IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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IIW-2016-21 --- Designed with
purpose-It's All About the Genes
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It has stood the test of time.
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God's book, The Bible
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Still relevant in
today's complex world
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It Is Written
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Sharing messages of
hope around the world!
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CHRIS: Thank you so much for
choosing to watch It Is Written.
We are in the third part of a
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three-part series, "Designed
with Purpose." Did you know that
every cell starts out with long
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strands of deoxyribonucleic
acid? Now, we more commonly call
this huge molecule DNA. It is
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essential for life to exist, as
it serves as kind of a chemical
paper on which the plans for all
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our proteins, as well as much of
the other information necessary
for our bodies to exist. That
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information is divided into
units called genes. And if that
sounded confusing to you, here
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to help us sort it all out and
help us understand it and its
implications for our faith is
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Dr. Tim Standish. Dr. Standish,
thank you so much for joining
us. DR. STANDISH: Well, thank
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you so much for having me, and I
am excited to talk about genes.
CHRIS: Yes. You know, Dr.
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Standish, we've had a number of
times together. we've actually
known each other for quite
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awhile. We met 20 years ago at
Andrews University where you
were an associate professor of
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biology, and I was a student
studying theology. And your
career has taken you far and
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wide in many different places.
Before coming to Andrews, you
were an associate professor of
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biology at Union College there
in Lincoln, Nebraska. You have a
Ph.D. in environmental biology
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and public policy; a master's of
biology; and a bachelor's of
science in zoology. And now
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you're the senior scientist at
the Geoscience Research
Institute. And that sounded
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really big and confusing, and so
unravelling this confusion,
before we unravel the DNA
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confusion, let's kind of unravel
that confusion that I talked
about. What does all that mean?
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What do you do, Dr. Standish?
DR. STANDISH: You know,
sometimes I don't think I know
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what I do. But I listen to my
wife, and then I know
immediately. CHRIS: Yes, that's
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a good thing. DR. STANDISH: Now,
I work for the Geoscience
Research Institute. And this is
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an institute located in southern
California. We're interested in
how the Bible and the
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information that's recorded in
there, and science, interact
with one another. Most of the
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time, they're in complete
agreement. Sometimes, there's
some tension between the claims
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of science and the record of
Scripture. And that's where we
think, "You know what? There's
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something interesting to find
out there." CHRIS: And so you
spend a lot of time researching,
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exploring these tensions,
finding ways in which these
tensions can either be
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explained, or actually, maybe
they're not even a tension, or
maybe this tension is actually a
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complementary and intentional
tension. If somebody wanted to
read more about the things that
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the Geoscience Research
Institute is doing, if someone
wanted to read maybe some of the
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research papers that you have
written, where could they find
that information? DR.
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STANDISH: The best place to
start would be at the Geoscience
Research Institute website,
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which is just GRISDA.org. CHRIS:
Very good. So Dr. Standish, we
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opened the show talking about
DNA. So let's just begin very
basically. What is DNA? DR.
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STANDISH: Well, DNA is a
molecule. So that means that
it's a structure that's made up
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of lots of atoms all joined
together. Now, most molecules
are very small relative to the
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scale of things that we deal
with. You can't see molecules
typically with the naked eye.
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But DNA has two really
interesting properties, just on
a global scale. First of all, it
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is really a big molecule. That
doesn't mean that you can
necessarily see it with your
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naked eye. CHRIS: Okay. DR.
STANDISH: But it is very, very
long. You have, in pretty much
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all of your cells, 46
chromosomes. And the DNA is a
major component of those
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chromosomes. If you just took
the DNA from those chromosomes,
so that's all 46 of them, and
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stretched it out straight, it
would be about six feet, a
little over six feet,
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approximately two metres long.
So my DNA, if I just sort of
lined it up, all those bits of
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DNA inside my cells, would be
about as tall as I am when I'm
standing up. CHRIS: And just to
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make sure I understand
correctly, is it the DNA in all
of your cells, or the DNA in
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just one cell that is about two
metres long? DR. STANDISH: That
would be in one cell. CHRIS: And
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we have lots of cells throughout
our body. So you're talking, if
you took all the DNA that's
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inside of us, you're talking
about something that's huge. DR.
STANDISH: Oh, yes. You have
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something on the order of, you
know, approaching a trillion
human cells in your body. And so
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yeah, there's a lot of DNA in
there, at least in terms of
length. CHRIS: Wow, so you're
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talking about almost two
trillion metres of length in
just one human body. This is a
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huge molecule. So let's talk a
little bit more about this DNA.
So what does this DNA do for us?
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How is information encoded in
it? Let's talk about this DNA.
DR. STANDISH: The information is
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probably the most interesting
thing about the DNA. I mean, the
structure of DNA itself is very
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elegant and beautiful.
Everybody's seen their
structure. It's that sort of
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double helical twisting
structure that you see showing;
when people want to talk about
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science kind of things, they
frequently have a picture of DNA
in there. And finding that
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structure was a very, very big
deal. In 1953, James Watson and
Francis Crick, along with a
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couple of other people, but
they've been the big sort of
movers and shakers with this.
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They published a paper that got
them this Nobel Prize.
Interestingly enough, the paper
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itself is only about a page
long, but it reported this
double helical structure. And
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that's very, very important. In
terms of recording the
information or storing the
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information in there, you can
think of the DNA language as
being spelled out in just the
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same way we spell out words
ourselves. CHRIS: Okay. DR.
STANDISH: Just like letters of
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the alphabet. Instead of using
letters, it uses slightly
different flat molecules that
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are attached to the. so what
sticks into the middle of that
sort of twisted ladder
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structure, those are the parts
of the molecule that contain the
information. And each one of
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those is like a different
letter. There are only four
different letters in the DNA
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alphabet. CHRIS: Okay. DR.
STANDISH: So we symbolize them
as A, T, G, and C. And I know
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when I first saw that, I
thought, "Wow, how can you spell
very much using only that many
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letters?" CHRIS: And so, the key
to DNA is that it encodes
information, holds information
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DR. STANDISH: And it's a very
good molecule for doing that.
CHRIS: Yes. Why is it such a
00:10:06.53\00:10:12.11
good molecule for doing that,
and how does it get the
information? I mean, how does it
00:10:12.21\00:10:17.58
get that information? DR.
STANDISH: Okay. Let's first talk
just a little bit about why it's
00:10:17.68\00:10:22.82
a really good molecule for
storing information. First of
all, it's very stable. So it
00:10:22.92\00:10:31.83
doesn't break very easily, it
doesn't change very easily. It
can be broken and it can be
00:10:31.93\00:10:40.54
changed, but it's pretty
amazing, for such a huge
molecule. And because it's so
00:10:40.64\00:10:47.08
stable, it actually stays around
for a long time. You can find
DNA in samples of bone, let's
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say, that's thousands of years
old. CHRIS: Wow. DR. STANDISH:
So we've been able to actually
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retrieve, for example, DNA from
mammoths; that's obviously quite
old. It's kind of a cool thing.
00:11:01.22\00:11:10.17
It lets us find out stuff about
the past and some information
about those organisms back then.
00:11:10.27\00:11:17.87
So that's one of the great
things about DNA. Another great
thing about it is that it's
00:11:17.97\00:11:23.71
double-stranded, so it has these
two strands that are twisted
around each other. If you want
00:11:23.81\00:11:32.19
to, you can unzip those strands.
Remember, they're held together
by these molecules, parts of the
00:11:32.29\00:11:37.76
molecule, I should say, that are
sticking into the middle. CHRIS:
Right. DR. STANDISH: And
00:11:37.86\00:11:42.80
those are not physically joined
together. They are held together
by forces. And those forces are
00:11:42.90\00:11:49.70
pretty easily broken. So you can
just sort of unzip the DNA. The
great thing about that is that
00:11:49.80\00:11:57.91
both strands actually contain
100% of the information. So you
were asking, where does the
00:11:58.01\00:12:04.99
information come from? What
happens is, to make a new strand
of DNA, you take an old strand
00:12:05.09\00:12:11.29
of DNA, you unzip it, and you
synthesize the opposite strand
on each of those original
00:12:11.39\00:12:19.10
strands, and you have a perfect
copy. So that's another reason
why it's a fabulous molecule for
00:12:19.20\00:12:26.88
storing information, because it
can be passed from mother cells
to daughter cells as cells
00:12:26.98\00:12:35.35
divide, so you can easily. it's
easily copied. And obviously,
then, the big ultimate question
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is, where did that information
come from in the first place?
CHRIS: Yes. DR. STANDISH: Where
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did it come from? And to answer
that question, it's probably
worth looking at the kind of
00:12:50.53\00:12:59.27
information that's actually
stored in DNA. CHRIS: Yes. DR.
STANDISH: Now, I should give you
00:12:59.37\00:13:04.11
a warning. We probably don't
fully understand all of the
information that's stored in
00:13:04.21\00:13:13.22
DNA. It seems that every few
months, something comes out that
is absolutely jaw-dropping when
00:13:13.32\00:13:24.60
it comes to that. But let's talk
about a gene, because you can
think of a gene as being
00:13:24.70\00:13:32.91
something like maybe a chapter
in a book. I'm going to use
different analogies here,
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because they're a little bit
easier to understand. But don't
be angry with me if I switch
00:13:43.32\00:13:49.19
from one analogy to another
analogy. We're trying to
understand something that isn't
00:13:49.29\00:13:55.50
exactly like this, but it's
close. CHRIS: For sure. DR.
STANDISH: So if you've got a
00:13:55.60\00:13:59.43
long strand of DNA from one of
your chromosomes, there will be
these genes in there, and they
00:13:59.53\00:14:04.47
will be like, if the long strand
is a book, then a gene might be
a chapter. Now, there are a lot
00:14:04.57\00:14:09.08
of chapters in the book. It's a
long book. Just to put it in
perspective, those letters that
00:14:09.18\00:14:16.89
I mentioned that code the
information, there are about
three billion of them in the
00:14:16.99\00:14:21.29
human genome. And you have two
copies of the human genome in
most of the cells of your body.
00:14:21.39\00:14:28.90
So it's a pretty. there are a
lot of letters in these
chapters. CHRIS: Now, I just
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want to make sure, because we're
talking some big things here.
Six billion, did I hear the word
00:14:38.91\00:14:44.85
right? DR. STANDISH: Six billion
total. Three billion of these
DNA letters in a complete copy
00:14:44.95\00:14:54.12
of the human genome. You got one
copy from your mother, and you
got another copy from your
00:14:54.22\00:15:00.93
father. So that's why you have
two copies in every cell in your
body. CHRIS: Fabulous. DR.
00:15:01.00\00:15:07.57
STANDISH: Oh, and that is a
really important thing, by the
way, because if, let's say there
00:15:07.67\00:15:13.68
was a problem with one of the
genes that your father gave you,
you have a backup copy from your
00:15:13.78\00:15:18.58
mother. So it's a very clever,
redundant, and robust system.
It's been thought through very
00:15:18.68\00:15:27.62
well. CHRIS: Yes. DR. STANDISH:
God, Who created humans, and I
00:15:27.72\00:15:32.43
believe, ultimately put the
information into the DNA for
human beings, chose a really
00:15:32.53\00:15:40.67
good material to encode that
information into, and a really
good system for passing that
00:15:40.77\00:15:47.04
down through the generations so
that we can survive and thrive
in the world that we live in.
00:15:47.14\00:15:53.65
But anyway, getting back to
genes. CHRIS: Yes. DR. STANDISH:
I'll tell you an embarrassing
00:15:53.75\00:15:57.62
story about myself. When I was
teaching at the university we
were both at, one day, I stood
00:15:57.72\00:16:04.99
up in front of my molecular
genetics class and gave a truly
brilliant lecture on estimating
00:16:05.09\00:16:12.17
the number of genes that are in
the human genome. We're big,
complicated creatures, so you'd
00:16:12.27\00:16:18.91
expect that there'd be a lot of
information that would need to
be encoded in our DNA - and
00:16:19.01\00:16:24.38
there is. I used absolutely
correct data and made what I
think everybody would agree were
00:16:24.48\00:16:36.16
very reasonable assumptions and
demonstrated to my class that
there are about 125,000 genes
00:16:36.26\00:16:44.70
encoded into the DNA of a human
being. But the next day, "The
Human Genome"was published. So
00:16:44.80\00:16:56.81
that was the first time it was
fully sequenced and that it was
published. And I, of course,
00:16:56.91\00:17:05.12
immediately grabbed my copy of
The Journal of Science where it
was, and I read and I read and I
00:17:05.22\00:17:13.56
read, and I felt more and more
foolish, because there are not
125,000 genes in the human
00:17:13.66\00:17:19.97
genome; there are only about
50,000 genes in the human
genome. And yet, my logic had
00:17:20.07\00:17:27.41
been so good. Nobody really knew
why there were so few genes.
This was one of the big
00:17:27.51\00:17:33.15
surprises. Now, since that time,
the number of genes has actually
gone down further. There are,
00:17:33.25\00:17:39.89
you know, between 20 and 25,000
genes now, we think, in the
human genome. How can this be?
00:17:39.99\00:17:47.50
We make so many more proteins
than there are genes in our
body. CHRIS: Yes. DR.
00:17:47.60\00:17:54.47
STANDISH: As it turns out, genes
are not what we thought they
were. We thought that a gene was
00:17:54.57\00:18:01.78
just the plan for one protein.
So we thought there's one gene,
one protein. But that's not the
00:18:01.88\00:18:10.65
way it works. In reality, each
gene can make multiple proteins.
Now, some genes only do make one
00:18:10.75\00:18:20.43
protein, but there are other
genes that make a whole lot of
them. CHRIS: Okay. DR.
00:18:20.53\00:18:25.13
STANDISH: And instead of being
just sort of a simple string of
information, the genes are more
00:18:25.23\00:18:33.31
like little computer programs.
And there's all kinds of input
that comes in via various
00:18:33.41\00:18:42.18
molecules that bind with the DNA
and bind with each other and
bind with other molecules,
00:18:42.28\00:18:49.06
particularly RNA, possibly.
well, there's a whole lot of
things that come together, and a
00:18:49.16\00:18:57.80
decision is made about whether
the gene is going to make a
protein or whether it isn't
00:18:57.90\00:19:06.54
going to do so. In addition to
that, the genes will be talking
with, basically, with other
00:19:06.64\00:19:14.92
genes, and that information is
also being integrated. A gene
might decide to make one version
00:19:15.12\00:19:22.66
of a protein, and at another
time, because of other input,
decide to make another version
00:19:22.76\00:19:28.33
of that gene. And I can give you
a specific example, if you'd
like. CHRIS: Please. DR.
00:19:28.43\00:19:34.10
STANDISH: There's a gene called
PITX-2, and we won't worry about
what that stands for. But PITX-2
00:19:34.20\00:19:43.51
has an interesting role in
development. It helps to
determine the shape of our face.
00:19:43.61\00:19:50.92
But it does some other things as
well. Now, sometimes, that gene
needs to make a protein that is
00:19:51.02\00:20:03.50
embedded into a cell membrane.
And other times, it needs to
make a very similar protein that
00:20:03.60\00:20:10.71
isn't embedded into a membrane.
So it needs to make two kinds of
proteins. It actually makes more
00:20:10.81\00:20:16.64
than two kinds of proteins. How
does it do that? Well, the gene
itself has segments of
00:20:16.75\00:20:25.65
information in it. Remember,
they're sort of all lined up on
this long string of DNA. And you
00:20:25.75\00:20:31.79
can take a segment - these are
called exons - you can take a
segment from here and a segment
00:20:31.89\00:20:37.77
from here and a segment from
here and join those all
together, and those are the
00:20:37.87\00:20:41.87
information for, let's say, the
version that floats around
inside the cell. CHRIS: Yes. DR.
00:20:41.97\00:20:48.34
STANDISH: Whereas if you take,
you know, a slightly different
combination of them, that's the
00:20:48.44\00:20:52.88
one, that's the code, then, for
the protein that sticks into the
cell membrane. It sounds so
00:20:52.98\00:21:00.36
technical and fabulous. The
point is, genes are much more
fantastic than we thought they
00:21:00.46\00:21:07.56
were. It's not just simple
information; it's complex,
integrated information.
00:21:07.66\00:21:18.04
CHRIS: And I don't want take too
many leaps here, Dr. Standish,
but if I hear what you're
00:21:18.14\00:21:25.45
saying, we have DNA, and within
that DNA, we have genes, and
genes are the chapters of the
00:21:25.55\00:21:33.19
book DNA, and those chapters,
instead of necessarily. those
chapters are written, but then
00:21:33.29\00:21:41.40
those chapters then help write
other things - proteins. DR.
STANDISH: Yes, I'm actually
00:21:41.50\00:21:47.50
mixing a metaphor here. CHRIS:
Okay. DR. STANDISH Yeah. I said
00:21:47.60\00:21:51.81
they're kind of like chapters,
but they're also kind of like a
computer program. They're like a
00:21:51.91\00:21:59.35
dynamic chapter. They're like.
and that's why they're not just
a passive kind of thing like a
00:21:59.45\00:22:06.29
book that doesn't change; they
are interacting with the
environment, they're taking
00:22:06.39\00:22:11.13
information, they're integrating
information, and then they're
using that to make the right
00:22:11.23\00:22:15.83
kind of protein. So it's like a
little computer. CHRIS: And this
little computer, what it
00:22:15.93\00:22:22.14
sounds like, as you're talking,
is not something that could
exist or function in partial
00:22:22.24\00:22:29.31
pieces. DR. STANDISH: It seems
like doing things in bits and
pieces would be an unlikely way
00:22:29.41\00:22:40.22
of getting this kind of system,
because it's not just a matter
of getting one bit of
00:22:40.32\00:22:49.20
information right; it's a matter
of getting several bits of
information correct, but also,
00:22:49.30\00:22:58.47
the information about when to
use that information, and the
whole mechanism for making that
00:22:58.57\00:23:05.18
decision. CHRIS: And so, it
seems like, once again, Dr.
Standish, we are looking at
00:23:05.28\00:23:14.19
something that points to a plan,
that points to design. DR.
STANDISH: In our normal
00:23:14.29\00:23:24.27
experience, we know that
computer programs are probably
the closest analogy that we can
00:23:24.37\00:23:32.94
make to genes at this particular
point. We know where they come
from. We've got literally many
00:23:33.04\00:23:41.68
thousands, probably millions of
examples now of the source of
this kind of information. It's
00:23:41.78\00:23:50.53
engineers, human beings.
Computer programs don't come
about by random number
00:23:50.63\00:23:57.43
generators. Random number
generators themselves don't come
about by random number
00:23:57.53\00:24:01.80
generators. These are engineered
systems. And so where did the
information come from? If I look
00:24:01.90\00:24:10.51
at a computer, I say, "Oh, that
information came from computer
engineers, software engineers,
00:24:10.61\00:24:17.59
and so on." Why would I come to
a different conclusion about
quite similar kinds of systems
00:24:17.69\00:24:26.83
that we find inside the cells of
every living thing that we know
of? CHRIS: And so if I hear what
00:24:26.93\00:24:34.54
you're saying, Dr. Standish,
what you're saying is, is that
as we look at DNA, as we look at
00:24:34.64\00:24:40.38
genes, the possibility or
probability that these genes
just came together by random
00:24:40.48\00:24:50.39
chance. DR. STANDISH: Something
unguided. CHRIS: . something
unguided, what is the
00:24:50.49\00:24:56.22
probability that that's the
case? DR. STANDISH: In my
opinion, it's zero. Now, you
00:24:56.32\00:25:03.10
could probably figure out a
probability using various
assumptions, and I've seen
00:25:03.20\00:25:08.34
people try to do this sort of
thing. But that's not the way
science really works. You know,
00:25:08.44\00:25:15.64
science is about seeing
patterns, things that occur
repeatedly, and saying, "Ah-ha,
00:25:15.74\00:25:25.42
that's the way things work."
When we look at where
information like the information
00:25:25.52\00:25:34.13
that we see in genes comes from,
when we look at that, we can see
that with absolutely 100%, you
00:25:34.23\00:25:46.57
know, of the time, it comes from
intelligent minds. It never
comes from any other source.
00:25:46.68\00:25:53.08
CHRIS: And so when we look at
DNA, once again, we see a plan
and a Planner; a design and a
00:25:53.18\00:26:03.63
Designer. And so, as we are kind
of wrapping up here, Dr.
Standish, let me just ask the
00:26:03.73\00:26:11.73
question as straightforward as I
can: Did God write the DNA into
every cell in our body? DR.
00:26:11.83\00:26:19.94
STANDISH: I believe that that
original information was written
by God, just as much as I
00:26:20.04\00:26:27.88
believe, by the way, that God
wrote the Ten Commandments in
the tables of stone. It's no
00:26:27.98\00:26:33.82
different. He is the Source, the
Ultimate Source of that
information. Now, it has been
00:26:33.92\00:26:39.49
passed down through many
generations, obviously. But I
believe that the ultimate source
00:26:39.59\00:26:45.83
of that information was God
Himself. CHRIS: And what a
fascinating conclusion to this
00:26:45.93\00:26:53.84
series, "Designed with Purpose,"
to talk about DNA, the very
building blocks of who we are,
00:26:53.94\00:27:03.69
show us the actual fingerprints,
so to speak, of God, that each
of us was made with a purpose,
00:27:03.79\00:27:16.53
planned by the Master Planner,
Jesus Christ Himself. Dr.
Standish, thank you so much.
00:27:16.63\00:27:24.37
Would you be willing to pray for
us as we end our program today?
DR. STANDISH: Yes. Dear Father
00:27:24.47\00:27:30.35
in heaven, I thank You for all
that You did, all that You
planned, so that living things
00:27:30.45\00:27:38.09
can exist. I thank You that part
of that plan was also a plan of
salvation for each one of us. I
00:27:38.19\00:27:48.03
thank You for coming down, dying
on this earth, so that we can be
saved. And my prayer is that
00:27:48.13\00:27:54.44
each of us will seek to know You
as our Creator and our Redeemer.
I pray this in Jesus' name,
00:27:54.54\00:28:02.58
amen. CHRIS: Amen.
00:28:02.68\00:28:04.88
CHRIS: Dr. Standish, how
exciting it is to know that
God's very fingerprints are on
00:28:10.42\00:28:17.66
each and every one of our cells
through our DNA. You know, today
we want to offer our viewers the
00:28:17.76\00:28:24.23
DVD King of Creation. Tell us a
little something about it. DR.
STANDISH: We've talked about
00:28:24.33\00:28:29.60
really technical stuff, but
sometimes it's great to just be
still and know that God is God.
00:28:29.70\00:28:36.48
King of Creation is beautiful
cinematography, beautiful music,
and beautiful selections from
00:28:36.58\00:28:44.19
God's Word, all put together
into what we call a devotional
DVD. CHRIS: That is wonderful.
00:28:44.29\00:28:52.26
Friend, if you would like to
receive today's offer, here's
the information you need.
00:28:52.36\00:28:57.80
CHRIS: Dr. Standish, thank you
so much for joining us today.
DR. STANDISH: Thanks for having
00:29:38.11\00:29:41.34
me. CHRIS: My dear friend, thank
you for watching. And if you
want to learn more about our
00:29:41.44\00:29:48.35
wonderful Creator, join us again
next week. Until then, remember,
it is written: "Man shall not
00:29:48.45\00:29:55.89
live by bread alone, but by
every word that proceeds from
00:29:55.99\00:30:02.80