Hello. I'm Sven Ostring.
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Welcome to Let God Speak.
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For a young person
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who's trying to figure
out what is really true,
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the world can feel like
a rather confusing place.
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Many around us have
so many different ideas
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and worldviews,
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and they all are claiming
to be telling the truth.
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It can feel like a
bit of a confusing maze.
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How do we know
which worldview is true?
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The good news is that
God has revealed to us
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His transcendent
understanding of the world,
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through the Bible,
we're going to be exploring
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God's worldview
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and how we can share
it with young people.
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To discuss this
topic, we have Gayl Fong.
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Thank you so much
for joining us today.
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Thank you. And also Clive Nash.
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It's good to have you
here. Good to be here.
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Let's pray together as we
dive into God's Word today.
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Father in
heaven, we recognize that
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we are so small in this world,
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when we look at space
and all of the planets
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and galaxies and constellations,
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Lord, our view
is so microscopic.
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And, Lord,
sometimes we try to explain
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what the whole world is like.
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But we want to know what
Your view of our world is.
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We wanna understand your picture
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of who we are and
where are we going,
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where we've come from as well.
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Lord, as we head
into the Bible today,
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we pray that Your Holy Spirit
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would transform our minds
so that we can humble ourselves
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and accept what you
want to reveal to us
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today is our prayer.
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In Jesus' name. Amen.
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Amen. Amen.
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In 1999, Warner
Brothers Studios produced
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what is now considered
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to be one of the greatest
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science fiction
films ever created.
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The film I'm
referring to is "The Matrix,"
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a very thought-provoking
film on many levels.
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The basic storyline is
that people don't realize that
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they're trapped inside a matrix.
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It takes a computer nerd called
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Neo to free
people from this matrix.
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As you reflect on
the message of the film,
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you can detect
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an underlying
theme of salvation,
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even though it's
still a bit distorted.
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The critical problem in the film
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is that reality
is not what it seems.
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We believe that we
are living ordinary lives,
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going to work in the morning
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and then coming home in
the evening to our families.
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But the reality
is nothing like that.
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It's just an
illusion, a computer simulation.
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We're actually
trapped inside a giant matrix
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where highly
intelligent machines
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are using us, like a human farm,
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to harvest our energy,
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there has to come
to the understanding
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of the truth so he
can save all of humanity.
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You know, "The
Matrix" is just a film.
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But it does challenge us to us
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whether what we think
is real is actually true.
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You know, is this just a theme
for science fiction movies?
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Or is it more of
an issue in our world?
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Is it possible that the
world may be very different
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from what we
believe to be the case?
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No, throughout history,
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people have
believed different things
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about the world
that weren't true.
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For an example, for
2,000 years intelligent
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and well educated
people believe that
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actually the
world was stationary
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and that
everything in the universe
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revolved around the earth.
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And, you know, we
can understand that
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why they felt that, Gayl,
because of course, you know,
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when we stand on the ground,
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except when there's earthquakes
and other things like that,
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it does feel very stationary,
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and it looks like
the stars are going,
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you know, round around the sky.
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So we can understand it.
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But, you know, the
question, Clive, is this,
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is it an issue which
we still see even today?
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Well, we might,
from our standpoint
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here in the 21st century,
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so, well, as medieval people,
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you know, they had a
pretty limited idea of things
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and we smile at them.
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But there are a lot of
well educated people today,
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people with science degrees,
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who think that we came
out of some kind of warm pond
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and, you know, life
just evolved by chance.
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Yes. Yes.
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You know, that leads us
to a very interesting point.
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People will say
that science shows that
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the earth is moving,
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in fact, it's
hurtling around the sun
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at an incredible speed of
108,000 kilometers per hour,
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which is incredibly fast.
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And so what
science has shown that
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the earth is not stationary,
as you observed, Gayl.
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We also not
only moving very fast
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but we located on the
edge of the Milky Way galaxy
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in a remote corner,
shall I say, of the universe.
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So I guess the question is this
if the scientific explanation
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for how life began was that
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we evolved from
a warm little pond
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as Darwin put it,
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shouldn't we
automatically accept that too?
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You know, shouldn't we say,
well, back in Galileo's time,
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the church was wrong,
so we should admit that
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we're wrong now
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and just accept the
scientific viewpoint.
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Well, that's
actually a misunderstanding
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of what happened.
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And I have a quote here
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perhaps that would just
throw some light on that.
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John Linux, he's
pointed out that,
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"Galileo enjoyed a
great deal of support
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from religious intellectuals,
at least at the start,
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the astronomers of the powerful
Jesuit educational institution,
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the Collegia Romano
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initially endorsed
his astronomical work
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and vetted him for it.
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However, he was
vigorously opposed
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by secular philosophers
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who were in enraged at
his criticism of Aristotle.
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So this was
bound to cause trouble,
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be it emphasize not at
first with the church."
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Very interesting.
That's right, Gayl.
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And in especially "A
Brief History of Time"
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by Stephen Hawking,
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he wrote that
Galileo actually annoyed
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the Aristotelian philosophers
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who united against him seeking
to persuade the Catholic Church
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to his cosmology
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or his view of
the of the cosmos.
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And the real problem
was that the Catholic Church
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was persuaded by the
scientists of the day
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to conform to science.
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Well, what they thought
was good science of their day.
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And, unfortunately,
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I think the
mainstream Christianity,
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the Catholic
Church in particular,
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are making a
similar mistake today
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by adopting the Big Bang Theory
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and theistic
evolution, for example.
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Theistic evolution
is one of your areas,
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I think, you might
like to just define.
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I was going to define it,
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but I thought it might
be better coming from you.
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Yes. Sure. Sure.
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Yes.
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So theistic evolution
is basically this idea
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that Neo Darwinian evolution
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has occurred
down through history,
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and the gods
supervise this process.
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And that is how
we came about and,
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in particular, that
there was no observable,
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identifiable time when
God stepped in to create.
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So you can accommodate
long ages of the earth,
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for example, in
that sort of philosophy.
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That's correct. That's correct.
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And so as you
rightly say, Clive, you know,
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the Catholic Church has adopted
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both the Big Bang cosmology
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but also theistic
evolution as well.
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But what I want to do
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is I want to go
back to the movie,
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The Matrix, and the
idea that was brought up
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in that because, you know,
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we can say, well,
that's just a movie.
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You know, movie
makers produce stories
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about all sorts of things.
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But it's really fascinating
that there is a Swedish
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professor called
Professor Nick Bostrom,
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who believes that
we are actually living
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in a computer simulation.
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So this world,
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everything around
us is a simulation.
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And that might sound
very, very crazy to you.
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But the fascinating
thing is he's not alone.
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So think of Elon Musk,
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the CEO of the
Tesla car company.
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SpaceX. Yes, exactly.
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And also, you have
Neil deGrasse Tyson,
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who is a TV
presenter on science.
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Both of them agree on TV
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that we might be living
in a computer simulation.
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And I guess my
question for us today is this,
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what do you make of this idea
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that these well
informed scientific people,
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the idea that
I'm putting forward?
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I think it confirms that
really intelligent people
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can have some
very farfetched ideas.
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It is amazing,
isn't it? It is amazing.
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I was thinking, as in the back
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to the 17th century
philosopher Descartes.
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Right.
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French philosopher, who
said in his own language...
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[speaking in French]
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Which I think has become more...
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It had become better known
in the Latin cogito, ergo sum,
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"I think therefore I am."
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You know, so I must
exist because I'm thinking.
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That's right.
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So, you know, this
sort of this idea of
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if there's
design in the universe,
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there must be a designer.
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Yes.
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And that fits in with
a Christian worldview.
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Yes, absolutely.
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So what the
computer simulation concept
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is really telling us
or it kind of supports,
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'cause, you know,
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we know that
computer simulations
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are created environments.
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So it supports this
idea that the whole universe
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is actually designed
by intelligent being,
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as you say, Clive,
it's really fascinating.
00:10:41.50\00:10:44.31
But that leads us
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to two fundamentally
different worldviews.
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Two fundamentally
different worldviews,
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on one hand, you have this idea
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that the
universe is all that is.
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And Carl Sagan,
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another very
famous TV presenter,
00:10:58.59\00:11:01.26
in the 20th century said this,
00:11:01.29\00:11:02.79
"The cosmos is all that
is or was or ever will be."
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That's a classic statement
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from an atheist
and a naturalist.
00:11:09.23\00:11:11.73
But then the other
worldview is that the universe
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has been created and designed.
00:11:16.64\00:11:19.64
And so my
question, Gayl, is this.
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Which worldview
does the Bible support?
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Well, the Bible is very clear.
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And if we were to
turn to Psalm 53:1,
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I'm just reading
from the New King James,
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"The fool has said in his heart,
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there is no God.
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They are corrupt
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and have done
abominable iniquity.
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There is none who does
good." Now it's interesting.
00:11:42.46\00:11:47.90
The biblical concept of a fool
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is actually not
someone who's stupid.
00:11:50.71\00:11:53.81
What the Bible means is a fool
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is someone who is
morally undiscerning.
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So according to their worldview
is how they will live and act.
00:11:59.35\00:12:05.02
Very
interesting. Very interesting.
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It's interesting that the
wisest man who ever lived,
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and Proverbs 15:3,
00:12:09.76\00:12:14.16
he makes a comment here that,
00:12:14.20\00:12:16.00
"The eyes of the
Lord are in every place,
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keeping watch on the
evil and on the good."
00:12:20.74\00:12:24.64
So to me, what
this text is saying,
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in part, is that God's
got a worldview as well,
00:12:26.64\00:12:30.71
you know, He is looking
and He takes everything in.
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In. Yes.
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And whether we ourselves
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include God in
our worldview or not,
00:12:37.79\00:12:41.29
we are
definitely in His worldview.
00:12:41.32\00:12:42.96
That is fascinating.
00:12:42.99\00:12:44.33
That's a great insight, Clive.
00:12:44.36\00:12:45.89
And I guess, one of
the major differences
00:12:45.93\00:12:49.46
between the
naturalistic worldview
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and the biblical
worldview or the worldview
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that this world was
created is the idea that God
00:12:56.24\00:13:00.04
has the ability and the
power to step in to our world
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and perform miracles.
00:13:05.58\00:13:07.45
So He is not bound
by the natural laws that
00:13:07.48\00:13:11.55
he has built into
the universe itself.
00:13:11.59\00:13:15.46
So I guess, Gayl, it
comes to that question,
00:13:15.49\00:13:17.99
what does the
Bible say about this?
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Is God bound by the natural laws
00:13:20.73\00:13:23.06
that He has created?
00:13:23.10\00:13:25.53
Well, He isn't
because He goes beyond.
00:13:25.57\00:13:30.57
And God is a God who
performs many miracles.
00:13:30.61\00:13:33.07
And the Bible has so
many accounts of miracles
00:13:33.11\00:13:35.64
which are actually
outside those natural laws.
00:13:35.68\00:13:39.81
And an example would
be the outstanding miracle
00:13:39.85\00:13:43.22
of the beginning of
Jesus human existence.
00:13:43.25\00:13:47.62
When Mary was visited
00:13:47.66\00:13:48.99
by the angel
Gabriel and he told her that
00:13:49.02\00:13:51.49
she would become a
mother, she would bear a child,
00:13:51.53\00:13:55.03
and this child is
going to be the Son of God.
00:13:55.06\00:13:58.23
Well, Mary she was,
00:13:58.27\00:13:59.60
I'm sure she must have
been absolutely amazed.
00:13:59.63\00:14:01.60
But she was very humble.
00:14:01.64\00:14:03.30
And she just simply
asked, "How can this be so?"
00:14:03.34\00:14:06.37
Because she was a virgin,
00:14:06.41\00:14:08.41
and the angel Gabriel explains
in the book of Luke Chapter 1,
00:14:08.44\00:14:13.42
if we turn the Luke 1:35,
00:14:13.45\00:14:18.35
"And the angel
answered and said to her,
00:14:18.39\00:14:21.49
"The Holy Spirit
will come upon you,
00:14:21.52\00:14:24.09
and the power of the
highest will overshadow you,
00:14:24.13\00:14:28.10
therefore also that Holy One
00:14:28.13\00:14:30.73
who is to be born will
be called the Son of God."
00:14:30.77\00:14:34.84
Well, this is
an absolute miracle
00:14:34.87\00:14:36.27
because it's impossible
00:14:36.30\00:14:39.34
for a virgin to
conceive of natural causes.
00:14:39.37\00:14:43.81
Yes. Yes.
00:14:43.85\00:14:45.85
That by themselves.
00:14:45.88\00:14:47.22
It's a bit like the
story of creation, isn't it?
00:14:47.25\00:14:49.12
You know, there's
no real explanation
00:14:49.15\00:14:50.69
of how it
happens, how it's done.
00:14:50.72\00:14:53.32
You just got the
state that it is a fact.
00:14:53.36\00:14:55.59
Just base it and it's there.
00:14:55.62\00:14:57.46
Yes.
00:14:57.49\00:14:58.83
What about you, Clive,
00:14:58.86\00:15:00.20
is there any
miracles in the Bible
00:15:00.23\00:15:02.00
which stand out to you?
00:15:02.03\00:15:03.43
Well, I think if we go
00:15:03.47\00:15:04.80
to the other end of Christ life,
00:15:04.83\00:15:06.60
you go from the incarnation
through to the crucifixion.
00:15:06.63\00:15:12.31
In Romans 1:4, 5, for example,
00:15:12.34\00:15:17.38
Paul writing
here, and he says that,
00:15:17.41\00:15:21.75
"We've declared that
00:15:21.78\00:15:23.18
Jesus Christ to
be the Son of God,
00:15:23.22\00:15:25.95
with power, according
to the Spirit of holiness,
00:15:25.99\00:15:28.32
by the
resurrection from the dead.
00:15:28.36\00:15:30.46
Through Him,
00:15:30.49\00:15:31.83
we have received
grace and apostleship,
00:15:31.86\00:15:33.86
for obedience to the faith,
00:15:33.90\00:15:35.23
and are all
nations for His name."
00:15:35.26\00:15:37.27
So he emphasized here,
00:15:37.30\00:15:39.27
this resurrection from the dead.
00:15:39.30\00:15:42.37
And that Jesus was
raised back to life,
00:15:42.40\00:15:46.14
it's often being said,
00:15:46.17\00:15:47.91
Christianity doesn't go
00:15:47.94\00:15:49.81
to the tomb of
their founder to say,
00:15:49.84\00:15:52.45
"This is where He's buried."
00:15:52.48\00:15:54.52
You know, out the founder
of Christianity is alive.
00:15:54.55\00:15:57.52
That's amazing. That's amazing.
00:15:57.55\00:15:58.89
Thank you...
00:15:58.92\00:16:00.26
And this is not natural
for someone to come back
00:16:00.29\00:16:02.42
from the dead.
00:16:02.46\00:16:03.79
Yes, otherwise, we'd see
people coming back to life
00:16:03.83\00:16:05.89
all over the place.
00:16:05.93\00:16:07.76
But thank you so
much for reminding us
00:16:07.80\00:16:09.30
of these two powerful
miracles, amazing miracles.
00:16:09.33\00:16:12.13
And what we wanna do,
00:16:12.17\00:16:13.50
we're gonna go back
all the way in history,
00:16:13.54\00:16:15.57
to the very
creation of the universe,
00:16:15.60\00:16:19.07
the time and when the universe
00:16:19.11\00:16:21.14
didn't exist as well.
00:16:21.18\00:16:23.45
There was the very
famous German mathematician
00:16:23.48\00:16:27.22
called Gottfried Leibniz.
00:16:27.25\00:16:29.72
And he asked the question,
00:16:29.75\00:16:31.62
"Why is there
something rather than nothing?"
00:16:31.65\00:16:35.32
Why is there
something rather than nothing?
00:16:35.36\00:16:37.53
That's a very profound question.
00:16:37.56\00:16:40.13
So one of the most
basic fundamental questions
00:16:40.16\00:16:42.40
we can ask.
00:16:42.43\00:16:43.77
And, Gayl, just wanted to
know, what does the Bible say?
00:16:43.80\00:16:46.84
What's the Bible's
answer to that question?
00:16:46.87\00:16:49.17
Well, we can go right
to the very beginning.
00:16:49.20\00:16:52.01
And God tells us the
answer in Genesis 1:1.
00:16:52.04\00:16:57.48
And it reads, "In the beginning,
00:16:57.51\00:17:00.85
God created the
heavens and the earth."
00:17:00.88\00:17:04.62
So the answer to
that fundamental question
00:17:04.65\00:17:08.89
is the reason
00:17:08.92\00:17:10.39
why there is
something rather than nothing
00:17:10.43\00:17:12.59
is because God
created everything
00:17:12.63\00:17:14.90
that there is around us.
00:17:14.93\00:17:16.50
And something
that I find is just
00:17:16.53\00:17:18.43
so amazing about this verse
00:17:18.47\00:17:22.80
is that word created.
00:17:22.84\00:17:25.47
And I've
understood that to mean,
00:17:25.51\00:17:28.21
in the Hebrew, Bara,
00:17:28.24\00:17:30.58
and referring to
the actions of God alone
00:17:30.61\00:17:35.08
because I can create a...
00:17:35.12\00:17:37.62
Cake.
00:17:37.65\00:17:38.99
Cake, I can make something,
I can design something.
00:17:39.02\00:17:41.62
You are creating
something out of something Yes.
00:17:41.66\00:17:43.93
Yes, but I cannot Bara,
00:17:43.96\00:17:46.59
only God can create
something from nothing.
00:17:46.63\00:17:49.36
And I just find
that simply amazing
00:17:49.40\00:17:51.27
about that in Genesis.
00:17:51.30\00:17:52.63
Yes.
00:17:52.67\00:17:54.00
It's interesting
that the New Testament
00:17:54.04\00:17:55.37
and the Bible
backs this up in John 1.
00:17:55.40\00:17:58.04
And I'm going to have a look
00:17:58.07\00:18:00.14
at verses 1 to 3
in John's Gospel,
00:18:00.18\00:18:03.55
says, "In the beginning,"
it's very similar wording
00:18:03.58\00:18:06.72
to the Hebrew Old
Testament Scriptures,
00:18:06.75\00:18:09.38
"In the beginning was the Word."
00:18:09.42\00:18:11.35
And he's using a
code here to mean,
00:18:11.39\00:18:13.86
the Word is Jesus Christ.
00:18:13.89\00:18:16.56
"In the beginning
was the Word," as Jesus,
00:18:16.59\00:18:19.03
"and the Word was with
God, and the Word was God."
00:18:19.06\00:18:22.03
He was in the
beginning with God.
00:18:22.06\00:18:23.93
And the interesting
part about this verse here,
00:18:23.97\00:18:27.07
it says, "All things
were made through Him.
00:18:27.10\00:18:31.17
And without Him,
00:18:31.21\00:18:32.54
nothing was made that was made."
00:18:32.57\00:18:34.18
So Jesus was the
active person of the Godhead,
00:18:34.21\00:18:38.25
who is there creating.
00:18:38.28\00:18:39.65
It's incredible, isn't it? Yeah.
00:18:39.68\00:18:41.75
Amen.
00:18:41.78\00:18:43.12
And Job points out too that,
00:18:43.15\00:18:44.95
"All the living
creatures around us,
00:18:44.99\00:18:47.12
they actually say
and will tell us that
00:18:47.16\00:18:50.59
there is a creator,
and who created them."
00:18:50.63\00:18:53.29
And just reading in
Job 12:7-10, it says,
00:18:53.33\00:18:59.17
"But now ask the beasts,
00:18:59.20\00:19:01.04
and they will teach you
and the birds of the air,
00:19:01.07\00:19:04.37
and they will tell
you, or speak to the earth,
00:19:04.41\00:19:07.54
and it will teach you
and the fish of the sea
00:19:07.58\00:19:10.45
will explain to you
00:19:10.48\00:19:12.21
who among all
these does not know,
00:19:12.25\00:19:15.48
in whose hand is the
life of every living thing,
00:19:15.52\00:19:19.15
and the breath of all mankind."
00:19:19.19\00:19:22.36
So I just find
that very amazing.
00:19:22.39\00:19:24.29
Yes. It's a
wonderful thought too.
00:19:24.33\00:19:26.39
Yes, Clive, it's a
beautiful thought in terms of
00:19:26.43\00:19:29.13
all of these animals and plants.
00:19:29.16\00:19:30.97
And so what does
the Bible tell us
00:19:31.00\00:19:33.20
with regards to the time
that it took God to create life
00:19:33.23\00:19:39.17
on earth originally?
00:19:39.21\00:19:42.08
Well, I would
answer that question
00:19:42.11\00:19:44.05
by referring to
the Ten Commandments,
00:19:44.08\00:19:46.55
Sven Ostring.
00:19:46.58\00:19:47.92
In Exodus Chapter 20,
00:19:47.95\00:19:50.79
we have the Ten
Commandments listed there.
00:19:50.82\00:19:53.96
And in particular,
the fourth commandment
00:19:53.99\00:19:56.96
answers this question of yours
00:19:56.99\00:19:58.59
because here in Exodus 20:11.
00:19:58.63\00:20:03.23
I have to say, "Remember,
the Sabbath day," says,
00:20:03.26\00:20:06.10
"because in six days,
the Lord made the heavens
00:20:06.13\00:20:09.77
and the earth, the sea
and all that is in them,
00:20:09.80\00:20:13.44
and rested the seventh day."
00:20:13.48\00:20:15.78
So it is the six
days of creation.
00:20:15.81\00:20:19.18
Yeah. Six literal days.
00:20:19.21\00:20:21.45
Wow. That's
amazing. That's amazing.
00:20:21.48\00:20:23.79
You know, one of the
questions that I have,
00:20:23.82\00:20:28.06
Gayl, is that,
you know, what about,
00:20:28.09\00:20:30.29
we talked about
Theistic evolution.
00:20:30.33\00:20:32.53
But there's another possibility.
00:20:32.56\00:20:34.66
And that's what we would
call progressive creationism,
00:20:34.70\00:20:37.90
which over billions of
years over earth's history,
00:20:37.93\00:20:41.40
the God stepped
into to create animals
00:20:41.44\00:20:45.61
and plants as well, you know,
00:20:45.64\00:20:47.94
what do we think of this concept
00:20:47.98\00:20:50.05
and how it relates to the Bible?
00:20:50.08\00:20:52.71
The problem with that
idea is we're actually
00:20:52.75\00:20:55.32
just not taking God at His Word.
00:20:55.35\00:20:58.19
He said that He
created the world in six days,
00:20:58.22\00:21:01.06
and He rested on the
seventh, the Sabbath day.
00:21:01.09\00:21:04.19
So we need to
accept what God says.
00:21:04.23\00:21:08.63
The Bible is clear that
00:21:08.66\00:21:10.60
God originally created the world
00:21:10.63\00:21:13.10
and he said it was very
good, if we look at Genesis 1,
00:21:13.13\00:21:18.14
for example, the
end of the chapter,
00:21:18.17\00:21:20.48
Genesis 1:29, onwards.
00:21:20.51\00:21:23.31
"So see, I've
given you every herb
00:21:23.35\00:21:24.85
that yields seed,
00:21:24.88\00:21:26.21
which is on the
face of all the earth,
00:21:26.25\00:21:28.18
every tree whose
fruit yields seed,
00:21:28.22\00:21:31.62
to you it shall be for food."
00:21:31.65\00:21:32.99
So it was a
vegetarian or a vegan lifestyle.
00:21:33.02\00:21:36.56
"And also to every
beast of the earth,
00:21:36.59\00:21:38.63
to every bird of the air do."
00:21:38.66\00:21:40.23
Every animal was also, you know,
00:21:40.26\00:21:43.26
there was no loss of
life to be able to feed
00:21:43.30\00:21:45.73
the appetite of these creatures.
00:21:45.77\00:21:47.97
And then verse 31 said,
00:21:48.00\00:21:49.34
"God saw
everything that He had made,
00:21:49.37\00:21:51.41
and it was very good."
00:21:51.44\00:21:52.91
There was no
pain, there was no sin,
00:21:52.94\00:21:54.88
there was no death,
no suffering at all.
00:21:54.91\00:21:57.38
Yes.
00:21:57.41\00:21:58.75
And so what
this does, of course,
00:21:58.78\00:22:00.12
is that goes directly against
00:22:00.15\00:22:02.48
either deep time
evolutionary worldviews
00:22:02.52\00:22:05.22
or even progressive
creationism as well.
00:22:05.25\00:22:08.66
It's very fascinating.
00:22:08.69\00:22:10.56
But I guess, yeah,
one question is that,
00:22:10.59\00:22:13.63
you know, scientists
may come to us and say,
00:22:13.66\00:22:16.36
well, you know, that
the Bible is contradicting
00:22:16.40\00:22:20.70
the evidence all
around us so that, you know,
00:22:20.74\00:22:23.71
if we are
rational, intelligent people,
00:22:23.74\00:22:27.64
we should go with the evidence.
00:22:27.68\00:22:29.88
And how do we
respond to that statement?
00:22:29.91\00:22:34.12
Well, it's
important to understand that
00:22:34.15\00:22:36.35
we all look at the world
00:22:36.38\00:22:38.59
through a particular lens,
and science is no exception.
00:22:38.62\00:22:42.39
So if we took the
rainbow as an example,
00:22:42.42\00:22:45.33
and God gave us the rainbow
00:22:45.36\00:22:47.53
as a promise that
00:22:47.56\00:22:48.90
He would never
flood the entire world.
00:22:48.93\00:22:51.50
And we read about that
account in Genesis Chapter 9.
00:22:51.53\00:22:55.24
And I'm just
reading verse 13-16.
00:22:55.27\00:22:58.77
And it reads, "I
set my bow in the cloud,
00:22:58.81\00:23:01.51
and it shall be for
the sign of the covenant
00:23:01.54\00:23:03.85
between Me and the earth,
00:23:03.88\00:23:05.88
it shall be when I
bring a cloud over the earth,
00:23:05.91\00:23:08.88
that the rainbow
shall be seen in the cloud.
00:23:08.92\00:23:11.42
And I will remember my covenant
which is between Me and you
00:23:11.45\00:23:15.62
and every living
creature of all flesh,
00:23:15.66\00:23:18.33
the water shall never again
00:23:18.36\00:23:19.96
become a flood to
destroy all flesh.
00:23:20.00\00:23:22.76
The rainbow
shall be in the cloud,
00:23:22.80\00:23:25.07
and I will look on it
00:23:25.10\00:23:26.43
to remember the
everlasting covenant."
00:23:26.47\00:23:30.11
But when a
scientist sees a rainbow,
00:23:30.14\00:23:32.47
they just see the
different wavelengths of light.
00:23:32.51\00:23:35.44
So it just depends
which lens you're looking at.
00:23:35.48\00:23:38.68
And for us, we are looking at it
00:23:38.71\00:23:41.78
through the evidence
of the biblical worldview.
00:23:41.82\00:23:46.45
Through the biblical
lens. Yes, that's amazing.
00:23:46.49\00:23:49.29
So, Clive, I'm just, sort of,
00:23:49.32\00:23:50.66
stepping into the
shoes of a young person,
00:23:50.69\00:23:53.50
maybe a university student,
00:23:53.53\00:23:55.76
and I love that concept
of what you're saying there,
00:23:55.80\00:23:58.20
Gayl, you know, how we
are looking at the world
00:23:58.23\00:24:00.64
through a particular lens.
00:24:00.67\00:24:02.37
And in particular, you know,
00:24:02.40\00:24:04.21
we're looking at
through the biblical lens.
00:24:04.24\00:24:06.51
But, Clive, the
question is this,
00:24:06.54\00:24:08.48
and I think it's a
very honest question.
00:24:08.51\00:24:10.98
How do we know that
00:24:11.01\00:24:12.35
the biblical lens
is the correct way
00:24:12.38\00:24:15.68
to look at the world?
00:24:15.72\00:24:18.49
Well, that's a
big question, Sven,
00:24:18.52\00:24:21.42
and we'd have to
take several episodes,
00:24:21.46\00:24:23.63
I think, if we
let God speak to us
00:24:23.66\00:24:25.06
and thoroughly answer that one.
00:24:25.09\00:24:27.00
But I just put
it two principles,
00:24:27.03\00:24:30.43
I think, which
may help to lead us
00:24:30.47\00:24:32.43
in the right direction.
00:24:32.47\00:24:33.94
First of all, the
matter of prophecy,
00:24:33.97\00:24:38.71
that's the first one
00:24:38.74\00:24:40.08
if I turn over to John 13:19,
00:24:40.11\00:24:45.48
and I'm looking at the
words of Jesus here, John 13:19,
00:24:45.51\00:24:48.78
He says, "Now I tell
you, before it comes,
00:24:48.82\00:24:51.45
that when it does come to pass,
00:24:51.49\00:24:53.39
you may believe that I am He."
00:24:53.42\00:24:56.06
So this is the
first key prophecy
00:24:56.09\00:25:00.70
and it happens, is a
key to understanding that.
00:25:00.73\00:25:04.23
The other one is,
00:25:04.27\00:25:06.37
certainly Jesus
points to His miracles,
00:25:06.40\00:25:08.24
and we go back in
John's Gospel 5:36,
00:25:08.27\00:25:14.18
he says, "I have a
greater witness than John's,
00:25:14.21\00:25:18.68
for the works which the
Father has given me to finish
00:25:18.71\00:25:21.18
the very works that I
do be a witness of me,
00:25:21.22\00:25:25.05
that the Father has sent me."
00:25:25.09\00:25:27.29
The miracles
that Jesus performed,
00:25:27.32\00:25:30.06
you know, to be able to
raise a widow's son for example,
00:25:30.09\00:25:36.03
you know, to heal
someone of leprosy that
00:25:36.06\00:25:39.40
there are so many
miracles that He performed,
00:25:39.43\00:25:41.60
which were outside of the realms
00:25:41.64\00:25:43.30
of our natural world.
00:25:43.34\00:25:45.57
So certainly prophecy
00:25:45.61\00:25:47.84
fulfilled the miracles of Jesus,
00:25:47.88\00:25:50.05
these are two keys.
00:25:50.08\00:25:51.41
Fantastic. Thank
you so much, Clive.
00:25:51.45\00:25:52.88
And I just wanted
to ask both of you,
00:25:52.91\00:25:55.98
we've covered some
really important topics
00:25:56.02\00:25:58.25
in terms of the
biblical worldview,
00:25:58.29\00:26:00.36
but in just a
quick sort of rapid fire,
00:26:00.39\00:26:03.53
is there anything
which you would want to bring
00:26:03.56\00:26:05.76
about in terms of
the biblical worldview,
00:26:05.79\00:26:09.03
that you just want to
bring to our attention today?
00:26:09.06\00:26:12.20
Well, we're in the
midst of a spiritual battle,
00:26:12.23\00:26:15.04
but we have a loving Savior,
00:26:15.07\00:26:17.87
He's not only our
Creator, He's our Redeemer.
00:26:17.91\00:26:20.34
And He promises that
as we put our trust in Him
00:26:20.38\00:26:24.18
that He will take us through.
00:26:24.21\00:26:25.85
Yes, anything that
you'd like to bring
00:26:25.88\00:26:27.98
to our attention, Clive?
00:26:28.02\00:26:29.42
Well, it's probably
a difficult principle,
00:26:29.45\00:26:32.52
but, you know, everything
is working together for good,
00:26:32.55\00:26:35.29
the Bible says.
00:26:35.32\00:26:36.69
And God's got our
best interests at heart.
00:26:36.73\00:26:39.93
And He's coming back for us.
00:26:39.96\00:26:41.90
That's the
really good news. Yeah.
00:26:41.93\00:26:44.33
Such that our
worldview brings to us.
00:26:44.37\00:26:46.97
And it's amazing, at the
center of this is God's love,
00:26:47.00\00:26:50.71
the fact that Jesus
died for us on the cross.
00:26:50.74\00:26:54.44
You know, this has
been an amazing discussion,
00:26:54.48\00:26:57.01
exploring the biblical worldview
00:26:57.05\00:26:59.11
and why it is so important
00:26:59.15\00:27:01.45
for the
Seventh-day Adventist Church
00:27:01.48\00:27:03.18
to remain
committed to promoting it
00:27:03.22\00:27:05.65
in our churches and schools.
00:27:05.69\00:27:08.46
Every other worldview is faulty
and will ultimately crumble.
00:27:08.49\00:27:12.99
And we've looked at a
number of those today.
00:27:13.03\00:27:15.76
Let's stand firmly
on the Word of God.
00:27:15.80\00:27:19.23
We're glad that you joined
us today on Let God Speak.
00:27:19.27\00:27:23.47
If you've enjoyed this program,
00:27:23.51\00:27:25.54
you can watch past programs
00:27:25.57\00:27:27.24
on our website
3abnaustralia.org.au.
00:27:27.28\00:27:31.68
You can also download
teachers' resources there
00:27:31.71\00:27:34.65
if you're leading
your own Bible study.
00:27:34.68\00:27:37.29
If you'd like to
get in touch with us,
00:27:37.32\00:27:39.02
send us an email to
lgs@3abnaustralia.org.au.
00:27:39.05\00:27:44.39
We look forward to
seeing you next time.
00:27:44.43\00:27:46.26