Hello I am Shelley Quinn
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and welcome again to
"Issues and Answers."
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This is a program
where we talk about issues
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that are facing
the Christian church
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and try to find some answers.
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And today I think
we are going to have
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a very informative program
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as we talk about the
role of laity the lay person.
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What is our role in the church?
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You know, Paul wrote to
the Ephesians in Ephesians 4
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he talks about as Jesus ascended
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that He gave gifts to all men.
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And then he says in
verse 11 he actually identifies
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a five-fold
ministry and he talks about
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how He gave some to be apostles,
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prophets, evangelists,
pastors and teachers.
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But what was the purpose of
these officers in the church.
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Is the pastor
supposed to do everything?
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Is the evangelist
supposed to do everything?
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Here is what he says.
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His intention, his
reason for giving these gifts,
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was for the perfecting and
full equipping of the saints.
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So what Jesus intended as
he set up this five-fold office
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was that these individuals
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that were
appointed to these offices
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would turn around and
train up the laity to go out
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and fulfill the
great commission.
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Please help me
welcome our returning guest
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we have Ken and Julie
Norton from Orlando, Florida
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and it's so nice to have
you all back again. Thank you.
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Julie, why don't you tell me,
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what do you do in Orlando
and tell us about the ministry
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that you and your husband
are currently working in?
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I am blessed to
help out in the office.
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I am technically
assistant administrator and--
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And what is
name of the ministry?
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Oh, I am so sorry. That's okay.
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Lay Institute for Evangelism.
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The Lay
Institute for Evangelism.
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Now, Ken what do you all do?
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We train laypeople
that's the institute was set up
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to be able to equip laypeople
to have the tools they need
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to finish the great commission.
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Amen, and this is a--
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this institute you
actually train online,
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you got some online training.
We do have some online training.
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And then onsite as
well, that's where you have--
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where you are
doing special programs
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for youth and for other people,
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who youth to train them to go
and have to share Bible studies
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and share the gospel with people
in their own neighborhoods
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and then others to go actually
into foreign countries, right?
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That's right.
That's so wonderful.
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Get the churches
active, get out there.
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And you all are
teaching not just theory
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but by experience
because you've been out there
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and done it
yourself, have you not? Yes.
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Okay, now I know that you were
a pastor before seven years?
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Hmm, that's correct.
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Seven years before you
came into this ministry
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which is operated by
ASI, Adventist-laymen Services
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and Industries of the
Seventh-day Adventist Church.
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But as a pastor did you find
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that Ephesians 4:11 and 12
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was being
fulfilled in your church?
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Did you find that
people expected you as a pastor
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to be doing it
all or were the people
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the members of
your congregation,
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eager to be trained so
they could go out and do it?
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The answer is yes.
You've done the both.
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There is both,
that's right, there is both
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and there is always
a group that's excited
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and willing to go
out and that's the ones
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that we ended up in our ministry
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really trained to focus on this.
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Fulfilling our part of just
training them to get out there
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and share Jesus with
their friends and neighbors
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but there is a certain
element that they want,
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many church members just
want the pastor to do it all.
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And I think, I think
that we are working now
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and our discussion today we
will talk about a mind change.
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You know a mindset change
that needs to happen, I think.
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Paradigm shift that
this thing is called now,
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so tell us what the
Bible I mean when you
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as you have studied the Bible
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and I know you have
done a lot of studying,
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what do you see
the model that Christ
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wanted to set up for the church?
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You know as we're
preparing for this,
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ah, we came up with
kind of a title for it
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and it's called
the Fatal Mistake.
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And it's based on
actually a passage
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we are going read near
the end by a Christian writer
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who talks about how
it's a deadly mistake
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to think that the
pastors or the church officials
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are supposed to do everything
when it comes to sharing Christ.
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And so as we got in
and we started looking okay
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what does a New Testament
say about what church members
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are supposed to be
doing, what's their role?
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Because I think that's
the big problem as we--
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we might have a misunderstanding
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of what the role
is of Christians,
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what are we
called to when we accept
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Jesus Christ as our savior.
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So we want to
look at some text today
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and just have a
good Bible study.
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Let's get into them.
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Let's look at 1 Peter 2:9
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when we first start
talking about the role,
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this is one of the
most famous passages
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that talks about
the role of the laity.
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And it's a really neat
chapter because this is where
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Peter sets up Christ as
the foundation, he is it.
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So we are not
building on any man,
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we are building on
Christ as a cornerstone
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and building up
into a lively building
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you know with lively
stones we uses that term.
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But then he says
in verse 9 he says,
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"But you are a
chosen generation,
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a royal
priesthood, a holy nation,
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His own special people,
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that you may
proclaim the praises of Him
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who called you out of darkness
and to his marvelous light."
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Its beautiful, two
things we catch there.
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We catch that we
are-- He first uses his term
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we are royal priesthood.
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Well, Royal
means kingly you know
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and then priesthood
means we are priests.
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And this is
where actually we got
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you know in Martin Luther when
he first had his inspiration
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that set forth the
fire of the reformation
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was based on this that,
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wait a second if
we are all priests,
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then what are the priest doing
and we are just sitting here
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and taking mass
and so forth of course
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as they did in
the Catholic Church.
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And he said no there is a
problem, we are all priests.
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Absolutely. So what's a priest?
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What is the role
of priest? Right.
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And I think-- I think
that he is referencing back
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to the Old Testament
because in the New Testament
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priests were the only
priests that are talked about
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were the ones of
course in the Jewish nation
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that
persecuted, you know, Christ
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and then set up
persecution for his disciples.
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But, Jesus is the only
priest in the New Testament,
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He is the Priest,
He is the High Priest,
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but it talks about us
being priest in a way that
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not like we think of
a normal priest today
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that we use that term today.
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So as we were
discussing last night,
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what did priest do
in the Old Testament.
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Let's talks about
that for a minute.
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What did they do?
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They ministered
in the sanctuary,
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they ministered to the people.
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Yeah. And they--
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They offered
sacrifices. Offered sacrifices.
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They were, you know, the
people look to the priest
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as one who was
between them and God, right.
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Well, in the New
Testament its interesting
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that we become the ones
to connect people to God,
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so it becomes a role not
so much as in a you know,
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I can't go to God,
I have to, you know,
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I have to go
through the special person,
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it becomes what
we say you know what,
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you can be connected to God.
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You can have a
relationship with Him,
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that's a priestly role.
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So basically you are
saying that if someone
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is outside the church
that we as a royal priesthood,
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we are to go in kind
of in intercessory way
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help bring them to the Lord.
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Get them to join in
this royal priesthood
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where they got that
direct relationship within.
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That's a good
summary of it. Okay.
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And Paul uses a term
ambassador that's another one.
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But he uses a lot of
these different terms
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and Peter uses
this term to talk about,
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you know, we have a role to play
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in connecting other
people to Christ. Amen.
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And that's beautiful,
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so I think first, the first role
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we find laity ought to
play are the connectors.
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They are the ones to say
you don't know Jesus Christ,
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let me connect you to God
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and that's kind of a priestly
role that we play. Okay.
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The second one was that
laypeople are ministers.
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Now this sounds funny,
but let's go back to the text
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that you started out with today.
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Ephesians 4. Ephesians 4:11.
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In Ephesians 4:11 we
talk about those five roles
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that those who give themselves
full time to the ministry play
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and we find them in
verse 11 but, I like the way
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and I am not sure the
way your Bible put it,
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I like to finish out
verse 12 because it says
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that they do this for
the equipping of the saints
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for the work of ministry.
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Yes, I actually
stopped too soon.
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No, that's okay. But that's--
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the emphasis is that
they are that the clergy
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is trainers and equippers
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but for the
laypeople to do what?
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To fulfill a great commission
to go out and minister.
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To be ministers. Yes.
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So you know after I
started learning this,
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I was like I don't like it
when people call me a minister,
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because we are all ministers
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if you clean the name of Christ,
you are a minister. Amen.
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I will never forget, ah, it's
been a couple of months ago,
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Ken and I were sharing our
testimony to a group of people
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and afterwards, one
young lady came up and said.
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I was just so
impressed by your testimony
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and but I can never do that,
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I will leave it
to you professionals.
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And I thought, I
am not a professional,
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I wasn't trained
to be a pastor either,
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I am just a normal person.
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Carried away that was
something completely different
00:10:38.72\00:10:41.45
but I am, I just
when I want to share,
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I just ask Lord help me,
help me to be not like Moses.
00:10:45.95\00:10:49.94
Well I say I can't do
this my tongue is tied,
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you know I don't
know the language,
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but Lord use me as a vessel
that you can speak through
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anyone can ask that
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and that gift he
wants to give anyone
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who is willing to open up
and share their testimony,
00:11:01.85\00:11:04.41
so it's not just
for the professionals.
00:11:04.44\00:11:07.34
He wants everyone to be.
00:11:07.37\00:11:08.48
It's for the one who I believe
that the call to ministry comes
00:11:08.51\00:11:12.65
when we press him
to the presence of God
00:11:12.68\00:11:14.66
as we really getting
into his presence in prayer
00:11:14.69\00:11:18.27
as Isaiah did in Isaiah 6
00:11:18.30\00:11:21.90
when he said I saw the
Lord high and lifted up.
00:11:21.93\00:11:24.58
He was pressing
into God's presence
00:11:24.61\00:11:27.20
and then he hears
God's conversation
00:11:27.23\00:11:31.02
who shall I send and he
says here am I, send me.
00:11:31.05\00:11:34.62
And I think that that's you know
as we come to near to the Lord
00:11:34.65\00:11:38.87
and coming to His presence
00:11:38.90\00:11:40.85
and recognize the
majesty of the law giver,
00:11:40.88\00:11:44.34
the majesty of the life giver.
00:11:44.37\00:11:46.74
Then when we know that he says,
00:11:46.77\00:11:49.60
I've got this
work that's unfinished,
00:11:49.63\00:11:51.92
we are just looking
up and saying oh, Lord
00:11:51.95\00:11:53.81
whatever it
takes, send me, equip me.
00:11:53.84\00:11:56.63
That's right, that's
beautiful, because it just our--
00:11:56.66\00:12:01.71
at the Lay
Institute for Evangelism,
00:12:01.74\00:12:03.87
we decided that
the greatest thing
00:12:03.90\00:12:06.95
that we can do for
laypeople is to let them know
00:12:06.98\00:12:10.34
God needs you, he
need you as ministers.
00:12:10.37\00:12:13.79
He need you to be
the reaching hand out,
00:12:13.82\00:12:16.20
don't leave that
up to your minister
00:12:16.23\00:12:18.33
or to a Bible
worker in your church,
00:12:18.36\00:12:20.51
this is something
biblically you're called to do.
00:12:20.54\00:12:23.81
We as pastors and
others are here to help you
00:12:23.84\00:12:26.70
and equip you and train
you for the work of ministry.
00:12:26.73\00:12:30.27
If we are to hold the
ministry all to ourselves,
00:12:30.30\00:12:33.02
not only is it not
biblical, but it's not healthy.
00:12:33.05\00:12:36.26
It's not healthy
for people spiritually
00:12:36.29\00:12:38.67
God wants all lay people.
It's not healthy for the pastor.
00:12:38.70\00:12:41.40
No, its not. It's not.
00:12:41.43\00:12:43.55
So we are to be
priests, we are priests,
00:12:43.58\00:12:47.66
we are ministers and
that's more than just
00:12:47.69\00:12:50.42
ministering to
people's spiritual needs.
00:12:50.45\00:12:52.85
Don't you believe
that-- that also has something
00:12:52.88\00:12:54.66
to do with ministering?
00:12:54.69\00:12:56.28
Loving not only
inwards but in actions,
00:12:56.31\00:12:59.38
ministering to the
people's physical needs
00:12:59.41\00:13:01.91
as Jesus did so often.
00:13:01.94\00:13:03.69
What are some of the
other roles of laity?
00:13:03.72\00:13:05.76
The next one is interesting,
00:13:05.79\00:13:07.17
because laypeople should be
involved in church planting.
00:13:07.20\00:13:10.96
Okay, give us a scripture.
00:13:10.99\00:13:12.33
And let's look at the scripture,
that's 1 Corinthians 16.
00:13:12.36\00:13:18.70
My Bible is in so many pieces,
00:13:18.73\00:13:20.25
it's hard to turn sometimes to--
00:13:20.28\00:13:22.05
That's a good sign,
it's been gone through a lot.
00:13:22.08\00:13:24.61
1 Corinthians 16. All right.
00:13:24.64\00:13:27.23
And verse 19 we find
two very active laypeople
00:13:27.26\00:13:31.89
who were tent
makers, good friends of Paul,
00:13:31.92\00:13:35.07
but they were
serious about the religion,
00:13:35.10\00:13:36.98
they were serious about
other people knowing about Jesus
00:13:37.01\00:13:39.72
and we find in 1
Corinthians 16:19.
00:13:39.75\00:13:43.76
Why don't you read that?
00:13:43.79\00:13:44.82
"The churches of Asia greet you.
00:13:44.85\00:13:46.78
Aquila and Priscilla
greet you heartily in the Lord,
00:13:46.81\00:13:49.66
with the church
that is in their house."
00:13:49.69\00:13:52.56
So there was a church
meeting in their house,
00:13:52.59\00:13:54.30
they were church
planting. That's right.
00:13:54.33\00:13:56.29
They may not-- we
don't know it doesn't give us
00:13:56.32\00:13:58.27
lot of details that may
be, may be someone like Paul
00:13:58.30\00:14:01.98
had come through and preached,
00:14:02.01\00:14:03.76
helped to establish the
church but they were involved
00:14:03.79\00:14:06.48
in church planting and this is,
00:14:06.51\00:14:09.05
this is something that
laypeople need to know.
00:14:09.08\00:14:11.54
Well, I am not going
to wait for my pastor
00:14:11.57\00:14:13.07
to go out and
start up a new church,
00:14:13.10\00:14:15.35
I can be involved in doing
00:14:15.38\00:14:16.61
starting a
small group in my home
00:14:16.64\00:14:18.49
and then bringing them to
church, that's the spirit.
00:14:18.52\00:14:20.81
And you know
there are so many people
00:14:20.84\00:14:21.96
and we touched on this a
little when you were here before
00:14:21.99\00:14:24.37
talking about the problems
in the church in America
00:14:24.40\00:14:28.44
and the unfinished
business around the world
00:14:28.47\00:14:31.07
is that there are some people
00:14:31.10\00:14:33.23
who just don't feel
conformable coming to church,
00:14:33.26\00:14:36.18
it's unfamiliar to
them, they don't understand
00:14:36.21\00:14:38.88
the "lingo" the
language that we use
00:14:38.91\00:14:43.38
and they will come
into someone's home
00:14:43.41\00:14:46.25
and there is an
intimacy in the fellowship there
00:14:46.28\00:14:49.19
and as they become comfortable
00:14:49.22\00:14:51.77
with knowing the
Bible and knowing the Lord,
00:14:51.80\00:14:55.13
then they easily
transition into the more
00:14:55.16\00:14:59.11
typical church's
model setting. That's right.
00:14:59.14\00:15:02.15
So that's
something that we can all do.
00:15:02.18\00:15:04.64
You know even
though I am a pastor,
00:15:04.67\00:15:07.41
now I am not in that position,
00:15:07.44\00:15:09.15
but we have a small
group that meets in our home
00:15:09.18\00:15:11.74
and just this last
week one of them said
00:15:11.77\00:15:13.86
they want to be
baptized. Praise God.
00:15:13.89\00:15:15.96
And that was exciting for
us, because it's a young man
00:15:15.99\00:15:17.78
that's come out
of the drugs scene,
00:15:17.81\00:15:19.65
the party scene and everything
00:15:19.68\00:15:21.66
and so comfortable
to meet Friday night,
00:15:21.69\00:15:23.75
we sit around,
we open our Bibles,
00:15:23.78\00:15:25.47
we talk about the real issues
00:15:25.50\00:15:27.96
that are effecting
us everyday in scripture
00:15:27.99\00:15:29.92
and he is like I am
ready, ready to take my stand
00:15:29.95\00:15:32.37
and it shows the
power of doing something
00:15:32.40\00:15:34.55
like this that
Aquila and Priscilla did.
00:15:34.58\00:15:36.15
You know, when we were
in England not too long ago,
00:15:36.18\00:15:38.89
one of the churches
over there had separated
00:15:38.92\00:15:42.46
as we have here, we have
what we call a TLC groups,
00:15:42.49\00:15:46.48
I just say it stands for
Tender Loving Care groups
00:15:46.51\00:15:48.54
but what they did was
they actually chose people
00:15:48.57\00:15:54.02
and train people up as
teachers in their church
00:15:54.05\00:15:56.92
and they started
these little home groups
00:15:56.95\00:15:59.99
for their midweek service
00:16:00.02\00:16:01.51
in place of
their midweek service,
00:16:01.54\00:16:03.67
but they assign
people to these groups.
00:16:03.70\00:16:06.41
And I am sure
it was geographical
00:16:06.44\00:16:08.30
and was part of
the consideration,
00:16:08.33\00:16:10.71
but they would start
off with 8 to 10 people
00:16:10.74\00:16:13.78
in this little home groups
00:16:13.81\00:16:15.28
and what everyone's
assignment was is that
00:16:15.31\00:16:18.63
your assignment is to
bring some else to this group,
00:16:18.66\00:16:21.39
that's not a Christian.
00:16:21.42\00:16:23.39
And they started
bringing and these groups
00:16:23.42\00:16:26.36
when they would
get up to like 25
00:16:26.39\00:16:28.80
then they break them
off and start over again.
00:16:28.83\00:16:31.47
This church
quadrupled in its memberships
00:16:31.50\00:16:34.37
in just two years by doing this.
00:16:34.40\00:16:36.34
So there is something
about that one-on-one study
00:16:36.37\00:16:39.72
and the or the
intimacy of the small group
00:16:39.75\00:16:41.95
that can be very effective than
church going. That's excellent.
00:16:41.98\00:16:45.86
That's why I feel that
you know the Lord blesses us
00:16:45.89\00:16:49.09
so that we can
bless others. Exactly.
00:16:49.12\00:16:51.62
So, you know, our
house that we have,
00:16:51.65\00:16:53.43
our apartment that we have,
00:16:53.46\00:16:55.00
whatever we live in or the car
that we have are all resources
00:16:55.03\00:16:59.02
that I feel that he has
blessed us with to bless others.
00:16:59.05\00:17:02.10
So in taking whatever you have,
00:17:02.13\00:17:04.02
whatever a little thing or
whatever great thing you have
00:17:04.05\00:17:06.70
and lay it
before the Lord and say
00:17:06.73\00:17:08.59
I know that you
are giving this to me,
00:17:08.62\00:17:10.89
to bless others, how
can I, how can I use this,
00:17:10.92\00:17:14.25
then you open up your house
00:17:14.28\00:17:15.83
you know this
house is not for you,
00:17:15.86\00:17:18.15
it's so that he can bless
others and or this car you know,
00:17:18.18\00:17:22.31
may not have anything
else but I have this car
00:17:22.34\00:17:24.53
may be you can car pull someone.
00:17:24.56\00:17:26.42
It's using all resources,
00:17:26.45\00:17:28.43
understand that this
isn't something that's my own,
00:17:28.46\00:17:31.60
it's something
that's a gift from the Lord
00:17:31.63\00:17:33.43
and I really think
it can bless others.
00:17:33.46\00:17:35.19
Now we had a friend just
tell us that two weeks ago
00:17:35.22\00:17:37.24
remember she said they
moved into a neighborhood
00:17:37.27\00:17:39.80
bought a new house
and it was much bigger,
00:17:39.83\00:17:41.70
you know her husband
is making good money,
00:17:41.73\00:17:43.22
but it's much bigger
than what she had wanted
00:17:43.25\00:17:45.26
but as she is there,
she started thinking,
00:17:45.29\00:17:47.66
I have so many
neighbors around here
00:17:47.69\00:17:49.74
that would probably
love to have a Bible study,
00:17:49.77\00:17:52.04
you know in this house,
00:17:52.07\00:17:53.21
and even though
it's too big for us,
00:17:53.24\00:17:54.96
could be a perfect
place to bring people
00:17:54.99\00:17:56.62
and introduce something.
00:17:56.65\00:17:57.68
So the Lord, the Lord impresses
00:17:57.71\00:17:59.44
and we see all over people
call us in different place,
00:17:59.47\00:18:03.52
we get emails from
people around the world.
00:18:03.55\00:18:06.10
We see God moving
on laypeople's hearts
00:18:06.13\00:18:09.05
to become active
and to begin working
00:18:09.08\00:18:12.63
in their communities
and that's inspiring.
00:18:12.66\00:18:14.65
I think people are
taking it seriously
00:18:14.68\00:18:16.31
that the Lord is
coming back soon.
00:18:16.34\00:18:17.84
And sometimes I
hear myself cry out,
00:18:17.87\00:18:19.81
O Maranatha, come O Lord.
00:18:19.84\00:18:21.79
And then I think will
give us just a few more days,
00:18:21.82\00:18:24.33
dear Lord because
there are so many people
00:18:24.36\00:18:26.16
yet to be reached and
some of the statistics
00:18:26.19\00:18:28.82
that you shared in
earlier programs with us
00:18:28.85\00:18:31.34
about the church
in the world condition
00:18:31.37\00:18:33.76
is just alarming to us. Yes.
00:18:33.79\00:18:36.16
Okay, so we have
got priests, ministers,
00:18:36.19\00:18:39.69
church planters, what else.
00:18:39.72\00:18:41.55
We have laity as overseers
in the church. All right.
00:18:41.58\00:18:46.76
Now this is interesting one,
00:18:46.79\00:18:47.82
because this is going
to tie into some things
00:18:47.85\00:18:49.14
we are going to talk
about in future programs too,
00:18:49.17\00:18:51.23
but I want us to
look as Titus 1:5.
00:18:51.26\00:18:58.57
Many churches feel
that they are robbed when,
00:18:58.60\00:19:03.39
let's say a
conference or denomination
00:19:03.42\00:19:05.42
doesn't send
them a pastor to come
00:19:05.45\00:19:07.46
and to preach to
them and it's interesting
00:19:07.49\00:19:09.68
that the New Testament
pattern that we find it,
00:19:09.71\00:19:12.23
that was never the
point in the New Testament
00:19:12.26\00:19:15.79
where these groups
would ask for somebody to come
00:19:15.82\00:19:19.25
and just
specifically be over them.
00:19:19.28\00:19:20.75
But we find that Paul when he
was setting up these churches,
00:19:20.78\00:19:25.58
that he asked
Titus to do something.
00:19:25.61\00:19:27.62
I want you to go head and
read this, I'm trying to find.
00:19:27.65\00:19:29.37
Titus 1:5, "For this
reason I left you in Crete,
00:19:29.40\00:19:32.42
that you might set
right what was defective
00:19:32.45\00:19:35.14
and finish what was left undone
00:19:35.17\00:19:36.82
and that you
might appoint elders
00:19:36.85\00:19:38.94
and set them over the churches
00:19:38.97\00:19:41.45
in every city
as I directed you."
00:19:41.48\00:19:44.55
Very interesting that the
elders were the term for elder,
00:19:44.58\00:19:49.11
there is a couple of Greek
terms but it means overseer,
00:19:49.14\00:19:52.18
those that were responsible
for that local congregation.
00:19:52.21\00:19:55.94
So Paul when he would
go and he would preach
00:19:55.97\00:19:58.51
and he would raise up a group.
00:19:58.54\00:20:01.01
In this situation
when Titus was left there
00:20:01.04\00:20:03.40
to help in the organizational
00:20:03.43\00:20:05.16
to make sure
things were going okay,
00:20:05.19\00:20:06.94
he told them okay,
00:20:06.97\00:20:08.00
it's time to set up
elders in those churches.
00:20:08.03\00:20:10.92
And then basically to move
on that was how they would do
00:20:10.95\00:20:14.19
in establishing
the kingdom of God
00:20:14.22\00:20:15.92
and expanding the
work in the church.
00:20:15.95\00:20:18.04
These elders came from
the laity, they were not.
00:20:18.07\00:20:21.35
So when you
said, to set up elders
00:20:21.38\00:20:22.93
and then basically
move on, who was moving on?
00:20:22.96\00:20:25.15
The clergy, the
itinerant preachers,
00:20:25.18\00:20:28.04
like Paul and
Barnabas and those John,
00:20:28.07\00:20:30.42
there were many of them
that that's what they did,
00:20:30.45\00:20:32.40
they would go and
just establish churches.
00:20:32.43\00:20:34.27
But they would
set up in the church,
00:20:34.30\00:20:36.25
if they were there
let's say six moths
00:20:36.28\00:20:37.84
or eight months or a year.
00:20:37.87\00:20:39.55
They would find men and woman
00:20:39.58\00:20:42.46
that would
bubble to the surface,
00:20:42.49\00:20:44.47
that were spiritual,
that were good leaders
00:20:44.50\00:20:47.34
and then they
would appointment them
00:20:47.37\00:20:48.77
as elders in the church
00:20:48.80\00:20:50.08
and the elders would
oversee the local congregations
00:20:50.11\00:20:53.06
and take care of
shepherding those little flocks.
00:20:53.09\00:20:56.68
So they were laypeople though,
00:20:56.71\00:20:58.30
they were people
like Aquila and Priscilla
00:20:58.33\00:21:00.61
that would be in charge
of a church in their home
00:21:00.64\00:21:02.90
or church in their
locality and that's significant.
00:21:02.93\00:21:05.80
It is significant.
00:21:05.83\00:21:07.11
I think that lets us know that
00:21:07.14\00:21:08.51
that God wants to put
his burden of responsibility
00:21:08.54\00:21:11.85
upon the shoulders of laypeople
00:21:11.88\00:21:13.32
that are willing to take
responsibilities like that.
00:21:13.35\00:21:15.99
Okay, so now we
have got priests,
00:21:16.02\00:21:19.21
ministers, church
planters, overseers
00:21:19.24\00:21:23.84
and lastly the laity were to be
00:21:23.87\00:21:26.54
the primary
caregivers for each other. Okay.
00:21:26.57\00:21:30.41
And this goes along with
the last one but this is,
00:21:30.44\00:21:33.83
these are all the
one in another text
00:21:33.86\00:21:35.78
that we find in
the New Testament,
00:21:35.81\00:21:37.01
I think the heart of
them would be in Romans 12.
00:21:37.04\00:21:43.31
Romans 12:9 through 18.
00:21:43.34\00:21:48.21
Romans 12...
00:21:51.89\00:21:53.00
And that's a long, we
probably don't have to read
00:21:53.03\00:21:55.87
the whole thing but... Go ahead.
00:21:55.90\00:22:00.40
All right, let just
read it quickly here it says
00:22:00.43\00:22:02.48
"Let love be without hypocrisy.
00:22:02.51\00:22:05.09
Abhor what is evil,
cling to what is good.
00:22:05.12\00:22:07.55
Be kindly affectionate to
one another with brotherly love,
00:22:07.58\00:22:11.19
in honor giving
preference to one another,
00:22:11.22\00:22:13.63
not lagging in
diligence, fervent in spirit,
00:22:13.66\00:22:16.47
serving the Lord
rejoicing in hope,
00:22:16.50\00:22:19.00
patient in tribulation,
continuing steadfastly in prayer
00:22:19.03\00:22:24.42
distributing to the
needs of the saints,
00:22:24.45\00:22:27.03
given to hospitality.
00:22:27.06\00:22:28.53
Bless those who persecute you
00:22:28.56\00:22:29.98
bless and do not curse.
00:22:30.01\00:22:31.76
Rejoice with those who rejoice,
and weep with those who weep.
00:22:31.79\00:22:34.74
Be of the same
mind toward one another.
00:22:34.77\00:22:37.26
Do not set your
mind on high things,
00:22:37.29\00:22:39.29
but associate with the humble.
00:22:39.32\00:22:40.83
Do not be wise
in your own opinion.
00:22:40.86\00:22:43.14
Repay no one evil
[] for evil have regard
00:22:43.17\00:22:46.38
for good things
in the sight of men.
00:22:46.41\00:22:48.28
If it is possible, as
much as depends on you,
00:22:48.31\00:22:52.34
live peaceably with all men."
00:22:52.37\00:22:54.19
Now there is a lot of
things that Paul mixed in there,
00:22:54.22\00:22:56.69
but the point is
this is a little synopsis
00:22:56.72\00:22:59.26
of what he says
all through his letters
00:22:59.29\00:23:01.56
and that the laity will be--
00:23:01.59\00:23:03.33
to be the ones that were
to care each others burdens.
00:23:03.36\00:23:07.08
Edify, build up. Share.
00:23:07.11\00:23:09.60
Contrasted with
sometimes the mindset
00:23:09.63\00:23:13.55
that the pastor is
the one that is to come
00:23:13.58\00:23:16.44
and be my spiritual, my
primary spiritual caregiver.
00:23:16.47\00:23:20.91
So I went to a church
that there was a little--
00:23:20.94\00:23:27.50
I will say the people
were little disgruntle
00:23:27.53\00:23:29.44
because it's a very busy church
00:23:29.47\00:23:30.79
and the pastor didn't have time
00:23:30.82\00:23:32.28
to go do all the
hospital visitations
00:23:32.31\00:23:35.15
and people
would whisper and say,
00:23:35.18\00:23:37.12
he isn't going and taking
care of his hospital duties.
00:23:37.15\00:23:40.48
Now, I have gone
to another church
00:23:40.51\00:23:42.54
that what the pastor did
was train people how to go out,
00:23:42.57\00:23:47.01
I mean literally
train them how long to stay,
00:23:47.04\00:23:49.58
what not to do,
don't sit on their bed.
00:23:49.61\00:23:51.20
What to do when you
are going into hospital
00:23:51.23\00:23:52.91
for a hospital visitation,
00:23:52.94\00:23:54.55
which I think is
an excellent thing
00:23:54.58\00:23:56.04
to do as trainee. Yes.
00:23:56.07\00:23:57.17
Because then people
don't outwear their welcome
00:23:57.20\00:24:00.99
and weary the patient,
00:24:01.02\00:24:02.55
but there was a group of people,
00:24:02.58\00:24:05.13
because there are some
people that aren't comfortable
00:24:05.16\00:24:07.03
going and doing hospital visits,
00:24:07.06\00:24:08.37
and there are some
people who just it's in them
00:24:08.40\00:24:11.39
and so what we are coming
to in all of this is that--
00:24:11.42\00:24:15.52
that five-fold
ministry that we discussed
00:24:15.55\00:24:18.11
is talking about
Jesus who gave these offices
00:24:18.14\00:24:21.39
if you will in the church
that they may train the laity
00:24:21.42\00:24:26.11
to go out and do all of
these things. That's right.
00:24:26.14\00:24:29.65
Now, I believe that
you have an important quote
00:24:29.68\00:24:33.13
from Christian
author Ellen White
00:24:33.16\00:24:36.01
and I would like you
to read that quote to us.
00:24:36.04\00:24:39.47
'Cause this is fatal mistake
quote, and here is what it says,
00:24:39.50\00:24:42.01
this is from Acts of
the Apostles, on page 110.
00:24:42.04\00:24:45.19
"Not upon the ordained minister
only rests the responsibility
00:24:45.22\00:24:49.80
of going forth to
fulfill the great commission.
00:24:49.83\00:24:52.92
Everyone who has received Christ
00:24:52.95\00:24:55.54
is called to work for the
salvation of his fellowmen.
00:24:55.57\00:24:59.74
It is a fatal mistake to suppose
that the work of soul saving
00:24:59.77\00:25:04.81
depends alone upon the minister.
00:25:04.84\00:25:08.35
Those who stand as
leaders in the church of God
00:25:08.38\00:25:11.53
are to realize that
the Savior's commission
00:25:11.56\00:25:14.56
is given to all who
believe in His name." Amen.
00:25:14.59\00:25:17.84
"God will send
forth into His vineyard
00:25:17.87\00:25:20.60
many who have not been
dedicated to the ministry
00:25:20.63\00:25:23.56
by the laying on of hands."
00:25:23.59\00:25:26.13
That word fatal means fatal.
00:25:26.16\00:25:29.51
It's a deadly mistake to think.
00:25:29.54\00:25:32.01
And when you go to a church
00:25:32.04\00:25:34.41
where they expect the
pastor to do everything,
00:25:34.44\00:25:36.59
what you do find is it is deadly
that the church is not growing,
00:25:36.62\00:25:40.12
it's just, it's
just like the Dead Sea.
00:25:40.15\00:25:43.09
You know, there is just
nothing really coming I mean,
00:25:43.12\00:25:46.65
It's coming in
but nothing going out.
00:25:46.68\00:25:47.72
Nothing is going out, so
essentially let's go through,
00:25:47.75\00:25:51.53
why don't you
recap very quickly.
00:25:51.56\00:25:53.04
Okay, laity are be as priests,
were to connect people to God.
00:25:53.07\00:25:56.68
Number two, laity are ministers
that wants to do the ministry.
00:25:56.71\00:26:00.84
Number three, laity can be
involved in church planting
00:26:00.87\00:26:03.67
as Aquila and Priscilla.
00:26:03.70\00:26:05.12
Number four,
laity were appointed
00:26:05.15\00:26:06.98
as overseers of the church,
00:26:07.01\00:26:08.96
they were the pastors in
many of the early churches.
00:26:08.99\00:26:12.23
And number five,
00:26:12.26\00:26:13.29
laity are the primary
caregivers for each other.
00:26:13.32\00:26:16.90
Simply put it's
impossible for a minister,
00:26:16.93\00:26:19.65
I am not going to use that word,
00:26:19.68\00:26:20.73
it's possible for a
pastor to be responsible
00:26:20.76\00:26:23.43
to give the
spiritual primary care
00:26:23.46\00:26:25.50
to be the primary
caregiver for 100, 200 people,
00:26:25.53\00:26:28.97
it's just impossible.
00:26:29.00\00:26:30.17
God wants mutual
care giving among laity.
00:26:30.20\00:26:33.68
Amen, so that means that
we all has some growing to do
00:26:33.71\00:26:37.91
and I bet I would
like to know the difference
00:26:37.94\00:26:41.86
when you first
arrived at your church.
00:26:41.89\00:26:44.19
Did you see as you
began to teach from the Bible
00:26:44.22\00:26:48.03
what God meant the
church model to be?
00:26:48.06\00:26:50.48
Did you see your
church come alive
00:26:50.51\00:26:53.17
and begin to thrive in this?
00:26:53.20\00:26:54.67
It created
warfare. Of course, always.
00:26:54.70\00:26:57.31
Because you have a
group that doesn't,
00:26:57.34\00:26:59.69
that doesn't want to
change the status quo,
00:26:59.72\00:27:02.17
but then you have a
group that realizes,
00:27:02.20\00:27:03.91
you know what, God is calling me
00:27:03.94\00:27:05.93
and I do have friends
and neighbors that need Jesus
00:27:05.96\00:27:08.84
and so praise the
Lord, blessings happened.
00:27:08.87\00:27:11.64
Well, thank you so much, Julie.
00:27:11.67\00:27:13.43
Thank you, Ken, for
coming and sharing today.
00:27:13.46\00:27:15.94
We want to have you comeback
00:27:15.97\00:27:17.51
and we are going to discuss
a few more things about this.
00:27:17.54\00:27:20.16
But for those of you at
home I hope please lets,
00:27:20.19\00:27:24.14
let this be a wakeup call.
00:27:24.17\00:27:25.74
You know I am a layperson,
I am not a professional person
00:27:25.77\00:27:28.13
and really all
I did was pressing
00:27:28.16\00:27:29.85
to the presence
of the Lord and said,
00:27:29.88\00:27:31.28
Lord, here I am, send me.
00:27:31.31\00:27:33.32
And you know what, he did it.
00:27:33.35\00:27:34.84
I never had to do anything
to open the doors for ministry
00:27:34.87\00:27:37.71
God just took me
seriously and He sent me out.
00:27:37.74\00:27:40.80
And He wants to do
that for all of us,
00:27:40.83\00:27:42.51
it may be just reaching your
00:27:42.54\00:27:43.96
next door
neighbor or a coworker,
00:27:43.99\00:27:46.19
but God wants to
use you and He can,
00:27:46.22\00:27:49.45
all you have to do
is share your testimony
00:27:49.48\00:27:51.53
about what He had
done in your life.
00:27:51.56\00:27:53.63
Thanks for watching.
00:27:53.66\00:27:55.15