¤[Theme Music]¤
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¤[Music]¤ Thanks
for joining me today
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on It Is Written.
I'm John Bradshaw.
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You know as well as I
do that in recent years,
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environmental issues
have become very big news.
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People talk about climate
change, the resulting rising
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in sea levels, the polar ice
cap melting, people in danger,
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wildlife endangered, species
becoming even more endangered.
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In recent years there has
been talk about ozone layer
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depletion, nuclear issues,
particularly when natural
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disasters cause problems
at nuclear power stations.
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People fear what are we going
to do to avoid nuclear waste
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and nuclear
fall-out. There's any number
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of environmental issues
today, some of them have been
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highly politicized
but my question today
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is what does any of this
have to do with the Bible?
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Maybe nothing, maybe
something. My guest today
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is Scott Christiansen.
Scott has worked virtually all
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of his adult life in Christian
ministry, at times, working
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with environmental issues
in various parts of the world.
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He has seen, up close, the
way the environment is changing
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and the effect that that has
on society and its relationship
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to the Bible. Scott
is an author and his
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seminar on the Bible
and the Environment has been
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warmly and enthusiastically
received all across
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North America.
Scott Christiansen,
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thanks for joining me
today. SC: Thank you John.
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It's my pleasure to be here.
JB: Tell me, to begin with,
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what do environmental issues
have to do with the Bible,
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if anything at all?
SC: Well, let's go straight
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to Scripture.
Let's go to Matthew 24.
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Christ told his disciples
what the waymarks would be
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before he came. He gave us many,
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many things to
look for. And in fact,
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in Mark, Chapter 13,
we are told to watch.
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We have a
responsibility to watch.
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So we are not to be passive.
When in Matthew 24 we are told
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that there will be
wars and rumors of wars.
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We are told that there
will be pestilences and famines
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and earthquakes
in diverse places.
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In the last 50 years or
so, we've seen increasing
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disturbances in the
environment and we are
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coming to understand
destabilization in the
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environment destabilizes a
society and leads to conflict,
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and leads to
pestilence, and leads to famine.
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It leads to the fulfillment
of prophecy and we're
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seeing it now. JB:
So why are environmental
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issues biblical issues?
Where is the correlation?
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SC: You have to go back
to the systems, not just
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the things that were
created during creation week
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because we all know
that the oceans were made
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and the atmosphere and
everything else, but you
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have to go back to the systems.
JB: What do you mean systems?
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SC: Well, our oceanic system
and how it interacts with our
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atmospheric system.
How these two systems which
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were created on the same day,
two halves of one whole, our
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atmosphere and our hydrosphere,
how these were created and are
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constantly interacting with
each other, chemical balances
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and thermal balances and that
enabled, of course, animal life
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and the animal life depended
upon the plant life that was
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created which depended,
of course, upon the soil
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being healthy. All of
these things are systems.
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You've got our fresh
water system and you've got such
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things as our nutrient system,
our nitrogen cycle, our alkaline
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metal cycle, which is
potassium, calcium, magnesium.
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So the Lord made massive
systems, oceanic, atmospheric,
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climate, and he made
small systems and they all fit
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together and work
together perfectly.
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He created
everything in perfection.
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And then sin entered the
world. JB: What did sin do to
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the perfection of God's systems?
SC: What is the consequence
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of sin? The
consequence of sin is death.
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And we have always said, well,
OK, people die, animals die,
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humans understand that.
What we have not appreciated
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is that sin
affects the planet itself.
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JB: So when death entered
the world, and if we stop
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and think about this,
sin brings death but also
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it brought death to
trees and whatever else dies,
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stuff in the water. SC:
It brought death to every
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part of the massive systems
that God created to sustain
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life on this planet and,
therefore, it brought death
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to those systems themselves.
If every piece is dying,
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if every cell in your
body is dying, then your entire
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body is dying. God
created the planet in such
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perfection, and in such perfect
balance, that it has gone
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on for a very long time.
However, like a spinning top,
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you know, it goes
perfectly at first.
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It's very stable.
But then it destabilizes
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and it begins to
wobble and you have seen
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the spinning top. The
end comes very quickly
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and looking at the
evidence in their natural world,
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we are at the point where
the systems that God created
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are so affected by sin
that they are destabilized
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and like a top they
are wobbling significantly.
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JB: Somebody is going to
say, Why are you blaming sin for
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a hole in the ozone layer when
scientifically we would believe
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that that is because of too much
CFC's gone in the environment.
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Why are you blaming sin for
my careless use of refrigerants?
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SC We were told to be
stewards of this planet.
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We were given
dominion over the planet.
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If we were living up to
our charge, we would not be
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destabilizing the earth.
And that's a fact of sin in man.
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You have to trace the
problem all the way back.
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You can say that
people are not responsible.
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You can say that
corporations aren't responsible.
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You can say that
governments are not responsible
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but that does not trace
the problem back to its roots.
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You trace the
problem back to its roots,
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and it's the effect of
sin. There is a reason that God
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hates sin. It
only decays, it only
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destroys, it only causes
death. JB: We tend to think
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of industrialization and flash
cars, nice cars, as progress.
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SC: What we've done
as a global human society
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is kind of build a
bubble around ourselves.
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Cars are part of
it. The industrial life
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is a part of it. But
we think we don't really
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need God. And we
think we don't really
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need the world that He created.
We think that spirituality
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is outside of our industrial
society and we think that nature
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is outside of our
industrial society.
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In fact, God created systems
that support life on this earth
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and we are anything but
outside of those systems.
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So as the earth continues to
decay and it is an accelerating
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decay, right
now, so its not just a
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linear process, it is
an accelerating decay.
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As the earth continues to
decay, we will be more and more
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destabilized as a global society
and that's a big deal because
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it leaves us to the
fulfillment of prophecy.
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JB: The decay we see in
society not just people killing
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each other and interpersonal
problems, but environmental
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issues we see because
they are a result of sin.
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SC: Absolutely. Oh, absolutely!
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Let me give you a specific
example just of a society
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that's being impacted
by environmental decay.
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Let's go to Syria.
For the last six years,
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there has been ...
and it has kind of gone
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up and down a little
bit, but there has been a very
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significant
drought in the Middle East
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and in the Mediterranean region.
So much so, that in Syria,
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in particular, there have
been successive years of crop
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failures and successive
years of herds of animals
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that could not graze
and had to be slaughtered.
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Subsistence farmers
had less and less and less.
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Now, scientific studies have
validated that the Arab spring,
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so-called, while it
was in response to despotic
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governments, was actually
triggered by a sharp rise
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in food prices. So
all around the Middle East
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you had the Arab spring rise.
It was triggered ultimately
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by this drought. Now
so what we see is a shift
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in climate,
people that are hungry
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and desperate, rebellions
and then massive death
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and displacement and continuing
disruption to neighboring
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countries. So we
see wars and rumors
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of wars. We see famine.
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We see pestilence
because of rise in disease.
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This is just one
grain of sand on the scale.
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But when you see the trend that
we are one as a globe, you see
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how this lines up with
prophecy and we're really
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not awake to it. JB:
Societal issues brought
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about by environmental issues,
which were triggered by sin.
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SC: Right, right. JB:
In just a moment I am going
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to ask you this question.
I want to give you a second
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to think about it.
The question is: Is God
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an environmentalist?
Give that some thought.
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You can give
that some thought too.
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We'll be back with more on
It is Written in just a moment.
00:10:41.50\00:10:46.27
¤ [Gentle Music] ¤
00:10:46.94\00:10:56.65
Every Word is a one-minute
Bible-based daily devotional
00:10:57.05\00:11:01.06
presented by pastor John
Bradshaw and designed especially
00:11:01.06\00:11:04.26
for busy people like you.
Look for Every Word on selected
00:11:04.26\00:11:08.06
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00:11:08.06\00:11:11.13
itiswritten.com.
00:11:11.13\00:11:13.57
¤ [Bright Rythmic Melody] ¤
Well they say the Mayan calendar
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was going to expire
on December 21, 2012.
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Some say the
world was going to end,
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but we're still here.
The expiration of this
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particular cycle of the
Meso-American long count
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calendar was most likely only
meant to signify the end of a
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particular cycle and
not the end of the world.
00:11:36.22\00:11:38.93
The world was never going to
come to an end on December 21,
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but it will one day. In
Matthew 24, Jesus spoke of
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certain things that would take
place in the world and then he
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said in verse 33, "When
you see all these things,
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know that it is near
- even at the doors!"
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And those signs he
spoke of look very much like
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they're very near
the point of fulfillment.
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If you follow an old
calendar, you'll likely believe
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anything, but if
you trust the Bible,
00:12:00.45\00:12:02.98
you'll know that
Jesus will soon be here and
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you'll be ready.
[Bright rhythmic tune]
00:12:06.15\00:12:07.82
I'm John Bradshaw
for It Is Written.
00:12:07.82\00:12:09.52
Let's live today by Every Word.
00:12:09.52\00:12:12.79
Thanks  for joining me
today on It Is Written.
00:12:15.53\00:12:17.93
My guest today is author,
seminar presenter, Christian
00:12:17.93\00:12:21.87
minister, Scott Christiansen.
And we are discussing today
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the relationship between
the environment, the decaying
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environment, and the Bible.
Scott, I told you just a moment
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ago that I am about
to ask you this question.
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SC: Right. JB:
Here's the question.
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Is God an environmentalist?
SC: If you take the word
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"environmentalist" and you
ask people to define it you are
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going to get a bunch of
different ... so I have to be
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careful in my answer because
if I say yes, then theres
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going to be a dozen
different people thinking
00:12:48.73\00:12:50.73
a dozen different things. So
let me just put it like this:
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when God created the
world, we're told in Job
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that the morning stars
sang, that heaven was amazed
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and celebrated
over this amazing earth.
00:12:58.71\00:13:02.21
So if you mean by
"environmentalist" that this
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is someone who loves the
beauty and majesty of the earth
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and who
celebrates it, then my answer
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is absolutely yes!
And if you mean that by
00:13:10.49\00:13:13.79
"environmentalist" that this
is someone who wants to preserve
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the earth, then
my answer is yes.
00:13:16.96\00:13:19.26
And all we have to do is
go to the most commonly quoted
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and memorized text
in all of Christendom.
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"For God so loved the world..."
JB: There's a tension here.
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Probably in everything there
is a tension and we are going
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to zero in on the tension
here. God created the world.
00:13:32.84\00:13:36.08
The question I asked
you is a loaded question,
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"Is God an environmentalist?"
because it is loaded with
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so many different
meanings, but looking at it,
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the first verse of the
Bible says "in the beginning
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God created," so God loves
the environment, obviously,
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and he made a perfect
and a beautiful earth which
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is still very beautiful
but far from perfect today.
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God made the earth
to serve us, did He not?
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SC: Yes He did. It's our home.
00:14:00.34\00:14:02.07
JB: Kill that animal under a
certain circumstance, cut down
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that tree under a
certain circumstance, these were
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renewable resources, so probably
God was not taking a big risk
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with that. But
there's a tension,
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isn't there, between
how to appropriately manage
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the environment. How does
the Christian find that balance?
00:14:17.02\00:14:21.49
SC: First of all, we have
to remember that the world
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is not only
tainted by sin, it is dying
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as a result of sin. If
we are going to try and fix
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something, if we are
going to try and save the world,
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then what is the proposal for
reversing the effects of sin?
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What is the proposal
for not having prophecy come
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to fulfillment that
the earth will be destroyed
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and recreated?
JB: Are you saying
00:14:45.25\00:14:46.85
that environmental
activism is futile?
00:14:46.85\00:14:49.18
SC: I have to walk
a very fine line here.
00:14:49.18\00:14:50.69
JB: That's the tension.
SC: That's the tension because
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here's the thing. If
you only have so much time
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and you only have so
many resources, are you going
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to invest those in a
planet that's dying or are you
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going to invest those
in people who can be saved?
00:15:00.36\00:15:03.43
And you have to
balance that, with the fact
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that there is a tremendously
disproportionate distribution
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of resources in the world.
There is 3.5 billion people who
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make less than $2.50 a day.
Some of those people spend 90%
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of their income on food
and their lives are desperate.
00:15:17.45\00:15:21.15
So everything that we do
that consumes more resources,
00:15:21.15\00:15:25.62
disproportionately, in excess if
you will, and everything that we
00:15:25.62\00:15:29.99
do that places a greater burden
on the planet, makes those
00:15:29.99\00:15:33.73
people's lives more difficult.
There is a responsibility there.
00:15:33.73\00:15:37.43
There is a balance
there and I think it is to
00:15:37.43\00:15:39.90
the individual to
decide where it is.
00:15:39.90\00:15:41.94
For me, it's a matter of
putting all of my efforts into
00:15:41.94\00:15:46.27
pointing people to Christ
and His very, very soon coming.
00:15:46.27\00:15:49.68
JB: I imagine ... I'm imagining
that if somebody loves God they
00:15:49.68\00:15:52.35
are going to love what God loves
and that would instill in them
00:15:52.35\00:15:55.55
a care, at least,
for the environment.
00:15:55.55\00:15:59.59
Should Christians
be environmentalists?
00:15:59.59\00:16:01.92
Should Christians be greenies?
SC: Christians should be
00:16:01.92\00:16:04.59
environmentalists in this sense:
Well, first they should be
00:16:04.59\00:16:08.00
responsible to their fellow
man and they should not have
00:16:08.00\00:16:11.60
a disproportionate
use of resources.
00:16:11.60\00:16:13.70
They need to be
careful but at the same time
00:16:13.70\00:16:16.24
understanding, of
course, that the world is dying.
00:16:16.24\00:16:19.07
Christians should be
environmentalists in the sense
00:16:19.07\00:16:21.81
that they are absolutely looking
forward to seeing the earth
00:16:21.81\00:16:25.31
recreated in its
full glory and full
00:16:25.31\00:16:27.62
majesty. In that
sense, I am a raging
00:16:27.62\00:16:30.15
environmentalist. I
can hardly wait to see
00:16:30.15\00:16:32.42
the earth as God
created it in its perfection.
00:16:32.42\00:16:34.62
It fills me with joy
just to think about it.
00:16:34.62\00:16:38.46
But our
responsibility is here and now.
00:16:38.46\00:16:40.76
Our responsibility is
spreading the good news
00:16:40.76\00:16:43.37
of Christ's return.
JB: A few moments ago you
00:16:43.37\00:16:46.27
mentioned that
you'll find the right words
00:16:46.27\00:16:49.20
...the destruction of the earth,
00:16:49.20\00:16:50.61
the decay of the
earth. You said it's happening
00:16:50.61\00:16:53.01
in a fashion that is not
linear, but it's accelerating.
00:16:53.01\00:16:56.75
How do we see this accelerating
decay of the planet.
00:16:56.75\00:17:00.78
Let's talk about some examples.
SC: I want to go immediately
00:17:00.78\00:17:03.49
to scientific studies
and data and all of that.
00:17:03.49\00:17:06.22
But, concurrent with scientific
studies, you get a general sense
00:17:06.22\00:17:11.03
when you talk to people or when
people observe the environment
00:17:11.03\00:17:13.23
around them.
This was not happening
00:17:13.23\00:17:15.30
when I was a kid.
People themselves observe
00:17:15.30\00:17:17.93
changes. Greater
storms, greater heat
00:17:17.93\00:17:20.34
waves, more droughts and you
can't always trust those things.
00:17:20.34\00:17:24.04
When you've got a global
sense that things are changing
00:17:24.04\00:17:27.74
and things are
different and that the planet
00:17:27.74\00:17:29.74
is more hostile, that
in itself is a data point.
00:17:29.74\00:17:32.88
Aside from that,
let's go back to data.
00:17:32.88\00:17:35.02
Let's go to something
that is hard. And that is, we
00:17:35.02\00:17:37.59
have had a quintupling
of damage from disasters
00:17:37.59\00:17:40.99
on a global basis, with a
disproportion amount of that
00:17:40.99\00:17:44.59
damage centered in the United
States, which is interesting.
00:17:44.59\00:17:47.60
JB: Before we talk about
natural disasters, let me slip
00:17:47.60\00:17:50.80
in here if I may.
Don't we simply have better
00:17:50.80\00:17:55.60
mechanisms for
recording disasters?
00:17:55.60\00:18:01.04
The Richter scale has only
been in existence for so long
00:18:01.04\00:18:03.55
and so forth.
SC: It's interesting.
00:18:03.55\00:18:05.25
Let's go back to the
frequency of disasters.
00:18:05.25\00:18:08.02
Now I have a chart that I use
that tracks disasters and this
00:18:08.02\00:18:11.69
is out of an organization called
EM-DAT out of Brussels and you
00:18:11.69\00:18:15.56
have to use the chart very,
very carefully because these are
00:18:15.56\00:18:18.26
observed disasters or
these are reported disasters,
00:18:18.26\00:18:21.46
more accurately. And
so, you go back to 1900
00:18:21.46\00:18:24.30
and while we were still
using, you know, the telegraph,
00:18:24.30\00:18:27.80
but if you look at the data
trend on this and you notice
00:18:27.80\00:18:31.04
from, say, 1970, 1980,
we had satellites, we had
00:18:31.04\00:18:36.64
communication everywhere.
We had cable TV in the 80's
00:18:36.64\00:18:39.61
but the rise in
disasters has been constant
00:18:39.61\00:18:43.22
since then and
extremely significant.
00:18:43.22\00:18:46.05
So yes, we are seeing
an increase in disasters
00:18:46.05\00:18:49.06
and an increase in the
magnitude of disasters as well.
00:18:49.06\00:18:52.33
It's happening and it is a big
deal and it fulfills prophecy.
00:18:52.33\00:18:55.60
JB: And an increase in the cost
of those disasters in turn goes
00:18:55.60\00:18:59.13
on to affect
society in many ways.
00:18:59.13\00:19:01.94
SC: We underestimate
the profound affect
00:19:01.94\00:19:05.64
of society by an environment
that is steadily destabilizing.
00:19:05.64\00:19:09.98
We think we are separate.
We think there's just trees
00:19:09.98\00:19:13.42
and grass and things out there
but, as a matter of fact, we're
00:19:13.42\00:19:16.38
pumping out our
aquifers all over the world.
00:19:16.38\00:19:18.85
In major cities, we're
beginning to run out of water,
00:19:18.85\00:19:22.26
especially in
Asia. It's a big deal.
00:19:22.26\00:19:24.29
The oceans are
crashing. It's expected,
00:19:24.29\00:19:28.06
scientists who have looked at
this carefully, that the oceans
00:19:28.06\00:19:31.03
will be essentially
fished out of commercial species
00:19:31.03\00:19:33.27
in the next 25 years.
The ecosystem is crashing
00:19:33.27\00:19:36.37
and there is a billion
people who rely on the oceans
00:19:36.37\00:19:39.41
for their food. JB:
Let's come back to this
00:19:39.41\00:19:41.04
in just a moment. And
also, let's look at some
00:19:41.04\00:19:44.25
biblical references to
the problems the environment
00:19:44.25\00:19:51.72
is facing due
to the work of sin.
00:19:51.72\00:19:55.16
We'll be back with
more in just a moment.
00:19:55.16\00:19:58.76
¤ [Gently thoughtful Melody] ¤
00:19:59.43\00:20:08.90
If you could just go back in
time and do things differently!
00:20:10.07\00:20:14.88
Perhaps you've
struggled with regret,
00:20:14.88\00:20:16.54
the added weight of guilt.
While theres no way to undo
00:20:16.54\00:20:19.48
the past, God offers us a
forgiveness so complete that it
00:20:19.48\00:20:23.42
comes with the promise of
a life that will never end.
00:20:23.42\00:20:26.86
Sound too good to be
true? See what the Bible says!
00:20:26.86\00:20:30.13
Our booklet, "Hope
for a Planet in Crisis,"
00:20:30.13\00:20:33.03
will walk you
through the Bible's teachings
00:20:33.03\00:20:34.63
about sin and forgiveness
and show you how a new start
00:20:34.63\00:20:37.90
can be yours. Just
call (800) 253-3000 and
00:20:37.90\00:20:43.07
request your FREE copy of
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00:20:43.07\00:20:47.34
If the line's busy,
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00:20:47.34\00:20:49.78
Or write to It Is
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00:20:53.01\00:20:57.72
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00:20:57.72\00:21:01.52
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00:21:09.60\00:21:11.50
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00:21:11.50\00:21:15.30
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00:21:15.30\00:21:17.61
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00:21:17.61\00:21:22.34
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00:21:22.34\00:21:27.58
This is It Is
Written. I'm John Bradshaw.
00:21:29.12\00:21:30.95
My guest today is Scott
Christiansen who is an author,
00:21:30.95\00:21:34.39
a Christian minister,
and a seminar presenter,
00:21:34.39\00:21:36.69
dealing with the very important
and timely subject of the decay
00:21:36.69\00:21:41.90
in the environment
around us and how that relates
00:21:41.90\00:21:45.53
to the Word of God. Now
Scott, Isaiah wrote many,
00:21:45.53\00:21:48.60
many years ago that the earth
would wax old like a garment.
00:21:48.60\00:21:52.87
What do you think he
was talking about there?
00:21:52.87\00:21:54.91
SC: In my interpretation, under
sin, the world destabilizes.
00:21:54.91\00:21:59.25
The world falls apart.
JB: So sin doesn't just make
00:21:59.25\00:22:01.88
murderers out of people,
it affects the ground and the
00:22:01.88\00:22:06.15
trees and the air and the ocean.
Absolutely and surprisingly!
00:22:06.15\00:22:09.82
And you know, we couldn't
actually see this because
00:22:09.82\00:22:12.63
we only have a generational
view, because we only see
00:22:12.63\00:22:14.60
things in our lifetime.
Until the decay of the earth
00:22:14.60\00:22:18.27
accelerated. Basically
within the last 50 years
00:22:18.27\00:22:20.90
we've been able to
begin to see this and now
00:22:20.90\00:22:23.47
we have a building sense,
as a global community we have
00:22:23.47\00:22:25.94
a building sense
that something's wrong.
00:22:25.94\00:22:29.54
Let's zero in a little
bit on some of these systemic
00:22:29.54\00:22:33.05
collapses. You'd
spoke before briefly
00:22:33.05\00:22:36.62
about the oceans. You
mentioned that a colossal
00:22:36.62\00:22:40.09
amount of people
depend upon the oceans.
00:22:40.09\00:22:43.06
SC: A billion or
more than a billion.
00:22:43.06\00:22:45.23
JB: But the
oceans are collapsing.
00:22:45.23\00:22:48.20
I've heard about these
dead spots in the ocean.
00:22:48.20\00:22:51.57
Tell me about that. SC:
Well what happens is, we
00:22:51.57\00:22:53.54
apply massive
amounts of fertilizer to grow
00:22:53.54\00:22:56.00
the food that the
planet needs and, by the way,
00:22:56.00\00:22:58.11
we're on a razor's edge, we
might want to talk about that
00:22:58.11\00:23:00.74
when it comes to
global food supply.
00:23:00.74\00:23:02.64
But this fertilizer
and pesticides that we use
00:23:02.64\00:23:04.81
all over the world,
part of it gets washed off
00:23:04.81\00:23:06.78
the land and then you have
all these nutrients flowing
00:23:06.78\00:23:09.18
into the ocean, and that
causes a bloom, an algal bloom,
00:23:09.18\00:23:13.59
and that algal bloom
just expands, just explodes
00:23:13.59\00:23:16.69
and then collapses and
dies, and when that algal
00:23:16.69\00:23:19.56
bloom dies the decay sucks
all the oxygen out of the water.
00:23:19.56\00:23:22.76
In the Gulf of Mexico you have
a dead spot the size of Vermont,
00:23:22.76\00:23:27.64
for instance,
where the water is dead.
00:23:27.64\00:23:30.21
Theres nothing in
there that's living.
00:23:30.21\00:23:31.87
It is below the surface,
because the surface of the water
00:23:31.87\00:23:35.04
exchanges oxygen
with the atmosphere,
00:23:35.04\00:23:37.08
but below the
surface, if something swims in,
00:23:37.08\00:23:39.61
it doesn't swim out.
It is completely dead.
00:23:39.61\00:23:41.45
JB: Okay. We're
talking about the oceans.
00:23:41.45\00:23:42.45
The ocean is really big, man.
It covers this great big part
00:23:42.45\00:23:45.32
of the earth.
You talk about a size
00:23:45.32\00:23:47.26
of Vermont. Here's my question.
00:23:47.26\00:23:49.72
Is it really that big?
SC: It's really that big.
00:23:49.72\00:23:51.63
JB: No, no, I mean really.
Is it really that bad or is this
00:23:51.63\00:23:54.36
just environmental hysteria,
some greenie who hugs trees
00:23:54.36\00:23:58.57
wants you to think
that we're at crisis point.
00:23:58.57\00:24:01.97
Is it really that bad?
SC: It's really that bad.
00:24:01.97\00:24:04.21
Let's take your point.
You say the ocean's big.
00:24:04.21\00:24:07.11
Now when I worked in Mongolia
I would frequently fly from
00:24:07.11\00:24:11.78
Los Angeles to Beijing. I
get on the plane in seconds
00:24:11.78\00:24:14.65
I would be over
the Pacific Ocean.
00:24:14.65\00:24:16.45
I'd read a book.
I'd watch a movie.
00:24:16.45\00:24:18.92
I'd start another
book. I'd take a nap,
00:24:18.92\00:24:21.02
and you know what? At
600 miles an hour we were
00:24:21.02\00:24:23.22
still over the
Pacific Ocean. It's massive.
00:24:23.22\00:24:25.56
It's huge and yet,
it's very well documented.
00:24:25.56\00:24:28.36
The entire ocean, not
just the Pacific, our entire
00:24:28.36\00:24:31.03
hydrosphere is collapsing,
the ocean specifically.
00:24:31.03\00:24:35.40
The life in it, the fish in it,
the very acid levels which are
00:24:35.40\00:24:39.24
affecting life
chains, our corals,
00:24:39.24\00:24:41.58
everything's falling apart
the most rapidly of any system
00:24:41.58\00:24:44.91
that we are
observing. It's profound
00:24:44.91\00:24:47.18
and it's very serious. JB:
And the implications of this
00:24:47.18\00:24:51.85
collapsing ocean will be what?
SC: Well over there the economic
00:24:51.85\00:24:54.89
implications are
huge, though we're mostly
00:24:54.89\00:24:57.99
focusing on the spiritual.
But let's go to the things
00:24:57.99\00:25:00.23
that are linked to prophecy.
We've got a billion people
00:25:00.23\00:25:03.80
who depend primarily
on the ocean for food.
00:25:03.80\00:25:06.37
Each year that
food gets less now.
00:25:06.37\00:25:08.80
The resource is less on
a global basis, but within
00:25:08.80\00:25:12.97
25 years or less,
it'll be entirely fished out
00:25:12.97\00:25:16.98
for all practical purposes.
Then you have got a billion
00:25:16.98\00:25:19.45
people that, starting now,
are having to transition over
00:25:19.45\00:25:22.98
to land-based food. Now,
we are right at a razor's
00:25:22.98\00:25:26.92
edge between the amount of food
that we produce and the amount
00:25:26.92\00:25:30.39
of food that we consume.
Last year we consumed more food
00:25:30.39\00:25:33.43
than we produced. Yes,
that's a very big deal.
00:25:33.43\00:25:36.40
It's very serious.
We're in a world of trouble
00:25:36.40\00:25:40.30
and we can see the process
is flowing that, where society
00:25:40.30\00:25:43.84
becomes more destabilized,
we see more wars and rumors
00:25:43.84\00:25:47.58
of wars over food, over
water, over oil, over metals,
00:25:47.58\00:25:51.78
over something like phosphate,
which is a critically pressured
00:25:51.78\00:25:55.02
resource. All of
these things are coming
00:25:55.02\00:25:57.12
at once in our age.
We're seeing this confluence
00:25:57.12\00:26:01.16
of forces. JB:
Won't we figure it out?
00:26:01.16\00:26:04.16
I mean, we've got brilliant
people around this world.
00:26:04.16\00:26:06.43
We've figured out
all the problems so far.
00:26:06.43\00:26:09.13
I mean, isn't
there a way out of this?
00:26:09.13\00:26:11.80
SC: It is the fundamental nature
of man to try and figure out
00:26:11.80\00:26:15.90
a solution to
these, to problems.
00:26:15.90\00:26:18.97
And we've dodged the
bullet, as a global society,
00:26:18.97\00:26:22.48
we've dodged the
bullet a number of times.
00:26:22.48\00:26:24.48
But we've got a number of
problems facing us right now.
00:26:24.48\00:26:27.85
We've got a decay
in our atmosphere.
00:26:27.85\00:26:31.55
We've got a decay in our
hydrosphere -- that's fresh
00:26:31.55\00:26:34.02
water and salt water.
We've got significant decay
00:26:34.02\00:26:37.39
of soils around the world,
and their ability to produce.
00:26:37.39\00:26:41.66
We've got a
growing population base.
00:26:41.66\00:26:44.67
If we look at one problem, one
universal problem that the globe
00:26:44.67\00:26:50.37
got together, the nations
of the earth got together
00:26:50.37\00:26:53.31
and solved, what
would that problem be?
00:26:53.31\00:26:56.68
There's almost no example.
So we've got these numbers
00:26:56.68\00:26:59.88
of problems which are converging
and which accelerate each other
00:26:59.88\00:27:03.82
and we've got no
basis for solving anything.
00:27:03.82\00:27:06.42
But, above and beyond
that, let me ask again,
00:27:06.42\00:27:09.16
you know, what is the proposal
for reversing the effects of sin
00:27:09.16\00:27:12.83
and how does that
sync with scripture?
00:27:12.83\00:27:15.36
JB: So, looking at this
scripturally, the environment
00:27:15.36\00:27:17.40
is falling apart as a
result of sin collapsing.
00:27:17.40\00:27:19.90
What's the end game?
SC: The end game is laid out
00:27:19.90\00:27:22.77
very well in Matthew
24 and it's a good chapter
00:27:22.77\00:27:26.31
to read every month. We
know that we have a time
00:27:26.31\00:27:28.98
of little trouble coming.
We know we have a time of great
00:27:28.98\00:27:31.98
trouble coming, and we know that
Christ's coming is soon and this
00:27:31.98\00:27:35.92
really is my message to people.
It's not an environmental
00:27:35.92\00:27:38.25
message. The message is Jesus
00:27:38.25\00:27:40.42
really is coming. JB:
And the environment is yet
00:27:40.42\00:27:43.79
another marker,
demonstrator of that fact.
00:27:43.79\00:27:46.73
SC: Right.
Christ would not tell us
00:27:46.73\00:27:48.30
in Mark 13 to watch and
give us nothing to watch
00:27:48.30\00:27:51.60
for. And this is one more
sign that His coming is very,
00:27:51.60\00:27:54.50
very soon. Is
our sense of urgency
00:27:54.50\00:27:57.71
commensurate with the
nearness of His coming?
00:27:57.71\00:28:00.88
JB: Facinating discussion today
about the biblical connection
00:28:00.88\00:28:04.08
between the
deterioration of our environment
00:28:04.08\00:28:07.78
and the prophetic
signs of Jesus' return.
00:28:07.78\00:28:12.65
Scott Christiansen,
I'm so thankful you were
00:28:12.65\00:28:14.36
here with me today.
SC: It's been my pleasure.
00:28:14.36\00:28:15.79
JB: Let's take the opportunity
to pray and ask God to bless
00:28:15.79\00:28:18.09
as we get ready
for Jesus' return.
00:28:18.09\00:28:21.00
¤ [Gentle Melody] ¤
Our Father in heaven,
00:28:21.00\00:28:23.23
how thankful we are that we
have much to look forward to.
00:28:23.23\00:28:26.53
The signs around us that herald
the return of Jesus, while they
00:28:26.53\00:28:30.81
can alarm us on so
many levels, also excite us.
00:28:30.81\00:28:33.84
It was Luke who wrote Jesus'
words "When you see these things
00:28:33.84\00:28:37.15
begin to come to pass,
lift up your heads and look up
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for your redemption draws nigh."
Lord, thank you for the message
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that around us the world tells
us our redemption draws nigh.
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We thank you for a Savior
who loves us enough to return
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and take us home. Let
that day come soon, I pray,
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in Jesus' name, Amen.
¤ [Thoughtful Melody] ¤
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¤ [It Is Written Theme] ¤
Thank you for joining me today.
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I look forward to
seeing you again next time.
00:29:20.66\00:29:22.72
Until then, remember, "It
is written, 'man shall not
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live by bread alone, but
by every word that proceeds
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from the mouth
of God.'" ¤[Music]¤
00:29:30.97\00:29:48.22