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Hello friends and welcome
to 3ABNs Issues and Answers. My
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name is John Lomacang. It's
always good to have you tune in
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especially when the program is
as good as this one's going to
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be on Family Communications.
I'm so glad that Carol Zarska is
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here today to open our minds to
find out how we can better our
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communication not only as
husbands and wives but how to
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talk to our children, children
how to talk to your parents and
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then how to build a bond that
will last and strengthen your
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family as the years roll
by. Carol thank you so much for
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being here. Thank
you for inviting me.
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I just really enjoy, we've had a
chance to visit before and I've
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always appreciated that,
but I enjoy topics such as this
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because we do
need strong families.
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Yes, it's such a need today. So
many families are breaking apart
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If somebody's watching this
program that may not have met
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you before just kind of give us
an overview of who you are and
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where you're from
and maybe what you do.
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Well I've been a family
counselor and a speaker since
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1984. I joined in that year with
American Cassette Ministries at
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that time, now American
Christian Ministries and have
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traveled around the world
speaking and giving seminars and
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so forth. But I in later
years have been doing a lot more
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counseling and it's really
exciting to see the things that
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God is showing us today
about how to be better parents,
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better friends, better husbands
and wives. There's a lot of
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information that's coming out
today even in science about how
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we are created differently and
how to relate so that there's
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going to be happiness instead
of suffering and anger and
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resentment toward each other.
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Having the experience you've had
as a wife married for 50 years
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(that's right) and that is
a milestone in patience and
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learning loving. Yes
it is. It has been quite a
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journey but very exciting.
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I would say if you wake up
tomorrow morning as husband and
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wife and you feel that there's
nothing new to focus on or not
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another platform to take
your relationship to then
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relationships tend to
start dying from that point on.
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Mmm. That's so true. God created
us in his image which means that
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there is no limit to the
expansion that we can have
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forever, even in eternity.
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I like that, in the image of God
because with the Lord there's
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no beginning and
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there's no end, so why would the
Lord create something that has
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a definite end to it? I like
that. I'm going to use that one.
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I haven't used that before.
Thank you for that tidbit.
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Yes it's exciting
to be a child of God.
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And I'm talking about family
counseling. That is one dynamic
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that is so amazing. Because if
there are just four individuals,
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the mother, father, son and
daughter, those are four minds.
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The minds of the children are
often the result of what they
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see in parents, the parents are
the result of what they saw in
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their parents and so on and so
forth. But how do we better and
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enhance our
family communication?
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Well my favorite text to begin
this discussion is found in
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Ephesians 4 and that whole
chapter is about unity that the
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Lord wants us to have and so
it starts out... Be completely
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humble and gentle. Verse 2 be
patient bearing with one another
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in love. Make every effort
to keep the unity of the Spirit
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through the bond of peace. That
in itself sets the tone for this
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whole chapter. And of course
it's not just for families only
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it's for church members,
neighbors or friends or whatever
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that God wants us to be because
that's what he is. He is three
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in one and he would like for us
to be like that too. We can be
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one with one another and
yet retain our individuality and
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that's the hard part. So I want
to skip quickly to verses 29 and
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on, a little further than
that but I want to start with 29
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because this in one verse
actually incorporates what I
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feel can help us to grow in our
relationships in such a way that
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it transcends anything that
we've been doing in the past.
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OK. It says do not let any
unwholesome talk, I'm using the
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NIV by the way, come out of
your mouths but only what is
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helpful for building others
up according to their needs that
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it may benefit those who listen.
Now there's a lot more that we
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can read on, but I want to just
examine that for what it says.
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If we live just that one verse
we would never have another
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problem with other people.
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It would be revolutionary.
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It would be and that should be
our goal. So it says do not let
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any, that's zero, unwholesome
talk come out of your mouths.
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Unwholesome means that's it not
helpful for the other person and
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we do this all the time.
Of course we feel generally if
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there's going to be an argument
ensuing that it's the other
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person that's the
problem and we blame them.
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Oh that is so good Carol. I'm
just excited about this because
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what you're saying is you're
validating some of the view
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points that I've had in the
sense that as a family we are
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not the problem but we have
a problem. You suggest that in
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order to resolve the problem you
don't get rid of the family, NO,
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but you work on the
problem collectively.
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Some people do, a lot of people
do just decide this is not the
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person I want to live with
and so they split and of course
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children are abused and are
always blamed. In many families
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it's the children that are
yelled at and called all kinds
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of names and so forth. This is
so satanic because in doing this
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we're taking on the actual
character of the evil one for he
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is the accuser of the brethren
and we become accusers. We're
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taking on something that's not
from God, it's from the evil one
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and we don't even know we're
doing this. It's so common to
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hear criticism. We even get
together like say at potluck
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after church and we talk about
other people or each other or
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whatever. We talk about our
husbands if they're not there to
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hear it, or our kids if
they're not there to hear it or
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whatever and this seems to
be just our fare, but it should
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never to said not only to each
other but to the person that
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we're talking about.
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You know the thought that just
came to my mind is we take pot
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shots at pot luck.
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Yes it's true and I
think it's rather sad.
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So if you would analyze it,
and I like that verse the way it
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reads in the NIV, verse 29
in Ephesians 4. It is in essence
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saying so whatever comes out of
your mouth, if I'm hearing you
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correctly, becomes a seed of
destruction when it's negative.
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But a seed of beauty when
it's positive. But it's a seed
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nonetheless. It's
seed and it will sprout. It
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will grow. Then thinking about
a little further on here, any
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unwholesome talk but only...
notice the superlatives that
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Paul is using here. Of course,
the Holy Spirit is impressing
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him to do that. The superlative
of no unwholesome talk, only
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what is helpful for building
others up. Only. How many times
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do we even know how to build
others up? In order to do that
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we would have to follow the
instruction here that continues,
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which is according to their
needs. If we don't know the need
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of the person we're not going
to know how to build them up
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and so often we're strangers.
A lot of people are strangers in
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their own home. They have done
studies to count the minutes, or
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maybe hours if we're lucky that
family members spend together in
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one week and it's unbelievable
because we're running here and
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there and when we are home we
may be watching television and
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doing other things. Do we really
know the need of that other
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person so that we can build them
up. And then it says that it may
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benefit those who listen. So if
we just take that one text and
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really live it by the power
of the Holy Spirit our whole
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families, our
lives would be changed.
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When I combine both of the
translations, I have the New
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King James version, reads that
we may benefit those... Read
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that verse again, that it may
benefit. And it says that it may
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benefit those who listen. Our
words should benefit those who
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listen. And I like
what it says, that it
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may impart grace to the hearer.
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Yes that's wonderful.
What is benefit? It's grace and
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we're imparting to the one we're
talking to the grace that God
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is imparting to us when we ask
him Lord, we're praying to you.
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We want his grace and
others want our grace.
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Oh absolutely. And how reticent
we are to give grace when we
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think someone has done something
wrong. I remember a mother
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saying to me who was very
critical of her son, he was an
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adult, and she say if I
don't tell him, who will? Oooo.
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And this is a Christian person,
a very dedicated Christian
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person. Sometimes Christians
are even more like that perhaps
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because we're trying to make
sure that we shake them up so
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that they're going to be able
to be saved or whatever we think
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that we're doing for them.
We can be so critical sometimes.
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The think that I have been
learning more and more and I
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believe that it's more and more
in society in general and that
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is how do you build other people
up? What kind of verbiage is
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going to do that? I'm going
to use two illustrations of
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children. There was a
story years ago that I read in a
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magazine about a female
psychiatrist or at least, I
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don't remember exactly but
at least a counselor, and the
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father brought his little girl
to this counselor. I would say
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the little girl was about
five, no more than five. To my
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recollection there was probably
a divorce so that the mother was
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not available or maybe even
death of the mother. I don't
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know. But as this father brought
the little child and left it for
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some reason with the counselor
and then he left. Well the
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little girl just threw a
fit. She was crying, she was
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inconsolable and so the
psychiatrist was trying to get
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get her to stop crying so that
they could go on their way. She
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would not stop crying and
the psychiatrist said everything
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she knew to do and nothing
worked. So finally she said to
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her it's really sad isn't it
that your daddy isn't here and
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your mommy isn't here and you
feel left and alone don't you?
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And the little girl climbed up
in her lap and fell asleep. You
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see we don't even know what
the needs are. We're trying to
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correct behavior. We're trying
to stop something that we think
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is wrong or something that is
irritating to us. But we need to
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be able to know the heart of
another person and enter into
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that because that's what Jesus
does for us. He entered into the
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very heart of humanity. He took
upon himself our feelings and
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our infirmities so that he would
know what we feel like so that
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he can sympathize with us and
that's why we love him. That's
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why we're drawn to him
because we know he cares and he
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understands even though he's the
God of the universe he loves us
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and if we could love people like
that things would change. One
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more story: My daughter Karen
is going back to school. She has
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about a year, a little over
a year, to finish her education
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at Columbia Union College
in early childhood development.
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As a part of her curriculum she
has to work in a day care center
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and so she gets to take care
of children around two to four.
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There's this one little boy that
she has been telling me about,
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this is very recent. His name is
Noah and he is three years old.
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He is a total basket case a lot
of times. His mother is in the
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throws of a divorce with the
father so Noah is with his dad
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part of the time and his mom
part of the time. They have not
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finished the divorce yet so it's
a very new thing. Now mother has
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to work, Noah has to stay at the
day care center and he doesn't
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like it. He's only three years
old but he throws a fit. He
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kicks the teacher. He grabs from
the children and anything bad
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that he can think of to do he
does and sometimes they call the
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mother and say come and get your
child, we can't do anything. The
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day care center people said
this is the worst child they've
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ever had. So my daughter loves
children and so she had been
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working with Noah and she will
tell him you know Jesus loves
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you so much and talks to him
about his feelings and so forth
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and one day just last
week Karen said that Noah was
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throwing a fit, so one of the
other teachers said why don't
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you take Noah and see if you can
do anything with him. Noah ran
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into another room where there
were tables where they would eat
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He got under the table and lay
on his back and he put his feet
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up and he was pushing the table
up and down, banging up and down
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and rattling things and just a
mess. So Karen didn't know what
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to do so she prayed and the Lord
impressed her what to so. She
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lay down on the floor with
Noah right beside of him and she
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said Noah you must be hurting
because your daddy isn't with
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you anymore much and your mommy
is working and you can't be with
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mommy and daddy the way you
could and you must be really
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hurting inside. He stopped
banging the chair, the table,
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and he listened and she said you
know Jesus really loves you and
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he understands you're hurting.
Noah said my heart is broken.
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He's three year old. My
heart is broken and you know he
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didn't give another bit of
trouble that whole day. That to
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me is this kind of talk that we
should enter into the feelings
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of other people for healing so
that we're not just saying well
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we think you ought to do this
and why don't you do that and
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how come you did that. We just
have all kinds of suggestions
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that we think are so good. But
if we could listen with a heart
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of love knowing that person and
pray that God will help us to
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whether it's our husbands our
our children or the next door
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neighbor or somebody that calls
us on the phone and really care.
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I believe that we would see a
total transformation instead of
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the bickering and so forth that
so often happens among people.
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I'm just soaking this in because
you're speaking the language
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that is often unheard. You're
communicating the thoughts of
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people that are sometimes
communicating in behavior, in
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frustration, in anger. They're
acting it out. We look at the
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action and we so often forget
that that's just a symptom of a
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deeper problem. Yeah exactly.
You know the only way I could
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illustrate this is sometimes we
put too much oil in an engine.
00:17:24.61\00:17:29.81
It's going to bubble out. It's
going to impact the function of
00:17:29.84\00:17:33.72
the engine. In some cases, if
you fill it up till the oil is
00:17:33.75\00:17:37.92
pouring out you can blow the
engine. Sometimes people are so
00:17:37.95\00:17:42.52
filled up so that they're about
to pour out that this internal
00:17:42.59\00:17:47.00
combustion that's happening all
the time and we see that when in
00:17:47.03\00:17:51.57
fact it's either a deficit, not
enough affection, or too much of
00:17:51.60\00:17:56.20
the wrong affection. Right.
And children and adults today in
00:17:56.24\00:18:00.14
families if we understand that
we'll change our approach and
00:18:00.18\00:18:04.25
stop addressing just the symptom
and start saying to the person
00:18:04.28\00:18:08.28
tell me how you
feel, what's bothering you?
00:18:08.32\00:18:11.19
If Noah as a three-year-old
child never having any training
00:18:11.22\00:18:16.02
could express himself when he
got loved how much could we do
00:18:16.06\00:18:20.80
that with our own families as
they get used to mom and dad who
00:18:20.83\00:18:25.03
really care, or husband and
wife, or friend to friend that
00:18:25.07\00:18:29.07
you know that person cares
enough to really listen to your
00:18:29.10\00:18:33.07
heart and help. Jesus
said that out of the heart
00:18:33.11\00:18:36.58
proceed the issues of life.
Right. That's another way to
00:18:36.64\00:18:40.82
look at that. The heart is often
not heard. I was talking to
00:18:40.85\00:18:44.99
couples just recently. I said so
often we get sidetracked by what
00:18:45.02\00:18:50.06
we hear. Some men get locked
into the details. You know we're
00:18:50.09\00:18:55.10
very left brain, right
brain. We're very analytical and
00:18:55.13\00:18:57.57
compartmental and we'll say to
our wives well I know what you
00:18:57.60\00:19:02.10
said but do you want a black
purse or a blue purse or is your
00:19:02.14\00:19:05.61
black shoe hurting you or your
blue shoe hurting you? Is it the
00:19:05.64\00:19:08.41
one you bought last week or
the week before last? We getting
00:19:08.44\00:19:11.11
caught in the details and
the wife is in essence saying my
00:19:11.15\00:19:14.32
foot is hurting, that's the
bottom line. I don't care when
00:19:14.35\00:19:18.02
it was bought, what happened,
my foot's hurting. Okay. My wife
00:19:18.05\00:19:20.82
and I had that experience coming
back from the airport. We were
00:19:20.86\00:19:23.32
rushing our suit cases into the
car and she took hers out and
00:19:23.36\00:19:27.30
just in a hurrying moment the
suitcase ripped the top of her
00:19:27.33\00:19:31.17
shoe bow off and her focal point
was oh I can't go to the airport
00:19:31.23\00:19:36.34
like this. It's awful, it's
flapping back and forth and I
00:19:36.37\00:19:39.21
heard right away and the
frustration was not so much that
00:19:39.24\00:19:41.98
the shoe was uncomfortable, that
she didn't like it any longer,
00:19:42.04\00:19:45.21
but she says I can't present
myself in public this way. So
00:19:45.25\00:19:48.62
my quick response was after a
counseling seminar, do you have
00:19:48.65\00:19:52.12
another pair with you, how can
we resolve this? She said I have
00:19:52.15\00:19:55.09
another pair in the suitcase.
So what I asked was how could we
00:19:55.12\00:19:58.03
resolve this rather than
telling her how to resolve it.
00:19:58.06\00:20:01.03
That's good, right. That way you
don't come over parent/child.
00:20:01.06\00:20:05.80
You come over friend to friend,
caring friend to friend. There's
00:20:05.83\00:20:10.51
something in here goes right
along with that in verse 30
00:20:10.54\00:20:13.71
where it says and do not grieve
the Holy Spirit of God with whom
00:20:13.74\00:20:17.38
you were sealed for the day
of redemption. 31-Get rid of all
00:20:17.41\00:20:21.02
bitterness, rage, anger,
brawling, slander, along with
00:20:21.05\00:20:23.59
every form of malice. Be kind
and compassionate to one another
00:20:23.62\00:20:26.96
forgiving each other just as
in Christ God forgave you. So he
00:20:27.02\00:20:29.89
goes back with the grace again.
That's what's we're really
00:20:29.92\00:20:32.76
wanting. But isn't it
interesting to see that when we
00:20:32.79\00:20:37.77
talk about wanting the feeling
of the Holy Spirit and yet it
00:20:37.83\00:20:43.10
says here that when we're not
kind to each other we grieve the
00:20:43.14\00:20:47.88
Holy Spirit, the very Holy
Spirit that we want to be filled
00:20:47.94\00:20:52.11
by is the Holy Spirit we're
grieving because the Holy Spirit
00:20:52.15\00:20:56.02
is hurting when we're hurting
another person. That's a child
00:20:56.05\00:20:59.89
of the Holy Spirit just as we
would hurt if we heard someone
00:20:59.92\00:21:03.83
saying nasty things to our child
so the Holy Spirit is grieved
00:21:03.86\00:21:07.33
when we do this to each other.
I don't see how the Holy Spirit
00:21:07.36\00:21:10.83
can stand it, you know, really,
because there's so much pain
00:21:10.87\00:21:14.30
in the world today. I was
talking to a Christian, not a
00:21:14.34\00:21:18.67
Seventh-day Adventist, but a
Christian woman on the phone,
00:21:18.71\00:21:22.74
she was counseling with me,
and they had a fairly decent
00:21:22.78\00:21:26.75
marriage but she said well maybe
she could learn some more and I
00:21:26.78\00:21:29.98
was talking to her about
this and being careful not to be
00:21:30.02\00:21:33.76
critical ever, ever, of
her husband. We weren't talking
00:21:33.79\00:21:37.43
about children at that time. And
she said will the other day I
00:21:37.46\00:21:41.80
said to my husband, he said
something and I said to him well
00:21:41.83\00:21:45.73
that was a stupid thing to
do. She said was there something
00:21:45.77\00:21:50.84
wrong with that? And I said
Um-huh. I didn't want to jump on
00:21:50.87\00:21:55.64
it but it just shows how easy
it is for us to not even realize
00:21:55.68\00:22:00.42
that we're hurting the other
person. This was a Christian
00:22:00.45\00:22:03.59
woman, goes to church every
Sunday and still didn't know
00:22:03.62\00:22:06.76
that to say that was unkind.
00:22:06.79\00:22:09.12
You know, sometimes
we communicate how we are
00:22:09.16\00:22:12.66
communicated to. There are some
homes that are dysfunctional and
00:22:12.69\00:22:17.30
one of the things that
frustrates me more than anything
00:22:17.33\00:22:20.80
else in the family circle is
when I hear people say a child
00:22:20.84\00:22:25.84
should be seen and not heard.
Oh yes. And the reason I'm
00:22:25.87\00:22:29.91
saying that is because I was
raised somewhat that way. You
00:22:29.94\00:22:33.95
don't butt into adults'
conversation which children
00:22:33.98\00:22:37.12
shouldn't but if they come in
and say mom, dad, if that's the
00:22:37.19\00:22:40.82
time to teach them how to butt
in properly and respectfully.
00:22:40.86\00:22:44.59
You say well say excuse me.
That's better than saying look
00:22:44.63\00:22:48.26
go in the corner, I don't want
to hear you. Shut up, go in your
00:22:48.33\00:22:51.13
room and when I'm
done I'll see you.
00:22:51.17\00:22:52.53
Right, right I hear that a lot.
00:22:52.57\00:22:55.07
And they grow up hasn't it
done damage? Tell me about that.
00:22:55.10\00:22:58.41
A great deal of damage. What
that tells the person is you are
00:22:58.44\00:23:02.18
not valuable. You're input is
not valuable, your feelings are
00:23:02.21\00:23:05.75
not valuable and it's a type
of rejection and there isn't any
00:23:05.78\00:23:10.02
more painful experience that
a human being can have besides
00:23:10.05\00:23:14.26
rejection. That is the
worst, rejection or a sense of
00:23:14.29\00:23:17.86
rejection and we do this all
the time. We can do it in little
00:23:17.89\00:23:21.13
ways. We don't think we're being
rejecting but it feels that way
00:23:21.16\00:23:24.37
to the other person and that's
why this text says that it
00:23:24.40\00:23:27.87
should be building them up for
their edification according to
00:23:27.90\00:23:31.11
their needs and we need to know
one another well enough to know
00:23:31.14\00:23:34.28
what the other
person's needs are.
00:23:34.31\00:23:35.98
Instead of cutting them off,
instead of saying, look I'm the
00:23:36.01\00:23:40.65
father, I say it, you do
it or I'm the mother I set the
00:23:40.68\00:23:43.15
standards, you don't question it
What happens is I've seen adults
00:23:43.18\00:23:46.89
grow up in situations where
they are now adults in an office
00:23:46.92\00:23:51.76
setting or adults in society
and they feel that they have no
00:23:51.79\00:23:55.53
boundaries. They can't even
establish boundaries because
00:23:55.56\00:23:59.20
their parents had so belittled
them that they feel they don't
00:23:59.23\00:24:02.30
matter and they will go so
far as saying my voice doesn't
00:24:02.34\00:24:05.37
really count. Well
because that's the only
00:24:05.41\00:24:08.28
thing they know and they learned
it at home. I have a wonderful
00:24:08.31\00:24:13.65
quotation here from the Spirit
of Prophecy, Ellen White's
00:24:13.68\00:24:18.72
writings, that speaks to that in
such a special way that I'd just
00:24:18.75\00:24:23.16
like to share that. This is
found in Isaiah where God is
00:24:23.19\00:24:35.47
talking about the Elijah
message that is to come to
00:24:35.50\00:24:39.81
prepare the way for Jesus'
coming. And of course we know
00:24:39.87\00:24:45.11
that that the first Elijah was
John the Baptist. I think this
00:24:45.18\00:24:51.49
is so appropriate for us today
in preparation for Jesus' second
00:24:51.55\00:24:56.22
coming in our families and
the repair that God wants to do.
00:24:56.26\00:25:00.90
This in Isaiah 62. It says, Pass
through the gates, pass through
00:25:00.93\00:25:06.03
the gates, and of course I
always think about the gates of
00:25:06.07\00:25:09.64
praise because we're talking
about sanctuary language here,
00:25:09.67\00:25:13.14
because the gates of praise are
where people come to worship God
00:25:13.17\00:25:19.05
and it says pass through the
gates, prepare the way for the
00:25:19.08\00:25:22.78
people, build up, build up the
highway, and remember those are
00:25:22.85\00:25:27.49
the very words of Ephesians
4:29, to build them up. And it
00:25:27.52\00:25:32.23
says remove the stones, raise
a banner for the nations. There
00:25:32.26\00:25:36.40
are stones in people's lives
that we may have put there or
00:25:36.43\00:25:39.97
somebody has put there, stones
that are stones of stumbling,
00:25:40.00\00:25:44.21
stones that cause a stony heart
for the person and they can't
00:25:44.24\00:25:48.94
really receive God and Jesus
because there's no pathway that
00:25:48.98\00:25:53.42
is clear enough for them
and they can stumble over these
00:25:53.45\00:25:57.82
stones that we have put in there
That's my introduction here to
00:25:57.85\00:26:04.56
something that is in the
writings of Ellen White. She
00:26:04.59\00:26:08.73
says the reason why there
are so many hard-hearted men and
00:26:08.76\00:26:13.44
women in our world is that true
affection has been regarded as
00:26:13.47\00:26:18.07
a weakness and has been
discouraged and repressed.
00:26:18.11\00:26:21.84
The better part of the nature
of persons of this class is
00:26:21.88\00:26:25.58
perverted and dwarfed in
childhood and unless rays of
00:26:25.61\00:26:29.22
divine light can melt away
their coldness and hard-hearted
00:26:29.28\00:26:33.79
selfishness the happiness of
such is buried forever. We can
00:26:33.82\00:26:38.49
do something about that. We
can be the way to open up those
00:26:38.53\00:26:43.50
hearts. We can do things to
remove the stones by saying you
00:26:43.53\00:26:48.00
aren't invaluable, you aren't
a bad person. You may have had
00:26:48.04\00:26:51.87
something bad happen to you
but Jesus loves you just like a
00:26:51.94\00:26:56.08
little Noah. Jesus loves you
Noah and it took away the pain
00:26:56.11\00:27:00.62
he was having for the moment
at least and for that afternoon.
00:27:00.65\00:27:05.02
So we can be that kind of people
that will help the Holy Spirit
00:27:05.05\00:27:09.26
to be able to fill people's
lives that may never be able to
00:27:09.32\00:27:13.50
be saved unless
we're there doing that.
00:27:13.53\00:27:15.30
So in essence for the family,
mother, father, sister, brother,
00:27:15.33\00:27:19.67
however many siblings there may
be the answer to reconciliation
00:27:19.70\00:27:24.04
is building them up but
understanding their needs. Yes.
00:27:24.07\00:27:27.71
And in learning how to
communicate in such a way that
00:27:27.74\00:27:31.31
whatever your words are make
sure that they're positive so
00:27:31.35\00:27:34.35
when the seed is planted
whatsoever a person sows they
00:27:34.38\00:27:37.35
will reap and reap the rewards
of the blessings that God has in
00:27:37.39\00:27:40.19
store for them. Right.
And we can learn how to
00:27:40.22\00:27:43.79
do this. You know, people say to
me well I don't know how to do
00:27:43.83\00:27:46.90
that. Well, I don't
either but we can learn.
00:27:46.93\00:27:50.10
Well friends as you see here
there's always a blessing in
00:27:50.13\00:27:52.87
learning to follow the Christ
that we love. May today be the
00:27:52.90\00:27:55.60
day that you
yield your life to him.
00:27:55.64\00:27:59.11