The following
program features real clients
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discussing sensitive issues.
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The views and opinions
expressed in this program
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don't necessarily reflect
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that of 3ABN's
Dare to Dream Network.
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Viewer discretion is advised.
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Hi, I'm Dr. Kim Logan-Nowlin.
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Welcome to Live To Be Well.
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Today my special guests,
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they are Tracy Hightower
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and Mrs. Sheila Hightower White.
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Welcome to Live To Be Well.
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Thank you. Thank you.
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Today I want to talk
about a cry for help.
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And I would like for you to...
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I appreciate you
coming on Live To Be Well.
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But let's talk
about your sister,
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then your daughter, Tracy.
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Tell us what happened?
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In 1991,
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our beautiful,
intelligent outgoing sister
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at the age of 32
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was stabbed to
death by her husband.
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This is someone who
we welcome to our home,
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who sat at our dinner table
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and ate with us
and laugh with us.
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We were just devastated.
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We had no idea.
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Her neighbors told us
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that she was
abused almost every day.
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Even when I
talked to her coworkers,
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they said that he would call her
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and just and just keep
ringing the phone, calling,
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dialing the phone, you
know, calling her on the phone,
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Just harassing her.
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Just keep... Just harassing her.
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And she was so nervous.
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How long have they been married?
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They were
married for five years.
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And there were no red
flags prior to her dating him?
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Did she ever say anything?
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No, she didn't.
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She was just very
protective over him.
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We know she loved him.
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And she would do
anything for him.
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But what she was...
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We just didn't think
that she would ever let anyone
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abuse or beat on her.
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Did he put her
like in isolation?
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Did she still attend
the different holiday events
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and things like that?
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Or he did not permit
her to engage with you all?
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Well, at first,
she was always around.
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We had every holiday event.
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Every get
together, she was there.
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But he was always...
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She was nervous around him.
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But there was a sign
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but we didn't, we
just didn't pick it up.
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Did they have children?
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No, thank goodness,
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we're grateful that
they didn't have children.
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Because I know that
children suffer from that,
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you know, those kinds
of things later in life.
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How did you get the call
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to let you know
when it happened?
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What is her name?
What was her name?
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Her name was Phoebe. Phoebe.
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And I named my
daughter after her.
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Oh, that's beautiful. Yes.
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Yes. So how did
you get the call?
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And how were you notified
that Phoebe had been murdered?
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Well, you know, actually,
this is a lesson to everyone.
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They lived in an
apartment building
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and her manager,
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they didn't know
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how to get in touch with anyone.
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So it's always good
to have additional info
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and emergency contact
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when you're, even
if you're married.
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You know, you have
to, they were married.
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But you would have to put
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an additional
family's member's name down.
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So her boss called my mom.
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They went to the
morgue, the City Morgue
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to identify my
sister. And they came over.
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And told you all. And told us.
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Okay, back up a minute, though.
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So who called your,
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was she had her job
listed on the application?
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They found a telephone
number where she worked.
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She had a business card.
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And they... And they found out.
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So they found her,
the apartment owner,
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the manager of the
apartment building?
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No, I'm sorry, I'll back up.
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What had happened is that
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he called the
police and said that,
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"I killed my wife."
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He called himself.
He called the police.
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But when the police arrived,
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he told him it was self defense.
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So...
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That's a person who
will never even kill a fly.
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Okay.
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You know, he said
it was self defense.
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So what happened to him?
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He's in jail.
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He's in jail for
life because God is good.
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The neighbors,
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they saw a
silhouette of my sister
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running and screaming.
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So everything that he
told to police was a lie
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when the witnesses came forward.
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When they came forward? Yes.
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So she was murdered
right there in her home?
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In her home, in her apartment.
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So your mother was notified.
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Your boss, her boss.
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And then from there,
you all were notified?
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We were notified.
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They called me home from work.
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So you were stunned
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'cause you had no idea
this was even going on.
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We were shocked.
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We just even, just thinking
that she would put up with it,
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because we knew that
she was the type of person
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that wouldn't put up
with things like that.
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But she loved her husband.
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And we were, we just,
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you know, an actor,
she passed away actually,
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several family
members passed away,
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our parents passed away.
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So we thought
that we were almost,
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you know, getting over to grief
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and the tragedy of having
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you know, our sister
murdered so tragically.
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But then, in night in
2013, on Mother's Day,
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her daughter, she get.
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Yes. What happen to her?
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My daughter Stacy was
murdered by a predator
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that followed her
home from a party.
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The night before I
had talked to Stacy
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and she told me
where she was going.
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She was going to a party
that was invitation only,
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and I felt good about that,
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because it was
right up the street.
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And we made plans
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for Mother's Day
Brunch the next day.
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At about 7:15 in the morning,
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the detectives
arrived at my door
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to tell me that my
daughter was murdered.
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Tracy, where did they find her?
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They found her in her apartment.
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Yeah.
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And how were you notified?
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The minute detectives came
to my door they notified me,
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and let me know
that she was murdered.
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When you saw them at your door,
what went through your mind?
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I thought they
were at the wrong house.
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That's the first
thing you thought.
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Yeah.
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I thought I was
glad just talk to her.
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I could remember her last words.
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You know, she
told me she loved me.
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And that was it.
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I could just still
hear that in my mind.
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And that was Mother's Day.
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That was Mother's Day,
they were at your door.
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Yes. Mother's Day,
they came to my door.
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They notified my son first.
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I guess she, I don't know
how they knew he was my son.
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And when I see my
son came driving up,
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and then I've seen the
detective car drove up too,
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I knew something was wrong.
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Something was wrong. Yes.
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The pain that you feel,
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how have you been?
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And how long ago was this?
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Six years. Six years.
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How have you been
able to go on, how?
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But with my
family, with their help
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because I didn't want to go on.
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What do you mean you didn't,
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when you say you
didn't want to go on?
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My daughter was my best friend.
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Yes.
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And I didn't want to go on.
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Was that your oldest
child or youngest child?
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Yes, she's my oldest
child. Your firstborn?
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Yes.
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And it's still difficult today?
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It's difficult for me
right now to even talk.
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Yes.
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We appreciate you so much.
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But we want you to know that
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your testimonial
service is going to
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and your story is
going to help so many people
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on the 3ABN Dare
to Dream Network.
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Yes.
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Because people are being
abused every six seconds.
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And it's not
even reported by men
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who are being abused
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because they're so embarrassed.
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I'm wearing
purple in honor of those
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who have been a part
of domestic violence.
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Purple is a color
for domestic violence.
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Yes, it is.
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I didn't even know that
there were so many colors
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because domestic
violence did not impact my life.
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It did not impact
me on an adult level
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once I was hit by a man.
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And it just
literally just shocked me.
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And my father was called in
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and my oldest brother
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and they said if you
stay in this relationship,
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it's a choice and it
could take your life.
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Yes.
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And we don't realize how
the community is impacted.
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When we talk
about the cry for help,
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how, your
sister kept the secret.
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You know, let's talk about
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why you think
she kept the secret?
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I know she loved
him. You told me that.
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But why?
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Well, you know, our sister,
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she kept a diary
since she was a teenager.
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And after she passed
away, I read her diary.
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And in the diary, she said that,
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he wants, he, I
can't divorce him
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or leave him
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because he told me
that if he, if I did,
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he would kill my family.
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So she was protecting us.
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Because I always
wonder why she never left him.
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And then another thing.
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She thought that
she could change him.
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She prayed that he would change.
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So she stayed with him.
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But she didn't realize that
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God didn't want
her to live with anyone
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that would treat her any less
than what He would treat her.
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So she was confused.
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She was in
love. She was a shame.
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She wanted people to think
she had everything together.
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And there were so many signs
that we didn't even look for.
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We just thought she
was, everything was okay.
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But I remember one
time my mother said that,
00:09:44.45\00:09:47.85
she was, um, she came
over and her arm was broken.
00:09:47.88\00:09:52.75
And she had encased on
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and she told my
mother that she tripped.
00:09:54.16\00:09:56.96
You know, but that was a sign.
00:09:56.99\00:09:58.99
But she was always nervous.
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That was a sign.
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When you say nervous, was
she just always fidgeting?
00:10:02.16\00:10:04.27
She was always,
when he was around,
00:10:04.30\00:10:06.47
she was, she
had to be so careful
00:10:06.50\00:10:08.37
about what she said.
00:10:08.40\00:10:09.97
And even with him,
00:10:10.01\00:10:11.57
we thought that he was
always so easily offended.
00:10:11.61\00:10:14.81
He was so sensitive.
00:10:14.84\00:10:16.54
But that was a sign.
00:10:16.58\00:10:19.38
And even what, he
would never keep a job.
00:10:19.41\00:10:22.25
It was always, "I'm quitting.
My boss, he did something."
00:10:22.28\00:10:26.05
It was always
somebody else's fault.
00:10:26.09\00:10:28.09
That was a sign.
00:10:28.12\00:10:29.46
And she was more
so the breadwinner.
00:10:29.49\00:10:30.89
She was the breadwinner.
00:10:30.93\00:10:32.33
She tried to help him.
00:10:32.36\00:10:34.00
After reading the diary,
she couldn't do enough for him.
00:10:34.03\00:10:37.70
Nothing would satisfy him.
00:10:37.73\00:10:39.47
And that's usually the
case in abusive situations.
00:10:39.50\00:10:42.67
And so, therefore,
they feel again that they,
00:10:42.70\00:10:45.24
it's their fault.
00:10:45.27\00:10:46.61
Right.
00:10:46.64\00:10:47.98
I am your trigger. Yes.
00:10:48.01\00:10:49.34
You are worthless. Yes.
00:10:49.38\00:10:50.75
You are stupid.
00:10:50.78\00:10:52.11
You're dumb. Yes.
00:10:52.15\00:10:53.55
You know, the way
they degrade their victims.
00:10:53.58\00:10:57.32
And then the other day
I was talking to someone
00:10:57.35\00:10:59.02
they said, I'm now,
I'm no longer a victim.
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I'm a survivor. Right, right.
00:11:01.66\00:11:03.36
I am a survivor and
I will tell my story.
00:11:03.39\00:11:05.53
Yes.
00:11:05.56\00:11:06.90
And so, with, and your
sister was how old again?
00:11:06.93\00:11:09.83
She was 32 and
her daughter was 32.
00:11:09.86\00:11:13.34
They both passed
away at the same age.
00:11:13.37\00:11:15.77
Same age.
00:11:15.80\00:11:17.14
So young. Yes.
00:11:17.17\00:11:18.51
So young. Yes.
00:11:18.54\00:11:19.87
Now, was your
daughter close to her aunt?
00:11:19.91\00:11:22.88
Yes, they were.
00:11:22.91\00:11:24.25
You know, that's
something, they were close.
00:11:24.28\00:11:25.98
Yes.
00:11:26.01\00:11:27.88
How's your son doing?
00:11:27.92\00:11:29.65
He's doing better, you know?
00:11:29.68\00:11:32.22
It was really rough for a while.
00:11:32.25\00:11:34.19
He's kept things in
00:11:34.22\00:11:35.56
and now he's
talking more and, you know.
00:11:35.59\00:11:38.66
'Cause they were
close. Just back yourself.
00:11:38.69\00:11:40.03
They were real
close. They were close.
00:11:40.06\00:11:41.40
They were two years apart.
00:11:41.43\00:11:42.76
My goodness.
00:11:42.80\00:11:44.13
You yourself and Phoebe,
00:11:44.17\00:11:46.74
where it was just
the three sisters.
00:11:46.77\00:11:48.77
No, we have four sisters.
00:11:48.80\00:11:50.14
All girls, no sons?
00:11:50.17\00:11:51.51
Yes, we have a
brother but he was...
00:11:51.54\00:11:53.44
Men take at heart.
00:11:53.48\00:11:54.81
They take it really
hard because they are...
00:11:54.84\00:11:56.85
Men are just natural protectors.
00:11:56.88\00:11:58.51
Yes. So he was upset.
00:11:58.55\00:12:00.98
"I wasn't there to protect her."
00:12:01.02\00:12:03.15
You know, so he
took it a lot differently
00:12:03.18\00:12:04.85
from how we took it.
00:12:04.89\00:12:06.62
He wanted to be there.
00:12:06.65\00:12:07.99
And now, and then of course,
00:12:08.02\00:12:09.36
out there he
wanted to go to the jail
00:12:09.39\00:12:11.59
and do something
to him, you know?
00:12:11.63\00:12:13.90
But um, they're protectors.
00:12:13.93\00:12:15.26
First impulse.
00:12:15.30\00:12:16.63
It's the first impulse. Yes.
00:12:16.67\00:12:18.00
You hurt my family.
00:12:18.03\00:12:19.37
You hurt my
family, you hurt my sister.
00:12:19.40\00:12:21.27
They were both
pretty cool woman,
00:12:21.30\00:12:22.97
her daughter, little
hands, little feet just little.
00:12:23.00\00:12:25.47
And even the gentleman
that murdered my niece,
00:12:25.51\00:12:28.81
her daughter.
00:12:28.84\00:12:30.18
He went to police, he
went to, he was a big guy.
00:12:30.21\00:12:32.81
So he was no match to my niece.
00:12:32.85\00:12:35.88
The police said he had
an elaborate weight system
00:12:35.92\00:12:38.82
in his basement.
00:12:38.85\00:12:40.19
So it was just no match.
00:12:40.22\00:12:43.39
Let me ask you this.
00:12:43.43\00:12:46.29
When you think about your loss,
00:12:46.33\00:12:48.86
I know God has
been your strength.
00:12:48.90\00:12:50.47
Yes.
00:12:50.50\00:12:51.83
Your faith in God,
and your hope in God.
00:12:51.87\00:12:56.94
But when you go
throughout the day,
00:12:56.97\00:13:00.28
and you see young girls
00:13:00.31\00:13:02.38
or in the supermarket
00:13:02.41\00:13:03.75
or someone hollering at someone.
00:13:03.78\00:13:06.88
Is that a trigger for you?
00:13:06.92\00:13:08.38
Yes, it is. Yes.
00:13:08.42\00:13:09.82
Tell me how
does that impact you?
00:13:09.85\00:13:12.42
Because I wanted to,
I just I really want to
00:13:12.45\00:13:14.92
because it
happened to my daughter.
00:13:14.96\00:13:17.26
And I really want to
just go to her and say,
00:13:17.29\00:13:19.33
you know, and talk about
her and tell her she's worth.
00:13:19.36\00:13:21.90
You know, she's more than that.
00:13:21.93\00:13:23.87
Don't allow someone
to talk to you like that.
00:13:23.90\00:13:25.47
Don't let somebody, you know,
00:13:25.50\00:13:26.84
don't let
somebody do that to you.
00:13:26.87\00:13:28.60
So, your self
confidence, you know, be strong.
00:13:28.64\00:13:31.24
And you know, and later on,
00:13:31.27\00:13:33.14
you'll see what you're worth it.
00:13:33.17\00:13:34.91
And you know,
00:13:34.94\00:13:36.28
and you don't
think about those things
00:13:36.31\00:13:37.65
when you're in a public place,
00:13:37.68\00:13:40.02
but you, I began to notice,
00:13:40.05\00:13:42.45
I'm learning to
notice different signs.
00:13:42.48\00:13:46.15
And I'm learning how people,
00:13:46.19\00:13:48.02
couples
interact with each other.
00:13:48.06\00:13:51.36
Someone came to me and told me,
00:13:51.39\00:13:54.50
Dr. Nowlin, there's
someone that you know,
00:13:54.53\00:13:57.30
that's been abused for 25 years.
00:13:57.33\00:14:01.20
You know, but when I see them,
00:14:01.24\00:14:03.00
they're out, they're
bubbly, they're happy.
00:14:03.04\00:14:05.31
She's holding his hand
and he's holding her hand.
00:14:05.34\00:14:09.34
And, but she
can't leave, 25 years.
00:14:09.38\00:14:13.95
So in a situation like that,
00:14:13.98\00:14:16.72
I then, I go to my pastor,
00:14:16.75\00:14:19.62
I go to someone who
can intervene in that,
00:14:19.65\00:14:23.29
because you just don't
know what you're dealing with.
00:14:23.32\00:14:26.53
And you have to pray for wisdom.
00:14:26.56\00:14:29.26
Because if
something happens to her,
00:14:29.30\00:14:30.87
and I know and I
did nothing about it.
00:14:30.90\00:14:33.97
I knew about it, but
I did nothing about it.
00:14:34.00\00:14:36.64
See, and your sister,
00:14:36.67\00:14:38.17
she was, and
this is what they do.
00:14:38.21\00:14:41.04
I will hurt your family.
00:14:41.08\00:14:42.61
Right. Right.
00:14:42.64\00:14:43.98
If you leave me I will
kill your entire family.
00:14:44.01\00:14:46.08
Yes.
00:14:46.11\00:14:47.45
So the threat of violence that,
00:14:47.48\00:14:50.75
you know, constantly
being beat into your mind
00:14:50.79\00:14:54.96
because she did not want
anything to happen to you all
00:14:54.99\00:14:58.06
because we know in the news.
00:14:58.09\00:15:00.80
We know what happens constantly.
00:15:00.83\00:15:02.60
Yes, that's true.
00:15:02.63\00:15:03.97
So she could not,
you know, allow herself
00:15:04.00\00:15:07.37
to be the cause of
losing her entire family.
00:15:07.40\00:15:10.61
Exactly.
00:15:10.64\00:15:11.97
You have a good point,
00:15:12.01\00:15:13.34
as far as the
person that's being abused,
00:15:13.38\00:15:15.54
we want to tell woman
if it's happening to you
00:15:15.58\00:15:18.45
to tell
someone, talk to someone.
00:15:18.48\00:15:21.08
You know, because
violence, it strives in silence.
00:15:21.12\00:15:25.39
So we had to let
people know what's going on.
00:15:25.42\00:15:27.69
My sister didn't tell us.
00:15:27.72\00:15:29.29
We, like I said, we were shocked
00:15:29.32\00:15:31.86
when we talked to the neighbors,
00:15:31.89\00:15:33.23
when we talked to her coworkers,
00:15:33.26\00:15:34.73
we just didn't think that
she would ever let this happen.
00:15:34.76\00:15:38.00
I want to talk to the people,
you know, to the coworkers,
00:15:38.03\00:15:40.84
to the people
that she worked with.
00:15:40.87\00:15:44.01
If you notice something,
00:15:44.04\00:15:45.37
if you notice something
suspicious about a person,
00:15:45.41\00:15:47.61
if they're isolated,
or if they feel like,
00:15:47.64\00:15:52.21
you know, that they
don't want to talk to you,
00:15:52.25\00:15:54.25
and you notice
that they're different,
00:15:54.28\00:15:56.48
just open up and say,
00:15:56.52\00:15:58.05
"Are you okay?
00:15:58.09\00:15:59.42
You know, I noticed
that you're not the same.
00:15:59.45\00:16:01.42
Can I talk to you?
You know, I love you.
00:16:01.46\00:16:03.59
You know, God loves you."
00:16:03.63\00:16:05.46
Some people don't open up.
00:16:05.49\00:16:06.83
People need to take
that village concept back.
00:16:06.86\00:16:09.66
If they see people
struggling, just talk to them.
00:16:09.70\00:16:12.40
Yes.
00:16:12.43\00:16:13.77
If someone comes to a person
00:16:13.80\00:16:15.14
and tell them, I'm
in a bad situation,
00:16:15.17\00:16:17.44
I'm hurting, I'm being abused.
00:16:17.47\00:16:20.81
Don't shut that person down.
00:16:20.84\00:16:22.18
Yes.
00:16:22.21\00:16:23.55
Because a lot of the
events that we go to,
00:16:23.58\00:16:25.01
a lot of the woman will say,
00:16:25.05\00:16:26.72
the worst people
00:16:26.75\00:16:28.35
who give them the
most grief are other woman,
00:16:28.38\00:16:31.02
you know, they have,
people have told me that
00:16:31.05\00:16:33.46
we've been to numerous events,
00:16:33.49\00:16:34.82
and people have told me
that I went to a friend.
00:16:34.86\00:16:37.86
And she told me what,
you know, you married him,
00:16:37.89\00:16:40.00
and you shouldn't be
telling his business.
00:16:40.03\00:16:42.06
You know, he's a
good community leader.
00:16:42.10\00:16:44.70
He's nice to me.
00:16:44.73\00:16:46.10
So I will keep it to
myself, I won't tell anyone.
00:16:46.13\00:16:49.17
And so a lot of women shut down
00:16:49.20\00:16:51.64
when they see that
they can't talk to anyone,
00:16:51.67\00:16:54.48
and they become a part product,
actually a victim blaming.
00:16:54.51\00:16:58.31
People, you know, so,
00:16:58.35\00:17:00.15
"Why should I talk to anyone,
I'm just gonna get blamed?"
00:17:00.18\00:17:03.49
Talk a little bit
about victim blaming?
00:17:03.52\00:17:04.95
Victim blaming,
because when people are blamed,
00:17:04.99\00:17:07.72
they feel like, they
just, they're all alone.
00:17:07.76\00:17:11.66
And that's what the devil,
00:17:11.69\00:17:13.03
the enemy wants people to think.
00:17:13.06\00:17:14.46
You're the only person
that's going through this.
00:17:14.50\00:17:16.56
You know, so don't tell anybody.
00:17:16.60\00:17:18.60
And a lot of women actually,
00:17:18.63\00:17:21.34
victim blaming
00:17:21.37\00:17:22.70
causes a lot of
women to commit suicide.
00:17:22.74\00:17:25.07
Really? They get
depressed, you know.
00:17:25.11\00:17:27.31
And people don't
go to counselors,
00:17:27.34\00:17:29.14
because they feel like,
their, it's their fault.
00:17:29.18\00:17:31.75
So they won't go to
a counselor like you,
00:17:31.78\00:17:33.88
they won't go to a pastor,
00:17:33.92\00:17:36.05
because they'll think that
they're gonna get shut down
00:17:36.08\00:17:38.65
because a friend shut them down.
00:17:38.69\00:17:41.96
But, so people should know
that they can't go with this.
00:17:41.99\00:17:45.63
There's help out there.
00:17:45.66\00:17:47.06
But a lot of
people don't think that is
00:17:47.10\00:17:49.20
that they need it
00:17:49.23\00:17:50.57
because they think that,
00:17:50.60\00:17:51.93
"Oh, wow. Like I
said, Oh, I'll pray for him.
00:17:51.97\00:17:53.94
He'll get better,
00:17:53.97\00:17:55.30
you know, I should
still do what I have to do
00:17:55.34\00:17:57.37
to keep this marriage together,
00:17:57.41\00:17:59.04
to keep this
relationship together."
00:17:59.07\00:18:00.84
I mean, woman had who
went out on dates with me,
00:18:00.88\00:18:02.58
and, and they were
abused like yourself,
00:18:02.61\00:18:05.01
and some woman feel like,
00:18:05.05\00:18:06.65
"It was my fault.
00:18:06.68\00:18:08.02
I shouldn't have
him over to my house
00:18:08.05\00:18:09.38
or I might have done something."
00:18:09.42\00:18:11.62
So they let it go.
00:18:11.65\00:18:13.42
But the only thing
is the gentlemen will,
00:18:13.46\00:18:15.19
I mean, the person will go out
00:18:15.22\00:18:16.56
and they will do the
same thing to someone else.
00:18:16.59\00:18:17.93
Someone else.
00:18:17.96\00:18:19.29
So that's what our ministry is.
00:18:19.33\00:18:20.96
We want to break the silence.
00:18:21.00\00:18:22.33
We want to bring awareness,
you know, to help other women.
00:18:22.36\00:18:25.63
To let everyone know
that we can, you can talk,
00:18:25.67\00:18:28.84
you can talk about it.
00:18:28.87\00:18:30.21
The need is
great. The need is great.
00:18:30.24\00:18:32.21
Tracy, let's go
back to something.
00:18:32.24\00:18:35.11
You said that your
daughter left an event,
00:18:35.14\00:18:38.68
the man followed her home.
00:18:38.71\00:18:41.12
He was able to pry
the knob, the lock,
00:18:41.15\00:18:46.22
and came in on her.
00:18:46.25\00:18:48.82
And then, of course,
the incident happened?
00:18:48.86\00:18:52.43
Yes.
00:18:52.46\00:18:53.80
And so being such
a tiny little woman,
00:18:53.83\00:18:57.53
she could not defend herself.
00:18:57.57\00:18:59.53
And you said that
this man was married?
00:18:59.57\00:19:01.64
Yes.
00:19:01.67\00:19:03.00
He worked out. Yes.
00:19:03.04\00:19:04.67
And he is almost like he
set at that event outside
00:19:04.71\00:19:09.14
just waiting for a
victim to come out?
00:19:09.18\00:19:10.78
Yes.
00:19:10.81\00:19:12.15
And she came out.
00:19:12.18\00:19:14.22
And he followed her.
00:19:14.25\00:19:15.58
He followed her.
00:19:15.62\00:19:16.95
While he was, while
she was at the event,
00:19:16.99\00:19:18.69
he was in the event
00:19:18.72\00:19:20.06
and he was, he was
trying to talk to her all night.
00:19:20.09\00:19:22.02
But she was brushing him off.
00:19:22.06\00:19:23.39
So he went
outside and he followed?
00:19:23.43\00:19:25.13
He followed her. He followed?
00:19:25.16\00:19:27.10
I remember reading
a story a while back.
00:19:27.13\00:19:29.70
You might remember this story.
00:19:29.73\00:19:31.30
A young lady received a
phone call from her cousin.
00:19:31.33\00:19:34.27
Let's go out to dinner.
00:19:34.30\00:19:36.20
And she said, "No,
I have a big exam."
00:19:36.24\00:19:37.97
And her husband says,
00:19:38.01\00:19:39.34
"Go out. You've been studying,
you've been doing really well."
00:19:39.37\00:19:42.84
So she called her cousin
says, "Let's go out to dinner."
00:19:42.88\00:19:46.28
Well, there was a gentleman
walked up to her and said,
00:19:46.31\00:19:48.72
"Hello, may I buy you dinner?"
00:19:48.75\00:19:51.82
And she says, "No, I'm fine."
00:19:51.85\00:19:53.72
And he says,
"Oh, it's like that?"
00:19:53.76\00:19:55.82
Because the cousin was sitting
there and she walked way,
00:19:55.86\00:19:58.59
but she heard the
conversation, coming back.
00:19:58.63\00:20:01.90
And then he walked away.
00:20:01.93\00:20:04.30
They had dinner.
00:20:04.33\00:20:05.70
She went outside.
00:20:05.73\00:20:07.44
Her cousin left
her purse or something.
00:20:07.47\00:20:10.01
She went outside
00:20:10.04\00:20:11.37
and the man was
standing next to her
00:20:11.41\00:20:13.31
and, 'cause the valet parked.
00:20:13.34\00:20:15.21
And the man said,
00:20:15.24\00:20:16.58
"Oh, really, you just
gonna ignore me like that."
00:20:16.61\00:20:19.55
And shot her right there.
00:20:19.58\00:20:22.28
Just like that.
00:20:22.32\00:20:23.82
And I don't know the
husband, I just read the story.
00:20:23.85\00:20:28.46
And you just don't know
what will trigger a person.
00:20:28.49\00:20:32.29
Mental health is serious.
00:20:32.33\00:20:35.13
I tell people constantly
00:20:35.16\00:20:37.47
stress, anxiety, depression,
00:20:37.50\00:20:40.20
bipolar disorder, mood swings.
00:20:40.24\00:20:42.84
Yes, yes.
00:20:42.87\00:20:44.21
Insomnia, I
haven't slept in five days.
00:20:44.24\00:20:46.14
I'm not going to do
too well at work today.
00:20:46.17\00:20:48.38
Right.
00:20:48.41\00:20:49.74
So that's a trigger
00:20:49.78\00:20:51.11
if someone says something to me,
00:20:51.15\00:20:52.48
and I'm already
dealing with a problem.
00:20:52.51\00:20:54.55
So I'm gonna go out,
00:20:54.58\00:20:56.48
and then I'm gonna come back in.
00:20:56.52\00:20:58.69
And then I'm just gonna start
shooting everyone on my job.
00:20:58.72\00:21:01.12
Right. Right. So
we have mass shooting.
00:21:01.16\00:21:03.29
Yes.
00:21:03.32\00:21:04.66
All of these
things, they have it yet,
00:21:04.69\00:21:06.03
and you're right.
00:21:06.06\00:21:07.40
You, Sheila, the enemy is busy.
00:21:07.43\00:21:09.26
He knows he has
but a short time.
00:21:09.30\00:21:11.50
And he is out to
destroy God's people,
00:21:11.53\00:21:14.84
kill, steal and destroy.
00:21:14.87\00:21:16.20
Yes.
00:21:16.24\00:21:17.87
In a situation like mine,
00:21:17.91\00:21:20.51
I had a father,
brother and mother.
00:21:20.54\00:21:22.74
I was able to,
00:21:22.78\00:21:24.25
I came to my
senses that punch alone.
00:21:24.28\00:21:27.42
And I thought about myself
that I want to live like this.
00:21:27.45\00:21:30.45
And usually, if
they hit you once,
00:21:30.49\00:21:32.35
they'll hit you again.
00:21:32.39\00:21:34.02
I saw a woman at a restaurant.
00:21:34.06\00:21:35.89
He just snatched her.
00:21:35.92\00:21:37.46
And she said,
00:21:37.49\00:21:38.89
I'm coming and he just
right in front of everyone.
00:21:38.93\00:21:42.60
He didn't even care.
00:21:42.63\00:21:44.20
And she says,
00:21:44.23\00:21:45.57
"Okay, please stay out
of it, stay out of it."
00:21:45.60\00:21:48.10
You know, because
I don't have a voice.
00:21:48.14\00:21:51.27
I don't have anything.
00:21:51.31\00:21:52.64
Women have voices, do they not?
00:21:52.67\00:21:54.01
Yes, they do. They do.
00:21:54.04\00:21:55.38
And men? They do. They do.
00:21:55.41\00:21:56.75
Because women abuse men. Right.
00:21:56.78\00:21:58.71
Have you ever met a man
00:21:58.75\00:22:00.08
that had been
abused by his spouse?
00:22:00.12\00:22:01.78
Okay.
00:22:01.82\00:22:03.15
You know, have
you ever encountered
00:22:03.18\00:22:04.52
any of that, Sheila?
00:22:04.55\00:22:05.89
No, but I think if
men are like you said
00:22:05.92\00:22:07.36
they'll keep it quiet.
00:22:07.39\00:22:08.72
Yes.
00:22:08.76\00:22:10.09
And we focus on woman
00:22:10.13\00:22:11.46
because two women in our,
in our family were murdered.
00:22:11.49\00:22:14.80
But we, our ministry
and our organization,
00:22:14.83\00:22:18.33
we're looking for
property right now.
00:22:18.37\00:22:20.67
Because we are
gonna have classes
00:22:20.70\00:22:23.14
for men and woman,
00:22:23.17\00:22:24.51
you know about
domestic violence.
00:22:24.54\00:22:26.21
And we're in the
process right now
00:22:26.24\00:22:28.28
to of writing a
book, a children's book.
00:22:28.31\00:22:30.78
Because we know that
00:22:30.81\00:22:32.15
a lot of times it starts
from a young age, you know?
00:22:32.18\00:22:36.08
We're gonna, we're
writing a children's book
00:22:36.12\00:22:38.05
to let with illustrations,
00:22:38.09\00:22:39.99
to let the children
know that this is not okay.
00:22:40.02\00:22:42.26
It's not okay, if
mom is abusing dad,
00:22:42.29\00:22:44.69
or dad is abusing mom,
00:22:44.73\00:22:46.63
because a lot of those children,
00:22:46.66\00:22:48.00
they grow up and
they start being abusers
00:22:48.03\00:22:50.70
and it goes from
generation to generation.
00:22:50.73\00:22:53.13
And it's not cute.
00:22:53.17\00:22:54.50
It's not cute. No, it isn't.
00:22:54.54\00:22:56.14
You know, kicking someone
00:22:56.17\00:22:57.51
and then you see
the bullying in school.
00:22:57.54\00:22:59.77
Yes, yes.
00:22:59.81\00:23:01.14
See they're little. That's true.
00:23:01.18\00:23:02.51
And you know, or
you see it in church.
00:23:02.54\00:23:04.28
I just bumped that person.
00:23:04.31\00:23:05.81
Oh, that's cute. It's not cute.
00:23:05.85\00:23:07.18
It's not. It's not.
00:23:07.22\00:23:08.55
You know, or I
see little children
00:23:08.58\00:23:09.98
in the grocery store.
00:23:10.02\00:23:11.69
And this little baby,
00:23:11.72\00:23:13.49
she could have
been more than four,
00:23:13.52\00:23:15.32
you know, just kept
slapping her mother.
00:23:15.36\00:23:18.19
Wow.
00:23:18.23\00:23:19.56
And the mother
didn't do anything to stop.
00:23:19.59\00:23:21.33
And I'm behind them in the line.
00:23:21.36\00:23:24.33
And that little girl
looked at me and I said,
00:23:24.37\00:23:26.23
"No, no, no."
00:23:26.27\00:23:27.60
Yes, yes.
00:23:27.64\00:23:28.97
And she looked
at me and she just
00:23:29.00\00:23:30.67
and she turned around
and she punched her mother.
00:23:30.71\00:23:32.74
Oh, my goodness.
00:23:32.77\00:23:34.11
So I don't know if this
is what she's seeing at home,
00:23:34.14\00:23:36.88
because they
emulate what they see.
00:23:36.91\00:23:38.91
Right. Right.
00:23:38.95\00:23:40.28
So, 'cause a four year old
00:23:40.32\00:23:42.32
just slapping her
mother and punching her.
00:23:42.35\00:23:44.15
Yeah.
00:23:44.19\00:23:45.52
So she's been
exposed to something.
00:23:45.55\00:23:47.12
Yes, she is.
00:23:47.16\00:23:48.49
But your sister
and your daughter
00:23:48.52\00:23:50.43
was not exposed
to domestic violence.
00:23:50.46\00:23:52.06
Right. Right.
00:23:52.09\00:23:53.43
So this was something
that was just like I said,
00:23:53.46\00:23:56.23
it was so shocking,
00:23:56.26\00:23:57.60
because Phoebe
wasn't raised like that.
00:23:57.63\00:23:59.57
She wasn't raised like that.
00:23:59.60\00:24:00.94
We were always
raised to treat people,
00:24:00.97\00:24:03.20
you know, with kindness.
00:24:03.24\00:24:04.74
We were raised in a church
00:24:04.77\00:24:07.44
that but only thing is
00:24:07.48\00:24:08.81
sometimes people take
advantage of your kindness
00:24:08.84\00:24:11.61
and they look at it as weakness.
00:24:11.65\00:24:13.11
As a weakness.
00:24:13.15\00:24:14.48
And so we, because we treat,
00:24:14.52\00:24:16.05
we teach people how to treat us.
00:24:16.08\00:24:18.35
So she just, we
just thought that
00:24:18.39\00:24:22.29
my niece, our sister,
00:24:22.32\00:24:25.89
they thought that it was okay
00:24:25.93\00:24:27.76
to try to help this person
00:24:27.80\00:24:29.13
because they felt
that as a Christian person,
00:24:29.16\00:24:32.83
a religious person
00:24:32.87\00:24:34.30
that they were
supposed to do the right thing
00:24:34.34\00:24:36.84
but abuse like what you
say love is not violent.
00:24:36.87\00:24:40.84
Love, you know, we
don't serve a violent God.
00:24:40.88\00:24:43.18
It is not intimidating.
It is not intimidating.
00:24:43.21\00:24:45.41
2 Corinthians 13
talks about, what love is.
00:24:45.45\00:24:48.78
Yes, that's true.
00:24:48.82\00:24:50.15
You know, and so therefore
we are to love ourselves,
00:24:50.19\00:24:52.39
love our neighbor as ourselves.
00:24:52.42\00:24:54.16
And for God so loved the world
00:24:54.19\00:24:56.32
that He gave His
only begotten Son,
00:24:56.36\00:24:58.36
in love He did that.
00:24:58.39\00:24:59.73
Yes.
00:24:59.76\00:25:01.10
And Jesus, I can't even
fathom Him on the cross.
00:25:01.13\00:25:04.33
But He said,
00:25:04.37\00:25:05.70
"Father, forgive them
00:25:05.73\00:25:07.37
for they know not what they do."
00:25:07.40\00:25:09.50
Exactly.
00:25:09.54\00:25:10.87
And Jesus, He literally
00:25:10.91\00:25:12.57
the nail prints in
His hands and His feet.
00:25:12.61\00:25:15.18
And He said that,
00:25:15.21\00:25:16.54
"If this cup could
pass, let it pass,"
00:25:16.58\00:25:18.41
because they abused
our Lord and Savior.
00:25:18.45\00:25:20.38
Yes, yes,
00:25:20.42\00:25:21.75
You know, I mean,
00:25:21.78\00:25:23.12
we can go all the way
back to the beginning of time,
00:25:23.15\00:25:25.39
domestic violence,
00:25:25.42\00:25:27.06
and the things that they
did to our Lord and Savior.
00:25:27.09\00:25:30.23
You know, when we think about
Cain and Abel in the Bible.
00:25:30.26\00:25:33.66
Cain killed his brother,
that you know, violence.
00:25:33.70\00:25:37.43
And so we look
at all the history,
00:25:37.47\00:25:40.44
you know, we look at slavery,
00:25:40.47\00:25:42.10
we look at the
Holocaust with the Jews,
00:25:42.14\00:25:45.84
we see the pain.
00:25:45.87\00:25:47.98
And I remember my
administrator, Karen said,
00:25:48.01\00:25:52.11
you need to go and
visit the Holocaust Museum.
00:25:52.15\00:25:55.05
And I'm like, "I'm not
Jewish. Why do I need to go?"
00:25:55.08\00:26:00.06
See, that's the
mentality we have.
00:26:00.09\00:26:01.62
Yeah.
00:26:01.66\00:26:02.99
As long as it's not
impacting our lives.
00:26:03.02\00:26:04.73
And Karen said to me,
"You need to see this."
00:26:04.76\00:26:08.03
And I took our daughter
class, eighth grade class,
00:26:08.06\00:26:12.17
my daughter, she
was in eighth grade,
00:26:12.20\00:26:14.04
took them,
00:26:14.07\00:26:15.40
and I don't know
where it was in the museum,
00:26:15.44\00:26:17.97
but there was a
railroad storage unit,
00:26:18.01\00:26:22.61
or, you know, where the railroad
00:26:22.64\00:26:24.61
caboose or whatever,
00:26:24.65\00:26:26.01
and they stuffed
those individuals in there.
00:26:26.05\00:26:28.85
And you can still
see the stain blood
00:26:28.88\00:26:31.39
on the inside of the train.
00:26:31.42\00:26:33.56
Right. Right.
00:26:33.59\00:26:34.92
So we have all suffered. Yes.
00:26:34.96\00:26:37.26
And domestic violence
does not have a color.
00:26:37.29\00:26:40.56
No, no, it doesn't,
00:26:40.60\00:26:42.40
or boundary or
anything, it's there.
00:26:42.43\00:26:45.50
But it's funny
that you talked about
00:26:45.53\00:26:47.64
how people would
think, oh, this is not me,
00:26:47.67\00:26:49.54
or you know, but you went
and you found out that it was,
00:26:49.57\00:26:52.67
but um, and that's one
of our biggest obstacles,
00:26:52.71\00:26:54.91
because we have
a hard time with,
00:26:54.94\00:26:57.51
we, you know what?
00:26:57.55\00:26:58.88
We go out and speak on
awareness on prevention.
00:26:58.91\00:27:01.05
But some people say,
00:27:01.08\00:27:02.42
"Oh, well, you know,
00:27:02.45\00:27:03.79
domestic violence doesn't
have anything to do with me."
00:27:03.82\00:27:06.35
But how do you know
it's not your sister,
00:27:06.39\00:27:08.49
or your brother,
00:27:08.52\00:27:09.86
or the lady sitting
next to you in church.
00:27:09.89\00:27:12.39
Even domestic violence
is prevalent in charge.
00:27:12.43\00:27:15.06
And thank goodness,
00:27:15.10\00:27:16.43
you have a awesome
ministry in your church
00:27:16.46\00:27:18.63
for domestic violence,
00:27:18.67\00:27:20.00
but people
don't think it's dumb.
00:27:20.04\00:27:21.77
So that's why we still
want to bring awareness
00:27:21.80\00:27:24.54
because it can happen to anyone.
00:27:24.57\00:27:25.94
It can happen to anyone.
00:27:25.97\00:27:27.31
I want to thank you both
00:27:27.34\00:27:28.68
for coming on the
3ABN Dare to Dream Network.
00:27:28.71\00:27:31.51
I know it was hard, Tracy.
00:27:31.55\00:27:32.91
We love you.
00:27:32.95\00:27:34.28
We love you,
Sheila. Thank you so much.
00:27:34.32\00:27:35.92
We love you, and
we appreciate you.
00:27:35.95\00:27:38.82
If we can say anything today,
make God your first choice.
00:27:38.85\00:27:42.76
Yes.
00:27:42.79\00:27:44.13
Don't keep the secret.
00:27:44.16\00:27:45.73
Let someone know
that you are in trouble.
00:27:45.76\00:27:49.53
Let someone know
that you need help.
00:27:49.56\00:27:52.33
And God is going
to see you through it.
00:27:52.37\00:27:54.97
Amen.
00:27:55.00\00:27:56.34
Our prayers are
with the Hightower family
00:27:56.37\00:27:57.71
and all of you
00:27:57.74\00:27:59.07
who may be going
through something right now.
00:27:59.11\00:28:01.81
I'm asking you to take a
stand against domestic violence.
00:28:01.84\00:28:05.81
I'm Dr. Kim Logan-Nowlin,
and live to be well.
00:28:05.85\00:28:09.48
God bless.
00:28:09.52\00:28:10.85