(triumphant music)
00:00:00.73\00:00:03.10
- Hello, and welcome
to Jesus for Asia Now.
00:00:22.08\00:00:24.52
I'm Natalie Wood,
00:00:24.52\00:00:25.95
and today my friend
Natalie Howell is with me.
00:00:25.95\00:00:28.06
Hello, Natalie.
00:00:28.06\00:00:28.99
- Hello, how are you?
00:00:28.99\00:00:30.13
- Good, welcome to the show.
00:00:30.13\00:00:31.59
- Thank you for having me.
00:00:31.59\00:00:32.79
- Well, I'm glad you're here,
00:00:32.79\00:00:33.90
because we wanna talk about
00:00:33.90\00:00:35.43
your experiences
in Cambodia recently.
00:00:35.43\00:00:39.00
Now tell me why
you went to Cambodia.
00:00:39.00\00:00:41.60
- October 2018, yes, my family
and I, we went to Faith Camp,
00:00:41.60\00:00:46.57
and while I was there,
the need to go was great.
00:00:48.01\00:00:51.75
God told me I
need to stop running.
00:00:52.95\00:00:54.42
And I remember,
we were watching,
00:00:54.42\00:00:56.75
they were playing
"Mission Trick" that Sabbath,
00:00:56.75\00:00:59.29
and God just said,
"Look, you want your daughter
00:00:59.29\00:01:01.79
to go to the mission field,
00:01:01.79\00:01:02.89
but you're not willing to go?
00:01:02.89\00:01:05.13
And so what if, when
you're ready for her to go,
00:01:05.13\00:01:07.76
she doesn't wanna go?
00:01:07.76\00:01:08.93
It'll be because of you."
00:01:09.80\00:01:11.50
And so I remember,
I jumped out the seat
00:01:11.50\00:01:13.34
and i ran to John.
00:01:13.34\00:01:14.87
I was like, here I am,
tell me where you want me to go.
00:01:14.87\00:01:17.91
And he introduced me to Miranda.
00:01:17.91\00:01:20.01
Yup, so that's how Cambodia.
00:01:21.74\00:01:23.38
- Cambodia came in.
00:01:23.38\00:01:24.81
Now what do you mean by running?
00:01:24.81\00:01:26.65
- Well, in 2014, He called
us to go to the mission field.
00:01:26.65\00:01:31.19
And couple
opportunities presented itself,
00:01:31.19\00:01:34.29
and I was like, naw (laughs),
00:01:34.29\00:01:35.76
no, I'm not ready to go.
00:01:37.36\00:01:38.89
You know, one
thing after the other.
00:01:38.89\00:01:41.20
And so I realized at that
moment that I was running.
00:01:41.20\00:01:45.00
And so it's our nature to run
00:01:45.00\00:01:47.60
when we have to do
something different
00:01:47.60\00:01:49.47
that's outside
of our comfort zone.
00:01:50.97\00:01:53.64
It's easier to run than face it.
00:01:53.64\00:01:55.51
So yes, I ran for
four years (laughs).
00:01:56.98\00:01:59.05
- So when you went to Cambodia,
your husband went with you,
00:02:00.52\00:02:03.28
and then your two daughters.
00:02:03.28\00:02:04.45
- Yes.
00:02:04.45\00:02:05.69
- Okay, did anyone
else join you on this trip?
00:02:05.69\00:02:07.52
- Yes, three young people,
00:02:07.52\00:02:09.46
two young
ladies and a young man.
00:02:10.79\00:02:13.50
And so I had five
teenagers ranging from 14 to 18.
00:02:13.50\00:02:17.97
- Wow, I bet that
brought up some challenges
00:02:19.30\00:02:22.07
and some interpersonal stuff.
00:02:22.07\00:02:25.17
- It did (laughs).
00:02:25.17\00:02:26.88
It was character building, yes.
00:02:26.88\00:02:29.21
But you know, I
wouldn't trade it for the world.
00:02:29.21\00:02:31.58
It was a good experience.
00:02:31.58\00:02:33.01
They learned so many things:
00:02:33.01\00:02:36.72
how to deal with each other,
00:02:36.72\00:02:38.05
how to resolve conflicts.
00:02:38.05\00:02:40.66
I took the more
hands-off approach,
00:02:40.66\00:02:43.29
because oftentimes
teenagers and their drama
00:02:43.29\00:02:45.83
can bring you down,
00:02:45.83\00:02:47.36
so I try to let them
work it out within themself,
00:02:47.36\00:02:50.10
and it was a blessing.
00:02:50.10\00:02:52.23
It was really a
blessing having them with us.
00:02:52.23\00:02:55.00
- Okay, so what was the
main purpose of you going?
00:02:55.00\00:02:58.21
- Well, we were
going to see the project
00:02:58.21\00:03:00.64
that we were
gonna be involved in.
00:03:00.64\00:03:02.64
- Okay, and
what is that project?
00:03:02.64\00:03:05.31
- So we're trying to
build a school in Cambodia,
00:03:05.31\00:03:09.12
in Battambong, in one
of the major cities there.
00:03:09.12\00:03:12.62
And so they do not have an
Adventist school in that city.
00:03:12.62\00:03:16.79
And so oftentimes, the schools
there are six days a week.
00:03:16.79\00:03:20.93
And so if you're
Seven Day Adventist,
00:03:20.93\00:03:24.07
then you have to make an option,
00:03:24.07\00:03:25.57
do I wanna go to church or
do I wanna get an education?
00:03:25.57\00:03:28.10
- 'Cause the six days are
including Saturday, not Sunday.
00:03:28.10\00:03:31.27
- Exactly, and so most make
the choices to go on Saturday.
00:03:31.27\00:03:36.28
And so we wanted to
provide for them an opportunity
00:03:37.68\00:03:40.48
where they
actually have an option
00:03:40.48\00:03:42.18
where they can
get your education
00:03:42.18\00:03:44.25
while still honoring God.
00:03:44.25\00:03:46.09
- Right, wow, that's
a hard choice for them.
00:03:46.09\00:03:48.42
- Absolutely, absolutely.
00:03:48.42\00:03:50.39
I can't even comprehend,
00:03:50.39\00:03:53.40
at such a young age
being faced with that choice.
00:03:53.40\00:03:56.46
- Yeah, that's hard.
00:03:56.46\00:03:58.50
Well, I know
you've shared with me
00:03:58.50\00:04:00.10
some of the things that
you started seeing and learning
00:04:00.10\00:04:03.07
when you got to Cambodia.
00:04:03.07\00:04:04.87
One of the things
was, like, in the market.
00:04:04.87\00:04:07.91
You started seeing
all these different foods
00:04:07.91\00:04:11.05
that you would never
see in a market here.
00:04:11.05\00:04:13.75
- Not at all.
00:04:13.75\00:04:14.58
Snakes. - I know your favorite,
00:04:15.68\00:04:17.39
live snakes.
00:04:17.39\00:04:18.59
- I know (laughs).
00:04:18.59\00:04:21.42
Going to the market
was really different.
00:04:21.42\00:04:23.49
Nothing really
prepares you for it, nothing,
00:04:24.89\00:04:28.46
even all the stories you hear.
00:04:28.46\00:04:31.07
I remember our
first day at the market,
00:04:31.07\00:04:33.60
your sense of
smell is on overdrive.
00:04:35.54\00:04:38.57
You're trying really
hard not to throw up,
00:04:38.57\00:04:41.68
because the smell, you know,
00:04:41.68\00:04:43.35
you have beef,
chicken, everything is there,
00:04:43.35\00:04:46.78
and it's not like here where
you have things in the fridge.
00:04:46.78\00:04:49.82
Everything is in the open.
00:04:49.82\00:04:51.69
There's no ice. - Pre-packaged.
00:04:51.69\00:04:52.92
- Yeah, there's no ice
there, it's just there,
00:04:52.92\00:04:55.22
and so you just go
pick what you want.
00:04:55.22\00:04:57.83
And so you're
smelling all these things,
00:04:57.83\00:04:59.79
and it's different from
what you're accustomed to.
00:04:59.79\00:05:02.46
When you go to
the grocery store,
00:05:02.46\00:05:03.70
you don't smell anything here.
00:05:03.70\00:05:06.27
And so I remember that
first time we were there,
00:05:06.27\00:05:09.60
we were all struggling.
00:05:10.87\00:05:12.81
And the kids, they
had their faces covered,
00:05:12.81\00:05:16.18
and they're like,
"I'm gonna throw up,"
00:05:16.18\00:05:18.08
and all these different things.
00:05:18.08\00:05:19.91
And after we got back home,
00:05:19.91\00:05:22.15
I had to tell them,
"We have to be careful
00:05:22.15\00:05:25.52
how we act out there.
00:05:25.52\00:05:26.72
We're trying to witness to them,
00:05:26.72\00:05:28.99
and we don't want to
have our faces turned up,
00:05:28.99\00:05:32.93
and then turn around and
tell them Jesus love them."
00:05:32.93\00:05:35.90
They're not gonna, you know?
00:05:35.90\00:05:37.03
So even though we're struggling,
00:05:37.03\00:05:38.90
we have to put aside
our personal feelings.
00:05:38.90\00:05:43.61
And we speak a lot of,
00:05:43.61\00:05:45.47
we speak most with our face
00:05:45.47\00:05:47.31
than with the
words out of our mouth.
00:05:47.31\00:05:49.68
- Especially when
it's cross-cultural.
00:05:49.68\00:05:51.18
- Exactly, and so learning
to not show it on your face.
00:05:51.18\00:05:55.72
I mean, I
struggled there at times.
00:05:55.72\00:05:57.62
I was in the
market and I saw a snake
00:05:57.62\00:05:59.29
and I jump and scream
and like, "Agh!" (laughs),
00:05:59.29\00:06:01.52
and I had to take a deep breath,
00:06:02.86\00:06:04.69
'cause they
stared at you (laughs).
00:06:04.69\00:06:07.10
And so, self-control (laughs).
00:06:07.10\00:06:11.03
- Yeah, huge thing. -
But we worked through it.
00:06:11.03\00:06:13.44
It wasn't easy, it wasn't easy,
00:06:13.44\00:06:16.14
but every time you
went, we got a little better.
00:06:16.14\00:06:20.01
I mean, even up
until when we were leaving,
00:06:20.01\00:06:21.84
I still struggled.
00:06:21.84\00:06:23.14
There were times
when I went in there,
00:06:23.14\00:06:24.65
and I was like, "Lord please
(inhales deeply) help me."
00:06:24.65\00:06:27.58
- 'Cause it's so different
from what we're used to,
00:06:29.58\00:06:31.45
and the smells and
the sights and the sounds,
00:06:31.45\00:06:34.29
it can be very overwhelming.
00:06:35.19\00:06:37.26
So also want you to
share a little bit about how,
00:06:37.26\00:06:41.13
you know, when we
go as a missionary,
00:06:41.13\00:06:42.80
we think, okay, we're
having a change of address,
00:06:42.80\00:06:45.20
we're gonna have
this whole new life,
00:06:45.20\00:06:47.07
everything's gonna be great,
I'm gonna be a missionary,
00:06:47.07\00:06:50.14
all this kinds of stuff.
00:06:50.14\00:06:51.64
But what's the reality?
00:06:51.64\00:06:53.17
What really happens when you
change your address like that?
00:06:53.17\00:06:56.64
- All you did was
change your address (laughs).
00:06:56.64\00:06:58.48
You bring your same
botched-up character with you.
00:06:58.48\00:07:01.88
- You take your
history, you take your baggage.
00:07:01.88\00:07:04.85
- Yeah, and so
when you go over there,
00:07:04.85\00:07:07.22
it's different, because here
you're in a Christian country,
00:07:08.82\00:07:13.63
we have this
fakeness, we can hide stuff
00:07:13.63\00:07:17.27
and we can pretend
things don't, you know?
00:07:17.27\00:07:20.14
You know how we do.
00:07:20.14\00:07:21.77
But then you're there
00:07:21.77\00:07:23.00
and you're really
on Satan's territory.
00:07:23.00\00:07:25.41
And if you're not
spiritually grounded here,
00:07:25.41\00:07:27.94
he gonna bust
you wide open there.
00:07:27.94\00:07:29.78
And I saw myself
struggling in so many areas
00:07:29.78\00:07:34.78
as I was there
00:07:35.38\00:07:36.85
and realized, and all I
did was just change address.
00:07:36.85\00:07:38.99
I didn't become a new person.
00:07:38.99\00:07:41.12
Whatever temperament I
had here, it was there.
00:07:41.12\00:07:45.49
I didn't come back
00:07:45.49\00:07:46.90
with these glamour
stories of winning people,
00:07:46.90\00:07:49.63
I came back battered.
00:07:49.63\00:07:51.37
I think we have this expectation
00:07:53.03\00:07:55.37
that when you
become a missionary,
00:07:55.37\00:07:57.04
all of a sudden,
almost like you've arrived,
00:07:57.04\00:07:59.11
or you have a new status now.
00:07:59.11\00:08:01.38
- There's some sort of sainthood
00:08:01.38\00:08:02.81
or instant glorification
or something (laughs).
00:08:02.81\00:08:06.05
- Absolutely, and
I remembered that,
00:08:06.05\00:08:08.08
I was questioning myself, like,
00:08:08.95\00:08:12.09
does other people feel this way,
00:08:12.09\00:08:14.12
and I was kind of
bitter and angry about it.
00:08:14.12\00:08:16.09
Like, am I the only
one that's struggling?
00:08:16.09\00:08:18.76
'Cause you hear all
these great stories,
00:08:18.76\00:08:21.66
you hear all
these feel-good things,
00:08:21.66\00:08:24.43
and why am I not feeling good,
00:08:24.43\00:08:26.20
why am I struggling so much?
00:08:26.20\00:08:28.14
The culture
shock, all these things
00:08:29.30\00:08:30.97
play into you being there.
00:08:30.97\00:08:33.17
You're adjusting to the culture,
00:08:33.17\00:08:35.34
you're adjusting to the climate,
00:08:35.34\00:08:37.98
you're adjusting to
five teenagers in your house,
00:08:37.98\00:08:41.52
you're adjusting to the students
that we have to work with.
00:08:41.52\00:08:45.29
So you find yourself, you
just giving, giving, giving,
00:08:45.29\00:08:48.92
and you just feel broken,
00:08:48.92\00:08:50.93
'cause, I don't
know, I just felt
00:08:52.09\00:08:53.70
drained. - You
expected something
00:08:54.96\00:08:56.80
of yourself and
of the experience
00:08:56.80\00:08:59.13
that wasn't reality.
00:08:59.13\00:09:00.30
- Absolutely, absolutely.
00:09:00.30\00:09:02.64
- And whatever was going on
00:09:02.64\00:09:04.51
in your
relationships with your husband
00:09:04.51\00:09:06.31
and your own children,
00:09:06.31\00:09:08.24
they were still there
when you went over there.
00:09:08.24\00:09:10.68
So many times I think we think
00:09:12.18\00:09:13.68
that there's some
instant change thing
00:09:13.68\00:09:16.69
that happens to us on the plane
00:09:16.69\00:09:18.05
on the way over or something,
00:09:18.05\00:09:19.32
and suddenly we're
this great, strong person,
00:09:19.32\00:09:23.53
and have the perfect
spiritual walk and everything,
00:09:23.53\00:09:26.80
but we're still human.
00:09:26.80\00:09:28.40
We still need God every moment.
00:09:28.40\00:09:30.33
- Yes, and I
think what didn't help
00:09:30.33\00:09:33.90
is that, from
the moment we decided
00:09:33.90\00:09:37.11
to go into the field,
00:09:37.11\00:09:38.44
it was like one
thing after the other,
00:09:38.44\00:09:40.88
after another started happening.
00:09:40.88\00:09:43.18
And so even up until the
night we were flying out,
00:09:43.18\00:09:47.52
I was still putting out battles.
00:09:47.52\00:09:49.35
There was still things
that was just popping up,
00:09:49.35\00:09:51.99
and so I went there
00:09:51.99\00:09:55.09
broken or battered or bruised.
00:09:55.09\00:09:59.36
You went there in a deficit,
00:09:59.36\00:10:01.43
and then nothing,
there's no magic wand
00:10:02.73\00:10:06.37
that you just wave
and you just get better.
00:10:06.37\00:10:08.54
And so it was really an
eye-opening experience for me.
00:10:09.90\00:10:14.04
- So you went with
certain expectations
00:10:14.04\00:10:16.04
and you found out
that God is there with you.
00:10:16.04\00:10:20.25
I mean, He was there.
00:10:20.25\00:10:21.15
- He was there.
00:10:21.15\00:10:22.22
- But it was not easy.
00:10:22.22\00:10:23.79
- [Howell] It
wasn't easy at all.
00:10:23.79\00:10:25.15
- Now talking
about expectations,
00:10:25.15\00:10:27.42
you had seen videos,
00:10:27.42\00:10:28.66
you'd seen lots of
pictures of the area.
00:10:28.66\00:10:31.16
And so you kind of had
an idea of what to expect,
00:10:31.16\00:10:33.90
but then, no.
00:10:33.90\00:10:35.13
- Nothing beats
reality (laughs).
00:10:35.13\00:10:36.43
- It was still
totally different.
00:10:37.60\00:10:38.57
- It was totally different.
00:10:38.57\00:10:39.77
Nothing, I mean,
you're overly stimulated.
00:10:39.77\00:10:43.07
You know, the crowd,
the smelling, the poverty,
00:10:43.07\00:10:47.54
the trash, you know,
00:10:48.71\00:10:51.78
the seeing
hopelessness all around you.
00:10:51.78\00:10:55.62
I don't know if you can
really capture that in pictures.
00:10:55.62\00:10:59.29
When you look all around
you and you're seeing idols.
00:11:00.76\00:11:03.69
I mean, I see those things,
00:11:05.26\00:11:06.59
you read about it in the Bible,
00:11:06.59\00:11:08.50
not realizing- -
That it's real today.
00:11:08.50\00:11:12.77
- You read about Abraham,
00:11:12.77\00:11:14.67
and this is what,
4,000 years later,
00:11:14.67\00:11:17.11
and we still
have the same things.
00:11:17.11\00:11:18.94
I realize that you really
have to be grounded in God.
00:11:21.01\00:11:24.85
If you're not grounded here,
00:11:24.85\00:11:26.88
it's gonna be hard
to be grounded there.
00:11:26.88\00:11:29.48
- Now talking about
the different religion.
00:11:29.48\00:11:33.42
So here, like you
said, it's a Christ country,
00:11:33.42\00:11:37.89
it's a Christian country here.
00:11:37.89\00:11:40.50
But over there, did
you see a difference?
00:11:40.50\00:11:43.63
- I think what I saw was,
00:11:43.63\00:11:45.33
here, you know
when the weekend comes.
00:11:46.53\00:11:49.74
You know Sunday, you
see people go to church,
00:11:49.74\00:11:51.87
Sabbath, you see
people going to church.
00:11:51.87\00:11:54.44
There, I probably
can count on one hand
00:11:54.44\00:11:56.85
how many churches I saw
00:11:56.85\00:11:57.91
in the five months I was there.
00:11:57.91\00:11:59.45
You don't have a weekend.
00:11:59.45\00:12:01.42
There is no separation.
00:12:01.42\00:12:03.89
- They just work
00:12:03.89\00:12:05.05
every day of the
week. - They just work
00:12:05.05\00:12:05.85
every day of the week.
00:12:05.85\00:12:06.62
I mean, like, the banks
and some of those places,
00:12:08.06\00:12:09.56
they'll open on Sabbath.
00:12:09.56\00:12:11.53
They're closed on Sundays,
00:12:11.53\00:12:12.83
but outside of that,
everything, everything.
00:12:12.83\00:12:16.20
So you can't
tell the difference,
00:12:16.20\00:12:18.07
everything just
continue just going.
00:12:18.07\00:12:20.30
Life just go from
one day to the next.
00:12:20.30\00:12:22.57
And so you see people are tired.
00:12:22.57\00:12:25.17
The main religion
over there is Buddhism,
00:12:26.74\00:12:29.11
but there's also
animists, spirit worshiping.
00:12:29.11\00:12:32.31
And so that's
totally out of our realm.
00:12:32.31\00:12:35.85
I mean, and here, we
don't even talk about demons.
00:12:35.85\00:12:38.85
That's like a taboo.
00:12:38.85\00:12:40.69
- Well, we don't think
they're real for one thing,
00:12:40.69\00:12:44.33
because we haven't
seen them like they have.
00:12:44.33\00:12:46.33
- Absolutely, we just
see it in different forms,
00:12:46.33\00:12:48.13
and they'll
recognize that's what it is,
00:12:48.13\00:12:50.10
you know what I mean?
00:12:50.10\00:12:51.33
- We call it mental
illness, or we call it-
00:12:51.33\00:12:53.94
- A variety of
stuff but what it is.
00:12:53.94\00:12:56.07
- Now I know another thing
you mentioned to me in the past
00:12:56.07\00:12:58.54
is that you started seeing,
00:12:58.54\00:13:01.38
like, looking for the reasons
00:13:01.38\00:13:03.11
why they did some of the
things that are so different.
00:13:03.11\00:13:06.01
And one thing that
really brought that to your mind
00:13:06.01\00:13:08.05
was the green fruit.
00:13:08.05\00:13:10.09
Can you share that with us?
00:13:10.09\00:13:11.49
- Absolutely, I was struggling
00:13:11.49\00:13:13.76
because you're in
this tropical place,
00:13:13.76\00:13:16.19
they have
endless amount of fruits.
00:13:16.19\00:13:18.93
And I grew up in the tropics,
00:13:18.93\00:13:20.50
so I'm accustomed to that,
00:13:20.50\00:13:22.30
so I was really happy.
00:13:22.30\00:13:23.80
And so you go and you
see them eating green stuff.
00:13:23.80\00:13:27.57
And some of the green is like,
00:13:27.57\00:13:29.64
it's not even fully developed,
00:13:29.64\00:13:31.71
like, it's nowhere
close to being ripe.
00:13:31.71\00:13:33.98
And so I sat there and I'm like,
00:13:33.98\00:13:36.14
why would someone
eat something so young?
00:13:36.14\00:13:39.55
There is literally no
nutritional value in that.
00:13:39.55\00:13:44.55
And I remember talking
with one person before,
00:13:45.72\00:13:47.72
and they were
saying how, during the war,
00:13:47.72\00:13:50.93
that they had to go out early.
00:13:50.93\00:13:52.69
You know that early
bird catches the most worms.
00:13:52.69\00:13:55.00
So you go out there,
and whatever you find,
00:13:55.00\00:13:56.73
that's what you eat.
00:13:56.73\00:13:58.00
- Foraging.
00:13:58.00\00:13:59.03
- Foraging,
yes. - In the jungle.
00:13:59.03\00:14:00.04
- In the jungle.
00:14:00.04\00:14:01.27
So you grab,
'cause if you don't grab,
00:14:01.27\00:14:03.44
somebody else is
gonna come and eat it.
00:14:03.44\00:14:05.41
- And if you're late going out?
00:14:05.41\00:14:06.91
- You're not gonna
get nothing at all.
00:14:06.91\00:14:08.48
And so I realized that,
even though the war has ended
00:14:08.48\00:14:13.48
21 years ago,
00:14:14.08\00:14:15.58
that that
mentality is still there.
00:14:15.58\00:14:17.95
It's so ingrained and
it's so a part of their life
00:14:19.39\00:14:21.89
that even though
they don't have to do it,
00:14:21.89\00:14:24.39
they still do it.
00:14:25.33\00:14:26.59
- So when we look at that,
00:14:27.86\00:14:29.60
and we try to learn why
they do what they're doing,
00:14:31.00\00:14:34.80
it makes it a lot easier for us
00:14:34.80\00:14:36.97
not to say,
"Well, they're wrong."
00:14:36.97\00:14:38.91
- Exactly. - Or my way's right
00:14:38.91\00:14:41.21
or whatever.
00:14:41.21\00:14:42.78
- Oftentimes from the outside,
00:14:42.78\00:14:44.71
it's easy to look and
pass judgment or condemnation
00:14:44.71\00:14:49.22
as to why people
do the things they do.
00:14:49.22\00:14:51.79
And so, for me,
it was eye-opening,
00:14:51.79\00:14:54.39
that in order to
figure out why somebody
00:14:54.39\00:14:57.53
is doing what they're doing,
00:14:57.53\00:14:58.99
we need to understand
the culture or the origins
00:14:58.99\00:15:02.16
or look beyond the surface.
00:15:02.16\00:15:04.73
- Right, the worldview.
00:15:04.73\00:15:05.97
- The worldview
of what's going on,
00:15:05.97\00:15:08.60
and not just saying,
"Well you know that's wrong
00:15:08.60\00:15:10.34
and you shouldn't do it."
00:15:10.34\00:15:12.51
'Cause it's easy for
us to turn up our nose,
00:15:12.51\00:15:14.71
like, they're
wrong and we're right.
00:15:14.71\00:15:16.48
How' bout we're both right.
00:15:16.48\00:15:18.08
- We're very black
and white with stuff.
00:15:18.08\00:15:19.88
We like to be right or,
00:15:19.88\00:15:21.28
it's either right or
wrong, we like it that way.
00:15:21.28\00:15:23.52
But it's not always
that way with everything.
00:15:23.52\00:15:26.15
- Exactly, and one
of the things I realized
00:15:26.15\00:15:29.12
is that I don't
know what it's like
00:15:29.12\00:15:32.26
to grow up so impoverished.
00:15:32.26\00:15:35.26
I don't know what it's like
00:15:35.26\00:15:36.50
to grow up in a
war-torn country or a zone.
00:15:36.50\00:15:40.57
And so because I
don't understand that,
00:15:40.57\00:15:44.51
it's easy, when
they do something,
00:15:44.51\00:15:46.17
to say, "Why did you do that?"
00:15:46.17\00:15:48.18
and realizing I need to
place myself in their shoe,
00:15:48.18\00:15:52.58
what it must have
been like losing families
00:15:52.58\00:15:57.05
and on the run or
living in such poverty,
00:15:57.05\00:16:01.29
like, how do you
even rise above that?
00:16:01.29\00:16:04.29
The mental
oppression, not only physical,
00:16:04.29\00:16:07.60
but the mental
oppression during that
00:16:07.60\00:16:10.27
or during that period of time.
00:16:10.27\00:16:12.10
And so once we try to
understand their past,
00:16:12.10\00:16:16.74
then we'll understand
their past affects the present,
00:16:16.74\00:16:20.94
and it also
affects their future.
00:16:20.94\00:16:23.01
And that's where we can
come in to help guide them
00:16:23.01\00:16:25.71
to have a different future
00:16:25.71\00:16:27.45
and not spend
time finding faults
00:16:27.45\00:16:31.09
with why they do what they do.
00:16:31.09\00:16:32.69
And if we truly are Christians
00:16:33.56\00:16:36.26
and if we truly
believe that Jesus is love
00:16:36.26\00:16:40.03
and we want to share that,
00:16:40.03\00:16:41.50
we cannot go over
there with that attitude
00:16:41.50\00:16:44.63
of I'm here and you're there,
00:16:44.63\00:16:48.10
because truthfully we
will not make it to heaven
00:16:48.10\00:16:51.01
if that's our
attitude, if that's my attitude.
00:16:51.01\00:16:54.01
And so it's difficult
00:16:55.28\00:16:57.11
because sometimes things
happen and it's frustrating.
00:16:57.11\00:17:00.58
But you have to
ask God to help you.
00:17:01.72\00:17:03.55
Help me to see
them the way you see me.
00:17:04.75\00:17:08.22
It's easy to say,
"I don't wanna do this.
00:17:09.42\00:17:12.83
Let me go
somewhere where I fit in,
00:17:12.83\00:17:15.26
where I don't stand out,"
00:17:15.26\00:17:17.43
and recognizing that we
have to go where God calls us.
00:17:17.43\00:17:21.57
- So the young
people that are learning
00:17:22.70\00:17:24.04
to be teachers right now,
00:17:24.04\00:17:25.64
they were all
born after the war.
00:17:25.64\00:17:27.74
But the other
people that were helping,
00:17:27.74\00:17:29.14
the older young
people that were helping you.
00:17:29.14\00:17:31.25
- Two of the people
that we were working with,
00:17:31.25\00:17:34.92
they were alive
during that period of time.
00:17:34.92\00:17:37.45
I sat down and
talked with one of them,
00:17:39.12\00:17:41.86
and he shared what
his family went through.
00:17:41.86\00:17:45.29
He lost his mom, he lost
his brother during that time.
00:17:45.29\00:17:49.36
His brother was murdered.
00:17:49.36\00:17:51.30
His mom, I think,
she end up getting sick.
00:17:51.30\00:17:53.74
His family was on the run.
00:17:53.74\00:17:55.24
They owed money, and so
they took him and his brother.
00:17:55.24\00:18:00.08
- The people they owed money to.
00:18:00.94\00:18:02.48
- Yeah, and so they had
to work to pay off the debt.
00:18:02.48\00:18:05.08
And so they had to,
you know, they were kids.
00:18:05.08\00:18:07.72
They were under 10.
00:18:07.72\00:18:09.65
And so foraging to find food
00:18:09.65\00:18:12.19
and just different things
00:18:12.19\00:18:13.76
like I cannot even
begin to understand at all.
00:18:13.76\00:18:18.76
I can't even
pretend I understand.
00:18:19.86\00:18:21.83
I was just sitting
there just so dumbfounded.
00:18:21.83\00:18:24.13
- That people could
survive something like this.
00:18:24.13\00:18:27.47
- Yes, and then
the beauty about him
00:18:27.47\00:18:30.57
was that, after all
of that, he found God,
00:18:30.57\00:18:34.81
and now he's
working full-time for Jesus.
00:18:34.81\00:18:37.75
He became a pastor.
00:18:37.75\00:18:39.01
And so you're able to see,
00:18:39.98\00:18:42.48
he's able to look
at his life before,
00:18:42.48\00:18:45.29
and now see what God has done.
00:18:45.29\00:18:47.79
- Praise the Lord. - Amen.
00:18:47.79\00:18:49.22
- That's really
awesome. - Absolutely.
00:18:49.22\00:18:51.43
- So when you look at them
00:18:51.43\00:18:52.83
and you look at the
history that they have,
00:18:52.83\00:18:55.60
and you think about
sharing Jesus with them
00:18:55.60\00:18:58.53
and sharing heaven with them,
00:18:58.53\00:19:00.64
is that a hard thing
to try to share with them
00:19:00.64\00:19:03.10
what heaven is gonna be like
00:19:03.10\00:19:04.64
when they've gone
through all this evil?
00:19:04.64\00:19:07.88
- You know,
truthfully, I haven't tried.
00:19:07.88\00:19:10.45
- Because you
don't speak the language.
00:19:10.45\00:19:11.81
- I don't speak the language.
00:19:11.81\00:19:13.28
You know, during that
time, I actually realized
00:19:13.28\00:19:14.92
the importance of
learning the language.
00:19:14.92\00:19:17.05
Our words that we have here,
00:19:18.89\00:19:21.59
there's not a
word over there for it.
00:19:21.59\00:19:23.46
- So you're trying
to explain something
00:19:24.63\00:19:25.89
that there's no-
00:19:25.89\00:19:27.03
- Explanation for.
00:19:27.03\00:19:28.40
- Wow, yeah, we
saw that in Thailand.
00:19:28.40\00:19:31.03
It's like there's no word,
00:19:31.03\00:19:32.53
there's no concept for salvation
00:19:32.53\00:19:34.87
or for even the word saved.
00:19:34.87\00:19:36.24
It's like, saved from what?
00:19:36.24\00:19:38.81
They don't have
that concept at all.
00:19:42.51\00:19:45.25
And so the idea of a Savior.
00:19:45.25\00:19:47.68
- Complete foreign.
00:19:47.68\00:19:48.82
- Like, what is that?
00:19:48.82\00:19:50.25
So you have to
figure out how to explain it
00:19:50.25\00:19:53.05
in a language
they can understand,
00:19:53.05\00:19:55.42
using words that they have
and concepts that they have.
00:19:55.42\00:19:58.19
That's a challenge.
00:20:00.00\00:20:00.93
- It is. (both laugh)
00:20:00.93\00:20:02.86
But with God, all
things are possible.
00:20:02.86\00:20:05.17
- That's true.
00:20:05.17\00:20:06.10
So when you went to Cambodia
00:20:06.10\00:20:07.64
and you started working
with these young people,
00:20:07.64\00:20:10.17
now we're trying to
build a boarding academy,
00:20:10.17\00:20:13.04
but you were working
with young people already,
00:20:13.04\00:20:16.88
but we don't have a school.
00:20:16.88\00:20:17.91
So what were you doing,
00:20:17.91\00:20:19.85
what were these
young people there for,
00:20:19.85\00:20:21.82
what was going on in the project
00:20:21.82\00:20:25.05
at that point in time?
00:20:25.05\00:20:26.82
- Okay, so we had some young
ladies that were in college.
00:20:26.82\00:20:31.56
And so when we got there,
00:20:31.56\00:20:33.80
one of the
things we started doing
00:20:33.80\00:20:35.13
was teaching them English.
00:20:35.13\00:20:36.67
We were teaching them English.
00:20:37.63\00:20:38.63
So every day we would go there
00:20:38.63\00:20:40.10
and spend a hour or a
little bit more than an hour
00:20:40.10\00:20:42.80
teaching them English,
00:20:42.80\00:20:43.74
and then, in return,
00:20:43.74\00:20:45.74
they would help us
to learn the language,
00:20:45.74\00:20:47.31
which is Khmer.
00:20:47.31\00:20:48.74
And so there were five of them
00:20:48.74\00:20:51.01
and there was five
young people from my team,
00:20:51.01\00:20:53.25
so I paired them up.
00:20:53.25\00:20:54.55
And so they
would teach them words.
00:20:54.55\00:20:57.82
So we would put
papers around the house.
00:20:57.82\00:21:00.86
That's a door, that's a chair,
00:21:00.86\00:21:03.29
and stuff like that,
00:21:03.29\00:21:04.49
everyday things
that they were using.
00:21:04.49\00:21:06.86
Going through the
phonograms and stuff like that,
00:21:06.86\00:21:10.13
so that's what we were doing.
00:21:10.13\00:21:11.77
And then we started
doing worship together.
00:21:11.77\00:21:15.14
And one evening a
week, on Wednesday evening,
00:21:15.14\00:21:18.47
we started going
through the book education.
00:21:18.47\00:21:20.78
And so, as we went through it,
00:21:20.78\00:21:22.74
we had somebody
there that translated
00:21:22.74\00:21:25.08
to their language for them,
00:21:25.08\00:21:26.72
and we had these study guides
00:21:26.72\00:21:29.28
that we were
going through with them,
00:21:29.28\00:21:31.15
just slowly making
sure they understand
00:21:31.15\00:21:34.19
the importance of,
not just education,
00:21:34.19\00:21:36.62
but true education.
00:21:36.62\00:21:38.16
How does God
desire us to be educated
00:21:38.16\00:21:41.90
and to educate others?
00:21:41.90\00:21:43.43
- Okay, so I know
that education is one thing
00:21:43.43\00:21:46.47
that really
suffered because of the war,
00:21:46.47\00:21:49.10
because their goal was to
kill all the intellectuals.
00:21:49.10\00:21:52.44
Everybody that had a pen,
00:21:52.44\00:21:53.81
everybody that wore glasses.
00:21:53.81\00:21:56.04
And so what have you seen
00:21:56.04\00:21:57.88
as far as their
educational system?
00:21:57.88\00:22:00.55
I mean, these young
ladies are in college?
00:22:00.55\00:22:03.12
What have you seen as far
as the educational system?
00:22:03.12\00:22:06.25
Is it suffering?
00:22:06.25\00:22:07.19
Has it suffered, do you think,
00:22:07.19\00:22:08.39
from having the war kill off
00:22:08.39\00:22:10.96
so many of the- - Absolutely.
00:22:10.96\00:22:12.23
I see the lack,
or the missing link,
00:22:12.23\00:22:14.83
in the education system.
00:22:14.83\00:22:16.63
So it's like, this is
your work, memorize it,
00:22:16.63\00:22:20.74
and pass.
00:22:21.77\00:22:23.27
So they're not really, you know,
00:22:23.27\00:22:25.67
for example, it's probably
better to give an example.
00:22:25.67\00:22:29.11
I was helping one
of the young ladies
00:22:29.11\00:22:30.78
with some questions
that she had to answer.
00:22:30.78\00:22:33.05
And so when I
gave her the answer,
00:22:33.05\00:22:35.98
the teacher marked it wrong.
00:22:35.98\00:22:37.42
And so I told
her, "No, he's wrong,
00:22:38.59\00:22:42.56
'cause this is
what it's saying."
00:22:42.56\00:22:44.33
And so when she
spoke to him and said,
00:22:44.33\00:22:49.30
"Based on the question
you asked, the word meaning,
00:22:50.77\00:22:52.13
this is what it means,"
00:22:52.13\00:22:54.20
he shut her down,
and that it is wrong,
00:22:54.20\00:22:56.77
and this is how it's gonna stay.
00:22:56.77\00:22:58.34
- So there are huge challenges
00:22:59.24\00:23:03.28
in the area of education still.
00:23:03.28\00:23:05.38
- There is, and, you know,
00:23:05.38\00:23:07.08
when you look,
Buddhism is taught,
00:23:07.08\00:23:10.02
and that's a
class they have to take.
00:23:10.02\00:23:11.89
They cannot escape it.
00:23:12.92\00:23:15.29
And so that's why it's
important for us to teach them
00:23:15.29\00:23:18.36
what true education is,
00:23:18.36\00:23:20.06
and not only teach them,
00:23:21.33\00:23:22.83
but to show them
what it looks like,
00:23:22.83\00:23:26.07
so that when the school starts,
00:23:26.07\00:23:28.64
they'll be able to transition
00:23:28.64\00:23:30.74
and lead them to God.
00:23:30.74\00:23:32.77
- Right, so the
purpose of these young ladies
00:23:32.77\00:23:35.61
going through college right now
00:23:35.61\00:23:37.58
is to become
teachers for this school.
00:23:37.58\00:23:39.41
- Correct.
00:23:39.41\00:23:40.78
We wanna give
back to the community.
00:23:40.78\00:23:43.62
And so oftentimes as
missionaries, when we go there,
00:23:43.62\00:23:47.19
we teach them the Western way,
00:23:47.19\00:23:49.39
and so when they're finished,
00:23:49.39\00:23:52.49
they will try to
move on to somewhere else.
00:23:52.49\00:23:56.23
Wherein if you educate
them within their environment,
00:23:56.23\00:23:58.93
within their community,
00:23:58.93\00:24:01.14
then they will wanna
stay around and help others.
00:24:01.14\00:24:05.21
- That makes a lotta sense.
00:24:05.21\00:24:07.31
You've gotta reach
people in their heart language.
00:24:07.31\00:24:09.68
That's the most
effective sharing of anything,
00:24:09.68\00:24:12.68
especially the gospel,
00:24:12.68\00:24:14.38
is when they can hear
it and they can read it
00:24:14.38\00:24:16.42
in a language that
they've known since birth.
00:24:16.42\00:24:18.79
- Absolutely, that's
the first angel's message,
00:24:18.79\00:24:21.19
every nation,
kindred, tongue, and people.
00:24:21.19\00:24:25.06
- So when you
went as a missionary,
00:24:25.06\00:24:26.80
you saw that, well,
you shared a quote with me,
00:24:26.80\00:24:30.07
that God didn't send
you to the mission field
00:24:30.07\00:24:32.70
to save others.
00:24:32.70\00:24:34.90
He sent you to the
mission field to save you.
00:24:34.90\00:24:37.77
- Yes, oh yes (laughs),
00:24:37.77\00:24:39.77
'cause you know, like
we were saying earlier,
00:24:41.11\00:24:42.61
all we did is change address.
00:24:42.61\00:24:44.68
And so, for me
personally while I was there,
00:24:46.01\00:24:50.42
I saw so many
defectiveness in me.
00:24:50.42\00:24:53.19
- That's humbling.
00:24:54.49\00:24:55.36
- Yeah, absolutely.
00:24:55.36\00:24:57.06
And so we have this idea that
I'm just gonna go over there
00:24:57.06\00:25:01.00
and I'm gonna
tell them about Jesus
00:25:01.00\00:25:02.46
and I'm gonna
win souls for kingdom
00:25:02.46\00:25:04.30
and all these different things,
00:25:04.30\00:25:06.94
and I had to sit back
and realize, like, no.
00:25:06.94\00:25:11.54
He brought me here to show me
00:25:11.54\00:25:13.88
who I truly am,
00:25:13.88\00:25:15.28
that I am nothing
and I don't know nothing,
00:25:17.18\00:25:21.05
and I am in need of Him.
00:25:22.15\00:25:24.39
- So you had to
look at your purpose.
00:25:24.39\00:25:26.22
- Absolutely, absolutely,
00:25:26.22\00:25:28.49
and recognize
how much I need Him,
00:25:28.49\00:25:30.96
and pray that as
I'm clinging to Him,
00:25:32.09\00:25:36.26
that He will use
me to save others.
00:25:36.26\00:25:38.97
But my first purpose,
00:25:38.97\00:25:40.67
His first purpose
for me is to save me.
00:25:41.80\00:25:44.11
'Cause it's only as you do,
00:25:44.11\00:25:46.07
you realize that you're nothing.
00:25:46.07\00:25:48.38
And so oftentimes
we are complacent here,
00:25:49.58\00:25:52.18
very complacent here.
00:25:53.38\00:25:54.85
You go there and
you really realize
00:25:56.02\00:25:59.12
I don't have a
church to hide behind.
00:25:59.12\00:26:02.12
I don't have
friends to hide behind.
00:26:02.12\00:26:04.79
- I need Jesus.
00:26:04.79\00:26:05.79
- I need Jesus.
00:26:05.79\00:26:06.93
- Wow, well, that's powerful.
00:26:06.93\00:26:09.50
- It was eye-opening, humbling.
00:26:09.50\00:26:12.33
'Cause sometimes
we like to think that
00:26:13.80\00:26:15.94
we're at a certain level.
00:26:15.94\00:26:18.07
We like to think that.
00:26:19.11\00:26:20.44
- And we look
down at other people
00:26:20.44\00:26:22.31
from our high
position of greatness.
00:26:22.31\00:26:24.65
- And you go to the mission
field with that same attitude,
00:26:26.11\00:26:29.72
and He's like, no, you're
all on the same playing field.
00:26:29.72\00:26:33.32
We're all in need of a savior.
00:26:34.76\00:26:36.42
We're all dying.
00:26:37.26\00:26:38.96
He's saying,
"Look, you're dying.
00:26:38.96\00:26:40.53
"Come to me and live."
00:26:40.53\00:26:42.43
So the same
message for them is for me.
00:26:42.43\00:26:45.50
It's not a
separate message; it's one.
00:26:45.50\00:26:48.77
So we always talk about
leading others to Christ,
00:26:48.77\00:26:53.61
and we forget ourselves,
00:26:53.61\00:26:54.81
'cause we think we
already have Him (laughs).
00:26:56.14\00:26:58.05
- Wow, that's really powerful,
00:26:59.38\00:27:02.22
just to think about
how much we need Him.
00:27:02.22\00:27:06.05
- Absolutely, and
when you recognize that,
00:27:06.05\00:27:08.79
you're not quick
to pass judgment.
00:27:08.79\00:27:11.83
You're not quick to
look down on others,
00:27:13.03\00:27:16.26
because you realize we're
all in the same playing field.
00:27:16.26\00:27:19.07
- We all need Him.
00:27:20.04\00:27:21.14
- We all need Him.
00:27:21.14\00:27:22.10
- Well, that's
powerful and beautiful,
00:27:23.57\00:27:26.14
and I wanna thank you so much
00:27:26.14\00:27:27.58
for sharing so
openly with me today
00:27:27.58\00:27:30.55
(Howell laughs)
and with our viewers.
00:27:30.55\00:27:32.15
- Thank you. -
It's been a privilege.
00:27:32.15\00:27:33.82
- Thank you, likewise (laughs).
00:27:33.82\00:27:36.18
- I would like to invite you
to pray for the Howell family,
00:27:36.18\00:27:39.42
that they can very
soon return to Cambodia
00:27:39.42\00:27:42.36
and to the project there.
00:27:42.36\00:27:44.29
If you would
like more information,
00:27:44.29\00:27:45.96
please contact us
at Jesus for Asia,
00:27:45.96\00:27:48.66
PO Box 1221,
Collegedale, Tennessee, 37315.
00:27:48.66\00:27:52.83
Call us at 423-413-7321,
00:27:54.54\00:27:58.94
or visit our
website at Jesus4asia.org.
00:27:58.94\00:28:02.84
May God richly bless you
until we see you next time
00:28:02.84\00:28:05.98
on Jesus for Asia Now.
00:28:05.98\00:28:08.08
(triumphant music)
00:28:08.08\00:28:11.02