Participants: Shelley Quinn (Host), Yvonne Lewis
Series Code: IAA
Program Code: IAA000432
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00:01 If we use the words counterfeit and
00:03 Christianity in the same sentence. 00:06 It sounds like an oxymoron, 00:08 like pretty ugly. They're absolutely 00:11 diametrically opposed and yet the New 00:14 Age Movement is in full trading the church 00:17 and it is producing counterfeit Christianity, 00:20 join us today on Issues and Answers. 00:46 You know Jesus said in Matthew 24 and 00:49 I'm gonna begin with verse 4. 00:51 He said, Take heed that no one deceives you. 00:56 For many shall come in my name, 00:59 claiming these people claiming themselves 01:01 I am the Christ and he says and they will 01:05 deceive many. When we look at what's 01:08 happening with the New Age Movement today, 01:11 teaching people that they individually are 01:14 Gods and we see people who rise up as the 01:18 gurus and the heads of these different 01:21 religions that all are these amalgamation 01:26 of religions that make up the New Age 01:28 Movement. We see that there is a real 01:30 problem in the world, but this problem is 01:34 insidiously infiltrating the church and we want 01:39 to introduce you to our special guest is gonna 01:41 talk about that today. She is returning 01:43 again Dr. Yvonne Lewis. Dr. Lewis, how are 01:46 you. Yes, I'm doing great. Praise God. 01:49 I thought of that word insidious. I know. 01:51 We're both sitting here smiling. 01:52 I love it, I love it. You asked the 01:54 Holy Spirit and he answered. 01:57 And to clear our viewers I was having a little 01:59 brain fog, but before we begin, 02:01 I knew there was a word I wanted to use. 02:03 That's it. It is an, in an insidious manner. 02:08 Yeah. That this is infiltrating the church, 02:10 but before, before we begin on this, 02:13 because here we see before us a beautiful lady 02:16 who is known on 3ABN to have a beautiful 02:19 singing voice. She was actually a professional 02:21 singer for many years. A third generation 02:24 Adventist, a natural path and someone who 02:29 has the utmost integrity and character. 02:32 Christian, good Christian girl. 02:35 How did someone like you become involved in 02:40 a minor way in that insidious way 02:43 with the New Age Movement? 02:46 Insidious is the operative word, 02:49 because it was a gradual process. 02:52 I started with nutrition and then Ideology 02:57 and Massage Therapy and Reflexology and 03:02 Acupuncture and I just began to study these 03:07 different modalities feeling that I needed to 03:10 have several modalities under my belt since I 03:13 was practicing a natural path. 03:15 I wanted to know about some different 03:18 Therapeutic modalities that I could use on 03:20 my patients and so I began to study the 03:22 different ones and I began to study 03:25 Acupuncture and Chinese medicine and 03:27 began subsequently became board certified 03:29 in traditional Chinese medicine. 03:31 What woke you up, 03:32 how did God get your attention. 03:35 You know some interesting things 03:37 happened to me when I come to 3ABN or 03:40 when I'm ministering for 3ABN. 03:42 The first thing that was of interest was 03:47 Yolanda Innocent- Palmer and I were 03:49 ministering together. We were ministering 03:51 in New York for 3ABN and we were sharing a 03:54 hotel room. So I was in school at the time for 03:57 Acupuncture. And so I always traveled with 04:01 my needles everywhere I have my needles 04:03 with me. Because people get headaches and 04:05 back pain and that kind of thing and I can help, 04:07 so I had given someone a treatment in the room. 04:12 Because we had friends that come and visit 04:14 while we were in town. And Yolanda came back 04:17 to the room and she saw that I had somebody, 04:20 I have given someone the treatment and I 04:21 had needles and she said no, no don't do that. 04:24 And she said oh I'm gonna sleep in the room. 04:27 Exactly you know your bringing the demonic 04:29 spirits. I looked at her, it was friendly 04:32 because this was my life's work. 04:34 This is what I was studying, this is you know 04:36 something, everything is okay with it. 04:38 So long story short, she and I just, 04:42 we just went back and forth with this and 04:45 she said it was Satan and I thought where is 04:48 this coming from? But it did made me think 04:51 Shelley. It really made me think like am I 04:53 being used by the enemy, is this, 04:56 am I being an instrument of the enemy, 04:57 so it kind of began my questioning some 05:01 things, but still even with that I still, 05:06 I finished school, I got board certified and 05:09 I began to practice it, because I was able 05:11 to rationalize and say you know this is a 05:13 medical modality and Yolanda just didn't 05:15 know what she was talking about. 05:17 Love you Yolanda everything is fine now so. 05:21 She even sent you a book, didn't she? 05:22 She did, she sent me a book and the name 05:25 of this book was Spiritualistic Deceptions 05:28 in Health and Healing written by an Adventist 05:30 doctor. And I looked at the book and I 05:32 thought he doesn't really know what he's 05:35 talking about I mean no offense to him either, 05:37 but I just felt like this was a Western 05:40 practitioner who might not really been, 05:42 appreciated. That's a very good word, 05:45 thank you, appreciated Eastern, 05:47 Eastern mentally, the Eastern approach to 05:50 medicine, the Eastern medical construct. 05:53 So I just put the book aside and didn't think 05:56 about it. Well fast forward to April of '09 I 06:01 came to 3ABN and was interviewed. 06:06 This kind of I got my life in general and a 06:09 woman saw me and she sent me a package. 06:12 She must have gone to my website and she 06:14 saw that I had information on Acupuncture. 06:16 But you didn't talk about 06:18 Acupuncture when you're on 3ABN. 06:20 No, no I didn't mentioned it because it 06:22 was controversial and I thought you know 06:23 people might not understand then so I just 06:25 let it alone. She looked at my website, 06:29 she sent me a packet and in that packet 06:30 there was a picture of a book and she said 06:34 please carefully consider this. 06:36 It was the same book that Yolanda had sent 06:38 me. So I said Lord are you trying to tell me 06:41 something. So I took the book, out from 06:43 you know obscurity somewhere and began 06:47 to read the book with new eyes this time. 06:50 And Shelley as I read it, I was convicted. 06:53 I knew from when I was reading that there 06:55 was something to this. There was something 06:57 to the connection between astrology and 07:01 Eastern and Babylonian mystery religions 07:06 and Acupuncture and as I read I thought oh 07:10 my, I began to feel so broken and even now 07:14 I mean I just it's so deep for me, 07:19 because I spent so many years studying 07:21 it and immersing myself in it, and then to 07:24 find out that I had been deceived. 07:27 And that I was leading others into a kind of 07:31 deception too by practicing Acupuncture 07:34 it was so heavy on my heart. I also read an 07:36 internet article. It was entitled astrology 07:41 with needles and I recommend that to your 07:45 viewers to just go online and read, 07:47 and read that article because it really shows 07:50 the connection between Astrology and 07:52 Acupuncture. And I went to prayer meeting 07:55 that we Shelley and I just had, 07:58 I was so broken, because I felt like I'm down 08:02 and so from then on that was September 08:05 of '09 and I have not practiced Acupuncture. 08:11 Well you know, you were deceived and it's 08:14 because you didn't know. You want to see 08:17 the full picture and I think that this is 08:19 something the tenets of the New Age 08:23 Movement have really infiltrated holistic 08:27 approach to medicine, yes, in many ways, 08:29 yes, you can think of the, is it Reiki? 08:32 Reiki. Reiki massage and people don't 08:35 understand what the route of this is and you 08:38 can go. I've had someone who wanted to 08:41 give me that and try that on my arm and it 08:42 hurts me. But I didn't even realized till then 08:46 I looked it up later. Yes. You know where 08:49 these, had these spiritual routes if you were 08:53 in the dark side of the world. Exactly. 08:55 But we kind of teased our precious viewers 08:58 out there with the idea that we were going 09:00 to talk about the New Age Movement and 09:03 how it is coming into the church as 09:08 Counterfeit Christianity. So let's talk about 09:14 what you have seen and what you're 09:16 aware of and I don't want to, we need to talk 09:22 about things like kids who are going to 09:24 martial arts, martial art practices, 09:27 but more than that we need to talk about 09:29 things that are actually being brought 09:30 into the sanctuary types of prayers, 09:32 various things and how people are being 09:35 significantly impacted in the Christian church? 09:37 Yes, through practices like contemplated 09:41 prayer, meditation, but again the meditation 09:46 idea is emptying of the mind and the Bible 09:49 and for everything that God has, 09:52 Satan has a counterfeit, amen, 09:54 so we can consider you know the whole 09:58 Eastern meditation and this is not 10:01 demonizing people from the East or 10:03 anything like that. It's really looking at a 10:06 philosophy that is, it contradicts the 10:10 Christian philosophy and that is we empty 10:13 the mind with meditation, with these prayers 10:16 and mantras that are being said with prayers 10:19 now. Mantras have to do with freeing of the 10:22 mind that's really what it means, 10:24 so liberating the mind of thought. 10:27 Hypnotism. Hypnotism, Charmers. Yes, 10:30 Charmers, Deuteronomy 18, so we have to 10:34 again all these things that are going on in 10:36 the churches we have to, don't just take 10:39 the Pastor's word for it. Be like the Berrians, 10:42 go home, study it for yourself, make sure that 10:45 everything that you are learning is in harmony 10:48 with the word of God, that is our standard 10:51 and that is what we measure everything 10:53 against and if it's not you have to discard 10:56 it. You know it's interesting that you 10:58 said don't the Pastor's word for it. 11:01 I've heard of churches where the Pastor is 11:04 actually supporting the idea of bringing in the 11:10 ancient past, the Theophostics where we 11:13 have this spiritual, this is guided imagery. 11:16 Yes. To the max, and at first what's so 11:21 insidious about this now that I have 11:23 remembered that word am I using it a lot. 11:24 That's right, that's right. But we are 11:25 insidious about this is that when you first 11:29 start these practices that they seem to 11:33 have a great benefit and I've talked with 11:36 people who have went through the 11:38 Theophostics and I said oh I was really, 11:41 like I was emotionally being healed and but then 11:45 all of a sudden as you get a little deeper 11:48 into it there is a very sinister and dark side 11:51 that pops up and people left the church 11:53 over it. You know they have Christianity 11:55 over it and it's very dangerous, so can 11:58 you speak to some of those things? 11:59 Satan is so sure, he doesn't come at you 12:02 right away with things that are off putting, 12:07 but what he does is he just introduces a 12:10 little bit at a time and through experience the 12:14 key word here I think is experience, 12:17 because our experiences can really be tricky. 12:21 They can, they can come other sources that 12:23 are not of God and mimic God, Satan will 12:26 present himself as an angel of light the Bible 12:29 says, but the Bible also tell us that we're 12:31 wrestling against flesh and blood, 12:34 but against principalities and powers. 12:38 It's evil and so he comes, he transforms 12:41 himself as an angel of light and we think 12:44 that these things are okay, because we have 12:47 experiences that transform consciousness 12:50 and that's one of the goals of the New Age 12:53 Movement. There has to be a transformation 12:56 of consciousness. You know this whole idea 12:58 of the, of the Age of Aquarius. Yes. 13:03 Back in, I don't even remember what year it 13:05 was, the decade, the 70s or whatever. 13:07 We used to all sing this is the dawning of the 13:10 Age of Aquarius, so I, yeah, without 13:12 thinking what we were saying. 13:15 This whole idea of a planetary transformation 13:19 where men will find out that they are God, 13:23 that's what. The self actualization. 13:25 Self actualization, self purification it's finding 13:27 out, it's the whole metaphysical idea is 13:30 getting in touch with your higher self, 13:33 your inner wisdom, your inner guide. 13:36 It's transplanting the Holy Spirit and taking 13:41 away God's role as created and making the 13:46 creature the creator and taking away the 13:49 Holy Spirit's role as out guide and putting 13:53 ourselves in that position. It's blasphemy. 13:56 And you know even you think back to, 13:59 just to step back for a moment to the ancient 14:01 past where you have a prayer guide, 14:05 a prayer partner who is your prayer guide 14:07 with all of the visualization taking 14:10 you back to the room etc. This is 14:14 something that we don't need a prayer guide. 14:18 That's right. Our prayer guide, 14:19 the Bible says it is the Holy Spirit. Amen. 14:23 We know not how we should prayer, 14:24 but the Holy Spirit is teaching us, 14:27 interceding for us and then there is but one 14:30 mediator between us and God and that is the 14:33 man Christ Jesus. Yes. Who is also at the 14:36 right hand of the throne of father interceding 14:38 on our behalf, so these things though as 14:43 they begin to you know they're glassed over. 14:48 I always say this. Sin is never presented to us 14:52 in an ugly paper bag. That's right. 14:54 You know what the devil does. 14:56 He puts it in a shiny full package, that's right, 14:59 he puts a big Satan bow on it and he hands 15:01 it to us and sometimes we're in the process 15:05 of unwrapping all of this, just thinking we got 15:07 something excited and it's not until we get 15:10 into the heart of the package we've 15:12 released it's nothing, but gift wrapped garbage. 15:15 That's right. And that's what happening with 15:17 these things that are moving into the church. 15:19 That is such a good point, when you said, 15:22 when you quoted that scripture on, 15:24 there is one mediator the man Jesus Christ 15:27 and the New Age Movement. 15:28 The counterfeit for that is Christ consciousness, 15:32 taking the man Jesus Christ out of it and 15:36 putting inserting a Christ consciousness, 15:39 a state of being that every person can have 15:43 if they tap into that higher self, 15:46 that thought is that Christ himself went 15:49 away and became self actualized, 15:52 this is what they teach that he became self 15:54 actualized during those 17 years that there 15:57 is no record of what went on in his ministry. 16:00 But what, that's what they teach that 16:03 every person can be, can have 16:06 the Christ consciousness. 16:08 You know I'm sitting and thinking how easily 16:10 deceived someone could be because Paul says 16:14 you have the mind of Christ and this is 16:16 something we should be seeking, but if we 16:18 want to find the mind of Christ. 16:20 We find it right here in this word. 16:23 This is the mind of Christ. That's right. 16:26 This is where he has written his will, 16:27 that's right, and He says you have it and 16:29 the more the word that you have in your mind, 16:31 the more you operate by the mind of Christ. 16:35 But the New Age Movement has a way 16:39 of trying to teach you to seek a power within 16:44 you instead of seeking the power of God, 16:48 the Holy Spirit to come fill you and then he 16:52 works in you to will and to act 16:54 according to His good purpose. 16:55 That is exactly right, okay, that is the whole, 17:00 it's the spin, they put a different spin on the 17:04 whole idea of you know us being partakers 17:07 of the divine nature or having the mind of 17:10 Christ, because it's just a different spin on 17:13 it, just the Bible says a little bit of leaven 17:16 can poison the whole loaf and that's 17:18 what, that's what they do. 17:19 You know and Peter also says that you trust 17:22 the scriptures to your own destruction, 17:24 because I have seen that some will take a 17:27 scripture to use as a foundation and a kind 17:31 of present it like this, but then would it be 17:34 fair to say because I'm trying to think how 17:37 can we protect ourselves and how can we 17:38 share with the viewers to protect ourselves. 17:40 Anytime the emphasis is taken off of drawing 17:45 you near to the Lord and becoming fully 17:49 depended upon our creator God. 17:52 Anytime the emphasis, that emphasis is taken 17:55 away and it comes down to where we're 17:58 emphasizing on what we can do. 18:01 Is that a good, I mean a good check. 18:04 That's a great check, that's a great check 18:07 because again the emphasis is placed on 18:10 looking within, God within. 18:14 Swami Muktananda it's a tongue twister. 18:17 Yeah it is. Said, worship yourself, bow to 18:21 yourself, kneel to yourself, worship the God 18:24 that is in you, because you are God. 18:26 And when I read that I got a chill. Yes. 18:29 Because it's about, it makes the creature the 18:34 creator and so that parameter that, that, 18:38 that emphasis you have just made on what 18:44 anytime we are told to look within as opposed 18:48 to looking at the creator a red flag should come up. 18:52 I remember when I was very young and had 18:56 kind of gotten away from the church of my 18:57 rearing and I wasn't familiar with the 18:59 Old Testament at all at that time. 19:01 I do recall so clearly when Shirley MacLaine 19:06 had a movie out and I was so fascinated 19:09 by this movie. I was watching it. 19:11 I think it was a mini series or something if 19:14 I recall, because I remember I wanna see 19:16 a conclusion of this and it was the spirit of 19:19 God is within you and I'm thinking yeah I know 19:21 that scripture that's what Jesus said the 19:23 spirit of the kingdom of God. The kingdom 19:26 of God is within you. And I thought yeah, 19:29 I remember that and I went to bed that night, 19:33 actually I think I went and took a shower that 19:35 night, and I'm thinking about this and 19:39 you know that's when the Lord reached me. 19:41 I'm thinking about this movie and have the 19:43 kingdom of God is within you and the Lord, 19:46 I wasn't even one who knew the 19:47 Old Testament very well, but the Lord just 19:50 reached me and opened up my mind to 19:52 the treacherous path that just from watching 19:56 a movie that was fascinating to me at the 19:59 time. The treacherous path that I was about 20:03 to enter and I mean, I broke down weeping 20:06 and I went to the Bible and spend an hour in 20:09 my Bible studying and I thought Lord, 20:11 thank you. So to avoid this Counterfeit 20:16 Christianity. You were here before and we 20:19 talked about how important it is to pray 20:22 to know the word. What are some other things 20:24 that we can do to not get caught 20:28 up in the tenets of New Age? 20:31 The Bible says to be sober, to be vigilant, 20:35 because the devil is like a roaring lion seeking 20:38 whom he might devour. And so being sober 20:43 is to be mindful, to be aware, 20:45 to be alert, so I'm not saying to be one of 20:49 those Christians that is full of fear and 20:53 finding the devil and everything, 20:55 but certainly be aware of what's going on and 20:59 use that parameter that you just gave which 21:02 was just right on point. If there is emphasis 21:05 on self turn away from it, because God is, 21:11 He teaches us God reliance, not self 21:14 reliance. Or even we're gonna add to this 21:17 even if it is to rely on someone else to take 21:20 you to God like you the idea of ancient past 21:23 and Theophostics. That's right. If its reliance 21:25 on anybody besides God the Father, 21:27 God the Son or God the Holy Spirit, 21:29 we need to be aware of it. That's right, 21:34 that's right and also know that you know 21:36 when, when the disciples ask Jesus in 21:39 Matthew 24 verses 3 to 5 tell us when, 21:44 what are the signs of your coming and of the, 21:46 close of the age. And Jesus said, 21:50 the first thing He said was be not deceived, 21:52 yeah, for many will come in my name and 21:55 when you look at the Greek words for many 21:58 will come in my name, its masses, its like 22:01 millions of people they will come in his name 22:05 and say things that will try to represent him 22:09 as being having those authority. Yeah. 22:12 And we have to be careful, because millions 22:17 and millions and millions of people will be 22:19 deceived by this. It is the way that Satan can 22:23 use to get into the minds of each individual and 22:28 actually possess the minds of every saint. 22:32 We have to be careful. It's not just for the 22:36 people out there. It's for us as 22:38 well we are not to be deceived. 22:41 And you know you have mentioned earlier 22:43 that some people will go by experience and 22:45 certainly in the New Age Movement which 22:48 is an umbrella that covers so much. 22:51 It's like there is such an amalgamation of 22:55 religions and various things from Hindu, 22:58 Buddhism, the Wicca, Witchcraft, you know 23:03 Monotheism, Polytheism, Pantheism. Right. 23:06 It's all blended in here. That's right. 23:09 But the point is that all go for the 23:13 "Experience." That's right. This experience of 23:18 acceleration and transformation, 23:20 so we have to be careful, if I understood 23:23 what you were saying earlier Yvonne. 23:26 We have to be careful not to trust our experiences? 23:30 Absolutely, okay, absolutely because it's 23:33 through those experiences that Satan 23:37 gets a hold of you because you can't 23:39 question someone's experience really if you 23:42 have an experience and when I say that 23:45 I mean if I experience a being of light that 23:50 comes to me then, that's your reality. 23:53 That's my reality and you can't, you can, 23:57 you can question that from a philosophical 23:59 place, but my reality is that I just saw this 24:02 being, so how am I going to know that, that 24:06 being is from the enemy. The word of God 24:09 is my only standard against which I can test 24:15 that experience. You cannot lean on 24:17 experience, because experience will can take 24:20 you to another dimension and that is the 24:22 whole idea. That is what Satan is trying to do, 24:26 use experiences to have people 24:29 validate their new philosophy. 24:32 And that's not to say there are times, 24:35 I mean as a Christian that I have had 24:37 beautiful experiences with the Lord that, 24:40 with the Lord, with the Lord that's, that's 24:43 the point is that I was seeking him, 24:46 meditating upon his word praying honestly, 24:48 pressing into his presence and God has 24:53 blessed with something and it's not to say 24:55 that you should not trust all the experiences, 24:58 but we should test the spirits. 25:00 Test the spirits. Examine ourselves, 25:01 examine what's going on according to the 25:04 word of God. Absolutely, right. What would 25:06 you say to the young people who maybe 25:09 watching. Who I think that our youth live in 25:13 a day where it's much more difficult. 25:15 We thought we had problems growing up, 25:17 but it's much more difficult. There's more 25:19 of an identity crisis, the culture has become 25:23 a very lose moral culture if you want to say 25:29 the moralities are loose. Yes. What we just 25:31 say to young people who are seeking power, 25:35 seeking something that, that sometimes 25:37 attracts them to thinks like Wicca 25:41 and moves them away from the Bible. 25:44 I would say that it's so important to be careful, 25:48 to be careful because you can think that 25:51 you're doing something that is fun like 25:54 playing with ouija board. Some of these 25:56 kids are playing with ouija boards and they're 25:58 experimenting with the dark side not knowing 26:01 that they are opening themselves up to, to, 26:07 to the dark side. Demonic influence and 26:09 ultimately demonic possession, so it is so 26:12 important to stay away from that even when 26:15 you're trying to find out what this is. 26:19 There are some things that you just don't 26:20 need to try. If I say that there is rat 26:24 poisoning in that glass of water. 26:27 I'm not drinking it. You're not want to 26:29 drinking it and testing and find out, 26:31 so it is with the dark side. Don't play with 26:34 the dark side. It's way beyond what you could 26:37 imagine. It's so, it's so insidious, 26:40 but it's so, it's scary for our young people 26:45 it's scary and they would be entering into 26:48 an area that they just couldn't control. 26:50 It becomes out of their control. Absolutely. 26:53 You know that's so interesting that when 26:55 we think of hypnotism and the various things, 26:58 anytime someone takes control over you. 27:01 You know that I mean that's what the devil 27:05 does and all that he does is kind of takes 27:08 control, that's right, we have to yield 27:10 ourselves to the Lord, we have to submit 27:12 ourselves to God, absolutely, surrender if 27:15 you will. He never comes in and takes over, 27:18 he is not a God who controls, he is the God 27:21 who gave us the power of choice. 27:24 Yes, yes and that's, isn't it interesting that 27:28 the very thing, and this is so good, 27:30 the very thing that Satan does. 27:32 Satan takes control, he first tells you that 27:36 you're God and you're in control of your 27:39 own faith, but the reality is he is taking control. 27:43 Yeah, amen. I cannot believe I just looked up 27:45 at the clock. We've got to say goodbye 27:47 Dr. Yvonne Lewis, oh no it's so quick, 27:49 thank you so much for being here today. 27:52 And for all of you at home who are 27:54 watching or listening on the radio, 27:56 be vigilant because your enemy is prowling 28:01 around and he wants to get you and he will 28:03 come to you in sheep's clothing. 28:06 Now may the God of grace bless 28:08 you richly in all that you do and say. |
Revised 2014-12-17