Welcome to
Marriage in God's Hands.
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I'm Willie Lee, your host,
and our co-host is Wilma Lee.
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Welcome, today we're
going to talk about marriage,
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- celebrating uniqueness.
- And that uniqueness you
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can see in us. We hope that
you will join us in prayer as we
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begin this
session. Thank You dear Lord
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for creating us in Your
image, and we know, dear Lord,
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that as You have created us
You will support us and help us
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grow as a person, as well as
as a child of God, and we ask
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You to bless us as
we discuss this today.
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Lord, we know that You created
us, male and female, in Your
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image, so bless us as You
bring Your Holy Spirit into this
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conversation. We thank You
in the name of Jesus, amen.
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You can tell by our topic that
we're going to be talking about
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something that's very, very
special and very dear to our
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heart because as we look
different, and some people say
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we don't look that different,
but we are different, both male
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and female, as well as
personality, temperament,
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and we have a fun time together
because we are different,
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we're not exactly the same, and
we've learned how to celebrate
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that uniqueness and
differentness that we have
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as individuals and
persons in our marriage.
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Yeah, I think that
that's been the fun thing.
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You know, when you proposed
you asked me if I'd be bored
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for the rest of my life, and for
the past 40 years one thing I've
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not been is bored because
we are unique and different.
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And every day I
find out something new.
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- Oh, do
you...still? - Oh, definitely.
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And I thought I had stopped
releasing that new stuff.
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- Are you alive and breathing?
- I'm alive and breathing.
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- Okay. - So I'm
still releasing, huh?
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- Oh, definitely. -
Well, as we look at the Word
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of God. We can see in Luke
2:52, we're very familiar with
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this Scripture, we talk about
Jesus in light of the fact that
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He grew in wisdom, and in
stature, and in favor with God
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and man. As you read about
Jesus, Jesus was often talked
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about as someone different than
the norm, people looked at Him
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in a different way, and they all
loved Him, and they were dear
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to His heart, and He was dear
to many people's hearts because
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He represented a different
type of a person than they've
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been used to
having in their lives.
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And that is the beginning of our
discussion, because obviously,
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when Jesus came to this earth
He came fully as man, as well as
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fully God, but His personality,
and the personhood of Jesus
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was very unique
and very special.
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Yes, in Genesis God says He
created the male and female,
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so His plan was that they
would reflect His image uniquely
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- as male and female. -
That is a very, very special
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understanding, a lot of times we
go right past that and we fail
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to realize that when God created
you, and when God created
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your spouse, in Adam and
Eve, as He did at the beginning,
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the same thing He expects
of us - that we represent God
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through our gender, that's first
of all, and also through our
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uniqueness of personality,
and the way that we are
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as individuals. I guess
complicating that a little bit
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is after sin because after
sin the roles that are spoken
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of in Genesis 3, He says
that there would be certain ways
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that we would approach life and
approach each other that would
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be different; that there
is not a sameness about man,
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even after sin, and
woman, that they both would have
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to go through life with a little
bit more difficulty, and would
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have to have different ways in
which they approach the world,
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so there is a differentness,
and instead of using that
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as a point that we try to
make everybody like each other,
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we must celebrate that
differentness and especially as
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- it is reflective of God.
- But I think that if we just
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look at males and females, not
only are they different when you
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look at them, but if you
peal back that top layer where
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the brain is, we find
that they're wired differently.
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Oh yes, and if you haven't
noticed that in the way that
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people respond to each
other as male and female,
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there are many different types
of humorous stories that are
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told about the differentness
of men and women. But more than
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just in a humorous way,
there is a definite need to have
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the input of both, because they
bring something very special
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from the male perspective and
the female perspective because
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of being wired differently,
and seeing the world through
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different filters and different
eyes, and that makes for
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a blending of something
very special in a marriage.
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And God made it so from
the beginning, and it's unique,
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and it's very interesting that
it's taken scientists here, now,
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as they study the brain to find
that out, but that was God's
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plan because He said
that it was a help meet,
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a completing of one and the
other, because male and female
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- reflect the image of God.
- Ahh, that is something unique
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and special because when you
have 2 people in a husband and
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a wife, as Adam and Eve were
created in the image of God,
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and they were created by
the Father, the Son and the Holy
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Ghost, who are 3 persons,
but yet bringing their unique
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purposes, even though they're
combined into the Godhead,
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they represent different parts
of God, and the way He works
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with us, and the way He
works with the universe.
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And so it is with the
husband and wife, that we must
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maintain and celebrate our
uniqueness and differentness
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in our perspective in the
world because as we see through
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the eyes that God has created
in us, and as we reflect through
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the Word of God, and through
our relationship with God,
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we are to know that that
differentness creates something
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that is going to be very,
very practical in the way that
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we not only see the
world, but work in the world
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and represent God in the world.
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Yes, because we are told
that Holy Spirit gives gifts
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and talents to whom He will,
so that means that everybody
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comes to a relationship with
their own set of gifts, talents,
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personalities and temperaments,
and they're usually not the same
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- as their spouses.
- So not only ties into
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Galatians 5:22,23, it also ties
into 1 Corinthians 12 as well,
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that talks about gift
through the Holy Spirit.
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The Holy Spirit gives those
gifts, that that's when you're
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connected with God, and you
are really in tune with Him,
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then God can take who
you are as a husband and wife
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and create something that
is more than just a male or
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a female, but in their
unit itself, then the marriage
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becomes unique and we celebrate
the fact that not every marriage
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is going to look alike, just
like individuals are not going
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to look alike, they're all going
to reflect God, but they're
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going to reflect the gifts
that the Holy Spirit has brought
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- to that marriage. -
Definitely, and no husband
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and wife will look like any
other husband and wife because
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everybody is unique and God
celebrates that because He's
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- a big God. - Okay,
so even though they may
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not look alike, or even act
alike, but their behaviors will
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be respective of
God's behavior, they will be
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Christ-like in their behavior,
they will reflect the fruits
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of the Spirit in their
relationships with each other,
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as well as with others,
but each one will have a unique
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and special flavor
Now, maybe you can share
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with me some ways that that's
expressed within the marriage
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when a woman looks at the
marriage, and looks at being
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the wife of the husband, and
the husband looks at the wife.
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How do we celebrate that
uniqueness as man and wife with
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each other in our marriage.
Well, I guess that goes back
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to where we talked
about boundaries because when
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a husband and wife look at each
other, then they look at what
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they uniquely bring to the
marriage. You know, as a couple
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we're kind of strange because
people think that I'm the shy,
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retiring one in
this twosome. Not!
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Oh my, that would be
a strange thought, yes.
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So often times it looks
like I'm the more outgoing,
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talkative one when
that's not really the case.
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I just talk a lot sometimes.
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I'm not going to
try to parse that.
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No, don't do that, but at
any rate, because people make
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assumptions, because of what
they see, then it isn't always
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what people see, but
that's not their boundary.
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Okay, so what you're saying is
that whatever a wife may bring
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to that marriage, or the husband
brings to that marriage in
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their personality, temperament,
the way they interact,
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is not to be determined by
people outside of that marriage.
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- Exactly. - That's
something they work out
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with God within their marriage,
and we ought to be able
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to celebrate with them the
differentness that each of them
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brings. That's not
an easy thing, is it?
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And I think that for a
lot of contemporary couples
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where some wives make more money
than their husbands, and as we
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look at times past, husbands
made more money than wives
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and that was the expectation,
there's the discussion about
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who should be in charge
because money was usually
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the determining factor.
There's discussion about
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- then who is in charge?
- Well, was money the only
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determining factor
or was it also gender?
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Well, society said that
the person who made the most
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money, usually the man,
was the person in charge.
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But times have changed now,
so sometimes women make the most
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money, and there's the
tug of what they say, society,
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versus the reality of the
person who makes the most money
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may not be the man. So
does it mean that because
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he does not make the money
that he shouldn't be respected
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as Ephesians 5 says, as the
head of the home, or the head
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- of the family? -
No, not at all, however,
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that does not mean then
that that is an unequal marriage
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as some people would imply
because she makes more money
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- than he. - Well,
this is an interesting
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thing. Just to talk
about one area of differentness
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and uniqueness, but there
are many other things that are
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other than just financial things
that cause a couple to have
00:12:58.26\00:13:02.47
to struggle with the
issues of uniqueness and how we
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celebrate that, and
how we respect that.
00:13:06.71\00:13:09.51
And you brought another thing
in and that's the boundaries,
00:13:09.54\00:13:12.31
so our next period of time
when we talk we're going to be
00:13:12.34\00:13:15.71
talking about some other
areas in which boundaries,
00:13:15.74\00:13:18.68
and uniqueness, and special
celebration of that uniqueness
00:13:18.71\00:13:22.46
will take place, so stay right
there please, and let's continue
00:13:22.49\00:13:26.64
our discussion as we
talk about managing marriage
00:13:26.67\00:13:30.88
in God's hands.
00:13:30.91\00:13:33.06
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Welcome back to
Marriage in God's Hands.
00:14:15.93\00:14:18.27
We're discussing marriage
as a celebration of uniqueness
00:14:18.30\00:14:24.59
in a couple of different
ways, and as we've been talking
00:14:24.62\00:14:27.77
about that we've been showing
from the Word of God how God
00:14:27.80\00:14:32.02
has created us special and
unique, both as male and female,
00:14:32.05\00:14:35.56
but also with our
personality and temperament,
00:14:35.59\00:14:38.73
and gifts of the Holy Spirit
as provided for us based upon
00:14:38.76\00:14:43.74
how the fruits operated
as well. You have some things
00:14:43.77\00:14:48.09
you can share with us a little
bit more about how that might
00:14:48.12\00:14:51.69
look when God gets into
the lives and begins to express
00:14:51.72\00:14:56.92
Himself through husbands
and wives in their unique roles,
00:14:56.95\00:15:01.25
or their unique
place in marriage.
00:15:01.28\00:15:03.65
Well, Galatians 5:13-15, from
the Message, paraphrased, says
00:15:03.68\00:15:10.76
"It is absolutely clear that God
has called you to a free life, "
00:15:10.79\00:15:15.98
"just make sure that you don't
use this freedom as an excuse"
00:15:16.01\00:15:19.46
"to do whatever you want to
do and destroy your freedom. "
00:15:19.49\00:15:23.91
And I think that's interesting
because we often think
00:15:23.94\00:15:27.83
"I'm free to do whatever I want
to do", but here we're talking
00:15:27.86\00:15:31.28
about using freedom to
destroy freedom. It says:
00:15:31.31\00:15:34.73
"Rather use your freedom to
serve one another in love, "
00:15:34.76\00:15:38.27
"that's how freedom grows.
For everything we know about"
00:15:38.30\00:15:41.81
"God's word is summed up in
a single sentence: love others"
00:15:41.84\00:15:46.20
"as you love yourself.
That's an act of true freedom. "
00:15:46.23\00:15:50.13
"If you bite and ravage each
other, watch out, in no time"
00:15:50.16\00:15:53.99
"at all you will be annihilating
each other and where will"
00:15:54.02\00:15:57.61
"your precious
freedom be then? "
00:15:57.64\00:16:00.76
That's a terrific translation
because it really brings it down
00:16:00.79\00:16:06.30
and makes it very real to
us. We're living in an age now
00:16:06.33\00:16:11.29
where people are saying
"I'm free to do what I want to",
00:16:11.32\00:16:13.70
and even in marriages,
especially among younger couples
00:16:13.73\00:16:18.11
coming in and saying "Well,
I have my life, you have your"
00:16:18.14\00:16:20.62
"life, we can live it
like we want to live it",
00:16:20.65\00:16:23.44
and sometimes we find
them giving up on marriage very
00:16:23.47\00:16:26.84
quickly because they're not
utilizing the freedom God gives
00:16:26.87\00:16:32.00
them to be who they are
to complement one another,
00:16:32.03\00:16:35.21
or to supplement each
other, they're using it rather,
00:16:35.24\00:16:37.77
to devour each other, or to
test, or threaten one another
00:16:37.80\00:16:42.15
because "I've got to have
it my way, I've got to do what"
00:16:42.18\00:16:44.25
"I need to do". God
says that's not the way
00:16:44.28\00:16:46.94
to celebrate uniqueness,
there is a better way that that
00:16:46.97\00:16:52.07
freedom can be used in
Christ to celebrate uniqueness.
00:16:52.10\00:16:56.60
Can you maybe share with
us another way that uniqueness
00:16:56.63\00:17:01.96
can be celebrated that
adds to the marriage and adds
00:17:01.99\00:17:05.06
to the image of
Christ being restored in us.
00:17:05.09\00:17:08.42
Well, I think we go back
to where we were talking about
00:17:08.45\00:17:11.70
communication, words of
encouragement, because we look
00:17:11.73\00:17:18.31
at what happens when 2 unique
individuals come together,
00:17:18.34\00:17:23.64
you always have your own
cheering squad because that
00:17:23.67\00:17:28.20
other person rejoices when you
rejoice, and Solomon talks about
00:17:28.23\00:17:34.68
a chord being bound together
where 2 are always better than
00:17:34.71\00:17:39.18
1 and that you become a strong
team. So therefore you know
00:17:39.21\00:17:46.20
you always have somebody
on your side cheering for you.
00:17:46.23\00:17:50.26
So no matter what happens
outside you know you have
00:17:50.29\00:17:55.18
somebody in your corner,
and that's always the best part
00:17:55.21\00:18:00.76
of having that spouse who has
that encouraging word for you,
00:18:00.79\00:18:05.67
or the Kleenex for you when
things get tough, or somebody
00:18:05.70\00:18:09.68
to say "I know you can do
it, no matter what anybody"
00:18:09.71\00:18:13.03
"else says", so that's a part
of celebrating the uniqueness
00:18:13.06\00:18:17.99
because you need
somebody in your corner.
00:18:18.02\00:18:21.47
That's a very important
part of what we have found to be
00:18:21.50\00:18:25.70
very, very special for
our lives. As we got married,
00:18:25.73\00:18:29.67
of course, we made decisions
about children, about who was
00:18:29.70\00:18:32.82
going to stay at home and raise
the children while the other
00:18:32.85\00:18:35.24
was out, and that was fairly
traditional at that point,
00:18:35.27\00:18:41.47
but there was also another
decision that was made in which
00:18:41.50\00:18:45.01
we said after the children
are in school, and of course,
00:18:45.04\00:18:48.15
we chose church school
because we wanted them taught of
00:18:48.18\00:18:50.49
the Lord in the home as well
as in the school, then there was
00:18:50.52\00:18:54.83
an opportunity for you to finish
your education and to pursue
00:18:54.86\00:18:59.80
your work for Christ with
the training and the background
00:18:59.83\00:19:04.77
that you wanted to follow,
so we celebrated your uniqueness
00:19:04.80\00:19:08.18
and your gifts, even while
we were still allowing the gifts
00:19:08.21\00:19:12.92
of the Holy Spirit through
ministry and the pastorate
00:19:12.95\00:19:16.28
in my life. And that's another
way that we can say God is able
00:19:16.31\00:19:22.29
to celebrate the uniqueness.
John 15 talks about how we love
00:19:22.32\00:19:27.97
one another, the commandment
"love one another as I have"
00:19:28.00\00:19:31.69
"loved you", or He also says:
"Love one another as you love"
00:19:31.72\00:19:39.80
"yourself", so in marriage
we have another self who is
00:19:39.83\00:19:47.06
our wife or our husband,
and they're not the same
00:19:47.09\00:19:50.87
personality, they're not the
same temperament, but we read
00:19:50.90\00:19:55.53
in Genesis where the 2 become
1, but the self is not destroyed
00:19:55.56\00:20:03.96
of each person when they become
one they become so united.
00:20:03.99\00:20:08.27
Because Adam said: "This is now
bone of my bone, flesh of my"
00:20:08.30\00:20:13.18
"flesh, but she
shall be called 'woman'. "
00:20:13.21\00:20:18.86
And you know, as we look at
that the gender difference is
00:20:18.89\00:20:24.15
downplayed today in many
aspects. Now a woman can pursue
00:20:24.18\00:20:30.04
careers that only men pursued at
one point, but that should not
00:20:30.07\00:20:34.63
separate or cause the decisions
in the home to be changed
00:20:34.66\00:20:41.38
just because we can change
them, they ought to be changed
00:20:41.41\00:20:46.01
and reflect the gifts at home,
it ought to reflect also your
00:20:46.04\00:20:51.81
gender at home. Mothers
are still great mothers.
00:20:51.84\00:20:56.45
God, I think, built into
motherhood something that a man
00:20:56.48\00:21:00.53
who is a father could
never really do, not completely.
00:21:00.56\00:21:04.36
You might parent and you might
be a great nurturing parent,
00:21:04.39\00:21:08.40
but a father can't be a mother,
and a mother can't be a father.
00:21:08.43\00:21:12.96
- Definitely. - So
the uniqueness of those
00:21:12.99\00:21:15.52
roles in parenting, and in
making the home special is still
00:21:15.55\00:21:21.55
something that God wants us
to celebrate and to keep in its
00:21:21.58\00:21:26.91
order and in its place.
I feel very strongly about
00:21:26.94\00:21:33.68
that celebration, that freedom,
00:21:33.71\00:21:35.64
and the boundaries that each
couple has to decide which role,
00:21:35.67\00:21:41.63
and when, and how, God gives
us that privilege of working
00:21:41.66\00:21:45.98
- that out within our home.
- And I'm so glad that we serve
00:21:46.01\00:21:49.81
a God who trusts us with
that freedom. So often we think
00:21:49.84\00:21:54.53
that God is very limiting,
but we serve a God who created
00:21:54.56\00:21:59.22
us with a brain, and an
intellect, and the opportunity
00:21:59.25\00:22:03.80
to exercise that, and to
have that type of freedom within
00:22:03.83\00:22:09.81
the walk we have with
Him. I am so excited about that
00:22:09.84\00:22:14.87
opportunity to celebrate that,
and for couples to develop that
00:22:14.90\00:22:19.87
within their home, I think
that's so wonderful to have that
00:22:19.90\00:22:24.05
- kind of God. - So
we won't have to destroy
00:22:24.08\00:22:28.79
each other, we can
build each other up in Christ.
00:22:28.82\00:22:33.28
That's something about wholeness
that comes out of that,
00:22:33.31\00:22:36.20
it really creates a whole
when you're looking at the wife
00:22:36.23\00:22:40.83
and the husband in the
home, and they're sharing that
00:22:40.86\00:22:43.89
leadership position, but
recognizing and understanding
00:22:43.92\00:22:47.33
that God wants a man to
take the spiritual leadership
00:22:47.36\00:22:50.73
and to exercise the leadership
in that home and make sure
00:22:50.76\00:22:53.08
the family goes the way
it needs to go, and that wife
00:22:53.11\00:22:58.00
is a coregent with her husband,
and submitting to his leadership
00:22:58.03\00:23:04.57
- in Christ. - Yes.
00:23:04.60\00:23:06.83
Now, once again,
these boundaries have to be
00:23:06.86\00:23:09.67
established in the home by
the couple in their study of
00:23:09.70\00:23:14.06
the Word of God, in
their relationship with Christ.
00:23:14.09\00:23:16.98
And realizing that everybody
has a responsibility to answer
00:23:17.01\00:23:21.63
to Christ for the gifts
and abilities given to them
00:23:21.66\00:23:25.85
individually, and that Christ
would have an accounting to them
00:23:25.88\00:23:30.87
for what they have been
given, and if both people
00:23:30.90\00:23:34.04
are growing in Christ
with what they have been given,
00:23:34.07\00:23:37.69
how exciting can that be, that's
just an awesome experience,
00:23:37.72\00:23:42.78
and to see that for 2 people
to grow together in Christ,
00:23:42.81\00:23:47.05
I mean, isn't that what Christ
was doing every day when He
00:23:47.08\00:23:49.84
came and walked and talked
in the garden with Adam and Eve?
00:23:49.87\00:23:52.91
That's right, and we not only
have Him walking and talking
00:23:52.94\00:23:56.54
with them, but in many of the
aspects after sin we need help
00:23:56.57\00:24:05.36
because we do make missteps
and mistakes along the way,
00:24:05.39\00:24:09.71
and who better to love
you unconditionally is Christ,
00:24:09.74\00:24:13.03
except your mate, your spouse
in Christ ought to be the first
00:24:13.06\00:24:17.04
one to say "I know that's rough,
and yes, it was tough going"
00:24:17.07\00:24:21.50
"through that, but I'm not
giving up on you, I love you, "
00:24:21.53\00:24:25.92
"Christ loves you, and I
will exercise my freedom"
00:24:25.95\00:24:31.23
"to support you to continue
to grow, and to learn from"
00:24:31.26\00:24:35.10
"your experience.
" We all need that.
00:24:35.13\00:24:37.53
That's right, and it's
often nice to have another
00:24:37.56\00:24:41.20
perspective, to look at things
and say "Well, what do you"
00:24:41.23\00:24:46.06
"think about this... ", or
"here's an alternative... "
00:24:46.09\00:24:50.39
because sometimes out of
your frustration or your hurt
00:24:50.42\00:24:55.19
you don't have that ability
to see that for yourself.
00:24:55.22\00:24:58.63
And we don't have to collapse
into a "Mars/Venus" thing
00:24:58.66\00:25:01.68
because often times in homes
you do have people on different
00:25:01.71\00:25:05.51
planets, and we don't need
to be on different planets,
00:25:05.54\00:25:09.31
or from different planets,
we need to be in relationship
00:25:09.34\00:25:14.78
with Christ, and to be one
with Christ, and to feel with
00:25:14.81\00:25:19.06
each other and support one
another. This has been a very,
00:25:19.09\00:25:22.65
very meaningful discussion
and I hope that you at home
00:25:22.68\00:25:27.55
can continue to use the
dialogue as we have discussed in
00:25:27.58\00:25:31.58
a previous program to exercise
that uniqueness, and to share
00:25:31.61\00:25:38.17
with each other how you feel
and how you would like to see
00:25:38.20\00:25:41.74
your marriage, and
your relationship grow.
00:25:41.77\00:25:45.79
Who needs the
support? Who needs help?
00:25:45.82\00:25:49.73
Who needs to be encouraged?
So make sure that your dialogue
00:25:49.76\00:25:54.39
is encouraging and up building
in Christ with one another.
00:25:54.42\00:25:58.89
Maybe it's time for us to pray.
00:25:58.92\00:26:01.31
- I think so. - Dear
Lord, thank You so much
00:26:01.34\00:26:05.74
for sharing with us through Your
Word the different instructions
00:26:05.77\00:26:10.74
on how to be united and one,
and at the same time be very
00:26:10.77\00:26:15.82
special and unique. May we
continue to uphold one another
00:26:15.85\00:26:20.30
in Christ according to the
power and the understanding
00:26:20.33\00:26:24.80
- through Your Spirit.
- And thank You for being
00:26:24.83\00:26:27.40
a big enough God to make
us different, and yet unique,
00:26:27.43\00:26:31.92
and to reflect Your image.
We thank You for this privilege,
00:26:31.95\00:26:35.85
in the name of
Jesus we pray, amen.
00:26:35.88\00:26:40.94
I think there are many thing
that can be discussed out of
00:26:40.97\00:26:44.16
this in our coupleness in
our marriage. Don't you feel
00:26:44.19\00:26:49.70
that there's a lot of things
that will grow out of this?
00:26:49.73\00:26:52.55
I think so, and I think
that there's a lot of cause for
00:26:52.58\00:26:55.50
celebration maybe where
we haven't found a reason
00:26:55.53\00:26:59.23
to celebrate our uniqueness.
Yes, it's a lot better
00:26:59.26\00:27:04.73
to celebrate uniqueness
than to challenge one another
00:27:04.76\00:27:08.91
and to devour one
another and destroy each other.
00:27:08.94\00:27:11.96
There's no need for that,
there's room enough in God's
00:27:11.99\00:27:15.18
kingdom, in God's economy, and
in the family, in the marriage
00:27:15.21\00:27:19.64
for both of us to exercise
the gifts of the Spirit after
00:27:19.67\00:27:24.02
having developed the
fruits of the Spirit.
00:27:24.05\00:27:25.94
- Yes. - And
remember, the fruits
00:27:25.97\00:27:28.30
are needed in order to
know how to exercise the gifts.
00:27:28.33\00:27:32.07
- Yes. - So in
your prayer, in your
00:27:32.10\00:27:35.29
dialogue, in your togetherness,
remember, there is a uniqueness
00:27:35.32\00:27:39.69
that God has given to each
one of you, celebrate that,
00:27:39.72\00:27:42.93
and celebrate it as a
couple of God, God bless you.
00:27:42.96\00:27:46.38