Participants: Willie Oliver, Elaine Oliver
Series Code: MGH
Program Code: MGH000054
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00:29 Welcome to Marriage In God's Hands.
00:31 I'm Willie Oliver, Director of Family Ministries 00:34 for the Seventh Day Adventist Church in North America. 00:37 I'm Elaine Oliver, Willie's partner in ministry, 00:39 and a Marriage and Family Consultant 00:41 for the Seventh Day Adventist Church in North America. 00:44 We're delighted to be with you today. 00:47 In my work as Director of Family Ministries 00:49 for the Seventh Day Adventist Church in North America, 00:52 I often have to deal with the whole issue of marriage. 00:56 While it's most challenging, it can also be one of the most 01:00 rewarding enterprises that any human can be involved in. 01:05 I think we have found that to be true 01:07 in our almost 25 years of marriage. 01:09 We know that even though we're a couple in ministry, 01:13 that marriage still presents many challenges. 01:18 And we are awed by the fact that God has given us 01:22 this wonderful gift of marriage. 01:24 And given us an opportunity to better understand 01:27 His intention for marriage and what it can look like, 01:31 what it can be like. 01:32 We're determined that we are not only going to be married 01:36 for a life time, but we're going to be happy in marriage. 01:39 And so, we hope that as we share with you today 01:42 that you will get a clearer and a better understanding 01:44 of God's plan for marriage. 01:47 What a wonderful opportunity to deal with the issue of marriage. 01:52 Marriage is the first institution established 01:56 by God at Creation. 01:57 And it's not an afterthought. 01:59 It wasn't an afterthought even though when you look in 02:02 scripture you get the impression that when Adam was naming 02:05 the animals, he arrived at the place where 02:08 there was not one like him. 02:09 But really, it was God's intent from the very beginning 02:13 for man to not be alone. 02:15 If we go to the Bible, to the book of Genesis 02:18 chapter 2 and beginning with verse 18, 02:20 we see what the Word of God has to say about this. 02:23 And then on to verses 20-25. 03:17 We want to share with you this whole notion of marriage. 03:21 What God intended. 03:22 I love that text because it talks about 03:27 the most beautiful love story ever. 03:29 And yet, we know that somewhere along the line, 03:32 things went awry. 03:34 And Adam and Eve suffered some challenges in their marriage. 03:39 Just like so many couples today. 03:41 There's a wonderful quote that we have found over the years. 03:44 And it goes like this, "Getting married is easy. 03:48 Staying married is more difficult. 03:51 Staying happily married for a life time would be considered 03:54 among the fine arts. " 03:55 Wouldn't you agree with that? 03:57 Absolutely 03:59 So this whole marriage institution is, 04:03 in order for it to be wonderful, is it possible, 04:07 I guess I should ask, is it possible 04:09 for it to be wonderful? 04:10 Are we able as couples to experience the joy 04:18 and the oneness that God intended at Creation 04:21 when He created Adam and Eve? 04:23 Well, it is possible. 04:24 And at the same time, we have to be mindful of the dynamics, 04:29 those special principles that God has laid out 04:33 for marriage to be able to work the way He intended it to be. 04:39 So, should we take a look at the reality of marriage? 04:43 What is the reality of marriage? 04:46 Well, here's the reality of marriage that couples will 04:49 naturally move towards a state of alienation. 04:51 I often say that you have a husband and a wife 04:55 in front of a pastor, a husband and a wife to be, a couple. 05:00 And the pastor has just declared them husband and wife. 05:03 They're walking down the church aisle. 05:06 And I usually say they're heading for 05:08 alienation and separation unless they're intentional 05:11 about connecting with each other each day. 05:15 People often say, "Well we grew apart. " 05:19 And my response to that is, "We are going to grow apart. " 05:23 And the reason we grow apart is because we're human. 05:26 And because we're human and we have sinned, 05:29 the Bible says that sin is the transgression of the law, 05:32 and this sin is a reality that separates people. 05:37 So, unless you are intentional of connecting every day 05:41 with your spouse through the power of God, 05:44 you're going to be drifting apart. 05:46 In my work, I travel quite a bit. 05:49 And I remember when our children were much smaller, younger. 05:52 I intended in my heart that to be connected to Elaine 05:57 and to be connected to our children, 05:58 that no matter where I was, I would call home every day 06:02 and speak to Elaine. 06:03 So, how do you stay connected, because nature hates a vacuum. 06:07 And if you're not connected, and if you're not in touch 06:10 with each other and with Jesus Christ, 06:11 something is going to go awry. 06:14 That's absolutely right. 06:18 But what we want to share with couples, 06:20 with those of you that are listening, 06:22 husbands and wives can become one. 06:25 We can either choose to live with what's wrong; 06:29 we can go through life with a lot of resentment, 06:33 a lot of hurt, and a lot of animosity towards each other. 06:36 Or we can trust God, we can rely on God's Word. 06:40 Because He certainly does provide 06:42 a blueprint for us in marriage. 06:44 And we can learn how to love one another. 06:48 We can learn how to love in the way that God wants us to love. 06:52 And I truly believe that God intends for us 06:57 to have great marriages. 06:58 And He's given us in His Word, concepts. 07:02 And just whatever it is we need in order to have 07:09 the type of marriage where intimacy can grow. 07:12 So, tell us a little bit about intimacy. 07:14 Because whenever we talk about intimacy and we 07:17 say that we're going to talk about intimacy, 07:19 people are a little confused as to what 07:21 this intimacy looks like. 07:23 Well, God is very clear in the Word of God, 07:26 in the book of Genesis 2:25. 07:37 This nakedness that we're talking about, invariably, 07:39 people think that when they read this text in scripture, 07:43 that it's referring to sexuality. 07:46 That it's referring to a man and his wife having intercourse. 07:51 While that might be true, it really goes beyond that. 07:55 The whole notion of nakedness means that there's nothing 08:00 to hide, that what you see is what you get. 08:03 That the man and his wife are so intimate 08:07 in their relationship with one another 08:09 that they're open in every facet of their lives. 08:12 For example, this is not only physical nakedness, 08:16 it is spiritual nakedness, it is emotional nakedness. 08:20 If there's something in my soul, there's something that 08:22 happened at work that I'm not happy about, 08:25 I can come home and talk to Elaine about that. 08:27 There's an openness about that, I can be vulnerable. 08:30 Cry if I need to cry as a man. 08:33 Invariably in our society, we are afraid to allow men to cry. 08:38 "Oh, that's not manly. " 08:39 But the truth of the matter is, that's why men die more quickly. 08:44 Because they don't release their emotions. 08:46 There ought to be someone, certainly your spouse 08:49 that you can be open with. 08:50 And I'd like to encourage men to be open with their spouses. 08:53 So here, when the Bible says naked and not ashamed, 08:56 it's talking about nothing to hide. 08:59 You're not doing something behind your spouse's back. 09:01 You're not trying to in any way be deceptive. 09:07 You want to be open. 09:08 You want to be spiritually connected. 09:10 You want to be talking about, you need prayer. 09:13 And invariably I need Elaine to pray for me. 09:15 And I'm happy to share with her, "Pray for me. " 09:18 "You know, I'm not feeling so strong today, pray for me. " 09:21 So when the Bible speaks about naked and not ashamed, 09:24 there's a wonderful image of having nothing between you. 09:31 That's absolutely wonderful. 09:32 I think Matthew 19:6 clarifies this even more where it says: 09:47 We're talking about oneness. What is this oneness? 09:49 What does it look like? 09:50 How do we achieve this oneness, and what does God intend 09:54 for us when He says that they are no longer two, but one? 09:58 When we talk about oneness, we realize that the whole 10:02 theme of oneness runs through the theology of the Bible. 10:06 We see that God the Son, the Father, 10:09 and the Holy Ghost are one. 10:11 It's one God. 10:13 Three individuals, three personalities, but one God. 10:17 Also the Bible speaks about Jesus and the church being one. 10:23 It also speaks about marriage as the quintessential relationship 10:28 of oneness in scripture. 10:30 What often happens when couples have children 10:35 is that they tend to concentrate on the children 10:38 instead of on each other. 10:39 Not that you shouldn't concentrate on the children. 10:42 But you should concentrate on each other first. 10:45 Here's a reason why. 10:46 The only relationship in scripture where we're one 10:50 with anyone else is marriage. 10:53 Not one with my parents. 10:54 Not one with my children. 10:56 I'm only one with Elaine. 10:59 So this oneness is a special oneness. 11:02 And it's God ordained and designed. 11:05 We should also talk about the fact that when we 11:07 talk about this oneness, when we talk about coming together, 11:10 about being married, that God is talking about a covenant. 11:13 He's not talking about a contract. 11:15 And we hear so many people today talking about the contract. 11:19 And whether or not the deal is going to be broken 11:22 if something happens. 11:23 And that' not what God intended. 11:24 God intended that we form a covenant, a promise if you will. 11:29 Just like He made a promise to us, His people. 11:31 And this relationship is one that is spiritual, 11:35 as you mentioned earlier. 11:36 It's emotional and physical. 11:39 So, it's not just the benefit of the physical. 11:41 Sometimes, young couples are so excited about the physical part. 11:46 But this is a lot deeper, because truly, there is no 11:50 physical, there's no true physical relationship 11:54 if there isn't the spiritual, if there isn't the emotional. 11:59 And that's what we need to understand when God 12:01 is talking about oneness. 12:02 It's this covenant of two coming together as one. 12:06 We talk about it actually, as a three fold relationship 12:10 where we have God, we have the husband and the wife 12:13 coming together, understanding God's plan 12:18 for unity and marriage. 12:19 That we join with Him in this venture. 12:22 Or I should say adventure, because that's what 12:24 marriage really is. 12:25 It is an adventure and it certainly has 12:27 been an adventure for us in our marriage. 12:31 Indeed. 12:32 When you speak about covenant, I usually think about 12:35 a promise that is made. 12:37 And this promise that's made is not contingent on whether or not 12:41 someone did something for me. 12:43 The fact is, we make a promise to each other. 12:46 And that promise we keep, because we made it. 12:49 It's not based on what the other person is doing. 12:52 It's simply based on the fact that we made a promise. 12:55 And this promise in God's will, is to be permanent. 12:58 In the book of Malachi chapter 2 and verse 16, God says, 13:01 "I hate divorce. " 13:02 He doesn't hate people who have been divorced. 13:05 He doesn't hate people who are divorced. 13:06 But He does hate divorce because it's separation. 13:09 It separates people. 13:11 And God's plan for marriage is that there be unity. 13:15 That people be together. 13:16 That they grow this relationship together. 13:19 Not for a year or 5 years or 10 years, but for eternity. 13:24 Well, in a little while, we'll come back 13:27 and speak to you some more about this oneness 13:29 that we're talking about. 13:30 Right now we're going to go to break. 13:32 And stick around and stay with us and come right back 13:35 as we continue with our topic on the intimacy of marriage 13:39 and the power of one. 13:47 There are many "How To" books available. 13:49 But there's one that's free and perfect for every couple. 13:52 How You Can Build A Better Marriage 13:55 Bible-based matrimonial advice is given in a light-hearted 13:59 easy to read manner for those contemplating marriage, 14:02 newlyweds, couples in their golden years, 14:05 and everyone in between. Call or write for your copy. 14:22 Welcome back. 14:23 We've been talking about the power of one, 14:25 intimacy in marriage. 14:26 We've covered so far, the notion of oneness 14:29 and two becoming one, and what God intends 14:32 for oneness in marriage. 14:34 We're going to continue our discussion talking about 14:36 this mystery of oneness. 14:38 What exactly is this oneness and how does it look? 14:42 We often joke around and say, "Well, God intends for us to be 14:48 one, but which one?" 14:50 And in many relationships, that's not a joke. 14:53 So we want to explore this concept 14:57 of oneness and what it means. 14:59 And it certainly dissipates any myths about the fact that 15:02 perhaps God wants one personality to subsume 15:06 the other personality. 15:07 And that is definitely not what God intended. 15:10 When God talks about us being one, He certainly intends 15:14 as He understands that He made us as such unique beings. 15:18 That we came into this world with our temperaments 15:22 and our personalities. 15:23 And we bring that to the relationship. 15:26 And we bring that into this oneness. 15:28 But when we talk about becoming one, we also need to understand 15:32 that God wants us to understand that we have to, 15:38 I guess what we say is, have a compromise of autonomy. 15:43 That we are no longer operating just for ourselves. 15:47 So when we talk about oneness, we are talking about 15:50 accommodating the other person. 15:52 So someone might say, "Well does that mean that I have to 15:55 compromise on everything?" 15:57 "What if there's something that I like, if I like red 15:59 do I now have to like blue only because the other 16:02 person likes blue?" 16:03 And that is certainly not what God is talking about. 16:05 Well, I find it interesting that the whole notion of 16:10 accommodation and the whole notion of not 16:13 being subsumed by the other. 16:15 And in our culture we like to talk about the fact that 16:19 as men, we are the leaders of our home. 16:23 And Christian men like to often quote Ephesians, where it says 16:31 in Ephesians 5:22, "Wives submit to husbands. " 16:37 And yet, that's not really what the Bible is talking about. 16:41 When we look at scripture and God's plan for marriage, 16:45 we see that this whole leadership is 16:48 not necessarily being a boss. 16:49 This whole notion of leadership is being a leader. 16:53 And a leader doesn't need to set the law down 16:57 because you're actually one. 16:59 And if we're one, then we are negotiating. 17:02 And we're talking together, we are in contact with each other. 17:06 And we are consulting with each other. 17:08 And we're not just moving forward like, 17:10 "Well, the buck stops here and I need to make this decision. " 17:13 If we look at verse 21 of Ephesians 5, it says, 17:17 "Be subject to each other out of reverence for Christ. " 17:21 Indeed, what it's talking about is the mutuality in marriage and 17:24 the fact that God wants us to be partners in this enterprise. 17:28 There's something else about this oneness 17:30 that I really enjoy. 17:33 And we find it in the book of 1 Corinthians chapter 12 17:37 and also 1 Corinthians 14, where it speaks about the body as one. 17:43 It's a unit and yet it's made up of many parts. 17:46 And it uses the body as a metaphor for the church, 17:49 for the body of Christ, that we have different organs 17:53 with different functions, and yet they're all 17:56 intricately united and together. 17:59 Let's say in marriage, husbands have their roles to play, 18:04 and wives have their roles to play, 18:06 and God has us doing different things 18:08 but we're complimentary and we're working together 18:11 and we're working as a body. 18:13 Have you ever been hammering and all of a sudden 18:16 your hammer slips and you hit your finger? 18:19 I usually say, "ouch. " 18:21 Of course, unless you're really masculine and you just look. 18:24 But most of us say, "ouch. " 18:26 That's because the whole body hurts 18:28 when a piece of the body hurts. 18:31 And this is what God is talking about 18:33 when He's talking about oneness and unity and togetherness. 18:36 It's not a separation. 18:38 It is an organic relationship where we feel together, 18:44 we work together, we worship together. 18:47 So that as husband and wife, we can be on the same page 18:52 and lead our children to the kingdom of God. 18:55 That is so powerful, it's just the whole notion of oneness 18:58 and how God has laid it out for us. 19:01 But unfortunately, we understand that in real marriages 19:04 there are certain obstacles to enjoying this oneness. 19:09 And so we want to take a look at 19:10 what some of these obstacles may be. 19:13 Because we believe that if we can identify 19:15 where the challenges are going to be, then we can understand 19:19 how we can offset them. 19:21 And then put our marriages back on the right track 19:24 so we can have this oneness that God intends for us to enjoy. 19:28 So one of the challenges, one of the obstacles to oneness 19:32 would be what we call defensiveness 19:35 and the fear of rejection. 19:36 As we become more intimate with each other, 19:40 this is the challenge of marriage. 19:42 The other person knows us, probably better 19:44 than most other people. 19:46 And when Adam and Eve sinned, what did they do first? 19:51 They covered themselves. They were afraid. 19:54 So they covered up the places where they were most 19:57 different from each other. 19:58 The idea of covering up our differences. 20:03 And don't we do that in marriage? 20:05 Because we know that the other person knows us so well and 20:09 we have shared very intimately with one another 20:13 our thought, our emotions, our feelings. 20:15 When we experience some type of distress in our marriage, 20:21 we begin to cover ourselves up. 20:23 We no longer share with each other. 20:25 And that is definitely an obstacle to oneness 20:29 because if we're no longer sharing with each other 20:31 on an intimate, on a close level, 20:34 talking about more than just the weather. 20:36 And isn't that what happens in relationships? 20:39 That once we start to go down this road of covering up, 20:43 we do only talk about the weather. 20:45 We only talk about taking out the trash. 20:47 We only talk about picking up the kids from school 20:51 or from their after school activities. 20:53 And that becomes an obstacle to oneness. 20:57 Well, one of the problems is that you begin shutting down 21:01 certain parts of your marriage, so that you don't talk about 21:03 them because you think you have different opinions. 21:06 But instead of not talking about them, what we've learned 21:09 is that every crisis situation is an opportunity for growth. 21:13 It might cause a little tension but as you talk 21:16 some more about it, and as you work through it and 21:19 as you share with each other intimately about 21:21 what's going on, there is a tendency for us to get 21:24 on the other side with a greater understanding 21:27 of where our spouse is coming from. 21:28 And then we are growing because we have gotten to know 21:33 more about that individual. 21:34 One of the other obstacles in marriage is 21:37 wrong doing and selfishness. 21:39 We want to do it ourselves. We want it to go our way. 21:44 And while we didn't pay much attention to our parents 21:46 when we were growing up, invariably we want to do it 21:50 the way the Oliver's did it. 21:51 The way my family did it, that's the way 21:54 it's suppose to be done. 21:55 Well, the Powell's had their way of doing it, and it's not bad. 21:58 But really, the right way to do it 22:00 is the way the Oliver's did it. 22:02 That's the tendency we have once we get married. 22:05 We want to be the pre-eminent one. 22:07 And what we're talking about here is oneness. 22:10 So instead of doing it the Oliver way, 22:12 the way I was brought up in my family of origin, 22:15 or the way the Powell's did it, the way Elaine was brought up 22:17 in her family of origin, we want to do it the Oliver/Powell way. 22:21 So we create a new reality because there's a new unit. 22:25 We're married to each other. We are a "one". 22:28 We are one and we are an "us". 22:30 And now it's a new reality. 22:33 I love that. Absolutely. 22:35 We have to understand, as we've been talking about, that 22:38 it's no longer just about me, it's no longer just about you. 22:42 But it is about the "us". 22:43 And it's worth stressing again and again. 22:46 Because in marriage, we can destroy our marriages 22:50 just thinking about, "What's in it for me?" 22:53 "I know the best way. " 22:57 And I think it's worth stressing the "us". 23:00 That we have a new identity. 23:02 Just like when we are born again. 23:04 And we're reborn in Christ. 23:09 It's the same thing with marriage. 23:10 And that's why God uses marriage as a way to more clearly 23:17 illuminate when He talks about His relationship with us. 23:21 That notion of being one with us. 23:24 Another obstacle to oneness is lack of understanding. 23:28 We think that because we are Bible-believing people 23:31 that we read the Bible every day, that we understand 23:35 how to do marriage, how to be one. 23:39 Now clearly, and we've said before that God does provide 23:42 a blueprint, but sometimes we don't really abide 23:46 by the blueprint. 23:47 We don't do the things that God asks us to do. 23:51 So just because we're reading the Bible doesn't mean 23:54 that we are going to know how to talk to one another. 24:00 So what that means then is that we need to be able to go 24:03 someplace where we can be taught. 24:05 Because the dynamics of marriage don't come naturally. 24:09 Even though we think, "Well this should just come naturally. " 24:11 But it doesn't. 24:12 And so we want to talk here as we come towards the end is, 24:15 how can we preserve this oneness. 24:17 What kinds of things can we do to have this oneness 24:21 in our marriages? 24:22 And one of the first things we can do is by 24:25 being committed to destroying the obstacles 24:28 in our relationships. 24:29 In the bible, in the book of Colossians 3:19, it says: 24:42 It's so easy for husbands and wives to have bad feelings 24:45 in their marital relationship. 24:47 And so what we need to do is to destroy 24:50 these obstacles to oneness. 24:53 Being committed to destroying every obstacle 24:56 in our relationship and speaking kindly and gently 24:59 and nurturingly to our spouses. 25:04 We also need to be more intentional about 25:06 improving as a spouse. 25:08 Yes, we do need to improve. 25:10 Often times, I say to people that I find myself 25:14 praying for my husband. 25:15 And that's a good thing, we should pray for our spouse. 25:17 But one of the things that I've learned to do 25:19 is to pray and ask God to help me be the kind of wife 25:23 that He wants me to be. 25:25 Help me to be a better person. 25:26 James 1:19 says it well. 25:42 I think that sums it up when we talk about 25:43 being our best selves. 25:46 If I take the time to listen to you then I actually benefit 25:51 because I have a better understanding of who you are 25:54 and how I can be a better spouse to you. 25:57 And one other way of doing that is being dedicated to knowing 26:00 one's spouse deeply. 26:02 I hear often, people who have been married for 20 years 26:05 or 30 years, and the marriage is still rocky. 26:08 It's not going better. 26:09 That's because we've lived one year 30 times over. 26:11 And what we need to learn to do in marriage 26:13 is to grow every day. 26:15 And for that the scripture says in 1 Corinthians 13:4,7,8 26:37 So we need to be dedicated to knowing our spouse deeply. 26:40 And being kind about it, and being intentional about it. 26:44 Because love never fails. 26:47 And we also need to have a commitment to oneness. 26:51 Ellen White says it well in Happiness Homemade. 27:17 Now the whole enterprise of marriage is difficult. 27:19 It's hard stuff. But... 27:21 There's nothing more rewarding than working together through 27:26 the Spirit of God to bring ourselves in marriage 27:31 to be one with our mate. 27:33 It's God's plan. 27:34 And there's a promise of success in Philippians 4:13. 27:39 And it says, "I can do all things through Him 27:41 who strengthens me. " 27:43 God bless you and stay strong. |
Revised 2014-12-17