Participants:
Series Code: LI
Program Code: LI000375B
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00:04 Welcome back to the Liberty Insider.
00:06 Before the break, with guest Edwards III, 00:10 we were... 00:12 You were in fine sock, so pick up on that. 00:13 I'm sorry to have interrupted you 00:15 because I know the spirit was moving. 00:19 Well, I was talking about an experience 00:20 that really humbled me to be honest with you. 00:24 I was working for the Department of Human Services 00:26 and Ismael Ahmed had this vision 00:28 for a Poverty Summit along with Governor Granholm 00:30 at the time that we did at Detroit. 00:32 But leading up to it, 00:34 they had us do a food-step challenge 00:37 where we lived, I should say, food assistance 00:39 because we used debit cards challenge 00:41 where you would try to live, 00:42 I think it was like $30 for a week. 00:45 And for those perhaps overseas, 00:47 food stamps are part of social welfare for unemployed 00:51 and needy people where you can get... 00:52 Well, you don't necessarily have to be unemployed. 00:53 That's what I said, or needy people 00:55 below a threshold and so on. 00:56 Right, because you can't own your own house. 00:58 And they literally used to be stamps, 00:59 but you were saying... 01:01 It's a debit card. Debit card. 01:02 So we had a debit card. 01:03 And I remember going through the line. 01:07 And at one store, 01:09 you could only go at food assistance line. 01:11 And if they didn't have the icon of the card, 01:14 you were in the wrong line. 01:16 Whereas another store, you could go through any line. 01:19 And so I remember going to the line, 01:21 I was getting my food and I don't know 01:23 what they might have thought about me, 01:25 you know, I wasn't dressed horribly 01:27 since I didn't think I was dressed bad. 01:28 They said, "You have $5.28 left on card, sir!" 01:34 And, Lincoln, I'm looking at them like, 01:35 "Why are you yelling at me?" 01:37 You know, why do you fear I have been... 01:40 I don't understand. 01:44 But they made an assumption that I needed to know 01:47 how much was left on the card 01:49 because I couldn't figure it out for myself. 01:53 And that really struck me 01:56 because, you know, food assistance, 01:58 they always cry fraud, fraud, fraud, fraud. 02:01 There's not that much fraud in food assistance. 02:02 There's not that much fraud in any welfare program 02:04 if you really look at the numbers. 02:06 But they always have these one or two big cases 02:08 and they want to highlight them like this is the norm 02:10 for the course and it's really not. 02:12 There's more fraud out on Wall Street. 02:14 Well, I'm sure you've picked up 02:15 one of the very sinister underside 02:18 to the developing religious rightism 02:21 recently is that the poor are poor 02:24 because they've done wrong 02:27 and they've dropped themselves beneath God's blessing 02:30 and that they deserve to be poor. 02:33 I've worked in the system, 02:34 that's just fundamentally not true. 02:35 No, but I've heard it said. 02:37 I'm disagreeing it. 02:38 But what we don't do 02:40 when we talked a little bit earlier, learn, 02:42 this is why I want to get back to learn to do right. 02:44 You need to take an opportunity to walk in somebody's shoes, 02:47 whether it's living in a housing project, 02:50 whether it's living in a trailer park, 02:52 whether it's living on the streets 02:55 in terms of homelessness, 02:58 in order for you to learn to help people 03:00 and to understand what they're going through, 03:02 I mean, like I told you earlier in one of our previous shows, 03:06 it's not only hard work, 03:07 it's heart work being for someone. 03:09 I mean, you have to have a compassion, 03:11 you have to have a willingness to see 03:13 what it's like to be on the other side. 03:15 It's not something you can just give a prescription to. 03:18 I am amazed. 03:19 I mean, if you look at people who are in assistance, 03:21 how they are managing their money 03:23 and taking care of their kids, 03:25 they have some skill set, 03:28 you know, so to dismiss them and just... 03:30 I mean, it's not a question, there's some connection 03:32 between lack of education and dropping through the tracks 03:36 in modern life. 03:38 Yeah, I mean, you have education, 03:39 but like I shared with you earlier, 03:40 you know, the GED program got cut in Michigan. 03:43 You know, I mean in terms of we got to skip this generation 03:46 and go to another generation. 03:47 Unfortunately, you get below a certain threshold 03:49 and the support structures are removed. 03:51 The support structures are removed, 03:52 you have incentives. 03:53 When I was working with 03:55 the Workforce Investment Act Program, 03:56 you know, the incentive was 03:58 to lower your cost per placement. 04:00 Therefore, those that were hard to serve 04:02 fell through the cracks. 04:04 Now I need to say something first, 04:05 something for our foreign audience. 04:06 I came from Australia and I've lived in the US 04:08 most of my life and it's a very blessed country. 04:11 And on many markers, 04:12 it's the most wealthiest in the world. 04:15 But something that people in the third world countries 04:18 I don't think understand about western societal structure 04:23 and particularly the US 04:24 is you could be earning say 25,000 a year here 04:28 and not doing very well, 04:30 but the threshold for survivability 04:32 in the normal might be 20,000. 04:34 It's not these very low levels, 04:36 like it costs a certain amount just to get any sort of rent, 04:39 to have a car, or whatever, and you can drop below that 04:42 in a flash and you're in an another reality. 04:46 That's exactly right. 04:47 Right. You know, that isn't secure. 04:49 It's not incremental from zero up to whatever, 04:52 there's a breakpoint. 04:53 So, yes, it's looks like there's a lot of income, 04:55 but the income necessary to live 04:57 any sort of a respectable life, 05:00 it's relatively high and you drop below that 05:02 and you're in no man's land. 05:04 Especially for a family of four. 05:06 And so, you know, having the opportunity 05:09 to work in the city of Benton Harbor 05:11 but also to be a part of that Poverty Summit 05:13 and the food challenge, I mean... 05:15 I didn't... I failed. 05:16 Let me just be honest with you. 05:18 For the week, I failed. I couldn't do it. 05:20 I failed because I didn't know how to program 05:24 and how to buy appropriately to make things stretch 05:27 with regards to meal 05:28 because that was a foreign concept for me 05:30 and I failed miserably. 05:33 I have a newfound respect for those who are... 05:37 And they're not on assistance that long, that's another myth. 05:39 You know, people think they're on there 05:41 for year after year after year after year, 05:43 it's a stopgap measure. 05:44 And they might be on there depending on 05:46 if it's welfare or toward the assistance program, 05:48 year and a half, up to two years max, 05:50 and then there's... 05:52 No one really, really wants to be on assistance, 05:54 you have the story, 05:56 but they just did that stopgap to help 05:58 and get to that point 05:59 where they could be having a livable wage. 06:02 And the thing is we got to know. 06:04 We don't really know the programs 06:05 that are out there. 06:06 Now you talk to pastors and they can't even... 06:08 So information can help these people often more than... 06:10 And if they would go to the United Way, 06:12 everybody used to be familiar with United Way, 06:14 you can actually learn as a pastor 06:16 what programs are out there 06:18 so that you can assist your members. 06:20 The church doesn't have to do 06:22 every community service function 06:24 that comes to the church. 06:26 We should be utilizing those programs 06:28 that are out there and get people to help. 06:30 And not only that... 06:31 You don't realize how revolutionary 06:32 what you just said is because that flies against 06:34 the whole faith-based initiative representative Bush. 06:37 Well, I'm sorry. 06:38 I'm being fancy. You're right. 06:41 The church can be a facilitating agent 06:44 to help people get in touch with what exists, 06:46 it doesn't need to do everything itself. 06:48 It doesn't have immediate resources. 06:50 We don't have the capacity or the resources. 06:52 And then if we do it with someone else's money, 06:54 we are a hired hand then. 06:55 That was the problem with faith-based initiative I think. 06:58 We basically showed the press 07:00 that the churches could be bought out by the government, 07:02 which then wanted to control it. 07:05 But the church can be a helpful agency, 07:06 and there are... 07:08 And they need to understand the purpose. 07:09 My wife and I often see people at stop lots begging. 07:12 Well, I mean, I don't know their story, but I often say, 07:15 you know, "Why don't they go to the unemployment office? 07:18 There's agencies that at least could..." 07:21 It seems to me they've reached a dead end to be there just... 07:24 They're not spending time looking for real assistance, 07:27 even going to food banks and things like that. 07:30 And we just missed an opportunity 07:32 'cause we're not really educating, 07:34 you know, out pastors about the federal laws 07:37 that are available in the community. 07:38 I mean, they need to know about Community Action Agencies, 07:41 they need to know about the Michigan Works agency 07:44 and what they're doing. 07:45 They need to know about the different civil rights, 07:47 the Urban Leagues, the NAACP, National Council of ASA, 07:50 understand what's available in your community, 07:53 and then the local base stuff 07:54 'cause some things are just unique 07:56 to the communities because of a need. 07:58 And you have to educate yourself 08:00 and I know it's a huge responsibility, 08:02 but you are the representative, 08:04 you are the shepherd in that community 08:06 that you have said you received and accepted a call from God. 08:10 And although you can't do everything, 08:12 you have to make yourself available to the resources 08:15 to connect 08:16 so that your ministries are assisting the people 08:18 that are in need. 08:20 And I feel so strongly about it and so passionately about it. 08:23 I've never spoken to anyone 08:25 that sort of has a clearer vision on this as you. 08:27 But we can help people. 08:29 And it doesn't cost a lot of money 08:32 by making those referrals 08:34 and it's not just able by the people. 08:36 I'm also talking about the elderly. 08:37 I'm talking about people who are disabled. 08:39 I'm talking about rehabilitation services. 08:42 I'm talking about mental services. 08:43 I mean mental illness is real 08:45 whether people want to deal with it or not. 08:46 And we have these... 08:48 In fact it's a because of homelessness. 08:50 We have these ills in our community 08:52 and we're not really providing an avenue 08:54 or a resource where we can say, 08:56 "Hey, I can't help you here, but here's someone that can." 09:00 And that's what they're looking at, 09:01 I can't help you. 09:02 And I can help and I can send someone to go with you. 09:05 And to bring this back to our discussion of public affairs, 09:08 this is not making the church look good, 09:11 it's making the church effective 09:13 in the eyes of the community 09:14 if the church can be this respondent 09:17 to knowledge and to assistance. 09:19 Absolutely. It'll make a difference. 09:21 Rather than momentary charity. 09:23 It's good but has it's place, doesn't it? 09:25 You know, another thing is, 09:26 you know, Gandhi has this quote that I often remember. 09:30 "I like your Christ, 09:31 but I do not like you Christians" 09:33 because you Christians are so unlike your Christ. 09:37 And the thing is, folks, 09:40 we have a responsibility just to help. 09:43 You know, everybody thinks every time somebody wants help, 09:44 they want to give money. 09:46 Everybody doesn't want money, 09:47 they just need assistance to get over it. 09:49 And if you can connect them to that source... 09:50 Well, knowledge is power. Knowledge is power. 09:52 Knowledge is something we can give. 09:54 But you got to get involved. 09:55 And that means you got... 09:56 And you've got to activate your members. 09:58 You know, and when I say activate your members, 09:59 the pastor can't do everything, 10:01 but you can delegate who could activate your members 10:03 and make that difference. 10:05 Do you see a role 10:06 for the North American Religious Liberty Association 10:08 in activating members to this sort of social action? 10:11 Loaded question. 10:12 Very loaded question. 10:14 Answer that in the next few seconds. 10:15 As a member-based association, 10:19 North American Religious Liberty Association 10:21 really has an opportunity to redefine 10:24 how we connect pastors and members with the resources 10:27 that are available in the community 10:29 not just from an advocacy role 10:31 but also from a justice standpoint. 10:33 And by making those connections, 10:35 I think that we can have more of an impact 10:38 where we could represent the love and the evidence 10:40 of a living Christ in our lives by making those connections. 10:44 So I think the North American Religious Liberty Association 10:47 has potential. 10:48 But those connections are something 10:50 that we can do better in terms of making that happen. 10:52 And I think it will happen with the leadership 10:54 that's currently in place 10:56 and the members that are already on board. 10:59 As a teenager, I first came to the United States 11:02 and settled with my family in Washington, DC. 11:05 I will never forget, 11:07 within a few months of arriving, 11:09 seeing the nation's capital going up in flames. 11:13 There was rioting and indeed almost a state of war. 11:15 Why? 11:17 Martin Luther King had been shot. 11:19 And millions of people across the country cried out 11:23 because it seemed that their cause 11:25 was coming to nothing. 11:27 Don't tell me that social justice is immaterial. 11:31 We know, in the United States, how important this is. 11:34 Anybody that reads the Bible 11:36 knows how important social justice is. 11:38 Anybody that reads it knows how it's biased. 11:42 Salvation itself is almost biased against the wealthy, 11:46 and it's the needy and those that are downtrodden 11:49 that most benefit from the truce 11:51 that God has to give us. 11:52 It's our privilege, I believe, 11:54 working for religious liberty 11:56 to indeed be working for social justice, 11:59 to be working for divine justice, 12:01 and to spread the gospel of liberty 12:04 throughout the land. 12:06 For Liberty Insider, this is Lincoln Steed. |
Revised 2018-01-18