Participants: Lincoln Steed (Host), Ted Wilson
Series Code: LI
Program Code: LI000358A
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00:25 Welcome to Liberty Insider.
00:27 Not too long ago, 00:28 I sat down with Elder Ted Wilson, 00:30 president of the Seventh-day Adventist Church 00:32 and discussed a number of things, 00:34 but most particularly, the Reformation. 00:38 Elder Wilson, I'm sure you are aware 00:41 that 2017 00:43 is the 500th anniversary of the Protestant Reformation. 00:47 You're the head 00:49 of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, 00:51 elected to that position, few more years to go, 00:53 four more years I think in this current term. 00:56 How do you and do you think 00:58 the Seventh-day Adventist Church 00:59 as a group, how do we look at the Reformation, 01:01 now that we're 500 years away? 01:04 Is it really in the past or future for us? 01:07 Well, that's a great question 01:08 and I'm very happy to answer that 01:11 because the Reformation continues. 01:15 In fact, we're given counsel 01:19 in the Spirit of Prophecy that indicates 01:21 that the Protestant Reformation should continue 01:24 until the Lord comes. 01:26 And that we, of all people, 01:28 ought to be very focused on helping the world 01:33 to understand the very basic return 01:37 to the true worship of God 01:39 using scripture, only scripture. 01:42 It's the catchcry of the Reformation, 01:44 Sola scriptura. 01:46 Only by grace are we saved. 01:49 The powerful impact of the Protestant Reformation 01:54 is what helped to form 01:57 a new perspective and understanding of 02:00 how the Christian church should move ahead in an age, 02:04 especially culminating in the great mission outreach 02:08 of the Church several 100 years after the Reformation 02:13 and that has to continue. 02:15 If, in some way, this is diminished, 02:19 it takes away the underpinnings of 02:22 why we as Seventh-day Adventists 02:24 are even here at this very end of time. 02:26 Now, you mentioned the Spirit of Prophecy 02:28 and some of our viewers may not be familiar, 02:31 Seventh-day Adventists, 02:33 our pioneers in the mid-1800s included Ellen G. White, 02:37 in fact, a major figure. 02:38 She and her husband, James White, 02:40 let out and she wrote and said many things that, 02:43 we have clear evidence, were inspired. 02:45 Exactly. 02:47 Spoke prophetically 02:48 and, yes, she did make these clear statements, 02:51 and I guess in a way we are going over that 02:53 but talking to you, 02:55 you believe the Seventh-day Adventist church 02:59 is in the continuum of the Reformation. 03:01 Is that what you are saying? Absolutely. 03:04 Directly, not just in principle. 03:06 We can track our principles 03:08 and the progress of Christianity truth. 03:11 Our roots, our connection, 03:13 we come out of that beautiful stream 03:15 and it has to continue. 03:18 Everyone ought to be focusing upon Christ 03:22 and His righteousness. 03:23 Really, what the Seventh-day Adventist Church 03:27 is to be doing is to be proclaiming 03:30 the righteousness of Christ, 03:32 which is embodied in what we call 03:35 the Three Angels' Messages of Revelation 14, 03:39 and in those messages, 03:41 it is a return to a focus upon Christ 03:45 and not upon self, 03:47 an understanding that we're saved 03:49 through His righteousness not that of our own 03:51 which is essentially the basis of every 03:54 or many other religious organizations. 03:55 It's true. 03:57 It's the central point really that Martin Luther discovered 03:59 and re-readied the Bible, 04:01 and even as I'm listening to you 04:03 say these things which I know too. 04:04 I'm a Seventh-day Adventist, of course. 04:06 Even as I hear this, you know, I think prophecy, 04:10 and I don't think many people remembering 04:13 the Reformation not realize the role the prophecy played 04:16 in that movement. 04:17 Even Henry VIII, 04:19 you know, blasted by history is just being concerned 04:22 about an heir and how many wives 04:23 he could have. 04:25 He wrote himself expositions on prophecy. 04:28 Martin Luther also. 04:30 So you definitely see 04:31 the Seventh-day Adventist Church 04:32 is driven by a prophetic mandate. 04:35 Totally, prophecy and the unfolding 04:39 of what God has indicated 04:41 the Seventh-day Adventist church 04:43 and others who are joining us in proclaiming truly 04:47 the righteousness of Christ and the principles 04:49 of the Protestant Reformation, 04:52 truly that is the fruition at the very end of time. 04:56 We are not futurists or preterits, 04:59 we are historicists. 05:00 We understand the very direct enunciation 05:05 of prophetic instruction 05:08 that God has given in the Word of God 05:11 as something which will unfold and will take place. 05:16 I mean, you take, for instance, the classic example in Daniel 2 05:21 of all the kingdoms 05:23 and, you know, we're focusing on religious liberty 05:26 and all of this kind of thing... 05:27 Starting from Babylon down to Rome in the later day world. 05:29 Exactly. 05:30 And when you take that particular prophecy 05:33 and you understand the play out of that, 05:37 and then the very end of the experience 05:41 with the feet and the toes, 05:43 mixed of iron and clay 05:45 recognizing that in Europe itself, 05:48 which is what it represents, and the 10 kingdoms... 05:51 A weak union sounds like Brexit to me. 05:53 And that's exactly right. It simply will not work. 05:57 The next event after that we're told. 06:00 Stone without, 06:01 cut out without man's hand, the kingdom of God. 06:03 Coming down the kingdom of God. 06:05 So we are living in the very end 06:07 of the tips of the toes, so to speak, 06:10 of that statue of Daniel 2 06:13 and what a marvelous time to be alive. 06:16 What a marvelous time to proclaim the truths 06:18 of the Protestant Reformation. 06:20 What a marvelous time to proclaim 06:22 the righteousness of Christ, 06:23 the centrality of Christ, not our own works, 06:27 but what Christ is doing for us, 06:29 has done, and will do. 06:31 Not only just for us 06:33 and we have nothing to do with it, 06:35 but how we then enter into that 06:37 through the power 06:38 of the Holy Spirit working in us, 06:40 so that's justification, sanctification, 06:42 which is Christ's righteousness. 06:43 That's right, very solid spiritual basis 06:45 for Seventh-day Adventism and then, of course, prophetic. 06:48 You dropped the term that when I tried to explain 06:50 because I know that a lot of the viewers 06:52 are not just not Seventh-day Adventists 06:53 but even some of our own people may not know the terms. 06:56 You said preterism, preterits. What's that? 07:00 Well, an understanding that it was something 07:03 that took place in a very old age time, 07:09 something that essentially doesn't really apply 07:12 to a future application. 07:15 It took place simply at a particular time in history 07:20 and has no relevance to us in the future. 07:23 And the futurists, of course, 07:25 place things far beyond anything 07:27 that is in our time 07:29 and it's very ethereal kind of thing. 07:31 We believe that the Bible very clearly enunciates 07:36 exactly what is going to happen. 07:38 Now, not everything, 07:40 but certainly enough to help us realize 07:42 that God is in control and ultimately God's kingdom 07:47 will truly be the ultimate answer 07:50 to all the challenges that we are facing. 07:52 Yeah. 07:54 What comes to mind 07:55 since I'm on the Reformation mindset now, 07:59 as I understand that preterism was really a concept 08:02 that was if it did exist, before it was very low key, 08:05 but that was brought up as part of an answer 08:07 to the Reformation, in the counter Reformation, 08:10 as I said, because a lot of the reformers 08:12 had this prophetic viewpoint of events soon to come 08:17 and with a protestant cast on it 08:19 and so preterism was a way to pull it away 08:21 from them and say, 08:23 "Well, these prophetic predictions 08:25 really already happened, they were in the past," 08:28 so it denatured the Reformation 08:30 in many practical ways, I think. 08:32 Precisely and it takes... 08:33 And that's why, and I agree with, 08:35 I think that's why Adventists can legitimately see themselves 08:38 as the heirs to the Reformation 08:40 or at least one of the main heirs, 08:42 we're not the only ones but we're so fixated on this 08:45 that it has to describe Adventists very particularly. 08:48 And these erroneous applications 08:50 of prophetic understanding take away the very core 08:55 of how we understand ourselves 08:58 to be God's agents of good for the very end of time 09:04 because the Lord's coming, I believe, is imminent. 09:07 We don't know when the Lord is returning, 09:09 the Bible says only the Father knows 09:11 but we've been given signs, 09:13 I mean Matthew 24 and so many other places, 09:15 I believe, 09:17 the coming of the Lord is very soon. 09:19 I'm sure you've noticed these and preached on it, 09:21 speaks of the fullness of time. 09:23 Exactly. 09:24 Everything is, the conditions are ripe for 09:26 what was predicted. 09:27 And I think Christ could have come 100 years ago 09:31 just to pick one time out of thin air, 09:33 the conditions were ripe enough then, 09:35 when Liberty magazine was bigger 09:37 and, of course, that's my fixation. 09:38 Sure. 09:39 Our church has had a very strong 09:41 religious liberty emphasis 09:42 and there were several reasons for it, 09:44 but a prime one was 110 years or so ago, 09:48 it looked like these events, 09:50 that immediately preceded the return of Christ, 09:52 were about to happen. 09:54 Coercive religious edicts, like before the reformation, 09:59 even perhaps a Sunday law even in the United States, 10:02 even in the middle of Western 10:06 liberal democracies. 10:09 I know you've been very supportive 10:11 of Liberty magazine 10:12 and this program will be shown about the time 10:15 that we are promoting it in particular 10:17 with our own church members, and through 3ABN, 10:20 and hope to a larger audience, 10:23 but apart from financial support, 10:25 which we need, I know you will agree with me. 10:28 We need to get the word out that religious freedom, 10:32 of course, is for everybody to believe in and act 10:34 whatever their conscience guides them toward, 10:37 but as Seventh-day Adventists 10:38 we hope and pray that that leads them 10:40 toward an understanding of Christ 10:41 and where we live in the stream of history, right? 10:43 Absolutely. 10:44 And religious liberty is so vital 10:48 to a Christian's experience 10:50 and to our ability to be able to proclaim 10:53 the precious relationship that we have with people, 10:56 pointing them to the second coming 10:57 of Jesus Christ. 10:59 Without religious liberty, without freedom of conscience, 11:03 and the ability for an individual 11:06 to truly choose, 11:09 society is closed, it is locked down. 11:14 That's why we ought to thank God 11:16 in every country where at least some modicum 11:20 of religious freedom is provided. 11:23 We ought to thank him for that and use it to the hilt 11:26 and not get to the point 11:28 where things are really in very bad shape 11:31 and then say oh, oh, oh, yeah, no, no, I remember now, 11:33 I'm supposed to be trying to help 11:35 religious liberty, you see... 11:37 That's human nature to wait 11:39 until it's almost too late and then do something. 11:40 I mean... 11:41 This is the time to be active. 11:43 The freedom of conscience and religious liberty, 11:45 as we all know, requires constant vigilance. 11:49 That's why I'm so glad you have this program 11:51 and other ways of alerting people 11:53 to the very great importance of individuals taking 11:58 that responsibility on themselves, 12:01 not just leaving it to Lincoln Steed 12:03 or to some attorney or... 12:04 Or with a magazine just some proxy. 12:07 Everybody needs to be involved in helping to preserve that 12:11 and the best way to do that is to share with others 12:14 the need for that beautiful right 12:18 that God gave to us, 12:19 a blessing of the freedom of choice. 12:22 Absolutely. 12:23 And, you know, 12:25 God is still offering that to people, 12:27 and that's why you have this program. 12:29 Amen. 12:30 That's why you have Liberty Magazine. 12:32 I agree with that fully. 12:33 We need to take a break now and we'll be back. 12:34 Stay with us. 12:36 We'll be back shortly to continue 12:37 this discussion with Elder Ted Wilson, 12:39 president of the... 12:40 world president 12:41 of the Seventh-day Adventist church. |
Revised 2017-05-04