Participants: Lincoln Steed (Host), John Graz
Series Code: LI
Program Code: LI000117
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00:21 Welcome to the Liberty Insider.
00:23 This is the program that brings you news, 00:25 views and discussion on religious liberty 00:28 developments in our world. My name is 00:31 Lincoln Steed, Editor of Liberty Magazine 00:33 and my guest on the program is 00:35 Dr. John Graz. Welcome Dr. Graz you're Director 00:39 of Public Affairs and Religious Liberty for the 00:41 World Headquarters of the Seventh-day Adventist 00:43 Church in Silver Spring and. Yes it's a pleasure 00:46 to be with you Lincoln. We were close together 00:49 and it's always a pleasure to have you 00:50 on the program. There are so many things 00:53 going on at the moment. It's always hard to know 00:55 where to jump into. But lets really hit it 00:57 at a red hot flash point. Not too long ago, 01:00 a very small town, Florida independent Pastor 01:05 got everything hot and bothered. 01:07 That everybody hot and bothered by suggesting 01:09 that in retaliation for Islamic provocations. 01:12 He was going to publicly burn the Qur'an. 01:16 Yeah. What do you think such a, such a an 01:19 intention. Oh! There are many, many thing 01:22 we can say about that. First, you know 01:23 you would be interested to know that 01:26 we were in Middle East when it happened. 01:29 We were in Jordan. And in Jordan 01:31 and we had just organized our meeting 01:34 of expert there and of course we saw 01:37 the tension going up and specially you know 01:40 watching on the TV we saw how that the press 01:44 and the media you know put oil on the fire 01:47 instead to say okay, you know that's a very 01:49 marginal thing. You know he is a pastor, 01:51 he has maybe 50 members, 01:53 that's not very important. 01:54 We should ignore that. You know it's interesting 01:58 that to see that the media ignored many things. 02:01 Many things which are happening, which are very 02:03 good are totally ignored. But this time you know 02:06 everywhere in the world you know, 02:08 everywhere in the world we talk about that 02:10 and I remember watching on TV every five minutes 02:14 you know you had something about burning 02:16 the Qur'an, burning the Qur'an 02:18 and you can imagine the affect in Middle East 02:21 where people are really very much religious. 02:24 And it was multiplied by the e-mails 02:26 and so on. Multiplied and so on 02:28 and they were ready to kill people. 02:30 You know they make sure. 02:31 I think the responsibility of our own media are 02:34 very important. We almost make sure that 02:36 they will react. Well, it's a double edged sword, 02:39 because do we want to have the media 02:41 consciously damping down news. 02:44 There might be things that we need to know. 02:45 But there is no question that in many cases 02:48 they rev up something that is not big news 02:50 and make it. No, we could have just ignored, 02:52 you know. It reminds me of a little. 02:54 Fifty people, member of 50 people. 02:55 I will go from the sublime to the ridiculous, 02:57 but it illustrates the point totally. 03:00 In Australia, there is a Seventh-day Adventist 03:03 doctor that still writes for our signs 03:05 of the times. He writes some medical column. 03:07 Years and years ago when I was a very small 03:09 child and he was a friend of my father. 03:12 He worked for the local newspaper. 03:14 He was a reporter and he got front page 03:16 headlines one issue of the, one of the major 03:20 Sydney newspapers with the story about 03:23 there was a death. A lonely death on a 03:25 roadside and you know it would suck you in, 03:28 will it turned out that the story was he found 03:30 a little dead bird on the side of the road. 03:32 Yeah, you have read this. It's such a 03:33 sensational man, he just sucked everyone in. 03:38 I mean that was a total nothing, 03:41 I mean it was God knows every little bird 03:44 that falls, but in reality in the largest scheme 03:46 of things that was no news made into full news. 03:48 Yeah. But the media have that ability, 03:49 how they treated and how they focus on it. 03:51 Right. And in some cases we see a very negative 03:54 affect and. In fact you know we, 03:56 we give a lot of publicity to these pastor maybe 04:00 this is what he wanted. A lot of publicity, 04:02 we gave him you know a publicity everywhere 04:05 around the world and we create problem for 04:08 the country. We create problem for the American 04:10 tourists, for the American army and 04:12 so on and so on. 04:13 And we are really to think about that. 04:15 Well, this is a case where the religious 04:18 and civil liberty issue was sort of at odds 04:20 with the question of moral responsibility. 04:23 Yeah. He had every right to burn a book. 04:28 We shouldn't really say Qur'an, you know books, 04:30 books but, but what he was really attacking 04:33 were the ideas that it contained and, and 04:36 as Christian we're quite used to in Western 04:39 society Christianity is regularly insulted. 04:42 You turn on late night TV and you know they will, 04:45 they will, they'll drag Christian values 04:47 and Christ himself through the mud. 04:50 And we should be more troubled, but surely 04:53 we're not going to go and torch the studio 04:55 where they're filming that. 04:56 This was the dynamic that was uncorked there. 04:58 Prejudice on both sides. A simple Pastor 05:01 who I think was willing to do something beyond 05:04 the moral pale and then on the other side 05:07 Islamic mobs if you like who could be so easily 05:10 in-sided to violence in the name of their 05:12 religion. I think that you know I really wanted 05:15 that the Muslim understand that, 05:17 that is a provocation. And that is also a trap, 05:21 you know he wants to prove that the Muslim 05:23 are extremist, radical, you cannot talk 05:26 with them. They don't respect the freedom 05:28 of expression and they trap them. 05:30 And of course if they react. 05:32 They're killing people, burning embassies 05:35 and so on. It shows that he is right, 05:38 yeah, he is right. And something 05:41 that we have to be very careful too. 05:42 Yeah and of course he stated the reason for 05:46 doing that was because this mosque/community 05:49 center in New York. He saw as a provocation. 05:53 And we don't have any direct evidence 05:55 that it was intended to be, yeah, 05:57 but it functioned as a provocation to certain 06:00 elements in the United States. 06:02 You would be interested to know we talk with 06:04 several leaders in Middle East and several of them 06:08 said you know as a Muslim if we want to built 06:11 a mosque and it becomes a problem 06:13 for the people we should just not doing that, 06:16 that would because we should respect what 06:18 the people think. We should not provoke them. 06:20 It means even the Muslim disagree with the way 06:23 you know. If you have a reaction, 06:26 if people don't understand what you want to do 06:28 maybe the best is just to wait. Yeah. 06:31 It means you have also wisdom and it's not just 06:34 a reaction provoking other reaction. 06:37 The worst which can happened you know, 06:39 the extremists in one side, 06:41 feed the extremist on the other side. 06:44 And that's where I believe we are now 06:46 in global religious affairs. There's a, 06:49 there's a dangerous interaction between 06:51 the radical elements of different religions 06:54 that is feeding and escalating. 06:55 And, and you know we have mentioned 06:57 on this program before, but Samuel Huntington's 06:59 idea of the Clash of Civilization, 07:02 Clash of Civilization yeah. While it was 07:03 simplistic as expressed. Yeah. In many ways 07:06 it has some truth. You know we are, 07:08 I remember talking with someone from the, 07:11 the Untied Nation and a good friend there. 07:14 High position at the United Nation 07:16 and we're of course totally opposed to this 07:20 concept of Clash of Civilization. 07:21 But after September 11 you know he said 07:24 to me we are just in. Just the beginning. 07:28 Just the beginning here. I think so. 07:29 But we have to do our best because 07:31 what would be the benefit of this 07:33 Clash of Civilization. No, no. We will loose, 07:36 all of us will loose you know the best way, 07:38 the best way would be a place. 07:40 The world would be a place where people 07:42 can share what they believe and that is also 07:45 important for Christian. They want to pray 07:48 to the gospel. We want to pray to gospel 07:49 to everyone. We don't want to force anyone 07:51 to follow our Jesus and so on. We just want 07:54 people know that there is a way and you know 07:57 for doing, to do that. We need freedom, 08:00 yeah, we need freedom, the same for the 08:02 other religion. You know the other religion 08:04 also want to share. They need freedom, 08:06 it means we should have kind of a large consensus 08:09 about the religious freedom. It clearly, 08:12 it should be and has to be on a more humane 08:17 level then that burning threat and the 08:20 provocation of building in an alien environment. 08:24 But at the same token you know I read 08:26 my Bible and Paul represents in Ephesians, 08:32 yeah, they came in there and they disrupted 08:34 the local economy there and their religious 08:35 viewpoint was extremely threatening, 08:38 provocative and ultimately there 08:39 was a riot. Yeah. And through no direct 08:43 negative action on his part, there was just an 08:46 inherent conflict. Yeah. And I think on a certain 08:49 level we need to recognize, we do have 08:51 a clash not of cultures, but a clash of theology, 08:55 a clash of Gods. Yeah. That's there but as 08:58 human beings we certainly need to operate in, 09:01 in, in the right way both for civil laws 09:05 and to represent as Christians, represent our 09:08 Christ in a way that does not, you know 09:10 hinging on other people. I thought very often 09:12 of these points you know the consequence, 09:15 the economical consequences of 09:17 a religion. Imagine that the Adventist would 09:21 become a majority in a country. 09:23 Not just a few, a few person but a big majority 09:28 60, 70%. It will affect the economy of some, 09:32 some people. You know what about those 09:35 who are selling alcohol. What about those 09:38 who are selling meat or porks and so on. 09:41 You know and of course at this time 09:44 if you're not ready to accept that, 09:47 that's a part of the freedom we have. 09:48 You may have enemies without really trying 09:52 to make enemies just before because you exist 09:56 and because you have some values it can create 09:59 some hostility and opposition where 10:03 we were living. I'm sure when you said you had 10:04 in mind what's happening right 10:06 now in Iraq for example. The Christians are being 10:10 caught in the middle between the two Islamic 10:12 factions because by both of these radical 10:15 factions they see a problem with Christians 10:17 to pickle it. It's very often being the shop 10:20 that sells alcohol. Yeah, yeah. 10:22 So they see it subverting to their own faith, 10:24 not necessarily the Christianity threatens 10:26 them. No, no, no. But the Christian is an outlaw 10:28 in their society. Yeah exactly. 10:30 And we need to be, it means sometime even 10:33 if you don't want to have enemies indirectly 10:36 you know you provoke because you are affecting 10:39 the interest of some people. Yeah. 10:41 And tobacco is the same you know. 10:43 Imagine that instead to be one or two million 10:45 in North America who would be 50, 60, 70 million 10:49 that wouldn't be terrible for those 10:51 who are selling tobacco and some of the drools. 10:55 At least that's a problem that we haven't 10:56 yet faced, nor likely to soon that we don't know 11:00 how large our particular will grow. 11:04 But we should not under estimated the economic 11:08 affect of a religion, because it has, 11:11 you know it has. You know during long time 11:14 in the Catholic church and still now saw on 11:16 Friday you don't eat meat, but you eat fish. 11:21 It was very good for the fisherman those who 11:24 sell fish. You know the affect is there, 11:27 is the same way a Muslim eating a lamb. 11:30 That's very good for those who, but of course 11:33 business describing is not in a self religion. 11:35 It's just social norms and whenever you change 11:39 any of those, it has economic ramifications. 11:41 Yeah exactly. As the U.S. military have even 11:43 recognized the droughts and social dislocation 11:47 has immediate implications for warfare, 11:50 so it doesn't take much to unsettle the problems 11:54 of society. The point I would like to. 11:55 Like a pit stop football games on the weekend. 11:58 Hot dog sales would drop radically and even 12:02 parking tickets probably would diminish 12:04 and local candies would be in financial trouble. 12:07 There are unforeseen consequences. 12:09 Yeah exactly, the point is you know even 12:12 if you don't attack people directly you maybe 12:15 credit for the interest and at this time 12:18 don't expect that they will just let you to do 12:20 what you want to do and to prosper 12:23 onto increase, they will react. 12:24 And, and as far as Seventh-day Adventist 12:26 and Sunday laws which has been one of our 12:28 markers, we are not be provocative there unless 12:31 our religious behavior is threatened. 12:34 We are not to project that in a way that 12:37 is threatening or restricting to other 12:39 people. We'll be back after a break. 12:42 Interesting discussion, this is always an 12:44 interesting discussion on religious liberty 12:46 affairs that impacts society as a whole. 12:49 We'll be right back. 13:00 One-hundred years, a long time to do anything 13:04 much less publish a magazine, but this year 13:07 Liberty, the Seventh-day Adventist 13:09 voice of religious freedom, celebrates 13:11 a hundred years of doing what it does best, 13:14 collecting, analyzing, and reporting the 13:17 ebb and flow of religious expression 13:19 around the world. Issue after issue, 13:22 Liberty has taken on the tough assignments, 13:24 tracking down threats to religious freedom 13:27 and exposing the work of the devil in every 13:29 corner of the globe. 13:30 Governmental interference, personal 13:32 attacks, corporate assaults, even religious 13:35 freedom issues sequestered within the 13:37 church community itself have been clearly 13:39 and honestly exposed. Liberty exists for one 13:43 purpose to help God's people maintain that 13:46 all important separation of Church and State, 13:48 while recognizing the dangers inherent in such 13:52 a struggle. During the past century, 13:54 Liberty has experienced challenges of its own, 13:56 but it remains on the job. 13:59 Thanks to the inspired leadership of a long line 14:01 of dedicated Adventist Editors, three of whom 14:04 represent almost half of the publications 14:06 existence and the foresight of a little 14:08 woman from New England. One hundred years 14:11 of struggle, one hundred years of victories, 14:14 religious freedom isn't just about political 14:17 machines and cultural prejudices. 14:19 It's about people, fighting for the right 14:22 to serve the God they love as their hearts 14:25 and the Holy Spirit dictate. Thanks to the 14:28 prayers and generous support of 14:29 Seventh-day Adventists everywhere. 14:31 Liberty will continue to accomplish its work 14:34 of providing timely information, 14:36 spirit-filled inspiration, and heaven sent 14:38 encouragement to all who long to live and 14:41 work in a world bound together by the 14:44 God ordained bonds of religious freedom. 14:57 Welcome back to Liberty Insider. 14:59 Before the break we were talking about some 15:01 of the current dynamic of religious 15:03 conflict John. Yeah. You know the provocation 15:05 of a possible Qur'an burning and then 15:10 we were saying the clash of civilizations 15:12 because sometimes it be inadvertent religious 15:14 provocation. Yeah, you know which is interesting 15:17 coming back to the Qur'an, you know 15:19 there is an article was written about the 15:23 Muslim in France, you know in France Islam 15:27 is number two as second religion. It's amazing. 15:30 And which is interesting is, you know 15:32 if you go some part of Paris at 4:00 or 4:30 15:36 in the afternoon. All the quarter of the 15:39 street are block or closed because 15:41 it's a time of prayer which is totally 15:44 impossible to imagine that they do that, 15:47 they will do that for Christian. 15:48 You know if the Christian went to pray. 15:50 They will be arrested in the public square 15:53 and put in jail, but they accepted that 15:55 in these part of Paris you know the 15:58 Muslim can pray and they are protected. 16:00 I went through that part of Paris. 16:01 It's a kind of provocation. 16:02 I gone to see my GPS. I plotted a direct line, 16:05 instead of taking these on the main highways 16:08 it went straight through the area which was 16:10 also know where the riots where. 16:11 I saw all the riots and largely North African 16:15 Muslims that I saw that it was like being 16:19 in a foreign country. You know for me. 16:20 What would people would think of Paris. 16:22 Yeah that is a just violation for you know 16:25 religious or not religious freedom and church, 16:28 state separation, yes, because normally 16:30 they're to say, hey no that is a public area 16:33 you don't have to pray. The other side 16:35 is you know I'm happy to see that in a very 16:37 secularize countries you have people 16:41 who were praying and they are not afraid 16:43 to pray on the public square and they said 16:46 now it's time to pray and that's its kind 16:49 of provocation, but you know that's not 16:52 really.. It maybe, this is good time to put 16:54 an ad in for Islam. You know we have to admire 16:58 the daily faith commitment that it 17:00 requires from an observant Muslim 17:03 and a high percentage to do their prayers 17:06 five times a day. Yeah. Five time a day. 17:09 When you are, when you are, inconvenient. 17:11 Exactly this is what I said to the Christian 17:13 there you know when you are living in your 17:16 country, you know that now its time to pray. 17:20 Do have, you know how I have to pray. 17:22 You know people pray, you know what about 17:25 my own prayer and you know when I was there 17:28 every time you know the Muslim start to pray 17:31 I pray myself too. I said now its time to pray 17:35 and that's a very positive side. 17:37 Even if we can talk about you know is it necessary 17:40 to expand and to have this kind of low but for me 17:45 as individual you know it remember me, 17:48 remember me that, remind me that God 17:51 exists now its time to pray. Yeah. 17:54 And, and obviously as Christians looking at 17:57 any other religion we hold it, we have correct 18:01 faith and they are differing in some 18:03 erroneous in someway. But you can admire 18:08 elements of any faith I think and that 18:11 commitment is good, of course as we saw with 18:13 Roman Catholicism at the middle ages. 18:14 A formalism and wrote behaviors like that 18:19 can become an end in themselves and people 18:21 easily lose sight of the spirituality of it 18:24 and I was even thinking for the first time. 18:26 It never crossed my mom before, but prayer 18:29 or anything else like that. That's routinely 18:32 applied. It could like Pavlov's dogs, 18:34 yeah of course, you just saying you were 18:37 in an area, you learn that's what expected 18:39 and I think an observant Muslim would agree 18:43 readily that defeats the purpose. 18:44 They're supposed to open their mind to God 18:47 as a Christian would do prayer not just 18:49 go through the motions. 18:50 I accept that as long as I'm not forced 18:53 you know to pray and I don't want to force 18:55 anyone. Yes, as far as religious freedom. 18:56 But as the sign to you know which say 18:58 to me now it's a time to pray God exists 19:01 for a behavior that's a good thing. 19:04 But you know in some part of Europe 19:06 in one country they accepted. 19:09 I talk with one of the leader there. 19:11 They accepted that the Muslim could use 19:14 you know they are called to prayer the 19:16 Friday evening. They have the right to do that. 19:19 They did that and after the Atheists say 19:22 and we should have also the right to say 19:24 something and they accepted and the Atheist. 19:27 Atheist is one of those. And they pray this 19:30 a God doesn't exist, God doesn't exist 19:32 and after all the Pentecostal say we are 19:34 many in this city. We should also have the 19:36 right to say something and they also said 19:39 that God is, God is our savior, Jesus is 19:42 our savior. And you know why Babylon 19:45 comes to mind. Very interesting way. 19:48 But you know too many voices, 19:49 but hopefully among all the competing voices 19:52 we can hear the voice of God, because just 19:55 because people are talking religion. 19:56 It doesn't mean that God is really. 19:57 Yeah you talk about Middle Age you know 19:59 probably on the point of freedom, 20:01 Middle age is really a dark period, 20:04 but you know never forget that you have 20:06 a beautiful example of Christianity in Middle Age. 20:09 You had people giving their life not in killing 20:12 others, but really in trying to follow 20:14 the way of Jesus. That was a very observant 20:16 period people forget that. We say the dark ages, 20:19 but in many ways civilization flourished. 20:22 And it was wrong because they force 20:24 people, but there are many positive side 20:26 of Middle Age and one of the rest of the 20:29 Middle Age are the Cathedrals. You know now 20:32 you are living in a very secularized country 20:34 people don't speak about God, there is no 20:37 religion, if you speak about God they look 20:40 at you as a Fanatic you know you don't want 20:42 to walk in the street with your Bible. 20:45 They may arrest you because he is a Fanatic, 20:48 but you have cathedral. And what does 20:51 it cathedral, you know people are living in the 20:53 middle of the old city, you have a beautiful 20:56 cathedral. It means God. You cannot ignore 21:00 that sometime in this country you have people 21:04 believing in God and wanted to built a temple 21:08 for God. You know that's a kind of a message. 21:10 Well I think that's a given. You know, 21:11 we believe it immediately, but I think you talk 21:14 this stuff through and it's obvious that human 21:16 kind has an innate need for the divine, 21:19 yeah, and we're going through a period 21:21 in Europe particularly of secular materialism, 21:26 but that's superficial to some of the great. 21:28 Yeah it's because. It's need of the divine. 21:32 Yeah it becomes superficial when it is 21:34 imposed to people and also we have also to 21:38 remember that people are superstitious 21:40 and very often you know religion use superstition 21:45 to dominate people. You're right that's really 21:47 a lot of the power of religion over people 21:50 getting to these, these deep seated even 21:53 you may seen in some people that religion 21:55 can sort of uncork, superstition is an 21:58 old term for a modern dislocation that people 22:00 have Ron. You know if you say to people 22:02 you know if you don't go through us, 22:05 through special group of people, you will go 22:08 to hell. You know it's scarring and of course 22:11 at the same time it gives to a certain people 22:14 in the society a lot of power because you know 22:17 everyone one day or other have to die 22:20 and what happen after, after you die. 22:22 You know, you need to have some certitude 22:25 about your future and it gives to religious people. 22:29 You know what I think is one of the saddest 22:31 things about modern life and I've never 22:32 vocalized this before, but I have thought of it 22:36 a lot lately as I've read all the news magazines. 22:38 I think living under the nuclear threat for what 22:43 five decades now and other end omens 22:48 of modern life, the environment that. 22:50 People even, religious people as well as secular 22:54 people are almost saying this life is it. 22:57 Yeah. I don't really see that they're earning 23:00 for another life like they use to be. 23:02 Yes. At the moment this fellow Hitchens, 23:07 well known atheist is dying of cancer. 23:11 You picked up from that. Yeah, yeah. 23:13 And not till the end he is saying, not gonna 23:16 change my mind and you know I can't believe 23:18 in a God who would die for us. 23:19 I don't believe it, there is nothing beyond this. 23:22 If he had an enough hope from this life that 23:27 maybe more of it would be great, yeah, 23:29 he might have a hope for the beyond, 23:31 but when, when life is so stultifying now. 23:34 I think it's not conditioning people, 23:36 it's a sort of ironic because we've been 23:38 talking about the middles ages where life was not 23:41 good and they wanted a a better life to come. 23:43 Yeah right. I think that was long conditioning, 23:46 but we have lived through a dislocating 23:48 period where disillusioning and 23:51 curiously, you know maybe a good life is good 23:54 if you believe in religion, but if you don't same 23:57 thing because this is not a great life. 23:58 Yeah. The end of it is at least a release. 24:00 You know. What we have to supply to people 24:03 I think, we were talking about revival on another 24:05 program. Somehow we have to give them 24:07 as Paul said about the Damascus road is vision, 24:11 this heavenly vision. Yes and I think that you 24:14 know seeing you know when you believe 24:16 that there is something after it's not just 24:19 something after is your know there is a place, 24:22 there will be a place where you have all the 24:24 values. You know we see even if your 24:27 life is good, even if you have a beautiful house, 24:29 two or three cars everything is doing well 24:32 still you have to open your eyes. 24:34 There are so many people who are suffering 24:37 today. There are so many people who have 24:39 no hope, so many people who are slaved, 24:43 not you know under injustice and so on. 24:47 You cannot say that everything is doing well. 24:49 You know you need, I know, of course if you 24:52 have no, no values that it may work, but I think 24:57 that you cannot imagine that you know these 25:00 life we are here we find such many, 25:02 so many imperfection will be the end of all. 25:06 That would be a really something we cannot 25:08 accept. Well the Apostle Paul says if this is all 25:11 we bless people to be pitted. Yeah. 25:14 We have to believe something, we have to 25:16 believe. You know Even if we not are prosecuted, 25:20 even if we're not prosecuted, and what about justice, 25:24 he needs to believe in that. What about people 25:26 who're killing other people, who are torturing people, 25:28 You know they just will die in their bed and 25:31 nothing will happen. Well, that's the lamentive 25:34 of the jurists. Yeah. The wicked get away with this, 25:39 there got to be some punishment for those. 25:41 And the Bible does hold that God says 25:44 you know I will repay, vengeance is mine. 25:47 We don't know in what way. We all like to have 25:50 the faith that someone that abuses the child 25:52 or killed gratuitously that they pay for it 25:55 somewhere. Yeah right. You know justice is also 25:58 is something which is important, love is 26:01 important but love include justice too. 26:03 Yeah. Because you love people and you love 26:05 well prosecuted and I think Lincoln 26:09 what is important is you have, we have the 26:12 right to share what with believe including 26:15 the right. Not in a way that it pinches others 26:18 personhood and their spiritual right to believe 26:22 whatever. I will defend the freedom 26:24 of expression, it means I have no problem with 26:26 someone attacking me, attacking what I believe. 26:29 I have no problem with that. It gives me the 26:31 right to answer, but at the same time as 26:34 a Christian, as a believer I will be very careful 26:38 before provocating you know the face or the 26:42 religion of someone else, because you know 26:44 behind there is a man, there is a pupil, 26:46 there is a woman and I want to respect them. 26:50 We started this program by talking about a threat 26:53 to burn the Qur'an and someone in the studio 26:56 made a little comment about burning love, 26:59 well burning someone's holy book is not really 27:02 anything to do with love, Christian or secular. 27:06 But I look back in the Bible and one of the more 27:09 inspiring stories to me are the three Hebrew 27:12 worthies as they're called. Standing for their 27:14 faith and being ready if called upon to have 27:18 their own bodies burned in defensive of faith. 27:21 That's not a bad concept. We're not called 27:25 to be suicide bombers or anyone that throws 27:27 their life away, but there might be time when 27:31 to stand for our fight we will put our life on 27:34 the life and perhaps even undergo the trial 27:37 by fire. But in dealing with other people we call 27:40 to be charitable, we're called to understand 27:43 their point of view to the point of respecting 27:46 their humanity. We are called to exemplify the 27:49 golden rule of doing unto others as we would want 27:52 them to do under us. And ultimately the burning 27:56 issue is how we relate to other people, 28:00 what rights we grant to them. 28:04 For Liberty Insider this is Lincoln Steed. |
Revised 2014-12-17