Participants:
Series Code: LI
Program Code: LI190432B
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00:03 Welcome back to the Liberty Insider.
00:05 Before the break with guest Kingsley Palmer, 00:08 we were... 00:10 Well, I don't know about you, 00:11 I was really getting into the topic. 00:13 Because we really get into the nitty-gritty 00:16 of what religious liberty is 00:19 and how we are to cry aloud and spare not. 00:23 I believe, as a Seventh-day Adventist 00:25 with our particular take on religious liberty, 00:28 it's a prophetic call. 00:29 It is. 00:31 And it's, it is inseparable 00:34 from our view of where we are in the stream of history 00:36 and what must take place on this earth, 00:39 and then on the cosmic sphere. 00:42 Right, we have a message 00:46 to warn. 00:48 You know, back home in England, 00:50 they say that the queen, 00:52 the objective of the monarchy is to warn government. 00:56 That's probably not a very good thing. 00:58 Yeah, she's moving into direction. 01:00 To warn because she's the sovereign... 01:03 These are things, your policies 01:05 that you are doing are affecting. 01:06 And although I don't step in, but she has done that recently. 01:11 Let's put it back here. 01:12 I cannot be, 01:13 as a spiritual leader and a community leader 01:16 at the same time, 01:17 disconnected from one area of this prophetic ministry 01:21 that we have and only hold on to that 01:24 which I feel most comfortable with. 01:26 That renders me useless. 01:29 You can't do anything, you cannot be happy 01:32 if people are being abused by a system, 01:37 violating their civil rights, violating their human rights 01:40 because when you violate a human right, 01:42 we're telling from a religious standpoint, 01:46 I don't respect your God, I don't honor your God, 01:48 I don't know your God, I don't care about your God. 01:51 So that gives me justification to do whatever... 01:53 To behave. 01:55 You broaden that little bit and I agree with you. 01:57 Religious liberty is not just the narrow 02:00 or what can become a narrow application 02:03 of the Second Amendment in the US particularly. 02:08 It's been said and correctly said 02:10 that religious liberty is the first right, 02:13 but all rights are interconnected. 02:14 You meddle with one, you affect the other. 02:16 Well, of course. And all the others. 02:19 And I think it's arguable, 02:21 and I think observable in the US, 02:23 especially after 9/11, 02:25 when we've seen an erosion of many civil liberties 02:28 that at root, 02:30 religious liberty is weakened. 02:33 Yes. 02:34 And we've lost... 02:36 And it manifests different ways. 02:37 It's not yet manifesting by people being, 02:40 you know, throwing into jail 02:42 because they're Christians or a type of Christianity, 02:45 because they're Muslims, for that matter or anything on. 02:48 But I think it follows, like, 02:50 I'll just give you one roar example. 02:54 I won't say the organization, 02:55 but I have had personal contact with and get emails 02:59 and another missives from a legal advocacy group 03:03 that are concerned about religious liberty 03:06 within the largest civil scale. 03:08 And they're talking about many cases lately 03:10 and one in particular, 03:12 a mayor of a city mistakenly... 03:16 The authorities didn't know 03:18 they were approaching the mayor's residence, 03:19 but a SWAT team came into his, on to his property, 03:24 burst through the doors and windows, 03:26 shot his dog twice, 03:28 and handcuffed him, 03:29 and had him up against the wall, 03:31 and, you know, shocking over treatment 03:33 of a private individual. 03:37 Mistaken, 03:38 but let's just say he had been the one 03:42 they were after. 03:43 That sort of an approach 03:45 can be applied now for the drug user or suspect. 03:50 But with the collapse of all the civil liberties, 03:53 particularly religious liberty, 03:54 with this sort of thing now more rampant, 03:57 you now... 03:58 You were seen as belonging 04:00 to a suspect religious liberty group, 04:02 SWAT group may be coming through your window tomorrow. 04:05 So I think they all are threatened 04:08 declining at the same time. 04:09 It isn't just, 04:11 you know, here we have a nice healthy 04:12 civil liberty situation, 04:14 but religious liberty is a little bit troubled. 04:15 That doesn't work that way. 04:17 No, no, they are all interconnected. 04:19 And so we have a vested interest 04:22 in upholding the general civil liberties 04:24 of the West and the US 04:25 that recognizes the Declaration of Independence. 04:28 I just love to quote it because it sounds great, 04:31 but at root, it means nothing unless it's a Christian logic. 04:34 It says, you know, 04:36 "Nature and nature's God has given us this." 04:39 You know, natural law is not as natural as people imagine, 04:42 it's revealed. 04:44 Revelation as in the Bible 04:46 that there's a God that loves us, 04:48 and wants us to live in His image, 04:50 and to remake our fallen sensibilities 04:55 in a divine image and respect the other people. 04:59 That's the marching orders, and we need to uphold that. 05:02 Well, and I agree, 05:03 and we can't be shrinking violets, 05:05 we can't be non... 05:09 We can't be inactive, as it were. 05:12 We wouldn't be sitting here 05:14 if it were not for the things that our pioneers did. 05:17 Those of the biblical era, 05:19 those that are living in the 21st century, 05:21 we have to care about the planet. 05:22 And we also have a younger generation, 05:25 the millennials 05:26 who are very engaged. 05:28 You got to give them credit. 05:30 They're engaged and wanting to make... 05:32 To map out the identity of Seventh-day Adventist, 05:35 what we mean to a community, 05:36 what value do we bring 05:38 without losing the prophetic focus 05:41 of telling forth 05:45 and also predicting what will come at the end. 05:50 I mean, that's what I'm finding with this particular group. 05:53 I let you freely like all older people, 05:55 I've become older. 05:56 I remember when I was younger, 05:57 but it was a different age when I was younger. 05:59 But the new generation are always a mystery to the... 06:02 Every generation is, I'm sure, we were at our time. 06:06 You know, I have a daughter who's a teenager, 06:09 so I'm not totally disconnected from it. 06:12 But it seems to me that this generation, 06:15 more than others, runs the risk 06:18 of having lots of energy and reaction to the times, 06:21 but not really being well informed. 06:24 And that is our job. 06:26 That's our challenge. 06:27 That's our challenge, it's our job. 06:30 Misdirected passion can be or effort can be dangerous. 06:33 And that is why, at least in my field, 06:37 we have some young adults 06:39 that we have to educate and train. 06:41 I got trained and educated by people 06:43 who were concerned about the things 06:45 that I was 30, 40 years ago. 06:47 I have two grown sons. 06:49 And so there has to be a way 06:53 in which we're able to engage and encourage that. 06:56 We use our wisdom, 06:58 we couple that with their energy, 07:00 and they can identify... 07:03 It's worth remembering that through the ages, 07:07 especially being young people that made a real difference. 07:10 Well, Adventism was started by young people 07:14 and I believe it. 07:15 And nearly out of their teens, 07:17 Ellen White is one of the cofounders. 07:18 When she was 15 or so 07:20 when she first started as a Millerite, 07:21 but she was... 07:23 I'm trying to think of her age when the church was formed, 07:27 but she was... She had to be still very young. 07:29 Yeah, she was, I mean, 07:30 1861, 1863, and right in the middle, 07:32 she jumped in with all our contemporaries. 07:35 We have a group 07:36 that's like that in the 21st century. 07:39 You have back end of the Bible and Daniel and his friends, 07:43 I think they were 17 or so. 07:46 As I told you, 07:48 trying to shock you as much as I discovered, 07:50 they were much abused by the conquering power. 07:53 I think, the unkindest cut had been performed. 07:57 Remember, that was the way 08:02 that Babylon was using them, 08:04 they didn't want them to intermarry and... 08:06 No, kept them separated. They were kept separate. 08:08 They were nullified by... 08:13 Well, how am I describe it? Muted. 08:15 Muted. 08:16 And remember, he went to the king, 08:21 the ruler of the eunuchs. 08:22 Of course, which kind of imply... 08:24 It doesn't mean they were eunuchs. 08:26 Well, you know, 08:28 we don't need to be, we don't need to be... 08:30 Well, the Bible does say something interesting. 08:32 It says we're to be eunuchs for the kingdom. 08:34 That's true. 08:35 That's where I was going with that. 08:37 They are always single-minded... 08:38 Yeah, focus not in the physical realm, 08:41 like that, but... 08:42 So focused on spiritual things 08:44 that the worldly things have no place for them. 08:46 Exactly. 08:48 And we don't have that kind of generation. 08:50 And again, 30, 40 years later, 08:53 and watching this group emerge passionate, 08:56 but need direction, connected, 08:59 but need purpose. 09:00 And I think it serves as a reminder to us 09:04 of where we came from, what we're about, 09:06 and what we should be doing. 09:08 And there's no need to apologize for that. 09:10 We have a wonderful, powerful message. 09:13 Religious liberty, I think is... 09:15 It's so close to the very point of Christianity, 09:19 and, you know, 09:21 it goes to the very ministry of Jesus Himself. 09:25 It isn't just something that as Christians we do, 09:28 it's right at the central thing. 09:29 It should become a lifestyle. 09:31 Christ died for us to reclaim our humaneness, 09:34 and religious liberty helps us reclaim 09:37 what is most human about us, not our visage. 09:40 And I think some Christians have misunderstood 09:42 that we look like God. 09:43 It's to reclaim our character... 09:45 The character of God. 09:46 And how we share mental similarity to God. 09:50 And to each other. Right. 09:51 Well, in relating to each other, 09:53 we will rediscover that and encourage it. 09:55 Exactly, and it's like... 09:56 Let me share with you very quickly. 09:59 When we were in India, 10:00 seeing how young people would come to our home, 10:04 and they would mingle with each other, 10:05 some whose countries were at war with each other, 10:08 and sitting down listening to their dialogue 10:09 and watching them share common experiences. 10:14 That is what we need to be doing, 10:16 and, you know, 10:17 we've talked about my journey, 10:19 and I'm very, very pleased, and happy, 10:22 and privileged to be able to serve in this capacity 10:26 in public affairs and religious liberty. 10:28 And I think the best days are yet to come. 10:31 So I thank you for that opportunity 10:34 to come and share my little story. 10:38 Hopefully it will be a blessing. 10:41 Jesus said when He was asked about John the Baptist 10:45 that he was the greatest of the prophets. 10:47 Nobody greater born of a woman. 10:51 I like to think that religious liberty 10:53 is a prophetic ministry. 10:55 And I would appropriate the words of Jesus 10:57 to this prophetic call 11:00 that in the words of the Apostle Paul, 11:03 that we are proclaiming the gospel of liberty 11:07 and explicating it in a way 11:09 that is meaningful to those around us, 11:12 perhaps those that don't even know 11:14 about the Bible 11:15 or the particular direct call of Jesus. 11:18 We are proclaiming religious freedom 11:21 that is part of a pantheon of civil liberties, 11:25 that in the West, 11:26 we've been taught to ascribe to secular constitutions, 11:30 but ultimately derives from the divine percentage 11:35 from the Creator, 11:36 from His messenger, the Son of God, Jesus Christ, 11:40 and ultimately, 11:41 at the very end, absolutely, 11:44 is a prophetic message to all mankind. 11:49 For liberty Insider, this is Lincoln Steed. |
Revised 2019-04-25