Participants: Alane Waters, Tom Waters
Series Code: MGH
Program Code: MGH000007
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00:01 A promise
00:03 to love 00:06 in good times 00:08 and bad 00:11 for richer 00:14 or poorer 00:17 forsaking all others 00:19 as long as 00:21 you both shall live 00:25 MARRIAGE In God's Hands 00:28 Marriage Heart to Heart with Tom & Alane Waters 00:33 Welcome to Marriage Heart to Heart 00:36 We are Tom & Alane Waters with Restoration International 00:40 We hope you have your pencils and paper ready because today 00:43 we're gonna be talking about Establishing our Roles 00:46 in the Marriage! 00:49 You know, this is something that I guess we would call it 00:52 a "hot topic" because there's been 00:56 a real misunderstanding in erosion a way of the roles 01:00 not just women's roles today, but 01:03 the real place that God designed for man to take. 01:07 So, we want to begin right back at the beginning 01:11 with what God has showed us 01:14 the best way for man and wife. So if you have your Bibles, 01:19 turns with us today to Genesis. We're gonna be looking at 01:21 Genesis the second chapter in the 18 verse: 01:27 "And the LORD God said, It is not good that man should 01:31 be alone; I will make him an help meet. " 01:37 A qualified, suitable helper. I put that in parenthesis. 01:42 That's what a help meet is. 01:45 So, when God created man and women, He created them equal. 01:49 Because women was taken from man's side. 01:53 That meant: she was not to rule over him, to be above him 01:56 or not to be below him, to be stepped on or walked on. 02:00 That's what God designed in the original Plan of Creation 02:03 for husband and wife. 02:05 So, what happened? 02:07 Well, Eve decided she was going to try something 02:11 a little different. 02:13 And she chose to leave her husband's side. 02:17 And in her wanderings she fell into temptation. 02:22 And after that happened we see a difference in the role 02:26 of men and women as God placed there early in Genesis. 02:30 So, then am I to understand that the problem is that you 02:35 can never physically leave my side!? 02:38 No! Not at all! 02:40 But it means that women need to be content with the role 02:43 God has given them, in the home and not to become disillusioned 02:46 or dissatisfied looking for something else. 02:50 Ok. So there's a restlessness that Eve experienced 02:54 an in her restlessness she tried to take herself into a position 02:58 and do some things that God never designed for her. 03:02 And as some of you may or may not know in the Biblical account 03:06 there Eve was standing at that tree that she wasn't supposed to 03:11 be partaking of and the Devil insinuated himself there 03:16 as a serpent, 03:17 and gave her the illusion that if she would just eat this fruit 03:21 she would be, well the snake was talking supposedly, 03:25 and that she would be like the Gods and that in reality God 03:29 was withholding something that was really good for her. 03:32 And if she could experience this she would have a 03:35 higher understanding. 03:37 Well, as we know, she did experience this and it didn't 03:41 give her that. All she got out of that experience was 03:46 she found out what sin and transgression was like and 03:48 the pain begin there. 03:50 And it immediately affected their home. 03:53 Up until that point there was no contention, no problem, 03:57 no strife in the marriage. But when that happened 04:00 and The Lord came back to Adam and Eve and wanted 04:03 to make them accountable immediately blame began. 04:07 Eve blamed, Adam blamed and then we had the whole problem that 04:11 we still can see in marriages: blaming each other. 04:14 That's right! 04:15 And so, in Genesis 3:16 in the second half of the verse there 04:21 this is where we see that Eve lost her perfect equality. 04:26 She chose to step away from the role that God gave her 04:29 and she lost her perfect equality there. 04:31 And part of Eve's consequences there in Genesis 3:16 04:38 we're told: "thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he 04:42 shall rule over thee. " 04:46 wooow! 04:47 Rule over! I don't know of any woman who likes that term: 04:52 to be ruled over! 04:54 It was a hard one for me because I interpreted that to mean 04:57 that I have no more choice, no more say! 05:02 That I was to be controlled by somebody else. 05:05 That's not what it says! 05:07 That's right! 05:09 So, don't click off the program thinking: "oh boy! Here we go!" 05:14 "Now we're gonna talk about putting women in their place 05:16 today. " That's not what we're talking about here. 05:19 Our desire, in our own marriage, our desire has been to find 05:25 and establish or shall I say reestablish the real positions 05:30 that God has for us! Because where He created us 05:34 the closer we can come back to where He created us 05:38 the happier we are going to be as individuals and the happier 05:41 more blended we're going to be 05:43 in our marriages. 05:44 That's right! So, let's look at those roles than that we have 05:48 that God uniquely designed for us 05:51 to enter into as husband and wife in the marriage. 05:56 You know, the Apostle Paul tells us there in 1 Corinthians 11 06:01 verse 3: "I would have you know, that the head of every man 06:06 is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; 06:11 and the head of Christ is God. " 06:15 I think we can take a step back and look at how Christ shows 06:21 to be under the Heavenly Father. 06:25 It was a choice that He made. He was equal with God. 06:29 And because of sin, because of this very scenario that we just 06:33 talked about, where Eve decided that she was gonna do her own 06:36 thing and than Adam got involved and we know the story. 06:40 God and Jesus had a plan! Jesus chose to be under the Lordship 06:47 under the Head of His Father, 06:50 in order to carry out the plan of salvation. I think 06:52 that's beautiful! It was a cooperative plan that 06:55 where Jesus willingly, Jesus chose to willingly become 06:59 a servant. He chose to become a sun. He chose to become 07:05 a Savior! 07:06 Our savior! 07:08 And that's beautiful! 07:09 And I think if we can look at this context now where 07:13 where Paul the Apostle says that "the head of every woman 07:16 is the man. " 07:19 I know in our marriage we had some struggles with this. 07:24 Early on, especially! - Well, I wanted you to be 07:26 the head but I wanted you to do it my way! 07:27 That's right! 07:28 That was the problem! 07:32 I think that if we look at this in the way that Jesus 07:36 looked at this for our salvation. 07:40 Aren't you happier when you are in the position 07:42 that God designed for you to be? 07:44 Oh absolutely! I have found out to be the happiest I've been 07:48 because I can trust in your leadership! But it doesn't mean 07:52 that you make all the decisions alone! 07:54 That's right! - Because we work together! 07:56 And that's what that cooperation that is demonstrate 07:59 through Christ and the Father. 08:01 And that same thing needs to be demonstrated between 08:03 a husband and wife, that's the cooperation between the two. 08:06 That's right! 08:07 It's like having a team, you know! Your dad has often talked 08:10 about having a team of horses out on the farm you know! 08:13 That's right! - He used to drive a team 08:14 of horses when they planted the fields or plowed the fields. 08:17 And he talks about, he'd always tell us about the main horse. 08:23 They were yoked together but he'd have the main horse 08:26 that was the lead horse and then the other horse. But 08:30 they were a team together. 08:31 The lead horse by himself wouldn't be sufficient 08:35 to meet the task. And certainly 08:37 the other one needed the leadership of the lead horse. 08:41 So I think it's a beautiful illustration of what God designs 08:45 for us in our marriage, that we read here in the New Testament, 08:49 the Apostle Paul is talking about, that cooperation 08:51 that team effort! But there needs to be a leader and there 08:54 needs to be a helper, a help meet. 08:57 And even in the beginning, in the perfect environment 08:59 woman's role was called to be a help-mate for her husband. 09:05 So, the issue here, in this I wanna say especially for 09:09 the ladies that are listening, are watching today. 09:13 The issue here is not that we have to get woman 09:17 back into her right place. 09:20 And man just goes on business as usual. 09:24 What we're talking about is roles, plural today. 09:28 We're talking about getting men and women back into our 09:32 right roles, because we're living in a society 09:35 where it's been lost. 09:37 And it's being lost. It hasn't completely being lost, but 09:41 We wanna see the man take up responsibility. When I 09:45 began take up responsibility as the real priest and leader 09:50 of our home it made it a lot easier for you, 09:54 to take up in desire to take your role as the wife 09:59 in the home. - That's right! 10:01 So maybe we should turn to Ephesians 5:22 because 10:05 here we find it very clear. We've talked about this already 10:08 through this series Marriage Heart to Heart, 10:11 about the role of the wife, and it says here: 10:14 "Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands 10:17 as unto the Lord. " 10:19 Now, unless we learn how to really submit or surrender 10:23 ourselves to God, we are going to find it impossible 10:27 to really understand how to submit to our husband. 10:32 Because we have to understand how to do it unto the Lord first 10:36 And one of the things that helped me the most was to know 10:39 that God only wants what is best for me! 10:41 And when I choose to trust Him, that's really what submission is 10:45 I trust Him with my life! I trust Him with my being, 10:50 with my happiness, with my peace with my joy! I trust Him! 10:55 And when I trust God it makes it easy to trust you! 11:00 - I know! - And God then fulfills 11:02 what He can do and He wants to do in us. 11:05 And to give us that peace and contentment. 11:08 That's right! 11:09 Now was there a time when it was difficult for you to trust me? 11:14 Oh Yes! - Do you remember that little 11:16 situation that happened when we were making our move 11:19 to the country? 11:21 Yes! I was learning in little things to trust 11:24 and to be submissive, in small ways and it's a growing process. 11:29 Because having been single and had my own career 11:32 and my own profession, lived in my own apartment 11:35 made all my own decisions. 11:37 And to move from that to being married, you know I wanted that 11:40 dependence on you but I still had a problem with controlling 11:44 thing myself! And I learned little by little in small things 11:47 and it was growing but when we made the move 11:50 and we were leaving our medical professions and all the security 11:54 of that, and we were moving to the country 11:58 and you were going to change occupations 12:01 A lot of changes! - A lot of changes! All at once! 12:04 I had it all figured out! This was my plan: 12:08 "Look, we're gonna move from suburbia 12:11 from health professions, we're gonna move to the country 12:14 they don't really need a lot of program directors for radiology, 12:18 X ray teachers" I guess I could say to make it simple. 12:22 What, you know, there's not those kind of jobs 12:25 where we were moving. 12:27 So, my reasoning, my understanding was: 12:31 "I'll just continue my nursing profession, I'll be a nurse. 12:35 everywhere, everywhere there's jobs for nurses! 12:38 I'll continue in my role as a nurse and make a little money 12:42 to sustain the family until you could establish your profession" 12:49 And what did I think about that? 12:52 You challenged me! 12:55 In a very loving way! 12:57 You said: "Honey we're not gonna move across the country, 13:01 for you to be out of the home and working. " 13:04 "The whole purpose of this is to return to God's original plan 13:07 as close as we can!" 13:09 "I don't want you working!" 13:11 And, you know: "I'll take care of you!" That was the promise, 13:14 the commitment you made to me. 13:17 - I know. - And I found it a joy 13:19 to surrender to that. Because it wasn't looking for my way out. 13:25 'Cause you really didn't wanna go back to work at that point. 13:28 I really didn't want to, but I felt like you know somebody 13:31 has to make an income. - Yes! 13:33 But, I trusted you in that and I saw you put forth a diligent 13:37 effort and I saw a willingness in you to do whatever it took, 13:40 in order to provide for the family. -That's right! 13:42 I would've done Glitches(?) if I needed to. 13:45 Or razed worms. You talked about razing worms. 13:47 I wasn't impressed. I'm sorry! 13:50 You know, right here I think it might be good for 13:53 our viewing audience, this is not to say that a woman 13:58 doesn't need to be prepared where there's a genuine need. 14:02 That's right! 14:03 Where there's a health challenge where there's a crisis. 14:06 A single parent. - Where there's a single parent. 14:09 There's many different situations. But what we were 14:12 talking about in what we were going through was: 14:15 If my wife would've begin working it would've made it 14:19 too easy for us to miss the transition that God wanted 14:22 and was preparing for us. 14:25 And we see this a lot. We see many, many marriages today 14:28 where it's either because of a life-style that wants 14:32 to be maintained, that you got two people that are 14:35 working together out there in the work force and 14:38 and the family is straggling in some of those areas. 14:41 Or it's just that maybe the wife can make more money 14:44 than the husband. When that scenario was happening 14:47 if the husband isn't working 14:51 to change that scenario we have found over and over again 14:55 that it creates imbalances in the marriage. 14:58 And we find as woman has left her role of nurturing 15:02 the children in the home and being a home maker 15:06 and providing a little "haven on earth" for the family 15:10 as she has left that role and has entered into the career 15:14 scene shall I say, and that becomes her life-focus, 15:20 we see the deterioration of families. -Yes! 15:22 all around the world it's the result of that! 15:24 Everywhere this has happened we see deterioration in the 15:27 families. And so, in order to continue 15:33 to develop our relationship as husband and wife we felt 15:37 the need to go back to the original. 15:40 And strife(?) for the original, for the best! 15:43 and to whatever level God could bless us with, 15:46 that's where we would be content. 15:48 That's right! 15:49 Well, we need to take a break right now 15:51 and we will come back and we'll talk about 15:54 the man's responsibly, the husband's responsibility. 15:58 So, stay with us! 16:04 There are many "How to?" books available, 16:06 but there's one that's free and perfect for every couple: 16:10 how you can "Build a Better Marriage". 16:13 Bible-based, matrimonial advice is given 16:15 in a lighthearted, easy-to-read manner, 16:17 for those contemplating marriage 16:19 newlyweds, couples in their golden years, 16:22 and everyone in-between. 16:24 Simply call or write for your free copy of 16:26 this amazing little booklet, a handy little tool 16:29 to help build a better marriage. 16:36 Welcome back! 16:38 As we're talking here together about the roles, 16:41 understanding our roles as husband and wife. 16:44 We were just beginning to talk about the importance of the 16:47 husband's responsibility here. It's not just what 16:51 you need to do! Or how you need to change or 16:53 reestablish your role. 16:56 We men, need to look at how we can reestablish our proper role. 17:02 And I think the verse in Ephesians 5 verse 25 is 17:06 is an appropriate starting place or 17:11 a real stepping stone to that. 17:14 "Husbands", it says "love your wives, even as Christ loved 17:18 the church, and gave himself for it" 17:22 The first key here is giving myself. 17:26 It isn't being a dictator. - That's right! 17:29 If I'm going to really love you, 17:32 in the same way that Christ loves his people, 17:35 loves the church and gave himself that I'm gonna 17:37 be willing to give myself. True leadership is service 17:41 and servants and it's interesting that even in 17:45 top corporations the top people who really have 17:48 successful employees are people that stay in communication 17:51 with those people that they are really in communication 17:55 and service from the top. - That's right! 17:58 It's really a blend of both roles that God has given us here 18:03 to bring us perfect harmony and unity and it's a perfect balance 18:07 because as wives learn to let the husband lead 18:11 and to be submissive to their leadership 18:13 and to work and cooperate with that leadership and 18:16 husbands learn to love their wives we have a marriage truly 18:20 Heart to Heart. 18:21 But when either one of us are refusing to enter into our role 18:26 that God has clearly marked out we find conflict in the marriage 18:30 If a wife is submissive and the husband doesn't love her 18:34 you have conflict. And if the husband loves his wife but 18:39 the wife refuses to let him lead and to be in subjection not 18:44 to be dominated by but to be led, 18:48 you have conflict! 18:49 That's right! 18:50 It's really "the two me(s)" in operation again 18:53 instead of "the us" the wife submission and 18:56 the husband's love brings us to a loving us relationship. 19:00 That's right! - And that's what we keep 19:02 working towards 'cause I'm not a perfect submitter all the time! 19:05 But I'm learning that I'm happier that way. 19:07 And I think that as I'm learning one of the things that 19:11 frustrates many women, and we've talked to many couples 19:14 where this is the case, one of the things that really 19:17 frustrates women is where they're desirous. 19:20 They want to have their husband lead. 19:24 And the husband just refuses. 19:27 And leadership here is in giving ourselves. It means 19:32 giving ourselves! 19:34 to do what we need to do for the family as the head of the family 19:38 as the priest of the home. 19:40 And so, it makes it difficult for a wife if I'm not really 19:46 supporting you as a husband, if I'm not really leading 19:49 the way, doesn't that make it hard for you? 19:51 to wanna follow? 19:52 Oh, absolutely, because I don't have 19:54 confidence there! - That's right! 19:56 But as I had put my confidence in the Lord 19:58 He helps me to find ways that I can encourage you 20:01 to take up that role. - That's right! 20:02 instead of criticizing. And I think this is very important 20:06 for us as women that we encourage and lift our husband 20:10 to help them to gain that leadership that we want. 20:15 And not to condemn them and criticize them 20:17 when they don't do it our way or when they fail. 20:20 Because this area, well we have a lot of influence in 20:25 how affective our will love us and lead in the family. 20:31 Yes! 20:32 Hebrews 13:5, Jesus, this is really the model of Jesus for us 20:39 And He says: "I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee" 20:43 - That's very comforting! - Isn't it though? 20:45 - Yes! - And He is to us, He is our God 20:50 He is our Savior. He plays the role to us as 20:54 the Husband and we as His church or His people 20:59 we are the Bride. 21:00 And so, here we are in this relationship and we know 21:03 that we can always count on Him. 21:06 He will never leave us, or forsake us! 21:08 It is been one of the things that I've tried to do 21:09 in our marriage. It is to give you the security that I will 21:13 not leave you or forsake you. 21:15 That doesn't mean just to get a divorce from you. 21:17 - That's right! - Or a separation. 21:19 It means that I wanna be there so you can count on me in 21:23 every situation and the little things of life. 21:26 That I'm there to be the leader, to be the priest, 21:30 to be the house bend. - My protector. 21:33 - Yes! To be these things and to provide for you. 21:37 And as I am choosing to do that 21:42 and choosing to trust Christ to do that 21:44 is that providing to you this security? 21:47 Oh, no question! I mean I could trust anything 21:50 you know, even if we were separated I know 21:54 I can trust you and I look to you to run my ideas by. 21:59 I look to you for your judgment for your input. 22:01 And for you to make a decision, not always but in many things I 22:05 do, even if they could be simple things that I 22:08 can do in the home. Even if I'm the one making those 22:10 decisions in your absence I still like to run them by you, 22:14 and get your input for them. 22:17 Well, I think that's the beautiful thing and this is 22:20 what I wanna bring through to the viewers today. 22:24 This understanding in reestablishing of our roles 22:27 is not where we're trying to say: "Ok, let's get this 22:29 woman back in her place, here!" - That's right! 22:34 "Let's put here in her place!" Right? 22:35 This restless woman that needs.. - Restraint! 22:40 Now let's let God put us each back in our rightful places. 22:46 Because it's as we are the husband and the wife 22:51 that God wants us to be, as my wife is truly submissive 22:55 first to the Lord as unto the Lord. 22:57 As you are truly submissive to the Lord you find your 23:00 your greatest opportunity to be submissive and to serve me. 23:06 That's right! 23:07 And as I am surrendered to the Lord I find my 23:10 greatest ability then to love you! 23:14 As Christ loved the church and to give myself for you. 23:19 Ok? 23:20 And so, it isn't: "Let's get woman back and get man 23:24 dominating again!" Now let's get woman back in the position 23:29 where she's contented to be what God intended for woman to be. 23:34 And you have things that I'll never have. 23:37 I mean we've talked about this before. You have 23:41 strength, that God given strength of how you relate 23:45 in the home environment. Even though you had a 23:47 professional career when I met you I can see 23:49 over & over again this ability to, well nest making. Ok? 23:56 And the bond that you have with the children, specially 23:58 when they were young, 23:59 Is something that men cannot equal. And I believe 24:03 that in the roles that God gave us that, that is a special gift 24:08 that He gives to women. 24:10 And He makes us men, you know we talk about the bucks 24:13 we have a lot of bucks and deer that come through our yard 24:16 where we live up in North-West Montana. 24:19 And it's amazing to watch the little bucks, 24:22 those little tiny bucks before they even have any antlers 24:27 They're up there ramming into those big bucks. 24:31 This bucks with these huge racks on them. 24:34 And, that's what the little.. they're getting prepared 24:36 - To face a harsh world. - For the harsh world. 24:39 And I believe God puts in us as men that part of our role 24:43 is being out there and facing a hard world 24:47 a tough world and that you're designed in a special way 24:50 to have that bond and that love with the children. 24:53 And, not that I don't have the bond with our children 24:57 I certainly do! But the roles there, there's a distinct 25:00 difference and they blend together 25:03 to complement the home beautifully. 25:05 That's right! It makes us complete in our marriage 25:08 that way. - That's right! 25:09 Because we each are taking up our responsibilities 25:12 to make the home run harmoniously. 25:15 One of the greatest blessings I found was to start 25:17 studying through Scripture about women. 25:20 And I wanna encourage you women to go to the Bible and 25:23 study what God has to say about women there. 25:26 Look how women lived with Christ through their roles 25:29 that God had given them. Especially in 25:31 the Book of Titus and Timothy we can get a tremendous 25:34 encouragement and I know what it's done in my life. 25:37 It doesn't make me any less of a person. 25:39 I become more complete as I'm willing to be submitted 25:42 to Christ and learn how to be that true companion 25:45 to my husband. 25:47 And the same goes for the men. I think men we need 25:50 to take responsibility, we need to recognize that 25:53 if we wanna become the men that God wants us to be 25:56 godly leaders, the priest of our home, we need 25:59 to be spending time in God's world that is where we'll find 26:03 the answers, which really leads us into the personal challenge 26:07 for the viewing audience today. 26:10 If we're going to be understanding our roles then 26:14 we need to really, as husbands, love our wives! 26:19 Even as Christ loved the church and gave himself. 26:23 Husbands we need to be willing to turn to Christ! 26:26 We'll never be able to love like Christ unless we're surrendered 26:30 like Christ surrendered Himself to become 26:34 the sin-bearer of the world. 26:36 We need to love our wives, we need to give ourselves 26:39 to our wives and make their lives easier in the role 26:43 that God has given them. 26:45 And we wives, we need to encourage our husband to 26:48 take up that role. And we need to cooperate with them 26:51 and allow them to lead us and our family. 26:54 That has been such a blessing in our home. 26:56 And I wanna challenge you the way God has challenged me 26:59 that with Him it is possible! 27:01 Amen! 27:02 And we need Him to make it possible! Let's pray together! 27:06 Father in Heaven we need Your Grace to be 27:10 the true husbands and wives that you want us to be. 27:13 We thank You that You give us the power 27:15 in Jesus name Amen! 27:19 Well we hope that you'll join us again as we talk about: 27:22 Finding Forgiveness 27:24 That's gonna be a good topic, isn't it dear? 27:26 Oh, yes! Something we all need! 27:28 And we've had to learn to find that real forgiveness 27:31 in our marriage, haven't we? - Yes! 27:32 And it's there! It's there if we are willing 27:37 because true forgiveness only comes from God! 27:41 So we look forward to seeing you! 27:44 Marriage Heart to Heart! 27:48 Marriage in God's Hands |
Revised 2014-12-17