In Matthew 19:6, it tells us,
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"Therefore what God
has joined together,
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let no man put asunder."
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Today, we're gonna be talking
about surrender and divorce.
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Stay with us,
we'll be right back.
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Welcome to Issues and
Answers. My name is J.D. Quinn.
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I want to read to you from
Matthew 11 verses 28 to 30.
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"Come to me, all you who
labor and are heavy laden,
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I will give you rest.
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Take my yoke upon
you and learn from me,
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for I am gentle
and lowly in heart,
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and you will find
rest for your souls.
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For my yoke is easy,
and my burden is light."
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Today, we have a special guest,
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his name is Pastor Greg Jackson.
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Welcome, Pastor
Jackson. Thank you.
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It's good to see
you. It's good to be here.
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Tell our audience a
little bit about yourself.
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Well, I am a pastor in
the Allegheny West Conference,
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and I now pastor the Bethel
Seventh-day Adventist Church
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in Cleveland, Ohio.
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I've been a
minister for 31 years
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and married to
Marilyn Jackson, for 14 years,
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we have five
children, five grandchildren.
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Amen. And that's basically it.
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We're talking
about a topic today
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that's gonna grab a
lot of people's attention.
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And divorce a blessing?
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In your book, "How surrender
makes marriage happier,
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divorce a blessing, the
simple life fulfilling."
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You have a chapter
on divorce a blessing?
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Please, explain that.
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Yeah, that's the
title that does generate
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debate or inquiry
and sometimes confusion,
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divorce a blessing those seem
to be two conflicting ideas,
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but my purpose in writing
the book is to show that,
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when we deal with
surrender in any situation,
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we can find the blessings
of God in that situation
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There are many people
that I've gone through divorce
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and divorce has just
ravaged them emotionally,
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spiritually, and
every other kind of way,
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but it doesn't
have to be that way,
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if they're
dealing with surrender,
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they can find the peace
and the blessings of God
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even in that negative situation.
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I also noticed here, Greg,
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how to turn your pain
into peace, why divorce?
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Yes, yes. There is,
that's the whole focus of it
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really as well as showing
how you can even find peace
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after the divorce has happened,
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but there is something
that very few people understand
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and I think that,
if they understood it
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and dealt with surrender,
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it would stem a lot of problems.
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If both married partners did it,
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it would save
the marriage. Amen.
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If one does it, it
may not save the marriage
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because in order to save
a marriage, it takes two.
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But it can give them peace
in the midst of the problem,
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in the midst of the situation,
and that's why I deal with it.
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So, and that, that is this.
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In every situation
before you come to the decision
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to divorce, there is a
process that takes place.
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Now let me put it like this.
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When you get married,
you either going through
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one or two
processes, either going through
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the process of God
joining you together
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because that's a process.
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When you first say, "I do."
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You're not fully
joined at that point,
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you're announced
as husband and wife.
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But, only God can
join you more and more,
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and that's the process.
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The marriage is a process
of God joining two individuals,
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two different individuals and
joining them and molding them
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in more and more into
oneness, that's a process.
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So we're either going through
that process of being made
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one by Jesus or we're
going through the process
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of what I call the
process of divorce.
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Now, it may not end in divorce,
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two people can
still stay married,
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but they don't have too
much love for one another,
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and that too they're not one.
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They're like two
different individuals
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living two ships
passing in the night.
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But, in order for it
to be a true marriage,
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you have to be
going through the process
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of being joined together.
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There is the other process
of being -- process of divorce
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if you recognize the
symptoms, you can avert it.
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And that is this, you see,
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when we get married,
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again this goes back
to an early interview
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we had about the
purpose for getting married.
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And remind our audience
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what the purpose
of getting married is.
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The purpose for
getting married is,
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is because you are convinced
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that's God's will
for your life, amen.
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And God's purpose which
becomes your ultimate purpose,
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it's develop His image in
you, which is His agape love.
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And so, in marriage
it's more about giving
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than it is receiving. Amen.
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Now, so when if our
purpose is other than that,
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what happens is, we are
joining to the other person,
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when we say, I do,
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like I did in my first marriage,
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I was a Christian individual,
my wife was the same,
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we both loved the
Lord and both were sincere,
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when I said I
do, I meant for life
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and I'm quite sure she did too.
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But what I didn't
understand is that,
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I had the wrong
purpose and it was depending
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on the wrong source,
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and relating with
the wrong kind of love.
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And so, when I said I do,
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I'm thinking that this
woman God has given her to me
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and she's gonna
meet all my needs
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and she's probably
thinking the same thing.
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Well, what
happened was, she was human
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and I'm human and so I
didn't meet all of her needs
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and she didn't meet all of mine.
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And when that happens
your needs are not getting met
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what happens is every time
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your needs are not
getting met there's hurt,
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there's pain, there's a scar.
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And the more the
person doesn't meet the needs
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and the less needs they meet,
the more you feel that pain
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and what happens is you began,
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at first it doesn't
effect you too much 'cause
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you still have hope
that the person is gonna do.
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But after a
while if it continues,
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you began to
feel, wait a minute,
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I don't know if they
can ever make me happy
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and meet those needs.
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Now what starts happening
is a process of divorce.
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Because when you come to
the conclusion that this person,
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I made a
mistake or this marriage
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is not gonna make me happy
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or this person can
never meet my needs
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or somebody out
there better, or whatever.
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You're beginning the
process of divorce I don't care
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if you're married,
you're beginning that purpose.
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If you don't stop that process
and start the other process
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of being joined together,
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it's going to either
come to physical divorce
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or emotional
divorce, where you're still
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in the same house,
but you're not divorced
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or the best
scenario, the best scenario,
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you're still married, you
have a degree of happiness.
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But, you know, a lot
of it is just, you know,
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I'm used to this,
we've been married and so,
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you know, I've put a
lot of time into this
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and we're gonna
stay married, you know.
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But, and even I'm
pretty happy in it.
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That's why I said,
makes marriage happier,
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because the best
marriage will be enhanced
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when the two
understand surrender,
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have the right
purpose for being married,
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are depending
on the right source
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and relating to
the right kind of love.
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So, whenever
divorce is happening
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it's because the
worse scenario is happening.
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It's the same thing, you know,
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you had the wrong purpose
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and maybe with the
wrong kind of love.
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Just the fact that
you're so radically
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different in personality
that the needs not being met
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or the conflicts that you
run into are much more frequent.
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And the needs
being met are much less,
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because the person is
so radically different
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from who you are.
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And that
process begins to happen
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and it happens in
ways that we don't know
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and don't even recognize
until we get to that point
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where we say, "I'm
ready to end this thing.
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" But there was a process
that happened way before then
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and if we realize
and when we began to see
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just a little
tell-tell signs of,
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you know, that I make a mistake,
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I don't know if I
can ever be happy,
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you know, those
little kinds of things.
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Any kind of doubt or whatever,
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it lets you know
you're in that process
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and you need to understand
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the process of
being joined together,
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which comes from
understanding surrender.
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Again, the reason we go
through the process of divorce
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is because we're not going
through the process of being
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joined together, the
reason we're not being
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joined together
by God is because
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we're not
surrendering fully to God
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and depending on
Him to supply our needs,
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that's why that text
that you opened up with,
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"Come unto me
all ye that labor."
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"And are heavy-laden
and I will give you rest."
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You know, "take
my yoke upon you,
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learn of me, for I am
meek and lowly in heart
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and you will find rest."
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That's the only way
we can turn this around,
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but we have to, we
have to come to grips
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with the truth
that in Christ dwells
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all the fullness
of the Godhead bodily.
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And in Him, we
are made complete.
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Let me just say
this quickly, you know,
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one of the
biggest errors of our,
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of our not only our
time throughout time
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concerning marriage is --
and the church helps perpetuate
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this error in many ways.
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I mean, we say,
"You're not complete
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until you have the other half."
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And we, and we
and now, you know,
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that sounds good and we,
I've heard it many pastor
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I've done it myself, we
feel sorry for single people.
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And we, we pity them
and feel that they are,
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they can't find happiness
until we find them a mate.
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And it is true that God came up
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with the institute of
marriage is a beautiful thing,
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but He never instituted it
for the reasons that we give.
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For instance, we use this
text and I've used it like this,
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I hear it, use it
like this all the time.
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It is not good
for man to be alone.
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Now, we interpret that
text from a sinful perspective.
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What do I mean by
that? I mean by that is this.
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We interpret that
from our sin experience.
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When God did it,
there was no sin.
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We are born in sin that means
we're born separated from God.
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We're not born with
God in His rightful place,
00:12:00.23\00:12:03.75
ruling our lives,
intimately connected to Him,
00:12:03.76\00:12:07.14
knowing His power in our lives.
00:12:07.15\00:12:09.48
We're not born like that,
we're born separated from God.
00:12:09.49\00:12:11.53
Therefore, we're born
with a hole in our center,
00:12:11.54\00:12:16.70
that is crying out
to be met by whatever
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and whoever we can
see, touch, feel, whatever.
00:12:20.27\00:12:24.16
And we use people, places
and things to fill that hole,
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well, until we come to
grips with Jesus Christ.
00:12:28.11\00:12:32.10
But, what
happens is we are spoiled
00:12:32.11\00:12:35.72
by the
philosophies of this world
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and the rudiments of this world
00:12:38.38\00:12:39.71
in our own human,
faulty human nature that says,
00:12:39.72\00:12:43.87
we need someone other
than Christ to fill this gap.
00:12:43.88\00:12:47.14
Because in
Colossians 2:8, it says,
00:12:47.15\00:12:48.95
"Don't be spoiled
by the philosophies
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and the traditions and
the rulers of this world
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as if you can find
it in other than Christ,
00:12:55.42\00:12:57.64
for in Him who
has all the fullness."
00:12:57.65\00:12:59.94
But we don't feel that,
00:12:59.95\00:13:01.15
that's not --
we're not born with that,
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because we're born separated.
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That is an act of faith
until we get to know God.
00:13:05.59\00:13:08.46
And so we don't know
until we interpret that text
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it's not good to
be alone to say this.
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You need to be
married to someone
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because it's not
good to be alone,
00:13:22.89\00:13:23.92
so they can give, so
you can receive from them.
00:13:23.93\00:13:28.15
It's not good for
you to be alone so
00:13:28.16\00:13:29.45
you need somebody
else to make you whole,
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to deal with your loneliness.
00:13:31.78\00:13:33.17
So with some more receiving,
00:13:33.18\00:13:35.16
I need for you to receive.
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So when we get
married, we get married
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for the whole purpose
of self and that's sin.
00:13:38.73\00:13:42.66
Our whole focus,
when I married I said,
00:13:42.67\00:13:44.41
I do, this woman's
going to make me happy,
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fulfilled,
complete, this is the one
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and for the rest of my life,
00:13:51.47\00:13:53.46
I'm gonna stay with her.
00:13:53.47\00:13:54.78
She is saying, this is my knight
00:13:54.79\00:13:55.94
in shining armor, he's
going to be my deliver,
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that's Jesus, not me.
00:13:59.72\00:14:03.14
He's going to be for
all and so we get it in
00:14:03.15\00:14:05.21
and that doesn't happen.
00:14:05.22\00:14:07.30
And we perpetuate
that, it's not good,
00:14:07.31\00:14:09.65
the Bible says, it's
not good to be alone.
00:14:09.66\00:14:12.34
Now, when Jesus said
that, when God said that,
00:14:12.35\00:14:15.70
He said, "I have
made you in my image."
00:14:15.71\00:14:20.35
God is love and
His love is the kind
00:14:20.36\00:14:24.13
that doesn't receive it gives,
00:14:24.14\00:14:26.55
and the more He
gives the happier He is.
00:14:26.56\00:14:29.75
He said, it's not
good for you to be alone
00:14:29.76\00:14:31.10
because you're my image,
00:14:31.11\00:14:32.10
you have the
kind of love I have,
00:14:32.11\00:14:33.47
you in order for you
to go grow in that image,
00:14:33.48\00:14:36.37
you must give of
yourself selflessly to others.
00:14:36.38\00:14:41.04
Therefore, it's not
good for you to be alone,
00:14:41.05\00:14:43.64
you have to have
someone else that --
00:14:43.65\00:14:45.57
and soI'm gonna
give you equation,
00:14:45.58\00:14:47.10
I'm gonna give you a
mate that's made like you,
00:14:47.11\00:14:48.77
and I'll get into
that in depth in the book.
00:14:48.78\00:14:50.58
How that the one
that's like us requires of,
00:14:50.59\00:14:54.88
requires us to
give more selflessly
00:14:54.89\00:14:56.99
than even the inanimate,
00:14:57.00\00:14:58.64
the nature, inanimate nature.
00:14:58.65\00:15:00.82
So, when God did that,
00:15:00.83\00:15:02.82
He did that for
His ultimate purpose,
00:15:02.83\00:15:05.79
which is to
develop us in His image.
00:15:05.80\00:15:07.72
The more we grow in that image,
00:15:07.73\00:15:10.55
the happier we are,
because I've learned
00:15:10.56\00:15:13.59
as I am dealing with God,
00:15:13.60\00:15:15.71
His love is
beginning to complete me.
00:15:15.72\00:15:18.98
And the more I am used of God
to spread that love selflessly
00:15:18.99\00:15:24.13
I am blessed.
00:15:24.14\00:15:26.20
I tell people, you
know, when I'm ministering,
00:15:26.21\00:15:28.78
the Lord's working through me,
00:15:28.79\00:15:30.73
it's more of a blessing
to me than it is to you.
00:15:30.74\00:15:32.77
You know, and so God, you know,
00:15:32.78\00:15:35.56
and when He said that,
that's what He was saying.
00:15:35.57\00:15:38.53
He wasn't saying
it's not good for you
00:15:38.54\00:15:40.76
to be alone because
you're gonna be lonely.
00:15:40.77\00:15:43.24
Because Adam didn't
even know he was lonely
00:15:43.25\00:15:45.98
when God created
him, he said, you know,
00:15:45.99\00:15:47.63
now name the animals, he
started naming the animals.
00:15:47.64\00:15:49.79
He said, wait a
minute, I noticed something,
00:15:49.80\00:15:52.21
there's two of
them and only one of me.
00:15:52.22\00:15:54.76
And then, you
know, once he realized,
00:15:54.77\00:15:56.97
he said, my Lord, he
said, you know, the Lord,
00:15:56.98\00:15:58.59
I put it like this.
00:15:58.60\00:16:01.19
The Lord says,
you know, okay, okay,
00:16:01.20\00:16:02.49
now that you realize that,
00:16:02.50\00:16:03.47
now that you know that
you have your wholeness
00:16:03.48\00:16:06.05
and completeness
without your companion,right.
00:16:06.06\00:16:10.09
You're ready for her,
'cause if you try, if you,
00:16:10.10\00:16:13.69
so I'm gonna put you to sleep,
00:16:13.70\00:16:15.33
why he had to put Adam to sleep?
00:16:15.34\00:16:17.70
It didn't hurt him
for God to take the rib,
00:16:17.71\00:16:20.21
God can do without
the-- he put Adam to sleep
00:16:20.22\00:16:22.21
because he wanted
time alone with Eve.
00:16:22.22\00:16:25.32
The first man Eve saw
was not Adam, it was God.
00:16:25.33\00:16:30.13
I don't know how much
time they had together,
00:16:30.14\00:16:31.52
but I'm quite sure she realized
00:16:31.53\00:16:33.66
and that time together
that my wholeness is in him.
00:16:33.67\00:16:36.23
God wanted her to realize that.
00:16:36.24\00:16:38.39
The reason sin came is
because Adam either forgot that
00:16:38.40\00:16:43.78
or ignored it,
because when Adam realized
00:16:43.79\00:16:48.42
that he was not
going to have Eve,
00:16:48.43\00:16:50.77
he wasn't willing to do that.
00:16:50.78\00:16:53.37
And there's a quote in
Patriarchs and Prophets,
00:16:53.38\00:16:57.66
it said that, you know, Adam,
00:16:57.67\00:16:59.15
he forget all, he knew the love,
00:16:59.16\00:17:02.08
but he turned away from
all that for the love of her
00:17:02.09\00:17:05.12
not realizing or not thinking
and remembering that God
00:17:05.13\00:17:09.69
could be all that he
need and supply her place.
00:17:09.70\00:17:12.08
See, he put too much and then
immediately after he did it,
00:17:12.09\00:17:18.03
all that love he
had for her was gone,
00:17:18.04\00:17:20.37
because when God came,
He said, this is that woman,
00:17:20.38\00:17:23.51
she did it, you know,
don't get me God, get her.
00:17:23.52\00:17:26.76
And then she said, oh, no.
00:17:26.77\00:17:27.85
It was, you see that
that's the result of self law,
00:17:27.86\00:17:32.43
that's the result of it.
00:17:32.44\00:17:33.77
And we get married
for that very reason.
00:17:33.78\00:17:39.16
And, you know, like I say,
00:17:39.17\00:17:40.34
the church puts its stamp on it,
00:17:40.35\00:17:41.64
because we say,
isn't not good for man
00:17:41.65\00:17:43.27
to be alone, you need somebody.
00:17:43.28\00:17:45.80
Well, you do need somebody,
00:17:45.81\00:17:46.89
but not for the reason you say.
00:17:46.90\00:17:48.93
When you have God
right in your life
00:17:48.94\00:17:50.42
that's what
John could, you know,
00:17:50.43\00:17:51.88
be on the Island of
Patmos and be complete wherever,
00:17:51.89\00:17:54.48
and be imprisoned.
00:17:54.49\00:17:55.99
And because we need
Jesus and we have Him.
00:17:56.00\00:18:00.06
Now, we do need others because
00:18:00.07\00:18:02.33
we need to give
ourselves selflessly,
00:18:02.34\00:18:03.98
single people need
others for that reason
00:18:03.99\00:18:06.98
and they can find the joy
of the Lord in this singleness,
00:18:06.99\00:18:09.58
if that's God's will for them,
00:18:09.59\00:18:12.02
they can find just as much
joy in that as a married couple
00:18:12.03\00:18:16.40
can find in their marriage.
00:18:16.41\00:18:17.43
Because the source of their
happiness is the very same,
00:18:17.44\00:18:21.05
it's the
relationship with Jesus Christ
00:18:21.06\00:18:22.93
and God has ways of fulfilling
00:18:22.94\00:18:24.79
even the human aspects
of our needs through others
00:18:24.80\00:18:27.97
in legitimate ways when
we have the right connection.
00:18:27.98\00:18:31.78
What do you think about going
through Christian counseling?
00:18:31.79\00:18:37.90
I think you do
what you have to do
00:18:37.91\00:18:41.46
and wherever you
are, so I have no problem.
00:18:41.47\00:18:43.76
So then your relationship
spiraling downward, yes.
00:18:43.77\00:18:46.43
Okay, and now
you're beginning to,
00:18:46.44\00:18:48.56
you certainly sense that hey,
00:18:48.57\00:18:50.37
this is not my
knight in shining armor.
00:18:50.38\00:18:52.32
Yes. And vice versa... Yes.
00:18:52.33\00:18:54.44
And so now you reach out.
00:18:54.45\00:18:57.55
Yes, yes, I have no, I
have no problem with counseling.
00:18:57.56\00:19:02.01
The care that I have
in that to make sure that
00:19:02.02\00:19:06.02
you pray about it
and ask God to lead you
00:19:06.03\00:19:07.77
through right
kind of council. Amen.
00:19:07.78\00:19:09.51
Because the counselor
can either be good or bad
00:19:09.52\00:19:12.90
and I don't say
this, very few counselors,
00:19:12.91\00:19:15.06
even Christian counselors will
lead you to the right source,
00:19:15.07\00:19:21.02
more often than not.
00:19:21.03\00:19:23.39
We try to altar the
people to fit the situation
00:19:23.40\00:19:29.85
rather than point
them to Jesus who only...
00:19:29.86\00:19:34.58
Can first of all
meet their need, amen.
00:19:34.59\00:19:36.74
We're trying to
tell needy people
00:19:36.75\00:19:39.60
what they need to do in
order to solve the situation.
00:19:39.61\00:19:46.27
If they had all
of that capacity,
00:19:46.28\00:19:49.56
it wouldn't be a
problem, they need something,
00:19:49.57\00:19:53.60
you know, for it to happen.
00:19:53.61\00:19:55.53
And even when
they do those things,
00:19:55.54\00:19:58.27
they're not gonna
work, like you say,
00:19:58.28\00:19:59.64
"Well, you need to
fix yourself up most,
00:19:59.65\00:20:01.82
so when he comes home, you know,
00:20:01.83\00:20:04.24
well it doesn't matter,
00:20:04.25\00:20:05.70
I mean it may
work for a day or two,
00:20:05.71\00:20:08.32
but after a while okay."
00:20:08.33\00:20:10.83
Because what
causes us to go through,
00:20:10.84\00:20:13.01
what we go
through us inside of us,
00:20:13.02\00:20:15.01
there is a need and
that need is the Lord.
00:20:15.02\00:20:18.82
So the counseling, yes,
but pray about it and let it,
00:20:18.83\00:20:23.46
and make sure
they're leading you
00:20:23.47\00:20:24.93
to have a closer
walk with the Lord.
00:20:24.94\00:20:26.97
So, is it possible
for a married couple
00:20:26.98\00:20:29.06
who's going through
the process of divorce
00:20:29.07\00:20:31.15
to start a
process of regeneration?
00:20:31.16\00:20:33.98
Very much so, It
requires surrender them,
00:20:33.99\00:20:37.63
It requires
surrender, Becuase...
00:20:37.64\00:20:39.62
And that's what
you're talking about here
00:20:39.63\00:20:41.02
how surrender
makes divorce a blessing.
00:20:41.03\00:20:43.18
Yes, yes. Then go ahead.
00:20:43.19\00:20:44.85
And let me just say this,
00:20:44.86\00:20:47.84
and I'll say this at
this point because any,
00:20:47.85\00:20:52.28
we think when we're going
through the process of divorce
00:20:52.29\00:20:55.51
and we get to the point
where we're ready to divorce,
00:20:55.52\00:20:57.50
that divorce is the answer.
00:20:57.51\00:21:02.43
My thing is always
this, I've talked I had,
00:21:02.44\00:21:07.60
and I've had
this happened before,
00:21:07.61\00:21:10.27
a couple that they're
vibrant in their ministry now,
00:21:10.28\00:21:14.27
they're wonderful together,
00:21:14.28\00:21:15.48
they had me to do their
renewal of vows and things.
00:21:15.49\00:21:18.54
But, when they
came, they had heard about
00:21:18.55\00:21:23.07
one of my books it
leads in and the husband said,
00:21:23.08\00:21:25.37
I want us to go
here to talk with him,
00:21:25.38\00:21:27.41
because that was in
their city at the time
00:21:27.42\00:21:28.87
I'm going to tell
you what that city was.
00:21:28.88\00:21:31.43
But, they came to me
and he had talked he say,
00:21:31.44\00:21:34.19
"If you just go
with me this one time,"
00:21:34.20\00:21:35.47
and she came and she take
that in my living room said,
00:21:35.48\00:21:37.56
"look, pastor, I'm
tell you this right now.
00:21:37.57\00:21:39.55
We've been to all
kind of counselors,
00:21:39.56\00:21:41.71
we've been through
all kinds of seminars,
00:21:41.72\00:21:44.48
I'm done, I'm done.
00:21:44.49\00:21:46.89
I'm only here
because I, he agreed with me
00:21:46.90\00:21:50.05
if I came with
him to this meeting,
00:21:50.06\00:21:52.19
he would leave me alone
and give me my divorce."
00:21:52.20\00:21:55.83
And I said, and I told her this,
00:21:55.84\00:21:57.11
I say look, "I'm
not gonna tell you
00:21:57.12\00:21:59.83
that things will
work on your marriage,
00:21:59.84\00:22:02.19
you know, I'm not gonna
tell you to go home and do this,
00:22:02.20\00:22:04.24
what I'm saying to you is this,
00:22:04.25\00:22:06.44
is that right now you're hurting
00:22:06.45\00:22:09.32
and you need some healing.
00:22:09.33\00:22:11.51
And you're about to make
one of the most important
00:22:11.52\00:22:13.90
decisions in your life,
00:22:13.91\00:22:16.01
when you're not
well, you're hurting.
00:22:16.02\00:22:19.05
And all I'm
saying to you is this,
00:22:19.06\00:22:20.52
I'm not saying go home and
try to patch up the marriage,
00:22:20.53\00:22:23.11
as a matter of fact, I'm
gonna tell the both of you
00:22:23.12\00:22:25.69
don't even focus on
saving your marriage."
00:22:25.70\00:22:27.71
You know, I told him I said,
00:22:27.72\00:22:29.25
"you need to stop
pressuring her, let her alone.
00:22:29.26\00:22:31.96
What you need to is
get your healing too
00:22:31.97\00:22:34.19
and that means that
both of you need to go home
00:22:34.20\00:22:37.63
and start relating
to the Lord in ways,"
00:22:37.64\00:22:40.65
and I'm, I didn't have, I
don't have time to go into
00:22:40.66\00:22:44.77
'cause I'm telling them
how to, but start relating
00:22:44.78\00:22:47.08
and then gave
them one of my books
00:22:47.09\00:22:48.19
on how to really
start dealing with the Lord.
00:22:48.20\00:22:51.75
I'm saying, I'm
just, I'm telling you not,
00:22:51.76\00:22:53.53
I'm not telling
you not to do it,
00:22:53.54\00:22:55.44
I'm just saying
before you do it,
00:22:55.45\00:22:58.29
let God give you some healing.
00:22:58.30\00:23:00.92
You know, you have time I
mean it's, there's no hurry,
00:23:00.93\00:23:03.40
I mean it's not gonna
change you don't have to work.
00:23:03.41\00:23:06.61
So just work on that right now,
00:23:06.62\00:23:09.32
I'm not telling you
and even told her husband,
00:23:09.33\00:23:11.25
back off, leave her alone.
00:23:11.26\00:23:13.90
Matter of fact, if
you always, you know,
00:23:13.91\00:23:15.57
if you're living
in separate places,
00:23:15.58\00:23:16.87
leave that alone, you
know, give her some space.
00:23:16.88\00:23:19.86
You take your time
because you need some space,
00:23:19.87\00:23:22.51
work on your
relationship not your marriage,
00:23:22.52\00:23:25.88
work on your
relationship. With the Lord.
00:23:25.89\00:23:27.97
That's right. Work on that,
00:23:27.98\00:23:29.52
because and I told
where her need was,
00:23:29.53\00:23:31.96
her need was not to
work on your relationships
00:23:31.97\00:23:34.75
that you can stay married,
because that's her pain.
00:23:34.76\00:23:37.81
She's saying,
no, no, and I've been
00:23:37.82\00:23:40.72
through all kind
of counseling, no.
00:23:40.73\00:23:43.57
But her need was,
I need, I'm in pain,
00:23:43.58\00:23:47.31
and if I get this divorced,
it may not stop my pain,
00:23:47.32\00:23:49.68
but it's gone ease it some.
00:23:49.69\00:23:51.77
And my thing was, go to Jesus
00:23:51.78\00:23:54.44
and let Him deal with your pain,
00:23:54.45\00:23:55.97
because He can
bring you some healing.
00:23:55.98\00:23:57.25
Now she started
hearing that because
00:23:57.26\00:23:58.41
that's what her
need was, I'm in pain
00:23:58.42\00:24:00.96
and all I'm hearing
from people are these words
00:24:00.97\00:24:02.73
of what I need to
do and all that's,
00:24:02.74\00:24:05.14
what the Bible says, what
the Spirit of prophecy says,
00:24:05.15\00:24:07.37
but that's, you
know, all that's going
00:24:07.38\00:24:08.60
just bring more pain to me,
00:24:08.61\00:24:09.62
I've been trying to
do, it doesn't work.
00:24:09.63\00:24:12.64
But, when you start here,
here don't worry about it,
00:24:12.65\00:24:15.87
deal with your
pain, and if you feel
00:24:15.88\00:24:17.75
you need to do it,
go ahead and do it.
00:24:17.76\00:24:19.68
But deal with God first,
00:24:19.69\00:24:21.54
in the way of
seeking your healing.
00:24:21.55\00:24:24.93
Long story short, she
called me about a month later,
00:24:24.94\00:24:29.22
and she said,
"Pastor, guess where I'm?"
00:24:29.23\00:24:31.22
I said,"Where are you?"
She said,"I'm in Florida."
00:24:31.23\00:24:32.82
So that's nice and guess
who I have standing beside me.
00:24:32.83\00:24:35.49
I said, who? She
said, "My husband."
00:24:35.50\00:24:37.26
She says, "Oh
I'll tell you, really,
00:24:37.27\00:24:38.28
I just have to tell
you, when I came down here,
00:24:38.29\00:24:40.14
I was coming down
here to get away from him
00:24:40.15\00:24:42.53
and meet a old
friend we, you know,
00:24:42.54\00:24:44.78
going to another man, she said,
00:24:44.79\00:24:46.01
but when I was on the plane,
00:24:46.02\00:24:47.73
the Lord started
speaking to me about that
00:24:47.74\00:24:49.49
and so and so,
now when I got here,
00:24:49.50\00:24:51.58
I called him up
and say, you know,
00:24:51.59\00:24:52.88
did you want to
join talk about it,
00:24:52.89\00:24:54.60
he came down and I
tell you the Lord has worked
00:24:54.61\00:24:57.60
some miraculous things
and we want to try it again.
00:24:57.61\00:25:00.06
Long story short
about a year later,
00:25:00.07\00:25:02.33
they called me they've been
vibrant in ministry together,
00:25:02.34\00:25:05.10
and they say they
wanted to me to do the renewal.
00:25:05.11\00:25:07.42
The Lord brought that
marriage back together.
00:25:07.43\00:25:10.11
One of the
things that, you know,
00:25:10.12\00:25:11.60
when I say and I'll say
this, and when people come to me
00:25:11.61\00:25:17.29
hurting about
marriage, I don't even deal with
00:25:17.30\00:25:20.01
how to make
your marriage better,
00:25:20.02\00:25:22.65
I deal with how to make
your relationship better.
00:25:22.66\00:25:25.37
Relationship with the Lord.
00:25:25.38\00:25:26.65
That's right, because
when you make your relationship
00:25:26.66\00:25:29.59
with the Lord better, if
God wants to save that marriage
00:25:29.60\00:25:31.57
and more often than not He will,
00:25:31.58\00:25:33.52
you know, He wants to.
00:25:33.53\00:25:34.56
The only way He doesn't
to is neither one of us,
00:25:34.57\00:25:36.63
if both of you are surrendering,
00:25:36.64\00:25:38.49
you know, He'll do that.
00:25:38.50\00:25:39.97
I have another part which says,
00:25:39.98\00:25:41.11
if God wanted a
divorce and be surprised,
00:25:41.12\00:25:44.34
I don't have
time to begin to that,
00:25:44.35\00:25:45.50
maybe we'll have
some other time for that.
00:25:45.51\00:25:47.94
But, you know, is
if more often than not,
00:25:47.95\00:25:51.40
if both of you're doing,
He's gonna save that marriage.
00:25:51.41\00:25:54.81
So don't focus on
try to save the marriage.
00:25:54.82\00:25:56.71
So you're getting
yourself out of the way.
00:25:56.72\00:25:58.20
That's right, and God's will
00:25:58.21\00:26:00.52
is for the marriage to be whole.
00:26:00.53\00:26:02.36
So you both
start dealing with God,
00:26:02.37\00:26:04.05
start surrendering to
God, let him start healing you,
00:26:04.06\00:26:06.93
start fixing
you and molding you,
00:26:06.94\00:26:09.19
He'll work in you both to will
00:26:09.20\00:26:10.65
and do of His good pleasure,
His good pleasure,amen.
00:26:10.66\00:26:14.32
And He'll bring you
together, so don't work on that,
00:26:14.33\00:26:16.99
work on your relationship
people can hear that.
00:26:17.00\00:26:18.98
And when you
meet where they are,
00:26:18.99\00:26:20.07
they're hurting, God's
going to heal they're motivated.
00:26:20.08\00:26:23.77
Amen, and when you
say for His good purpose,
00:26:23.78\00:26:26.53
what do you think that
means, God's good purpose?
00:26:26.54\00:26:29.73
When I say for His good purpose,
00:26:29.74\00:26:31.10
I don't know,
quite sure what... Okay.
00:26:31.11\00:26:33.61
God's purpose for the-- Yes.
00:26:33.62\00:26:34.94
Okay, well His purpose
ultimately is to develop you
00:26:34.95\00:26:37.93
in his image, to
make you in his character,
00:26:37.94\00:26:40.88
in his character of love,
agape love, selfless love.
00:26:40.89\00:26:43.87
That you're giving of --
and when he has two people
00:26:43.88\00:26:47.20
like that, that's a
little bit of heaven on earth.
00:26:47.21\00:26:49.05
And you don't
have to be married too,
00:26:49.06\00:26:50.75
to have that
for a single person,
00:26:50.76\00:26:52.61
as they're like that,
near around people like that.
00:26:52.62\00:26:55.00
There is still heaven on earth.
00:26:55.01\00:26:58.27
And what is our role as
being brothers and sisters
00:26:58.28\00:27:00.52
in Christ for
those that need love?
00:27:00.53\00:27:02.94
Our role as brother and sister
in Christ is to first of all,
00:27:02.95\00:27:07.65
beyond giving them a
counsel is to reflect
00:27:07.66\00:27:11.14
the loving
character of God. Amen.
00:27:11.15\00:27:13.57
And the only way
you can reflect the care
00:27:13.58\00:27:15.66
and loving care
'cause, you know,
00:27:15.67\00:27:17.15
we try to reflect love and
we do it either to one extreme
00:27:17.16\00:27:21.14
or the other, we've two
pains and that too not enough.
00:27:21.15\00:27:23.91
But reflecting now that
means surrendering to God
00:27:23.92\00:27:26.32
and let God use us to
go there to be used of God.
00:27:26.33\00:27:29.39
Not to try to correct
them well I'm not telling
00:27:29.40\00:27:31.38
what the Bible says about this,
00:27:31.39\00:27:32.64
what the Spirit of
Prophecy says about this,
00:27:32.65\00:27:34.59
but spiritually,
that's why I love this,
00:27:34.60\00:27:35.70
let those who are spiritual,
00:27:35.71\00:27:36.84
that means you're gonna
surrender to the spirit.
00:27:36.85\00:27:38.86
Lord, show me
how if I can be used.
00:27:38.87\00:27:40.88
And it might be don't
say anything right now,
00:27:40.89\00:27:42.41
just put your arms
around them, whatever,
00:27:42.42\00:27:45.13
but you have to let the
spirit of God work through
00:27:45.14\00:27:47.31
you to reach out
to them to love them.
00:27:47.32\00:27:49.54
Amen, amen, what a good topic,
00:27:49.55\00:27:54.05
divorce a blessing,
but yet we know that
00:27:54.06\00:27:57.02
God is what it's all about. Yes.
00:27:57.03\00:27:58.76
You know, ultimately.
00:27:58.77\00:28:00.73
Just thank you for
being with us today
00:28:00.74\00:28:02.34
on Issues and Answers. Yes.
00:28:02.35\00:28:04.12
I want to thank our
audience for being with us.
00:28:04.13\00:28:06.63
You know, that our
desire for you is that
00:28:06.64\00:28:09.56
He just blesses you
abundantly, God bless.
00:28:09.57\00:28:12.20