[Theme Music] It
has stood the test
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of time, God's Book the Bible.
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Still relevant in
today's complex world.
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It Is Written,
sharing hope around the globe.
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Thanks for joining me
today on It Is Written.
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I'm John Bradshaw.
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You know as well as I do that
in recent, environmental issues
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have become very big news.
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People talk about climate
change, the resulting rising
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in sea levels, the polar ice
cap melting, people in danger,
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wildlife endangered, species
becoming even more endangered.
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In recent years there has
been talk about ozone layer
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depletion, nuclear issues,
particularly when natural
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disasters cause problems
at nuclear power stations.
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People fear what are we going
to do to avoid nuclear waste
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and nuclear fall-out.
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If there is any number of
environmental issues today,
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some of them have
been highly politicized but
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my question today is
what does any of this
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have to do with the Bible?
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Maybe nothing, maybe something.
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My guest today is
Scott Christiansen.
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Scott has worked virtually all
of his adult life in Christian
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ministry, at times, working
with environmental issues
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in various parts of the world.
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He has seen up close the
way the environment is changing
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and the effect that that has
on society and its relationship
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to the Bible.
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Scott is an author and
his seminar on the Bible
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and the Environment has
been warmly and enthusiastically
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received all
across North America.
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Scott Christiansen,
thanks for joining me today.
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SC: Thank you John.
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It's my pleasure to be here.
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JB: Tell me, to begin with,
what do environmental issues
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have to do with the
Bible, if anything at all.
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SC: Well, let's go
straight to Scripture.
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Let's go to Matthew 24.
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Christ told his disciples
what the waymarks would be
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before he came.
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He gave us many,
many things to look for.
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And in fact, in
Mark, Chapter 13,
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we are told to watch.
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We have a
responsibility to watch.
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So we are not to be passive.
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When in Matthew 24 we are
told that there will be wars
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and rumors of wars.
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We are told that there
will be pestilences and famines
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and earthquakes
in diverse places.
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In the last 50 years or so we've
seen increasing disturbances
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in the environment and
we are coming to understand
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destabilization in the
environment, destabilizes
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a society and leads to conflict,
and leads to pestilence,
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and leads to famine.
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It leads to the
fulfillment of prophecy and we
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are seeing it now.
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JB: So why are environmental
issues biblical issues?
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Where is the correlation?
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SC: You have to go back
to the systems, not just
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the things that were
created during creation week
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because we all know
that the oceans were made
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and the atmosphere and
everything else but you
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have to go back to the systems.
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JB What do you mean systems?
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SC: Well, our oceanic system
and how it interacts with our
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atmospheric system.
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How these two systems
were created on the same day,
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two halves of one whole, our
atmosphere and our hydrosphere,
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how these were created and are
constantly interacting with each
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other, chemical balances
and thermal balances and that
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enabled, of course, animal life
and the animal life depended
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upon the plant life that
was created which depended,
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of course, upon
the soil being healthy.
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All of these things are systems.
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You've got our fresh
water system and you've got such
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things as our nutrient system,
our nitrogen cycle, our alkaline
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metal cycle, which is
potassium, calcium, magnesium.
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So the Lord made massive
systems, oceanic, atmospheric,
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climate, and he made
small systems and they all fit
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together and work
together perfectly.
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He created
everything in perfection.
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And then sin entered the world.
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JB What did sin do to the
perfection of God's systems?
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SC: What is the
consequence of sin?
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The consequence of sin is death.
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And we have always said, well,
OK, people die, animals die,
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humans understand that.
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What we have not appreciated
is that sin affects the planet
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itself.
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JB: So when death
entered the world and if we stop
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and think about this,
sin brings death but also
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it brought death to
trees and whatever else dies,
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stuff in the water.
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SC: It brought death to every
part of the massive systems
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that God created to
sustain life on this planet
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and, therefore, it brought death
to those systems of selves.
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If every piece is dying,
if every cell in your body
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is dying, then your
entire body is dying.
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God created the planet in such
perfection and in such perfect
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balance that it has
gone on for a very long time.
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However, like a spinning
top, you know, it goes perfectly
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at first.
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It's very stable.
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But then it destabilizes
and it begins to wobble
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and you have
seen the spinning top.
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The end comes very quickly
and looking at the evidence
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in their natural world,
we are at the point where
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the systems that God
created are so affected by sin
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that they are destabilized
and like a top they are wobbling
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significantly.
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JB: Somebody is going to
say, Why are you blaming sin for
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a hole in the ozone layer when
scientifically we would believe
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that that is because of too much
CFC's gone in the environment.
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Why are you blaming sin for
my careless use of refrigerants?
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SC We were told to be
stewards of this planet.
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We were given
dominion over the planet.
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If we were living up to
our charge, we would not be
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destabilizing the earth.
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And that's a fact of sin in man.
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You have to trace the
problem all the way back.
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You can say that
people are not responsible.
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You can say that
corporations aren't responsible.
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You can say that
governments are not responsible
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but that does not trace
the problem back to its roots.
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You trace the
problem back to its roots.
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And it's the effect of sin.
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There is a reason
that God hates sin.
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It only decays, it only
destroys, it only causes death.
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JB: We tend to think of
industrialization and flash
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cars, nice cars, as progress.
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SC: What we have done
as a global human society
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is kind of build a
bubble around ourselves.
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Cars are part of it.
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The industrial
life is a part of it.
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But we think we
don't really need God.
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And we think we don't really
need the world that he created.
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We think that spirituality
is outside of our industrial
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society and we think that nature
is outside of our industrial
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society.
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In fact, God created systems
that support life on this earth
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and we are anything but
outside of those systems.
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So as the earth continues to
decay and it is an accelerating
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decay right now.
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It is not just a linear process,
it is an accelerating decay.
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As the earth continues to
decay, we will be more and more
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destabilized as a global society
and that is a big deal because
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it leaves us to the
fulfillment of prophecy.
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JB: The decay we see in
society not just people killing
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each other and interpersonal
problems, but environmental
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issues we see because
they are a result of sin.
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SC: Absolutely.
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Oh, absolutely!
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Let me give you a specific
example just of a society
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that is being impacted
by environmental decay.
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Let's go to Syria.
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For the last six
years, there has been
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... and it has kind of
gone up and down a little bit,
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but there has been a
very significant drought
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in the Middle East and
in the Mediterranean region.
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So much so that in Syria,
in particular, there have been
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successive years of
crop failures and successive
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years of herds of animals
that could not graze and had
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to be slaughtered.
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Subsistence farmers
had less and less and less.
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Now scientific studies have
validated that the Arab spring,
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so-called, while it
was in response to despotic
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governments, was actually
triggered by a sharp rise
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in food prices.
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So all around the Middle East
you had the Arab spring rise.
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It was triggered
ultimately by this drought.
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Now so what we see
is a shift in climate,
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people that are hungry
and desperate, rebellions
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and then massive death and
displacement and continuing
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disruption to
neighboring countries.
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So we see wars
and rumors of wars.
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We see famine.
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We see pestilence
because of rise in disease.
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This is just one
grain of sand on the scale.
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But when you see the trend that
we are one as a globe, you see
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how this lines up with
prophecy and we are really
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not awake to it.
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JB: Societal issues brought
about by environmental issues,
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which were triggered by sin.
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SC: Right, right.
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JB: In just a moment I am
going to ask you this question.
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I want to give you a
second to think about it.
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The question is: Is
God an environmentalist?
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Give that some thought.
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You can give
that some thought too.
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We'll be back with more on
It is Written in just a moment.
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[Music] ...In
Matthew 4:4 the word
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of God says, "It is written,
'Man shall not live by bread
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alone but by every word that
proceeds from the mouth of God."
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Every Word is a one-minute
Bible-based daily devotional
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presented by pastor John
Bradshaw and designed especially
00:09:41.86\00:09:44.83
for busy people like you.
00:09:44.83\00:09:45.93
Look for Every Word on selected
networks or watch it on line
00:09:45.93\00:09:50.33
everyday on our
website, itiswritten.com.
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Receive a daily spiritual boost.
00:09:54.23\00:09:56.20
Watch Every Word.
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You'll be glad you did.
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Here's a sample.
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Astronomers in Australia
announced a few years ago that
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they had calculated the
number of stars in the sky.
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Seventy sextillion.
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That's seventy thousand
million million million.
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70 followed by 22 zeros.
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That's more stars than there are
grains of sand in all of Earth's
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deserts and beaches.
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And the astronomers say
it's likely their number
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is way too low.
00:10:29.23\00:10:30.36
In Psalms 8:3-4
we read these words.
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"When I consider they heavens,
the work of thy fingers,
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the moon and the stars,
which thou hast ordained,
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what is man that thou art
mindful of him?" God has made
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a universe that vast,
and yet He is still 'mindful'
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of the human family.
00:10:45.63\00:10:46.63
We serve a
great, and a big, God.
00:10:46.63\00:10:48.93
If He made all that - and He did
- you can be certain He can take
00:10:48.93\00:10:53.43
care of you and
your burdens today.
00:10:53.43\00:10:55.76
I'm John Bradshaw
for It Is Written.
00:10:55.76\00:10:57.76
Let's live today by Every Word.
00:10:57.76\00:11:01.83
JB: Thanks for joining
me today on It Is Written.
00:11:01.83\00:11:04.40
My guest today is author,
seminar presenter, Christian
00:11:04.40\00:11:08.26
minister, Scott Christiansen.
00:11:08.26\00:11:10.30
And we are discussing
today the relationship between
00:11:10.30\00:11:12.96
the environment, the decaying
environment, and the Bible.
00:11:12.96\00:11:17.30
Scott, I told you just a moment
ago that I am about to ask
00:11:17.30\00:11:20.36
you this question.
00:11:20.36\00:11:21.36
SC: Right.
00:11:21.36\00:11:22.36
JB: Here's the question.
00:11:22.36\00:11:23.36
Is God an environmentalist?
00:11:23.36\00:11:25.83
SC: If you take the word
"environmentalist" and you ask
00:11:25.83\00:11:29.80
people to define it you
are going to get a bunch
00:11:29.80\00:11:31.40
of different ... so I have to
be careful in my answer because
00:11:31.40\00:11:34.13
if I say yes, then
there is going to be a dozen
00:11:34.13\00:11:36.13
different people thinking
a dozen different things.
00:11:36.13\00:11:38.13
So let me just put it like this.
00:11:38.13\00:11:40.13
When God created the
world, we are told in Job
00:11:40.13\00:11:42.13
that the morning star is
saying that heaven was amazed
00:11:42.13\00:11:45.10
and celebrated
over this amazing earth.
00:11:45.10\00:11:48.46
So if you mean by
environmentalists that this
00:11:48.46\00:11:50.60
is someone who loves the
beauty and majesty of the earth
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and who
celebrates it, then my answer
00:11:54.23\00:11:56.73
is absolutely yes!
00:11:56.73\00:11:57.73
And if you mean that by
environmentalists that this
00:11:57.73\00:12:01.26
is someone who wants to preserve
the earth, then my answer
00:12:01.26\00:12:04.56
is yes.
00:12:04.56\00:12:05.56
And all we have to do is
go to the most commonly quoted
00:12:05.56\00:12:09.96
and memorized text
in all of Christendom.
00:12:09.96\00:12:11.96
"For God so loved the world..."
00:12:11.96\00:12:14.26
JB: There's a tension here.
00:12:14.26\00:12:16.76
Probably in everything there
is a tension and we are going
00:12:16.76\00:12:19.16
to zero-in on the tension here.
00:12:19.16\00:12:20.40
God created the world.
00:12:20.40\00:12:22.40
The question I asked
you is a loaded question,
00:12:22.40\00:12:25.63
"Is God an environmentalist?"
00:12:25.63\00:12:27.63
because it is loaded with
so many different meanings,
00:12:27.63\00:12:29.63
but looking at it, the
first verse of the Bible
00:12:29.63\00:12:31.66
says "in the beginning"
God created so God loves
00:12:31.66\00:12:35.43
the environment,
obviously, and he made a perfect
00:12:35.43\00:12:37.90
and a beautiful earth which
is still very beautiful but far
00:12:37.90\00:12:41.16
from perfect today.
00:12:41.16\00:12:42.23
God made the earth
to serve us, did he not?
00:12:42.23\00:12:47.26
SC: Yes he did.
00:12:47.26\00:12:48.26
It's our home.
00:12:48.26\00:12:49.26
JB: Kill that animal under a
certain circumstance, cut down
00:12:49.26\00:12:52.26
that tree under a
certain circumstance, these were
00:12:52.26\00:12:54.26
renewable resources, so probably
God was not taking a big risk
00:12:54.26\00:12:57.26
with that.
00:12:57.26\00:12:58.26
But there is a tension,
is there not, between how to
00:12:58.26\00:13:01.13
appropriately manage
the environment, how does
00:13:01.13\00:13:06.20
the Christian find that balance?
00:13:06.20\00:13:08.20
SC: First of all, we have
to remember that the world
00:13:08.20\00:13:11.36
is not only
tainted by sin, it is dying
00:13:11.36\00:13:13.66
as a result of sin.
00:13:13.66\00:13:15.16
If we are going to try and
fix something, if we are going
00:13:15.16\00:13:18.26
to try and save the world,
then what is the proposal for
00:13:18.26\00:13:23.40
reversing the effects of sin?
00:13:23.40\00:13:25.70
What is the proposal
for not having prophecy come
00:13:25.70\00:13:29.86
to fulfillment that
the earth will be destroyed
00:13:29.86\00:13:32.60
and recreated?
00:13:32.60\00:13:33.60
JB: Are you saying
that environmental activism
00:13:33.60\00:13:35.60
is futile?
00:13:35.60\00:13:36.60
SC: I have to walk
a very fine line here.
00:13:36.60\00:13:38.60
JB: That's the tension.
00:13:38.60\00:13:39.60
SC: That's the tension
because here's the thing.
00:13:39.60\00:13:42.60
If you only have so much
time and you only have so many
00:13:42.60\00:13:44.60
resources, are you going
to invest those in a planet
00:13:44.60\00:13:46.60
that is dying or are you
going to invest those in people
00:13:46.60\00:13:48.96
who can be saved?
00:13:48.96\00:13:49.96
And you have to
balance that with the fact
00:13:49.96\00:13:52.40
that there is a tremendously
disproportionate distribution
00:13:52.40\00:13:56.33
of resources in the world.
00:13:56.33\00:13:58.33
There is 3.5 billion people
who make less than $2.50 a day.
00:13:58.33\00:14:02.13
Some of those people spend
90% of their income on food
00:14:02.13\00:14:06.13
and their lives are desperate.
00:14:06.13\00:14:08.66
So everything that we do
that consumes more resources,
00:14:08.66\00:14:12.70
disproportionately, in excess if
you will, and everything that we
00:14:12.70\00:14:16.70
do that places a greater
burden on the planet makes those
00:14:16.70\00:14:19.76
people's lives more difficult.
00:14:19.76\00:14:21.76
There is a responsibility there.
00:14:21.76\00:14:23.76
There is a balance
there and I think it is to
00:14:23.76\00:14:26.50
the individual to
decide where it is.
00:14:26.50\00:14:28.86
For me, it is a matter of
putting all of my efforts into
00:14:28.86\00:14:33.16
pointing people to Christ
and his very, very soon coming.
00:14:33.16\00:14:36.56
JB: I imagine ... I am imagining
that if somebody loves God they
00:14:36.56\00:14:40.93
are going to love what God loves
and that would instill in them
00:14:40.93\00:14:45.30
a care, at least,
for the environment.
00:14:45.30\00:14:47.66
Should Christians
be environmentalists?
00:14:47.66\00:14:49.66
Should Christians be greenies?
00:14:49.66\00:14:50.66
SC: Christians should be
environmentalists in this sense.
00:14:50.66\00:14:54.30
Well, first they should be
responsible to their fellow men
00:14:54.30\00:14:57.63
and they should not
have a disproportionate use
00:14:57.63\00:15:00.43
of resources.
00:15:00.43\00:15:01.43
They need to be
careful but at the same time
00:15:01.43\00:15:03.66
understanding, of
course, that the world is dying.
00:15:03.66\00:15:06.26
Christians should be
environmentalists in the sense
00:15:06.26\00:15:09.20
that they are absolutely looking
forward to seeing the earth
00:15:09.20\00:15:12.76
recreated.
00:15:12.76\00:15:13.76
In its full
glory and full majesty.
00:15:13.76\00:15:16.20
In that sense, I am a
raging environmentalist.
00:15:16.20\00:15:18.60
I can hardly wait to
see the earth as God created
00:15:18.60\00:15:21.26
in its perfection.
00:15:21.26\00:15:22.26
It fills me with joy
just to think about it.
00:15:22.26\00:15:25.73
But our
responsibility is here and now.
00:15:25.73\00:15:28.30
Our responsibility is
spreading the good news
00:15:28.30\00:15:31.23
of Christ's return.
00:15:31.23\00:15:32.23
JB: A few moments ago you
mentioned that you'll find
00:15:32.23\00:15:35.36
the right words
... the destruction
00:15:35.36\00:15:37.03
of the earth, the
decay of the earth.
00:15:37.03\00:15:39.60
You said it is happening
in a fashion that is not
00:15:39.60\00:15:41.60
linear, but it's accelerating.
00:15:41.60\00:15:43.93
How do we see this accelerating
decay of the planet.
00:15:43.93\00:15:48.20
Let's talk about some examples.
00:15:48.20\00:15:50.20
SC: I want to go immediately
to scientific studies and data
00:15:50.20\00:15:52.60
and all of that.
00:15:52.60\00:15:53.60
But concurrent with scientific
studies you get a general sense
00:15:53.60\00:15:57.93
when you talk to people or when
people observe the environment
00:15:57.93\00:16:01.60
around them.
00:16:01.60\00:16:02.60
This was not
happening when I was a kid.
00:16:02.60\00:16:05.16
People
themselves observe changes.
00:16:05.16\00:16:07.16
Greater storms, greater heat
waves, more droughts and you
00:16:07.16\00:16:10.06
can't always trust those things.
00:16:10.06\00:16:12.06
When you've got a global
sense that things are changing
00:16:12.06\00:16:15.06
and things are
different and that the planet
00:16:15.06\00:16:17.46
is more hostile, that
in itself is a data point.
00:16:17.46\00:16:20.96
Aside from that,
let's go back to data.
00:16:20.96\00:16:23.96
Let's go to something
that is hard and that is we
00:16:23.96\00:16:25.96
have had a quintupling
of damage from disasters
00:16:25.96\00:16:27.96
on a global basis with a
disproportion amount of that
00:16:27.96\00:16:32.60
damage centered in the United
States, which is interesting.
00:16:32.60\00:16:36.33
JB Before we talk about
natural disasters, let me slip
00:16:36.33\00:16:38.93
in here if I may.
00:16:38.93\00:16:41.80
Don't we simply have
better mechanisms for recording
00:16:41.80\00:16:46.80
disasters?
00:16:46.80\00:16:48.80
The Richter scale has only
been in existence for so long
00:16:48.80\00:16:51.90
and so forth.
00:16:51.90\00:16:52.90
SC: It's interesting.
00:16:52.90\00:16:53.66
Let's go back to the
frequency of disasters.
00:16:53.66\00:16:56.76
Now I have a chart that I use
that tracks disasters and this
00:16:56.76\00:17:00.23
is out of an organization called
EM-DAT out of Brussels and you
00:17:00.23\00:17:03.93
have to use the chart very,
very carefully because these are
00:17:03.93\00:17:07.03
observed disasters or
these are reported disasters,
00:17:07.03\00:17:09.90
more accurately.
00:17:09.90\00:17:10.46
And so you go back to 1900
and while we were still using,
00:17:10.46\00:17:13.73
you know, the telegraph,
but if you look at the data
00:17:13.73\00:17:16.83
trend on this and you
notice from say 1970, 1980,
00:17:16.83\00:17:22.06
we had satellites, we
had communication everywhere.
00:17:22.06\00:17:25.16
We had cable TV in the
80's but the rise in disasters
00:17:25.16\00:17:30.03
has been constant
since then and extremely
00:17:30.03\00:17:33.36
significant.
00:17:33.36\00:17:34.36
So yes, we are seeing
an increase in disasters
00:17:34.36\00:17:38.00
and an increase in the
magnitude of disasters as well.
00:17:38.00\00:17:40.70
It's happening and it is a big
deal and it fulfills prophecy.
00:17:40.70\00:17:43.73
JB: And an increase in the cost
of those disasters in turn goes
00:17:43.73\00:17:47.53
on to affect
society in many ways.
00:17:47.53\00:17:49.70
SC: We underestimate
the profound affect
00:17:49.70\00:17:52.76
of society by an environment
that is steadily destabilizing.
00:17:52.76\00:17:56.20
We think we are separate.
00:17:56.20\00:17:58.13
We think there are just trees
and grass and things out there
00:17:58.13\00:18:02.80
but as a matter of fact we
are pumping out our aquifers
00:18:02.80\00:18:07.40
all over the world.
00:18:07.40\00:18:08.93
We are in major cities, we are
beginning to run out of water,
00:18:08.93\00:18:13.90
especially in Asia.
00:18:13.90\00:18:15.06
The oceans are crashing.
00:18:15.06\00:18:16.83
It is expected.
00:18:16.83\00:18:17.83
Scientists who have looked at
this carefully that the oceans
00:18:17.83\00:18:21.13
will be essentially
fished out of commercial species
00:18:21.13\00:18:23.40
in the next 25 years.
00:18:23.40\00:18:24.86
The eco system is crashing
and there is a billion people
00:18:24.86\00:18:28.33
who rely on the
oceans for their food.
00:18:28.33\00:18:30.50
JB: Let's come back
to this in just a moment.
00:18:30.50\00:18:32.50
And also let's look at
some biblical references to
00:18:32.50\00:18:38.50
the problems the environment
is facing due to the work
00:18:38.50\00:18:44.06
of sin.
00:18:44.06\00:18:45.26
We'll be back with
more in just a moment.
00:18:45.26\00:18:49.23
It Is Written is dedicated
to sharing the gospel around
00:18:49.23\00:18:52.13
the world.
00:18:52.13\00:18:53.13
To discover more about
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00:18:53.13\00:18:55.36
to visit our
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00:18:55.36\00:18:58.56
and browse the dozens of pages
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00:18:58.56\00:19:01.90
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00:19:01.90\00:19:02.96
Let's get to know
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00:19:02.96\00:19:04.53
Visit our website
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00:19:04.53\00:19:08.40
This is It Is Written.
00:19:08.90\00:19:10.03
I'm John Bradshaw.
00:19:10.03\00:19:11.03
My guest today is Scott
Christiansen who is an author,
00:19:11.03\00:19:14.10
a Christian minister
and a seminar presenter
00:19:14.10\00:19:16.70
dealing with the very important
and timely subject of the decay
00:19:16.70\00:19:21.93
in the environment
around us and how that relates
00:19:21.93\00:19:25.20
to the Word of God.
00:19:25.20\00:19:26.83
Now Scott, Isaiah wrote many,
many years ago that the earth
00:19:26.83\00:19:29.96
would wax old like a garment.
00:19:29.96\00:19:33.00
What do you think he
was talking about there?
00:19:33.00\00:19:36.00
SC: In my interpretation, under
sin, the world destabilizes.
00:19:36.00\00:19:38.00
The world falls apart.
00:19:38.00\00:19:39.60
JB: So sin doesn't just
make murderers out of people,
00:19:39.60\00:19:43.83
it affects the ground, and the
trees and the air and the ocean.
00:19:43.83\00:19:47.83
Absolutely unsurprisingly
and you know, we could
00:19:47.83\00:19:50.26
not actually see this because
we only have a generational
00:19:50.26\00:19:53.30
view, because we only see
things in our lifetime until
00:19:53.30\00:19:56.90
the decay of the
earth accelerated, basically
00:19:56.90\00:19:59.33
within the last 50 years
we have been able to begin
00:19:59.33\00:20:01.73
to see this and now
we have a building sense,
00:20:01.73\00:20:04.53
as a global community
we have a building sense
00:20:04.53\00:20:06.60
that something is wrong.
00:20:06.60\00:20:08.46
Let's zero-in a little
bit on some of these systemic
00:20:08.46\00:20:12.70
collapses.
00:20:12.70\00:20:13.70
You'd spoke before
briefly about the oceans.
00:20:13.70\00:20:17.30
You mentioned that a
colossal amount of people depend
00:20:17.30\00:20:21.50
upon the oceans.
00:20:21.50\00:20:22.50
SC: A billion or
more than a billion.
00:20:22.50\00:20:24.50
JB: But the
oceans are collapsing.
00:20:24.50\00:20:27.36
I've heard about these
dead spots in the ocean.
00:20:27.36\00:20:30.93
Tell me about that.
00:20:30.93\00:20:31.93
SC: Well what happens
is we apply massive amounts
00:20:31.93\00:20:34.53
of fertilizer to grow
the food that the planet
00:20:34.53\00:20:37.10
needs and by the way,
we are on a razor's edge.
00:20:37.10\00:20:39.40
We might want to talk about that
when it comes to global food
00:20:39.40\00:20:42.40
supply.
00:20:42.40\00:20:43.40
But this fertilizer
and pesticides that we use
00:20:43.40\00:20:45.96
all over the
world, they get washed.
00:20:45.96\00:20:48.13
Part of it gets washed
off the land and then you
00:20:48.13\00:20:50.16
have all these nutrients flowing
into the ocean and that causes
00:20:50.16\00:20:53.33
a bloom, an algal
bloom and that algal bloom
00:20:53.33\00:20:56.66
just expands, just
explodes and then collapses
00:20:56.66\00:20:59.83
and dies and when that
algal bloom dies the decay sucks
00:20:59.83\00:21:03.53
all the oxygen out of the water.
00:21:03.53\00:21:05.53
In the Gulf of Mexico you have
a dead spot the size of Vermont,
00:21:05.53\00:21:09.90
for instance,
where the water is dead.
00:21:09.90\00:21:13.00
There is nothing in
there that is living.
00:21:13.00\00:21:15.00
It is below the surface
because the surface of the water
00:21:15.00\00:21:18.06
exchanges oxygen
with the atmosphere
00:21:18.06\00:21:20.06
but below the
surface, if something swims in,
00:21:20.06\00:21:22.06
it does not swim out.
00:21:22.06\00:21:23.06
It is completely dead.
00:21:23.06\00:21:24.06
JB: Okay.
00:21:24.06\00:21:25.06
We are talking about the oceans.
00:21:25.06\00:21:27.06
The ocean is really big, man.
00:21:27.06\00:21:28.06
It c overs this great
big part of the earth.
00:21:28.06\00:21:30.06
You talk about
a size of Vermont.
00:21:30.06\00:21:32.00
Here's my question.
00:21:32.00\00:21:33.00
Is it really that big?
00:21:33.00\00:21:34.00
SC: It's really that big.
00:21:34.00\00:21:35.00
JB: No, no, I mean really.
00:21:35.00\00:21:36.00
Is it really that bad or is this
just environmental hysteria,
00:21:36.00\00:21:39.00
some greenie who hugs
trees wants you to think that we
00:21:39.00\00:21:42.70
are at crisis point.
00:21:42.70\00:21:44.10
Is it really that bad?
00:21:44.10\00:21:45.36
SC: It's really that bad.
00:21:45.36\00:21:46.36
Let's take your point.
00:21:46.36\00:21:47.86
You say the ocean is big.
00:21:47.86\00:21:49.20
Now when I worked in Mongolia
I would frequently fly from
00:21:49.20\00:21:52.43
Los Angeles to Beijing.
00:21:52.43\00:21:53.66
I get on the plane in
seconds I would be over
00:21:53.66\00:21:56.96
the Pacific Ocean.
00:21:56.96\00:21:57.96
I would read a book,
I would watch a movie.
00:21:57.96\00:22:00.96
I would start another book.
00:22:00.96\00:22:02.50
I would take a
nap and you know what?
00:22:02.50\00:22:05.90
At 600 miles an hour we were
still over the Pacific Ocean.
00:22:05.90\00:22:08.83
It is massive.
00:22:08.83\00:22:09.83
It is huge and yet, it
is very well documented.
00:22:09.83\00:22:12.76
The entire ocean, not
just the pacific, our entire
00:22:12.76\00:22:15.76
hydrosphere is collapsing,
the ocean specifically.
00:22:15.76\00:22:17.76
The life in it, the fish in it,
the very acid levels which are
00:22:17.76\00:22:22.13
affecting life
change, our corals, everything
00:22:22.13\00:22:24.86
is falling apart, the
most rapidly of any system
00:22:24.86\00:22:28.03
that we are observing.
00:22:28.03\00:22:29.23
It is profound
and it's very serious.
00:22:29.23\00:22:31.76
JB: And the implications of this
collapsing ocean will be what?
00:22:31.76\00:22:36.70
SC: Well over there the economic
implications are huge, though
00:22:36.70\00:22:40.16
we are mostly
focusing on the spiritual.
00:22:40.16\00:22:42.50
But let's go to the things,
which are linked to prophecy.
00:22:42.50\00:22:44.66
We have got a billion
people who depend primarily
00:22:44.66\00:22:47.73
on the ocean for food.
00:22:47.73\00:22:49.30
Each year that
food gets less now.
00:22:49.30\00:22:51.76
The resource is less on a
global basis but within 25 years
00:22:51.76\00:22:56.96
or less, it will
be entirely fished out
00:22:56.96\00:22:59.66
for all practical purposes.
00:22:59.66\00:23:00.73
Then you have got a billion
people that starting now are
00:23:00.73\00:23:04.16
having to transition
over to land-based food.
00:23:04.16\00:23:06.53
Now we are right at a razor's
edge between the amount of food
00:23:06.53\00:23:10.96
that we produce and the
amount of food that we consume.
00:23:10.96\00:23:14.70
Last year we consumed
more food than we produced.
00:23:14.70\00:23:17.73
Yes, that's a very big deal.
00:23:17.73\00:23:19.76
It is very serious.
00:23:19.76\00:23:21.36
We are in a world of trouble
and we can see the process
00:23:21.36\00:23:24.53
is flowing that where society
becomes more destabilized
00:23:24.53\00:23:28.90
we see more wars and rumors
of wars over food, over water,
00:23:28.90\00:23:32.63
over oil, over metals,
over something like phosphate
00:23:32.63\00:23:36.03
which is a
critically pressured resource.
00:23:36.03\00:23:38.76
All of these things
come in at once in our age.
00:23:38.76\00:23:42.30
We are seeing this
confluence of forces.
00:23:42.30\00:23:44.83
JB: Won't we figure it out?
00:23:44.83\00:23:46.83
I mean, we've got brilliant
people around this world.
00:23:46.83\00:23:49.03
We've figured out
all the problems so far.
00:23:49.03\00:23:51.80
I mean, isn't
there a way out of this?
00:23:51.80\00:23:54.36
SC: It is the fundamental nature
of man to try and figure out
00:23:54.36\00:23:58.46
a solution to
these two problems.
00:23:58.46\00:24:01.60
And we've dodged the
bullet, as a global society,
00:24:01.60\00:24:05.10
we've dodged the
bullet a number of times.
00:24:05.10\00:24:07.10
But we've got a number of
problems facing us right now.
00:24:07.10\00:24:10.46
We've got a decay
in our atmosphere.
00:24:10.46\00:24:14.16
We've got a decay in our
hydrosphere -- that's fresh
00:24:14.16\00:24:16.63
water and salt water.
00:24:16.63\00:24:17.80
We've got significant
decay of soils around the world,
00:24:17.80\00:24:22.63
and their ability to produce.
00:24:22.63\00:24:24.30
We've got a
growing population base.
00:24:24.30\00:24:27.30
If we look at one problem, one
universal problem that the globe
00:24:27.30\00:24:33.00
got together, the nations
of the earth got together
00:24:33.00\00:24:35.93
and solved, what
would that problem be?
00:24:35.93\00:24:39.30
There is almost no example.
00:24:39.30\00:24:41.13
So we've got these numbers
of problems which are converging
00:24:41.13\00:24:44.83
and which accelerate each
other and we've got no basis
00:24:44.83\00:24:47.90
for solving anything
but above and beyond that,
00:24:47.90\00:24:50.63
let me ask again.
00:24:50.63\00:24:51.63
You know, what is the proposal
for reversing the effects of sin
00:24:51.63\00:24:55.30
and how does that
sink with scripture?
00:24:55.30\00:24:57.86
JB: So, looking at this
scripturally, the environment
00:24:57.86\00:24:59.90
is falling apart as a
result of sin collapsing.
00:24:59.90\00:25:02.76
What is the end game?
00:25:02.76\00:25:04.23
SC: The end game is laid
out very well in Matthew 24
00:25:04.23\00:25:08.26
and it is a good
chapter to read every month.
00:25:08.26\00:25:11.16
We know that we have a
time of little trouble coming.
00:25:11.16\00:25:13.83
We know we have a time of great
trouble coming and we know that
00:25:13.83\00:25:17.16
Christ's coming is soon and this
really is my message to people.
00:25:17.16\00:25:20.70
It is not an
environmental message.
00:25:20.70\00:25:22.70
The message is
Jesus really is coming.
00:25:22.70\00:25:25.36
JB: And the environment is
yet another marker demonstrator
00:25:25.36\00:25:29.36
of that fact.
00:25:29.36\00:25:30.30
SC: Right.
00:25:30.30\00:25:31.30
Christ would not tell
us in Mark 13 to watch
00:25:31.30\00:25:33.40
and give us nothing to watch
for and this is one more sign
00:25:33.40\00:25:36.70
that his coming
is very, very soon.
00:25:36.70\00:25:39.06
Is our sense of urgency
commensurate with the nearness
00:25:39.06\00:25:43.30
of his coming?
00:25:43.30\00:25:44.30
JB: Scott Christiansen,
thank you for joining me today.
00:25:44.30\00:25:47.00
SC: I appreciate it very much.
00:25:47.00\00:25:48.16
Thank you.
00:25:48.16\00:25:49.16
JB: This is a world that
is under attack and while
00:25:49.16\00:25:52.76
the environment tells us that
the earth is at breaking point,
00:25:52.76\00:25:55.93
philosophies and
theories are tearing the heart
00:25:55.93\00:25:59.26
out of the world and attacking
faith in what matters most.
00:25:59.26\00:26:03.56
That is why I want
you to have this book.
00:26:03.56\00:26:05.56
It's called
"The Thought makers".
00:26:05.56\00:26:08.43
Learn how the Bible
answers the biggest questions.
00:26:08.43\00:26:12.10
To get your free copy,
call right now 1.800.253.3000.
00:26:12.10\00:26:14.70
Now, supplies of
this book are limited.
00:26:14.70\00:26:18.40
So call right away.
00:26:18.40\00:26:20.60
If the line is busy, please
do call again or write to us at
00:26:20.60\00:26:24.23
It Is Written, Box O,
Thousand Oaks, California
00:26:24.23\00:26:27.56
91359 and we will mail a copy
00:26:27.56\00:26:30.60
to your address
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00:26:30.60\00:26:32.76
It Is Written is a
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00:26:32.76\00:26:34.90
To support It Is
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00:26:34.90\00:26:37.03
1.800.253.3000 or visit us
on-line at itiswritten.com.
00:26:37.03\00:26:44.56
Fascinating discussion today
about the biblical connection
00:26:44.56\00:26:47.73
between the deterioration of our
environment and the prophetic
00:26:47.73\00:26:53.93
signs of Jesus' return.
00:26:53.93\00:26:56.33
Scott Christiansen, I am
so thankful you were here
00:26:56.33\00:26:58.43
with me today.
00:26:58.43\00:26:59.43
SC: My pleasure.
00:26:59.43\00:27:00.50
JB: Let's take the opportunity
to pray and ask God to bless
00:27:00.50\00:27:03.50
us as we get
ready for Jesus' return.
00:27:03.50\00:27:05.50
Our Father in heaven,
how thankful we are that
00:27:05.50\00:27:08.13
we have much to look forward to.
00:27:08.13\00:27:10.26
The signs around us that herald
the return of Jesus while they
00:27:10.26\00:27:14.56
can alarm us on so
many levels also excite us.
00:27:14.56\00:27:17.56
It was Luke who wrote Jesus'
words "When you see these things
00:27:17.56\00:27:21.56
begin to come to pass,
lift up your heads and look up
00:27:21.56\00:27:23.86
for your redemption draws nigh.
00:27:23.86\00:27:25.10
Lord, thank you for the message
that around us, the world tells
00:27:25.10\00:27:29.16
us our redemption draws nigh.
00:27:29.16\00:27:31.93
We thank you for a Savior
who loves us enough to return
00:27:31.93\00:27:37.80
and take us home.
00:27:37.80\00:27:39.06
Let that day come soon, I
pray, in Jesus' name, Amen.
00:27:39.06\00:27:44.83
Thank you for joining me today.
00:27:49.86\00:27:50.80
I look forward to
seeing you again next time.
00:27:50.80\00:27:53.10
Until then, remember "It
is written, man shall not
00:27:53.10\00:27:56.40
live by bread alone but
by every word that proceeds
00:27:56.40\00:28:00.66
from the mouth of God.
00:28:00.66\00:28:04.66