Participants:
Series Code: MIW
Program Code: MIW000070A
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00:01 Hi, I'm Dr. Kim Logan Nowlan. I'm Arthur Nowlan.
00:03 And welcome to Making It Work. 00:05 ¤ ¤ 00:36 When you talk about single parenting, a lot of times you'll 00:40 talk about or you'll see single mothers. But yet on Making It 00:45 Work we wanted to view or interview a single father. 00:49 In today's society what are some of the things that men are 00:53 facing as single-parenting fathers? 00:55 Well I guess expectations. 00:57 What do you mean expectations? 00:59 For the man as the single parent of the home people in general 01:05 expect that things are going to be taken care of or not so much 01:11 taken care of but there would be a void in how he would care 01:17 for his child. 01:18 Okay, do you think single fathers can change diapers, 01:20 take care of an infant? 01:22 Absolutely. Anything a woman can do a man can do. 01:25 You think so? 01:26 Absolutely. I mean, but you have nurturing characteristics that 01:29 may be different than a male's nurturing characteristics. 01:34 I see. What was it like for you to go through... 01:37 See I was raised by a single father. 01:40 Yes you lost your mother when you were seven years old. 01:42 What was it like for you... And I was raised by a single mother 01:45 because my parents got divorced when I was 12 but my father was 01:49 still having parenting time with us. But what was it like when 01:52 you saw me, you were there, when I gave birth to your daughter 01:56 Ann. What was that like for you? 01:57 It was an experience, I mean. 01:59 Do you think you could have gone through something like that? 02:03 No, that's why God built you because you can handle that 02:07 better. 02:09 Let's go there before we go to our guest. You said that men 02:13 could do everything that women could do. All right. 02:15 Of course, I didn't mean that. 02:18 I know you didn't. But why do you think, you know you said 02:21 nurturing, we are built to nurture and that's something God 02:24 made us to do. 02:26 No I said that the nurturing characteristics are different. 02:29 What was it like to see me give me give birth. You were right 02:33 there. 02:34 It was an experience. 02:35 What kind of experience to see God's work. I mean, here it is 02:41 that for 9 months you carried this child and now you are 02:44 giving birth. That was an amazing experience. It really 02:48 brought into mind how great he is that He would allow a 02:52 person to give birth and for me to be there. 02:56 Well I guess where I'm going with this is that we talk about 03:01 the empowerment, empowering women, but we need to recognize 03:05 that men and fathers have to be empowered also. Yes it's a great 03:09 task to give birth, but it's a greater task to be a good parent 03:14 And today we are blessed to have a great parent with us and he 03:19 has three sons. And there's a twist to this story. But we want 03:24 to let him tell his story. We want to welcome Jeff and Jestin 03:29 Wilder. Welcome to the show. Listen, well I want to hear your 03:34 story. I know, Jeff, you have three sons, three different 03:38 mothers. I want to talk about your relationship with the 03:42 mothers, with your sons and you being raised in the church. You 03:46 were born and raised Seventh-day Adventist. How old were you when 03:50 you had your first child? 03:51 I was 23 years old when I had my older son, my first child. 03:55 Your first child. And then you got in another relationship and 03:59 had a second child. 04:01 Well there's a twist to that. I didn't know about the second 04:03 child. 04:04 You didn't know about the second child. 04:06 I didn't know about that. 04:07 How many years you didn't know about him? 04:10 Three and a half years actually. 04:13 So you never saw your father Jestin for 3-1/2 years. 04:17 No ma'am. Okay, we'll come back to that. 04:20 Then your youngest son Chase 04:22 He's 11. Actually when I was in a relationship with his mother, 04:29 we were engaged and actually when she found out she was with 04:35 child that's when I found out about him. I received a letter 04:40 from the state. He actually was a ward of the state. He was in a 04:46 foster home at the time when I found out. 04:49 What?! What happened that placed him in a foster home? 04:52 His mother for lack of a better way to say it, she abused him. 05:01 And the state stepped in. One of the things that she did was she 05:10 finally mentioned my name so they contacted me and that's 05:16 how I got him. But it didn't take place right away. There had 05:22 to be a process, paternity, which took two months. Then 05:28 there was another five months before he came to live with me. 05:33 Through that process, they gave me the opportunity to get to 05:40 know him. I requested that we do it on a gradual basis because 05:45 I didn't think it was fair for not only him but myself to be 05:50 thrusted in and we don't know anything about each other. So it 05:55 was an every weekend thing, but then that wasn't working so I 06:00 requested he needs to just come. After about four and a half 06:04 months I decided, no, he needs to come on. Then they granted 06:09 it. They were just happy that a black man was standing up to 06:13 take care of his responsibility. One of the things that really 06:18 kind of shocked me is they gave me a choice whether to leave 06:24 him in the system or take him. And of course he's here with me 06:30 now. How old were you then at that 06:31 time Sweetheart, how old? 06:33 I was about three. 06:35 Do you remember all that? 06:37 I remember bits and pieces like vaguely what happened 06:41 here and there. 06:43 Do you remember being abused by your mother? 06:45 No. You don't remember any of that. 06:46 Do you see your mother today? 06:48 No. No contact at all with her? 06:50 It's very rare, very rare. Like I have talked to her since then 06:58 seen her a couple of times, but it's very rare. 07:04 So evidently every time I see you, you know we are church 07:07 members, we go to the same church and I have a lot of time 07:11 I spend with Jestin at camp meeting where we have once a 07:15 year at the camp wagon at Camp Au Sable, Michigan. He's a joy 07:20 to be around and with. But you know during this process you 07:24 know what was going on in your life, because I know you're a 07:27 teacher, you have your Masters Degree. What was going on in 07:31 your life at that time? 07:33 At that time I wasn't in education yet. I was a trade 07:38 worker, a communications technician. But there was a lot 07:44 of things going on with me as far as not knowing what my next 07:53 step was. I was just drifting. When he came along this was kind 07:59 of the handwriting on the wall so to say. It sort of slowed me 08:05 down. It kind of made me put things in perspective. When I 08:09 got out of high school and I actually went to church school 08:14 all through grade school and high school and went straight 08:19 to an Adventist college but did not finish. Just like the age 08:25 old story, you go and play around. You know, get your 08:28 things taken care of the right way. I came back home. Well when 08:32 he came along that kind of put a lot of things in perspective. 08:37 Now I go from one son to three in a matter of six months. So 08:44 the Lord put in my mind you have three men that you have to be 08:52 an example for. More it was a scary transition because I'm 09:01 doing this by myself. And let me say that I have a lot of respect 09:07 for single mothers because I live what they live. It's not an 09:12 easy task. I mean, we've gone through a lot of battles, 09:18 behaviors, just the aspect of trying to teach them just the 09:24 simple things. There were a lot of obstacles that contributed 09:29 to the difficulties between Jestin and myself. It hasn't 09:35 been an easy row. It's been rather difficult financially, 09:41 but through it all, even though I'm not where I want to be 09:46 not having the things that I probably need or want. I get 09:51 the things I need, just not things I want. Being of a 09:56 spiritual background the Lord hasn't left me hanging so I can 10:03 say that has been the highlight of raising him and the other two 10:09 You never expected yourself to be in a position like that. 10:13 Well growing up in a church, no. So many times as young people 10:18 we tend to go through the motion because that's what we're born 10:24 into. Not necessarily we develop our own relationship with the 10:29 Lord. It's always an act. But I heard something yesterday 10:36 that we can't live our lives spiritually off the backs of our 10:42 parents and that was what I did not understand. That's what I 10:48 was spinning my wheels on. So when I did that there were a lot 10:55 of things that I was becoming involved in. 10:57 Let me ask. So you have three sons. Okay, and when they all 11:06 came together where was the help I heard you say that you did it 11:12 by yourself. Did your parents... 11:13 My mom stepped in especially with him not having his mother 11:20 around. My mom stepped in to provide that motherly part of 11:26 the situation because I don't have it at all. I'm hard core. 11:33 Especially when it comes to raising a young man. This is how 11:40 we do it. 11:41 That's the difference between the male and the female. 11:44 That's the difference. And you know I admit it. There's not a 11:49 lot of compassion in our DNA. When you do it the right way 11:54 it's balanced out. But when you're alone it's hard to find. 12:00 And it's the same I would imagine with a single mother. 12:08 She doesn't have that mental strength that men have to 12:15 out their children. 12:17 Jestin let me ask you a question How is it dealing with your dad 12:21 and growing up in that environment? Being given rules 12:28 and sometimes not agreeing with those rules? 12:30 It's tough. It's very hard because I'm a teenager now so... 12:37 And how old are you? 15 12:38 So everything your parents tell you what to do is just because 12:43 they tell you to do it and it's for your benefit. You don't 12:47 always get it and don't always see how it's going to benefit 12:51 you. But then there's a saying, you don't see it now but you 12:56 will in the future. So it's like man, I don't get it. But I just 13:01 have to do it because that's what he says and it's better 13:04 for me. He's older than me, he's lived through it and some 13:07 things he probably has experience to his life so 13:10 he knows so I just have to go along with him. 13:14 How do you get along with your brothers? 13:16 Well I'm closer with my older brother. Chase was like a baby 13:25 when me and little Jeff were introduced. He was a baby. 13:30 So you know, he's a little brother. But me and little Jeff 13:35 we kind of grew up a little bit closer because we went through 13:40 more. Chase was obviously the baby so you know he was too 13:43 young to experience some of the things that me and little Jeff 13:47 went through. My older brother went through. So we get along. 13:50 We have our moments where each other gets on the other 13:54 person's nerves but for the most part I love my brothers. 13:58 But Chase comes over on the weekends and things like that. 14:03 Now he's Seventh-day Adventist? Chase? 14:05 Yes ma'am. 14:06 And Jeff is a Seventh-day Adventist? (Nods head). 14:08 Now where does Jeff live? 14:10 He lives at Huntsville, AL. 14:11 So do you go down and visit him? 14:13 Yes ma'am. Sometimes for the holidays days, for Alumni weekend 14:18 Things like that. So what about your chores? What kind of chores 14:24 do you have? 14:26 I do everything. Cook, clean. I can do some things... 14:35 Do you get an allowance? No ma'am. 14:37 You don't get no allowance. What is this? Slave labor. 14:43 You don't get no allowance... Never got an allowance... 14:48 I mean, you don't look like you are lacking or in need of anything. 14:50 He gets pretty much... I sacrifice pretty much to get him 14:54 what he wants sometimes. 14:56 I'm glad you brought that up. 14:57 You know because it is a sacrifice and what you're 15:04 experiencing is probably once again with the unexpected. 15:09 You know let's talk about behavior. Let's talk about your 15:14 behavior. Being born and raised 15:15 Seventh-day Adventist, you know going through Christian 15:19 education and then I understand you get to a point where you 15:23 have a child outside of wedlock. But you don't have just one, you 15:28 have three. What were you missing. What got you to that 15:33 point? 15:34 I shouldn't think about that a lot. There were some things in 15:41 my upbringing that contributed to that. My mom did the best 15:46 that she could. I had a step father in the home but step 15:51 father was always gone. He was always doing his thing, so my 15:56 mom pretty much ran the house hold but by her running the 16:01 household there were some things in her upbringing that she did 16:07 not have. Saying I love you was very rare. A hug and a kiss was 16:15 very rare. So there was a lot of searching for that acceptance. 16:21 Growing up there were a lot of low self-esteem issues and when 16:26 I got out and started receiving attention, it was the wrong 16:31 attention. It was the thirst for more but it was always the wrong 16:40 attention. 16:41 What about biological father? 16:42 My biological father was not in my life. I knew him, I saw him, 16:49 but there was no connection, there were no dealings with him 16:55 in terms of a relationship and that's one of the reasons why 17:01 I do what I do with my boys. One, because of the in-home 17:06 situation and, two, because of I always say I would never do 17:12 my children like my dad did me. And that's why I'm hard on my 17:17 boys. That's why I teach them to be respectful, I teach them 17:21 to handle their business. And that was another reason why I 17:25 decided to go back to school because if I can't do it, I 17:28 can't tell them to do it. So in the span of like three years I 17:34 completed my bachelors and got my masters. So he's a 4.0 17:42 student. The importance of that to me is I wasted a lot of 17:48 time and I don't want that for my children. Because of the 17:54 relationships that I did not have caused a lot of time 18:01 wasted. As long as I'm breathing I insist that that not happen to 18:09 my boys. 18:10 That's so beautiful Jeff. You know when I see you in church 18:13 he sits close to you. Do you know you have those boys right 18:17 there. I see that that's military. That's Jeff, I see 18:21 daddy, I see those two boys, I see those boys, I see daddy. 18:28 One thing my mom taught us was when we're in church it's not a 18:35 time for play. And being young you naturally do what everybody 18:42 else does. I have them around me because that's what had been 18:48 taught to me. And I do recognize and understand that church is 18:54 for development of our relationship with Christ and 18:59 if we're playing, we're missing it. So they know when we're in 19:05 church they need to be around me. No hiding, no running around 19:11 none of that. So they understand that. 19:13 They understand? Let me ask. 4.0. What are your goals for 19:18 your life? 19:19 Ultimately I want to become a neurosurgeon. 19:25 Is that right? Why? 19:26 Well I just always gravitated towards the body, especially 19:32 the brain. That's something that always fascinated me since I was 19:37 little. 19:39 So your good in math, 4.0, sciences 19:41 You do your homework, you do your chores. You attend church. 19:45 Can you sing? 19:49 No I don't do the singing. 19:55 You know I don't see you in the choir. I say where is Jeff? 19:57 Singing, that's not one of my talents. 20:01 Okay, all right. What about girlfriends? 20:04 He's shaking his head. You're so handsome. So what you going to 20:15 do? _with that. 20:17 The thing is there's time for that and now is not the time. 20:24 I wish my mom would have done that with me because my focus 20:31 probably would have been a little different. She allowed me 20:35 like I said I had to sit with her. Well she allowed the young 20:41 lady to come sit with us when I sat with my parents. It's too 20:47 early to develop that in my opinion. Some people may 20:50 disagree with that but he's my child, so I know his DNA because 20:57 his DNA is my DNA and he can't do what I know that I did. 21:02 You understand what I'm saying? So if I'm wrong on that I'll 21:07 just have to be wrong on that. 21:08 So what do you do at church when these young ladies are 21:12 growing up and see the young lady, you just _ 21:18 I don't tell them anything. He tells them. 21:24 I mean if something's done that's inappropriate I just let 21:28 them know, I don't do that. 21:30 So what about if the young ladies want to sit with you in 21:32 church? You tell them... What do you tell them? 21:35 Well I don't say anything. They already know. People just 21:38 going to take one look at my dad and they already know. 21:41 They're scared more than I am. So they take one look at him. 21:46 So this then is not a problem. 21:50 No, no, not at all. I mean I do a lot of fussing but that comes 21:55 with the territory. 21:57 So is his bark really loud? Does it get loud sometimes. 22:01 It can get there. 22:03 It can get there. So you know when daddy has that look, does 22:07 he have a look? 22:08 Just look at you, you do something. He looks like this. 22:12 I know when I was talking about the program, wait I'm 22:16 going to tell you what's up. We were in the corridor of the 22:20 church, the vestibule of the church and Lord just put this 22:24 on me. I said, Jeff I gotta interview you and what you've 22:27 gone through, and I didn't know the three different stories, but 22:31 Jestin was standing behind him as captain, lieutenant, 22:36 did I say that right? 22:37 Jestin didn't move. Chase was to my right leaning over me 22:44 and I'm like Jestin didn't move. He didn't move. Did he breathe? 22:50 I've taught them, I mean... and there's a funny story. 22:54 You know I used to play basketball for the church and I 22:58 used to always have the boys with me and you know I can't 23:03 watch them and play at the same time so I had them sitting in 23:07 the bleachers. And one of my former teachers, Ms. Bertram, 23:12 after it was all over, I forgot about the boys. I went to the 23:16 locker room. We were upset, we'd lost. And I'm on my way out to 23:20 the car. And I said, wait a minute, I came with two little 23:25 people. And I go back, and Ms. Bertram said, I told them to 23:30 come on. They were like, no my dad says to sit right here. And 23:34 if he says sit right here, we're going to stay right here. So 23:38 They've been conditioned whatever I say they need to 23:43 follow through. 23:44 My goodness. I guess what I'm getting out of 23:48 this at this point is basically nothing that you experienced 23:55 in your family of origin, especially negative situations 24:00 is going to cross over into how you raise your children. 24:06 No, no. I think the things and the experiences that I've had 24:13 motivate me to do what I do the way that I do it. I'm very, very 24:22 adamant about making the best of their time. No opportunity's 24:31 wasted. They believe in that, especially him. He knows the 24:37 hard work that I put into him to teach him, he's owned it for 24:43 himself and he does above and beyond with his school work. 24:48 I still have to tighten him up around the house but for the 24:53 most part he's a good kid. 24:55 What about Chase? Where is the youngest one? 24:57 Did you ever consider that you were going to have a 25:02 relationship that would have led to marriage or anything? 25:07 I did but under the circumstances it didn't 25:10 work out because of everything that I was going through. 25:16 Even with him that is why I go above and beyond with him. 25:22 Every chance, every free moment he's with me and he follows 25:28 through just like Jestin. He's a 4.0 student too. 25:32 I like the way Jestin is dressed Sabbath, the bow tie, the jacket 25:38 you know how you keep them dressed. Appropriate for church. 25:41 We've gotten kind of lax in our children can come the way I 25:45 don't. You know Brother Nowlan and I and Aaron. 25:48 But at the same time not only outwardly but inwardly I see 25:52 excellent parenting skills and that's why we wanted you to 25:57 come on Making It Work. You are single, you are focused, and you 26:00 directing these children in the way they should go and the way 26:04 the Lord. And now you are totally connected with the Lord. 26:08 Let's talk about that in the last about a minute and a half. 26:11 Your relationship spiritually in the home. 26:14 We are striving every day. My prayer daily is to develop a 26:22 stronger sense of spirituality so that they can see the face 26:29 of Jesus in me. It's a struggle sometimes because of 26:34 circumstances. You know, I'm human just like everybody else 26:39 and I do sometimes get weighted down. But I was born and raised 26:45 in the church and a lot of the doctrines and philosophies I do 26:49 believe in. So this is why I haven't to turn my back totally 26:54 on what I've learned. Train up a child in the way he should 26:57 go and my mom has really instilled that in me regardless 27:01 of what was going on. So I try to do that with them. We're not 27:06 always there but we're still striving. 27:09 Do feel daddy is a good parent? 27:11 I do, I do. Why, why? Because my dad he knows me and he knows 27:17 what I'm capable of doing and he wants nothing but the best 27:22 for me. Do you love your father? 27:24 I do, with all my heart. 27:25 So you're glad that the Lord sent him to come get you out of 27:29 that foster home? I'm grateful. 27:32 Amen. I'm very grateful. 27:33 Arthur, single, focused and directed. Single fathers. 27:40 I want to say to all the single fathers today, hold on, be 27:44 strong and continue to stay focused and directed. 27:47 I'm Dr. Kim Logan Nowlan, I'm Arthur Nowlan. 27:51 and I want to thank this wonderful family for being with 27:53 us. Continue to Make It Work. God bless. God bless. |
Revised 2018-02-06