Participants: Stan Hudson
Series Code: ITB
Program Code: ITB000002
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00:15 Hello I'm Stan Hudson.
00:17 I'm a speaker for In The Beginning. 00:19 Today I we take a look at what I consider to be the very best 00:21 question that proponents of evolution asked those of us 00:24 who believe in God. 00:26 That is if there is a God, Where is He? 00:30 It seems like this world is devoid of evidences 00:34 of a loving God. 00:35 All the death and suffering all around, it seems like the 00:39 biblical God is absent. 00:43 To me that is a very good question and it needs 00:46 to be addressed. 00:47 When we take a look for instance at the fossil record, 00:50 we see evidence of death. 00:52 A record not so much of evolution, at least that is 00:56 what I would say, but much evidence of death and violence 01:01 in the past history of this earth. 01:05 You can't really address these questions with good answers 01:10 strictly in our observation of nature. 01:12 When we take a look at nature we can see evidences of that 01:16 suffering, we see death. 01:18 We see survival the fittest like Darwin saw. 01:20 But we don't see necessarily, 01:23 evidence of loving Creator. 01:25 We see design, but where is the love? 01:29 We see systems that relate with each other. 01:32 We see some care apparently and some needs being met. 01:36 But again we see the claw, we see the tooth, 01:40 we see suffering. 01:42 And you just can't get all the answers you need to those 01:45 great questions strictly from your study of nature. 01:49 That is really why you need another source of information 01:53 to answer those great questions. 01:55 That is where the Bible comes in, if we didn't have 01:59 revelation, a source of information we believe from God, 02:03 through the aspiration of godly people writing these 02:08 words we could never get the great questions answered 02:11 that people ask where suffering comes from? 02:13 It is in this book that we find out about Lucifer? 02:16 We find out about Adam and Eve and the great mistakes they made 02:21 in the garden of Eden that led to a world that is suffering the 02:25 effects of sin and selfishness. 02:27 We see in the first generation after Adam and Eve, 02:30 Cain and Abel. 02:31 Already violence is being perpetrated on the human family, 02:36 from within. 02:38 We see violence getting so bad that, as we see in the fossil 02:42 record, by the time the flood came God apparently had to do 02:47 something drastic to protect the human race from a world that was 02:51 becoming increasingly violent. 02:53 For instance let me show you these teeth from two sharks. 02:58 This smaller white one is actually from a great white 03:02 shark and because it is about an inch and a half long, 03:05 it represents a fish of about 15 feet. 03:08 That is a serious size shark. 03:10 When you compare it to a pre-flood great white shark's 03:15 tooth, you can see that this represents a fish that was 03:18 about 50 feet long. 03:20 You wouldn't want to be in the water swimming around 03:22 with these in the water. 03:24 So the fossil record shows evidence of a violent world, 03:27 even more violent perhaps prior to the flood. 03:30 Certainly in the animal world and that is one of the reasons 03:32 why the animal world was targeted by God in the flood. 03:35 But why there is pain and suffering in the world, 03:39 is one question. 03:40 Another question, that is kind of related, is why is there even 03:42 death in the world? 03:44 When you speak to evolutionists about death, there is no real 03:49 great reason biologically for death. 03:51 There is benefits in the sense that you eliminate some 03:55 species and other species can rise to fill the void in 03:58 nature, I guess. 04:00 So there is a purpose of death there, but in terms of 04:02 evolution, the idea of death is still unclear because all 04:08 living systems have repair systems in place. 04:11 We all have repair systems in our body. 04:14 But it seems they are not quite able to keep up 04:17 with everything. 04:19 But from an evolution stand point it is very difficult to 04:21 explain why a creature can't seem to repair itself and exist 04:25 on long enough to pass on genetic information. 04:30 Why is it then that things are falling apart? 04:33 Aging even is death incrementally. 04:39 It is the repair system is not quite able to keep up with 04:43 things and keep replenishing parts of the body that decay. 04:47 It's interesting but the Bible also gives us a bit of an 04:51 explanation of why there is decay in God's creation. 04:55 From Romans 8:19 it says, "the creation waits in 04:59 eager expectation from the sons of God to be 05:02 revealed, for the creation was subjected to 05:05 frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will 05:09 of the one who subjected it in hope that the creation 05:13 itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and 05:17 brought into the glorious freedom of 05:18 the children of God. " 05:19 We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the 05:23 pains of childbirth right up to the present time. 05:27 So the Bible tells us why there is decay in the world. 05:30 Why there is corruption the King James version talks about. 05:34 Why things seem to be falling apart, 05:36 why there is death and suffering? 05:37 It all points back to Genesis, in the beginning, 05:42 when Adam and Eve made that fateful decision in 05:44 the Garden of Eden. 05:45 In a sense they were asking God to step back, and when God 05:50 steps back things sometimes are affected. 05:54 But God did not go very far, according to the apostle Paul 05:59 when he spoke to those at Athenian philosophers on 06:01 Mars Hill, he said, "God is not very far from any of us," 06:06 "just a prayer away. " 06:08 The good news is that even if the creationist subjected to 06:14 decay, it said it is subjected in hope because God has plans 06:20 for this creation. 06:21 The groanings are birth pain groanings. 06:24 In other words something is about to happen. 06:26 Something great is going to take place in the 06:28 future of this world. 06:29 Decay will become a distant memory and the second law of 06:34 thermodynamics will be changed, there will be no more decay. 06:40 Jesus talked about a new heaven and new earth where there is 06:43 no moth or rust corrupting things, decaying things. 06:47 So the animal and the chemical world seems to be changed 06:51 and there's no more decay. 06:52 There is no more death or suffering or sorrow of any kind, 06:56 that is the promise. 06:57 God promises to give us something to look 07:00 forward to, it's hope. 07:02 As a pastor I can not say enough about the importance of 07:06 hope, it is what makes funerals tolerable that someday we 07:11 will see those loved ones again. 07:13 We will see them no longer destroyed by disease or age, 07:20 but we will see them internally young and healthy. 07:23 We won't see any more the effects of decay and corruption. 07:26 We will not see what we see in this planet operating, 07:30 we will see something beautiful, something God intended from 07:33 the very beginning and that is what He wants to give us, 07:36 a future and a hope. 07:38 Something to look forward to. 07:39 So today as your taking a look at this important topic of 07:43 In The Beginning, Where did God go? 07:46 Just remember, He hasn't gone far and He's coming back. 07:57 Thank you very much and again we appreciate you coming and so 07:59 as we talk tonight about issues involving 08:02 In the Beginning, whenever we do a debate, 08:03 whenever I have been involved in a public debate on this 08:06 subject, the question always comes back aimed at the 08:09 Christian, aimed at those who believe in God. 08:11 Why is there suffering? 08:14 Why is there pain in the world? 08:15 If God is really here and in charge, then what is going on? 08:18 So today we're going to talk about that on In The Beginning. 08:21 In the beginning, and the question tonight is 08:23 In The Beginning, Where Did God Go? 08:29 You know it was Richard Dawkins the famous atheist who so 08:33 much in front of the discussion and debates on this topic. 08:36 When he was asked, in a recent movie, and perhaps some of you 08:39 see the movie Expelled. 08:40 When he was asked about a future imaginary meeting with God, 08:44 thought he would say, should he meet God, what would he say? 08:48 He would say something like: 08:53 That is a good question. 08:55 In fact it is one of the reasons I want this to be the second 08:58 topic because I feel it is that important, it is that 09:01 significant, that good of a question and it takes a little 09:05 effort to address it. 09:06 So today we are going to ask the question, Is God hiding? 09:09 Now we talked briefly about Epicurus and the Epicurean 09:17 riddle is what we are going to take a look at. 09:19 Remember Apostle Paul encountered Epicureans in Athens 09:23 The riddle of Epicurus was this. 09:25 And you have probably heard this in some form or another. 09:53 Now that sounds like a pretty sound argument, 09:57 pretty sound argument. 09:58 We are going to take a look at that reasoning tonight. 10:01 If God is willing to prevent evil, Why hasn't He? 10:03 So that is the question. 10:05 Evolutionists have made this argument and brought it out 10:09 as they observe nature. 10:10 They say: 10:38 these are typical comments made by evolutionists as they 10:42 look at the evidence, as they look at nature, 10:44 they see things broken. 10:46 If there is a loving God, why are these systems broken? 10:50 Why is there pain and suffering? 10:52 Why is there wastefulness and so on? 10:54 So we will talk about that tonight because those are very 10:56 good questions, I mean if you think about the history of 10:58 this planet with the sickness, with the disasters of war and 11:04 so forth, with pestilence, with famine, with crop failures, 11:07 personal disasters, and losses. 11:11 When we look at such things as natural disasters as well, 11:15 like volcanoes and so forth as the picture shows. 11:18 We see the devastating effects of war. 11:21 When we see children dying from starvation we ask a good 11:28 question, Where is God? 11:30 When we see the beautiful things of nature whither and 11:34 almost no evidence of loving God. 11:36 What do we do with that information? 11:38 Even we look at the fossil record, we see evidence of 11:43 violence of ferocity, we see suffering, we see dog eat dog. 11:49 It is a dog eat dog world. 11:50 In this case it's a stork eat lizard world. 11:54 We see this kind of thing and try to imagine, is this the way 11:57 God originally intended to set up the world? 12:00 I mean did God design mosquitoes to do what they do? 12:05 These kind of issues are raised, mosquitoes are raised 12:07 as a point against the loving Creator God. 12:11 Of course the basic question of Why is there death? 12:15 Incidentally I think that is a pretty good question to aim 12:17 towards evolution as well. 12:19 Why is there death, you would think by this time some 12:22 animal might have developed a way for all of the repair 12:26 systems that are in animals and plants for that matter, 12:29 they should be able to stay ahead of the game. 12:31 They are never quite able to keep up. 12:33 So why is there death? 12:35 If God is in charge why is there death? 12:37 The question has been asked if you could ask God one question, 12:42 this is a typical poll question by the Barnes Institute. 12:46 The question comes back: 12:53 so if they only had one to ask it would be that. 12:55 Darwin also had questions about a loving God, 12:59 a benevolent God. 13:01 He made this comment to a pastor who was writing to him. 13:04 He said now Charles was the easy on God and talk about this. 13:09 Then Charles answered, pastor this is what I see. 13:39 While it is anticipating eating that mouse. 13:42 Why would it have this kind of cruelty in the world? 13:46 So we use these two examples to try and make a point of how 13:49 he could not see a benevolent God in charge of this planet. 13:54 Good questions. Good observations. 13:56 Reasonable questions. 13:58 Yet having said all that, do you not see beauty in the world? 14:05 You have this lingering image of beauty and design in the 14:08 world, you see colors and colors that don't seem to be 14:12 necessary for strictly survival. 14:15 You see colors and designs of beauty and wonder, 14:18 Why is there beauty? 14:19 Systems that appear to be designed for each other, 14:24 interrelated systems like the bee with the flower, 14:27 pollination and so forth. 14:28 To imagine this to happen by chance, 14:31 there seems to be design. 14:32 There seems to be evidence of a potential designer and yet 14:37 with all these other problems in the world, 14:39 What has gone wrong? 14:40 Where did God go if He did, in fact, put us here? 14:47 Now it was Sir Francis Bacon who said this: 15:10 Study both. 15:17 So even in those days there were arguments going back and 15:20 forth between people of religion and people of science. 15:24 And not necessarily applying charity to the argument. 15:28 So we let Francis Bacon say this: 15:32 He established this idea for us, idea of two books, 15:36 and the author still being God, one author, two books. 15:39 Nature and revelation. 15:42 Remember yesterday we talked about narrative and 15:47 observation as sources of information. 15:49 And remember that the Greeks were among the first ones 15:52 to discard narrative, to discard the idea of historical 15:55 records to account for us being here. 15:57 No, no gods making us, let's just observe nature 16:02 and let's come up with our own answers. 16:03 It was during the period of Isaac Newton that scientists 16:07 took narrative and observation and put them together to 16:11 come up with a complete picture. 16:12 From Darwin's period on, the influence of humanism derided 16:18 and put down narrative, put down Scripture as a reliable 16:22 historical source of information, and strictly 16:24 went with observation. 16:28 Looking back to traditionally we are considering now nature 16:32 and revelation to help us to deal with this question. 16:34 I would like to tell you tonight, you cannot get from the 16:39 study of nature, from that one book alone, an answer 16:43 to the question of suffering. 16:44 No matter how hard you look at nature you will never find 16:47 answers as to why there is pain and suffering, by simply 16:50 looking at nature in my opinion. 16:52 So there needs to be another source of information. 16:55 Enter the Bible, enter in particularly on the subject 17:01 of origins, the book of Genesis. 17:03 I would like to talk to you about the origin, 17:05 the genesis of Genesis. 17:07 This is what we believe about this ancient book. 17:11 We believe it was written by Moses, Moses is a classic figure 17:15 in Hebrew history. 17:17 Some people question whether he ever existed, or whether he 17:21 had anything to do with what eventually became the book of 17:24 Genesis, but some of us feel it is reliable and we will give 17:28 some evidence for it. 17:29 But Moses as the stories goes was actually raised to be a 17:32 leader in Egypt, the story was that Pharaoh's daughter 17:35 found him in a basket, and you remember all that. 17:38 We believe that took place during the period of the 18th 17:42 dynasty in Egypt, a historical period of time. 17:45 There is evidence and we could go into some of the 17:48 information that we think supports the Exodus account. 17:51 It was during this time that Israel was a slave in Egypt. 17:55 And during that period Moses was absence, you may remember 17:59 the story of Moses going off into the desert, fled there for 18:02 his life and was there 40 years. 18:04 We believe that while he was in the desert, whether he was 18:08 inspired directly by God in a miraculous way, whether he 18:12 talked with his future father-in-law Jethro, who had 18:17 some knowledge of God. 18:19 We believe he composed the book of Genesis during that period of 18:24 time to answer some questions that Israel might have. 18:26 Now it is very interesting in the history of writing, 18:30 the history of writing prior to the time of Moses all writing 18:34 was pretty much done in Cuneiform or what we would call 18:38 Hieroglyphics, picture form, symbols of words in a sentence 18:44 structure, but not an alphabetic writing system. 18:49 An alphabetic system did not come around until some people 18:53 say as late as about 1000 BC or 1200 BC. 18:56 Some of us feel it is probably a little bit older about the 18:59 time of Moses, about the time when alphabetic writing started. 19:04 It is conceivable because some of the earliest writings are 19:09 found were alphabets, an proto-sinaitic script they found 19:15 out in the desert in a couple places where apparently it 19:20 was the first attempt to use an alphabet system for writing. 19:24 They were moving away from hieroglyphs. 19:25 It's funny that in the Negev, in the desert, between Egypt 19:31 and Israel are the oldest and these may date to as early as 19:35 15th century BC, depending upon whom you talk to. 19:38 That would be about the time of the Exodus. 19:40 So it's potential that Moses may be in one of the first 19:44 people to write with an alphabetic system of writing. 19:47 It's potential, and it's arguable either way. 19:50 Let's assume for a moment that there is the potential that 19:54 somebody as educated as Moses may have been able to record 19:59 this information in the book of Genesis. 20:01 That far back, there are a lot of code words in the book 20:04 of Genesis that clearly date to that period. 20:07 Well he wrote not only the book of Genesis, I believe, 20:11 but he also wrote another book and the book is Job. 20:15 These two books were probably written by Moses at about the 20:17 same time and carried with him back to Egypt for the famous 20:22 Exodus account, the story. 20:23 Why would he write Genesis, and why would he write Job? 20:26 What was in his mind, what was he thinking about in 20:29 writing these two great books? 20:30 First of all Genesis we can call the Book of Beginnings. 20:33 If you ever think of Genesis in any way, think of it like 20:36 this, it is The Book of Beginnings. 20:38 The Book of Beginnings we are introduced to many things. 21:07 These are all recorded in the Book of Beginnings. 21:09 These things are reasonably important and significant 21:11 in your life today. 21:13 You may find some interesting parts of it in The Book of 21:16 Beginnings, the book of Genesis. 21:18 Now the other book that is significant, oh! 21:22 I should say about The Book Of Beginnings, 21:24 The Book Of Beginnings are important because, 21:27 for instance it talks about the beginning of Israel 21:30 and a special and unique call that God gave to Israel, 21:33 to be a people that would retain the knowledge of the 21:37 creator God and share that with the world. 21:39 In a world that had all kinds of glasses and world views, 21:43 cosmologies of different kinds of gods and how we got here. 21:48 It was to preserve this unique account of the creator God 21:52 in the world, Israel was chosen and especially to retain that 21:56 knowledge and disseminated in a world that had forgotten a 21:59 lot of their roots. 22:01 So Israel is mentioned, Babylon is mentioned and then Babylon 22:04 shows up in the Book of Endings as well in the 22:06 book of Revelation, we will talk about that in a bit. 22:08 But why write the book of Job? 22:10 Israel needed to know where they came from so Moses brought 22:14 that book back and try to tell them that they were special 22:16 people, I know you are slaves, I know you are suffering but 22:18 you are a special people and God has a special future for 22:21 you, so he shared that story with them, their history, 22:24 their roots. 22:25 But also he wrote the book of Job, and why is the book of 22:27 Job significant, because it records the introduction of a 22:32 key person in the question of pain and suffering. 22:36 That person is Lucifer, or Satan as the book calls him. 22:40 Let's talk about this person. 22:43 His name means in Hebrew Morning Star. 22:49 It is actually a beautiful name although I am guessing that 22:53 none of you named your children Lucifer. 22:55 What that be fair to say? 22:56 Or even your pets, well maybe a pet depending on their 23:02 personality, but Morning Star is the name of what apparently 23:06 was an angel created by God with the freedom of choice. 23:13 Freedom of will to choose and apparently at some ancient 23:16 time he chose to be a rebel? 23:18 He went from Morning Star, into a new Hebrew name he acquired 23:24 and that name means the adversary, or the enemy. 23:27 You know that name as Satan, and that is what it 23:30 looks like in Hebrew, Satan and that is how he evolved, 23:35 pardon the pun, into a new character, a new person. 23:39 If you look at the book of Job you will see this person 23:43 that challenges God and challenges the peace and 23:47 happiness of God's created planet. 23:50 He messes around with Job's happiness in his life by a lot 23:54 of different ways. 23:55 Let's take a look at story and you will see it. 23:57 Jesus had some to say about Satan. 23:59 He said that he was a murderer from the beginning and does 24:01 not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in 24:04 him when he speaks a lie when he speaks from his own resources 24:07 for he is a liar and the father of lies. 24:10 So the father of lies is who this person is. 24:14 All deception, all error, originates, he is the creator, 24:20 shall we say of it. 24:22 Here is this new character, you would not get this by studying 24:25 nature, how could you get that by studying nature? 24:27 You couldn't, all you will see is a broken messed up planet. 24:31 So you really do need to understand that if you want to 24:37 get a complete and accurate worldview of this planet, 24:39 you need to combine Revelation. 24:42 Now here's where I go with this a little bit, just work with 24:45 me from a strictly point of logic, just logic. 24:49 I struggle sometimes with logic. 24:52 Okay here we go. 24:54 Logic: A. if there is a God and B. if He has something to 25:01 do with us being here, which is not always following in 25:04 some peoples thinking, but assuming He has something to 25:06 do with us being here. 25:07 Wouldn't it seemed logical that He would want to share that 25:12 information with us in some form? 25:14 Communicate with us, I would assume He would think 25:16 we would want to know. 25:18 Would you like to know where you came from? 25:19 If He has any caring in us at all, I would assume that the 25:24 answer would be yes, He probably would. 25:27 But in what way would He communicate that with us? 25:29 Well, you think He would just say hi, I'm God and here is 25:34 the information you need. 25:36 Let Me just tell you the story. 25:37 Somehow or other there is a problem with God being in the 25:40 room with us right now uncovered and in person. 25:44 There is something the matter with that. 25:45 There is some problem with that, actually the Bible records 25:49 says that there has been a separation. 25:51 The story is recorded in Genesis about how Eve chose to trust 25:56 Lucifer against God and by that choice we selected a new 26:01 leader in our life. 26:03 God honors choice, He believes in freedom of choice. 26:08 We would not have Lucifer running around if God didn't 26:10 believe in freedom of choice. 26:12 So He honors choice, and He honored this plan, this choice 26:17 at the time, and took a step back. 26:19 Not entirely leaving, but took a step back. 26:22 There is a distance, a gulf there even though God is still 26:28 reaching out to us, and still very near to us. 26:31 There is never the less a gulf. 26:33 You would not get that from studying nature, you would 26:36 not get that story from just looking at nature. 26:38 You really need another source. 26:40 I believe that God inspired people to write Scripture. 26:44 Let's talk about that a little bit here. 26:51 The word doctrine means teaching, useful for teaching. 26:53 It is helpful in getting under- standing on the basic truths. 26:57 All Scripture, it doesn't say part of Scripture, 26:59 and here's where we get into trouble. 27:02 Some critics of the Bible will say the later books are 27:05 probably okay, but the earlier books, especially Genesis, 27:08 has got the be full of myth. 27:10 Let's face it, the later books. 27:12 And yet that's not the claim of the Scripture itself, it says 27:17 all Scripture, as though that maybe was even an issue when it 27:19 was written, maybe with an issue then and wanted it 27:22 underlined, oh no, all Scripture is by the inspiration of God. 27:26 Let me tell you what the word inspiration of God is in the 27:30 Greek, it is an interesting phrase. 27:31 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God that is 27:34 actually the Greek word Theo-pneumatos. 27:39 You see the pneumatos there, pneumatic tires. 27:44 It's a word for air, it is a word for breath. 27:48 Theo, theology is God, the Greek word for God. 27:51 So God breathed, God an inspiration, in the spirit. 27:59 Inspiration, He inspired writers. 28:02 Now it's funny, my image, when as a kid, I was taken to church 28:07 as a kid and I remember thinking the idea of inspiring 28:10 the Bible, the writers, maybe what would that be like? 28:13 Maybe an angel was just talking to them like, 28:16 okay now write this. 28:17 In the beginning God, no in the beginning God, 28:21 every word just so. 28:24 You know like dictation or something. 28:27 But we know as we study, and I studied Greek because 28:30 I am a minister and they teach us Greek, right? 28:32 I studied Greek in the New Testament and the Greek of the 28:35 New Testament writers varies from author to author. 28:37 You can tell Paul's writing because he uses $.50 words. 28:41 You can tell John's writings because he uses very simple 28:45 Greek, so when God inspires writers He doesn't make them 28:49 robots, it's not robotic like writing. 28:53 It is not mechanical writing. 28:55 He inspires people to use their own language and their own 28:58 words, but the thoughts apparently, at least the claim 29:02 is rather high, that the thoughts are God's. 29:04 All Scripture is breathed by God and profitable for doctrine. 29:09 Jesus had a very high view of Scripture. 29:13 When He said: 29:19 then He goes on to quote several scriptures from, dare I say 29:25 it, the books of Moses. 29:27 For Him the books of Moses, when it said it is written, He 29:32 thought they came from the mouth of God. 29:34 So He had a very high view of Scripture. 29:37 Some people say that Jesus didn't know everything. 29:43 But it is written from the mouth of God for Him, 29:48 He had a high view. 29:50 Now when we look at Genesis and we are introduced to God, 29:53 the very first thing God does is speaks, He speaks. 30:01 So we do not have a God that is inclined to be quiet. 30:03 We have a God who is inclined to communicate and talk 30:07 and reveal information. 30:08 And this is the kind of God, I believe, Scripture reveals. 30:12 He does want to give us information. 30:14 Okay, question: 30:21 This is from one of our agnostic friends, no atheist friend. 30:37 Based on predictions coming true very good and reasonable. 30:45 How about this: 31:13 All these things were predicted and in many of these cases, 31:16 especially the later ones on that list, we have manuscripts 31:20 that predate the actual event, so you cannot say they were 31:24 not predicted, or written down after they had happened. 31:26 That's what people say on some earlier things. 31:28 Let's take a look a little bit at the history of the Bible 31:31 briefly, on the left you see an old manuscript of Hebrew. 31:35 Can you read Hebrew? 31:36 From right to left, Hebrew is written from right to left, 31:39 like Arabic is and this is a little more modern. 31:43 This is actual modern Hebrew script, not the old Hebrew 31:46 script, it's actually Aramaic script. 31:48 The Hebrew script goes from right to lift and it originally 31:51 didn't have any spaces, didn't have any punctuation, 31:55 and you had to really know your language and imagine all the 31:58 letters running together. 32:00 And actually ancient Greek is on the right and the Old Testament 32:04 was written in Hebrew, the New Testament written in Greek. 32:07 That manuscript on the right dates to only about 100 years 32:11 after the original was written on this book of the 32:14 New Testament, but on the left, and this is an issue, 32:18 our oldest Hebrew manuscript only went back to about 1000, 32:22 or 900 AD prior to a very famous discovery. 32:28 I'm going to take you to the Dead Sea now in 1947. 32:32 The Dead Sea is in Israel and just to the west of the 32:35 Dead Sea on the West Bank there is an area where 32:38 these canyons are. 32:40 There is an Arabic boy with some sheep and so forth and as 32:44 kids tend to do with they have time on their hands, 32:46 he was throwing rocks. 32:48 He saw a nice cave up there and picked up a rock and wondered 32:53 if he could hit that cave from there. 32:55 And he threw a rock and it went into the cave and went crack. 33:00 It had hit something. 33:03 So he did a little investigating and found some pots that 33:06 looked like this. 33:08 He went and got some folks and pretty soon they discovered 33:12 what became known as the Dead Sea scrolls. 33:15 They found dozens and dozens of manuscripts that dated to the 33:21 time of Christ or even 100 or 200 BC. 33:25 They found Hebrew books of the Bible. 33:28 They found a complete Isaiah scroll. 33:31 They found a number of wonderful scrolls and of course 33:34 immediately scholars were excited about this because we 33:37 had nothing older than about 900 AD in Hebrew 33:41 Old Testament manuscripts. 33:43 So everybody was wanting to know, well for that thousand 33:47 years has the Bible changed? 33:49 Has the Old Testament changed, has somebody added some things, 33:52 or taken some things out? 33:53 What do you suppose the answer was? 33:56 It was extremely accurate, only a couple of insignificant 34:01 words were found to be different. 34:02 It put the Old Testament 1000 years older in accuracy than 34:09 it had previously been known. 34:11 The Hebrew way of thinking about the Bible, you can't allow 34:15 a manuscript to fall apart, that is showing disrespect to 34:18 the word of God. 34:20 So unlike the Greek New Testament manuscripts that could 34:23 just practically fall apart with no problem on a shelf somewhere, 34:27 they would not allow the Hebrew scripture should do that. 34:30 So when it came that they were too bad a shape and they 34:33 would destroy them because that was more respectful to the 34:37 word of God than to let them fall apart. 34:39 So we had nothing older than about 900 AD. 34:41 So at this point the Dead Sea scrolls were discovered and why 34:45 they were found intact near a community apparently 34:48 somebody had apparently hid them there 34:53 expecting to go back and get them and something happened to 34:56 them so they could not go back and get them and 34:58 they were left there. 34:59 So a big library was discovered from the time of Christ. 35:04 So the Dead Sea scrolls were established. 35:06 Another significant development in the history of the Bible 35:10 is the printing press. 35:11 Gutenberg Bibles, you heard of the Gutenberg Bibles in the 35:14 1400s when the printing press was developed. 35:17 One of the very first things that was printed was the Bible. 35:20 It was suddenly available, prior to that only rich people 35:24 could own a Bible and they were all hand written. 35:28 Often you just owned books of the Bible because you couldn't 35:30 afford a whole Bible. 35:31 It wasn't until the printing press came along, and when the 35:34 printing press came along and made the Bible available, 35:37 in this case in Latin, not many people could speak Latin, 35:40 or read anyway, it wasn't until shortly after that that the 35:45 Bible suddenly became available as it was being translated 35:48 in modern languages. 35:50 Suddenly there was an incredible increase of knowledge of 35:53 the Bible, and it was during that atmosphere of increased 35:56 knowledge and excitement in the discovery of the Bible. 35:59 I would say it is not disassociated in any way 36:03 it's when Western science also took off as well. 36:07 As people were discovering things about God and His Word, 36:09 they were discovering things about God in nature. 36:11 It went hand-in-hand and increased knowledge 36:13 really took off. 36:15 Okay so events in the history of the Bible, just real quickly 36:19 summarize, the Old Testament was apparently written: 36:25 With Moses and Genesis and Job and so on. 36:27 To 400 BC like Ezra, Nehemiah, which were written 36:31 in Persian period. 36:33 Septuagint which is the first translation of the Old 36:35 Testament into Greek by Greek Jews at 250 BC. 36:41 Some of those also still exist, not quite that old but the 36:45 Septuagint version is the oldest testament. 36:47 The Council of Gemini in AD 90 put together the books 36:51 of the Old Testament and made it an complete record. 36:53 So much so that pretty much from that point on nothing 36:57 could be added or subtracted. 36:59 This was what we would call the Old Testament, the Hebrews 37:02 called the Hebrew Scriptures. 37:03 The New Testament was written during a period of roughly 50 37:07 years from 50 to 100 A.D. 37:09 The New Testament Canon, again the Canon is a collection of 37:13 the accepted authoritative collection which was established 37:18 by the Roman period of AD 300, roughly. 37:31 So those are some significant things. 37:33 It has been argued that a lot of stories in the Bible have 37:36 not been supported archaeologically. 37:38 When you can't find archaeological evidence, 37:40 you wonder about the historicity of those stories. 37:43 Yet archaeology does keep finding things that are very 37:46 interesting, for instance David. 37:48 Up to recently there has been some skeptics say that David 37:51 was a mythological figure, David didn't exist. 37:54 Until a few years ago when they found at Dan, which is the 37:58 northern part of it Israel settlement called Dan. 38:01 They were excavating there and found a broken monument 38:06 and on it was written from about 900 BC this monument 38:12 recording a Syrian king who had defeated the house of David. 38:17 Prior to that we had nothing anywhere near that old that 38:22 would describe David outside of the Bible. 38:25 Now we believe there is evidence for David in the Bible. 38:28 Some people this is not an issue, but it is for some. 38:31 Then over on the right there a monumental piece was found 38:35 in Caesarea, on the coast of Israel. 38:37 It is the only place outside of the Bible, at least the only 38:40 reliable place outside the Bible, that actually mentions 38:43 Pontius Pilate, there it says Tiberiam and Pontius Pelotas 38:49 and it says perfectos u daia, which means the prefect of 38:55 Judea, so there is this title as well. 38:57 Pontius Pilate Prefect of Judea, there it is in the monument. 39:01 Prior to that there has been some questions of if 39:03 Pontius Pilate had ever been a genuine historical figure. 39:08 And speaking of Caesarea, I have to just throw this in. 39:11 A little slide I had the opportunity of a few years ago 39:15 being in archaeological dig in Caesarea Israel. 39:18 There's my handsome self way back when, so. 39:20 Oh boy, look at that and you can see. 39:23 There was some very interesting people 39:25 that we worked with in doing archaeology there, 39:28 so I recommend it. 39:29 Their students here, a lot of students here, if you ever get 39:32 a chance to do archaeology dig, jump at it. 39:34 It is a great way to get college credit and get out of 39:36 the classroom, it is very good. 39:42 It was Robert Boyle who said: 40:05 so what he is saying there is that two books written by the 40:08 same author, nature and scripture, 40:10 if understood correctly, should agree. 40:13 That makes sense doesn't it? 40:15 That does make sense if you believe in God having something 40:17 to do with us being here and potentially sharing 40:22 information with us about that. 40:23 Now poor science statements. 40:25 Every once in a while someone will raise an argument about 40:28 the Bible has terrible science, 40:30 there's some silly things in there. 40:31 For instance, doesn't it say that the world is square, 40:34 or flat, or something and they will mention a 40:38 statement like this. 40:44 You can see the science, if this is a scientific statement, 40:47 it is not a very good one. 40:48 Well I have to say that you need to understand the Greek in 40:51 this particular case, the word for corners can mean angle 40:54 or direction as well. 40:56 But take a look and see if you think these statements are 40:58 not too bad scientifically. 41:06 Back in the ancient day it was generally thought that planet 41:10 Earth rode on the back of something, like a turtle or an 41:13 Atlas's shoulder, something had to hold to hold the earth up. 41:16 It is not a bad statement if I can say by Richard Dawkins, 41:20 usually says that the writers of the Bible were camel herders 41:23 from the Middle East. 41:24 It is not a bad guess by the camel herders. 41:27 He hangs the Earth on nothing. 41:29 How about this one: 41:34 the word circle in Hebrew can also be translated, sphere, 41:36 a separate word for sphere or ball. 41:49 Now that is really interesting because the tense of the verb 41:51 there is present tense. 41:53 So it literally says that God is stretching out the heavens 41:56 like a curtain, currently doing that and how would camel 42:00 herders know that the universe is expanding currently? 42:03 I just throw these out as potentially interesting things 42:07 to talk about if ancient writings in the Bible having 42:12 some science in them. 42:13 But I will be the first one to say that the Bible, 42:15 is not, repeat not, a science textbook. 42:17 It is not, but every once in a while it makes a science 42:20 statement that isn't too bad. 42:22 Okay, so Isaac Newton said this: 42:26 Newton is one of our heroes in this subject. 42:33 Quite a scholar he was. 42:37 The question of pain and suffering, Where did God go? 42:42 Why is the world apparently in turmoil? 42:45 Here's this long statement but follow it with me, 42:48 if you would. 43:20 This is very interesting language. 43:22 The creation was subjected to futility, something was 43:25 broken in nature, something isn't working right. 43:29 It is within God's plan for that to be going on temporarily. 43:34 He has a hope for it in the future. 43:37 There is a bondage of corruption the word corruption there, 43:40 is an old English word. 43:41 Especially the King James version uses it a lot. 43:43 The word corruption there simply means decay, decay. 43:47 If you think about that, decay is a significant issue in this 43:52 universe, especially in our neck of the woods it is an issue. 43:55 Yet the Bible seems to have something to say about it. 43:58 But there is a bondage, there is something controlling nature 44:02 it seems to me causing nature to groan under the oppressive 44:07 conditions that it is in. 44:08 Well let me just mention that this has been observed and it 44:12 is called the second law of thermodynamics. 44:14 You have probably heard that in entropy happens. 44:17 You have science students here and entropy happens. 44:20 That ought to be a bumper sticker. 44:22 Entropy happens, in fact it usually happens after a big test 44:43 And basically it is decay that is talking about decay. 44:45 Everything assuming room temperature on a universal scale 44:48 So this is the direction of the universe towards entropy 44:52 right now, this is not a theory, it is a law. 44:56 It is testable and laboratories and that is why it has gotten 44:59 to level of law. 45:38 So I would like to show you a little experiment right now. 45:41 I'm sure this will be a tricky thing. 45:45 When we talk about things organizing against the second 45:49 law of thermodynamics, what we are generally talking about 45:53 is a tendency for things to become disorganized. 45:56 Now one of the things that is usually used as an argument 46:00 against that, that therefore could allow organization, and 46:06 life, and evolution, and so forth happens in spite of 46:09 entropy is that energy can be added to a system. 46:13 Energy in some way, energy gets put into the system. 46:16 Now generally speaking, and this is an old example and 46:20 I'll probably have some problems. 46:22 Here we go. 46:23 Here is the system and let's see how organized I can get this 46:26 by adding some random forces. 46:33 Now random energy, have I organized this anymore by adding 46:37 random energy? 46:40 Usually random energy will dis- organize things, not organize 46:45 things and yet the theory of evolution includes that things 46:51 get more organized as energy has been added in some form. 46:54 Well that doesn't explain everything but at least it is 46:59 one illustration. 47:01 It seems like energy does not, by itself, organize things. 47:05 The secrets of evolution are time and death. 47:13 So death is part of evolution and yet remember what I said 47:18 a little earlier in the evening? 47:20 I said I am still wondering why evolution hasn't produced 47:24 something that doesn't die yet, I wonder about that because 47:27 all the systems of repair are present. 47:30 All systems of repair are in some rudimentary form are 47:34 present, it is like it is almost barely unable to keep up 47:39 at some point and as time goes on it is less able to keep up. 47:43 You would think at some point something, somebody, 47:46 somewhere would evolve to where the repair systems 47:49 are working properly. 47:51 It does seem in my opinion there is a place where nature 47:54 seems to agree with the biblical statement of creation 47:57 groaning under some kind of form of corruption or decay. 48:01 Entropy, Karl Hagan said: now here is my problem 48:08 theological, and I know some people say religion and faith 48:10 are compatible, I mean religion and science are compatible 48:13 the theory of evolution, and so forth. 48:15 Here is where theology enters into the problem 48:18 of this combination. 48:19 Did God create death? 48:22 Was it on His chalkboard to make? 48:25 Because the Bible doesn't seem to say it was 48:30 God's plan for death. 48:32 According to Romans 5:12 it says: 48:40 Now that is a pretty clear statement. 48:42 The Bible says it wasn't part of the original design of God 48:45 but it came through a decision that was made early on. 48:49 Now Jesus had these things that He accomplished in His life, 49:09 Folks at some rudimentary level you and I fear death. 49:13 At someplace, somewhere in our souls and hearts we fear it. 49:17 We'll duck when something is coming our way. 49:20 It is a natural reaction and God has created us that way. 49:23 It is hardwired into us and there is a fear of death. 49:28 God would like to somehow deliver us from fear of death. 49:34 It is a bondage. 49:46 Why would God create death and then go to such a tremendous 49:51 amount of effort to get rid of it? 49:53 Okay, it is a thought! 49:56 Again the book of Endings, the book of Revelation which ends 49:58 all the things you saw that long list, or in other words how 50:02 things end up for those subjects in the Book of 50:05 Beginnings, the Book of Endings says this: 50:20 so a new order is now re-created or restored and there is 50:24 no more death, as though death were an intruder. 50:26 Again did God create death is part of His plan? 50:28 That is a question! 50:30 Notice that this atheist has correctly observed, he has got 50:34 this nailed down when Richard Bozarth said this: 50:50 Why?, Let's see this is what he said: 51:15 There is no purpose to Christianity according to 51:18 Richard Bozarth, the atheist and I think he is correctly 51:21 seeing that dilemma. 51:25 So we look at the book of Genesis and we see in it 51:28 information that describes how this planet got into this 51:31 predicament and if you do not believe this you are going 51:34 to call it a myth. 51:36 Then suddenly you are making God really responsible for death 51:39 as part of what we see in the planet. 51:42 Here is a description of where He was not the ultimate 51:45 responsible source, that it was this other character that we 51:50 described in the book of Job mournfully, and that is Lucifer. 51:53 So your image of God is what is at stake here. 51:58 There is nothing more important in any teachings, on any 52:02 subject, how it will eventually boil down to 52:04 your view of God. 52:05 If you believe God created death and suffering in this 52:09 planet as a way of creating new life and species, evolving 52:13 then through millions of years of clawing and fighting and 52:17 struggling for limited resources if that is your image of 52:20 a loving God it clashes with other images. 52:24 The Riddle of Epicurus again was this: 52:44 I want you to throw into this Riddle this possibility. 52:47 Let's assume for a moment that God honors freedom of choice. 52:52 He wants people to be interested in Him like He is interested 52:57 in them, but only by their freedom of choice. 53:02 So He can't force anybody, that is against His nature. 53:07 How is He going to allow evil to exist, but then deliver 53:13 the universe from the pain and suffering that it causes in 53:19 such a way that it still honors freedom of choice? 53:22 Not force, or cause people to serve out of fear or whatever. 53:28 Might it be that God is allowing planet Earth to become an 53:33 experiment, and I know this is a loaded thought, an 53:37 experiment to let a planet show what it is like to try a 53:42 different path and to ask God to step away from it. 53:47 And God honors that request in letting it do its own thing. 53:52 Letting the planet deal with its own thing. 53:55 At some point God has promised to end the bad news we see 54:01 and bring it back to where it needs to be, but He wants 54:06 to do it in such a way as to make sure that evil never 54:10 ever comes back by freedom of choice. 54:15 It will never be chosen again because the experiment will 54:18 have proven that what He was saying originally in the garden 54:21 of Eden was right. 54:23 Maybe God is honoring this Riddle in a way. 54:29 He is willing to do good than evil and He is able to keep it 54:34 from happening, but He has to honor freedom of choice. 54:38 So He is a little bit restricted to what He can do. 54:42 Now if you believe in an omnipotent God, God could wipe 54:46 us all out and start over with people who look just like you 54:49 and me, they are much nicer. 54:50 Isn't that right? Sound like you act like you. 54:54 It might even have your own DNA to some extent. 54:58 He could do that, but God would know, no one else, but God 55:03 would know that He wasn't honoring freedom of choice. 55:06 He would rather you choose. 55:08 I mean parents would you like to have clones of your children 55:12 that were just kind, and I would open the door, and do the 55:16 laundry, and pick up the dirty clothes, and do everything 55:20 like that, and say yes or hello mom and dad, I love you, 55:24 knowing full well that they are that were not from choice, 55:28 because they are pre-programmed to do it only that way? 55:32 Would that ever be the same versus somebody that did it 55:36 because they wanted to? 55:37 It would never be quite the same and God knows it. 55:42 So God is restricted, He has restricted Himself 55:46 in this regard. 55:48 Is He going to deal with evil? Yes He is, but by honoring 55:51 choice, individual choices that we are all making. 55:54 He made you in the image of God. 55:56 Jesus said this about a sparrow, and I want you to compare 56:00 this was the theory of evolution that says that creatures, 56:04 new species are created after periods of suffering and 56:08 adapting to new environments. 56:11 Jesus said this: 56:19 Now many translations say your Father's will, but I looked at 56:23 the original and it does not have a will in there, will is 56:27 supplied, it literally says no sparrow falls alone, 56:34 God is there. 56:35 Now if no sparrow falls alone, no sparrow falls without God 56:41 noticing and being touched by that loss, does that jive with 56:46 millions of years of pain and suffering? 56:50 I wonder, you have to deal with the image. 56:53 Jesus said this, and this is one of the saddest verses 56:58 in the Bible: 57:22 now you see, He knew God to be a loving person, but the world 57:26 for the most part, is not acquainted with Him. 57:29 I hope through this week you will get evidence that you 57:35 consider that maybe He is not so bad. 57:38 At our next presentation we will talk about where these 57:42 issues especially impact all of us. 57:45 This is where the rubber meets the road on the subject 57:47 of origins, that is where mankind came from. 57:49 We will see you at our next presentation. |
Revised 2014-12-17