Participants: Jeff Reich
Series Code: LM
Program Code: LM000125
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00:47 Laymen Ministries has been working in India for going on
00:49 18, 19 years now, so we really understand the culture here, we 00:52 understand the people and the problems that we face. 00:54 And working with people like Pastor Shadrach Samuel and 00:57 Pastor Johnson, being nationals, we've developed a system that is 01:01 very effective in being able to reach people. 01:06 We believe it's a kind of sowing the seed. 01:09 Various churches we go, and we help people to prepare for these 01:15 end times. 01:17 In 2000 we hardly had like 15 to 30 churches. 01:21 But today, around 150 churches. 01:23 We need a spiritual revival, and by God's grace through the help 01:29 of Laymen Ministries, this is what we are trying to do. 01:40 Being the director of Laymen Ministries, I personally come 01:43 and check on all the different projects. 01:45 Pretty much every year I come to India. I go to North India and I 01:47 look at what's happening with our training school up there. 01:50 I go to the Philippines and I check with what's happening with 01:52 our schools there. Making sure that money is being 01:54 used in a proper way, the work is being done effectively and 01:57 efficiently, and also to build a spirit of camaraderie. 02:00 Because of the fact that we're working with mostly in South 02:03 India with Nationals. They are able to speak the 02:06 language, they understand the challenges they face, they can 02:08 do evangelism. They know when they go into a 02:11 home, like the Bible workers for instance, go into a home, they 02:13 know what to say to be able to touch the lives and hearts of 02:16 those people because they can identify with them because 02:19 they're their own people group. 02:20 And so Laymen Ministries over the years here has really 02:23 developed a very good system. 02:25 We'll go door by door. The first one is forming group 02:29 Bible study. It's a kind of friendship, then 02:32 forming group Bible study. Then the third one is kind of 02:37 evangelistic meeting. The fourth one is the follow up 02:39 work and planting churches. What we are doing is, sowing the 02:43 seed through TV and then we have our Bible workers. 02:47 They will follow the addresses and phone the people who call. 02:51 And then we'll hold a meeting in a particular place, and after 02:56 the meeting we'll plant a church. 02:59 We'll hire a place and put a temporary church roof, then 03:04 we'll appoint a layman to hold a church. 03:08 Then after that, try to buy land, then construct a church, 03:13 it's a long process. 03:15 One of our many challenges is, we do not have a different 03:21 program to reach those who are non-Christians. 03:25 In India, Christian population is very small, less than 7%. 03:31 Less than 7%. So you can understand, 80% of our 03:36 population is un-reached. So our greatest challenge is to 03:41 reach people who have never heard of the gospel. 03:46 Laymen Ministries from the beginning to not just with the 03:51 baptism, we have an ongoing program, training them for 03:55 bringing more souls in soul winning and nurturing the 03:59 churches after, even after baptism, providing lay people 04:03 with the literature, with the resources. 04:07 Pastor Johnson took a few minutes to share with me about 04:10 some of the literature they use in evangelism. 04:12 Many of these books which Laymen Ministries helped print, include 04:15 such titles as "The Great Controversy," "Prophets and 04:18 Kings," "Education," "Mount of Blessings," "Life Sketches of 04:21 the Apostle Paul," devotional books and Bible study lessons. 04:25 Laymen Ministries is not just another type evangelism, just 04:29 people coming here preaching, conducting meeting and going 04:32 away. No. 04:33 This has been an ongoing program, a steady permanent work 04:37 beginning from 1994 and it has steadily grown. 04:41 So we're here to stay we're here to really keep training keeping 04:44 this program going, and that's probably one of the unique 04:46 things about Laymen Ministries is that we just haven't come in 04:49 did some kind of project and left. 04:51 We've been here for a long time and continue 04:53 to plan to stay here. 04:56 When we first started coming to India I would stand in a city 04:59 like Chennai and I think it's the sixth largest city in the 05:02 world or the sixth largest city in India. I cant remember but 05:04 it's just teaming with people and I would look and I would say 05:07 "how in the world is the Lord going reach 05:09 all these people?" 05:10 And it just seemed almost impossible and then as we 05:12 started developing the TV ministry here I realized that we 05:16 can take the truth right into the privacy of a home and be 05:19 able to share the truth with the person. 05:21 A person can be having problems in their life and going through 05:24 different things and they can turn on the TV set and there we 05:26 are face to face with that person in the privacy of their 05:28 home sharing the gospel. 05:30 I really believe that in the end times that somehow God is going 05:33 to take the reigns into His own hands and He's going to somehow 05:36 finish this work in a way that's just going to amaze all of us. 05:39 but meanwhile we have the opportunity to be able to share 05:42 the gospel with millions of people through the privacy of 05:45 their own homes in a television set and I can see now a little 05:49 bit, a glimpse of how we can really touch the lives and 05:52 hearts of a lot of different people. 05:54 There are few homes that which we visited. All came to a church 06:01 through the result of TV evangelism. 06:05 Over the course of several days we had the opportunity to visit 06:09 many homes of people whose lives were transformed by Laymen 06:12 Ministries TV programs and DVDs. 06:14 One couple we visited was particularly on fire for God and 06:18 the Sabbath Truth this was the home of Clayton and Jennifer. 06:22 Clayton is a very interesting person. 06:27 He was a boxer. He lived a wild life, drinking, 06:33 all kinds of bad habits. 06:37 And it's amazing how this man has completely changed. 06:42 He was also a catholic. Once he was one of those who 06:46 received our free CD players. And being an Anglo-Indian, he 06:52 could watch all our programs and DVDs. 06:55 And this man was amazed. He went to his priest asking 06:59 them questions. Why is the catholic church 07:02 teaching like this? 07:04 Clayton was born and raised a Catholic while his wife was a 07:07 protestant Christian. 07:08 Once being introduced to the truth about God, His 07:11 commandments and the Sabbath; Clayton was convinced and 07:14 convicted. 07:15 He doesn't just have a mere knowledge of the truth his 07:18 diligent search for truth accompanied by his discoveries 07:21 made a profound impact on his life. 07:23 As a result his passion to share these truths with others should 07:28 be an example to us all. 07:29 Our duty is to teach everyone and tell them the Truth. 07:32 they must come to know, to know the Truth. 07:35 Come to repentance. 07:36 Come to maturity in Grace. 07:38 Bibles is in every house. 07:40 Its up to you to study it. 07:41 [that's true] 07:43 So you don't study it, you're left without an excuse. 07:46 There's no excuse for you. 07:47 You have it in your use and you don't open it. 07:49 And if someone shows you the light, 07:51 you want to turn your face. 07:52 You don't want to hear. 07:54 But if God is speaking, you have to listen, you have to hear, 07:57 because it's the Truth you see. 07:58 Today we have a choice. 07:59 Jesus said "if you love me, keep my commandments." 08:03 I said, there's a condition in that. 08:04 The whole world is praying for the Holy Spirit, but can't hear 08:07 the Holy Spirit. Why? 08:08 The condition. "If you love me, keep my commandments." 08:11 I'll pray to the Father and He'll send you another 08:13 comforter, "even the Spirit of Truth who the world cannot 08:15 receive. 08:17 But who will be with you and in you forever." 08:19 So God's Truth will come to a person who wants it. 08:23 "Those who hunger and thirst after righteousness shall be 08:25 filled" He says. 08:27 So unless you hunger and thirst 08:29 only God can fill you with His Words. 08:31 Then you can go, and you can share with people. 08:34 Another very interesting thing about 08:36 this man; he found the Seventh 08:38 day Sabbath on his own reading the Word of God. 08:41 And when he found the Adventist Church he was so happy, now this 08:45 man is on fire. His wife did not first accept 08:49 the truth, and this man did not force her. 08:51 It is nearly 4 or 5 years now, just recently two months ago the 08:56 wife on her own decided to take baptism and both husband and 09:01 wife were baptized. 09:03 At first Jennifer wasn't really too convinced about the Sabbath 09:06 or it's importance. When she finally investigated deeper she 09:10 became restless and approached other Christians about the 09:13 Sabbath including her pastor. 09:15 Since pastor said this is done away at the cross and then God 09:19 has given us grace and all this. 09:21 We thought ok, that's it. That's the way it is. 09:23 [and that's good enough] 09:25 Whenever I ask anyone about the Sabbath day they'd say it's a 09:28 cult, and they're making one person very prominent and all 09:31 these things. And also you better be careful. 09:34 This is what they always used to tell me. 09:36 And I used to ask him and he says no, this is what the Bible 09:39 says. You don't have to see anyone, I 09:41 am looking at the Word of God and telling you that it is it. 09:44 And that's all. He'd play the CD. And I'd be 09:47 doing my work and I'd be listening, but like I'd never 09:50 open myself to it, you know? 09:52 Then recently now, one of his parents. 09:55 I think pastor gave him the CD. 09:58 Actually he brought a set of Mark Woodman. 10:01 He started talking and I listened. 10:04 I only just listened to one CD. 10:07 It's was like something was troubling me. 10:09 And again I listened. And it was bringing me back. 10:12 Come listen and I listened. I think 15 no? 10:14 15 CDs. 10:15 The full thing I listened to and that's it. 10:18 I became so... I was sick. 10:20 I didn't know what was wrong with me. 10:22 I couldn't sleep. I couldn't eat. 10:25 I've had that happened to many friends their like "no 10:27 this can't be true! This can't be true!" 10:28 Then you listen some more. 10:30 "No! this cant be true!" 10:31 And then he said what.... we said no I listened to this Mark 10:35 Woodman. And he's a layman but, it's such 10:37 a nice thing. I said he explained everything. 10:39 And he's gone through all the details. 10:42 I mean, he's a layman. What gives him the trouble of 10:45 doing all this? 10:46 That pastor, ok, he's a pastor he has to do it. 10:49 He's taken the job. 10:50 But not a layman. [laughing] 10:51 Not a layman, I said why should he do it I said? 10:52 Is something really...and after seeing it 10:54 I'm so etcetera, etcetera. 10:55 Something's wrong with me. I can't explain it. 10:58 I cannot even eat for three days. 11:00 I can't sleep. I just can't enjoy anything 11:02 [laughing]. 11:03 And this is one those couples who are on fire for the Lord. 11:08 I gave them hundreds of DVDs and they go on distributing to other 11:14 catholics and Anglo-Indians. 11:17 And wherever I go, If I'm in a tea shop, 11:18 I will talk about Christ. 11:20 Anywhere, if I go to the market and see someone... 11:23 I'm not ashamed of the gospel. 11:25 Wherever I go, wherever I go. I'm not ashamed. 11:27 So I go to houses. I speak to people in the house. 11:32 Wherever I go, wherever I go, 11:35 I give the Sabbath Truth. 11:37 Our DVD ministry has been greatly blessed, it has been 11:42 very effective. We have distributed thousands 11:46 and thousands of DVDs. 11:48 With our TV viewers, when they write to us and when we know 11:53 they can follow English, they can understand, we send them our 11:58 English sermons, 11:59 or of our various other speakers like Pastor Mark Finley, Pastor 12:04 Doug Batchelor. And our local language sermons also. 12:08 Many people have expressed appreciation and some people 12:15 have been baptized only through this DVD ministry, this is a 12:20 very great thing. 12:22 It's been really amazing you know, there has been cases like 12:25 one family that was a Hindu family and the wife was going 12:28 through some deep turmoil in her life. 12:29 She watched one of our TV programs and it really touched 12:32 her heart. 12:33 She started calling in on a regular basis. 12:36 Finally she was interested in having the Bible workers come 12:39 but was afraid of what her husband would think because he 12:42 was a high caste Hindu man. 12:44 And what ended up happening is they arranged a meeting away 12:48 from her home. And they ended up starting Bible 12:51 studies with her. 12:52 One day she said my "husband's gone" so, they invited the 12:54 Bible workers to come over to the house and to have a Bible 12:57 study there. 12:58 And in the middle of the Bible study her husband came home, and 13:01 you could imagine he was really disappointed, he's a high caste 13:04 Hindu. Seeing his wife studying with 13:06 these Christian people and he became furious. 13:08 But at the same time he knew that his wife had been 13:11 struggling with a lot of sever depression and he had seen the 13:14 changes that had happened to her over the last several months. 13:17 And he started to understand that this came about from her 13:21 studying the Bible and her new found faith in Christ. 13:24 And so he generally accepted her desire to want to become a 13:27 Christian. 13:28 So he even started taking her to church on Sabbath morning. 13:31 Dropping her off and then driving away and doing different 13:33 things and then coming picking her up at church. 13:35 And one Sabbath morning he pulled up to the church. 13:37 He got there early and the sermon was going on and 13:40 sometimes outside the churches 13:41 they have these loud speakers there. 13:43 And he listened to the sermon and he was touched by the sermon 13:46 and so he actually after that started every once in a while 13:49 coming and parking his car and 13:50 just listening to the sermon outside. 13:52 And then eventually he got to where 13:53 he started coming in the building. 13:55 And praise God that family was 13:57 baptized into the church and it all started 13:58 through this TV ministry. 14:00 It shows how it can go into a home, can touch a person's life 14:03 and it can draw people into the truth. 14:06 This shows how our program works, from sowing the seed 14:13 through TV and then evangelistic meeting then giving books, Bible 14:21 study and planting churches and then not only planting churches 14:25 nurturing the people. 14:27 Nurturing the people is exactly what we were doing one afternoon 14:30 at an Adventist Church in Chennai. 14:32 The church where I'm standing is started through the fruits of 14:37 Laymen Ministry India Bible workers. 14:39 Since 2005 the church is existing. 14:41 Today more then 50 believers are attending every Sabbath service, 14:47 and this church is one of the best examples how Laymen 14:51 Ministry, it's not one thats sowing the seed but focusing 14:56 planting churches in various parts of India. 15:00 So this is the little church that was raised up in 2001? Is 15:03 that what year it was? Yeah? Ok, good. 15:05 We'd come to hear some of the testimonies of the Bible workers 15:08 and to pray with some of the women who were asking for 15:11 special prayer. 15:12 Her name is Shandra Kumari and her husband is to take a lot of 15:18 hard cleaning alcohol. 15:20 He's drinking a lot. 15:21 Shandra Kumari's husband suffered from alcoholic 15:24 poisoning, providentially Laymen Ministry's Bible worker, Joseph, 15:27 had just visited the house at that time. 15:29 And upon learning of her husband's condition suggested 15:32 that he try taking charcoal. As a result her husband 15:36 recovered and they both have been 15:38 receiving Bible studies and now attend the local Seventh day 15:41 Adventist church every Sabbath. 15:43 And their story is a very interesting story, her husband 15:47 is working in the electrical department. 15:50 Stella's husband is a telephone line man, which means he has to 15:54 climb up the telephone poles to repair the lines. 15:56 While working one day he fell and was taken 15:59 to near by Hospital. 16:00 The Bible workers were providentially visiting that 16:03 Hospital and took time to visit with her husband. 16:05 After his recovery Bible studies started with 16:08 the couple at their home. 16:09 Both of them were excited about the message and today they 16:12 attend the Adventist church and watch our television programs 16:15 regularly. 16:16 This again is another example how Laymen Ministries outreach 16:20 with Bible workers, works in tandem with the television 16:23 ministry and the local churches. 16:25 These are just a couple examples of many more stories, every 16:29 Sabbath at this tiny church 40 members along with their 16:32 children attend church every Sabbath. 16:34 After I met with these women I shared a brief message about the 16:38 importance of Lay workers in the church 16:40 and then prayed with them. 16:42 We prayed specifically for a couple of women and then a third 16:45 stranger came forward for prayer. 16:47 And then the unexpected happened. 16:50 She became demon possessed! 16:54 [screaming: "Don't pray! Don't pray! 16:58 Don't pray for me!"] 17:01 [Pastor Shadrach praying] 18:11 We were finishing praying for this one lady and there was this 18:14 one lady there that we didn't know where she had came from. 18:16 Turned out that she was a catholic lady and she came there 18:20 because she was seeking help. 18:22 But as soon as we started to pray, 18:23 She was telling us not to pray she said "don't pray, don't 18:27 pray, don't pray for me!" she said. 18:29 And she fell on the floor and she was gnashing her teeth and 18:33 it was quite evident demon activity. 18:35 And Pastor Shadrach immediately put his hands on her forehead 18:38 and started praying for her and commanding 18:40 the demon to come out. You know, 18:42 calling on the name of Christ. 18:43 And when we prayed finally she became quiet. 18:46 Then she immediately.... and this is the way I think that 18:49 should happen, that I believe should happen because Christ is 18:52 more powerful then demons, then immediately she fell to the 18:55 floor and immediately a calm came over her. 19:01 These people who are possessed after we pray they fall down and 19:05 they lay unconsciously, after some time they get up and they 19:09 are normal. 19:21 One of the things that they were saying is that he was telling me 19:24 when he is coming across this kind of demon activity, that its 19:27 like talking to the devil. 19:29 They'll say who they are, where they came from and such 19:31 This case is like classic case 19:34 of how it really should be dealt with. 19:35 He immediately put his hands on her, prayed for her and then 19:37 she became unconscious and 19:39 then when she woke up she was much better. 19:41 But she was actually from what they were telling me looking for 19:43 a place to go to find deliverance from this demon 19:45 harassment that she'd been having. 19:47 So that was quite the interesting experience for sure. 19:50 When we saw that lady suddenly acting different, it is amazing 19:56 and we still don't...I do not know how she has been talking 20:01 like a spirit of a dead person. 20:04 And often this happens like that. 20:07 They would say "I am from so and so and I'm such and such a place 20:12 and I have possessed this woman!" 20:14 But what we do is we will pray earnestly and our Bible workers 20:19 will take fast and they will... whole day they will sit in the 20:24 church and we'll invite them in the church and we'll pray. 20:29 Sometimes when it is repeated we fast and pray for such people 20:33 and they have permanent relief. 20:35 They have to have a willingness inside to really release that 20:38 demon and to stop the things that are causing those 20:40 demon...demonic influences in their life too. 20:43 They have to stop that kind of association if they really want 20:46 to be free from that kind of demon activity. 20:48 Why do you think it is so common in India that you see so many 20:51 people that have like this kind of demonic activity? 20:53 We see this lady, there is nothing they can do, she is a 20:57 Catholic lady. 20:58 oh. 20:59 The Catholicism is almost like Hinduism here. 21:02 I have observed that this is seen mostly among ignorant 21:07 people, unlearned people. that's one thing, if at all if 21:12 you see this among learning people it's very rare. 21:16 Maybe it's because of the fear 21:19 and their belief in this Hindu or heathen gods. 21:23 And what we witnessed on Wednesday, that woman happens to 21:27 be a catholic believer and this is another observation, 21:31 catholicism and Hinduism we see not very much difference there. 21:36 For example you see a procession there with the Hindu 21:39 deity they're carrying our catholic virgin Mary statue. 21:45 You will not know the difference whether it is Hindu or 21:49 Christian. So even though that woman was a 21:52 Catholic lady I am sure she has this Hindu Philosophy mind, 21:57 worshipping idols and trying to appease God and having fear. 22:03 I think these are some of the reasons. 22:06 With the practices and lifelong traditions of false worship in 22:09 India, demonic activity is not uncommon 22:11 as the vast majority of India's population have heard nothing of 22:16 the gospel. As Pastor Shadrach stated 80% of 22:18 India is completely un-reached for Christ. 22:21 For this reason Laymen Ministries is in a very unique 22:25 and profound position to reach the multitudes with the Truth. 22:28 Why? 22:29 Because our Christian TV programs are airing on a 22:32 mainstream Hindu network Jaya Television, as a result these 22:36 programs are bearing a lot of fruit and a positive result. 22:40 We are receiving a lot of letters. 22:42 Not very many baptisms but one thing I have observed, people 22:47 come to know Adventists as Christians for the first time. 22:51 Many people have the idea that Seventh-day Adventists 22:55 they are a cult. 22:57 Now after our TV presentation they come to me they are 23:01 surprised "You believe in the Bible you believe in 23:03 Jesus Christ?" 23:04 It is a surprise to them, so our TV ministry in Telegu language 23:09 is a great blessing. People come to know 23:12 who Seventh-day Adventists are. 23:14 As far as I know in our whole division, southern Asia 23:19 division. Laymen Ministries is the first to 23:22 start the TV ministry. This has been, beginning 23:27 from 2000 or so we have continued nearly for ten years. 23:33 One of the problems we face we go use secular studios to record 23:36 our programs, Pastor Johnson and Paster Shadrach are under an 23:39 immense amount of pressure 23:41 because they go in there, they're watching the time, 23:42 they know if they go over time their gonna 23:44 get charged extra amount of rupees. 23:45 If we have our own studio we can do things in a more casual 23:48 manner, we can plan things, we can develop programs that will 23:51 even be more effective then the ones we have. 23:53 Soon we are planning to start a Hindi television program because 23:57 in India the potential audience of Hindu speaking is 750 million 24:04 people, and also apart from that those who are in Pakistan those 24:09 who are in the middle east can understand Hindi. 24:12 So the potential audience will be more then 750 million people. 24:18 We have been looking for land to build a studio on for a few 24:21 years. One afternoon I was out with 24:23 Pastor Johnson and Paster Shadrach, we looked at a few 24:26 different potential properties. 24:28 This is one of the places that we're looking at a piece of 24:31 property to buy for a Laymen Ministries office and studio, 24:34 and it's the end of rainy season right now so there's a lot of 24:36 floating water in this area so what we would normally have to 24:39 do most of the places in this part of India anyhow is you have 24:42 to build up the property with 24:44 some kind of pit run and rock fill. 24:45 But anyhow we're looking at a piece right back in there and 24:49 possibly this area where this little house is at and this is 24:52 the silicon valley of south India, this area so real-estate 24:56 here has been skyrocketing the last 10 years. 24:58 Yeah this is an incredible housing development here. 25:07 Where are we at right now? 25:11 Just for one house? 25:14 We have been carefully pursuing plans to build a studio in 25:18 Chennai now for several years. Either the price wasn't right or 25:21 there were complications with the location. 25:24 So we continued to pray and only a few days later 25:26 God answered our prayers! 25:28 Just this morning while we were here in India we were offered 5 25:31 cents of land. Thats roughly maybe a quarter of 25:34 an acre or a little bit less of property here by Paster 25:37 Shadrach's brother Meshach Samuel 25:39 who is a doctor in America. 25:40 And I told him that we are looking for land. 25:43 And I suggested to him why not we give at least 3 cents of our 25:48 land to be registered in Laymen Ministries name. 25:51 And I'm glad he told me "why 3 cents 25:54 lets give 5 cents" he said. Apart from that 5 cents another 25:58 10 cents is available of our land which my brother 26:03 wants to give to Laymen Ministries for the use of 26:06 evangelism in the memory of our parents. 26:09 And that's really an answer to prayer because we've been 26:11 spending the last year and a half 26:12 looking for a piece of property. 26:13 We can start building on this immediately, we need to buy some 26:16 cameras, the studio we need to build, all together probably for 26:20 around $60,000 dollars we could equip this studio to be able 26:23 to do our own in-house production. 26:24 And not have to be wasting money going off to secular studios and 26:28 having programming done. So thats a really God-send that 26:31 happened just today. 26:33 Now we have secured land to help this television ministry 26:36 grow. We are also seeking to increase 26:39 the number of Bible workers who will go out and reap the seeds 26:42 from our TV broadcasts. Our Bible workers will go door 26:45 to door to hand out literature, DVDs and to offer 26:48 to do Bible studies. 26:53 In the last two years has it gotten more difficult to find 26:56 people interested in having Bible studies? 26:58 They said "no!" 27:00 Amazing that they're saying that it's not more difficult. 27:02 Explain to me why it's not difficult to find Bible studies. 27:05 She says they have a lot of experience how to reach 27:13 the un-reached, how to give the Bible study, 27:16 they know the strategy now. 27:18 I asked for Bible workers about their strategy for studying the 27:22 Bible and generally they said they'll start by sharing about 27:25 creation and a single God who created it. 27:28 Then they discuss sin and the need of redemption followed by 27:31 the prophesies and verses that prove Jesus is the Messiah. 27:35 Once a person has an understanding of the gospel 27:37 message, from there we'll branch off into other types of studies 27:41 like on the state of the dead or hell. 27:43 And end time Bible prophesies. 27:45 Due to the success of the Bible worker program we're planning to 27:48 double the number of Bible workers 27:50 so we can have two teams. 27:51 So many people in South India are still in spiritual bondage, 27:56 slaves of ignorance, false Gods and even demonic possession. 28:01 80% of the country is still Non-Christian which makes our 28:04 work in South India a very important one. 28:06 We are doing our best to try to maximize the potential for a 28:10 successful strategy of outreach combining our Bible workers, 28:14 Evangelism and the TV ministry. 28:16 If you'd like to get involved with Laymen Ministries please 28:20 contact us at 414 ZAPADA RD. ST.MARIES, ID 83861 28:25 Or you can contact us at 1-800-245-1844. |
Revised 2014-12-17