Hello, I'm Shelley Quinn.
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Welcome to Issues and Answers.
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This is a program
where we talk about issues
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that are affecting Christians
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and people other
than Christians even,
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and what are the
Biblical answers.
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And today we are going
to be talking about stop.
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We're going to look at
the warning signs of abuse.
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You know, the Bible says Timothy
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or Paul worth is to
Timothy in 2 Timothy Chapter 3.
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Listen to what he
said about people.
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He said, beginning in verse 1.
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"Understand this
that in the last days
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they will become perilous times
of great stress and trouble.
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People will be lovers of self,
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they will be
utterly self-centered,
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lovers of money and greedy,
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they have a
greedy desire of wealth.
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They are gonna
be proud, arrogant,
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and contemptuous boasters.
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They will be abusive,
disobedient to parents,
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ungrateful,
unholy, and profane."
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He goes on to
talk about these people
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and here is what he
finally says in verse 5.
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"For they hold a
form of piety or religion
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but they deny and
reject the power of it
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avoid all such people."
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In the Greek he is saying,
turn away from people like this.
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What we want to do today
is to arm you with knowledge.
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Maybe you are in a
wonderful relationship,
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maybe you're dating
someone who's wonderful,
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and you think I
don't need to know
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about what the
warning signs are of abuse.
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But let me tell you, you do
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because there's
other people in your church
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that you need to
educate, that you need to say.
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Maybe it's your
own child and you say,
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you know, there
is something here
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that this person you are
dating this is a scary sign.
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And if you are in a relationship
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and you know something is wrong
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but you always feel like
it's your fault stay tuned
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because we're going to tell you
what these warning signs are.
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Please help me
welcome retuning to us
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Liz Harrison from
St. Louis Missouri.
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Now tell us about your ministry.
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Yes, Harrison's
Referral Services
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is a domestic
violence organization.
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We help women and children
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that are flaying
from domestic violence,
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that are displaced
due to domestic violence.
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We help women and children
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get into a safe
havens, into a shelters.
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We help with emergency
toiletries, food, and clothing.
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And we also offer spiritual
guidance and counseling as well.
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And I know that you do a
lot of workshops in churches
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and you're trying
to really get churches
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off the mark if you
will and it's on mark
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but you trying to get them to
where churches are recognizing
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these problems of
domestic violence and abuse.
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That's correct.
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And praise the Lord for
the work that you're doing
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but this comes from something
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you come at this
topic with a lot of passion
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because you were abused yourself
in your previous marriage.
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Yes, yes.
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Well, what we
want to do today, Liz,
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is as you have come to
tell us about the warning signs.
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Yes.
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Let's just jump right
into the warning signs
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but I want to
frame it in this way.
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After you tell us
some of these warning signs
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I want to know did
you recognize any of these
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in your relationship
before you married your husband?
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The warning signs
are controlling behavior,
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force to calculating your
time when you leaving the house
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and when you are
at work. The abuser--
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So when you say
calculating the time
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you mean like, if
some one is saying
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it should have only
taken you 22 minutes
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to drive from work to home,
ehy are you 10 minutes late.
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Yes, the abuser will accuse you
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of having an
outside relationship
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or maybe stopping
to talk to someone
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about what's
going on in the home.
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So the abuser is
always tracking your time.
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And will give
you an estimated time
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of how long it should take you
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to get to one
destination to the next.
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Also to you have
control in behavior
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forced to telling you where
you can go, where you can't go,
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isolating you from
family and friends,
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also to the abuser
will control the money,
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the bank accounts,
checking accounts or whatever,
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also to their control
how much money you spend.
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They only give
you so much money.
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So you know, they are afraid
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that you might pack
up and try to leave.
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They don't want you to have
any outside access to anyone.
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When you see the
jealousy behavior
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where the spouse or
the boyfriend or the abuser
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doesn't want you
socializing with other people,
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they isolate you from
family members and friends.
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Even your children,
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they will isolate you
from your children as well.
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Some other ones
signs that we have is that
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when you see that the
abuser starts to yell and scream
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and punch the walls sometimes
they will be abusive to family,
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they are abused to animals,
they will torture animals,
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they are also torture themselves
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to make you feel
guilty about what's going on.
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They hold you responsible
for everything that is going on.
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Also to they will control
that where you can't work,
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they will keep you
from working a job.
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What they will do is they
will keep calling your job,
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harassing you to the point
where you are employer will say,
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you know, we can't
accept this anymore.
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We gonna have to let you go.
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Also to the abuser where he will
try to control you spiritually,
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you know, as well by telling you
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that you will
never amount to anything.
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And sometimes, you
know, you believe it
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as a victim of domestic
violence you will believe that
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and the warning signs
also to can be spill over
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until marking how
you cook your food
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and how the house is not clean.
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The abuser is
controlling about how the--
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the cabinets or whatever.
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All different
types of warning signs,
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like I said, punching the wall,
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it just so
simultaneously is as well.
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Really, you know,
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now I want to get back
to that premise of that
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how I frame that
question as well.
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Did you recognize
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because we're not just
talking about domestic violence
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we're also talking
about relational violence.
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Sometimes it
happens in a relationship
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and people don't
see these as red flags.
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They don't see that they
need to stop and pay attention.
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Where there any-- now
that you can look back
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where there any of
these warning signs
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before you married you husband,
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when you were in a relationship
did any of these signs exist
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and you just missed them
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or did yours happened
after you are married?
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No the warning signs were
there I just ignored them.
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You ignored them?
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Yes, and that's not healthy
to ignore the warning signs.
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Well, sometimes don't
you think that people think
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oh, if I can just love
him enough or her enough
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I mean, if I can just
be what they want me to be
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then I can get the
beyond these things
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or they're just
ignorant of facts.
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I've actually counseled
with young ladies who have said,
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oh he just, he
obsesses over me it's wonderful.
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You know, he just
wants me to himself.
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And they don't
recognize that what,
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I mean, it's not a
marriage relationship,
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it's a dating relationship
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wouldn'tmake it right if it
wasn't a marriage relationship.
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But what those
warning signs are coming up
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is that this is someone
who is crawling them off
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from everyone else so that
they can gain control over them.
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Yes, it's a isolation thing
where they will isolate you,
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they can only isolate you.
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When they get you by yourself
then they can start the torture.
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And when they isolate you from
all your family and your friends
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and push everyone away
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because the abuser
will push everyone away.
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And when the family is
trying to work with the victim
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by trying to get them
out of the relationship
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and try to
separate you from the abuse
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a lot of the victim
starts to side with the abuser.
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And a lot of times the family
members are just pushed away
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and leave them
because they feel that,
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you know, you should
leave them because I said so
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because, you know,
this is what you should do.
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But we tend to
allow the victim to know
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that they need to
flee from the situation,
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they know that they
are in abusive relationship
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but they just don't know how
to leave because of the bond.
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And you know, sometimes--
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I think you
will agree with this.
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Sometimes people don't recognize
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they are in an
abusive relationship
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because they are not
yet got into the point
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where someone is
verbally denigrating them.
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They've not yet got to the point
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where maybe they slap
them around or something.
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But these warnings
signs are here, you know,
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just controlling
obsessive type behavior
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and it will escalate to
that after a period of time.
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So would you agree with that?
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Yes, I agree with that.
I experienced that myself.
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You know, in my situation
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when I was a victim
of domestic violence
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the verbal abuse was there,
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the psychological
abuse was there as well,
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and it actually escalated
over into physical abuse.
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A lot of times we don't
realize that we are being abused
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because we're not being physical
punched or hit or slapped.
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So a lot of times
the victim will say
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well, well I'm not being abused.
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Well, if you
being verbally abuse,
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psychological abuse, your
self-esteem has being torn down,
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you know, of that
sort you are being abuse
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and it leads, it will
lead to the physical abuse
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if you stay in the
situation long enough.
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So a lot of times they don't
realize that they're being abuse
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but when you explain to them
all the different warning signs
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and all the
different types of abuse
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then they come to realize,
you know, I am being abused.
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I am a victim of
domestic violence.
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And they don't
realize that until you open up
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the door of the
warning signs for them.
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I had a dear friend who,
you know, my sister first was--
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her first husband
was incredibly abusive
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and she did she ignored
some of these warning signs
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and thought that she
could just love him more
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and do things right
and it will be okay.
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But it got to the point over
their married life where if she,
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he come home from work
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if she didn't have
enough sugar in his tea,
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he put her in
the hospital one time
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because she didn't have
enough sugar in his tea.
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And her response after he
broke nose and a collarbone
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her response was
well, it's my fault
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I know how much
sugar he needs in his tea.
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So there is
something that happens
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in the psyche of a person
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who has been
isolated, who has been control.
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That the kind
of-- it's like this net
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that they get this the
current start circling in
00:11:05.76\00:11:08.48
and tightening it
up and tightening it up
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to where that control
it maybe flattering it
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first to think
someone cares for you so much
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but then they come in
and come tighten it up
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to where you can't look
left or right without being--
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What happens with
that is that, you know,
00:11:23.14\00:11:24.57
when you've been in
abusive relationship for so long
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you start to lose your identity.
00:11:26.62\00:11:28.52
You start to lose
yourself in another individual
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to the point where
who they are, you are now.
00:11:31.41\00:11:34.40
So you don't have
your own identity,
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you're not own
person, you don't exist
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and the only
reason why you existed
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because the abuser
says that you exist.
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And you only able
to talk, walk, and eat
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and to be mobile it's
when the abuser says so.
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And when that happens when
you're closed in or locked in,
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where your
identity is totally gone,
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it's almost like
identity theft, you know.
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That's a great
way-- You know, yes it is.
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And when you do that
it's like you're gone.
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You don't even exist.
00:12:03.41\00:12:04.44
You are forgotten into
the point where you think
00:12:04.47\00:12:06.84
that nobody
cares about you anymore
00:12:06.87\00:12:08.59
so the only
person that loved you
00:12:08.62\00:12:10.36
and care about
you is the abuser.
00:12:10.39\00:12:11.79
That's what they do
to close you and to say,
00:12:11.82\00:12:14.01
you know, I'm the
only one that loves you,
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I care about you,
that's why I'm here with you
00:12:15.78\00:12:17.58
but its your fault
that I'm doing this to you
00:12:17.61\00:12:20.04
because, you know,
if you just listen to me
00:12:20.07\00:12:21.67
and just do what I
say do and you know,
00:12:21.70\00:12:23.69
that need to be
a whole lot better.
00:12:23.72\00:12:24.77
So it's like the
guilty part of it,
00:12:24.80\00:12:26.37
the psychological part of it,
00:12:26.40\00:12:27.67
the mental part
and the emotional part.
00:12:27.70\00:12:30.55
And sometimes--
as I was gonna say
00:12:30.58\00:12:32.94
I had a dear
friend who married man
00:12:32.97\00:12:34.73
who just seemed to be
absolutely wonderful at first.
00:12:34.76\00:12:39.56
And bought her a new car
had sell everything of hers
00:12:39.59\00:12:42.97
then bought her a new
car and she was thrilled
00:12:43.00\00:12:45.32
and but then he
took that car away
00:12:45.35\00:12:47.35
and he start
trying to isolate her
00:12:47.38\00:12:49.56
and he would come in
and pound on, you know,
00:12:49.59\00:12:52.79
pound on cabinets
and pound on the walls.
00:12:52.82\00:12:56.28
And I kept telling her
'cause we prayed so hard
00:12:56.31\00:12:59.05
and she, you
know, God hates divorce.
00:12:59.08\00:13:01.51
She kept quoting from
Malachi, "God hates divorce."
00:13:01.54\00:13:04.08
But I kept asking her, you know,
00:13:04.11\00:13:07.12
you could see
all the signs there.
00:13:07.15\00:13:09.29
And I kept saying are
you afraid, are you afraid?
00:13:09.32\00:13:11.36
And she'd say no I don't
think he is going to hurt me.
00:13:11.39\00:13:14.04
But then he started doing some
things that you're talking about
00:13:14.07\00:13:17.77
where he was being
rather abusive with animals
00:13:17.80\00:13:20.53
and did some really
strange things. Yes.
00:13:20.56\00:13:22.88
That frightened her and
his behavior start escalating
00:13:22.91\00:13:28.53
and finally she called me and
said, I don't know what to do.
00:13:28.56\00:13:30.91
And I told her I think
you need to get out of there
00:13:30.94\00:13:32.96
and he needs some help.
00:13:32.99\00:13:34.45
But there is
probably some young person
00:13:34.48\00:13:38.40
that's watching us right now who
is saying mine's not like that,
00:13:38.43\00:13:43.54
he's not that bad,
yeah, he slap me once
00:13:43.57\00:13:47.01
but you know, he was just really
upset with me, he was jealous.
00:13:47.04\00:13:51.79
He, yes, he's a
little controlling
00:13:51.82\00:13:54.61
but he just loves me
that's why he wants to know
00:13:54.64\00:13:57.14
who I'm with and what I'm doing.
00:13:57.17\00:13:58.78
What would you
tell that young person
00:13:58.81\00:14:01.40
who has
experience this and thinks
00:14:01.43\00:14:04.39
mine is not like
that, he'd never do that?
00:14:04.42\00:14:07.47
Well, I would encourage
that they will pray first
00:14:07.50\00:14:12.01
and ask the Lord
to open up their eyes
00:14:12.04\00:14:13.91
and to accept the fact that
00:14:13.94\00:14:15.65
this is a relationship
that's not healthy for you.
00:14:15.68\00:14:19.32
Not in the short or long term
and that you should recognize
00:14:19.35\00:14:23.79
the different type abuse
and signs that are there.
00:14:23.82\00:14:26.72
Look for a way of escape,
cut the relationship off,
00:14:26.75\00:14:30.72
ask the Lord
also to a healthy way
00:14:30.76\00:14:33.90
of separating from
the abusive relationship
00:14:33.93\00:14:37.52
or seek
counseling, ask questions,
00:14:37.55\00:14:40.52
call different agencies
to find out how to separate
00:14:40.55\00:14:43.69
'cause sometimes
it depends on how far
00:14:43.72\00:14:46.40
the person is in
the relationship.
00:14:46.43\00:14:47.94
How rooted and grounded
they are in that individual.
00:14:47.97\00:14:51.19
Hopefully that person
is-- they are not have--
00:14:51.22\00:14:53.88
they haven't lost
themselves in that individual.
00:14:53.91\00:14:56.39
I will suggest to
a young person that
00:14:56.42\00:14:57.84
when the warning signs are there
that is your way of escape,
00:14:57.87\00:15:01.41
that is your red flag as I call
warning signs are red flags.
00:15:01.44\00:15:04.99
I say get out,
flee while you can,
00:15:05.02\00:15:07.75
flee while, you know, you
have your life and your being
00:15:07.78\00:15:10.87
and you still have your
self-esteem and your safe--
00:15:10.90\00:15:13.19
because once that's tore down
00:15:13.22\00:15:15.11
it's really hard to
separate from the relationship.
00:15:15.14\00:15:18.60
Oh, but Lez, I'm madly
in love with this young man
00:15:18.63\00:15:22.00
and I just know
that I can love him more
00:15:22.03\00:15:25.88
and I can bring
him through this.
00:15:25.91\00:15:28.48
And I suggest to on that
too is we cannot love a person
00:15:28.51\00:15:32.82
so much to the point
where it would change them.
00:15:32.85\00:15:35.24
God said he doesn't
have us to be ignored.
00:15:35.27\00:15:37.35
And He allows us
to understand that
00:15:37.38\00:15:39.82
what is right and what is wrong.
00:15:39.85\00:15:41.22
You can't love a person
enough to make them change.
00:15:41.25\00:15:43.62
You can't love a person
to make them not be abusive.
00:15:43.65\00:15:47.03
They are gonna have
to get that help himself.
00:15:47.06\00:15:48.85
And, you know, this is a,
it's a sin sickness if you will,
00:15:48.88\00:15:51.56
but it's a sickness. Yes.
00:15:51.59\00:15:53.17
And it something that
if you love that person
00:15:53.20\00:15:56.92
then you need to put
boundaries on the relationship
00:15:56.95\00:15:59.98
and you need to step back
00:16:00.01\00:16:01.04
and you need to tell
them you need counseling.
00:16:01.07\00:16:03.75
And let them get into counseling
but not just a small period
00:16:03.78\00:16:08.21
and see then that,
oh, yes I've changed.
00:16:08.24\00:16:11.54
It's got to be something
that they go through counseling
00:16:11.57\00:16:14.22
and walk it out and
you watch for few years
00:16:14.25\00:16:17.16
to witness this change, right.
00:16:17.19\00:16:18.68
A lot of times
the abuser will say
00:16:18.71\00:16:20.17
that they want to
get the counseling
00:16:20.20\00:16:22.14
and what they will do is
they will get the counseling
00:16:22.17\00:16:24.44
but they want you to
call the counselor for them,
00:16:24.47\00:16:27.54
set the counseling up but that's
not them getting the counseling.
00:16:27.57\00:16:30.90
They should do that themselves.
00:16:30.93\00:16:32.86
And what they will do is
they go a couple of times
00:16:32.89\00:16:35.65
or you might go with
them a couple of times
00:16:35.68\00:16:37.46
and then after that they are
right back into the situation
00:16:37.49\00:16:41.64
that they were at once
before, they still abusing.
00:16:41.67\00:16:44.64
They haven't
really totally changed.
00:16:44.67\00:16:45.86
You have to be
spritually changed.
00:16:45.89\00:16:48.09
You know, and it's not
just going to a counsel
00:16:48.12\00:16:50.22
you have to be
change in Christ Jesus,
00:16:50.25\00:16:51.82
you have to be
renewed in Christ Jesus,
00:16:51.85\00:16:53.54
you have be
repented of that wickedness.
00:16:53.57\00:16:56.91
You know, and ask God to
recreate in you a clean heart
00:16:56.94\00:16:59.57
and renew a right
spirit within you. Amen, amen.
00:16:59.60\00:17:01.90
You know, it's kind
of like what we read
00:17:01.93\00:17:04.27
at the beginning of the
program in 2 Timothy 3:4
00:17:04.30\00:17:08.12
or Paul wrote and said,
00:17:08.15\00:17:09.65
if people are like
this flee from them.
00:17:09.68\00:17:12.61
And it doesn't say, I mean,
00:17:12.64\00:17:14.04
we know that we have to reach
out with the love of Christ.
00:17:14.07\00:17:16.82
But we need to flee
from people like this.
00:17:16.85\00:17:19.36
Now let me ask
you another question
00:17:19.39\00:17:20.71
because I think, you
know, as we're sitting here
00:17:20.74\00:17:22.63
suddenly I'm thinking about
all the times that I have prayed
00:17:22.66\00:17:26.35
and counsel from Scripture with
people who are in situations.
00:17:26.38\00:17:29.39
One a young lady
that's actually came to me
00:17:29.42\00:17:32.81
highly educated, her
fiance was highly educated.
00:17:32.84\00:17:36.47
We kept seeing signs he
was very condescending to her.
00:17:36.50\00:17:40.94
He would put her
down with these little,
00:17:40.97\00:17:43.13
he was very passive aggressive
00:17:43.16\00:17:44.90
and you knew that
she was getting wounded
00:17:44.93\00:17:47.71
but she just loved him so much
00:17:47.74\00:17:49.05
she thought that this
marriage was going to be perfect
00:17:49.08\00:17:51.43
and it was not very
long after they said I do.
00:17:51.46\00:17:56.77
And probably less than six hours
00:17:56.80\00:17:58.85
he started abusing her
physical on their honeymoon.
00:17:58.88\00:18:03.69
And she actually stayed
with him for about a year.
00:18:03.72\00:18:06.65
Just feeling like
here she just gone through
00:18:06.68\00:18:09.21
this huge expensive
wedding and she covered up
00:18:09.24\00:18:11.99
and didn't let
anybody know what was going on
00:18:12.02\00:18:14.18
till it got really scary.
00:18:15.90\00:18:17.43
But my question was here
we were as the family members
00:18:17.46\00:18:24.37
recognizing something
is not healthy about this.
00:18:24.40\00:18:28.41
I know her mother talk to her,
I know we mentioned it to her
00:18:28.44\00:18:31.83
and she just didn't see it.
00:18:31.86\00:18:35.26
Is it possible and we need to
be talking to our audience now
00:18:35.29\00:18:39.37
that they maybe
in a relationship
00:18:39.40\00:18:41.52
and they are
hearing their family say,
00:18:41.55\00:18:43.53
you know, he's this, he's that
00:18:43.56\00:18:45.11
or maybe it's a man
that's in a relationship
00:18:45.14\00:18:48.08
and he has got an abusive
woman that is significant other
00:18:48.11\00:18:54.33
and the family is saying,
00:18:54.36\00:18:56.12
she is doing
this, she is doing that,
00:18:56.15\00:18:57.97
or he is doing
this, he is doing that.
00:18:58.00\00:19:00.35
Can family
sometimes see something
00:19:00.38\00:19:02.37
that you are blinded by love?
00:19:02.40\00:19:05.05
Yes, the family usually
00:19:05.08\00:19:06.64
recognize the
abuser faster than we do.
00:19:06.67\00:19:09.79
A lot of times we're
blinded with relationship
00:19:09.82\00:19:11.77
because we're already in it.
00:19:11.80\00:19:12.96
And when you're in
something you can't see outside.
00:19:12.99\00:19:16.07
But when the people
on the outside see inside
00:19:16.10\00:19:18.35
that's when they can recognize
that the abuser tactics
00:19:18.38\00:19:22.19
and his ways or
her ways or whatever.
00:19:22.22\00:19:24.34
A lot of times we
don't want to accept that.
00:19:24.37\00:19:26.37
We want to accept that well,
nobody wants me to be happy
00:19:26.40\00:19:28.97
and they are just jealous
00:19:29.00\00:19:30.17
because I have a
relationship and they don't.
00:19:30.20\00:19:32.19
You are just trying
to destroy it and ruin it
00:19:32.22\00:19:33.68
and you don't
want me to be happy.
00:19:33.71\00:19:35.17
A lot to time they feel
that way but it's not that.
00:19:35.20\00:19:38.00
You know, it's to
guide and to lead you
00:19:38.03\00:19:41.33
to let you know hey,
we see this going on.
00:19:41.36\00:19:43.44
You need to
recognize this. This is wrong.
00:19:43.47\00:19:45.97
We love you, we are
here to support you,
00:19:46.00\00:19:47.68
we want you to be happy
00:19:47.71\00:19:48.91
that's why we letting you
know that this is going on.
00:19:48.94\00:19:51.17
Family member can recognize
the different warning signs
00:19:51.20\00:19:54.43
when you don't 'cause
when you in you don't see out
00:19:54.46\00:19:57.29
and when you
out you see in, yes.
00:19:57.32\00:19:59.30
Can you just
pray this signs away?
00:19:59.33\00:20:01.41
I mean, can you just say,
00:20:01.44\00:20:02.51
okay, Lord, he is
your son You deal with him
00:20:02.54\00:20:04.60
or he is Your
daughter you deal with him.
00:20:04.63\00:20:06.32
Can you pray it away?
00:20:06.35\00:20:07.38
I, mean, I'm not saying through
God all things are possible.
00:20:07.41\00:20:09.23
Yes, that's true.
00:20:09.26\00:20:10.29
But in most instances I mean,
00:20:10.32\00:20:13.70
God can only work with somebody
00:20:13.73\00:20:14.92
who's going to
cooperate with Him
00:20:14.95\00:20:16.18
because God's not controlling.
00:20:16.21\00:20:18.25
He gives us the freedom
of choice and free will.
00:20:18.28\00:20:21.39
So it is it something that when
a Christians in this situation
00:20:21.42\00:20:25.82
that they are thinking whether
harder I pray the more it help
00:20:25.85\00:20:28.36
or what steps should they take?
00:20:28.39\00:20:31.21
Well, sometimes we feel
that we can pray things away
00:20:31.24\00:20:33.58
because Lord said, if
we pray He will hear us
00:20:33.61\00:20:36.12
when we pray
and He will help us.
00:20:36.15\00:20:38.13
But God says also to you
00:20:38.16\00:20:39.67
He doesn't have
us to be ignorant.
00:20:39.70\00:20:41.48
Well, sometimes
the help He gives us
00:20:41.51\00:20:42.87
is to give us a
way out. Exactly.
00:20:42.90\00:20:44.77
so we can pray, you
can pray for the individual
00:20:44.80\00:20:47.33
but you won't be able to
pray away the warnings signs.
00:20:47.36\00:20:50.13
You want to be able to pray away
what the abuser is doing to you.
00:20:50.16\00:20:53.65
You know you can't,
you can pray for them
00:20:53.68\00:20:55.34
but you want to
distance yourself
00:20:55.37\00:20:57.30
from the abusive relationship
00:20:57.33\00:20:58.84
and pray that the individual
gets the help that they need
00:20:58.87\00:21:01.90
and that God will work with
them to change and to repent.
00:21:01.93\00:21:04.79
And without repentance
He is not gonna do anything.
00:21:04.82\00:21:07.56
The relationship is not going
to bound back together that's--
00:21:07.59\00:21:10.04
if it's a relationship that
will be bound back together.
00:21:10.07\00:21:13.49
All relationships
won't survive the abuse.
00:21:13.52\00:21:16.83
Isn't no guarantee that the
relationship will bind together.
00:21:16.86\00:21:19.92
It's all on the individual
and whether they are at,
00:21:19.95\00:21:22.95
you know, in a
relationship with Christ.
00:21:22.98\00:21:24.64
But if we have a
young mother who is watching
00:21:24.67\00:21:27.69
and she has children
00:21:27.72\00:21:30.35
and she is recognizing
some of these warning signs
00:21:30.38\00:21:33.95
what would your counsel
be to her or your advice?
00:21:33.98\00:21:38.41
Well, my advice
will be to her is to pray
00:21:38.44\00:21:40.55
and ask God to work, to
go to seek the help first.
00:21:40.58\00:21:43.87
Because well, God is the first
help that we used to seek first.
00:21:43.90\00:21:46.77
And then prayer He will offer
00:21:46.80\00:21:48.39
and let us know what the
steps that we should take.
00:21:48.42\00:21:50.53
But we do need to
take steps and precautions
00:21:50.56\00:21:53.07
to separate yourself
from the relationship.
00:21:53.10\00:21:55.89
There is numbers you can call,
00:21:55.92\00:21:58.26
there is hotline
numbers you can call,
00:21:58.29\00:22:00.56
you can call 911, you can
even call to police station.
00:22:00.59\00:22:03.37
They have
domestic violence agencies
00:22:03.40\00:22:05.44
that we work with them
also in the police departments
00:22:05.47\00:22:07.74
where they will
get you to safe havens
00:22:07.77\00:22:10.35
and get you to
domestic violence shelters.
00:22:10.38\00:22:12.69
I will suggest to them
when they see the warning signs
00:22:12.72\00:22:15.68
start to prepare
for a way of escape,
00:22:15.71\00:22:18.10
or safe way of the escape.
00:22:18.13\00:22:19.46
So what you're saying is that
00:22:19.49\00:22:21.02
these warning signs
and recognizing them
00:22:21.05\00:22:23.22
could actually save your
life or your children's life.
00:22:23.25\00:22:25.77
Yes it can save your life
00:22:25.80\00:22:26.85
and your
children's life as well, yes.
00:22:26.88\00:22:28.62
And this is
something that, you know,
00:22:28.65\00:22:31.49
one case, a woman that said
that she'd be in grocery market
00:22:31.52\00:22:35.94
and her husband
would never let her go
00:22:35.97\00:22:37.06
grocery shopping by herself
00:22:37.09\00:22:38.73
but when they'd
leave to grocery market
00:22:38.76\00:22:40.95
he would be in a really bad mood
00:22:40.98\00:22:43.42
and he'd say I saw you
looking that man's direction.
00:22:43.45\00:22:47.74
And he was so
obsessively jealous of her
00:22:47.77\00:22:50.42
that if she smiled or--
00:22:50.45\00:22:53.00
I witnessed her going from
being a vibrant outgoing person
00:22:53.03\00:22:57.05
to suddenly becoming
one who was so fearful
00:22:57.08\00:23:00.08
to make eye contact
with especially a man
00:23:00.11\00:23:02.51
and what happened unfortunately
00:23:02.54\00:23:05.47
they divorced and
went back together
00:23:05.50\00:23:07.60
and he had never
lifted a hand to her
00:23:07.63\00:23:11.29
until after they remarried.
00:23:11.32\00:23:13.56
And he eventually killed her.
00:23:13.59\00:23:15.93
So it's
something that, you know,
00:23:15.96\00:23:17.90
if you see these warning signs
00:23:17.93\00:23:19.61
you need to get your
significant other some help
00:23:19.64\00:23:24.95
either they need,
if you're only engaged
00:23:24.98\00:23:29.34
then for goodness sake
get away from them for a while
00:23:29.37\00:23:32.85
and let them get that help.
00:23:32.88\00:23:34.22
And it may not go back together
00:23:34.25\00:23:36.14
but you don't want a
relationship like that.
00:23:36.17\00:23:38.29
If you are already married
00:23:38.32\00:23:39.87
and you are living
in these hell on earth
00:23:39.90\00:23:43.81
because you see
these signs and its--
00:23:43.84\00:23:45.78
these are no fun to go
through in the beginning.
00:23:45.81\00:23:47.88
Just because someone
hasn't taken a hammer to you yet
00:23:47.91\00:23:52.06
doesn't mean that it
won't happen and sometimes,
00:23:52.09\00:23:54.58
sometimes it's not
a gradual escalation,
00:23:54.61\00:23:58.10
sometimes it can be something
that causes them to snap
00:23:58.13\00:24:01.65
and we hear cases
all the time on the news
00:24:01.68\00:24:04.84
of people who've been
killed by their spouse
00:24:04.87\00:24:07.87
or someone that
they are even never met.
00:24:07.90\00:24:09.45
Because they think that
they can change the abuser
00:24:09.48\00:24:11.30
and they feel that the abuser
would be left alone without them
00:24:11.33\00:24:14.21
the abuser can't take
care of themselves without them
00:24:14.24\00:24:16.86
because they're
used to doing everything.
00:24:16.89\00:24:18.50
There is the guilt
part of going back.
00:24:18.53\00:24:21.65
And when they go back someone
who don't never leave home,
00:24:21.68\00:24:23.96
you know, some of them is--
00:24:23.99\00:24:25.52
we've lost a lots of
ladies and a lot of sisters
00:24:25.55\00:24:27.66
and brothers as well to domestic
violence and it is out there.
00:24:27.69\00:24:31.74
And that something that
was surprising you said to you.
00:24:31.77\00:24:33.88
You've been doing this
since 2003 in this ministry
00:24:33.91\00:24:36.85
that you find out that there are
00:24:36.88\00:24:38.04
quite a few men
who've been abused.
00:24:38.07\00:24:39.79
Yes, that's correct.
00:24:39.82\00:24:41.17
I know I work with a man
who-- his fairly new bride--
00:24:41.20\00:24:47.25
I think they've been
married less than a year.
00:24:47.28\00:24:48.98
If she got mad at him
she'd wait till he fell asleep
00:24:49.01\00:24:52.22
and she take a golf club to him.
00:24:52.25\00:24:53.89
And he was so embarrassed.
00:24:53.92\00:24:55.79
I shouldn't
laugh when I say that.
00:24:55.82\00:24:57.16
It just sounds so amazing.
00:24:57.19\00:24:58.98
But he was so
embarrassed to finally say that
00:24:59.01\00:25:02.08
and I told him, you know,
00:25:02.11\00:25:04.10
she is abusive and
he was ashamed of that.
00:25:04.13\00:25:06.52
So we don't want to
leave people feeling hopeless
00:25:06.55\00:25:10.26
because this is
a mental sickness
00:25:10.29\00:25:14.72
and it something though that
00:25:14.75\00:25:16.45
often you'll find
can be controlled.
00:25:16.48\00:25:18.89
I mean, there are people
who abuse their first spouse
00:25:18.92\00:25:21.09
and never abuse
their second spouse
00:25:21.12\00:25:22.73
because they say, well,
that spouse won't take it.
00:25:22.76\00:25:25.58
So but we need to know that
we want to reach out to this--
00:25:25.61\00:25:29.37
the abuser as well
for healing for them.
00:25:29.40\00:25:32.37
We're not trying to
make anyone feel that
00:25:32.40\00:25:35.97
it's a hopeless situation
but you need to be safe.
00:25:36.00\00:25:38.87
Yes, that's correct.
00:25:38.90\00:25:39.93
All right, go ahead.
00:25:39.96\00:25:41.24
So we want, you know, we just
really want to encourage that,
00:25:41.27\00:25:43.83
you know, we do not
just help the victim,
00:25:43.86\00:25:46.97
we also help the
abuser, you know, as well
00:25:47.00\00:25:49.39
to recognize that
they do have a problem.
00:25:49.42\00:25:51.81
And that The--happened
00:25:51.84\00:25:52.87
and a solution out there to
help them with their problem
00:25:52.90\00:25:55.21
and their illness and
that it takes a little time.
00:25:55.24\00:25:58.08
But recognizing that
you are an abuser actually,
00:25:58.11\00:26:02.85
you know, helps a whole life.
00:26:02.88\00:26:04.26
When you recognize
that you are an abuser
00:26:04.29\00:26:06.05
and that you do need the help
and that the help is out there
00:26:06.08\00:26:09.40
and your
willing to get the help,
00:26:09.43\00:26:10.97
you know, it's the
blessing to do that.
00:26:11.00\00:26:12.67
You know, we just
want to encourage that.
00:26:12.70\00:26:14.03
It's not just
females and, you know,
00:26:14.06\00:26:16.94
that are victims
of domestic violence.
00:26:16.97\00:26:19.27
There are also males that
are victims of abuse as well.
00:26:19.30\00:26:22.06
So it's not just a
one way thing here.
00:26:22.09\00:26:23.79
We do have men that
are actually being abuse.
00:26:23.82\00:26:25.65
And yes it's embarrassing to,
00:26:25.68\00:26:29.32
you know, to
have it out and open
00:26:29.35\00:26:30.62
to let people know
that you're being abuse
00:26:30.65\00:26:32.19
as a male but it does happen.
00:26:32.22\00:26:34.29
There's a shame
factor either way I guess.
00:26:34.32\00:26:36.66
Lez, thank you so
much for coming back
00:26:36.69\00:26:38.68
and you will
return we want to talk
00:26:38.71\00:26:40.47
about the healing end
of this and the support
00:26:40.50\00:26:42.80
but we're so thankful that
you've been here to share today.
00:26:42.83\00:26:46.58
And I just want to talk with
you at home for just a moment.
00:26:46.61\00:26:49.35
Perhaps as you're
watching this program
00:26:49.38\00:26:51.06
you recognize there are
some of these warning signs
00:26:51.09\00:26:53.85
either in a relationship
that involves you personally
00:26:53.88\00:26:57.48
or perhaps with
one of your children
00:26:57.51\00:26:59.78
you see that they are involve
in a relationship with that
00:26:59.81\00:27:02.53
or maybe a friend.
00:27:02.56\00:27:04.29
We want to encourage you
00:27:04.32\00:27:05.71
there are
support groups out there
00:27:05.74\00:27:08.75
that you can contact and
get in touch with someone.
00:27:08.78\00:27:12.67
Call you local
mental health center
00:27:12.70\00:27:14.52
and find where
there are support groups
00:27:14.55\00:27:16.24
if you don't have
access to the internet.
00:27:16.27\00:27:18.82
But if you are an abuser,
00:27:18.85\00:27:20.72
I want to speak to
you for just a moment.
00:27:20.75\00:27:24.03
Jesus Christ
loves you even though
00:27:24.06\00:27:27.03
you maybe as messed
up in the mind as you are
00:27:27.06\00:27:31.40
and there is hope
for you for change
00:27:31.43\00:27:33.78
and I want to encourage you
00:27:33.81\00:27:35.36
if this is something
that you recognize yourself
00:27:35.39\00:27:38.35
in some of these signs of
abuse go talk with the pastor,
00:27:38.38\00:27:41.66
go find some counseling,
some Christian counseling
00:27:41.69\00:27:44.75
because God is a
God of new beginnings
00:27:44.78\00:27:47.36
and He can
change things for you.
00:27:47.39\00:27:50.10
He can make you a new
creation in Christ Jesus.
00:27:50.13\00:27:53.75