>: It has stood
the test of time.
00:00:06.70\00:00:10.61
God's book, the Bible.
00:00:11.01\00:00:15.14
Still relevant in
today's complex world.
00:00:16.51\00:00:20.62
It Is Written,
sharing hope around the globe.
00:00:21.42\00:00:28.69
JB: This is It Is
Written. I'm John Bradshaw,
00:00:37.20\00:00:40.24
thanks for joining me today.
One of the most colorful and
00:00:40.24\00:00:43.51
significant characters in
the entire Bible is King David.
00:00:43.51\00:00:47.91
As a shepherd boy, armed with
just a handful of stones and a
00:00:47.91\00:00:51.55
leather sling, he took
down the giant Goliath.
00:00:51.55\00:00:55.52
With his bare hands he killed
a lion and he killed a bear.
00:00:55.52\00:00:59.22
He ruled Israel
during a period of greatness.
00:00:59.22\00:01:02.62
Jesus is known
as the Son of David.
00:01:02.62\00:01:05.83
King David, did he even exist?
00:01:05.83\00:01:08.56
From an
archeological point of view
00:01:08.56\00:01:10.77
what evidence is there that
validates the existence of David
00:01:10.77\00:01:14.24
and the existence of
his once-mighty kingdom?
00:01:14.24\00:01:17.41
My guest today is
Dr. Michael Hasel,
00:01:17.41\00:01:19.24
an archeologist and a
professor of archeology at
00:01:19.24\00:01:22.61
Southern Adventist
University. Dr. Hasel,
00:01:22.61\00:01:24.88
welcome to It Is Written.
MH: It's great to be here, John.
00:01:24.88\00:01:26.95
JB: Thanks for joining me today.
Let's talk about this character,
00:01:26.95\00:01:29.08
David, because in archeological
circles for years there have
00:01:29.08\00:01:32.79
been many who have said he
didn't exist, or his kingdom
00:01:32.79\00:01:35.59
didn't exist,
because we find no evidence.
00:01:35.59\00:01:38.66
And from an archeological,
historical point of view,
00:01:38.66\00:01:41.63
that's
significant. If we can't prove
00:01:41.63\00:01:45.07
the existence of David,
that then calls the Bible--
00:01:45.07\00:01:48.20
the entire
Bible-- into question.
00:01:48.20\00:01:50.27
Tell me something about
your work and what we've learned
00:01:50.27\00:01:52.44
about David, his existence,
his kingdom, and more.
00:01:52.44\00:01:55.18
MH: David is a central figure,
as you've said, in history.
00:01:55.18\00:01:58.28
If we remove David, we remove
a huge portion of the Bible.
00:01:58.28\00:02:02.38
And we do much more
than that, as you mentioned.
00:02:02.38\00:02:05.05
Jesus is the Son of
David, so it's through
00:02:05.05\00:02:07.49
the line of David that
the Messiah is promised.
00:02:07.49\00:02:10.06
David reigned in about 1000 BC
for a period of about 40 years.
00:02:10.06\00:02:15.53
His first seven years as a
king was in Hebron, and later he
00:02:15.53\00:02:18.40
established the
capital of Jerusalem.
00:02:18.40\00:02:20.50
Jerusalem still
serves as the capital today,
00:02:20.50\00:02:22.77
after 3,000 years.
It's hard to believe.
00:02:22.77\00:02:24.87
I don't think you can compare
a lot of other capitals of
00:02:24.87\00:02:27.34
the world like that. JB: Right.
00:02:27.34\00:02:28.74
MH: So, what do you do
with Jerusalem without David?
00:02:28.74\00:02:30.58
That's another big question.
But there's been a controversy
00:02:30.58\00:02:33.52
about David in the
last 20 to 25 years.
00:02:33.52\00:02:36.42
Was the kingdom of David
as large or as extensive?
00:02:36.42\00:02:40.26
Now, the first question
that came along early on was,
00:02:40.26\00:02:44.59
did David even exist.
Today that question is not as
00:02:44.59\00:02:47.30
big of a question anymore,
because in 1993 an inscription
00:02:47.30\00:02:51.23
was found at Tel Dan that
documented not only the king of
00:02:51.23\00:02:55.14
Israel, but documented the
House of David, referring to
00:02:55.14\00:02:58.71
the kingdom of Judah. And
David was clearly mentioned
00:02:58.71\00:03:00.78
for the first time as the
founder of a dynasty that was
00:03:00.78\00:03:04.28
remembered, in that inscription,
140 years after his reign.
00:03:04.28\00:03:09.28
So David we know existed
now. The question has turned to,
00:03:09.28\00:03:13.15
was his kingdom as extensive
as the Bible describes.
00:03:13.15\00:03:16.22
Was his son Solomon's
kingdom as extensive as
00:03:16.22\00:03:18.63
the Bible describes.
That's really where things
00:03:18.63\00:03:21.23
lie right now. And
part of the problem is that
00:03:21.23\00:03:23.77
archeology has not uncovered
a lot of evidence for cities
00:03:23.77\00:03:30.74
during the time of David
particularly, up to this point
00:03:30.74\00:03:33.74
in time, until just recently.
JB: Are there good reasons
00:03:33.74\00:03:36.31
for that? MH: I think there are.
00:03:36.31\00:03:37.85
Jerusalem has been an occupied
city continuously over the
00:03:37.85\00:03:40.85
centuries and it still
is an occupied city today.
00:03:40.85\00:03:43.92
And the places that can be
excavated in Jerusalem are very
00:03:43.92\00:03:46.82
limited, because people live
there, they have houses there,
00:03:46.82\00:03:49.19
they have businesses there.
The temple mount is a holy place
00:03:49.19\00:03:52.66
still today for Islam, the
third most holy place for Islam;
00:03:52.66\00:03:55.73
where the temple mount was,
now the Dome of the Rock stands.
00:03:55.73\00:03:59.93
Now, in the village of
Solon and down along the spur of
00:03:59.93\00:04:06.47
Mt. Moriah, you have the ancient
city of David, the historical
00:04:06.47\00:04:11.68
remains of that city, and that's
currently being excavated by an
00:04:11.68\00:04:14.68
archeologist named Eilat Mazar,
and she has made some amazing
00:04:14.68\00:04:17.72
discoveries in recent
years relating to that period.
00:04:17.72\00:04:21.16
JB: So tell me about some of
the things that have been found,
00:04:21.16\00:04:23.26
unearthed, turned up by
archeologists that we can say,
00:04:23.26\00:04:28.06
now we have this evidence
that answers certain questions.
00:04:28.06\00:04:32.17
MH: In Jerusalem it's difficult
because there's so much overlay
00:04:32.17\00:04:35.47
of one building after another
that it's difficult sometimes.
00:04:35.47\00:04:39.57
Later buildings destroy earlier
buildings, so it's difficult to
00:04:39.57\00:04:43.28
really ascertain whether we're
dealing with a structure from
00:04:43.28\00:04:47.85
the time of David or not.
Eilat Mazar has made a very
00:04:47.85\00:04:50.29
strong claim that she has found
part of the palace of David
00:04:50.29\00:04:53.72
in Jerusalem, and that's been
00:04:53.72\00:04:55.16
a contentious claim because,
again, only part of that
00:04:55.16\00:04:58.09
building was found. What
does it date to, how does
00:04:58.09\00:05:00.70
it relate to later
constructions and so forth?
00:05:00.70\00:05:03.83
So there it's a
little bit less clear.
00:05:03.83\00:05:06.43
We do know now, based on
excavations that we conducted in
00:05:06.43\00:05:10.21
the Elah Valley where
the famous battle between
00:05:10.21\00:05:12.84
David and Goliath took
place, according to 1 Samuel 17,
00:05:12.84\00:05:16.51
we have discovered a new
site with the modern name of
00:05:16.51\00:05:19.28
Khirbet Qeiyafa. And
that site in the last seven
00:05:19.28\00:05:22.75
years has contributed major new
data on the history of David.
00:05:22.75\00:05:27.26
JB: Okay, I want to ask,
how did this become identified
00:05:27.26\00:05:30.56
as a site?
Because you're dealing
00:05:30.56\00:05:32.59
with something
that's 3,000 years old.
00:05:32.59\00:05:35.46
How do you know when
you're dealing with something
00:05:35.46\00:05:37.80
of significance? That's part A.
00:05:37.80\00:05:40.54
Part B, what do you find
00:05:40.54\00:05:43.14
when you go to these places?
Are you walking into rooms,
00:05:43.14\00:05:46.81
are you digging into the ground
and sifting buckets of dirt?
00:05:46.81\00:05:50.35
What's found? MH: My
colleague Professor Yosef
00:05:50.35\00:05:53.98
Garfinkel from the Hebrew
University needed a biblical
00:05:53.98\00:05:57.35
site to excavate, and one of his
students directed him to this
00:05:57.35\00:06:00.96
particular location.
This site has been known
00:06:00.96\00:06:03.16
for over 100 years. The
walls of the city are still
00:06:03.16\00:06:06.16
visible from above ground.
The walls, I should say, of the
00:06:06.16\00:06:09.13
later city. There's
two cities superimposed
00:06:09.13\00:06:12.77
on top of each other.
That Hellenistic wall is still
00:06:12.77\00:06:15.80
known today; you can see
the site today physically.
00:06:15.80\00:06:18.94
And when they began excavations
there in 2007 for only two weeks
00:06:18.94\00:06:21.91
with a few students
from the Hebrew University,
00:06:21.91\00:06:24.21
they uncovered a
gate-- a massive gate that
00:06:24.21\00:06:27.12
predated the Hellenistic city,
made of monumental boulders--
00:06:27.12\00:06:32.79
some as large as this desk,
weighing five to six tons each.
00:06:32.79\00:06:38.29
And this monumental gate had
a double wall connected to it
00:06:38.29\00:06:42.10
running to the north and another
one running to the south.
00:06:42.10\00:06:45.53
And they saw that,
based on the pottery,
00:06:45.53\00:06:48.77
which is what we use for dating,
and the changes in pottery,
00:06:48.77\00:06:52.64
they determined that
that gate dated back to about
00:06:52.64\00:06:54.94
1000 BC. They
thought this would warrant
00:06:54.94\00:06:58.81
further investigation, so it
was a trial excavation and they
00:06:58.81\00:07:03.65
decided to start
a long-term project.
00:07:03.65\00:07:06.09
And Professor Garfinkel met me
in San Diego at our professional
00:07:06.09\00:07:08.72
meetings and said, "Michael, I
need a senior American partner.
00:07:08.72\00:07:11.56
Would you like to
join us on the project?"
00:07:11.56\00:07:13.70
So that's how Southern Adventist
University got involved.
00:07:13.70\00:07:15.96
JB: They found a
gate, they found boulders.
00:07:15.96\00:07:17.87
How did they find
them? What are they finding?
00:07:17.87\00:07:20.30
Walk me through the process
an archeologist goes through?
00:07:20.30\00:07:22.70
MH: Sure. We're
excavating from the
00:07:22.70\00:07:24.11
surface down through various
strata, or various layers.
00:07:24.11\00:07:27.94
We try to start from the known,
so if we see some architecture
00:07:27.94\00:07:31.05
from the surface or from
the side, we try to begin with
00:07:31.05\00:07:35.58
some kind of idea. We
don't just start randomly
00:07:35.58\00:07:38.19
many times. We try to
make an educated guess
00:07:38.19\00:07:40.76
of where we're going to find
the most, the most bang for our
00:07:40.76\00:07:43.56
buck, if you will. What
they saw on the outside of
00:07:43.56\00:07:46.46
the wall area, a very nice
straight line and then a turn
00:07:46.46\00:07:51.07
in, kind of like a tower, and
then another straight line and
00:07:51.07\00:07:54.50
then it stopped. It
looked like a gate that had
00:07:54.50\00:07:57.27
been blocked in antiquity.
So they began excavating,
00:07:57.27\00:08:01.08
moving down to bedrock
where this gate was established.
00:08:01.08\00:08:05.78
They found two drains leading
out of this gate, one dating to
00:08:05.78\00:08:10.79
the Iron Age, one dating
to the Hellenistic Period.
00:08:10.79\00:08:13.56
The gate had been reused
in the Hellenistic Period,
00:08:13.56\00:08:16.46
one dating back to 1000 BC
and then one 700 years later.
00:08:16.46\00:08:20.30
And what they found was a
massive gate into a small,
00:08:20.30\00:08:24.17
fortified garrison city located
right on the border between
00:08:24.17\00:08:28.27
Philistia and Israel.
What we decided in subsequent
00:08:28.27\00:08:32.01
years is to expand
excavations around the site
00:08:32.01\00:08:35.21
and around the city. We
found houses connected to
00:08:35.21\00:08:38.68
those city walls, we found
thousands of pieces of pottery.
00:08:38.68\00:08:44.72
Some intact pottery pieces,
like this lamp which dates
00:08:44.72\00:08:48.66
back to the time of David.
This is an Iron II Period lamp.
00:08:48.66\00:08:52.99
You can see the burn
marks here, around it.
00:08:52.99\00:08:55.76
This is very typical, this was
not found at Khirbet Qeiyafa,
00:08:55.76\00:08:58.30
but this is very
typical of that period.
00:08:58.30\00:09:00.47
The wick would
have been placed here,
00:09:00.47\00:09:01.87
the oil in here, and
this is a lamp that people
00:09:01.87\00:09:03.84
would have been carrying
around. So we found lamps,
00:09:03.84\00:09:06.91
we found bowls, we
found large storage jars.
00:09:06.91\00:09:10.71
There was a massive destruction
of the site, and what was left
00:09:10.71\00:09:14.05
behind was a very rich deposit
of material that helped us date
00:09:14.05\00:09:18.35
and helped us understand who
lived there and what they were
00:09:18.35\00:09:20.79
doing there. JB:
Also helped us, and helped
00:09:20.79\00:09:23.16
us to understand that the
Bible we hold in our hands today
00:09:23.16\00:09:26.56
can be trusted.
And not only trusted,
00:09:26.56\00:09:28.80
but in many times verified
archeologically that what the
00:09:28.80\00:09:32.43
Bible says is
true, is actually so.
00:09:32.43\00:09:35.00
We'll have more in just
a moment, don't go away.
00:09:35.00\00:09:37.11
¤ [Gentle Melody] ¤ >:
Every Word is a one-minute
00:09:38.14\00:09:40.21
Bible-based daily
devotional presented by
00:09:40.21\00:09:42.44
Pastor John Bradshaw
and designed especially
00:09:42.44\00:09:45.01
for busy people like you.
Look for Every Word on selected
00:09:45.01\00:09:48.75
networks, or watch it
online every day on our website,
00:09:48.75\00:09:51.75
ItIsWritten.com.
00:09:51.75\00:09:53.92
¤ [rythmic melody]  ¤
00:09:54.66\00:09:57.49
JB: Haven't things changed
over the years, and with the
00:09:59.93\00:10:01.90
relentless march of technology
things are still changing.
00:10:01.90\00:10:05.07
Time.com reported that in
America the following things
00:10:05.07\00:10:08.00
will be gone for
good within five years:
00:10:08.00\00:10:10.44
DVD and blu-ray players;
standalone in-car GPS units;
00:10:10.44\00:10:14.64
dial-up Internet access;
low-end digital cameras, and,
00:10:14.64\00:10:17.95
interestingly car keys.
Now, that's a prediction
00:10:17.95\00:10:21.35
not a promise, but
it could well be right
00:10:21.35\00:10:23.59
and it indicates that the
times, they are a-changin'.
00:10:23.59\00:10:27.26
But what will never
cease to be relevant
00:10:27.26\00:10:28.96
is the Word of God.
Isaiah 40 verse 8 says that the
00:10:28.96\00:10:32.46
grass withers, the flower
fades, but the Word of our God
00:10:32.46\00:10:36.03
stands forever. It
will never go out of style.
00:10:36.03\00:10:39.40
It won't ever be
obsolete. And try as they may,
00:10:39.40\00:10:43.00
people will never find a
viable replacement for it.
00:10:43.00\00:10:45.67
In a changing world,
hold tight to the Word of God.
00:10:45.67\00:10:48.58
I'm John Bradshaw
for It Is Written.
00:10:48.58\00:10:51.01
Let's live today by every word.
00:10:51.01\00:10:53.68
JB: This is It Is
Written. I'm John Bradshaw.
00:10:54.95\00:10:57.25
Thanks for joining me
today. We are being joined by
00:10:57.25\00:10:59.65
Dr. Michael Hasel, archeologist
and professor of archeology,
00:10:59.65\00:11:04.16
discussing the kingdom of
David and how the existence,
00:11:04.16\00:11:07.93
or the
nonexistence, of David's kingdom
00:11:07.93\00:11:11.30
impacts the Bible and our
understanding of the Bible.
00:11:11.30\00:11:13.74
Now, Dr. Hasel, we've
discussed the existence of David
00:11:13.74\00:11:16.74
pretty well accepted.
David's kingdom, well,
00:11:16.74\00:11:20.84
there's the question,
because today there are those
00:11:20.84\00:11:23.35
who say it didn't
exist to the extent--
00:11:23.35\00:11:26.41
it wasn't as great or
grand-- as the Bible says.
00:11:26.41\00:11:29.65
What are people
basing those claims on?
00:11:29.65\00:11:31.85
MH: They're
basing them, basically,
00:11:31.85\00:11:33.49
on the absence of evidence.
They're looking at Jerusalem and
00:11:33.49\00:11:35.99
saying we don't have a whole
lot of evidence for David in
00:11:35.99\00:11:38.19
Jerusalem. We
have some possible,
00:11:38.19\00:11:40.60
but it's not undisputed.
We don't have a whole lot of
00:11:40.60\00:11:43.70
evidence outside of
that area for David.
00:11:43.70\00:11:46.94
So maybe David was only
a shepherd king, and maybe
00:11:46.94\00:11:51.24
Jerusalem was not a
fortified city and it was only
00:11:51.24\00:11:53.61
a tent village. There
were no fortified cities
00:11:53.61\00:11:56.11
during this time of history, and
also during the time of Solomon.
00:11:56.11\00:11:59.71
There is no evidence for
extensive literacy during
00:11:59.71\00:12:03.79
this time and writing.
There is no evidence for a
00:12:03.79\00:12:08.62
capital city and extensive
wars with the Philistines,
00:12:08.62\00:12:11.73
as the Bible
describes, during this period.
00:12:11.73\00:12:13.93
There is no evidence for David
and Solomon, really, much in the
00:12:13.93\00:12:17.87
archeological record
and for a kingdom to exist
00:12:17.87\00:12:21.00
to the extent that it does.
JB: It sounds like these are
00:12:21.00\00:12:22.94
valid arguments. MH:
In some ways, but in other
00:12:22.94\00:12:26.34
ways it's always dangerous
in science to make an argument
00:12:26.34\00:12:29.54
out of silence.
Just because the evidence
00:12:29.54\00:12:32.21
doesn't exist
doesn't mean it didn't happen
00:12:32.21\00:12:34.42
especially in archeology.
We know that there are certain
00:12:34.42\00:12:37.39
evidences that don't survive;
we know that we're a very young
00:12:37.39\00:12:41.89
discipline, we haven't
found all that there is to find.
00:12:41.89\00:12:44.89
There are many different kinds
of reasons why we might not find
00:12:44.89\00:12:47.60
the evidence.
Jerusalem has been destroyed and
00:12:47.60\00:12:49.53
destroyed and
destroyed over the centuries.
00:12:49.53\00:12:51.63
It has been razed to the ground.
We might not find all the
00:12:51.63\00:12:54.77
evidence in Jerusalem that we're
looking for, for this period.
00:12:54.77\00:12:57.47
There are good reasons also to
explain the lack of evidence, in
00:12:57.47\00:13:01.51
some cases. JB:
You mentioned something
00:13:01.51\00:13:03.31
that, some things don't survive.
So we are dealing with somebody
00:13:03.31\00:13:06.21
3,000 years ago.
What doesn't make it
00:13:06.21\00:13:09.95
down to today? What
are we never going to find?
00:13:09.95\00:13:11.89
MH: Well, we're not going to
find a lot of written documents
00:13:11.89\00:13:16.29
on parchment or on leather or on
papyrus or that kind of thing.
00:13:16.29\00:13:22.20
Those things would have
all deteriorated, at least in
00:13:22.20\00:13:24.33
Jerusalem and in the
vicinity that we're excavating.
00:13:24.33\00:13:26.67
JB: So we're hopeful to find,
then, inscriptions that have
00:13:26.67\00:13:29.10
been carved into stone.
MH: Either carved into stone or
00:13:29.10\00:13:31.41
written on pottery.
There's not a lot of them that
00:13:31.41\00:13:34.21
have been found
during the 10th century BC.
00:13:34.21\00:13:36.75
There was one inscription, the
Gezer inscription, a calendar
00:13:36.75\00:13:39.01
that was found, that
dates back to the 10th century.
00:13:39.01\00:13:42.85
But in the last few years
it's been very exciting because
00:13:42.85\00:13:44.95
we've found a lot
more, at least in comparison.
00:13:44.95\00:13:48.46
At Khirbet Qeiyafa, in the
second season of excavation in
00:13:48.46\00:13:51.76
2008, a discovery was made
that was quite sensational.
00:13:51.76\00:13:56.83
It was on a broken piece of
pottery, like this one, and it
00:13:56.83\00:14:01.10
was five lines of
writing on that pottery.
00:14:01.10\00:14:04.21
That particular piece of pottery
was found in a house right
00:14:04.21\00:14:08.34
adjacent, just north of
the gate, in situ, in context.
00:14:08.34\00:14:13.35
It was written in
letters that were legible
00:14:13.35\00:14:17.62
to a certain degree.
Obviously the ink had faded over
00:14:17.62\00:14:20.59
3,000 years and some of
the letters were more legible
00:14:20.59\00:14:23.89
than others. We sent
it to the top labs in
00:14:23.89\00:14:26.76
the United States, imaging labs
at Megavision and Cedars Sinai
00:14:26.76\00:14:30.67
Hospital, to get the best
images we could for reading it.
00:14:30.67\00:14:33.77
And there have been a number
of different readings of it.
00:14:33.77\00:14:36.57
But most scholars agree that it
probably is written in Hebrew.
00:14:36.57\00:14:40.54
If it was written in
Hebrew, it would be the oldest
00:14:40.54\00:14:42.54
Hebrew inscription
ever found in history.
00:14:42.54\00:14:45.15
Now, that's quite amazing,
because you're talking about an
00:14:45.15\00:14:47.38
inscription that is between
1,000 and 800 years older than
00:14:47.38\00:14:51.72
the Dead Sea Scrolls. JB: Yeah.
00:14:51.72\00:14:53.92
What else has been found that
talks to us about David and the
00:14:53.92\00:14:56.02
extent of his kingdom?
MH: Well, the fortification
00:14:56.02\00:14:58.06
question. So there
were no fortifications
00:14:58.06\00:14:59.86
during that time. We
have a massively fortified
00:14:59.86\00:15:01.96
site, with double, or we
call them casemate walls,
00:15:01.96\00:15:05.50
surrounding the whole city.
We have a gate here, we have a
00:15:05.50\00:15:08.94
second gate that was
discovered in 2009 over here.
00:15:08.94\00:15:11.64
One facing
Philistia, one facing Jerusalem,
00:15:11.64\00:15:14.81
or the road
leading up to Jerusalem.
00:15:14.81\00:15:16.44
So we have this
massive fortified site--
00:15:16.44\00:15:19.05
we're estimating
between 100 and 200,000 tons of
00:15:19.05\00:15:22.95
stone were used to build
the fortification system.
00:15:22.95\00:15:26.12
This is not a cow pen or
a sheep pen that some farmer
00:15:26.12\00:15:30.16
was using for their purposes;
this was a garrison city.
00:15:30.16\00:15:34.20
We have found
weapons in the city.
00:15:34.20\00:15:36.40
We've found three
iron swords, in 2010.
00:15:36.40\00:15:39.97
One of our students from
Southern Adventist University
00:15:39.97\00:15:41.90
suddenly uncovered these swords.
And they were iron, which also
00:15:41.90\00:15:45.41
was interesting because
the Bible talks about the
00:15:45.41\00:15:48.21
Philistines
having iron capabilities,
00:15:48.21\00:15:50.65
not the Israelites.
There's a lot of intriguing
00:15:50.65\00:15:53.08
things that are
happening at this site.
00:15:53.08\00:15:55.08
Seven seasons of excavations
now, and we've excavated 30
00:15:55.08\00:15:58.25
percent of that site-- because
it's a fairly small site,
00:15:58.25\00:16:00.99
with not a lot of accumulation.
We have uncovered thousands and
00:16:00.99\00:16:05.19
thousands of bones. This
now speaks to the identity
00:16:05.19\00:16:08.93
of who lived at the site.
Because some of the critics have
00:16:08.93\00:16:12.83
said, well, it could have been
a Philistine site, it could have
00:16:12.83\00:16:15.27
been a Canaanite site.
What makes it an Israelite site
00:16:15.27\00:16:17.77
or a Judean site?
JB: Fair question.
00:16:17.77\00:16:19.21
MH: It's a fair
question. JB: Sure.
00:16:19.21\00:16:20.78
MH: So, we look at the bones.
And you've heard the expression,
00:16:20.78\00:16:24.38
you are what you
eat. JB: Yeah, sure.
00:16:24.38\00:16:26.38
MH: So, we're
looking at the bones.
00:16:26.38\00:16:27.68
These are bones that
people have left behind.
00:16:27.68\00:16:29.55
They weren't
vegetarian, they were eating.
00:16:29.55\00:16:31.85
But we haven't found a single
pig bone in the entire field
00:16:31.85\00:16:37.33
seasons of excavation,
among thousands of bones.
00:16:37.33\00:16:40.30
By contrast, at Gath,
where Goliath came from--
00:16:40.30\00:16:43.83
which is our neighboring
site-- and at Ekron--
00:16:43.83\00:16:46.37
I've excavated at Ekron for
many years-- 15 to 30 percent
00:16:46.37\00:16:50.94
of the bones are pig
bones. The Philistines ate pig;
00:16:50.94\00:16:54.64
the Judeans did not. And
this is very good evidence
00:16:54.64\00:16:58.41
that we have a Judean site.
The architecture is Judean.
00:16:58.41\00:17:02.65
That double
casemate wall is Judean.
00:17:02.65\00:17:05.02
The pottery is
Judean. This is a Philistine
00:17:05.02\00:17:08.12
piece of pottery, just
to give you a comparison.
00:17:08.12\00:17:10.23
They're brightly painted, many
times with different colors.
00:17:10.23\00:17:13.09
This is a bi-chrome
ware, which has two colors:
00:17:13.09\00:17:16.60
red and black. This
is a bird, by the way.
00:17:16.60\00:17:18.83
This is the wing of the
bird, the neck of the bird.
00:17:18.83\00:17:21.64
This is a typical bi-chrome
crater that was coming from
00:17:21.64\00:17:25.81
Philistia. We find
a few of these pieces,
00:17:25.81\00:17:30.15
but 99.9 percent of the pottery
at Khirbet Qeiyafa is typical
00:17:30.15\00:17:34.52
Judean ware. And so,
while it came probably
00:17:34.52\00:17:39.19
from Ashdod, from the coast,
maybe a few imported pieces
00:17:39.19\00:17:42.16
came in. The
majority of the material
00:17:42.16\00:17:44.33
is Judean. So we
believe we're excavating,
00:17:44.33\00:17:47.66
or we have excavated a Judean
site, the architecture of which
00:17:47.66\00:17:50.93
becomes a prototype for other
important Judean cities like
00:17:50.93\00:17:54.27
Beer-Sheva and other sites
that we excavate 200 years later
00:17:54.27\00:17:59.31
in the territory of
Judah. JB: So the life of an
00:17:59.31\00:18:01.98
archeologist in the
field, I imagine finding
00:18:01.98\00:18:04.41
those swords, that's
when you get real excited.
00:18:04.41\00:18:07.68
MH: Sure. JB: Finding a sword,
00:18:07.68\00:18:09.48
that doesn't
happen every day, does it?
00:18:09.48\00:18:10.92
MH: No. JB: As
exciting as Indiana Jones
00:18:10.92\00:18:14.69
made it seem, there's
just got to be a lot of long,
00:18:14.69\00:18:17.29
hot days in the sun.
What makes it worthwhile?
00:18:17.29\00:18:20.83
MH: You're uncovering not only
history, but you're uncovering
00:18:20.83\00:18:24.67
the world of the Bible.
To me, that's what makes it
00:18:24.67\00:18:27.30
exciting. And when
you discover a site
00:18:27.30\00:18:29.47
like Khirbet Qeiyafa, that dates
back to the time of David, that
00:18:29.47\00:18:32.81
may actually have been built by
Saul or David, we actually think
00:18:32.81\00:18:36.91
that we have identified that
site with one of the biblical
00:18:36.91\00:18:39.35
sites mentioned in the
story of David and Goliath,
00:18:39.35\00:18:41.62
in 1 Samuel 17. Because
when David slays Goliath
00:18:41.62\00:18:45.22
and chops off his head, it says
the Philistines ran along the
00:18:45.22\00:18:48.16
Sha arayim road, back to
the gates of Gath and Ekron.
00:18:48.16\00:18:51.83
Well, Sha arayim in
Hebrew means "two gates."
00:18:51.83\00:18:55.60
Sha ar means gate, ayim is
the dual ending, it means two.
00:18:55.60\00:18:59.47
So, Sha arayim means two gates.
We have two gates at Khirbet
00:18:59.47\00:19:02.94
Qeiyafa, that's very unusual.
All of the cities, in Judah and
00:19:02.94\00:19:07.18
in northern Israel, all of them
that have been excavated have
00:19:07.18\00:19:09.68
only one gate. The
exception is Jerusalem,
00:19:09.68\00:19:12.01
but all of them
only have one gate.
00:19:12.01\00:19:13.68
So why is this
called Sha arayim?
00:19:13.68\00:19:16.35
We believe we may have found the
city of Sha arayim that we have
00:19:16.35\00:19:19.39
been excavating.
And if that's the case,
00:19:19.39\00:19:21.09
we've actually found a city
that has never been identified;
00:19:21.09\00:19:23.46
a biblical city
that's never been identified.
00:19:23.46\00:19:25.93
And we've
connected it back to David.
00:19:25.93\00:19:28.13
Sha arayim is mentioned
three times in the Bible,
00:19:28.13\00:19:30.93
twice in connection with David.
00:19:30.93\00:19:32.93
Here is a very important
element, I think, again in the
00:19:32.93\00:19:36.50
pieces that
begin to fit together.
00:19:36.50\00:19:39.17
And, no longer can it
be said that we don't have
00:19:39.17\00:19:42.74
fortifications
during this time period.
00:19:42.74\00:19:44.98
No longer can it be
said we don't have literacy.
00:19:44.98\00:19:47.48
Interestingly, only
about two years ago,
00:19:47.48\00:19:49.88
Eilat Mazar in Jerusalem
also found a broken piece
00:19:49.88\00:19:52.99
of a jar with an incised
inscription on it, in Hebrew,
00:19:52.99\00:19:57.16
that dates a little bit earlier
even than our inscription.
00:19:57.16\00:20:00.46
So we now have a
piece from Jerusalem,
00:20:00.46\00:20:02.60
we have a piece from Sha
arayim, or Khirbet Qeiyafa.
00:20:02.60\00:20:06.27
And all of these pieces are
pieces of the puzzle that begin
00:20:06.27\00:20:09.97
to come together, to give us
a better picture of literacy,
00:20:09.97\00:20:14.21
of what the kingdom of
Judah looked like during
00:20:14.21\00:20:16.21
its earliest period.
JB: Biblical archeologists
00:20:16.21\00:20:19.18
are finding,
buried in the sands and
00:20:19.18\00:20:22.02
in the dirt of the Middle East,
those things that for you and me
00:20:22.02\00:20:25.85
are faith building and
help us to say yes, we have
00:20:25.85\00:20:30.03
more reason now to
believe in the Word of God.
00:20:30.03\00:20:32.49
I'll be back with
more with Dr. Hasel
00:20:32.49\00:20:34.46
in just a moment.
00:20:34.46\00:20:36.46
¤ [Musical Interlude] ¤
00:20:37.17\00:20:40.04
JB: The book of Daniel tells the
dramatic story of the fall of
00:20:47.11\00:20:50.51
ancient Babylon. During
a royal party, mysterious
00:20:50.51\00:20:54.22
handwriting appeared on a
wall to send a jolting message:
00:20:54.22\00:20:58.69
You have been weighed in
the balances and found wanting.
00:20:58.69\00:21:02.09
Babylon was
overthrown that very night.
00:21:02.09\00:21:05.79
Now, that happened
thousands of years ago,
00:21:05.79\00:21:07.83
but the Bible predicts
a modern Babylon will rise
00:21:07.83\00:21:11.03
and deceive much of the
world. So, how can you avoid
00:21:11.03\00:21:15.20
being deceived? To
learn what the Bible says,
00:21:15.20\00:21:17.87
request your free copy
of "The Fall of Babylon."
00:21:17.87\00:21:21.34
Just call (800) 253-3000, and
ask for "The Fall of Babylon."
00:21:21.34\00:21:27.42
If the lines are
busy, please do try again.
00:21:27.42\00:21:29.85
Or write to It Is Written,
Box 6, Chattanooga, TN 37401,
00:21:29.85\00:21:36.46
and we'll mail a
free copy to your address
00:21:36.46\00:21:38.29
in North
America. It Is Written is
00:21:38.29\00:21:40.10
a faith-based
ministry, and your support makes
00:21:40.10\00:21:42.53
it possible for us to share
God's good news with the world.
00:21:42.53\00:21:46.07
Your tax deductible gift
can be sent to the address
00:21:46.07\00:21:48.47
on your screen, or
through our website,
00:21:48.47\00:21:50.84
ItIsWritten.com.
Thank you for your continued
00:21:50.84\00:21:53.88
prayerful support. That
toll-free number again is
00:21:53.88\00:21:56.71
(800) 253-3000, and our
web address is ItIsWritten.com.
00:21:56.71\00:22:04.72
JB: This is It Is Written.
Thanks for joining us today.
00:22:06.02\00:22:08.86
Dr. Hasel, in talking about
archeology, what are the things
00:22:08.86\00:22:14.96
that get archeologists
excited? If I found this,
00:22:14.96\00:22:18.43
if we can discover that.
What are the buzz words in the
00:22:18.43\00:22:20.64
language of archeology?
MH: Archeologists get excited
00:22:20.64\00:22:23.97
about a lot of different things:
the ways that people lived,
00:22:23.97\00:22:28.28
and so forth. But I
think really down, down,
00:22:28.28\00:22:30.15
you know, somebody once said an
archeologist is just a boy who
00:22:30.15\00:22:34.32
never grew out of the
sandbox. We like to dig.
00:22:34.32\00:22:37.12
We like to dig for
treasure, in a sense.
00:22:37.12\00:22:39.05
We're not treasure hunters,
but these are treasures.
00:22:39.05\00:22:42.09
These are gifts that we have
from ancient civilization that
00:22:42.09\00:22:45.19
help us understand them better.
For me probably one of the most
00:22:45.19\00:22:48.40
exciting things that an
archeologist could find would be
00:22:48.40\00:22:51.87
inscriptions that talk about
ancient history, that talk about
00:22:51.87\00:22:56.74
kings, what took place.
That would give insight into the
00:22:56.74\00:23:01.58
thinking behind people.
We have to imagine from these
00:23:01.58\00:23:04.81
artifacts, many times,
what people thought and
00:23:04.81\00:23:07.32
what they did. We
have to kind of reconstruct
00:23:07.32\00:23:09.75
the past. There's a
lot of interpretation.
00:23:09.75\00:23:12.45
But with texts, we
can also then compare.
00:23:12.45\00:23:15.39
How do these texts match up with
what we find in Assyria or what
00:23:15.39\00:23:18.66
we find in Egypt or
what we find in the Bible?
00:23:18.66\00:23:21.26
And to me that
becomes very, very exciting.
00:23:21.26\00:23:23.50
JB: Now, excluding the obvious
things like the antiquities in
00:23:23.50\00:23:26.84
Turkey and
Egypt, excluding that.
00:23:26.84\00:23:29.50
Have we found all the good stuff
yet, or is there a lot more
00:23:29.50\00:23:32.97
waiting to be
discovered? In your opinion.
00:23:32.97\00:23:34.78
MH: Israel is one of
the most excavated countries
00:23:34.78\00:23:37.71
in the world. They
have a whole government
00:23:37.71\00:23:40.48
agency focused on excavation.
The national parks in Israel are
00:23:40.48\00:23:44.15
archeological national parks.
It's a huge tourism industry as
00:23:44.15\00:23:48.49
well as anything else, I mean,
people flock by the millions to
00:23:48.49\00:23:51.46
Masada every year
and to other sites.
00:23:51.46\00:23:54.00
I think there's a huge amount
left to uncover in Israel.
00:23:54.00\00:23:58.00
We've barely
scratched the surface.
00:23:58.00\00:23:59.87
Yes, there's wonderful things
that have been found, but there
00:23:59.87\00:24:03.17
are sites that we know about,
that haven't even been touched,
00:24:03.17\00:24:06.51
let alone excavated.
And I think the future in
00:24:06.51\00:24:09.24
archeology will
bring us even more.
00:24:09.24\00:24:12.11
Look at Khirbet Qeiyafa,
what it gave us for David.
00:24:12.11\00:24:15.98
How many other Khirbet Qeiyafas
are there for other periods
00:24:15.98\00:24:18.72
of history?
That's what the future of
00:24:18.72\00:24:20.79
archeology holds for us.
JB: Now, I'm happy to talk about
00:24:20.79\00:24:23.09
evidence that supports
believing in the Bible.
00:24:23.09\00:24:25.49
MH: Right. JB: I
think that's good.
00:24:25.49\00:24:27.13
MH: It is good. JB:
However, the Bible says
00:24:27.13\00:24:30.23
man shall not live
by archeology alone,
00:24:30.23\00:24:34.47
but by every word that proceeds
00:24:34.47\00:24:36.07
out of the mouth of God. Do
I as a believer-- and I'm not
00:24:36.07\00:24:40.14
trying to discredit archeology,
and you understand that--
00:24:40.14\00:24:42.68
do I need archeology
in order to be able to
00:24:42.68\00:24:45.25
have a solid faith in God?
Do I need to be able to say,
00:24:45.25\00:24:48.65
that's where David lived,
and that's where Jesus was
00:24:48.65\00:24:51.89
crucified, and here's some
temple or a piece of pottery?
00:24:51.89\00:24:55.82
Let's put that in its place.
What's the actual role of that?
00:24:55.82\00:24:58.86
MH: No, I don't
think we need archeology.
00:24:58.86\00:25:01.20
And Christianity and Judaism
survived for thousands of years
00:25:01.20\00:25:04.93
without archeology.
People lived and died for their
00:25:04.93\00:25:07.74
faith without archeology,
and people are still doing that
00:25:07.74\00:25:10.97
today, many of them
ignorant about archeology.
00:25:10.97\00:25:13.14
So, where I think archeology
plays a role, it's a tool.
00:25:13.14\00:25:16.81
It's a tool to illuminate the
Bible, and particularly in the
00:25:16.81\00:25:19.58
skeptical postmodern
age in which we live,
00:25:19.58\00:25:22.35
it answers many
questions, I think, that people
00:25:22.35\00:25:25.32
are asking
today about the Bible.
00:25:25.32\00:25:27.29
People who want to really
understand the Bible from a
00:25:27.29\00:25:29.99
three-dimensional way,
that's where archeology
00:25:29.99\00:25:32.23
plays a role. But
the Bible stands alone
00:25:32.23\00:25:35.73
as the Word of God.
JB: How do I then build my
00:25:35.73\00:25:38.20
faith, grow my faith in
God? Archeology or not, how do I
00:25:38.20\00:25:42.14
build my faith in the Word?
Now, for me, I'm happy to admit,
00:25:42.14\00:25:46.37
when I encounter archeological
discoveries, I say, aha!
00:25:46.37\00:25:49.44
That strengthens me. MH: Sure.
00:25:49.44\00:25:51.55
JB: How would you
recommend to anybody,
00:25:51.55\00:25:53.18
grow your faith in
God-- MH: Just what you did
00:25:53.18\00:25:54.78
right there. You
open the Word of God.
00:25:54.78\00:25:56.85
You read the Word of
God. You eat the Word of God.
00:25:56.85\00:25:59.95
You digest the Word of
God, and it will change you.
00:25:59.95\00:26:02.79
It will change you. It's
proven to have done that,
00:26:02.79\00:26:05.56
over and over again in the
lives of millions of people
00:26:05.56\00:26:07.50
around the
world. God becomes real.
00:26:07.50\00:26:09.76
He speaks to you
through His Word.
00:26:09.76\00:26:11.57
And, through that experience,
then, you can become a deeper
00:26:11.57\00:26:15.70
Christian, a deeper person,
understanding what God has and
00:26:15.70\00:26:19.71
planned for you in your life.
JB: Michael, thank you again for
00:26:19.71\00:26:22.44
joining us today.
It's been a blessing
00:26:22.44\00:26:24.48
and I wish you every
blessing of God on future
00:26:24.48\00:26:26.78
archeological expeditions.
You have no intention of slowing
00:26:26.78\00:26:30.55
down anytime soon. MH:
Well, I don't know about
00:26:30.55\00:26:33.05
that, but we have a
few seasons left to go.
00:26:33.05\00:26:35.26
And I know that as long as the
heart is willing we'll continue
00:26:35.26\00:26:39.19
to be working in the field.
JB: May God bless you in that.
00:26:39.19\00:26:40.96
MH: Thank you. JB:
Let's pray together now.
00:26:40.96\00:26:43.00
¤ [underscore of music] ¤
Our Father in heaven, we thank
00:26:43.00\00:26:45.87
You today that You have given us
evidences to support the faith
00:26:45.87\00:26:50.34
that we have in You. We
are grateful that we can
00:26:50.34\00:26:53.48
see Your handiwork
in nature about us.
00:26:53.48\00:26:57.05
We thank You that each
day is a gift, a miracle.
00:26:57.05\00:26:59.88
Life is a miracle
given by the God of heaven.
00:26:59.88\00:27:02.38
I pray that as we consider
those supports to our faith,
00:27:02.38\00:27:07.09
that You'd give us
grace to grow in faith,
00:27:07.09\00:27:09.06
that we would be men and
women, all of us, who would
00:27:09.06\00:27:11.89
stand on Your
Word. Live by faith.
00:27:11.89\00:27:14.63
Live according to the principles
You've outlined in Your Word,
00:27:14.63\00:27:18.13
and grow daily
in our faith in You.
00:27:18.13\00:27:20.54
That our connection
with You would grow strong.
00:27:20.54\00:27:22.40
I want to pray right now
for that one who, in his or her
00:27:22.40\00:27:25.24
heart, knows the connection is
not strong, the faith is weak.
00:27:25.24\00:27:28.81
Come close to that individual.
And friend, if that is you,
00:27:28.81\00:27:30.91
I encourage you to
surrender your life to Jesus now
00:27:30.91\00:27:33.45
and take Him at His Word,
and live your life by faith.
00:27:33.45\00:27:36.75
Today, we thank You Lord. We
ask Your blessing and we pray
00:27:36.75\00:27:40.29
in Jesus' name. Amen.
00:27:40.29\00:27:42.29
MH: Amen. [music fades]
00:27:42.29\00:27:46.19
¤ [It Is Written Theme Music]
¤ JB: I'm so glad you took the
00:27:47.20\00:27:49.53
time to join us today. I
look forward to seeing you
00:27:49.53\00:27:51.63
again next time.
Until then, remember:
00:27:51.63\00:27:54.34
It is written,
man shall not live
00:27:54.34\00:27:57.01
by bread alone,
but by every word
00:27:57.01\00:27:59.91
that proceeds
from the mouth of God.
00:27:59.91\00:28:02.21
¤ [music swells]  ¤
00:28:02.21\00:28:06.58