Hello, I'm Shelley Quinn.
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And welcome again to
"Issues and Answers."
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No matter where you're
tuning in from around the world,
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we are so glad that
you are with us today.
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And I'm really thrilled because
we have Doctors Ron and Nancy.
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Rockey back with us today.
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We're going to be
talking about fear.
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And how wounds from the
past can make us fearful
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and how they could set
up self-destructive behavior
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but more than
that how we can get rid
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of that
self-destructive behavior.
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And you know, the Bible
tells us in 2 Timothy 1:7,
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"That God didn't
give us the spirit of fear
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but He gave us
the spirit of love
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and power and sound mind."
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But there is a scripture
that's even better than that
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and it comes from 1 John
4:18. Let me read it to you.
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It says, "There is no
fear in love, perfect fear--"
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Let me say that again,
"Perfect love casts out fear."
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And that's what we're
gonna be talking about today.
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So help me welcome
Doctors Ron and Nancy.
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And I looked at--I
looked at you and I said Ron
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and him when I say Nancy.
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But anyway, two
Rockey's. We don't mind.
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We are so glad
that you are back.
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Move on, anyways
this doesn't matter.
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That's right. Call
me Nancy, I don't care.
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What was that--
oh, there was a song,
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a boy name Sue or something
like that from away back wind.
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I guess, I don't
remember that one.
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You were never a
Jonny Cash fan then.
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Probably not. Anyway.
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We have had some
good times with you guys.
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It's not your
first visit to 3ABN.
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But there are some
people who may not know you,
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so let's just talk about
what you are doing right now.
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You've got the Life Renewal
Institute, you are the founders.
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You've been a pastor--
you're a pastor for 20 years.
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Master's degree in
Family Therapy, both of you,
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doctoral degrees and
psychology and counseling.
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And now you've been spending,
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how many years
going around the world
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giving seminars 45
weekends out of the year?
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Well, let's see.
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We started that in 1995--
All right, has been a long--
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But have been
teaching seminars since 1980.
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Since 1980.
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Well, that's--you know,
for those who may not know
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and if you haven't seen
the Rockey's on 3ABN before.
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They came from, both of them,
very dysfunctional backgrounds,
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brought their dysfunctions
into their own marriage.
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And at the time that they
were just almost had a split,
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pastor and his wife.
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That's when they
went into this furtherance
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of their career,
thinking for Ron,
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thinking that he may
not get to be a pastor
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if he was divorced.
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And it was actually then that,
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what did you say to me
'cause I ask you, it wasn't,
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when you went to-- to
train for family therapy?
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Is that what woke you up?
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But what did
you say woke you up?
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I saw that there were, first
of all there's hope for Nancy.
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So you still didn't
see your own problem. No.
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I was only as I began
to understand my beginnings
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that I was able to see.
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Maybe I did have some
issues, that wasn't all Nancy.
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Because to me with my
background she was a nutcase
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because I
married a happy-go-lucky
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sweet smiling person.
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After we got
married she's crying
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and tearful and
sick all the time.
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And every time I turned around,
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she has some other
ailment going on with her
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and to me with
my rejection issues,
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severe rejection
issues in childhood.
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She was getting
sick all the time,
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so she wouldn't have
to kiss me or hold me
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or just be around me,
she was always sick so--
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And to be a good
husband and a good father,
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being German, I worked,
so I was gone all the time.
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Which of course made me
physically healthy, right?
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Yeah. Not.
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So she got more
sick, I worked more.
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She got more
sick, I worked more.
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It's a merry-go-round.
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So was it
stressed related illnesses?
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Oh, absolutely,
every one of them.
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Every one of them.
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And here he was being
a very controlling person
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which most
people who are fearful
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of rejection are
controlling. Oh, absolutely.
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Because when
childhood is out of control
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and adults would take
control. I was so controlling.
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Remember when I was in prison,
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when we talked the
last time being in prison
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that was in Tennessee.
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I was a Yankee in
a southern prison.
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Not a good place
to be 45 years ago.
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And they were--the
brutality was off the charts.
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And I went to the warden.
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And I said, "If you don't
get these guards off my back,
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I'm gonna leave."
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No arrogance in him, right?
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And he's sitting there
with his belly out here
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like this is the 38 up on top
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and chewing tobacco
coming down both sides.
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And he laughed at me.
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And he went, "Boy,
you think you can leave--
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you go ahead and leave,
nobody leaves this place."
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I said, "Glad to hear.
Thank you for the permission."
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That was on Saturday,
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the following
Friday, I was gone.
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To this day, they didn't
know how I got out of there.
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But they caught up with you.
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They caught up
with me, the FBI did.
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And you know,
then you gave your--
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well, wait a
minute, I start to say
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you gave your life to the
Lord but you became a pastor.
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You were actually a
pastor for many years
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before you
developed a very personal
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relationship with the Lord.
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And yet in prison, he
said, "It's where he found home.
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Where he found the safety
of a relationship with God."
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But just because one
has a relationship with God
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or what we think or consider
to be a relationship with God.
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It does not mean that our
history and all of the things
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that cause our dysfunction
magically get erased?
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There is that process of
sanctification, isn't it?
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Absolutely, and one of
the laws of the mind is
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with every period of exhaustion,
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there's a course
binding period of depression
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that goes for a weakest point.
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Now, wait a minute,
don't just rush pass that
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'cause I think that that speaks
volumes and I-- Oh, it does.
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With every period of exhaustion
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and it doesn't matter
what cause of the exhaustion,
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it could be stress, overwork,
studying too hard, mental--
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Physical, mental,
spiritual, the whole thing.
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With every period of exhaustion,
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there's a course
binding period of depression.
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That depression is
manifested in our weakest point.
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And the weakest point to me--
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For me was rejection. All right.
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So--when she is
sick all the time,
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I'm feeling, what?
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Rejected, so I work more.
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Which makes you exhausted?
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So it makes me more exhausted.
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Which brings on depression,
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which brings on
more about rejection.
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Absolutely, and I
didn't-- depressions for me.
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Each one of us displays
depressions differently.
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For me I just played
depression in rage. Okay.
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Oh, off the chart, I
was at a number 10 in rage
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before my feet hit the ground
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coming out of bed
every morning, every morning.
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And when I woke up--
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I wonder you were sick
all the time. Oh, yeah.
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Who made me
rageful every morning?
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I opened up my
eyes and there she was.
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Oh, mercy.
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I mean, she
couldn't do anything right.
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She couldn't sneeze right.
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And this is someone-- this is--
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oh, you can just
see the dynamics here.
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Because here you are with
all of your issues in baggage,
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and this rage, and everything,
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and you think she
can't do anything right.
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And here she is with
all of her dysfunction,
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a perfectionist
wanting and desiring
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and craving the
approval of a man.
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And so suddenly
you just keep getting
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more and more
perfectionist oriented
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and trying to do
performance oriented.
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You keep thinking
she is rejecting you.
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So she is working over
here, you working over there
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and you just keep going
in the opposite direction.
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Absolutely. Oh.
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And yet, you know,
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there was something
about our relationship.
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Maybe it was the way we met.
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I mean, how many people
actually meet in a courtroom,
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the day one of them
is released from prison.
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It just doesn't happen.
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And how many people
do you know say that,
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"How many children you want
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within 30 minutes
after meeting her?"
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You say, you knew, you
were gonna marry her, huh?
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Yeah, he did. And you know--
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And you thought you're
gonna marry this jailbird
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to straighten him out or what?
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Well, tell her
the rest of the story.
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I honestly thought
that, that was my job.
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Oh, you did
think. Oh, absolutely.
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But all of her life--
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Unless your
little diluted heart.
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All of her life she was told,
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she will never
marry any good man.
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That's right. No good
man will ever want you.
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Oh, that's hard.
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So what did she wind up
doing, she married a con.
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Oh, bless your heart.
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And you know
it's very interesting.
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We don't know the
depth of the wounds
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we cause with the words we say.
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Oh, Bible says in
Proverbs 18:21 that
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"The power of life and
death is in the tongue."
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And parents speak these
words into a child's life
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and they speak death into them.
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So no good man is
going to want you, why?
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You are too fat.
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Why was I? Why was I overeating?
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I was looking for comfort.
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I was feeling the
giant hole in my heart. Yeah.
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Where my parents
or more primarily
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my father should have been.
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And I was trying to comfort
myself from the sexual abuse
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that was going on
across the street.
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Okay, so all of this fear,
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you have a story
about black ice that I like
00:10:07.47\00:10:09.72
because when we go through
00:10:09.75\00:10:13.60
these really
negative childhood experiences
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and even early adulthood,
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just any negative
experience can setup fear,
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fear can setup this
self destructive behaviors.
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We find ourselves
on a slippery slope.
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We've been here with
black ice running on.
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I remember the first time we
saw black ice, I heard about it.
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I don't mind I'm from Wisconsin,
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I know how to drive on ice.
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But black ice means you
can't see it. You don't see it.
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You don't know it's there
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and you don't
know what it can cause.
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I'm from Texas, so I
know about black ice.
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We were driving in Texas. Yes.
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And we were heading up
north to our home with a trailer
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we were pulling behind us
with a refrigerator and a stove
00:11:02.69\00:11:06.30
and all the appliances
necessary to outfit a kitchen.
00:11:06.33\00:11:11.45
And all of a
sudden we hit black ice.
00:11:11.48\00:11:14.02
And that trailer was
dancing all over the highway,
00:11:14.05\00:11:17.02
our car was dancing
all over the highway
00:11:17.05\00:11:19.82
and we didn't know
had we blown a tire,
00:11:19.85\00:11:22.22
what had we done, we
couldn't see the black ice.
00:11:22.25\00:11:26.63
And that's the
way it is with fear.
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It is imperceptible to us.
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We don't realize that fear
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is at cause for
what is going on.
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Fear is-- well,
let me start again.
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There are two basic emotions,
00:11:43.88\00:11:45.95
one is love and
the other is fear.
00:11:45.98\00:11:48.31
They are total
opposites from each other.
00:11:48.34\00:11:52.31
And when we have been wounded,
00:11:52.34\00:11:55.29
the brain goes into
survival mode, I must survive.
00:11:55.32\00:11:59.41
I fear that no one
else will take care of me,
00:11:59.44\00:12:02.81
they will not protect me.
00:12:02.84\00:12:04.94
And fear sends us down that
slippery road to self defeat.
00:12:04.97\00:12:09.28
To developing
techniques, in order to survive,
00:12:09.31\00:12:13.02
addictions to numb our pain
00:12:13.05\00:12:16.02
and behaviors that
are destructive to others
00:12:16.05\00:12:19.37
and destructive to ourselves.
00:12:19.40\00:12:22.93
So-- you know, I
have a teaching that I do
00:12:22.96\00:12:25.03
and I haven't done
this in a long time.
00:12:25.06\00:12:28.31
But what you were saying,
I think I'm really getting.
00:12:28.34\00:12:32.28
The Bible tells us
that we are to be rooted
00:12:32.31\00:12:34.72
and grounded in
the love of Christ.
00:12:34.75\00:12:37.21
If we are not rooted
and grounded in love--
00:12:37.24\00:12:39.47
and that's the tap root.
00:12:39.50\00:12:41.28
Then if our taproot is fear
from that insecurity, rejection,
00:12:41.31\00:12:47.50
all of these other
things are rooted off there.
00:12:47.53\00:12:50.28
That is exactly right.
00:12:50.31\00:12:51.68
And what you're saying is that,
00:12:51.71\00:12:53.50
when we have--
our taproot is fear
00:12:53.53\00:12:57.15
then what actually
starts branching off
00:12:57.18\00:13:00.05
is all of these self
destructive behaviors
00:13:00.08\00:13:03.70
that are not only driving
us further away from God,
00:13:03.73\00:13:07.80
but they also cut off
any meaningful relationship
00:13:07.83\00:13:11.52
with another human
being. Well, exactly.
00:13:11.55\00:13:13.71
We pay a price for
the techniques we develop.
00:13:13.74\00:13:17.78
If it's an addiction
like to drugs or to alcohol,
00:13:17.81\00:13:20.84
we're gonna pay a price.
00:13:20.87\00:13:22.24
We're gonna lose relationships.
We're gonna lose money.
00:13:22.27\00:13:24.39
We're gonna lose our jobs. Okay.
00:13:24.42\00:13:26.46
But there is one point also
00:13:26.49\00:13:27.86
that we could
perform and look phenomenal.
00:13:27.89\00:13:30.47
We can be absolutely
perfect as a Christian
00:13:30.50\00:13:33.53
and look wonderful.
00:13:33.56\00:13:34.93
Well, we could put a perfect
front, so we put it that way.
00:13:34.96\00:13:37.10
Unless we do off, we come
in the church in the morning.
00:13:37.13\00:13:39.52
How are you doing?
What's your answer?
00:13:39.55\00:13:41.09
Yes, of course. Fine.
00:13:41.12\00:13:43.40
Everybody is fine. But
underneath we are dying.
00:13:43.43\00:13:47.54
Exactly, But, you know,
00:13:47.57\00:13:49.68
I tell people that
part of the reason that--
00:13:49.71\00:13:53.16
I mean it is fear
that we won't tell anyone
00:13:53.19\00:13:55.69
because part of the
reason is we're afraid
00:13:55.72\00:13:57.98
if we tell people, they're
gonna start gossiping about us.
00:13:58.01\00:14:00.25
Or the other one is
that they won't listen to me.
00:14:00.28\00:14:03.55
Yeah, 'Cause a lot of times
when people ask that question
00:14:03.58\00:14:06.86
they're not really
interested in the answer,
00:14:06.89\00:14:08.85
it's just a social--
00:14:08.88\00:14:10.25
It's a social reading. Yeah.
00:14:10.28\00:14:12.06
When I'm hurting
today, today 19--
00:14:12.09\00:14:16.80
No, it's 2000 honey sweet.
00:14:16.83\00:14:20.05
When I'm hurting today,
00:14:20.08\00:14:21.70
there's two
people I can go through.
00:14:21.73\00:14:23.10
Now you are only a
decade off for a sec.
00:14:23.13\00:14:24.50
That will listen
to me, Him and her.
00:14:24.53\00:14:25.95
Yeah. She'll listen to anything.
00:14:25.98\00:14:29.83
It doesn't matter and I spill
that out to her of my pain,
00:14:29.86\00:14:33.23
what am my feeling or
whatever because of overdoing.
00:14:33.26\00:14:36.71
Matter of fact, when
we overdo something we--
00:14:36.74\00:14:38.75
we cut each
other slack of that law
00:14:38.78\00:14:40.91
with a period of exhaustion.
00:14:40.94\00:14:42.54
Of course, my impeded depression
that was for a weakest point.
00:14:42.57\00:14:45.27
Her tendency is to--
is to get into something
00:14:45.30\00:14:48.40
that would
regenerate her by creativity.
00:14:48.43\00:14:51.40
I go to the
computer and I do editing
00:14:51.43\00:14:54.09
and creativity on the computer.
00:14:54.12\00:14:56.44
You know, I have to go back
00:14:56.47\00:14:57.84
'cause I know we
are talking about fear.
00:14:57.87\00:14:59.24
But boy, you really
hitting something here,
00:14:59.27\00:15:01.15
it's a hitting a nerve for me
00:15:01.18\00:15:02.55
because I'm a
driving personality,
00:15:02.58\00:15:05.08
I drive myself, you
know, I'm always over schedule.
00:15:05.11\00:15:08.82
And nobody really wants to say,
00:15:08.85\00:15:11.99
I mean, there's
this thing about--
00:15:12.02\00:15:13.69
in our society there's two
things that are interesting.
00:15:13.72\00:15:16.33
If we are independent
you get a pad on the back.
00:15:16.36\00:15:20.39
And being that independence
is what keeps you sometimes,
00:15:20.42\00:15:23.85
I mean, it keeps
you distant from God.
00:15:23.88\00:15:26.86
But also being a person
who is a high performer,
00:15:26.89\00:15:32.68
its pad on the back.
00:15:32.71\00:15:34.08
And you don't want to
ever tell anyone that--
00:15:34.11\00:15:36.81
'cause I actually asked myself
this question the other day.
00:15:36.84\00:15:39.63
Am I depressed?
00:15:39.66\00:15:41.35
And I thought I
don't act depressed,
00:15:41.38\00:15:42.75
I don't feel depressed,
00:15:42.78\00:15:44.15
but I'm doing some things
that are self-destructive.
00:15:44.18\00:15:47.04
I-- I've kind of like,
00:15:47.07\00:15:48.70
I've gained a little
weight 'cause I'm not eating--
00:15:48.73\00:15:50.92
you know, I'm eating
things that are not good for me.
00:15:50.95\00:15:52.90
But also I'm not motivated
right now to do the things
00:15:52.93\00:15:57.37
that normally just,
I'm passionate about.
00:15:57.40\00:16:02.01
And I thought may be I've
just pushed so far so long
00:16:02.04\00:16:06.34
and I've got one
deadline after a next
00:16:06.37\00:16:08.10
that I never have this lapse.
00:16:08.13\00:16:10.03
So are you really saying
00:16:10.06\00:16:11.58
that this is just
a general principle
00:16:11.61\00:16:13.65
that over exhaustion
when you over exert yourself
00:16:13.68\00:16:16.59
and you get
exhausted, every one of us,
00:16:16.62\00:16:19.41
whether we want to
say it out louder or not.
00:16:19.44\00:16:22.32
We go through kind
of a little depression
00:16:22.35\00:16:24.74
and it hits us at
our weakest point.
00:16:24.77\00:16:26.94
And our weakest
point is usually the trauma
00:16:26.97\00:16:29.12
that's happened
to us in childhood
00:16:29.15\00:16:30.67
and the experience that
we come out of that way.
00:16:30.70\00:16:32.72
Mine was rejection. Okay.
00:16:32.75\00:16:34.99
So I feel rejected.
00:16:35.02\00:16:36.96
So when Nancy and I do a
seminar even to this day,
00:16:36.99\00:16:39.50
all the recovery we've done.
00:16:39.53\00:16:40.95
And we really spent, we do two,
00:16:40.98\00:16:42.78
three up in a
row, where we spent.
00:16:42.81\00:16:45.08
We create at
least two or three days,
00:16:45.11\00:16:48.01
where she does her
thing and I do my thing.
00:16:48.04\00:16:50.42
And we just come
together in the evening
00:16:50.45\00:16:51.82
and we go out to eat,
00:16:51.85\00:16:53.74
knowing that we need
to take the time to rest
00:16:53.77\00:16:57.41
and to regenerate, recoup
00:16:57.44\00:16:59.34
and in the
evening we spent a few,
00:16:59.37\00:17:00.74
how are you feeling again?
00:17:00.77\00:17:02.14
I'm feeling all right.
00:17:02.17\00:17:03.54
But I little--yeah, and we
just kind of walk each other--
00:17:03.57\00:17:05.82
each others you
know, cuffing on.
00:17:05.85\00:17:07.94
And then go to
bed and go to sleep,
00:17:07.97\00:17:10.69
just create the
time for each other.
00:17:10.72\00:17:12.09
Okay, so this
is the kind of fear
00:17:12.12\00:17:14.17
from driving in exhaustion.
00:17:14.20\00:17:15.91
What a--what would you
talk to the people out here
00:17:15.94\00:17:20.35
who are listening in on
this conversation and watching.
00:17:20.38\00:17:24.77
What about the people
who have real issues of fear
00:17:24.80\00:17:27.87
in their life, not
just from exhaustion.
00:17:27.90\00:17:29.98
But maybe they've
got someone that--
00:17:30.01\00:17:33.66
and it's not just rejection
00:17:33.69\00:17:35.80
but there is
physical things going on,
00:17:35.83\00:17:38.97
there is maybe abuse going on.
00:17:39.00\00:17:41.07
How do people--?
00:17:41.10\00:17:43.06
And fear can be
a good thing too.
00:17:43.09\00:17:45.26
Yes, absolutely.
00:17:45.29\00:17:46.66
Fear is something
that's a natural--
00:17:46.69\00:17:48.49
It's a motivator at some point.
00:17:48.52\00:17:53.63
We have to understand that
fear paralyses most people.
00:17:53.66\00:17:58.43
Paralyses our
ability to think rationally.
00:17:58.46\00:18:02.22
Fear tends to
predict its own end.
00:18:02.25\00:18:04.61
In other words usually the
things we're scared to death
00:18:04.64\00:18:07.34
about end up happening,
00:18:07.37\00:18:09.57
because we set the
stage for it to happen.
00:18:09.60\00:18:13.53
Fear makes us emotionally or
fear makes us physically ill.
00:18:13.56\00:18:18.39
And God never wanted
any of these things for us.
00:18:18.42\00:18:21.83
He wanted us to live in love.
00:18:21.86\00:18:24.81
Amen. Not in fear.
00:18:24.84\00:18:26.97
Amen. And I tell women.
00:18:27.00\00:18:30.18
And I'm often
asked this question.
00:18:30.21\00:18:32.96
If you had it to do over again
would you have divorced Ron?
00:18:32.99\00:18:38.91
Big question. 12 years.
00:18:38.94\00:18:41.32
12 years. But
it wasn't physical.
00:18:41.35\00:18:45.41
And that was a rule I
had set in my own mind.
00:18:45.44\00:18:49.27
The second it
turns physical I'm gone.
00:18:49.30\00:18:53.81
As I look back on it,
00:18:53.84\00:18:55.21
I realize that the emotional
abuse took a toll on me.
00:18:55.24\00:18:59.88
And because we live in
this "cat kicking society"
00:18:59.91\00:19:03.75
I then took a
toll on our children.
00:19:03.78\00:19:06.49
That's the way we do.
00:19:06.52\00:19:07.93
And our children
took it on our dog-
00:19:07.96\00:19:10.09
and the dog on the cat.
00:19:10.12\00:19:11.80
And that's kind
of the way it goes.
00:19:11.83\00:19:15.19
But I always tell
women, if you are living
00:19:15.22\00:19:17.94
in a physically
abusive relationship,
00:19:17.97\00:19:21.19
you need to
separate from the abuser
00:19:21.22\00:19:24.62
for the purpose
of reconciliation.
00:19:24.65\00:19:27.47
God hates
divorce, but He never said
00:19:27.50\00:19:31.09
we have to stay
there and be beaten.
00:19:31.12\00:19:33.98
You are the temple of
the Holy Spirit. Absolutely.
00:19:34.01\00:19:36.34
And we are
teaching our daughters
00:19:36.37\00:19:38.12
how to be doormats and
we are teaching our sons
00:19:38.15\00:19:40.97
how to be abusers, if we stay.
00:19:41.00\00:19:43.31
You know, and it talks
about in Timothy about the--
00:19:43.34\00:19:46.40
isn't it Timothy, 2
Timothy where he's talking about
00:19:46.43\00:19:48.90
the end times and
the godless people
00:19:48.93\00:19:50.90
and they're gonna be
so abusive and he says,
00:19:50.93\00:19:53.72
have nothing to do
with those kind of men.
00:19:53.75\00:19:55.46
So I use that scripture to say
00:19:55.49\00:19:56.94
that supports getting
away from them. Right.
00:19:56.97\00:19:59.95
So that you can at least,
00:19:59.98\00:20:01.97
you cannot
reconcile with someone who--
00:20:02.00\00:20:05.36
I'm gonna use you as
an example Ron. Sure.
00:20:05.39\00:20:07.37
Because you said earlier,
you didn't even recognize,
00:20:07.40\00:20:11.21
this was your
normal pattern of behavior,
00:20:11.24\00:20:13.28
it's what you grew up with.
00:20:13.31\00:20:15.58
And so you
thought she was a nutcase,
00:20:15.61\00:20:18.31
you didn't realize
that all of your controlling
00:20:18.34\00:20:21.23
and verbal abusive,
00:20:21.26\00:20:22.63
you didn't even
recognize you were doing that.
00:20:22.66\00:20:25.10
And because this is,
it's get really hairy,
00:20:25.13\00:20:30.13
and it cuts
pretty deep inside of me.
00:20:30.16\00:20:36.06
Because Nancy did stay,
00:20:36.09\00:20:38.33
we've got a
ministry in each other. Yes.
00:20:38.36\00:20:41.65
But because she did stay,
00:20:41.68\00:20:43.25
both of our
girls married abusers.
00:20:43.28\00:20:45.13
Oh, boy. I can see
where that comes through.
00:20:45.16\00:20:47.89
And actually
what was so difficult
00:20:47.92\00:20:51.19
is that our eldest daughter,
a very beautiful woman,
00:20:51.22\00:20:56.67
was married to a man
who beat her for 6 ½ years.
00:20:56.70\00:21:00.13
He was unmerciful to her.
00:21:00.16\00:21:03.18
And she hid that
from you. Oh, yes.
00:21:03.21\00:21:05.22
Well, we were
living 2400 miles apart
00:21:05.25\00:21:07.27
so that's pretty easy, you know.
00:21:07.30\00:21:08.67
But I mean she still
hid it from you, she did--
00:21:08.70\00:21:10.74
She did not tell
us the story, no.
00:21:10.77\00:21:13.35
Didn't even
given any inclination,
00:21:13.38\00:21:14.75
'cause she knew her dad. Yes.
00:21:14.78\00:21:16.95
And she knew dad's
response to that. Yeah.
00:21:16.98\00:21:19.68
And so finally she called
00:21:19.71\00:21:21.95
and left a message
on her answering machine
00:21:21.98\00:21:23.80
that she had
escaped from her husband.
00:21:23.83\00:21:27.05
Well, in instantly
we tried to call her,
00:21:27.08\00:21:29.78
could not get her
so we hopped in the car
00:21:29.81\00:21:32.44
and drove 2400
miles straight through,
00:21:32.47\00:21:34.51
until we got to
the town where she was.
00:21:34.54\00:21:38.11
And I sat up all
night and listened to her
00:21:38.14\00:21:41.43
and listen to what had
transpired in these 6 ½ years.
00:21:41.46\00:21:45.41
And finally
towards morning I said
00:21:45.44\00:21:47.38
Sara, "Why?
00:21:47.41\00:21:49.43
Why would you stay with a man
00:21:49.46\00:21:52.11
who would do these
despicable things to you?"
00:21:52.14\00:21:56.84
She said,
"Mama, you fixed daddy,
00:21:56.87\00:21:59.48
so I figured I
should be able to fix him."
00:21:59.51\00:22:02.66
She didn't realize it
weren't you who fixed daddy.
00:22:02.69\00:22:04.88
Wasn't me who fixed daddy? No.
00:22:04.91\00:22:08.02
Heavens know I stayed, yes.
00:22:08.05\00:22:10.41
Because at some level,
meeting in a courtroom.
00:22:10.44\00:22:15.87
I felt God had
brought us together
00:22:15.90\00:22:19.77
and He doesn't change His mind.
00:22:19.80\00:22:22.42
So why would God bring us
together to tear us apart?
00:22:22.45\00:22:27.26
It made no sense.
00:22:27.29\00:22:28.83
And I used to plea, "God, You've
got to have a purpose in this.
00:22:28.86\00:22:32.20
I just don't
know what it is. Yes.
00:22:32.23\00:22:34.14
Please show us, please
show us. That's painful.
00:22:34.17\00:22:36.92
And finally He gave
us Isaiah 42. Praise God.
00:22:36.95\00:22:41.45
Which says, "I
have chosen you to--"
00:22:41.48\00:22:46.23
And there is a list.
00:22:46.26\00:22:47.96
Heal the broken
hearted, set the captives free.
00:22:47.99\00:22:53.36
And I said, "Well,
if that's the case,
00:22:53.39\00:22:56.34
you better get busy,
00:22:56.37\00:22:57.74
because I'm hanging
out with my fingernails."
00:22:57.77\00:23:00.25
Now, you know, we only
have a few minutes left
00:23:00.28\00:23:02.99
and I don't want-- I
mean, your story is so moving.
00:23:03.02\00:23:06.01
And I know you are touching
00:23:06.04\00:23:07.41
a lot of hearts
out there right now.
00:23:07.44\00:23:09.33
And there are
people who are saying,
00:23:09.36\00:23:11.49
"Help, you are
identifying me, what do I do?"
00:23:11.52\00:23:16.02
How do I get--you know,
here I quoted 2 Timothy 1:7,
00:23:16.05\00:23:20.66
"That spirit of fear
doesn't come from God."
00:23:20.69\00:23:22.88
You know, God's
not the kind of God--
00:23:22.91\00:23:25.73
and I want to tell you this.
00:23:25.76\00:23:27.17
He is not the kind of
father who is up there
00:23:27.20\00:23:29.62
trying to control
you or manipulate you
00:23:29.65\00:23:32.69
or zap you when you do wrong.
00:23:32.72\00:23:35.13
He is love and He wants you
00:23:35.16\00:23:38.64
to understand your
great value to Him.
00:23:38.67\00:23:41.72
How does someone get there?
00:23:41.75\00:23:43.50
How do they get from that point
of being paralyzed with fear
00:23:43.53\00:23:48.91
to where they can move beyond?
00:23:48.94\00:23:51.37
Let me say one thing before
Nancy open--finishes with that.
00:23:51.40\00:23:56.43
There's a lot of
people out there,
00:23:56.46\00:23:57.83
they have been
praying about their issues,
00:23:57.86\00:24:00.33
praying and praying
and reading scriptures.
00:24:00.36\00:24:03.00
And they don't seem to feel
like God answers their prayers.
00:24:03.03\00:24:08.19
And what I want them to hear is,
00:24:08.22\00:24:10.97
He's answering them but
they don't recognize it.
00:24:11.00\00:24:14.18
For me to recognize that
God loved me was impossible.
00:24:14.21\00:24:18.67
For me to recognize that God
accepts me, it was impossible.
00:24:18.70\00:24:22.03
So any prayers that I had
was totally unrecognizable.
00:24:22.06\00:24:26.32
He works with and for
us in spite of ourselves.
00:24:26.35\00:24:30.17
So don't give up on the prayers
because you can't see it,
00:24:30.20\00:24:33.68
doesn't mean He
is not there. Amen.
00:24:33.71\00:24:36.40
But prayer isn't
the only solution. Yes.
00:24:36.43\00:24:39.56
Lord tells us we
need to examine ourselves
00:24:39.59\00:24:42.16
to see how we got where we are.
00:24:42.19\00:24:46.30
And He tells us that wisdom
is in the council of many.
00:24:46.33\00:24:50.61
That we should go to a godly
counselor and get some help.
00:24:50.64\00:24:56.36
There are recovery
programs out there.
00:24:56.39\00:24:59.47
Our program "Binding the Wounds"
00:24:59.50\00:25:01.64
another one with "The Journey"
00:25:01.67\00:25:03.57
both have been
available now for some time
00:25:03.60\00:25:06.67
and have been used
by countless people
00:25:06.70\00:25:09.90
to find hope instead
of having to live in fear.
00:25:09.93\00:25:15.20
And it's partly just knowing--
00:25:15.23\00:25:18.36
if we can get to that point,
00:25:18.39\00:25:20.96
you know, there's
something and I say it so often,
00:25:20.99\00:25:23.30
I don't want anyone to think
00:25:23.33\00:25:24.77
that I'm using
this in a try fashion.
00:25:24.80\00:25:27.38
But the Lord told me when He
called me to fulltime ministry
00:25:27.41\00:25:30.11
to always remind people of this,
00:25:30.14\00:25:32.28
that you are worth
nothing less than the price
00:25:32.31\00:25:35.37
that He paid for you
00:25:35.40\00:25:37.17
with the precious
blood of His Son Jesus.
00:25:37.20\00:25:39.53
So no matter how
often someone's told you,
00:25:39.56\00:25:41.78
you are worthless, God
doesn't see you as worthless,
00:25:41.81\00:25:44.31
He puts a great worth on you.
00:25:44.34\00:25:45.84
You have great value to Him.
00:25:45.87\00:25:48.01
He loves you and He does
have a plan for your life.
00:25:48.04\00:25:51.48
And what you are
saying is go to someone
00:25:51.51\00:25:54.79
who can help you with the past.
00:25:54.82\00:25:58.31
You know, I teach people
00:25:58.34\00:25:59.84
to confess the word
of God over their life.
00:25:59.87\00:26:02.68
This is almost--
I didn't realized
00:26:02.71\00:26:04.65
this still the other
day, but it's kind of like
00:26:04.68\00:26:06.37
cognitive
behavioral therapy, I mean.
00:26:06.40\00:26:08.80
Oh, it's scientifically correct.
00:26:08.83\00:26:11.10
Your reply is--
that's the only way
00:26:11.13\00:26:12.52
you can capture your thought
and make it obedient to God.
00:26:12.55\00:26:15.43
You change, you program,
you reprogram your mind.
00:26:15.46\00:26:19.25
But I just cannot believe
00:26:19.28\00:26:21.94
how fast the time
flies when you are here.
00:26:21.97\00:26:25.17
And we're almost,
all the way out of time.
00:26:25.20\00:26:28.57
I just want to thank you
so much and tell me again,
00:26:28.60\00:26:30.81
what are the
names of your seminars?
00:26:30.84\00:26:32.54
Sure, we have two,
00:26:32.57\00:26:33.94
one is entitled
"Binding the Wounds"
00:26:33.97\00:26:36.38
taken from the Book of
Psalms, where God heals
00:26:36.41\00:26:38.59
the broken hearted
and binds up their wounds.
00:26:38.62\00:26:41.79
Our newest program
is called "The Journey."
00:26:41.82\00:26:44.66
And it's a more
complete program,
00:26:44.69\00:26:47.09
it's taught by
video and by 40 chapters
00:26:47.12\00:26:51.84
and 40 workbook sessions.
00:26:51.87\00:26:53.24
Okay, now what is
your website address?
00:26:53.27\00:26:55.59
And that's
www.your, Y-o-u-r-l-r-I,
00:26:55.62\00:27:02.51
life renewal institute.com.
00:27:02.54\00:27:05.20
so it's www.yourlri.com.
00:27:05.23\00:27:11.25
Well, Nancy and Ron Rockey,
thank you so much for coming.
00:27:11.28\00:27:15.33
You are welcome. It was a joy.
00:27:15.36\00:27:17.32
You know for
those of you at home
00:27:17.35\00:27:18.96
I hope that this
program has benefited you,
00:27:18.99\00:27:22.56
we've all got some
baggage from the past.
00:27:22.59\00:27:25.23
And it's just a
matter of, you know,
00:27:25.26\00:27:27.28
one of my favorite
scriptures is Psalms 129:4,
00:27:27.31\00:27:30.94
that says, "God is righteous,
00:27:30.97\00:27:32.47
He will cut you free
from the cords of the wicked"
00:27:32.50\00:27:34.75
that's binding you.
00:27:34.78\00:27:36.15
So I want to encourage you,
if you've been living in fear,
00:27:36.18\00:27:39.86
seek help, find a
Christian counselor
00:27:39.89\00:27:42.94
or find someone
that can help you,
00:27:42.97\00:27:45.42
point the way to God because
perfect love cast out fear.
00:27:45.45\00:27:50.57
Now may the grace of
our Lord Jesus Christ,
00:27:50.60\00:27:52.62
the love of the Father
00:27:52.65\00:27:54.02
and the
fellowship of the Holy Spirit
00:27:54.05\00:27:55.86
be with you always.
00:27:55.89\00:27:57.47