Welcome to the Liberty Insider.
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This is the
program bringing you news,
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views, discussion, insights,
and up-to-date information
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on religious
liberty developments
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in the US and around the world.
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My name is Lincoln Steed,
Editor of Liberty Magazine.
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And my guest on this
program Ed Woods III.
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That III is very important.
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You're the real
McCoy at the moment.
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I want to talk about
something that's near and dear
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certainly to
Seventh-day Adventists
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and anybody that's been
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on the end of our
wide-ranging publishing program
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for 100 plus years,
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the concept in a
book of that name,
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The Great Controversy.
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Okay.
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Ellen White who
wrote that, claimed to...
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well, she was a visionary
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and claimed to
have some insights
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that were
prophetically important.
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But when I read that,
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I see that
history features large,
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Bible prophecy
features very large,
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and contemporary events.
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At least when I
look at the news,
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I might as well be
reading Great Controversy.
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Do you get that
same feeling? I do.
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We are living in
the middle of a turmoil
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that's
unexplainable unless you see it
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as a battle between two forces.
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Two forces.
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And, you know,
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if we look at our theology
as Seventh-day Adventists,
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you know, and talk
about Revelation 12:7-9,
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"Then war broke out in heaven.
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Michael and his angels
fought against the dragon,
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and the dragon and
his angels fought back.
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But he was not strong enough,
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and they lost
their place in heaven.
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The great dragon
was hurled down."
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And when I really studied
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and tried to do an
exegesis of the text
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for the sermon war on earth,
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I realized that
polemos was what war meant.
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And when you're
thinking about war,
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you're thinking about combat,
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you're thinking
about fighting and warfare,
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and that's not what it was.
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It was a propaganda campaign
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between Satan and God
regarding Michael's role,
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but it's also looked upon,
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when you look at the Greek word,
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it was like a
character assassination scheme.
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And I was like...
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You know, I just
thought about it like that,
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you know, propaganda campaign,
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character
assassination scheme, and you...
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So you don't think
there was a literal war?
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It wasn't literal war
combat and I was like,
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it's the battle of the wills.
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I tend to look at the
universe and all the asteroids
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and the bits
and pieces floating,
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I think there might
have been a blow up.
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Yeah, but I guess
what I'm saying is
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in terms of how
the hurled down...
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The real dynamic that
was driving it, absolutely.
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The real dynamic was
the battle of the will
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and the deception
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because, you know, we
look at Isaiah and Ezekiel,
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and it talks about the pride
that was at Lucifer's heart
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that caused him to sin and
take a third of the angels.
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And when you
really look at that,
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you know, in terms of
pride comes before destruction
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and what happened in heaven,
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you know, with the
downfall of Lucifer,
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you're like, "Hmm."
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Going back to what you're saying
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with regards to the
paper, reading the newspaper,
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you know, we are in a war,
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we are in a great
controversy, we see...
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Well, it doesn't make any sense
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unless you
recognize this dynamic.
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This whole dynamic. It's chaos.
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And what I see
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when I think
about the war on earth
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related to the war in
heaven, I see three things.
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I think it begins in the mind,
I think it impacts your faith,
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and I go with the
third angel's message,
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the worship.
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And when I say the
worship in terms of
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we worship the
Creator not the Sabbath
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but we worship the Creator.
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John Milton said that a mind
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can make of
itself heaven of hell.
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It can, it can. So
it's all in the thoughts.
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United Negro College Fund says,
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"A mind is a
terrible thing to waste."
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Terrible thing to waste.
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As a graduate of Oakwood...
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Or not to have at all
according to the president.
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At Oakwood
University. Misquoting it badly.
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President Bush it
was. The President Bush.
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But we said that, you
know, when I went to Oakwood
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when Dr. Reaves
was our president,
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you know, "Enter to
learn, depart to serve,"
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you know, how are
we using our minds.
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And this really caught me
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because, you know,
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it was found in
his heart and his mind,
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he was thinking,
he was speculating,
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"Why can't I
get the same worship
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and honor as Michael?
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Why can't I have the
same, you know, place,
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go to the councils
of God like Michael?
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You know, why am I
being discriminated against?"
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Well, jealousy and
ambition all mixed in together.
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But let me link to
something contemporary
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before you slide on by.
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Okay.
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You know, we've seen a
number of disasters recently
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and I don't know
when this will be shown,
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I hope sooner rather than later,
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but in Puerto
Rico, disaster, right?
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And I heard a comment that
came from the community there.
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It was, not one person said it
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but it was on
behalf of the community,
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it says, "How come
this is happening to us?
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We're Roman Catholic Christians,
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why is this happening to us?"
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And, you know, often
Christians and people of faith,
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of any faith, not
just Christians say that,
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but in this regard,
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why would they say it
after reading Great Controversy?
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They've forgotten
about the bipolar universe.
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That's right, that's right.
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They think if bad comes,
it's from God. It doesn't.
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Absolutely not. This
is the antagonistic force.
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You know, we all go
through trials and tribulations.
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We all go through persecution,
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but it's our
faith that cannot fail.
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And that's why I was
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when we talk
about Revelation 12:7-9,
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it's not only
the war in the mind
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but it's also the war on faith.
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Can you believe God
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when you go through
trials and tribulation?
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I mean, I think the same thing
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when I lost my
grandfather, when I lost my dad.
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Do I believe "Weeping
may endure for the night
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and joy cometh in the morning"?
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Do I believe that the Lord's
is going to descend from heaven
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with a shout and the
dead in Christ are gonna rise?
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I mean, do I
believe what I'm reading,
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what I'm preaching,
what I'm talking about,
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what I've learned
in family worship?
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You know, you talk
about the three-legged school,
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the home, the
school, and the church,
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do I actually believe
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what I've been
hearing or reciting
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whether it's 13 Sabbath school
and they paraded us in front,
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we quote these things
in school, do I believe?
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That whole thing about faith...
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That's the
nitty-gritty of each of us.
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Is really, really important,
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we hit it on our previous show
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when we talked "Is my faith
'what if' or is it 'even if'?"
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Yeah. And we
need these challenges.
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We need these
trials and tribulations,
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as Paul calls it,
"A thorn in my side,"
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you know, in terms
of to keep us awake
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'cause it's so easy that
we could just drift to sleep
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and salvation is passing us by.
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We need these
wakeup calls. Right.
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And also the issue
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is in its overall
sense is very plain,
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but the argument is very subtle.
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Otherwise, a third of the angels
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wouldn't have got out on this.
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Absolutely.
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So people need
to really figure out
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and analyze The
Great Controversy,
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what it's about and
what role they'll play in it.
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And the Bible is
very clear to study
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to show ourselves approved.
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We've got to understand
deception and slander.
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It happens at our
constituency meetings.
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It happens at
our board meetings.
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We've got to pay attention
and you've got to listen.
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Even at the voting booth.
At the voting booth, yeah.
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You've got to pay attention.
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And the problem we're having is
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when people come to church
and they're seeing things,
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they're always quoting
what the preacher said.
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I'm like, "What
did the Bible say?"
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Yeah, good point.
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I mean, the Bible is
the inspired Word of God.
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The Bible is
responsible for rebuke,
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instruction to
righteousness, and correction.
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What does the Bible say?
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And we have too many
people quoting preachers
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instead of knowing
the Bible for themselves.
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Right, they need to know it.
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On religious
liberty, especially in the US,
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I have to throw in a little,
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you know, a lot
of it is based on
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the constitution models, right?
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That is true.
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And even that
sort of troubles me
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because more and
more I've come to believe
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very few people know
what's in the constitution
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and what they think
they know nearly always
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is the
Declaration of Independence.
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And the same thing
applies to the Bible truth.
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We need to know
what the Bible says
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not what people
say about the Bible.
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And then you also
need to also study.
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I mean, I invite
people to give commentaries,
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I invite people to read
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different
translations of the Bible,
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you know, NIV, New King
James, you know, what have you.
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And to know...
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Now you're getting
onto my hobby-horse,
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to know that some
are not translations
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but they're paraphrases.
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Paraphrases.
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There's definitely
the clear word Bible
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and the message Bible.
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You're on that.
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I think that NJKV...
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But more than that to
know what bias might be
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with a certain translation
like the King James Version.
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Most people don't know that
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that was designed to uphold
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the authority of
the king at a time
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when his divine
authority was being challenged.
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That's why we had
to have a new one.
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Right. The New
King James Version.
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It's a pretty
good version. Right.
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I like King James for
the point of language,
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but there was a built
in bias to the translation,
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there's no question.
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And, you know, NIV is
known as our study Bible
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in terms of the
accurate depiction of the Greek
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as related to the Greek
and the Hebrew versions.
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Now I want to throw
something in though.
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You gave me the
perfect opportunity.
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We're...
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I hate to give away
the time of this filming,
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but we're at the
tail end of 2017,
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which is among
other disasters...
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well, not other,
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among disasters had a
wonderful moment of remembrance,
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the Reformation as
defined as it could be,
00:09:13.35\00:09:17.69
but it's not the only event
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of Martin Luther's
Ninety-five Theses.
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But, you know,
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what was the central
point of that at least,
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the calling card
of the Reformation,
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sola scriptura?
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That's right.
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It was about... Read the work.
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And I was very taken
with a few years ago,
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Pope Benedict brought out a...
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well, not a document,
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he gave a speech at
Regensburg University.
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Okay.
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I'll repeat this
as often as I can.
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No one reads these
speeches or these documents.
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He gave a speech,
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he got into
trouble with the Muslims
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because he used an old example
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that apparently
connected Islam with violence,
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but then he said
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there Christianity
used to be nonviolent...
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Sorry, used to be violent
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until it adopted
Hellenistic rationality.
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You and I can
say paganism, right?
00:10:05.90\00:10:08.10
Although his premise was wrong.
00:10:08.14\00:10:09.50
But then he said
there are three threats
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to this nonviolent Christianity.
00:10:11.81\00:10:13.38
And you know what
the first one was?
00:10:13.41\00:10:14.74
What was that?
00:10:14.78\00:10:16.11
He said the reformers
00:10:16.14\00:10:17.48
by their
insistence on sola scriptura
00:10:17.51\00:10:19.01
exposed
Christianity again to violence.
00:10:19.05\00:10:22.25
But you and I know and
our listeners must know
00:10:22.28\00:10:25.15
that it's a
protection to know God's Word.
00:10:25.19\00:10:27.46
Absolutely.
00:10:27.49\00:10:28.82
But, you know, it's interesting
when you said to read these,
00:10:28.86\00:10:30.29
it's the same
thing with the simplica,
00:10:30.33\00:10:31.66
everybody got excited
00:10:31.69\00:10:33.03
because it was talking about
the environment, and recycling,
00:10:33.06\00:10:35.33
impact the environment,
but they didn't read it.
00:10:35.36\00:10:37.43
There was two things that
that simplica could call for
00:10:37.47\00:10:40.60
but they refused to read
it because they wanted to say
00:10:40.64\00:10:42.74
what was in the
paper, the mainstream media,
00:10:42.77\00:10:45.57
it called for true world order
00:10:45.61\00:10:47.58
and then said
there's no difference
00:10:47.61\00:10:49.51
between worshipping
on Sabbath and Sunday.
00:10:49.54\00:10:52.31
And it upheld the
Seventh-day Sabbath,
00:10:52.35\00:10:54.52
but then it flipped it
to the Eucharistic Sunday.
00:10:54.55\00:10:57.05
It was said
there's no difference,
00:10:57.09\00:10:58.42
what they're saying.
00:10:58.45\00:10:59.79
And people are understanding,
you know, what that means.
00:10:59.82\00:11:02.82
You know, the
Sabbath is the only day,
00:11:02.86\00:11:04.19
not only He blessed
it, but He hallowed it,
00:11:04.23\00:11:06.19
that means He
sanctified it and set it apart.
00:11:06.23\00:11:08.20
We can worship God
every day of the week.
00:11:08.23\00:11:09.93
I would encourage everybody
00:11:09.96\00:11:11.30
to worship God
every day of the week.
00:11:11.33\00:11:12.67
And I don't see
that as a Catholic issue.
00:11:12.70\00:11:14.04
No. No, no.
00:11:14.07\00:11:15.40
We're not Catholic,
00:11:15.44\00:11:16.77
but it's respect to
this Great Controversy.
00:11:16.81\00:11:18.41
God's way or what
I think might be fun,
00:11:18.44\00:11:21.21
you know, beside
the Lucifer or Cain,
00:11:21.24\00:11:25.51
man is tried at
many different ways
00:11:25.55\00:11:27.25
without going back to
the reference point of
00:11:27.28\00:11:28.92
what God is
requiring in heaven's order.
00:11:28.95\00:11:31.05
And then our people
are feeling comfortable.
00:11:31.09\00:11:32.69
Well, we know we
did take a survey
00:11:32.72\00:11:34.26
and, you know, the
majority people don't think
00:11:34.29\00:11:37.36
we have to follow the Bible.
00:11:37.39\00:11:38.73
You can't vote away a theocracy.
00:11:38.76\00:11:40.63
And we have to be... I know.
00:11:40.66\00:11:42.00
And I say this all the time,
00:11:42.03\00:11:43.37
we have to be
conservative with our doctrines
00:11:43.40\00:11:46.10
but liberal with our love
00:11:46.13\00:11:47.97
and that's just
something you can't waver on.
00:11:48.00\00:11:50.74
Now having said that though,
00:11:50.77\00:11:52.27
we are known as
Christians for our love,
00:11:52.31\00:11:54.98
and therefore, we
can expect people...
00:11:55.01\00:11:56.34
We should be. We should be.
00:11:56.38\00:11:57.71
It says, "They will know
we are Christians by our..."
00:11:57.75\00:11:59.91
So if there is a
love in our Christians,
00:11:59.95\00:12:02.05
even though we take the name,
the name could be taken easy
00:12:02.08\00:12:04.72
but that is
showing by your behavior.
00:12:04.75\00:12:06.86
And that's what makes
00:12:06.89\00:12:08.62
Public Affairs
and Religious Liberty
00:12:08.66\00:12:10.49
so exciting in the 21st century
where we can hasten the...
00:12:10.53\00:12:14.23
I believe Public Affairs
and Religious Liberty ministry
00:12:14.26\00:12:16.40
is the ministry that will hasten
00:12:16.43\00:12:18.27
the second coming of Christ,
00:12:18.30\00:12:19.73
but we have to
show it in our behavior.
00:12:19.77\00:12:22.54
And then through our behavior,
00:12:22.57\00:12:24.91
we can educate people
00:12:24.94\00:12:26.27
how to have
relationships with Christ,
00:12:26.31\00:12:27.91
then we could go
into Daniel and Revelation
00:12:27.94\00:12:30.25
and talk about the
beast and what those represent
00:12:30.28\00:12:32.65
and where we are as it
relates to the end of time
00:12:32.68\00:12:35.25
because I'm all for
Daniel and Revelation,
00:12:35.28\00:12:37.49
but let's get people to have
a relationship with God first.
00:12:37.52\00:12:40.52
Well, the beast has been a
teaching mechanism to some,
00:12:40.56\00:12:43.02
but if you focus on the beast,
you forget the real issue.
00:12:43.06\00:12:46.29
And we need to do that
00:12:46.33\00:12:47.66
and I'm seeing that
over and over and over again,
00:12:47.70\00:12:49.56
and I'm all for Daniel
and Revelation seminars,
00:12:49.60\00:12:52.07
but people need
to know God first.
00:12:52.10\00:12:54.24
They need to have that thing.
00:12:54.27\00:12:55.60
And that might
mean you have to create
00:12:55.64\00:12:56.97
your own evangelistic
pieces, and that's okay
00:12:57.01\00:12:59.34
because everything
doesn't have to be prepackaged
00:12:59.37\00:13:00.88
in order for it to be taught.
00:13:00.91\00:13:02.24
But meet the needs
of your local community
00:13:02.28\00:13:04.41
by, what, Public
Affairs and Religious Liberty
00:13:04.45\00:13:06.61
and you can make a difference.
00:13:06.65\00:13:08.68
Good breakpoint.
00:13:08.72\00:13:10.05
We'll be back
after a short break
00:13:10.09\00:13:11.45
to continue this discussion
of The Great Controversy,
00:13:11.49\00:13:14.86
the bipolar world.
00:13:14.89\00:13:16.96