Participants: Lincoln Steed (Host), Tim Roosenburg
Series Code: LI
Program Code: LI000286B
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00:05 Welcome back to "The Liberty Insider."
00:07 Before the break with guest Tim Roosenberg, 00:09 we were hitting the heavy topic 00:12 of prophecy in Islam and last day events 00:16 and so I'd asked you, Tim, just see if you can 00:18 just give a point of reference to our discussion. 00:21 The central thing that you are dealing with us, 00:24 the kings of the North and the South, 00:26 how could you sort of set the scene on that? 00:30 Well, let me just use my hand for the Mediterranean 00:34 and we have Jerusalem right here 00:35 at the east end of the Mediterranean 00:38 and the conflict is king 00:40 and North king and the South in Daniel 11. 00:42 Starting at with Persia, that takes Babylon 00:45 which and then occupies Jerusalem from the North. 00:48 Don't leave your hand over... 00:49 Yeah, comes in from the North. 00:51 Then the Greeks come in from the North. 00:53 Then the Greek empire divides four ways. 00:55 All the invaders into Israel had to come 00:57 from the North even if they started somewhere else. 01:00 That pretty much... 01:01 Unless they came form Egypt, there's a South. 01:04 It's true. 01:06 Because they are wider on one direction... 01:08 They are running really two directions. 01:10 You are right. 01:11 In Egypt though, they are usually didn't 01:12 'cause Egypt was, where they would have refuge. 01:14 It was most times the Federal country. 01:17 So the Greeks the came from the North... 01:18 I'm sorry I took you off this summation. 01:20 But then it spits to a North and the South 01:23 and that you have Sallust to the North, 01:25 the town is to the South, Jerusalem 01:27 gets caught in the middle for couple of centuries. 01:29 Then Rome takes over the whole Mediterranean. 01:33 Then Rome splits and again you have a North and a South. 01:36 You have the Christian North, Islamic South 01:38 and Jerusalem gets caught in the middle again 01:40 and it's still the city caught in the middle. 01:43 Now there are three conflicts: the first one, The Crusades... 01:46 Rome split into two between the eastern and the western. 01:51 Ah, not in Daniel. 01:54 In Daniel 7 and 8, Greek splits four ways. 01:57 And that's your Tolonese and the other. 01:59 But in Daniel 11, it only looks at North and South. 02:02 That's true, Daniel, though. 02:04 In Daniel 7and 8 you have in Daniel 2, 02:07 a ten-part split of Rome. 02:10 But in Daniel 11, only North and South. 02:13 Okay. 02:14 And all the North and South 02:16 previously were related to Jerusalem. 02:18 So if you continue with the same pattern, 02:20 you've got exactly the same thing 02:23 and you're gonna expect three conflicts, 02:26 three rules in Revelation, three conflicts in Daniel 11 02:29 after the fall of Rome and you have the Crusades, 02:32 the Ottomans and The Time of the End. 02:35 In The Time of the End conflict 02:37 you're gonna have the king of the South 02:39 push against the king of the North and attack him, 02:41 get the king of the North angry 02:43 and then it will go like a whirlwind 02:46 and Egypt would be overthrown. 02:49 Libya and Ethiopia will follow the king of the North and, 02:54 Moab, Edom and Ammon will escape 02:57 and that we can go to a further a while too 03:00 and the meaning of all that 03:02 but I have discovered in Daniel 11, 03:05 after the time of Christ, 03:06 everything is geopolitical and spiritual. 03:09 The king of the North runs real armies 03:12 and has real territory but it's also spiritual. 03:14 It attacks God's covenant and His people. 03:17 The king of the South ahs real armies, 03:19 real territory but it's also spiritual. 03:22 God's people Israel, 03:24 there is a real land of Israel or Palestine. 03:27 However, spiritually, God's people of faith, 03:30 anyone except Jesus is Lord and Savior 03:32 called Israelites in the New Testament. 03:34 Every thing is running on two levels in this prophecy 03:37 and has been accurate all the way through. 03:39 Yeah, I think you're accurate on that 03:41 'cause there's a lot of people take things spiritually 03:44 and far too many Christians in America 03:48 I think see the fortunes of the modern state of Israel 03:51 is as the literal fulfillment. 03:53 Oh, yeah, you are right about it. 03:54 But I thing this dual approach is the best way to go. 03:56 Here's the interesting thing. 03:58 Back in Jesus' day, they were looking for a literal 04:02 and they were ignoring spiritual. 04:03 In our time, many Christians are looking at a literal 04:07 and focusing on Jerusalem and they are not looking 04:10 at a world wide spiritual application. 04:12 Daniel 11 is really interesting. 04:14 It is literal but it is only like a parable. 04:17 That's only the surface level. 04:18 The real application is the world wide spiritual. 04:21 Yeah, and it causes the real conflict 04:23 that the New Testament, particularly speaks about 04:28 is the battle between the powers of evil, spiritual, 04:32 what does Paul say? 04:34 You know that we battle not against 04:37 the spiritual wickedness in the high places. 04:39 Of course the high places he means is satanic forces. 04:43 Let me add an interesting level to this. 04:47 During the time of the Crusades, 04:50 where Papacy has Israel, Jerusalem, 04:55 part of it, part of it. 04:57 During that time they also pretty much had control 04:59 of Christianity in the Northern part. 05:02 During the second part, they lost control of Jerusalem. 05:06 The Turks had it. 05:08 They also lost control of the church in the North 05:10 because of the reformation. 05:12 Now notice, whatever is happening literally 05:14 is happening spiritually. 05:16 In the third one, they once again get Jerusalem 05:18 according to the prophecy. 05:20 But in Revelation 13:3, and all the world follows him. 05:25 You have this geopolitical spiritual 05:27 that's going point by point through. 05:30 Do you think that in this contest 05:33 between not so much terrorism but the Muslim world 05:39 and its different political entities, 05:41 do you think that they will antagonize Christian powers 05:45 enough to retake Jerusalem 05:47 for sort of an international religious city? 05:51 It wouldn't surprise me at all. 05:54 I'm sort of leading here 05:55 because I think it's not impossible myself. 05:57 I don't know exactly how they do it. 06:01 But it says the king in the North 06:02 sets up his headquarters, temporary head quarters, 06:04 his tens of his palace in the near Jerusalem. 06:07 Depends on how you read the Hebrew 06:08 if it's in Jerusalem or near it. 06:10 So I had to say in or near Jerusalem 06:11 'cause Hebrew experts can't agree on that one. 06:15 I mean, I actually have read stuff about like 06:17 in Jerusalem sort of an international 06:20 or you know, like a theme park for religious identity. 06:24 And I would really like to know 06:25 what may have been going on in the back sides 06:28 of the recent agreement 06:29 with the Papacy acknowledging this Palestinians Day. 06:35 Well, I don't have message on this program before 06:38 but this is the best context. 06:42 I remember in the twilight days 06:46 of John Paul's Pontificate, he went to the Middle East 06:50 and I remember that before he went to Jerusalem, 06:52 he stopped in Ramallah 06:54 and signed an agreement with Arafat, 06:57 basically a treaty where by they said that 07:01 both of then had to be involved 07:04 with the disposition of the Jerusalem 07:07 and a few years later, few years ago now, 07:12 we had a meeting with one of the PLO leaders. 07:16 Actually they headed the delegation in Washington. 07:20 And I asked him about this 07:22 and I was very surprised at his reaction. 07:25 He got very animated and he says, I remember that, 07:28 he said, I was Arafat's deputy in Ramallah 07:32 when he signed that. 07:33 I was standing next to him when he signed it 07:35 and I said, "Is this the binding document?" 07:37 'Cause I said they both did. 07:38 And he says, "Of course," he says, "I want to assure you, 07:42 he says, "the Holy father is still intimately involved 07:46 with disposition of Jerusalem." 07:48 Sure. 07:49 They've always had an interest in it. 07:50 Yes, you know, in a way. 07:52 It's not an unexpected thing to know 07:55 but to me that was like a little window to see, yes, 07:57 this is ticking on in the backyard. 07:59 And so what city is still caught in the middle? 08:01 Islam has the Temple mount, 08:03 Jews are there at the Wailing Wall, 08:05 Christians want control of it, 08:07 it's still the city in the middle. 08:08 You know, the Islamic claim to Jerusalem 08:11 is not as clear as people imagine. 08:13 Yeah, you know what? 08:15 They have possession as nine tenths 08:16 to the law at the moment. 08:18 Well, it's probably even more than that. 08:20 When I was there when were at sunset Friday 08:24 at the Wailing Wall, or the Western Wall, 08:26 'cause I don't like to call the Wailing wall, 08:28 it struck me as overbearing 08:30 with the Al-Aqsa Mosque sitting on top of it. 08:33 It's like yes, you know, I control this 08:37 even though you think this is a Holy spot. 08:39 And if you visit up at the Mosque 08:42 or the Dome of Iraq and then come down 08:44 along the Western Wall, 08:45 you're not always completely welcomed in either spot. 08:48 It's a Gentile. 08:49 What I was gonna say that 08:51 the Islamic claim is interesting 08:54 because Muhammad was never there. 08:56 He had a dream a night, His Night ride. 08:59 Yes, His Night ride. 09:02 You know, where He... 09:04 But haven't you seen 09:06 the hoof prints of His horse in Iraq? 09:08 Well, legend could become pretty physical people 09:12 at their imagination. 09:14 But that's what it is. 09:15 And even though it was not totally clear 09:18 whether it was Jerusalem but it's identified that 09:23 you know, that sort of gives them claim 09:24 and it does figure in the end time events, 09:28 that when Muhammad and Jesus and the prophets 09:31 and the come back. 09:34 It'll all center around Jerusalem. 09:36 So one way or another, yes, you are right. 09:38 The major faiths have a claim on this 09:41 and on all occasions there have even been fist fights 09:44 and pushing and shoving between the various ministers 09:48 and clerics of the different phase. 09:51 Now we also have this third and final conflict. 09:56 For the first time since the Ottoman Empire 10:00 in June and July of 2014, we now have a effective 10:04 where some might functioning Caliphate 10:07 with Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi in Islamic State. 10:11 So for the first time since Ottoman Empire 10:13 we have a king of the South. 10:14 He instantly starts pushing against Christianity, 10:17 hard in Iraq and Syria. 10:19 Well, certainly the extirpation of Christians from Muslim. 10:21 It's pretty high. 10:23 I guess Seven, The Pope, the king of the North. 10:26 That's of 2000 and... 10:28 2014, just a month later. 10:30 Oh, last year. 10:32 Just a month and less than a year ago. 10:36 2104, he calls for a military action 10:42 against the Islamic State. 10:44 So that prophecy says the king of the South 10:46 will push against the king of the North. 10:47 The king of the North will come out him like a whirlwind. 10:52 The next day, Obama, 10:54 the President of the United States says, 10:55 the United States is coming to help. 10:57 And about 24 hrs after the Pope's call 10:58 for the military action, 11:00 the United States starts bombing the Islamic State. 11:04 Since then Islamic State has called the United States, 11:09 the Dog of Rome. 11:12 And because Papacy calls for action, Tomasi, 11:16 the Pope's ambassador to the UN within a couple of days 11:19 of the Pope's call made it clear that 11:21 that was military action that was being required 11:24 and just a month or two ago Tomasi came out 11:27 with a joint statement with Russia calling 11:30 for an International Coalition to go after the Islamic State. 11:35 Russia considers themselves the protector of Orthodox, 11:39 the Papacy of the Catholic church, 11:41 together they made a united call 11:44 for a coalition to take on Islamic State. 11:47 So the dynamic of the Crusades is with us still. 11:50 That's what I see at that. 11:53 Exactly, that's it. 11:54 But the prophecy says the king of the South 11:56 pushing it against him gets him mad. 11:59 He responds and you have an overpowering 12:02 military action that follows. 12:05 We're not there yet. 12:06 No, we're in dynamic situation. 12:08 It's you know, we have very little time left 12:10 but I just want to say and I give you a last word. 12:12 There's no question that prophecy is not words 12:15 on an old, in an old book. 12:16 It's playing out. 12:18 It's playing out in front of us right today 12:20 and it's amazing and what we have going now 12:24 is day by day, I keep looking at the news wondering 12:28 what exactly is gonna be happening today. 12:31 It's unfolding rapidly and I'm really excited about 12:34 watching scriptures come to life. 12:38 The Burden of History, 12:39 it's a phrase that resonates far too much today. 12:44 It's impossible to really understand 12:45 what's happening in the Middle East 12:47 and once you understand history 12:49 as far back as World War 1 certainly 12:51 but as far back as Crusades, I'll be oblique. 12:56 I believe a Christian, anyone of faith, 12:59 needs to understand history, 13:02 great woman that lead out in my church said 13:04 we have nothing to fear for the future except 13:06 we forget the way the Lord has lead in the past 13:10 and as we look at these confusing developments 13:13 that involve religion and fanatical religion often, 13:16 we need to realize that 13:17 the Burden of History is not on the past. 13:21 It reaches to the future 13:22 because it explains in God's word 13:26 that history is leading toward a great moment, 13:29 a moment of liberation, not when ISLE 13:32 or some other fanatical group wave their bandits 13:35 and their rifles over defeated fall 13:38 but when the Lord comes to receive His own 13:41 as it says to reward the faithful, 13:45 to bring history to an end and at eternity to a beginning. 13:51 For Liberty Insider, this is Lincoln Steed. |
Revised 2015-08-27