>> Welcome to It Is Written
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Canada.
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Thank you for joining us in
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beautiful Kelowna, British
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Columbia.
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Our special guest again is Don
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Straub, a practising clinical
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counsellor who helps people
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struggling with everyday
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problems by giving them
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powerful, practical solutions.
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>> Don is going to look at how
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to let go of deep hurt.
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Don, welcome again to It Is
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Written Canada.
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>> Thank you very much.
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>> Don, talk to us about deep
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hurt and forgiveness.
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>> Most of us have experienced
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deep hurt at some time in our
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life, we maybe have been
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betrayed, lied to, cheated on,
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sexually molested, maybe
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ripped off financially.
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It's difficult and sometimes
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these deep hurts come at the
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hands of people that we trust
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and love the most like a
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parent or a partner or a
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sibling, sometimes even a
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church leader.
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When I was pastoring, I found
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that there was so many people
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that would come and they would
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leave the church because of
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some deep hurt by someone else
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in the church.
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These are always difficult
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things to deal with and
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getting people to forgive.
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>> Don, have you had any
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personal experiences in your
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life of deep hurt and found it
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difficult to forgive?
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>> I think, fortunately, I
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haven't had too many deep hurt
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experiences in my lifetime
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until I did have one.
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So until then I found it quite
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easy, quite natural to forgive
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but when I was really deeply
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hurt at one time in my life
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which I'm not gonna go into
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today, it's in my book, I had
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extremely difficult time
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forgiving, in fact it wasn't
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until I was taking my masters
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degree in clinical counselling
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that I researched my way into
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forgiveness for these people
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because in that study, the
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things that I studied, I came
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across some really interesting
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things about forgiveness and
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what it is.
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And so now as a counsellor I
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have a lot more empathy than I
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did as a pastor towards people
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that find it impossible to
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forgive and now as a
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counsellor I help them to
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forgive because it actually is
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the cure to many of the mental
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illnesses such as depression
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and anxiety and even bulimia
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and anorexia.
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>> Isn't it just a simple
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decision that we make?
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I mean, the Bible tells us to
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forgive so it's kind of a
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command so we make the choice
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and then we forgive.
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[DON] It is a choice, but what
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I learned was it's not that
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one-step choice that so many
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of us as Christians think.
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It's actually a process, it's
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a journey, it's a process of
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letting go and it's a-- it
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takes sometimes years to
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finally get towards the end of
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that process.
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We're not God, we're not
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perfect, we don't perfectly
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forgive and just
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instantaneously.
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It is a process, often a
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life-long process.
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>> Why is it so difficult for
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some people to forgive?
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>> The reason, I believe, is
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because of a lack of
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information, a lack of what
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forgiveness is and what
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forgiveness is not
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can be confusing.
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I learned about forgiveness in
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a deeper way through a
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psychologist by the name of
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Robert Enright.
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Enright, who was around in the
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70's doing research on
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forgiveness, started this
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process, he even founded the
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International Forgiveness
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Organization, which actually
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has annual conferences, if you
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can believe it.
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I think a little bit of
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history would be helpful here
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because there seems to be, and
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has been historically, kind of
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a rift between religion
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and psychology.
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It's because when psychology
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started, it started by people
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by Sigmund Freud and these
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early psychologists were very
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anti-religion, they would say
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that religion was the cause of
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almost all mental illnesses.
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And so, obviously, Christians
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distanced themselves from the
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world of psychology.
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But somewhere in the early
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70's, psychology became more
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of a science, like the other
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sciences, in which people
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would do double-blind studies
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to see exactly what did help
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people and what didn't help
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people, right?
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And that's where Enright came
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into play during the 70's.
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And during those years, they
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did some research and
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discovered this: that those
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people who believe in an
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accepting, loving,
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non-judgmental God had the
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least amount of mental illness
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and get this: those people who
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believed in a judgmental,
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vindictive, angry God had the
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highest rate of mental illness,
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even higher than people who
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did not believe in God at all.
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>> So it's really important
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for us to have a clear picture
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and understanding about the
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character of God.
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[DON] And that's what I love
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to share with people wherever
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I can.
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So Enright went on and he
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developed some scientific ways
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of studying forgiveness.
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I'm not gonna go into detail
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here, I do more in my book,
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but basically when you do
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scientific studies, you have
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to have what we call an
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"operational definition,"
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that way you can measure
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forgiveness.
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So we had to come up with a
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definition of forgiveness that
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could be measured.
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To keep it short, basically he
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measures forgiveness through a
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person's thoughts, feelings,
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and behaviours towards the
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person that injured them.
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And by putting this into a
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numerical system he can
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measure forgiveness before
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therapy and after therapy.
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I do this with a lot of my
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clients, I will measure their
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level of forgiveness using
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Enright's instrument before we
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do the therapy and then after
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the therapy, do it again, and
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their forgiveness goes up and
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their mental health issues
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go down.
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So it's quite amazing,
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quite scientific.
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You need to know that most of
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my clients do not come to me
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with a Christian background or
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any faith at all and yet at
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the same time, I can use
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forgiveness therapy.
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Enright discovered that every
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world religion has the concept
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of forgiveness and even
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atheists kind of understand
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the concept.
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So I can teach forgiveness
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even to atheists.
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Now it's really helpful when I
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have Christian clients because
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then I can draw on the
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examples of Jesus who is the
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ultimate Forgiver and how He's
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forgiven us.
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But with others, I don't have
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that advantage, but I can
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still help people forgive and
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through that process find
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healing with their problems.
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>> So, Don, what is Enright's
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definition of forgiveness?
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>> I'm gonna read that from my
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book here 'cause it's a very
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technical definition.
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Enright basically says it this
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way: "Forgiveness is a"
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>> Whoa, that's a lot to take
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in, Don, I wonder if you could
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please break that down for us?
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[DON] It is a lot, so let's
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kinda take it like this:
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it's a willingness and that
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comes back to the idea that
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it's a choice.
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It's our free choice to
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forgive or not.
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What we're doing is we're
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choosing to let go of anger,
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resentment, judgment, all of
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this stuff, even though we
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have a right to be angry.
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Remember anger is an
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appropriate emotion when
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there's an injustice.
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The problem with that is that
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it's an action signal to
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protect yourself or those you
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love in the moment, but years
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later it serves no purpose
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anymore.
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So even though we have a right
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to be angry, we choose to let
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go of our anger towards the
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person that injured us and
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then that's only half way.
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The other half says, "And move"
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"towards love, compassion,"
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"generosity to this person"
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"even though they don't"
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"deserve it."
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And when I think about that,
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isn't that kind of what God's
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forgiveness is?
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Really, He has a right to be
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angry, there's an injustice,
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right?
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It's very normal, it's very
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natural to-- it's appropriate
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to be angered at injustice,
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but He chooses to move from
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His anger towards forgiveness,
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love, and compassion.
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But God does it naturally and
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freely, spontaneously even,
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'cause that's His character.
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I use a metaphor.
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Let's say that over here on
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this side of the street is a
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house and this is the house of
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anger and bitterness and
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resentment and rumination and
00:10:02.30\00:10:04.53
revenge, thoughts of revenge,
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and this is where I'm living.
00:10:06.74\00:10:08.57
I'm living in this house and
00:10:08.57\00:10:10.47
it's not a comfortable, fun
00:10:10.47\00:10:12.47
place to live, it's a very
00:10:12.47\00:10:14.04
painful place to live.
00:10:14.04\00:10:16.81
On this side of the street is
00:10:16.81\00:10:18.35
another house.
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It is a house of love and
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compassion, generosity, this
00:10:21.65\00:10:24.02
is a beautiful place to live,
00:10:24.02\00:10:25.89
a wonderful place to live.
00:10:25.89\00:10:28.36
If I choose to live in this
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house then this is my choice
00:10:29.79\00:10:31.69
to live with this pain, but I
00:10:31.69\00:10:33.83
can choose to move from this
00:10:33.83\00:10:35.83
house into this house.
00:10:35.83\00:10:38.67
But like anybody who knows,
00:10:38.67\00:10:40.00
when they move houses it's not
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a [snap] snap your fingers.
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Wouldn't it be nice?
00:10:42.94\00:10:44.07
Pictures on the walls,
00:10:44.07\00:10:45.37
everything in the cupboards,
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[snaps fingers] just like that.
00:10:46.44\00:10:47.51
It doesn't work that way.
00:10:47.51\00:10:48.78
I move into this house one box
00:10:48.78\00:10:50.38
at a time, maybe one piece of
00:10:50.38\00:10:51.75
furniture at a time.
00:10:51.75\00:10:53.28
Maybe sometimes those boxes
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don't make it all the way
00:10:54.68\00:10:56.08
there, maybe they end up in
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the middle of the street.
00:10:57.55\00:10:58.99
The street represents a
00:10:58.99\00:11:00.59
neutral place; I'm not angry,
00:11:00.59\00:11:02.32
but I'm not really loving or
00:11:02.32\00:11:03.83
compassionate either, right?
00:11:03.83\00:11:05.69
The ultimate thing of
00:11:05.69\00:11:07.13
forgiveness is to move from
00:11:07.13\00:11:09.00
this place completely to
00:11:09.00\00:11:10.47
this place.
00:11:10.47\00:11:11.73
Now, like I said, that is a
00:11:11.73\00:11:12.90
process, sometimes a life-long
00:11:12.90\00:11:14.44
process, but it's a wonderful
00:11:14.44\00:11:16.20
process.
00:11:16.20\00:11:17.54
But here's the truth: I have
00:11:17.54\00:11:20.58
the key to that house, the key
00:11:20.58\00:11:23.65
that unlocks my prison, sets
00:11:23.65\00:11:26.11
me free and opens up this
00:11:26.11\00:11:29.95
house, forgiveness is that key
00:11:29.95\00:11:32.65
that I hold.
00:11:32.65\00:11:33.96
>> But, Don, don't you have to
00:11:35.19\00:11:36.96
tell the person that you are
00:11:36.96\00:11:38.53
forgiving that you have
00:11:38.53\00:11:40.36
forgiven them?
00:11:40.36\00:11:42.06
[DON] No, you don't really,
00:11:42.06\00:11:43.26
because it's not about that
00:11:43.26\00:11:44.87
person, it's about yourself,
00:11:44.87\00:11:46.90
you're the one carrying the
00:11:46.90\00:11:48.27
pain, you're the one letting
00:11:48.27\00:11:49.50
go of the hurt and the pain.
00:11:49.50\00:11:51.31
This person might be dead,
00:11:51.31\00:11:52.94
they might be living somewhere
00:11:52.94\00:11:54.24
that you can't even find them,
00:11:54.24\00:11:55.68
they may not even think
00:11:55.68\00:11:57.01
they've hurt you or they may
00:11:57.01\00:11:58.85
be glad that they've hurt you.
00:11:58.85\00:12:00.92
So it's about you letting go
00:12:00.92\00:12:02.75
of your own pain, releasing
00:12:02.75\00:12:04.29
yourself from your own prison.
00:12:04.29\00:12:06.12
This is where I think we need
00:12:06.12\00:12:07.36
to talk about what forgiveness
00:12:07.36\00:12:08.79
is not now that we've looked
00:12:08.79\00:12:10.36
at what it is, moving from
00:12:10.36\00:12:11.93
anger to love, what is it not?
00:12:11.93\00:12:14.10
Number one, it's not
00:12:14.10\00:12:15.50
forgetting, you know, people
00:12:15.50\00:12:17.10
say, "Forgive and forget."
00:12:17.10\00:12:18.20
You can't forget,
00:12:18.20\00:12:19.07
that's impossible.
00:12:19.07\00:12:20.87
Number two, forgiveness does
00:12:20.87\00:12:22.94
not condone, excuse, justify,
00:12:22.94\00:12:25.24
to say it's OK, not at all.
00:12:25.24\00:12:27.34
If it was excusable or
00:12:27.34\00:12:29.24
justifiable, you wouldn't
00:12:29.24\00:12:30.38
need to forgive.
00:12:30.38\00:12:31.58
The next thing is forgiveness
00:12:32.85\00:12:34.72
does not mean you can't have
00:12:34.72\00:12:36.18
justice.
00:12:36.18\00:12:37.22
Absolutely, if someone has
00:12:37.82\00:12:39.79
raped somebody, there needs to
00:12:39.79\00:12:41.32
be justice, we need to keep
00:12:41.32\00:12:42.89
this person away from society
00:12:42.89\00:12:44.49
so they don't go hurting
00:12:44.49\00:12:45.63
someone else.
00:12:45.63\00:12:46.76
You see, sometimes we can have
00:12:47.23\00:12:48.46
forgiveness and justice,
00:12:48.46\00:12:51.73
sometimes we can have
00:12:51.73\00:12:52.87
forgiveness and mercy.
00:12:52.87\00:12:54.74
So mercy does not always have
00:12:54.74\00:12:56.27
to go hand-in-hand with
00:12:56.27\00:12:57.51
forgiveness.
00:12:57.51\00:12:58.84
Now, with God it seems to go
00:12:58.84\00:12:59.87
hand-in-hand, He has
00:12:59.87\00:13:01.94
forgiveness and mercy for us.
00:13:01.94\00:13:04.75
Forgiveness is also not
00:13:04.75\00:13:06.78
trusting, that's a whole
00:13:06.78\00:13:08.52
different process.
00:13:08.52\00:13:09.95
Some people can't be trusted.
00:13:09.95\00:13:13.69
Some people are too dangerous,
00:13:13.69\00:13:15.22
too toxic to trust, you have
00:13:15.22\00:13:16.93
to earn trust, trust has to be
00:13:16.93\00:13:18.36
earned so you don't have to
00:13:18.36\00:13:19.59
rush back and start trusting
00:13:19.59\00:13:20.76
this person.
00:13:20.76\00:13:21.56
No, you don't.
00:13:21.56\00:13:22.53
They have to earn that and
00:13:22.53\00:13:23.93
that takes experience over
00:13:23.93\00:13:24.97
time and that may never
00:13:24.97\00:13:26.03
even happen.
00:13:26.03\00:13:27.44
And the last thing is that
00:13:27.44\00:13:28.54
forgiveness is not
00:13:28.54\00:13:29.90
reconciliation.
00:13:29.90\00:13:31.74
Now reconciliation is a
00:13:31.74\00:13:33.21
wonderful thing, it's another
00:13:33.21\00:13:36.14
thing though, it's separate
00:13:36.14\00:13:38.01
from forgiveness.
00:13:38.01\00:13:39.25
In fact, before you can
00:13:39.25\00:13:40.88
reconcile, forgiveness has to
00:13:40.88\00:13:42.45
be the first step.
00:13:42.45\00:13:44.05
But reconciliation may not
00:13:44.05\00:13:45.79
happen because some people are
00:13:45.79\00:13:47.32
too dangerous, too toxic to
00:13:47.32\00:13:49.06
build a relationship with,
00:13:49.06\00:13:51.23
some people don't wanna have
00:13:51.23\00:13:53.36
reconciliation.
00:13:53.36\00:13:54.73
It takes two people working
00:13:54.73\00:13:56.70
together to work on this
00:13:56.70\00:13:59.57
reconciliation process.
00:13:59.57\00:14:01.57
[RENÉ] So, Don, is there
00:14:02.80\00:14:04.24
anything more that you can
00:14:04.24\00:14:05.71
tell us about you as a
00:14:05.71\00:14:07.88
counsellor facilitate this
00:14:07.88\00:14:10.18
whole process of forgiveness
00:14:10.18\00:14:12.25
with your clients?
00:14:12.25\00:14:14.35
>> Yes, you see, there's a
00:14:14.35\00:14:15.72
whole lot more to forgiveness
00:14:15.72\00:14:16.85
than just the simple act
00:14:16.85\00:14:18.15
of forgiving.
00:14:18.15\00:14:19.65
Remember we're talking today
00:14:19.65\00:14:20.89
about deep hurt.
00:14:20.89\00:14:24.59
So what-- it's complicated
00:14:24.59\00:14:26.53
because when people are hurt
00:14:26.53\00:14:28.36
that means they've been
00:14:28.36\00:14:29.86
possibly deeply traumatized.
00:14:29.86\00:14:32.70
And like in previous episodes
00:14:32.70\00:14:34.57
I've talked about how core
00:14:34.57\00:14:36.91
wounds are the root of all the
00:14:36.91\00:14:39.87
shame and the anger and are
00:14:39.87\00:14:43.81
self-defeating behaviours or
00:14:43.81\00:14:45.31
sins, right?
00:14:45.31\00:14:46.55
So I want to heal the
00:14:46.55\00:14:47.68
whole person.
00:14:47.68\00:14:49.35
And so I titled that iceberg
00:14:49.35\00:14:51.35
model, like, it's in my book,
00:14:51.35\00:14:52.99
it's titled, "Freedom Through"
00:14:52.99\00:14:54.72
"Forgiveness" because
00:14:54.72\00:14:56.59
forgiveness has to do with
00:14:56.59\00:14:58.49
dealing with the trauma, also
00:14:58.49\00:15:01.03
dealing with the negative
00:15:01.03\00:15:02.56
beliefs that we come to
00:15:02.56\00:15:03.97
believe about ourselves, the
00:15:03.97\00:15:05.13
lies that we come to believe
00:15:05.13\00:15:06.33
about ourselves due to this
00:15:06.33\00:15:07.97
act of trauma, and the shame
00:15:07.97\00:15:10.74
that we carry, letting go of
00:15:10.74\00:15:12.31
that shame, so it's a process.
00:15:12.31\00:15:14.78
So we have-- as a trauma
00:15:14.78\00:15:16.68
counsellor, I have some very
00:15:16.68\00:15:19.05
special therapies that I use
00:15:19.05\00:15:20.88
to heal trauma.
00:15:20.88\00:15:22.88
And then of course that
00:15:22.88\00:15:24.69
therapy actually changes a
00:15:24.69\00:15:26.22
person's feeling belief
00:15:26.22\00:15:28.09
simultaneously.
00:15:28.09\00:15:30.39
Like I said, I had very much
00:15:30.39\00:15:32.19
difficulty forgiving some
00:15:32.19\00:15:33.93
people that hurt me deeply.
00:15:33.93\00:15:35.93
And intellectually and the
00:15:35.93\00:15:37.70
best I could up here, I did
00:15:37.70\00:15:39.70
forgive and let go of my anger.
00:15:39.70\00:15:44.17
However, in addition to that
00:15:44.17\00:15:48.54
part of the hurt, I carried
00:15:48.54\00:15:51.18
this trauma in my body.
00:15:51.18\00:15:53.11
So if I would meet one of
00:15:53.11\00:15:55.05
these people or go into a
00:15:55.05\00:15:56.89
building where they were also
00:15:56.89\00:15:58.95
there, my heart would race,
00:15:58.95\00:16:01.66
and I would get triggered and
00:16:01.66\00:16:03.69
I would feel pain in my body,
00:16:03.69\00:16:05.43
it's that memory playing in my
00:16:05.43\00:16:07.23
body, I couldn't get rid
00:16:07.23\00:16:08.43
of that.
00:16:08.43\00:16:09.83
Well, someone told me about
00:16:09.83\00:16:11.27
trauma therapy and a
00:16:11.27\00:16:12.93
counsellor here in Kelowna
00:16:12.93\00:16:14.37
that could help me and I went
00:16:14.37\00:16:15.74
to that person and within
00:16:15.74\00:16:17.24
minutes it was gone.
00:16:17.24\00:16:19.67
And I said to myself, "Don,"
00:16:19.67\00:16:21.84
"you gotta get trained in"
00:16:21.84\00:16:23.04
"this type of therapy," and
00:16:23.04\00:16:24.38
four years later I was able to
00:16:24.38\00:16:25.81
get the training, but it was
00:16:25.81\00:16:27.48
an amazing-- it was just
00:16:27.48\00:16:29.18
amazing to not just forgive,
00:16:29.18\00:16:30.89
but to lose that pain in my
00:16:30.89\00:16:33.76
body, that trauma pain.
00:16:33.76\00:16:36.09
I think a little illustration
00:16:36.09\00:16:37.33
might be a little better for
00:16:37.33\00:16:38.69
people to understand.
00:16:38.69\00:16:40.60
Like, let's just say that I am
00:16:40.60\00:16:43.00
in a car accident and the car
00:16:43.00\00:16:45.80
accident was caused by another
00:16:45.80\00:16:47.84
person who broke some rules of
00:16:47.84\00:16:50.31
driving, it was their fault,
00:16:50.31\00:16:52.24
so to speak.
00:16:52.24\00:16:53.81
And let's say that during this
00:16:53.81\00:16:56.11
accident I injured my back
00:16:56.11\00:16:58.65
and I have now a permanent
00:16:58.65\00:17:00.48
back pain.
00:17:00.48\00:17:01.85
So the first thing might be to
00:17:03.08\00:17:05.19
forgive this person, but that
00:17:05.19\00:17:06.82
might be extremely difficult
00:17:06.82\00:17:08.26
to do.
00:17:08.26\00:17:09.66
I'm suffering the consequences
00:17:09.66\00:17:12.29
of this person's act.
00:17:12.29\00:17:14.93
So-- but I teach and I help my
00:17:14.93\00:17:17.10
clients to forgive, but in
00:17:17.10\00:17:19.53
addition to that, there's the
00:17:19.53\00:17:21.07
back pain.
00:17:21.07\00:17:22.47
That I can't help with.
00:17:22.47\00:17:23.97
Most of the time, that's
00:17:23.97\00:17:25.37
something that the doctors and
00:17:25.37\00:17:27.14
other professionals work with.
00:17:27.14\00:17:28.98
But as a counsellor
00:17:28.98\00:17:30.68
professional, I can work with
00:17:30.68\00:17:31.88
another aspect.
00:17:31.88\00:17:33.65
Let's say not only do I have
00:17:33.65\00:17:34.88
the back pain from that
00:17:34.88\00:17:36.45
accident, but now I have a
00:17:36.45\00:17:37.89
fear of driving in a car, it's
00:17:37.89\00:17:39.89
just too much for me to get
00:17:39.89\00:17:41.36
into a car, my heart races, I
00:17:41.36\00:17:43.32
sweat, I hang on for dear
00:17:43.32\00:17:45.46
life, it is painful to ride in
00:17:45.46\00:17:47.36
a moving vehicle because of
00:17:47.36\00:17:48.86
that trauma.
00:17:48.86\00:17:50.10
Well, this special trauma
00:17:50.10\00:17:52.10
therapy that I can put people
00:17:52.10\00:17:53.84
through erases those feelings,
00:17:53.84\00:17:56.64
basically neutralizes them,
00:17:56.64\00:17:58.24
and people can ride in a car
00:17:58.24\00:18:00.04
again and not feel that way.
00:18:00.04\00:18:02.01
So it's more complicated than
00:18:02.01\00:18:03.38
just forgiving when it comes
00:18:03.38\00:18:04.91
to counselling and trauma and
00:18:04.91\00:18:06.25
hurt, deep hurt.
00:18:06.25\00:18:07.85
>> Don, we are told that God
00:18:08.62\00:18:12.62
forgives us.
00:18:12.62\00:18:14.59
How come it's so difficult
00:18:15.86\00:18:17.86
for some people to really
00:18:17.86\00:18:20.16
believe that?
00:18:20.16\00:18:22.03
>> It is true, you know, we
00:18:23.30\00:18:25.33
can even know in our heads
00:18:25.33\00:18:27.60
that God forgives us, but in
00:18:27.60\00:18:30.37
our hearts, we can't forgive
00:18:30.37\00:18:32.81
ourselves.
00:18:32.81\00:18:34.08
Until I came across that in my
00:18:35.14\00:18:37.05
research taking my masters in
00:18:37.05\00:18:38.68
counselling, I never thought
00:18:38.68\00:18:40.25
about self-forgiveness, I
00:18:40.25\00:18:41.92
never thought it was a thing.
00:18:41.92\00:18:44.29
But it is a thing and the
00:18:44.29\00:18:46.39
whole idea works like this:
00:18:46.39\00:18:49.22
if someone hurts me, I become
00:18:49.22\00:18:50.96
angry at them for what they
00:18:50.96\00:18:52.63
did to me and my forgiveness
00:18:52.63\00:18:54.86
lets go of my anger towards
00:18:54.86\00:18:56.90
them and now I'm free of that
00:18:56.90\00:18:59.23
anger and I have love and
00:18:59.23\00:19:00.87
generosity for this person as
00:19:00.87\00:19:02.40
a child of God.
00:19:02.40\00:19:03.94
But what happens when I
00:19:03.94\00:19:06.14
hurt somebody?
00:19:06.14\00:19:07.74
I know God forgives me, but I
00:19:08.41\00:19:10.21
can't forgive myself.
00:19:10.21\00:19:12.01
So what am I doing?
00:19:12.01\00:19:13.68
I am carrying all this anger
00:19:13.68\00:19:15.72
towards myself day in and day
00:19:15.72\00:19:19.12
out, and that anger is eating
00:19:19.12\00:19:20.76
me up, it's causing me
00:19:20.76\00:19:22.46
depression and anxiety, it's
00:19:22.46\00:19:24.59
causing me to be angry at
00:19:24.59\00:19:25.83
other people 'cause this
00:19:25.83\00:19:27.03
spills out on other people,
00:19:27.03\00:19:28.20
it's toxic, this stuff.
00:19:28.20\00:19:30.00
So I need to let go of my own
00:19:30.00\00:19:32.17
anger towards myself and
00:19:32.17\00:19:35.60
that's self-forgiveness, you
00:19:35.60\00:19:37.01
see, and that's often
00:19:37.01\00:19:38.74
something that people have
00:19:38.74\00:19:39.97
never thought of and they-- I
00:19:39.97\00:19:41.48
find that people have the
00:19:41.48\00:19:42.91
hardest time forgiving
00:19:42.91\00:19:44.65
themselves than anything else.
00:19:44.65\00:19:47.12
When I was in my early college
00:19:48.02\00:19:49.52
years, I had this huge
00:19:49.52\00:19:52.19
spiritual experience and what
00:19:52.19\00:19:54.39
really helped me solidify that
00:19:54.39\00:19:56.36
spiritual experience was a
00:19:56.36\00:19:58.16
pastor, Morris Venden, who has
00:19:58.16\00:19:59.86
passed away now, he came to
00:19:59.86\00:20:01.36
our college campus and he did
00:20:01.36\00:20:02.66
a series of meetings.
00:20:02.66\00:20:03.97
In those meetings, I clearly
00:20:03.97\00:20:05.70
remember a parable that he
00:20:05.70\00:20:07.34
told, I keep using it with
00:20:07.34\00:20:08.94
people over and over again
00:20:08.94\00:20:10.27
through the years.
00:20:10.27\00:20:11.87
He called it "The Parable of"
00:20:11.87\00:20:13.27
"the Cadillacs," but, you know,
00:20:13.27\00:20:15.48
I prefer Tesla, I will never
00:20:15.48\00:20:17.28
be able to afford one, and I
00:20:17.28\00:20:19.08
know they're not sold in car
00:20:19.08\00:20:20.88
dealerships, but I'm gonna
00:20:20.88\00:20:22.82
use the word, "Tesla."
00:20:22.82\00:20:24.42
So let's just say that one day
00:20:24.42\00:20:26.05
I'm reading the newspaper and
00:20:26.05\00:20:27.56
there's an advertisement and
00:20:27.56\00:20:29.02
it says, "Five free Tesla"
00:20:29.02\00:20:32.56
"will be given away to the"
00:20:32.56\00:20:33.96
"first five people through"
00:20:33.96\00:20:35.50
"our doors Monday morning."
00:20:35.50\00:20:37.00
And I go, "Wow!"
00:20:37.00\00:20:38.93
So I take my sleeping bag and
00:20:38.93\00:20:40.50
I go down to the dealership
00:20:40.50\00:20:42.07
early in the afternoon the day
00:20:42.07\00:20:43.37
before and I plant myself at
00:20:43.37\00:20:45.27
the front door.
00:20:45.27\00:20:47.34
Next morning I'm awake and I'm
00:20:47.34\00:20:49.04
the first one to go through
00:20:49.04\00:20:50.75
that door and my Tesla is in
00:20:50.75\00:20:52.41
my hands.
00:20:52.41\00:20:54.18
And then I start looking at
00:20:54.18\00:20:55.75
who the other four people are
00:20:55.75\00:20:57.55
that are gonna get a free
00:20:57.55\00:20:59.05
Tesla and low and behold I
00:20:59.05\00:21:00.62
know these people.
00:21:00.62\00:21:02.26
Whoa, there's some real
00:21:02.26\00:21:04.16
hypocrites, terrible
00:21:04.16\00:21:05.99
hypocrites in the community
00:21:05.99\00:21:07.50
and I start thinking about
00:21:07.50\00:21:08.90
those hypocrites and the
00:21:08.90\00:21:10.37
angrier I get, the more I
00:21:10.37\00:21:11.83
think about them the angrier I
00:21:11.83\00:21:13.47
get and I say, "If that's the"
00:21:13.47\00:21:14.90
"kind of people they're gonna"
00:21:14.90\00:21:16.14
"give a free Tesla to, I don't"
00:21:16.14\00:21:17.57
"want one," and I pick up my
00:21:17.57\00:21:18.81
sleeping bag and go home.
00:21:18.81\00:21:20.11
And I'm sad to say that's how
00:21:22.21\00:21:23.95
some people do it.
00:21:23.95\00:21:25.91
They focus on the hypocrites
00:21:25.91\00:21:27.55
in the church and they focus
00:21:27.55\00:21:29.28
on them so much they just say,
00:21:29.28\00:21:31.42
"Well, if that's the kind of"
00:21:31.42\00:21:32.55
"people that go to this"
00:21:32.55\00:21:33.99
"church, I'm not coming," and
00:21:33.99\00:21:35.19
I pack up and go home.
00:21:35.19\00:21:36.73
And, unfortunately, under the
00:21:36.73\00:21:38.03
same breath they often say not
00:21:38.03\00:21:39.76
just "Goodbye, church," but
00:21:39.76\00:21:41.26
"Goodbye, God."
00:21:41.26\00:21:42.63
Don't let the hypocrites keep
00:21:44.07\00:21:46.03
you away from God.
00:21:46.03\00:21:47.50
That's the message.
00:21:47.50\00:21:48.67
Don't let them keep you away
00:21:48.67\00:21:50.11
from God.
00:21:50.11\00:21:51.57
I like to think of the church
00:21:51.57\00:21:53.11
as a hospital for sick people
00:21:53.11\00:21:55.08
and if we can keep that
00:21:55.08\00:21:56.61
perspective in mind,
00:21:56.61\00:21:58.68
things can go better.
00:21:58.68\00:22:00.08
>> What about God?
00:22:02.08\00:22:04.29
Didn't Jesus reconcile us to
00:22:04.29\00:22:06.99
God on the cross?
00:22:06.99\00:22:09.29
>> Well, let's look at it this
00:22:09.29\00:22:10.66
way: both the life of Jesus
00:22:10.66\00:22:13.46
and the death of Jesus were
00:22:13.46\00:22:16.06
God's initiation or steps
00:22:16.06\00:22:19.47
towards reconciliation.
00:22:19.47\00:22:22.54
He did everything He could
00:22:22.54\00:22:25.47
to set the stage for
00:22:25.47\00:22:26.88
reconciliation.
00:22:26.88\00:22:28.38
But remember, reconciliation
00:22:28.38\00:22:30.28
requires two and so now it's
00:22:30.28\00:22:33.42
my part, I need to respond to
00:22:33.42\00:22:36.62
that invitation, God wants to
00:22:36.62\00:22:38.22
be my friend, it's my role now
00:22:38.22\00:22:40.06
to be reconciled to God,
00:22:40.06\00:22:43.02
accept His forgiveness, accept
00:22:43.02\00:22:44.99
His grace, and accept that
00:22:44.99\00:22:47.46
wonderful friendship that He
00:22:47.46\00:22:49.03
wants with me.
00:22:49.03\00:22:50.87
As we've always been saying,
00:22:50.87\00:22:52.73
God has chosen to run His
00:22:52.73\00:22:54.20
universe on the law of freedom
00:22:54.20\00:22:56.07
and love and the result of
00:22:56.07\00:22:58.51
freedom has been a lot of pain
00:22:58.51\00:23:00.08
in this world, a lot of
00:23:00.08\00:23:01.68
suffering.
00:23:01.68\00:23:03.08
And what I see the cross as is
00:23:03.08\00:23:05.08
where God takes responsibility
00:23:05.08\00:23:07.65
for the sin in this world.
00:23:07.65\00:23:09.38
The cross teaches us three
00:23:10.52\00:23:13.05
things; number one: sin kills.
00:23:13.05\00:23:17.53
It's the natural consequence
00:23:17.53\00:23:19.83
of sin, we die due to sin.
00:23:19.83\00:23:22.56
Number two: God loves us.
00:23:24.03\00:23:26.30
He loves us infinitely, more
00:23:27.67\00:23:29.84
than we can imagine;
00:23:29.84\00:23:31.37
"For God so loved the world"
00:23:31.37\00:23:32.81
"that He gave..."
00:23:32.81\00:23:34.34
And three: the cross teaches
00:23:34.34\00:23:36.58
us our value and our worth.
00:23:36.58\00:23:39.38
We are worth the life and the
00:23:39.38\00:23:41.42
death of God Himself.
00:23:41.42\00:23:44.39
That's how He values us.
00:23:44.39\00:23:46.39
Now comes reconciliation.
00:23:48.76\00:23:51.86
Remember the life and the
00:23:51.86\00:23:53.83
death of Jesus was His way of
00:23:53.83\00:23:58.30
initiating this process of
00:23:58.30\00:24:00.44
friendship and reconciliation.
00:24:00.44\00:24:03.30
Now it's our choice, it takes
00:24:03.30\00:24:06.24
two, our choice to enter into
00:24:06.24\00:24:09.08
this friendship, to accept His
00:24:09.08\00:24:10.45
salvation, to accept His
00:24:10.45\00:24:11.81
friendship in this
00:24:11.81\00:24:13.11
relationship.
00:24:13.11\00:24:14.12
You know, theologians have had
00:24:15.98\00:24:18.05
arguments for years over a
00:24:18.05\00:24:19.62
single word in the Bible, one
00:24:19.62\00:24:21.39
word, it's only found in one
00:24:21.39\00:24:22.72
place and it's the word,
00:24:22.72\00:24:23.69
"atonement."
00:24:23.69\00:24:25.53
And it's really not that hard
00:24:25.53\00:24:27.46
to understand.
00:24:27.46\00:24:29.33
The spelling is: AT-ONE-MENT.
00:24:29.33\00:24:34.27
Atonement is God's design for
00:24:34.27\00:24:37.44
us to be at one with Him
00:24:37.44\00:24:40.01
again, to be reconciled,
00:24:40.01\00:24:41.84
to be at one.
00:24:41.84\00:24:43.31
And this is what He says in my
00:24:44.35\00:24:47.55
favourite verse in the Bible...
00:24:47.55\00:24:48.82
Being one with God, being His
00:24:56.16\00:24:58.09
friend is His heart's desire
00:24:58.09\00:24:59.79
for us.
00:24:59.79\00:25:01.46
Let's make the illustration
00:25:01.46\00:25:03.16
this way, let's say that my
00:25:03.16\00:25:04.80
arms are full of firewood,
00:25:04.80\00:25:07.87
right up to my chin and I'm
00:25:07.87\00:25:09.37
struggling and along comes God
00:25:09.37\00:25:11.84
and He says, "Don, I wanna"
00:25:11.84\00:25:13.64
"give you something."
00:25:13.64\00:25:15.28
Now this firewood represents
00:25:15.28\00:25:17.11
my anger, my bitterness, my
00:25:17.11\00:25:19.71
rumination towards this
00:25:19.71\00:25:21.52
person, my thoughts of revenge
00:25:21.52\00:25:23.92
and says, God says, "Don,"
00:25:23.92\00:25:26.12
"drop the load 'cause I can't"
00:25:26.12\00:25:27.72
"give you peace and joy"
00:25:27.72\00:25:29.99
"and freedom."
00:25:29.99\00:25:31.76
He's commanding me to drop the
00:25:31.76\00:25:33.19
load so He can give me this
00:25:33.19\00:25:34.46
other stuff, this better stuff.
00:25:34.46\00:25:36.67
That's how I see God.
00:25:36.67\00:25:38.57
He's a God of freedom and love.
00:25:38.57\00:25:41.24
>> That's so beautiful.
00:25:41.24\00:25:43.64
Just to close on that note
00:25:43.64\00:25:45.74
that His commandment is to
00:25:45.74\00:25:48.31
give us something better, let
00:25:48.31\00:25:50.85
go of what you're holding onto.
00:25:50.85\00:25:53.08
>> And we hold the key.
00:25:53.08\00:25:54.82
It's called forgiveness.
00:25:54.82\00:25:56.42
>> Don, before we end, I
00:25:57.52\00:25:58.89
wonder if you could have a
00:25:58.89\00:25:59.89
word of prayer?
00:25:59.89\00:26:01.06
[DON] Sure.
00:26:01.06\00:26:02.16
Father God, I wanna thank You
00:26:03.29\00:26:06.16
for Your gift of forgiveness.
00:26:06.16\00:26:07.86
So many of us don't see it as
00:26:09.73\00:26:10.93
a gift because it seems so
00:26:10.93\00:26:12.47
hard to do and so painful.
00:26:12.47\00:26:14.20
But help us to understand this
00:26:15.37\00:26:16.87
process as we go through life
00:26:16.87\00:26:18.74
and to just let go and to find
00:26:18.74\00:26:20.51
that peace and joy that You
00:26:20.51\00:26:22.14
want to fill our hands with
00:26:22.14\00:26:24.21
and our lives with.
00:26:24.21\00:26:25.68
I pray all these things in
00:26:25.68\00:26:26.95
Jesus' name, amen.
00:26:26.95\00:26:28.38
>> Don, thank you so much for
00:26:30.02\00:26:31.82
sharing with us on It Is
00:26:31.82\00:26:33.52
Written Canada today.
00:26:33.52\00:26:35.66
>> You're very welcome.
00:26:35.66\00:26:36.79
Thank you.
00:26:36.79\00:26:37.69
>> Friends, forgiveness is a
00:26:39.49\00:26:41.33
willingness to abandon your
00:26:41.33\00:26:43.06
right to resentment, negative
00:26:43.06\00:26:45.03
judgment and indifferent
00:26:45.03\00:26:47.07
behaviour towards one who has
00:26:47.07\00:26:49.50
unjustly injured you while
00:26:49.50\00:26:52.41
fostering the undeserved
00:26:52.41\00:26:54.64
qualities of compassion,
00:26:54.64\00:26:56.38
generosity, and even love
00:26:56.38\00:26:58.55
toward him or her.
00:26:58.55\00:27:00.92
>> That is a very tall order
00:27:00.92\00:27:03.18
and we want to give you a
00:27:03.18\00:27:04.65
chance to learn more about how
00:27:04.65\00:27:07.09
forgiveness is possible by
00:27:07.09\00:27:09.06
sending you our free offer
00:27:09.06\00:27:10.86
today which is Don Straub's
00:27:10.86\00:27:12.83
book entitled, Bridges to
00:27:12.83\00:27:15.10
Freedom: Creating Change
00:27:15.10\00:27:17.00
Through Science and Christian
00:27:17.00\00:27:19.00
Spirituality.
00:27:19.00\00:27:20.40
>> You can move closer to the
00:27:20.40\00:27:22.37
Lord, get past your hurts and
00:27:22.37\00:27:24.77
learn life lessons with the
00:27:24.77\00:27:27.01
essential bridges to freedom
00:27:27.01\00:27:28.71
described in this book.
00:27:28.71\00:27:31.41
[MIKE] Before you go, we would
00:27:32.75\00:27:34.28
also like to invite you to
00:27:34.28\00:27:35.55
follow us on Instagram and
00:27:35.55\00:27:36.89
Facebook and subscribe to our
00:27:36.89\00:27:38.49
YouTube channel and also
00:27:38.49\00:27:40.92
listen to our Podcasts.
00:27:40.92\00:27:43.22
And if you go to our website,
00:27:43.22\00:27:45.13
you can see our latest
00:27:45.13\00:27:46.56
programs including our cooking
00:27:46.56\00:27:47.96
demonstrations, our short,
00:27:47.96\00:27:49.70
spiritual messages entitled,
00:27:49.70\00:27:51.57
Daily Living, and our exercise
00:27:51.57\00:27:53.74
workouts called,
00:27:53.74\00:27:55.34
Experiencing Life.
00:27:55.34\00:27:57.17
>> We want you to experience
00:27:58.14\00:28:00.08
the truth found in the words
00:28:00.08\00:28:01.71
of Jesus when He said, "It is"
00:28:01.71\00:28:04.15
"written, man shall not live"
00:28:04.15\00:28:06.65
"by bread alone, but by every"
00:28:06.65\00:28:09.18
"word that proceeds out of"
00:28:09.18\00:28:10.72
"the mouth of God."
00:28:10.72\00:28:12.99
¤¤
00:28:12.99\00:28:57.57