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>>Eric Flickinger:
Welcome to "Sabbath School,"
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brought to you by It Is Written.
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We're glad that you
are joining us today.
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We are looking at how
to study Bible prophecy.
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And today we are
looking at part 2
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of a two-part
miniseries of studies in this,
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looking at the nations,
how politics and the history
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of the world and
geography all relate
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into history and a better
understanding of the Bible
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and God's plan for salvation.
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We're glad that
you're here with us.
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Let's start with prayer.
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Father, we ask that You'll
bless us again today as You have
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in the past, that You
would continue to give us mercy
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and grace and understanding.
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Pour into us a knowledge of
Scripture and a knowledge of You
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so that we may come
away from our study today
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trusting You more.
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And we thank
You, in Jesus' name,
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amen. >>Shawn Boonstra: Amen.
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>>Eric: Our guest this week once
again is Pastor Shawn Boonstra.
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He is the author
of this quarter's
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"Sabbath School" lesson.
Shawn, good to have you here.
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>>Shawn: Thank you.
And it was just because
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you couldn't get
anybody else. (laughing]
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>>Eric: Well, we're glad that
you were at least available.
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It says something
when someone is available.
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>>Shawn: I'm always
available. >>Eric: There we go.
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(Shawn laughs) So
this subject, though,
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the subject of the nations,
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this is something that you
are particularly interested in,
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you're passionate about.
It's part of your history.
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And so this means a lot to you.
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>>Shawn: It really does.
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I come from a life of politics.
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It was my life's ambition to run
for office one day, even though
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I'm an introvert and I
don't even like public speaking,
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but it's all I wanted out of
life until God turned me around.
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And I have firsthand experience
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in the contrast
between the kingdom of God
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and the kingdoms of
this world, I really do.
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>>Eric: And we're
starting to see some of that.
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It's very valuable
insight as we're going into it--
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last week,
certainly, and this week, again.
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In the second part of our study
of the nations, why do you think
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there's so much space
given to Israel's interaction
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with foreign
nations in the Bible?
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>>Shawn: Yeah, it
really is fascinating.
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I think if I were to give
one answer, and there isn't
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just one, but if I
were to give one answer,
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it's for the sake of contrast.
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Israel was supposed
to be something else.
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Israel was supposed to be
the seeds of God's kingdom
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bearing fruit in
this world already.
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Here's a group of
people that are aligned
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with the coming
Messiah, the seed of the woman.
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It's a
different type of kingdom.
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Even though we are
sinners and we're forced to live
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in the world systems,
God invites us, even now
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ahead of the
Second Coming of Christ
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to live as if we're
already in the kingdom.
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And Israel was
supposed to be that.
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And when Israel is behaving,
we get a great illustration
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of what it's
supposed to be like.
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I mean, even Ezekiel ends with,
here we go, everything restored.
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But then when Israel
goes astray and starts chasing
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the kingdoms of this
world that we saw last week,
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asking for a king, we want to be
like them, then we get contrast
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and we start to
see in Israel, too,
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how the influence of
these foreign entities started
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to change the
makeup of God's people.
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So we really see the
great controversy in, up close--
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it's a case study in it,
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kingdom of God versus
kingdoms of the world--
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kingdom motivated by the love
of God and the person of Christ
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and kingdoms motivated entirely
by self-interest, selfishness,
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and pride.
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And that, I'm surprised
it's only 66 books. (laughs)
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>>Eric: Yeah, we'd expect
it to be much, much longer.
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You also spend some time
in this week's lesson talking
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about the triumph of God's
system, how ultimately His plan
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is going to succeed.
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And unfortunately, though,
we've been seeing God's plan
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work out, for better or
for worse, over the course
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of several thousand years
now. >>Shawn: Yeah. (laughs)
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>>Eric: And there's a lot
of suffering, a lot of pain,
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a lot of
discouragement that goes along.
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Why doesn't God just kind of go,
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"Hey, you know,
let's finish it"?
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>>Shawn: Yeah, why doesn't He
just pull out a chart and say,
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"Here's the
difference, godly kingdom and"--
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it's because we're now tainted.
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We are self-oriented,
and a chart and a graph
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aren't going to do it, until we
figure this out for ourselves.
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Isaiah calls, in
Isaiah, chapter 10,
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all these other nations
"the nations of the idols."
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And that's not so
much-- the idol is not so much
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a foreign
entity, a foreign deity
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as it is a picture of yourself.
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Idols are gods
made in the image of man
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instead of man being
made in the image of God.
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It's still worship of self,
and it's a shortcut to intimacy.
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I've often found it
interesting--a little sidebar.
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Why is it that so
many of these ancient cults
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had temple prostitutes?
Well, it makes good sense.
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A prostitute is a shortcut
to intimacy that cheats you
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of the real thing, all
right? It's just a transaction.
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Same thing with idol
worship, just a transaction.
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I'll pay off my god and go do
what I want for the next week.
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They're both
shortcuts to intimacy.
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And until we figure this out
for ourselves, the hardest thing
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in the world--I have no problem
pointing out your faults.
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I have an awful lot of
trouble finding mine, right?
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Have you ever noticed how
sin seems so horrible in other
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people, but then we start
to downplay it when it's--
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"Ah, it's not all that
bad. You know, all I did was"--
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no, you sinned.
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And I think what God
wants--here, Psalm 46, verse 10:
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"Be still, and
know that I am God.
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"I will be exalted among
the nations, I will be exalted
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in the earth!"
That's coming in the future.
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But God's non-coercive.
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He wants you to
figure this out for himself.
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There's a pattern in the
book of Mark that I think
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illustrates what
I'm trying to get at.
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There's something scholars
call the "messianic secret"
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in the book of Mark. I
don't know if you've noticed
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Jesus keeps saying, "Okay,
don't tell anybody who I am.
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Don't tell anybody
who I am." Why not?
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Are You afraid of a
little publicity, Jesus?
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Now, there's a logic to it.
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The Gospel of
Mark is fascinating.
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It actually gains in physical
elevation as you go along.
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It starts at the Dead
Sea, down below sea level,
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and it ends up on the
Mount of Transfiguration.
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And then from there it
goes all the way downhill
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to Jerusalem
and the Crucifixion.
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But every succeeding
story gains a little higher,
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a little higher, a
little higher in elevation
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until they get to
Caesarea Philippi.
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And when you get there--
this was a pagan hot spot.
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There are little niches in
the wall above the river there
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that are still
there to this day.
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There was a statue
of Pan. What is Pan?
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Half animal, half man, but it's
a deity who's part-man, right?
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A part-man-god, really?
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And then it's named for
Caesar, Caesarea Philippi.
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What is the
Caesar? By this point,
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since Augustus Caesar,
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we started to
deify the Roman Caesars.
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So he's part-man, part-god.
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He's a man who's
said to be a god.
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And that's the spot Jesus
turns to His disciples and said,
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"Who do people say I am?"
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"Well, some say
John the Baptist."
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"But who do you say I am?"
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"Well, You're the Son of God."
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He lets them, over
all those chapters,
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come to that
conclusion themselves.
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He doesn't spell it out.
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They follow Him,
they listen to Him,
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and they come to that
conclusion themselves.
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Children are the same way.
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It's a famous one, right?
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"Don't touch it. It's
hot. Don't touch it. It's hot."
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They're going to touch it.
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And that's when
they learn why you said,
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"Don't touch it. It's hot."
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If God were to just
push the reset button,
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gather us all
into heaven, and say,
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"All right,
let's just try again,"
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would we really understand why
it was wrong to go our own way?
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Would we?
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Or is God allowing us to go our
own way? So we get to the point
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where we say, "Okay, God,
it's time to blow the whistle.
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"Let's get all the kids out
of the pool. We need a reset.
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"We get it now. We see
that what You said was right.
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"We don't want to live
in the kingdoms of the idol
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"and worship self anymore.
You belong on the throne.
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We mess up every
time we grab the throne."
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I think we're getting
close to that point now.
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>>Eric: We're getting closer.
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Unfortunately, we're
not there yet, or depending
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on how you want to look at it,
fortunately or unfortunately,
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we're not there yet.
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But we're getting
closer, to be sure.
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A while ago at
an ASI convention,
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you talked about
something interesting
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with respect to the tree of
the knowledge of good and evil
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and something that underlies
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this whole issue with the human
heart. Open that up for us.
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>>Shawn: Yeah, we touched
on this in a previous lesson
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a little bit. I kind of gave my
hand away, but let me repeat it.
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In Genesis, chapter 3, our
translation is pretty good,
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but it's not accurate.
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This I referred to--I don't know
if it was last week or a couple
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of weeks ago--where the devil
comes and asks this question:
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"Did God actually
say, 'You shall not eat
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of any tree in the garden'?"
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Well, yeah, the devil's method
is not to just contradict God,
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it is to raise
questions, and we still do that:
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"Okay, I know the Bible
says-- but what about...?"
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And we love to put
question marks over it,
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but only when it steps
on our toes. We do that.
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So that's not a
horrible translation,
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but one rabbi I know
who really is sort of the--
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reincarnation
is the wrong word--
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that would betray my theology,
but he's the reincarnation
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of a lot of the medieval
rabbi theologians like Rashi
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and Maimonides and others.
He translated this differently,
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and I brought this
up a few weeks ago.
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He translated
this, "Even if God said,
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'Do not eat from any of
the trees of the garden.'"
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That's the
devil's entire statement.
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Why? Well, it's an
unfinished thought.
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He's, like, finishing it with,
"So what? Okay, God said that."
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Clearly, he's not
going to convince Eve
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God never said that.
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So what? And in
another lesson I made reference
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to the fact that God just went
through this exercise with Adam
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to prove, "You're not an
animal. You're not an animal.
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Go try and find a mate."
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And we all know when we read
that story at the beginning--
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come on, Moses, really?
He's going to find a mate
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among the zebras or, you know,
the banana slugs? Gimme a break.
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We know the end of the
story before we read it,
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so why is it there?
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The story talks about
the garden and the trees
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in the midst of the
garden, and then it pivots
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to these animals and
then comes back to the tree.
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It's like an interlude.
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And the interlude
leads Adam to the conclusion,
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"There's no mate for me among
the animals. I'm different."
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Now the devil shows up
like an animal, a serpent.
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He says, "So God said, 'Don't
eat from the tree.' So what?
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"Didn't God create the animals?
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"Didn't He create them with all
their appetites and passions?
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"And look, that gazelle's
eating from the tree right now,
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nothing happening. Aren't you
also designed by that same God?"
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Yeah, except
there's different rules.
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Here's an interesting statement.
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This is from "Patriarchs
and Prophets," page 53.
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I think it's a keen observation.
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"While everything in nature
is governed by natural laws"--
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we know that--"man alone,
of all that inhabits the earth,
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is amenable to
moral law." Only us.
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"Man, the crowning work of
creation, God has given power
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to understand His requirements."
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This might be the reason.
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When you get to
Daniel, chapter 7 and you see
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all the kingdoms of
this world, what are they?
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Well, we've got a
lion with eagle's wings.
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It's an animal.
It's an unclean animal.
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We've got a bear
raised up on one side.
00:10:58.32\00:11:00.12
We've got a leopard.
We've got this loathsome beast
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with heads and
horns. They're all animals.
00:11:02.39\00:11:05.79
What do they represent?
00:11:05.83\00:11:07.46
Represent the kingdoms of this
world. The devil comes and says,
00:11:07.50\00:11:10.50
"Are you so sure
you're not an animal, Eve?
00:11:10.53\00:11:12.83
You know, follow your passions."
00:11:12.87\00:11:14.50
The kingdoms of this world in
Daniel 7 are those that follow
00:11:14.54\00:11:18.44
their own passions, took
the throne for themselves,
00:11:18.47\00:11:21.28
drive-by passion, and
at the end of the day,
00:11:21.31\00:11:23.11
we all know that's how we are.
00:11:23.14\00:11:24.95
You will always cave to
your passions in a hot moment
00:11:24.98\00:11:28.42
before anything else, right?
00:11:28.45\00:11:30.45
If you're really tired--here's
a simple one: cheesecake.
00:11:30.49\00:11:34.29
Not all that good for
you, a slice, no harm.
00:11:34.32\00:11:36.96
The whole thing? Bad idea.
00:11:36.99\00:11:38.63
But if you've been
on a plane for four days
00:11:38.66\00:11:40.30
and the only thing
sitting there is cheesecake,
00:11:40.33\00:11:41.73
you stare at that thing--"I'm
just going to eat a little"--
00:11:41.76\00:11:43.73
and you eat the whole thing.
00:11:43.77\00:11:45.40
Your passions will almost
override everything in a crisis.
00:11:45.43\00:11:48.40
And God knows
there's a crisis coming,
00:11:48.44\00:11:50.41
and He's trying to
remind us, why don't you build
00:11:50.44\00:11:53.04
your knowledge on what I
say instead of your passions?
00:11:53.07\00:11:56.04
The kingdoms of
this world are animals.
00:11:56.08\00:11:58.98
They build on passion.
You I intend to be different.
00:11:59.01\00:12:02.15
That's a convoluted--
that's a long way around.
00:12:02.18\00:12:04.09
But I think that
might be one of the reasons
00:12:04.12\00:12:06.09
God illustrates the kingdoms
of this world as animals.
00:12:06.12\00:12:08.42
>>Eric: Yeah, I
think you're right.
00:12:08.46\00:12:10.09
If somebody wants to
dig further into this,
00:12:10.13\00:12:12.09
there's a companion book.
Tell us a little bit about it.
00:12:12.13\00:12:14.30
>>Shawn: The
companion book-- written by me,
00:12:14.36\00:12:16.30
so don't get
your hopes too high.
00:12:16.33\00:12:17.63
However, there's
additional material.
00:12:17.67\00:12:19.63
We are rattling
through this stuff.
00:12:19.67\00:12:21.54
There's more in
there to keep you studying
00:12:21.57\00:12:23.54
and find some things
maybe you've never seen before.
00:12:23.57\00:12:25.67
>>Eric: And there
are going to be people
00:12:25.71\00:12:27.01
who might want to study
this. Maybe somebody who teaches
00:12:27.04\00:12:29.01
a Sabbath school class might
benefit from the companion book.
00:12:29.04\00:12:32.65
Somebody who's participating
in a Sabbath school class,
00:12:32.68\00:12:35.65
they want to appear
like the smart kid in class,
00:12:35.68\00:12:37.95
perhaps, perhaps. (Shawn laughs)
00:12:37.99\00:12:39.95
Or maybe there's somebody who's
not part of a Sabbath school
00:12:39.99\00:12:42.59
class, per se, but they
just want to better understand
00:12:42.62\00:12:45.33
how to study the
prophecies of the Bible
00:12:45.36\00:12:47.30
and get something out of it.
00:12:47.36\00:12:48.63
Anybody who falls in there, and
maybe a few other people, too,
00:12:48.66\00:12:51.50
would benefit from
this companion book.
00:12:51.53\00:12:53.87
So if you would like to
pick up the companion book,
00:12:53.90\00:12:56.94
you can find it
at itiswritten.shop.
00:12:56.97\00:12:59.61
Again, that's itiswritten.shop.
00:12:59.64\00:13:02.11
Just look for the companion book
00:13:02.14\00:13:03.65
to this quarter's
"Sabbath School" lesson.
00:13:03.68\00:13:05.81
You'll be blessed if you
pick it up and delve into it.
00:13:05.85\00:13:08.25
We're going to be back in just
a moment as we continue looking
00:13:08.28\00:13:10.62
at how we can study the
prophecies of the Bible,
00:13:10.65\00:13:13.96
specifically the role
that the nations play.
00:13:13.99\00:13:16.69
We'll be right back.
00:13:16.73\00:13:18.36
¤¤¤
00:13:18.39\00:13:20.40
>>John Bradshaw: Read
the book of Daniel and you
00:13:22.43\00:13:24.27
read about dreams and visions,
about kings and kingdoms,
00:13:24.30\00:13:28.40
and you encounter
prophetic symbols,
00:13:28.44\00:13:30.94
beasts that represent kingdoms,
00:13:30.97\00:13:33.27
days that represent
years, winds that portray strife
00:13:33.31\00:13:37.38
and warfare, and
oceans that represent people.
00:13:37.41\00:13:41.88
But the book of Daniel
is a book of salvation,
00:13:41.92\00:13:45.59
and Daniel,
chapter 4 makes that clear.
00:13:45.62\00:13:49.86
Don't miss "The Fall
and Rise of Babylon's King."
00:13:49.89\00:13:54.56
In
Nebuchadnezzar's last appearance
00:13:54.56\00:13:56.53
in the book of Daniel,
the king has another dream.
00:13:56.56\00:13:59.93
Again, it's
interpreted by Daniel.
00:14:00.04\00:14:02.27
And although the news
for the Babylonian monarch
00:14:02.30\00:14:04.34
is not good, God
ultimately does something
00:14:04.37\00:14:07.81
no one would
have thought possible.
00:14:07.84\00:14:10.48
"The Fall and Rise
of Babylon's King,"
00:14:10.51\00:14:13.08
hope in the heart of
Daniel's remarkable book,
00:14:13.11\00:14:15.62
brought to you
by It Is Written TV.
00:14:15.65\00:14:18.72
¤¤¤
00:14:22.32\00:14:26.80
>>Eric: Welcome
back to "Sabbath School,"
00:14:26.83\00:14:28.30
brought to you by It Is Written.
00:14:28.33\00:14:29.76
We're continuing our study
of looking at the prophecies
00:14:29.80\00:14:32.93
of the Bible and how we
can better understand them,
00:14:32.97\00:14:34.60
especially as they interact
with the kingdoms of this world.
00:14:34.64\00:14:39.11
Shawn, on Monday's lesson,
you talk about Daniel revealing
00:14:39.14\00:14:43.78
the fact that the
kingdoms of this world are never
00:14:43.81\00:14:45.95
going to solve our problems.
00:14:45.98\00:14:47.95
And we want to be optimistic,
00:14:47.98\00:14:50.89
as human beings. >>Shawn: Right.
00:14:50.92\00:14:53.52
>>Eric: But we know that
they're all going to fail.
00:14:53.56\00:14:54.96
What's--how do we balance this?
00:14:54.99\00:14:56.62
Do we just look at the
world and say, "Oh, woe is me;
00:14:56.66\00:14:59.43
it's all going to pieces"?
00:14:59.46\00:15:02.30
I mean, there's a temptation
there, but I don't think,
00:15:02.33\00:15:04.60
necessarily,
that's what God wants.
00:15:04.63\00:15:06.94
>>Shawn: I think that
there is appropriate optimism
00:15:06.97\00:15:11.27
and inappropriate optimism.
00:15:11.31\00:15:12.77
There's also
inappropriate pessimism,
00:15:12.81\00:15:15.01
which some
Christians are prone to.
00:15:15.04\00:15:17.25
Inappropriate optimism--
00:15:17.28\00:15:18.98
if we go to the
Paris Exposition--
00:15:19.01\00:15:20.32
whatever year that was,
1890-something or other--
00:15:20.35\00:15:22.82
it was brimming with optimism:
00:15:22.85\00:15:25.05
"We are going to
conquer science, technology.
00:15:25.09\00:15:27.62
Rationality is gonna conquer
all of our very worst problems."
00:15:27.66\00:15:31.63
If you go back to
the Hansard in England,
00:15:31.66\00:15:33.29
the Hansard is the actual
written record of what's said
00:15:33.33\00:15:36.10
in the House of
Commons every day.
00:15:36.13\00:15:38.63
Oh, people were
standing up making speeches:
00:15:38.67\00:15:40.64
"We have advanced so far.
00:15:40.67\00:15:42.14
That's the end of war
and the end of famine"
00:15:42.17\00:15:44.77
and the end of this
and the end of that--
00:15:44.81\00:15:46.27
brimming with optimism.
00:15:46.31\00:15:47.94
And by 1914, the
world's first world war,
00:15:47.98\00:15:50.98
and then a few years
later, a second world war,
00:15:51.01\00:15:53.31
and we haven't had a
moment's peace since.
00:15:53.35\00:15:55.32
Two hundred million people
died in warfare of some kind--
00:15:55.35\00:15:59.92
civil war, international
war-- during the 20th century.
00:15:59.95\00:16:04.69
It's an atrocious number.
00:16:04.73\00:16:06.96
It's like a fifth
of a billion people.
00:16:07.00\00:16:09.93
And when we went into
the camps of Auschwitz
00:16:09.96\00:16:12.27
at the end of the war in
1945, that really drove home
00:16:12.30\00:16:17.44
postmodern
philosophy in a deep, deep way.
00:16:17.47\00:16:19.94
We'd already been
told since the late 1800s,
00:16:19.97\00:16:22.94
"There really is no meaning
to life. There is no pattern.
00:16:22.98\00:16:25.61
"There's nothing you can trust.
00:16:25.65\00:16:26.95
"Just, you know, your
senses can't really make sense
00:16:26.98\00:16:29.28
out of this world. So
you live your narrative."
00:16:29.32\00:16:32.59
I'm using modern language
to describe what they're--
00:16:32.62\00:16:34.59
we go into Auschwitz--
we've never seen evil like that.
00:16:34.62\00:16:38.26
Auschwitz was to us
what the Lisbon quake was
00:16:38.29\00:16:40.96
to that generation. How could
something this awful happen?
00:16:40.96\00:16:44.27
Maybe nothing means anything.
00:16:44.30\00:16:46.27
So we were
inappropriately optimistic
00:16:46.30\00:16:48.17
going into the 20th
century, because God said,
00:16:48.20\00:16:50.11
"No, it doesn't get
better as time goes along."
00:16:50.14\00:16:52.27
Then there's the
flip side of the coin:
00:16:52.31\00:16:54.94
the inappropriate pessimism.
00:16:54.98\00:16:56.61
I had a woman come to
me shortly after 9/11.
00:16:56.64\00:16:58.61
"I can't sleep." I said, "Why?"
00:16:58.65\00:17:00.62
"Well, 9/11, it
was so horrible."
00:17:00.65\00:17:01.95
I said, "I
understand. It is horrible,
00:17:01.98\00:17:03.45
and I can't get that
picture out of my head, either."
00:17:03.49\00:17:06.29
She says, "It's terrible.
The world's going nowhere."
00:17:06.32\00:17:08.29
I said, "You need to understand
that Jesus offers the peace
00:17:08.32\00:17:11.63
"that passes understanding.
You're going to be fine.
00:17:11.66\00:17:15.00
"Even if you were
in the Twin Towers,
00:17:15.03\00:17:17.00
you're going to be fine."
00:17:17.03\00:17:19.00
I said, "What you need"--
she's terrified of death.
00:17:19.03\00:17:21.60
I said, "Here's what you need to
understand. Maybe it'll help."
00:17:21.64\00:17:23.94
This is terrible what
I'm about to say, but,
00:17:23.97\00:17:25.97
"You're going
to die, guaranteed.
00:17:26.01\00:17:29.01
"If Jesus doesn't come
first, you're going to die.
00:17:29.04\00:17:30.81
"It's not if, it's when,
and it's just a matter of how.
00:17:30.85\00:17:33.78
"So why don't you live your life
knowing that's going to happen
00:17:33.82\00:17:36.52
and let that happen
when it happens?" (chuckles)
00:17:36.55\00:17:39.35
And she said, "What?"
Inappropriate pessimism.
00:17:39.39\00:17:42.86
I got in trouble on TV a
while ago because I said,
00:17:42.89\00:17:45.36
"Look, America started
as, really, a godly republic."
00:17:45.39\00:17:49.23
We touched on that
in a previous lesson.
00:17:49.26\00:17:52.43
It was the only
place the remnant church
00:17:52.47\00:17:54.27
really could be born.
00:17:54.30\00:17:56.27
Was it a Christian
nation? Yes, it was.
00:17:56.30\00:17:58.27
Not in the sense that many
modern Christians say that.
00:17:58.31\00:18:00.68
It was meant as a place where
the individual could answer
00:18:00.71\00:18:03.81
directly to God with
his or her conscience
00:18:03.85\00:18:06.58
without a king in
between calling the shots.
00:18:06.61\00:18:10.55
That's what
America-- that's what Israel
00:18:10.59\00:18:11.89
was intended to be, every
individual answerable to God,
00:18:11.92\00:18:14.12
bring your own
lamb to the sanctuary.
00:18:14.16\00:18:16.49
The same thing was true here.
00:18:16.52\00:18:17.86
It was supposed to be a
place where--and we didn't do it
00:18:17.89\00:18:20.26
perfectly; you know, we
hung a Quaker in Massachusetts
00:18:20.30\00:18:23.57
for coming to town
and daring to preach.
00:18:23.60\00:18:25.57
We didn't execute it perfectly,
but it was intended to be
00:18:25.60\00:18:27.94
a place where you
answered directly to God again.
00:18:27.97\00:18:31.44
Today that's come to
mean something different.
00:18:31.47\00:18:33.64
It's almost like we want
another theocracy and the church
00:18:33.68\00:18:36.61
will call the
shots, thank you very much.
00:18:36.64\00:18:38.21
That's not what I
mean by "Christian nation."
00:18:38.25\00:18:40.68
But I dared to
say, you know what,
00:18:40.72\00:18:42.35
it's starting to fall apart.
00:18:42.38\00:18:44.22
The Lamb that you find
00:18:44.25\00:18:45.59
in Revelation,
chapter 13 and verse 11,
00:18:45.62\00:18:47.99
with two horns,
eventually speaks like a dragon.
00:18:48.02\00:18:50.89
And there's no reversal of that.
00:18:50.93\00:18:52.86
And what we're seeing take place
here in the Western world now--
00:18:52.89\00:18:56.87
I'm not pessimistic;
my hope is just anchored
00:18:56.90\00:18:59.10
in the coming of Christ.
00:18:59.13\00:19:01.14
We were told that the world's
kingdoms, the world's nations
00:19:01.17\00:19:03.47
are going to fall apart,
including the best example
00:19:03.51\00:19:06.01
we ever had of a godly
republic, going to fall apart.
00:19:06.04\00:19:08.94
And I got an angry letter.
00:19:08.98\00:19:10.31
It was like, "How dare
you say we can't fix America?"
00:19:10.35\00:19:13.35
Of course you want to do what
you can to preserve liberty,
00:19:13.38\00:19:16.62
and you want to
contribute the best you can.
00:19:16.65\00:19:19.62
But prophecy tells me
it's going to fall apart.
00:19:19.65\00:19:22.06
If you anchor yourself in
that, it's like a sandcastle.
00:19:22.09\00:19:26.36
Build it, work on it,
tide's going to take it away.
00:19:26.39\00:19:29.36
I don't care how
hard you worked on it.
00:19:29.40\00:19:31.20
You can work on the
kingdoms of this earth with--
00:19:31.23\00:19:33.27
you can devote
your entire life to it.
00:19:33.30\00:19:34.94
At one point I was doing that.
00:19:34.97\00:19:37.17
We know the end
result. Help where you can.
00:19:37.21\00:19:40.28
Live in the context you live
in. Be a light in this world.
00:19:40.31\00:19:43.41
But understand
you're going to lose it all.
00:19:43.45\00:19:45.91
And the only thing that
lasts is the kingdom of Christ.
00:19:45.95\00:19:48.42
Revelation--is it 11? "The
kingdoms of [this earth have]
00:19:48.45\00:19:51.02
become the
kingdom of our...Christ."
00:19:51.05\00:19:52.79
Become the
kingdom of our Christ--
00:19:52.82\00:19:54.39
there's optimism.
It's going to be okay.
00:19:54.42\00:19:57.46
No matter what they do to me,
it's going to be okay, you know?
00:19:57.49\00:20:02.53
So they behead
me. Pfft! (laughs)
00:20:02.56\00:20:05.43
And don't live
in terror of that.
00:20:05.47\00:20:07.00
I see so many
Christians living in terror.
00:20:07.04\00:20:09.17
Nah, nah, nah. God shows us
00:20:09.20\00:20:10.84
so that we're not
shocked when it comes.
00:20:10.87\00:20:12.94
And sometimes we sit and
we make all these charts.
00:20:12.97\00:20:15.01
Here's the time of trouble, and
this is going to happen here,
00:20:15.04\00:20:17.35
and this is going to
happen here, and this is gonna--
00:20:17.38\00:20:19.18
is it useful? Sure.
00:20:19.21\00:20:20.68
But Jesus was really
clear at one point that prophecy
00:20:20.72\00:20:23.18
is not about
predicting the future.
00:20:23.22\00:20:25.19
"I have told you these
things now so that when they
00:20:25.22\00:20:27.46
come to pass, you
may know that I am He."
00:20:27.49\00:20:29.79
It's recognizing it
as it happens so you know
00:20:29.82\00:20:32.29
which signpost you just went by.
00:20:32.33\00:20:34.66
If you're spending your
entire life making the charts--
00:20:34.73\00:20:37.60
and they're fun; I make prophecy
charts; believe me, they're fun.
00:20:37.63\00:20:41.74
But that's not the
job we've been given,
00:20:41.77\00:20:43.41
is to obsess about the
future and what's coming.
00:20:43.44\00:20:46.01
We've been told to share Christ.
00:20:46.04\00:20:48.18
And the only way you
grow is not by obsessing
00:20:48.21\00:20:50.35
about what might go wrong.
00:20:50.38\00:20:52.01
It's about obsessing about
finding God's missing children.
00:20:52.05\00:20:54.68
>>Eric: You know,
Jesus spoke directly to that.
00:20:54.72\00:20:57.42
He said, "It's not
for you to know the times
00:20:57.45\00:20:59.19
or the seasons, but you're
to go and be my witnesses."
00:20:59.22\00:21:02.22
I paraphrase, but
it's share the message.
00:21:02.26\00:21:05.23
It's good to
know what's going on,
00:21:05.26\00:21:07.23
where we are in the
timeline of earth's history.
00:21:07.30\00:21:09.40
>>Shawn: Yeah, I can
turn on the news, and I smile.
00:21:09.43\00:21:11.93
"A-ha, there it is."
00:21:11.97\00:21:13.07
>>Eric: Yep. >>Shawn:
I can see it happening.
00:21:13.10\00:21:15.07
But if you start to get
too specific, and especially
00:21:15.10\00:21:17.41
if you're fear-driven, have you
noticed the attitude of Jesus?
00:21:17.44\00:21:22.41
"Let not your
heart be troubled."
00:21:22.44\00:21:23.95
"Fear not."
00:21:23.98\00:21:26.48
You know, Paul, when he's
describing the Second Coming,
00:21:26.51\00:21:28.95
starts out by saying, I think
I gave you the wrong impression
00:21:28.98\00:21:32.29
"n 1 Thessalonians.
00:21:32.32\00:21:34.76
There are some things
that need to happen first.
00:21:34.79\00:21:36.36
Please don't fear.
00:21:36.39\00:21:39.03
If your Christianity is always
fear-driven, if that's what
00:21:39.06\00:21:42.10
you're getting out of prophecy,
you're doing this all wrong
00:21:42.13\00:21:44.33
because Jesus, Paul, the
Bible, it's not fear driven.
00:21:44.37\00:21:48.00
Is it realistic? Yes.
00:21:48.04\00:21:49.34
God doesn't sugarcoat
what we did to this place.
00:21:49.37\00:21:51.74
He holds out reality because
He loves us enough to hold up
00:21:51.77\00:21:54.61
a mirror and say, "Here's
where you went on your own.
00:21:54.64\00:21:57.45
Here's my solution."
00:21:57.48\00:21:58.78
I live in the solution.
The solution's guaranteed.
00:21:58.81\00:22:02.85
>>Eric: And that you can
do with an appropriate measure
00:22:02.88\00:22:05.75
of optimism.
00:22:05.79\00:22:06.96
>>Shawn: Oh yeah.
So people are like,
00:22:06.99\00:22:08.42
"How can you be happy, Shawn?"
00:22:08.46\00:22:09.96
Well, because I'm
fine. >>Eric: Yeah.
00:22:09.99\00:22:12.63
>>Shawn: It doesn't
even matter what happens now.
00:22:12.66\00:22:14.30
I could die a slow,
lingering death; I could be
00:22:14.30\00:22:16.33
suddenly beheaded--I don't know.
00:22:16.36\00:22:17.43
I'm going to die anyway
if the Lord doesn't come.
00:22:17.47\00:22:19.33
I used to think, "Oh, no,
Lord will come before I die."
00:22:19.37\00:22:21.74
Well, now I'm getting to
the point where maybe He does,
00:22:21.77\00:22:23.74
maybe He doesn't. (both laugh)
00:22:23.77\00:22:25.94
That's going to happen anyway.
00:22:25.97\00:22:27.44
Why obsess about
that? Why obsess about it?
00:22:27.48\00:22:29.44
Just mark it on the
calendar: "One day, gonna die.
00:22:29.48\00:22:32.28
Live for Jesus."
That's not the end.
00:22:32.31\00:22:34.62
If you're obsessing
about what can go wrong,
00:22:34.65\00:22:37.12
you might be living
in the wrong paradigm.
00:22:37.15\00:22:39.29
>>Eric: So we know
that these kingdoms
00:22:39.32\00:22:41.22
are not going to survive.
00:22:41.26\00:22:42.96
>>Shawn: That's a zero chance.
00:22:42.99\00:22:44.29
>>Eric: Yeah, let me touch
on something briefly: politics.
00:22:44.33\00:22:47.46
How much of a role should we
as Christians play in politics,
00:22:47.50\00:22:50.60
and four hours later,
we'll be done discussing this,
00:22:50.63\00:22:54.40
but the
program's much shorter, so.
00:22:54.44\00:22:56.40
>>Shawn: All right, so, listen.
00:22:56.44\00:22:59.27
I'm a preacher, so
let me start there.
00:22:59.31\00:23:01.94
You must never, ever, ever
preach politics from the pulpit.
00:23:01.98\00:23:07.42
Why would you?
And listen to me--
00:23:07.45\00:23:09.08
even if you're not a preacher,
you're a member in the pews.
00:23:09.12\00:23:12.09
Why? Why in Sabbath School would
you start talking politics?
00:23:12.12\00:23:15.09
Why would you do that?
00:23:15.12\00:23:16.62
We live in the
most sharply divided,
00:23:16.66\00:23:18.39
polarized society that I
think America's ever seen
00:23:18.43\00:23:22.53
maybe outside of the Civil
War. We are sharply polarized.
00:23:22.56\00:23:26.33
Why would I issue one word--
00:23:26.37\00:23:29.00
and you might do it
inadvertently; I'm sure I do--
00:23:29.04\00:23:31.67
but why would you
deliberately issue one word
00:23:31.71\00:23:33.84
that would immediately
shut off half of your audience
00:23:33.88\00:23:36.34
to the gospel?
Why would you do it?
00:23:36.38\00:23:38.35
"Yeah, but we've got to
be obsessed about politics."
00:23:38.38\00:23:40.68
Let me read one quick statement.
00:23:40.72\00:23:42.68
This, I think, is the best
comment I've ever seen on this.
00:23:42.72\00:23:45.35
"Great Controversy," page 610:
00:23:45.39\00:23:47.79
"[As] long as
Jesus remains man's
00:23:47.82\00:23:50.06
"intercessor in the sanctuary
above, the restraining influence
00:23:50.09\00:23:52.73
of the Holy Spirit is
felt by rulers and people."
00:23:52.76\00:23:55.26
What's that tell
me? Leave that to God.
00:23:55.30\00:23:57.93
He's got the nations.
00:23:57.97\00:23:59.83
"It still controls, to some
extent, the laws of the land.
00:23:59.87\00:24:01.64
"Were it not for those laws,
the condition of [this] world
00:24:01.67\00:24:03.94
"would be much worse....
00:24:03.97\00:24:05.14
While many of our rulers
are active agents of Satan"--oh,
00:24:05.17\00:24:07.88
I want to put names there, but
you can't, not as a Christian--
00:24:07.91\00:24:11.55
"God also has His agents among
the leading men of the nation.
00:24:11.58\00:24:13.88
"The enemy moves upon his
servants to propose measures
00:24:13.92\00:24:16.35
"that
would...impede the work of God;
00:24:16.38\00:24:18.69
but [God would have]
statesmen who fear the Lord."
00:24:18.72\00:24:21.69
He'll stop it. I
don't have to worry
00:24:21.72\00:24:23.19
about the
condition of government.
00:24:23.22\00:24:25.53
There's only one thing, I
think, that is a political issue
00:24:25.56\00:24:28.26
that is open, especially
00:24:28.30\00:24:29.60
for Seventh-day
Adventist Christians.
00:24:29.63\00:24:32.07
We should insert ourselves
into the equation when we see
00:24:32.10\00:24:34.87
somebody's religious
liberty being eroded.
00:24:34.90\00:24:37.27
"You can't preach
because you are"--
00:24:37.31\00:24:39.27
it doesn't
matter that it's not us.
00:24:39.31\00:24:40.94
"Jehovah's Witness,
you're not allowed here."
00:24:40.98\00:24:42.94
We need to defend that because,
eventually, it'll come for us.
00:24:42.98\00:24:46.78
But that's it. It doesn't
matter who takes office anymore.
00:24:46.82\00:24:50.62
Do I vote? Sure I do.
00:24:50.65\00:24:52.49
I can't completely--besides,
you lose the right to complain
00:24:52.52\00:24:55.62
if you didn't participate.
00:24:55.66\00:24:57.16
I do my duty, but I
leave the government to God.
00:24:57.19\00:24:59.86
I obey the government unless
it asks me to run against God;
00:24:59.89\00:25:03.93
then I stand for God.
00:25:03.97\00:25:06.77
Religious liberty, I think,
is the only legitimate issue
00:25:06.80\00:25:09.44
for us. I could be wrong.
00:25:09.47\00:25:10.77
You might know of other issues
maybe we should be involved in,
00:25:10.81\00:25:13.11
but politics, don't
preach it from the pulpit.
00:25:13.14\00:25:15.38
That's the nations of the world,
and that's not who we represent.
00:25:15.41\00:25:19.05
It's not who we
represent. Don't do it.
00:25:19.08\00:25:21.72
And sadly, a lot of us are
becoming--we're falling to it.
00:25:21.75\00:25:26.09
And I hear it all
the time in church.
00:25:26.12\00:25:27.82
Stop it. We preach
Jesus. We preach Jesus.
00:25:27.86\00:25:31.86
>>Eric: You're never
going to fail with that.
00:25:31.89\00:25:33.56
Never going to fail with it.
00:25:33.60\00:25:35.00
Touch briefly on the sea
and the land, sea and the land.
00:25:35.03\00:25:39.00
We don't have
enough time, but touch it.
00:25:39.03\00:25:40.34
>>Shawn: Yeah, in one
minute, the sea and the land.
00:25:40.37\00:25:43.61
The sea is interesting.
00:25:43.64\00:25:44.94
John says there's no
more sea in the new earth,
00:25:44.97\00:25:46.61
and I've often looked at
that and said, "Well, you know,
00:25:46.64\00:25:50.01
the New Jerusalem is so big
it covers the Mediterranean."
00:25:50.05\00:25:52.41
Nah, not really.
00:25:52.45\00:25:54.52
He's separated from his
own people in Ephesus by a sea.
00:25:54.55\00:25:58.52
No more sea, no more separation.
00:25:58.55\00:26:00.06
Maybe, but in
Daniel's day, we know this.
00:26:00.09\00:26:03.73
The Jews thought of themselves
as an island of God's mercy
00:26:03.76\00:26:06.46
and grace in a sea
of Gentile nations.
00:26:06.49\00:26:09.10
It was a well-known symbol.
00:26:09.13\00:26:10.60
That's why in Daniel 7,
the sea is being whipped up,
00:26:10.63\00:26:13.54
and it's one Gentile nation
going to war against another.
00:26:13.57\00:26:16.84
When Israel asked to live
like pagans and have a king,
00:26:16.87\00:26:19.34
those start
coming up on the shore.
00:26:19.37\00:26:21.34
Every one of those
animals comes up on the shore,
00:26:21.38\00:26:23.08
and Israel has to
live under their thumb.
00:26:23.11\00:26:25.41
When the Bible says,
"No more sea," the nations
00:26:25.45\00:26:27.75
of this earth are
finished. They're done.
00:26:27.78\00:26:31.75
No more warfare, no more strife,
no more living under the thumb
00:26:31.79\00:26:35.16
of godless people who
are interested in self.
00:26:35.19\00:26:38.36
There's my view of the sea.
00:26:38.39\00:26:40.30
Israel, an island
in a sea of nations.
00:26:40.33\00:26:42.40
The sea was a
common illustration
00:26:42.43\00:26:44.47
they used for Gentiles.
00:26:44.50\00:26:46.43
>>Eric: So there is
hope. >>Shawn: Oh yeah.
00:26:46.47\00:26:48.27
>>Eric: There's
plenty to hope for.
00:26:48.30\00:26:49.77
>>Shawn: "Peace, be
still." Sea gets quiet.
00:26:49.80\00:26:52.11
>>Eric: Beautiful.
Something to look forward to.
00:26:52.14\00:26:54.11
And the truth is, we don't have
too much longer before we get to
00:26:54.14\00:26:57.95
see the reality of
that, the fulfillment of that.
00:26:57.98\00:27:00.38
As we see what's happening
in the world today, you can look
00:27:00.42\00:27:02.58
at Matthew, chapter 24, you
can look at the wars and rumors
00:27:02.62\00:27:06.29
of wars and the famines and
pestilences and earthquakes,
00:27:06.32\00:27:08.69
and you can get depressed
and discouraged, if you choose.
00:27:08.72\00:27:11.66
But that's not why
Jesus gives us that picture.
00:27:11.69\00:27:14.03
He says, "If you see
all these things happening,
00:27:14.10\00:27:16.13
know that I am
near, even at the doors."
00:27:16.16\00:27:18.83
And the truth is,
that's where He is.
00:27:18.87\00:27:20.74
He is near, even at the doors.
00:27:20.77\00:27:24.01
So, "Look up, and lift up
your head"--and your eyes--
00:27:24.04\00:27:27.44
because "your
redemption draweth nigh."
00:27:27.48\00:27:29.38
We're going to continue looking
at the prophecies of the Bible
00:27:29.41\00:27:32.01
and how we can better understand
them as we continue this journey
00:27:32.05\00:27:36.08
through this quarter's
"Sabbath School" lesson.
00:27:36.12\00:27:38.09
We look forward to
seeing you again next week here
00:27:38.12\00:27:40.49
on "Sabbath School,"
brought to you by It Is Written.
00:27:40.52\00:27:43.29
¤¤¤
00:27:43.32\00:27:48.30
¤¤¤
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