Welcome back to
the "Liberty Insider."
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Before the break
with Paul Anderson
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we were deconstructing
Adventist chaplaincy work
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which as I had to reminded
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as more than just
military chaplaincy,
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it's the hospital
chaplains and airport chaplains.
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And in fact-- Community, police.
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Community, in
disaster situations and so on
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and of course
you are intersecting
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with other departments
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within the
Seventh-day Adventist church
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because we have a department
that deals with disaster relief
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and providing food and
other things like that.
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Right.
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So the chaplains
would be integral with that?
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The community service
chaplains have specific training
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that helps them
prepare for responses,
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disaster responses
or other kids of things
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and we would work
hand and glove with ADRA
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or some of the other
community service interjected.
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Yeah.
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I think at another program
I asked you for some stories
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but tell me some
stories you can remember
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of some of the
chaplains in our systems.
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What are some
interesting situations
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that they found
themselves in army or military
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or in some disaster?
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We have, my
latest and best story
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I wish had the graphic for it.
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We have a chaplain, he
is a brand new navy chaplain
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down on the
Island of Diego Garcia
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out in the Indian Ocean.
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It is Indian ocean territory.
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He got there and
he was eight weeks
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in chaplain corps,
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his senior
chaplain was relieved.
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And there were about
2,500 people on the--
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That naval support
activity down there.
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So he was left as a
brand new navy chaplain
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and lieutenant to run the
command religious program.
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He has done a
great job but the thing
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that I admire most this
Lieutenant Zachary Juniper
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there was reported
at General Conference
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that there were no Adventists
there they were actually two
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and he baptized
another one in the lagoon
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at Diego Garcia so
now there are three.
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That's an interesting point.
Let me ask you, what did the--
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He's the only
chaplain on that base, right?
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Correct.
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But often there
are more chaplains,
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how is that seen by
the chaplaincy fraternity
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if one chaplain baptizes
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someone to his
particular persuasion?
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We don't proselytize so--
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That's what I
thought not so ever.
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I just wondered to have word.
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Over an
evangelism is not preferred
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however lifestyle is
and when the chaplain
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is reflecting the
character of Christ
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and Christ is lifted
up through his ministry
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or hers people are drawn to them
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and they will say, "Well,
what's it makes you different?
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Why do you have that glove?"
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Well, it might be
because of health emphasis,
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it might be because of a
that vibrant spiritual life.
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And when we are asked
to share our distinctives
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we are free to do that.
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And if a person
says, "Well, I believe
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in these 28 fundamentals
that you've taught me
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and I want to be baptized
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into the
Seventh-day Adventist church.
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I would be a little
upset with the chaplain
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who wouldn't
baptize that person.
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That's good, and it
doesn't ruffle any feathers
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or anything wouldn't that up?
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No, not if we were holding
a six week evangelist campaign
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on the base I
would probably get a call
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from the chief
of chaplain saying,
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"You might want to call that guy
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but we teach them pretty well
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how to be team players
and community ministry.
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Let's discuss a case--
I'm not trying to ambush you
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but this is a squarely one
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and you probably
got an answer to it.
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Hope I got. So
you have an answer.
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There was a case quite some
years ago on a major US base
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where there
were several chaplain
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may be not at the same time
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but obviously they had
to run different programs
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and the wiccans had--
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Fort Worth, Texas. Yeah.
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You know the whole story
and a number of the chaplains
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when faced with that
resigned or asked for a transfer
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or whatever but
they what moved on,
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wouldn't deal with it.
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It turned out that one
of our Adventist chaplains
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was assigned there
and he authorized--
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Well, it's the wrong word,
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he was the authorizing
authority for this meetings.
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There was misreporting
because in that case
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did the Adventist
or the others preside
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over a wiccan meeting.
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Correct.
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But what-- just
explain that more.
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I've skipped over
so you might want to--
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Curiously the
chaplain who was involved
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in that was my
predecessor is the director
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of Adventist
Chaplaincy Ministries,
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Colonel Gary Councell. And--
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Oh, was that, Gary? It was Gary.
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Oh, I know but I never
asked him about the case.
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He took the dynamic position
that everyone has a right
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to worship in their own way
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and if we don't defend
someone else's right to worship
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we may not be able
to command our own.
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So he as part of
the role of chaplains
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is first to provide
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to facilitating care and advise.
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So he did all of those things.
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Obviously you can't provide
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service in ministry for a wiccan
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but he advocated that
their right be facilitated
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and he demonstrated
care for those individuals
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and their human
right to worship.
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You know, I couldn't say that
he did the wrong thing at all
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but it becomes
a little ambiguous
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on the religious
liberty principle
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I agree absolutely.
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We have to defend the
right for everybody to believe
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or disbelieve as
they moved in themselves
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and not just defend the right
it's such an important right
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that we need to
give our all to defend it
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because we are
defending everybody
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not just that person
with an unpopular belief.
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Correct.
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But it's there as a
dynamic in the Old Testament
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that gives me a little pause.
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It says, we are not
to facilitate witchcraft
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and where I get out
of it on this event,
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I think there is a
misunderstanding on wiccans
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it's really more folk religion
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of the elemental
spirits and so on
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but not in a
spiritualistic sense.
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I mean, I don't
think it's a good religion
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but it's I
wouldn't myself call it--
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It's certainly not like
LaVey and his Church of Satan.
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It's true. I would be very--
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Wouldn't you as a
chaplain very conflicted
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at the very least
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if I was having to authorize
little on run for someone,
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now the worship of Satan.
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Yet that
individual has the right.
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Oh, the individual does.
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So the chaplain's role
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will not be facilitating
providing the sacraments.
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They just basically sign--
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I mean, it might be a simplest
singing off on an authority.
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Exactly, saying to
ideally and in fact,
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when I was at
Andrews Air Force base
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I had a similar
experience and I--
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It was my job to do a needs
assessment for that faith group
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and having
completed the needs assessment
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to forward the request
up to the commanding officer
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and advocate that
individual's right to worship.
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Don't agree with it.
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Wouldn't go to it but
it's the provision of care.
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We care about
everyone of the individuals
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under our ministry of sorts
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and so in caring about
their spiritual development
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and their First Amendment
right to do so we provide care.
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Yeah, and principles plan
like I say on religious liberty
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it's just on the margins
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and individual
mind need to think,
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you know, I'm
going beyond allowing
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or creating the climate
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where they can make
a choice for the church
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or as they have
that choice on this
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or am I actually
making it easier for them to--
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But again it comes down
to a purely personal thing
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and I could see why
in a given situation
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one individual might say I can't
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but conscience do
that in other upfront.
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You know, I had
those young man on my ship
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when I was a chaplain
aboard the USS Monterey`
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who was wiccan.
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And we had an
interesting experience.
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Every night the
chaplain at sea offers
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and evening prayer.
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And after that
we would stand out
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on the bridge wing and talk.
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And it was good opportunity.
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He had grown up southern Baptist
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but because of he
thought their restrictive nature
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he went a different route.
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But in reality he
was living in rebellion
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but he was
growing back toward faith.
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And he actually
identified me as his chaplain
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knowing I was
Seventh-day Adventist but--
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So you are encouraging him
back to more God based faith?
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Absolutely.
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Because I mean, I'm
not an expert on wiccans,
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but I think it's sort of
an amorphous worship of the--
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Well, as Paul says,
the elemental spirits.
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Elemental spirits.
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So it could be
someone that wandering.
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It has a need for spirituality
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that doesn't hasn't
figured out where to find God.
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Let me say something about
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how a person becomes a chaplain.
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Yes.
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That would obviously
someone who has grown up
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or become a Seventh-day
Adventist church member
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who feels called into
ministry, pastoral ministry,
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ideally they would
have some experience
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in that either as a
an ordained local elder
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and of course pursuing a
master of divinity degree
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and after that
they would go online
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to nad.adventistchaplains.org
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and build a profile and
a request for endorsement.
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And we have assistant
directors who would mentor them
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in that application process.
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Once that's done we
have an ACM committee meeting
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that reviews the
application and the interviews
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and decides
whether to recommend them
00:10:54.12\00:10:57.65
as Seventh-day
Adventist chaplains.
00:10:57.69\00:11:00.12
Now it's not impossible
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for a
Seventh-day Adventist pastor
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who is not
working for the church
00:11:03.06\00:11:05.26
to enter the chaplaincy program
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under some other
endorsement isn't it?
00:11:07.23\00:11:09.43
No.
00:11:09.46\00:11:11.17
A Seventh-day Adventist chaplain
00:11:11.20\00:11:13.03
will be endorsed by the
Seventh-day Adventist church.
00:11:13.07\00:11:16.37
Now there are some people
who carry the title chaplain,
00:11:16.40\00:11:20.38
who have not been endorsed
00:11:20.41\00:11:22.41
some of the campuses
hired chaplains who--
00:11:22.44\00:11:26.65
And there are several levels.
00:11:26.68\00:11:28.18
So we have an
associate endorsement
00:11:28.22\00:11:30.32
that requires
lesser degree of training
00:11:30.35\00:11:33.82
than the full endorsement.
00:11:33.86\00:11:35.72
But we are working on
that, when I get to be--
00:11:35.76\00:11:37.79
Now I just
thought I met a chaplain
00:11:37.83\00:11:40.86
who was a Seventh-day Adventist
00:11:40.90\00:11:42.86
but he didn't go
through right track
00:11:42.90\00:11:44.57
and was in the military.
00:11:44.60\00:11:46.74
Could he go and be endorsed
by some other church thought?
00:11:46.77\00:11:50.81
Usually the
endorsement by another church
00:11:50.84\00:11:53.21
requires an
affirmation to their doctrine.
00:11:53.24\00:11:57.55
And in that case they would
not be Seventh-day Adventist.
00:11:57.58\00:12:01.35
Let me ask you one
last question very quickly.
00:12:01.38\00:12:04.19
Is the chaplaincy proportional
to the church membership
00:12:04.22\00:12:07.49
and the community
or in the military?
00:12:07.52\00:12:09.76
There used to be
a proportional need
00:12:09.79\00:12:12.16
where they would say,
00:12:12.19\00:12:13.53
"Well, there are
this many Adventist
00:12:13.56\00:12:14.90
so we can only have this
many Adventist chaplains."
00:12:14.93\00:12:17.60
That doesn't stand
anymore in the military
00:12:17.63\00:12:20.80
so if you are
qualified you can get in.
00:12:20.84\00:12:27.44
A few years ago before I
was editing Liberty Magazine
00:12:27.48\00:12:31.08
I interviewed
General Barry McCaffrey,
00:12:31.11\00:12:34.58
then the drugs
are but only months
00:12:34.62\00:12:37.65
before I interviewed him
00:12:37.69\00:12:39.02
the hero was the second
in command of desert war
00:12:39.05\00:12:42.99
or Gulf war one.
00:12:43.02\00:12:45.59
I introduced myself as
a Seventh-day Adventist
00:12:45.63\00:12:47.73
and he said
"Seventh-day Adventist"
00:12:47.76\00:12:49.13
he said, "I own my life
to a Seventh-day Adventist
00:12:49.16\00:12:53.77
medical corpsman in Vietnam."
00:12:53.80\00:12:57.01
Made me feel good to
think that a young man
00:12:57.04\00:13:00.41
back in that earlier era
00:13:00.44\00:13:02.11
had so practically
witnessed to his faith.
00:13:02.14\00:13:05.81
Through the chaplaincy
program also men and women
00:13:05.85\00:13:10.75
are able to
administer the love of Christ
00:13:10.79\00:13:13.22
to soldiers in harm's
way physically and morally.
00:13:13.25\00:13:19.83
For Liberty Insider,
this is Lincoln Steed.
00:13:19.86\00:13:22.83