Welcome back to
the Liberty Insider.
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Before the break
with guest Bruce Cameron,
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we were talking about
making the difference.
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Of course, at
you-- the school that you
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teach at Regent University.
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But let's take
it a little broader.
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And I had
mentioned Liberty magazine
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and how we send it out to
lawyers and public officials.
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That's one way by
giving means to the magazines
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someone can by vicariously
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carry forward religious liberty.
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What suggestions do
you have though for someone
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who wants to make a difference,
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who is concerned to
protect religious freedom
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and promote the
principles that lie behind it?
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What suggestions
would have for our viewers
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to be able to do something
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palpable to make the difference?
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Well, I think the first
thing you've to do is to,
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yourself be converted,
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i.e. no one
believes in these things
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as sort of abstract rules.
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I mean you change
the person's heart
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from within not
from outside. It's true.
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And so if someone
says I want to advance
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the cause of religious
liberty in the United States.
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They have to affirm
understanding the gospel.
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They've to understand
how the gospel should operate
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in society and then at
that point you can say,
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all right, what's
the specific need here.
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Is there a freedom issue
with regard to my local school?
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Is there freedom
issue in my local town?
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Is there freedom
issue at the state?
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There are also two organizations
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that are involved
in freedom issues,
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that is issues
that in which freedom
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advances the kingdom of God.
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And I think the
students can look for that.
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Now if you're talking
about it and I just mentioned
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the word
"students" there are all
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sorts of organizations
that offer internships
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and they offer
stipends for being involved
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in certain things,
for writing papers.
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The bottom line is
that with the internet
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you've access to
all this information
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and if a young person says,
I want to make a difference,
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I want make a
difference in the certain area,
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then you've to look
for the organizations
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that are involved in
that area that are advancing
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the King of God
through freedom of choice
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through proper,
you know, choices.
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Talking about the
internet, every now and again
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I've reason to dilate liberty,
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to liberty something. Right.
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Because there is
Liberty Magazine,
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it's "the magazine"
without against any thought.
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But you dial-in
liberty or religious freedom.
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I did that recent.
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I mean there are
hundreds of thousands of entries
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and many of those
for organizations,
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but discussion and
angles on, it's endless.
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And I'm sure that
someone is motivated.
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A little research like
that they would get contexts
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for organizations
to cooperate with,
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to support, write
letters or respond
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to what their initiatives
they're bringing through.
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The only criteria
or the qualification
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I need to bring
in is some people's
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view of religious
liberty is not correct,
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to say advance the kingdom.
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You know, I can
have the committed,
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I guess it's not
from the true conversion
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or at least of understanding
of God when you converted
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but it's possible to be
want, to want to just carve out
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and entitlement for
your particular viewpoint.
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That's not truly at
least in the construct
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that we use to
promote religious freedom.
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That is not religious freedom.
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That's a very protestant,
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religiously
protestant viewpoint.
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But I do think someone
that's understoodapparent.
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what God's all
about will want to grant
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that same right to someone
to believe something even
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apparent. Right.
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The right to believe that
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and to carve out
their entitlement,
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so it's--as long as all
people are free to pursue
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their religious freedom agenda,
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you've done a great
service for the Lord.
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And you would
see that in the Bible
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that God has allowed evil.
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God has allowed
humans to make choices.
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God allowed us to make choices
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that are very
great damage to Himself.
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And so, you know, I
think the Christian should say,
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how can I give glory to God?
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You know, how can I
advance the kingdom of God?
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And by that I don't mean
the protestant kingdom of God,
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I mean how can you
advance God's, God's word?
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And freedom and liberty
is important part of this.
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Because after all if
we don't have freedom
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we can't choose to follow God.
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And some of
these non-free nations
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where Christians are dying
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because of their
decision to follow, follow God.
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To me a vertical
criteria of freedom is whether
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there is coercion involved.
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If it's coercion it's suspect.
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Well, see that's,
that's why we've been
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talking about the
labor union conversion.
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And it's a good point.
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I think it's the most valid
point on likely--It, it is.
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I mean so forth
example, a young person says
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the Seventh-day Adventist
church has this teaching
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that says church member
shouldn't be union members.
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Well, there's a National
Right to Work Committee,
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which is lobbing in
favor of right to work laws,
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is allowing employees--No, I
should be left with a choice.
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We're talking about closing
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the Seventh-day Adventist church
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that I know of,
never disfellowshipped
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or disciplined anyone for
being a member of a union.
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Not to my knowledge.
It's a recommendation.
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It's based on our
principles we want people
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that is probably not messed.
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But we're not
directly opposed to unions
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nor do we strong our members
in how they're related to.
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We advise. It's
not test of membership.
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No. Test of fellowship, as
you've used the term right.
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And there's a very
few tested fellowship
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at the Adventist
Church and even those are not
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vigorously applied because
we're not in the business
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to use a word
that's larger in sense,
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not as a critic of
captures, but you know,
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we don't have no acquisition.
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The principle of the gospel
is allowed to the individual
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to make the choice and
operate on their unconscious.
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But a church that
represents a common point
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that they join
the common points,
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church has a very
obligation to advise them
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and to direct, but not
compel within the church
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and in the society
shouldn't be compulsive.
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Well, that's--
that is the mantra
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of the National Right to
Work Legal Defense Foundation,
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which is the
organization I work for,
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the committee does work
on litigation and foundation
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does work in the
field of litigation
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and law. And that's it.
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They 're standard
years that they're fighting
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against abuse as a
compulsory unionism.
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The idea is employee should
be free to make his choices.
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Ah, let me just, we
got a few minutes left
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and I want to take
you to another topic.
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Okay. And I don't know.
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I've never brought
this up with you before.
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But Unionism, there
are certain problems
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in relation to
freedom of councils.
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You had mentioned
that the teachers union
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is problematic
sometimes-- Yeah, largest union.
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Many people have
faith that shows them
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to educate the
children at home and schooling.
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Now that's more and
more becoming a matter
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of contention, not so
much in the US, but little.
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But in other
countries this case is,
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it may be NATO, I
think was Norway. No Sweden.
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In Sweden, the
state is acting quite
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harshly against those
usually of the Christian faith
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and want to try the children
at home, what do you think?
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I home school, I say, "I
home school" our children.
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Our children are home school,
my wife home school then.
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What a blessing it was to that.
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I'll tell you my son learned
skills on his spare time,
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home schooling
that have taken him
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through medical school.
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I mean he taught
himself to be a computer expert
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and so home schooling
is just a glorious thing,
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of course, my wife is
a highly skilled teacher
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and so it was a
tremendous blessing to my son,
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tremendous
blessing to my daughter,
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and why is it that
the teachers unions
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are against home school?
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It's because
they're not getting dues
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from the mothers and
fathers. It's that simple.
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It's a matter of control
and it's a matter of money.
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So I hope those unions don't
move upon state authorities
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to cast home
schooling under a legal shadow,
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which to say has happened
under some other countries.
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I first got into sitting
this because in the Soviet Union
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where there was,
there were severe problems
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with the people of
faith and the education
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that state education and
often I mean going to church
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instead of school on Sabbath.
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And so they ended
up trying to teach
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their kids in the
home and they were relaxed
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with the government who
would take the children away.
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And they'll take
the children away
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even in western
countries like United States,
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if it is seen that your
well view is a little elaborate.
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Well, we talk about young people
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who wanted to choose an
area of religious liberty.
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If these were the
issue for the young person,
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there is an organization called
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the Homeschool Legal
Defense Fund that litigates
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on behalf of parents
who want to have the freedom
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to home school their children.
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It's good, thank you
for that information.
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Right, right, well you know,
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almost any of these areas,
Lincoln, that we've discussed,
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the young
person says, "you know,
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I want to do something for God.
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This is the area in which
I want to make a difference.
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For example
religion has a big thing
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on human trafficking,
very great interest in that--
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We should have some discussions,
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but we ran out of time.
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But that's a very valid topic
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and very
contemporary concern I think.
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There are
organizations that address that,
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in fact you can work on that
if you're at the law school,
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work on that problem.
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So the young person just
needs to find the organization
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that is
involved in that activity
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and say what can
I do to help you?
00:10:01.86\00:10:04.10
Absolutely. Very good.
00:10:04.11\00:10:06.09
I appreciate your upbeat manner
00:10:06.10\00:10:07.09
like see the
seconds ticking down,
00:10:07.81\00:10:09.78
but it's been a
pleasure and privilege
00:10:09.79\00:10:13.63
to interview on this program
00:10:13.64\00:10:15.33
and little clue to our viewers.
00:10:15.34\00:10:19.41
You and I drove down
together for this filming
00:10:19.42\00:10:21.97
and we ask of the voting. Yes.
00:10:21.98\00:10:24.54
It's amazing
that we can hear it.
00:10:24.55\00:10:27.09
We need to tell
your viewers, Lincoln,
00:10:27.10\00:10:29.57
what a tough guy you
are because you made me
00:10:29.58\00:10:32.15
go without sleep
and without food.
00:10:32.16\00:10:34.30
And say, come on Bruce,
00:10:34.31\00:10:36.18
let's share with our audience.
00:10:36.19\00:10:38.16
I peddle an amount sometimes.
00:10:38.17\00:10:40.14
But thank you
and-- what do you have
00:10:40.15\00:10:43.31
as just a parting
word to our viewers?
00:10:43.32\00:10:45.60
Well, I tell you what.
00:10:45.61\00:10:47.14
One of the great
opportunities is for
00:10:47.15\00:10:49.43
a young person says
what can I do to advance
00:10:49.44\00:10:52.40
the kingdom of God and I
encourage them by to say,
00:10:52.41\00:10:56.17
you know, "dear
God, lead me on that,
00:10:57.17\00:11:00.29
guide me and help me to know
00:11:00.30\00:11:01.56
what I can do to
advance your kingdom."
00:11:01.57\00:11:03.27
I remember
hearing a story years ago,
00:11:06.70\00:11:09.65
I'm sure a
preferable about someone
00:11:09.66\00:11:12.15
who would had a
wonderful conversion experience
00:11:12.16\00:11:15.32
and then became quite in demand
00:11:15.33\00:11:18.16
going around the
different churches
00:11:18.17\00:11:20.14
explaining about the
Christian experience.
00:11:20.15\00:11:23.76
After quite sometime
and after many presentations
00:11:23.77\00:11:28.08
they were due to give
up in one of the meetings
00:11:28.09\00:11:31.35
and cast about for
the piece of paper that
00:11:31.36\00:11:33.50
they had written on
and couldn't find it.
00:11:33.51\00:11:36.67
And then this individual
was in absolute disarray,
00:11:36.68\00:11:40.35
and went around proclaiming
00:11:40.36\00:11:41.74
I've lost my
Christian experience.
00:11:41.75\00:11:43.53
I think it's very important
00:11:45.60\00:11:47.32
in defending religious
liberty to do the right things,
00:11:47.33\00:11:50.10
at times legally
challenge something important
00:11:51.14\00:11:54.24
and in the public
opinion, but it's the vital
00:11:54.25\00:11:56.82
all ways to have
that Christian experience
00:11:56.83\00:11:59.81
or else wonderful things
down for religious liberty
00:11:59.82\00:12:03.19
will accomplish nothing.
00:12:03.20\00:12:04.92
Guest, Bruce
Cameron, pointed that out
00:12:04.93\00:12:06.85
that we should be training
a car dry of young people
00:12:06.86\00:12:10.74
to reach out and to
speak out for religious freedom
00:12:10.75\00:12:15.09
for this most
precious religious liberty.
00:12:15.10\00:12:18.06
For Liberty Insider,
this is Lincoln Steed.
00:12:19.11\00:12:21.99