source,
He's the one changing us.
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I'm not trying to
convince myself that I'm safe,
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that I'm good
enough, that I'm accepted,
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I'm actually
receiving His acceptance
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to safety of His presence.
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And that's an
essential difference,
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so you're saying I'm not
like conjuring up within myself
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to convince myself of the truth.
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I'm actually receiving the truth
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that Jesus gives me
of all those things.
00:10:34.80\00:10:36.60
Yes.
00:10:36.63\00:10:37.97
And based on his experience
that He went through it
00:10:38.00\00:10:39.43
and He's already gotten victory.
00:10:39.47\00:10:40.94
So we're receiving
His truth and His victory.
00:10:40.97\00:10:43.54
And so Christ
centered cognitive behavioral
00:10:43.57\00:10:45.91
would be
cultivating a relationship
00:10:45.94\00:10:47.38
not only with
myself but with Jesus
00:10:47.41\00:10:49.44
where as generic
cognitive behavioral
00:10:49.48\00:10:51.25
would be just between me and me.
00:10:51.28\00:10:52.61
Yes.
00:10:52.65\00:10:53.98
Which is fine,
00:10:54.02\00:10:55.35
we have a
relationship with ourselves
00:10:55.38\00:10:56.72
but how much better to
be engaging in a therapy
00:10:56.75\00:10:58.99
that actually
connect me with the divine,
00:10:59.02\00:11:00.52
that's powerful.
00:11:00.56\00:11:01.89
Doesn't that bring to
light the scripture that says,
00:11:01.92\00:11:04.13
"The truth will set you free."
00:11:04.16\00:11:06.19
That's just brings
that to light, thank you.
00:11:06.23\00:11:08.76
And that truth is in the context
00:11:08.80\00:11:10.13
of a relationship,
00:11:10.17\00:11:11.50
which we've emphasized
00:11:11.53\00:11:12.87
in a number of the
programs here is that,
00:11:12.90\00:11:14.24
it's in the context of
a relationship with God
00:11:14.27\00:11:15.60
and with other caring people.
00:11:15.64\00:11:16.97
It's not just
doctrinal information...
00:11:17.01\00:11:19.04
That's right, amen.
00:11:19.07\00:11:20.61
So I want to
flip this a little bit
00:11:20.64\00:11:22.38
and I want to ask you,
00:11:22.41\00:11:23.81
Jean, to talk a little bit about
00:11:23.85\00:11:25.48
treating the other
side of the abuse problem,
00:11:25.51\00:11:28.02
because I know you work
with community forgiveness
00:11:28.05\00:11:30.19
and restoration and
in various capacities
00:11:30.22\00:11:33.15
that puts you in
touch with offenders,
00:11:33.19\00:11:35.42
people that have
perpetrated abuse.
00:11:35.46\00:11:37.13
What do you have
to say about that?
00:11:37.16\00:11:38.49
Should we, should we associate
with those people or what?
00:11:38.53\00:11:41.40
Absolutely, I think
we said it off the air
00:11:41.43\00:11:44.47
when we talked
about the type of folks
00:11:44.50\00:11:46.10
that Jesus associated with,
00:11:46.13\00:11:47.87
and if He hadn't how
any of us would be saved
00:11:47.90\00:11:50.17
and how any of us
would define ourselves
00:11:50.21\00:11:52.37
looking at the cross
as Paul has described,
00:11:52.41\00:11:55.28
and I tend to,
most of the people
00:11:55.31\00:11:57.65
that I see are
still behind bars.
00:11:57.68\00:12:00.18
So we have both
perpetrators of abuse
00:12:00.22\00:12:02.82
that I've seen and we also
have other victims of abuse.
00:12:02.85\00:12:05.45
How do you see,
00:12:05.49\00:12:06.82
you go to the jail and sit
there and talk with people?
00:12:06.86\00:12:08.19
Well, I used to
actually run a program
00:12:08.22\00:12:09.69
for sex offenders specifically
00:12:09.72\00:12:12.06
and so it is difficult for them
00:12:12.09\00:12:14.00
to see themselves as forgivable,
00:12:14.03\00:12:17.20
to see themselves as lovable
00:12:17.23\00:12:19.10
'cause I understand
they have a skewed view
00:12:19.13\00:12:21.60
and
understanding of what love is,
00:12:21.64\00:12:23.07
it's a perverse view of love,
00:12:23.10\00:12:25.01
and oftentimes
they have felt like
00:12:25.04\00:12:26.54
they love their victims
and they use that term a lot.
00:12:26.57\00:12:29.18
So we have to try to
get them to understand
00:12:29.21\00:12:31.45
why that is
perverse in terms of the acts
00:12:31.48\00:12:33.52
and the behavior that
they carried out in that way.
00:12:33.55\00:12:36.79
And so it's a
difficult thing so,
00:12:36.82\00:12:38.99
I think one of the advantages
of what Paul is sharing is that
00:12:39.02\00:12:42.16
it encourages forgiveness.
00:12:42.19\00:12:44.73
It encourages the acceptance
00:12:44.76\00:12:46.33
that someone has
already paid the price
00:12:46.36\00:12:48.50
and that is a key thing
00:12:48.53\00:12:49.86
because these individuals
tend to think that one,
00:12:49.90\00:12:52.10
society is
telling me I'm no good,
00:12:52.13\00:12:53.54
okay.
00:12:53.57\00:12:54.90
My own family is
telling me I'm no good.
00:12:54.94\00:12:56.34
They may have
even rejected them.
00:12:56.37\00:12:58.01
You know they don't get
a lot of visitors, okay.
00:12:58.04\00:13:00.34
They do not get a lot of support
00:13:00.38\00:13:02.14
and so that's one
of the main things,
00:13:02.18\00:13:03.51
so for them to be able to
look at themselves and say,
00:13:03.55\00:13:05.98
"You know, yes, I've
done a horrible thing, "
00:13:06.01\00:13:09.68
and yet I believe that
someone has died for me.
00:13:09.72\00:13:13.76
I believe that the God
of the universe loves me.
00:13:13.79\00:13:16.56
I believe that
00:13:16.59\00:13:17.93
he has demonstrated
that love to others like me
00:13:17.96\00:13:21.30
and so it is a
ability to relate to something
00:13:21.33\00:13:24.63
that they
couldn't relate to before
00:13:24.67\00:13:26.27
and that is so powerful
00:13:26.30\00:13:27.64
because it means,
I am not by myself.
00:13:27.67\00:13:29.54
It means I am not
someone unlovable.
00:13:29.57\00:13:32.44
It means that someone
paid the ultimate price
00:13:32.47\00:13:34.81
of giving the life for me
00:13:34.84\00:13:36.18
and that
resonates with individuals.
00:13:36.21\00:13:38.18
You know, we've really head
on some deep spiritual themes
00:13:38.21\00:13:41.62
during this program and
I just want to say that.
00:13:41.65\00:13:44.59
You know, you can't
really fully disconnect
00:13:44.62\00:13:47.59
psychology from spirituality.
00:13:47.62\00:13:50.16
What's happened in the world
00:13:50.19\00:13:51.76
and to some degree in the church
00:13:51.79\00:13:53.13
is you've got
physical health over here
00:13:53.16\00:13:54.76
and you've got
spirituality over here,
00:13:54.80\00:13:56.73
and there's this
big gap in between
00:13:56.77\00:13:58.23
and then there's
this third category
00:13:58.27\00:13:59.60
in the world
where the world says
00:13:59.63\00:14:00.97
there's this
thing called the psyche.
00:14:01.00\00:14:02.34
But it has nothing to
do with your spirituality,
00:14:02.37\00:14:04.01
you go to a
counselor for your psyche
00:14:04.04\00:14:05.84
and you go to the
pastor for your spirituality,
00:14:05.87\00:14:07.71
and I think that's
naive and small minded
00:14:07.74\00:14:10.81
and reductionist
00:14:10.85\00:14:12.18
because everything is connected.
00:14:12.21\00:14:13.92
I want to say this,
00:14:13.95\00:14:15.28
what has happen in Adventism is
00:14:15.32\00:14:17.59
we have experiences separation
00:14:17.62\00:14:20.02
of the
spiritual and the physical
00:14:20.06\00:14:21.39
and I think in
the process of that,
00:14:21.42\00:14:23.53
we've lost the psychological
00:14:23.56\00:14:25.16
and we haven't really
capitalized on the need
00:14:25.19\00:14:30.53
and the benefits
of helping people
00:14:30.57\00:14:32.93
with psychological
mental health issues.
00:14:32.97\00:14:34.90
Historically John Harvey Kellog
00:14:34.94\00:14:36.97
went this way with the health,
00:14:37.01\00:14:39.34
physical health message,
00:14:39.37\00:14:40.71
the pastors didn't
want to be vegetarian
00:14:40.74\00:14:42.74
and they didn't want to
observe the health message
00:14:42.78\00:14:44.25
and they went this way
and there is this big rift
00:14:44.28\00:14:45.98
and I think
mental health was lost,
00:14:46.01\00:14:47.68
and I think people like us
are trying to bring it back
00:14:47.72\00:14:50.39
and show the connection
between all those things.
00:14:50.42\00:14:52.45
Yes, it's all interrelated.
00:14:52.49\00:14:53.92
That is all interrelated,
00:14:53.96\00:14:55.29
it's just so powerful
00:14:55.32\00:14:56.66
so that's what we're about
00:14:56.69\00:14:58.03
is we're about
rooting and grounding
00:14:58.06\00:14:59.96
human psychology
in biblical principles
00:15:00.00\00:15:01.90
and you guys have
really brought out how,
00:15:01.93\00:15:03.97
you know, God really has this,
00:15:04.00\00:15:05.93
you know, he's got this covered
00:15:05.97\00:15:07.80
and social sciences
do not threaten that.
00:15:07.84\00:15:10.21
You know, we can
study the literature
00:15:10.24\00:15:12.07
and the research
and whatever is biblical
00:15:12.11\00:15:14.01
we can embrace and what
isn't we can leave it aside.
00:15:14.04\00:15:16.41
But we don't want to be
threatened by social sciences.
00:15:16.44\00:15:18.01
But the Bible talks
about the brokenness of life.
00:15:18.05\00:15:19.38
That's right.
00:15:19.41\00:15:20.75
There's all kinds of
incest, sexual abuse,
00:15:20.78\00:15:22.72
murder violence in the Bible.
00:15:22.75\00:15:24.09
That's right.
00:15:24.12\00:15:25.45
And the Bible is addressing
00:15:25.49\00:15:26.82
and I'm thinking
about what Jean said,
00:15:26.86\00:15:28.19
where these guys
listen to what they're saying,
00:15:28.22\00:15:29.56
I'm unforgivable.
00:15:29.59\00:15:30.93
I'm not good enough.
00:15:30.96\00:15:32.29
I'm rejected by
society, God cannot accept me.
00:15:32.33\00:15:34.60
Those are belief systems.
00:15:34.63\00:15:35.96
Yes, yes.
00:15:36.00\00:15:37.33
Was Jesus tempted to believe
00:15:37.37\00:15:38.70
He wasn't accepted by
God at any point in his life?
00:15:38.73\00:15:41.20
Yes, He was. On the cross.
00:15:41.24\00:15:42.80
So can He identify
with the temptation
00:15:42.84\00:15:45.31
and did he take to
death not just their behaviors
00:15:45.34\00:15:47.91
as bad as they were,
00:15:47.94\00:15:49.28
we're not minimizing
their sin, their abuse,
00:15:49.31\00:15:50.65
their perpetrating on others,
00:15:50.68\00:15:53.25
but did He take all
their belief systems
00:15:53.28\00:15:56.15
and their
behaviors into the cross,
00:15:56.18\00:15:57.85
even their inability to
believe they can be forgiven.
00:15:57.89\00:16:00.96
So now we can
bring in spirituality
00:16:00.99\00:16:03.09
into their belief systems,
00:16:03.12\00:16:04.46
they can begin to
transform their minds
00:16:04.49\00:16:05.83
and hearts
through the Holy Spirit
00:16:05.86\00:16:07.33
and now when they're released
00:16:07.36\00:16:08.96
society's going
to be better off.
00:16:09.00\00:16:10.57
They're going to be
better off, so everybody wins.
00:16:10.60\00:16:12.07
Yes.
00:16:12.10\00:16:13.44
When we bring in
spirituality into our bodies,
00:16:13.47\00:16:16.30
our minds, and hearts.
00:16:16.34\00:16:17.67
Paul, the second
great commandment
00:16:17.71\00:16:19.14
Jesus said is love others
00:16:19.17\00:16:21.31
as we would love ourselves
00:16:21.34\00:16:23.38
or as they
would like to be loved
00:16:23.41\00:16:24.75
as a matter of fact
and that is relational,
00:16:24.78\00:16:27.12
so the health message
really is not just physical,
00:16:27.15\00:16:30.35
the health message is
very mental and emotional
00:16:30.39\00:16:32.49
as well as the
physical, and that's very clear,
00:16:32.52\00:16:35.16
if we take the time to
study, it's very clear.
00:16:35.19\00:16:37.56
That's right.
00:16:37.59\00:16:38.93
So could you get into
the presenting issue here?
00:16:38.96\00:16:40.63
Sure. Go ahead.
00:16:40.66\00:16:42.03
Okay, so Frank,
00:16:42.06\00:16:43.80
a white man in his
50s comes to counseling
00:16:43.83\00:16:46.20
after his wife passes away.
00:16:46.23\00:16:48.44
He reports a
history of severe sexual
00:16:48.47\00:16:50.47
and physical abuse
00:16:50.51\00:16:51.84
at the hand of his
psychopathic father
00:16:51.87\00:16:54.08
who is now dead.
00:16:54.11\00:16:55.44
He developed a
severe sexual addiction
00:16:55.48\00:16:57.71
that lasted almost
his entire marriage
00:16:57.75\00:17:00.15
but when his wife died,
00:17:00.18\00:17:01.52
he knew it was
time to seek freedom.
00:17:01.55\00:17:03.92
Frank has committed to
counseling once a week,
00:17:03.95\00:17:06.55
attending support
groups two nights a week
00:17:06.59\00:17:08.92
in The Grief
Recovery group once a week
00:17:08.96\00:17:11.59
and has ceased
his pornography habit.
00:17:11.63\00:17:14.20
He has an
accountability partner at church
00:17:14.23\00:17:17.27
and is attending services
each week and volunteering.
00:17:17.30\00:17:20.90
One of his therapy
group leaders told him
00:17:20.94\00:17:23.10
to review all of his
childhood traumas with you.
00:17:23.14\00:17:26.34
So what do you do?
00:17:26.37\00:17:28.98
Well, then I'd like
to jump in and say...
00:17:29.01\00:17:30.71
Jump in.
00:17:30.75\00:17:32.41
Doing journaling work
in the form of a timeline
00:17:32.45\00:17:36.65
I have found that it's
very healing for clients,
00:17:36.69\00:17:39.69
they may not do it
all in one setting.
00:17:39.72\00:17:41.79
They may start with what
I call the charcoal sketch
00:17:41.82\00:17:45.46
and then during our
sessions we fill in the color
00:17:45.49\00:17:48.70
and that way they can
tell their story also...
00:17:48.73\00:17:52.43
So you're telling
some bullet point,
00:17:52.47\00:17:54.04
basically bullet
point their timeline...
00:17:54.07\00:17:55.40
Right.
00:17:55.44\00:17:56.77
Then they bring
that to the session
00:17:56.81\00:17:58.14
and then you
talk about each point.
00:17:58.17\00:17:59.51
Right and their
feelings around it
00:17:59.54\00:18:01.74
and what's unresolved
00:18:01.78\00:18:03.61
and once they go through
their life on a timeline,
00:18:03.65\00:18:07.98
then they can draw a line
and put a cross there and say,
00:18:08.02\00:18:11.89
"From this day forward.
00:18:11.92\00:18:14.99
I've given that
timeline to Jesus
00:18:15.02\00:18:17.73
and Satan doesn't that
have a foothold any longer."
00:18:17.76\00:18:21.20
You know and that is the
best part of the work we do.
00:18:21.23\00:18:25.87
Shelly, that just
reminds me of the very visual
00:18:25.90\00:18:29.10
that you have just
put to this journal.
00:18:29.14\00:18:31.14
Not only is it
getting their story
00:18:31.17\00:18:33.48
out like you said
in their feelings,
00:18:33.51\00:18:36.41
but when you put the timeline,
00:18:36.44\00:18:37.78
and you put a mark right there,
00:18:37.81\00:18:39.78
that visual is very powerful
to remind them of what God,
00:18:39.81\00:18:43.69
the work that God
is doing in their life
00:18:43.72\00:18:45.62
and will continue
to do on that timeline.
00:18:45.65\00:18:49.12
And with the equine therapy,
00:18:49.16\00:18:51.93
one of the ranches where
I go is called Story Ranch
00:18:51.96\00:18:55.43
and the whole premise of it is
00:18:55.46\00:18:57.23
to just give people a safe place
00:18:57.27\00:18:59.10
to come and tell their story.
00:18:59.13\00:19:00.74
Powerful.
00:19:00.77\00:19:02.10
There's power
in allowing someone
00:19:02.14\00:19:04.97
to tell their
story and be accepted.
00:19:05.01\00:19:08.68
That's how we show
the love of Christ,
00:19:08.71\00:19:10.45
but we don't
let them stay there,
00:19:10.48\00:19:12.35
if they're in a
perpetual pattern it's negative,
00:19:12.38\00:19:15.85
but validating you know
like this man's experience
00:19:15.88\00:19:21.02
and giving him a chance to
heal from the past let alone,
00:19:21.06\00:19:24.63
you know, the current problems.
00:19:24.66\00:19:26.49
Some people would say,
he shouldn't talk about it,
00:19:26.53\00:19:30.07
it's just going to reinforce
00:19:30.10\00:19:31.77
those negative
patterns of thought.
00:19:31.80\00:19:34.50
I don't take that position
00:19:34.54\00:19:36.04
because what I see
is so many people that
00:19:36.07\00:19:38.14
experienced abuse
are in a system that
00:19:38.17\00:19:40.41
then suppresses that information
00:19:40.44\00:19:43.51
and the abused is
required to remain silent
00:19:43.55\00:19:47.22
about it in order to...
00:19:47.25\00:19:48.58
But the Bible never
talks about problems.
00:19:48.62\00:19:50.09
Exactly.
00:19:50.12\00:19:52.85
I mean Paul never
talks about the mistakes
00:19:52.89\00:19:54.52
he made before, right.
00:19:54.56\00:19:55.89
He keeps all of his
bad stuff buried, right.
00:19:55.92\00:19:57.66
We don't know anything about
the bad thing he did, right.
00:19:57.69\00:19:59.53
He never brings it up
in any of his testimonies.
00:19:59.56\00:20:01.63
Yeah.
00:20:01.66\00:20:03.00
Only every time he
tells a story of Jesus.
00:20:03.03\00:20:06.40
He tells it in the
context of his story.
00:20:06.43\00:20:09.80
In 1 Thessalonians
2:8 says, you know,
00:20:09.84\00:20:12.27
we think of Paul as this type A,
00:20:12.31\00:20:13.64
full speed ahead,
00:20:13.68\00:20:15.01
Energizer Bunny
nothing stops him,
00:20:15.04\00:20:16.38
he says, "We love you so much,
00:20:16.41\00:20:17.75
we shared with you
not only the gospel of God
00:20:17.78\00:20:21.38
but our lives as well,
00:20:21.42\00:20:22.75
because he
become so dear to us."
00:20:22.78\00:20:24.12
He could not share
the gospel story...
00:20:24.15\00:20:25.59
Without sharing his life...
00:20:25.62\00:20:26.96
Without sharing his story,
00:20:26.99\00:20:28.32
having other people
share their stories,
00:20:28.36\00:20:29.69
it's biblical, we
call it the gospel story.
00:20:29.72\00:20:32.46
So when we turn it
into gospel information,
00:20:32.49\00:20:35.33
we're killing the relationship.
00:20:35.36\00:20:37.70
You know, and
when I work with people
00:20:37.73\00:20:39.17
as they start to get healing,
00:20:39.20\00:20:40.54
we start looking at
helping them write a testimony
00:20:40.57\00:20:43.41
that what has God done for them.
00:20:43.44\00:20:44.87
How is he identified
with their negative thoughts
00:20:44.91\00:20:46.94
and negative experiences?
00:20:46.98\00:20:48.31
How is he
brought healing to them?
00:20:48.34\00:20:49.68
And how is that helping them
00:20:49.71\00:20:51.15
share their story in a way
00:20:51.18\00:20:53.05
that others want to
connect with God as well.
00:20:53.08\00:20:55.08
We don't have to go
into all the details
00:20:55.12\00:20:57.35
but how can they
share their story
00:20:57.39\00:20:59.75
in a way that other
people can identify with them
00:20:59.79\00:21:02.19
and get hope that they
too can connect with God.
00:21:02.22\00:21:04.69
There's a big difference
00:21:04.73\00:21:06.63
between telling a
story for the purpose
00:21:06.66\00:21:09.16
of working through the
issues and ruminating over it
00:21:09.20\00:21:12.93
for years in
therapy and just, you know,
00:21:12.97\00:21:15.04
staying stuck in self-pity.
00:21:15.07\00:21:16.40
So there's a power,
00:21:16.44\00:21:17.77
there's such a
thing as over processing
00:21:17.81\00:21:19.14
and there's such a
thing as under processing.
00:21:19.17\00:21:20.51
We all know people,
00:21:20.54\00:21:21.88
clients and
people in our families,
00:21:21.91\00:21:23.88
in our churches that
are addicted to self-pity.
00:21:23.91\00:21:26.61
But see how much I've
suffered so the purpose is...
00:21:26.65\00:21:29.98
Not currently but it's yeah.
00:21:30.02\00:21:31.75
It's not about,
00:21:31.79\00:21:33.12
I'm not sharing with you
so that I can get better,
00:21:33.15\00:21:35.36
you can help me on
my part in the pattern,
00:21:35.39\00:21:38.39
own how I've been
hurt and move forward.
00:21:38.43\00:21:40.83
It's, I just
want to get attention.
00:21:40.86\00:21:42.90
Negative attention is
better than no attention
00:21:42.93\00:21:45.13
and then I can
live irresponsibly.
00:21:45.17\00:21:46.94
So I was going to say a good way
00:21:46.97\00:21:49.07
to help people with
journaling is to tell them
00:21:49.10\00:21:54.74
to end on a hopeful up note.
00:21:54.78\00:21:57.81
Okay, don't just ruminate
in what the problems are.
00:21:57.85\00:22:00.62
I use a book called,
On the Threshold of Hope,
00:22:00.65\00:22:04.05
by Diane Langberg.
00:22:04.09\00:22:05.42
I know her or I
know her therapist.
00:22:05.45\00:22:07.19
She does such a good
job of integrating Jesus
00:22:07.22\00:22:11.56
in a fact that
because a lot of times
00:22:11.59\00:22:13.33
people have a
hard time reconciling
00:22:13.36\00:22:14.80
if I was sexually
abused as a child.
00:22:14.83\00:22:17.27
Where was Jesus
when that happened?
00:22:17.30\00:22:20.07
That book helps a
person walk through their story
00:22:20.10\00:22:23.54
right out certain parts
00:22:23.57\00:22:25.34
and it's a slow
process and a lot of times
00:22:25.37\00:22:27.18
I'll use it chapter by chapter
00:22:27.21\00:22:28.71
in sessions with
people that are just beginning
00:22:28.74\00:22:31.91
the process of looking
at what happened to them.
00:22:31.95\00:22:34.08
So when you're
writing out your story, Rob,
00:22:34.12\00:22:36.42
you were saying
and on a positive note
00:22:36.45\00:22:38.82
I would say the
same thing is true
00:22:38.85\00:22:40.19
when we're talking in the...
00:22:40.22\00:22:42.36
not maybe not the therapist
00:22:42.39\00:22:43.73
but within the
average interaction
00:22:43.76\00:22:45.29
when we begin to admit
00:22:45.33\00:22:47.00
what we've been through.
00:22:47.03\00:22:48.43
I tell people have a
one sentence version,
00:22:48.46\00:22:50.77
have a paragraph
version and have a page version
00:22:50.80\00:22:53.07
and share the version
00:22:53.10\00:22:54.97
that is
appropriate to that context
00:22:55.00\00:22:56.71
so they can start to
learn to make social judgments
00:22:56.74\00:22:58.94
and not become energy
jittering type of people,
00:22:58.97\00:23:02.98
and so when they do that,
00:23:03.01\00:23:04.35
if they end on a note of
hope that can help redeem it,
00:23:04.38\00:23:07.85
they can be
honest about their past
00:23:07.88\00:23:09.48
at the same time redeem
00:23:09.52\00:23:11.12
it's socially lead to where
it's not a downer so to speak.
00:23:11.15\00:23:14.89
You know, if the client is
not used to this type of thing,
00:23:14.92\00:23:18.06
go to the Psalms,
isn't the Psalms all about,
00:23:18.09\00:23:20.60
a lot of the Psalms.
00:23:20.63\00:23:22.06
There's so much problems
and worry and depression,
00:23:22.10\00:23:24.73
and I'm going
through all of this pressure,
00:23:24.77\00:23:26.43
yet somehow there
seems to be an end note
00:23:26.47\00:23:29.40
that God is in control.
00:23:29.44\00:23:30.87
God will get me through this...
00:23:30.91\00:23:32.41
And they're
connecting with God in that,
00:23:32.44\00:23:34.01
that's why they end
in a note of praise.
00:23:34.04\00:23:35.44
Amen. Amen, amen.
00:23:35.48\00:23:37.28
So there is a place for
telling our story and, you know,
00:23:37.31\00:23:40.08
some people say don't share
00:23:40.12\00:23:41.45
but then I think there's
a danger of secondary trauma
00:23:41.48\00:23:43.79
if we shut
someone down, you know,
00:23:43.82\00:23:46.42
from sharing their story
00:23:46.45\00:23:47.79
if they've never
shared it before.
00:23:47.82\00:23:49.16
Maybe they're just
working up the courage
00:23:49.19\00:23:50.53
and they come
to us and they say,
00:23:50.56\00:23:51.89
"I need to tell someone."
00:23:51.93\00:23:53.26
You shut that person down,
00:23:53.29\00:23:54.63
it's going to look
like the same old same old.
00:23:54.66\00:23:56.26
The majority of
the Bible stories
00:23:56.30\00:23:57.63
and many of them
have a lot of dark,
00:23:57.67\00:24:00.24
dirty things.
00:24:00.27\00:24:02.07
We know that
secrets lead to sickness.
00:24:02.10\00:24:04.27
Yeah.
00:24:04.31\00:24:05.64
Honesty and
openness leads to wholeness.
00:24:05.67\00:24:08.24
So we have to
provide that safe place
00:24:08.28\00:24:10.65
as counselors
for people to share.
00:24:10.68\00:24:12.61
Yeah.
00:24:12.65\00:24:13.98
But not let them stay stuck
00:24:14.02\00:24:15.35
in ruminating
over and over again.
00:24:15.38\00:24:16.72
Yeah
00:24:16.75\00:24:18.09
I don't deny it any minute...
00:24:18.12\00:24:19.45
No, I think another important
00:24:19.49\00:24:20.82
if we put all of what
you all are saying together
00:24:20.86\00:24:22.19
for those people
that may struggle
00:24:22.22\00:24:23.56
and we do this in Philadelphia,
00:24:23.59\00:24:24.93
we actually have storytelling
00:24:24.96\00:24:26.73
we teach people
how to tell their story
00:24:26.76\00:24:28.86
and so outside
of the therapeutic,
00:24:28.90\00:24:31.33
you know, room that's great,
00:24:31.37\00:24:32.93
but there are some people
00:24:32.97\00:24:34.30
who need to talk to other people
00:24:34.34\00:24:36.07
that their story is so powerful
00:24:36.10\00:24:38.37
that they can
affect change in others,
00:24:38.41\00:24:40.54
and so the
therapy you gonna mention
00:24:40.58\00:24:42.31
with the counselor is
great but teaching people
00:24:42.34\00:24:43.95
how to share their
story with a group,
00:24:43.98\00:24:46.18
with an audience so to speak,
00:24:46.21\00:24:47.68
all the things
that you guys have said
00:24:47.72\00:24:49.18
so it's not reliving it
into a negative situation
00:24:49.22\00:24:51.85
or glamorizing it
or any of those things
00:24:51.89\00:24:53.99
but you're
actually teaching a person
00:24:54.02\00:24:55.36
how to relate what
has happened to them
00:24:55.39\00:24:57.33
in a pro-social,
00:24:57.36\00:24:58.69
proactive way that
can actually heal others.
00:24:58.73\00:25:00.50
That is so good.
00:25:00.53\00:25:01.86
That's something
that I think is important.
00:25:01.90\00:25:03.23
You can actually learn.
00:25:03.26\00:25:04.60
So part of our job
00:25:04.63\00:25:05.97
as counselors and
coaches is to teach people
00:25:06.00\00:25:07.34
how to tell their story in a way
00:25:07.37\00:25:08.70
that doesn't
sabotage them socially,
00:25:08.74\00:25:10.07
but gets it out
there for people to hear.
00:25:10.11\00:25:13.01
Maybe give them a platform
that is healing for them.
00:25:13.04\00:25:15.14
That's right, that's right,
00:25:15.18\00:25:16.51
which can be healing for them.
00:25:16.54\00:25:17.88
So, Jen, there's a
lot to sum up here.
00:25:17.91\00:25:20.55
You know, see if I can
do justice to everything
00:25:20.58\00:25:22.75
that you have
applied to this program.
00:25:22.78\00:25:25.32
We started with equine therapy
00:25:25.35\00:25:27.22
and how this is
a wonderful therapy
00:25:27.26\00:25:28.96
that incorporates horses
00:25:28.99\00:25:30.73
to those who have been abused,
who have really nonverbal,
00:25:30.76\00:25:36.73
they're coming in
with not a lot to say
00:25:36.77\00:25:39.20
and these horses
have a way of bringing out
00:25:39.23\00:25:42.37
something within
them through the tactile,
00:25:42.40\00:25:44.74
the touch the
brushing and then you just,
00:25:44.77\00:25:46.61
you just sit with them
and allow them the time
00:25:46.64\00:25:48.34
that they need in
order for their story
00:25:48.38\00:25:50.48
to start to come out,
00:25:50.51\00:25:51.85
so that's a wonderful therapy.
00:25:51.88\00:25:53.78
We talked about the
importance of listening
00:25:53.82\00:25:55.78
to negative thoughts to somebody
00:25:55.82\00:25:58.29
who has been abused
00:25:58.32\00:25:59.65
and how important that is too
00:25:59.69\00:26:01.39
because maybe they
haven't had a chance
00:26:01.42\00:26:03.22
for someone to
really listen to them.
00:26:03.26\00:26:04.79
So we're listening to
their negative thoughts
00:26:04.83\00:26:07.66
and we're
helping them to identify
00:26:07.70\00:26:11.73
and understand possibly
what they've gone through
00:26:11.77\00:26:14.00
from a objective perspective
00:26:14.04\00:26:15.60
that perhaps they haven't had
00:26:15.64\00:26:17.64
and what you're using is called
00:26:17.67\00:26:19.04
Christian centered
cognitive behavioral therapy,
00:26:19.07\00:26:22.11
and this is taking Christ
00:26:22.14\00:26:24.25
into the center of
our cognitive thoughts
00:26:24.28\00:26:26.41
and bringing
truth into the equation
00:26:26.45\00:26:28.42
and we know that the
truth can set us free.
00:26:28.45\00:26:30.85
And this is a really good bridge
00:26:30.89\00:26:33.02
Paul that you've talked about,
00:26:33.05\00:26:34.39
now we can start to talk about
the journey of Jesus himself
00:26:34.42\00:26:38.26
and the abuse
that He's been through
00:26:38.29\00:26:40.00
so that the client
can understand that
00:26:40.03\00:26:42.46
this is somebody
who went through things
00:26:42.50\00:26:45.13
actually in my behalf.
00:26:45.17\00:26:46.50
I'm not alone in this.
00:26:46.53\00:26:47.87
The Son of God actually
00:26:47.90\00:26:49.37
went through
these horrific abuses
00:26:49.40\00:26:52.07
and so this is important
for them developing empathy
00:26:52.11\00:26:55.81
with even the Son of God.
00:26:55.84\00:26:58.21
And we talked about, Jean,
00:26:58.25\00:27:02.48
we talked about how in prisons
you come across many men,
00:27:02.52\00:27:06.22
many men who
don't feel forgiven,
00:27:06.25\00:27:08.29
don't feel loved and
they need the gospel.
00:27:08.32\00:27:10.23
Right.
00:27:10.26\00:27:11.59
And this can really
help them to feel that way.
00:27:11.63\00:27:14.46
And so there's so much more
that we touched upon but, Jen,
00:27:14.50\00:27:19.40
I want to give you
the last words here
00:27:19.43\00:27:21.37
because I know that you
can sum this up so well,
00:27:21.40\00:27:24.41
but I just want to
mention the power of journaling
00:27:24.44\00:27:27.28
and how we need
to end on a up note
00:27:27.31\00:27:28.78
just like David
did in the Psalms.
00:27:28.81\00:27:30.15
Amen.
00:27:30.18\00:27:31.51
Psalms 107:20 says,
00:27:31.55\00:27:33.88
"He sent his
word and healed them
00:27:33.92\00:27:35.58
and delivered them
from their destructions."
00:27:35.62\00:27:38.85
I want to
encourage each one of you
00:27:38.89\00:27:40.96
that it's never too late.
00:27:40.99\00:27:42.76
No one has ever gone too far
00:27:42.79\00:27:44.36
regardless of which
side of abuse you've been on,
00:27:44.39\00:27:47.00
Jesus is able to heal you.
00:27:47.03\00:27:48.86
Reach out to a professional
Christian counselor.
00:27:48.90\00:27:51.93
Go to the Word of God,
get support around you.
00:27:51.97\00:27:54.74
And most of all,
00:27:54.77\00:27:56.10
trust in Him
and He will lead you
00:27:56.14\00:27:57.47
on a healing journey.
00:27:57.51\00:27:59.64
See you next time.
00:27:59.67\00:28:01.01
Amen.
00:28:01.04\00:28:02.38