Participants:
Series Code: LI
Program Code: LI210499B
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00:01 Welcome back to the Liberty Insider.
00:02 Before the break with guest Ed Cooke, 00:04 we were reaching back to Nazi Germany 00:09 and some of the uncanny parallels. 00:12 We're not really making the parallels yet, 00:15 but startling developments then particularly involving religion 00:20 and how people respond. 00:21 You mentioned Bonheoffer, 00:23 how people respond with their faith 00:25 in a time of great stress. 00:26 And that is very relevant to today, I think. 00:29 Yep. 00:30 And again, you know, I just wanted to touch on 00:32 the point that you mentioned just before the break. 00:35 So, the aspect of Bonheoffer, as far as him seeing 00:37 that there was a moral wrong with Nazi Germany. 00:41 Yes, that being a good point 00:42 at the same time like you pointed out. 00:44 And as we have mentioned in some prior programming, 00:47 that as Christians we are not involved 00:49 in trying to overthrow our government. 00:52 You know, we let God work things out 00:54 and He's the ultimate ruler. 00:56 He has the ultimate power to fix those types of wrongs. 01:00 But one of the things about Hitler's Germany 01:03 that I think is a fascinating part of history 01:06 is not only was he able to... 01:08 We could use the word co-opt the religions within Germany, 01:13 but also he was on a mad pursuit 01:16 and endeavor to obtain religious relics, 01:20 amulets, different things 01:21 that he thought would give he and The Third Reich 01:25 the power they needed to perceive. 01:26 Well, and they believed, 01:28 and I actually think there's some truth in it 01:31 that you know, 01:32 the Greek legends of Thor and his hammer, for example, 01:37 they believed that this was a remembrance 01:39 of an actual weapon. 01:40 And if they could find out enough information, 01:43 they could recreate that weapon. 01:44 Or the Holy Grail seeking after... 01:46 Holy Grail, they believed there was some secret power 01:50 that the early Christians had that derived from Christ. 01:53 Or the Shekinah Glory? 01:55 All sorts of stuff. The Jewish box, you know. 01:56 Yeah. They wanted to get the ark. 01:58 Indiana Jones wasn't totally fabricated, 02:01 it was reality, was the Ananobe group 02:05 that were hunting all this down, 02:06 but it wasn't just to, to get these icons of religiosity 02:11 or to find the secret behind them, 02:13 so they had power. 02:14 There's many things written by the insiders. 02:17 They planned on developing a religion of the area 02:20 and people's state religion, 02:23 and then removing Christianity and all of the religions. 02:26 They wanted in essence, a state 02:29 religion of the area and people, 02:32 sort of shades of Nebuchadnezzar in my view. 02:34 Yes, definitely. 02:36 That even overtures that we might say 02:39 are echoing, you know, today where you've got 02:42 groups that are wanting to take a, 02:44 whatever the religion may be right, 02:46 and make it the dominant state religion. 02:49 You know, maybe in some of our programming, 02:51 we can talk a little bit about Hinduism in India. 02:53 You know, there's another example, 02:55 or even Russian Orthodox Church in Ukraine 02:58 and overtures that way. 03:00 Well, you know, on this program, 03:02 I've said not inaccurately, but I'll qualify it now. 03:04 I've said for years after 9/11, 03:07 that nationalism had sort of ended. 03:10 And, of course, Trumpism 03:12 is a little bit of a denial of that 03:14 because it was make America great again. 03:16 That's Christian sort of nationalism, 03:19 but what's really emerged is ethnic power, 03:24 the religion of a people. 03:27 And so religion plays into that, 03:29 but it's the people group 03:31 and that can manifest in a pseudo nationalism, 03:34 but Hitler was clearly on the people power 03:36 and area and nation and their ancestral religion, 03:39 and descends in essence from the gods, 03:42 Valhalla and all, 03:43 not by accident that he loved Wagner 03:47 'cause Wagner himself had done a lot of research 03:50 into the Nordic gods and legends of origin. 03:55 Very true. 03:56 So you know, we need to stick to the Bible 04:01 as the Protestant Reformer said, 04:03 you know, to Sola scriptura, the Word only, 04:06 because once you start moving away, 04:08 even if you think you're talking religion, 04:10 you pretty soon into mysticism and legend 04:14 and a fatal construct or a false construct. 04:16 And, you know, one, not to get off topic, 04:19 but just to, to note a parallel, right? 04:22 Part of the underlying issues in America 04:26 that would go back to the time period, 04:27 leading up to the civil war 04:29 is that you had a Protestant 04:33 general understanding where, there were individual 04:35 I've actually I've read writings of individuals, 04:38 not only Christians, 04:40 but also scholars of that time period, 04:42 where they would look at passages in scripture 04:45 and use that, 04:47 even though it didn't say 04:48 the area and race or the Caucasian ethnicity. 04:52 They would use that to justify the dominance 04:55 of a certain class, like the Caucasians 04:58 over the African slaves. 05:00 And they would use Scripture to do that. 05:02 So, one can look at that as an example, right? 05:05 Of how religion can be taken and misconstrued 05:09 and individuals maybe being sincere, 05:12 but that's the way they were educated. 05:13 They were raised that way. 05:15 So, in the deep thoughts. 05:17 Well, the Bible talks about the natural heart 05:19 mixing the faith once delivered to the saints, 05:22 but with the natural heart, 05:24 and it will pervert it every time. 05:26 Yep. 05:27 And the natural person 05:28 is loyal to family and clan, and so on. 05:33 It's not unnatural, 05:34 but if that's allowed to play out, 05:36 and then we all like religion, need religion, 05:38 you mix it in, you got a bad, bad mix. 05:41 That's really what happened in Germany in my view. 05:44 They were led step by step toward it. 05:46 And, of course, there was a whole process 05:49 of social engineering. 05:51 It didn't happen in a moment. 05:53 You know, the hero worshiper of the Fuhrer, 05:55 training the youth, 05:56 you know, all things that the Seventh-day Adventist 05:58 we should be grateful that we'd been given advice on this, 06:02 you know, the schools of the prophets, 06:03 of course, it's the model in the Old Testament, 06:06 but church schools, training young people. 06:09 The earlier you get young people 06:11 and give them values that will stick. 06:13 And the Nazis understood that. 06:15 They even got to the point where they maybe had 06:17 basically had baby factories 06:20 with the Waffen-SS men, 06:23 but, you know, the archetype of Arians 06:25 and then suitable women and take the babies 06:27 and farm them and then send them 06:29 to the Hitler youth and so. 06:30 No accident that within a generation, 06:32 they had fanatic, fanatical Nazis, 06:36 and then simultaneously the cult of the leader, 06:40 which I think is dangerous, 06:41 whether it's political or the church. 06:43 You know, we've got powerful quotes in religious liberty. 06:46 You know, John F. Kennedy, 06:47 poet, pope, or prelate 06:50 not going to tell me what to do. 06:52 We shouldn't have that swapping of authority levels, 06:57 but even within a church, 06:59 you know, the Pope 07:01 X is the regent of God on earth. 07:02 The Bible doesn't say any such thing. 07:04 True. 07:06 You know, whether it was Saul trying to sacrifice, 07:08 God says, your kingdom's taken from you, 07:10 whether it was, you know, the priest, 07:13 they fed him into the Most Holy Place on a rope, 07:15 because if he stepped out of line, 07:17 he would be struck down. 07:18 They have to pull him out. 07:19 You know, there's just no argument, 07:22 I think from the Bible to elevate a singular person 07:25 over a church or a state 07:27 to see them like the king. 07:29 The sole authority. Yeah. 07:31 The kings came to say, you know, divine, right, 07:34 God, that's what the crown is. 07:36 People have forgotten all they assembled. 07:37 That's the diadem of the power 07:42 from on high on you. 07:44 Don't believe in that. 07:45 The interesting thing about that is that, 07:47 you know, when we look at aspects of individuals 07:51 and in relationship to God, 07:54 we always have to fall back upon 07:56 what Scripture does teach us about us 07:58 needing to have an individual relationship with Christ 08:01 and recognizing Jesus as the sole authority 08:04 in our lives. 08:06 I believe that as we take the time to cultivate 08:07 that kind of spiritual relationship, 08:09 that is what can help us avoid the errors 08:12 of falling under the dominance and power 08:15 and control of powers that would lead us astray. |
Revised 2021-07-19