Participants: Shelley Quinn (Host), Jeff Zaremsky
Series Code: IAA
Program Code: IAA000291
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00:30 Hello, I'm Shelley Quinn and welcome again to
00:33 Issues and Answers. We've got a very different 00:36 program today and I think you're really going to enjoy this. 00:39 We are going to be talking about Jewish outreach today. 00:42 Let me read something to you. One of these scriptures is going 00:46 to be very familiar, but to begin with may not be. It's 00:49 chapter 31 of Jeremiah and I'm going to begin with verse 1: 00:53 The Lord says, At that time, says the Lord, will I be the God 00:59 of all the families of Israel and they will be my people. Then 01:04 I'm going to skip to verse 3. The Lord appeared from of old to 01:07 me, saying, yes, I have loved you with an everlasting love, 01:11 therefore, with loving-kindness have I drawn you. 01:14 You know, this is a promise I often claim myself, but it's 01:19 also a promise for God's people of today, Gentile and Jew. 01:24 We are going to be talking with a very special guest, 01:28 Jeff Zaremsky. Jeff thank you so much for joining us today. 01:32 Thank you, Shelley, for having me. 01:33 You are the president of Jewish Heritage and before we go any 01:38 further, I'm going to talk about your head dressing, 01:41 which is a yarmulke. 01:43 Right, that's what it's called, it's in Yiddish. 01:45 And what is the purpose of that? 01:48 Well, there are a number of different variations of where 01:51 the wearing of the, in Hebrew, it's called the kippa, and kippa 01:56 is the same word in the word Yom Kippur, I mean Yom Kippur, 02:02 Day of Atonement. Literally Yom Kippur means day of covering. 02:06 So we think of God's covering over us, God's grace over us on 02:10 that day of judgment, that we passed the judgment because he's 02:14 covering us. So it has that spiritual sign that we're 02:18 covered with him. The prayer shawl kind of elaborates on that 02:23 even more. But you might go back that the Levitical priests all 02:28 wore a head covering. In the Bible, God commanded Aaron and 02:31 all his descendants to wear a miter on their head, and so it 02:35 may just come from that continuing of having the head 02:38 covered. Praise to the Lord. I don't wear it all the time. I'm 02:42 wearing it for the show to accent. 02:45 Now you were saying that you we're taking about the priests 02:50 You are, in addition to being the president of the Jewish 02:55 Heritage, you are also, I don't know what to call you, a Rabbi 02:58 or a pastor, but you have a church, Beth El Shalom, which 03:03 means house of peace. You have two congregations, actually. So 03:07 what do we call you? Are you called pastor or rabbi? 03:11 Some people call me rabbi, some people call me pastor. My 03:14 grandmother calls me Jeffrey Allan, some people don't call 03:17 me at all. But I don't get into the terms, I don't worry really 03:21 about terms. A lot of people just call me Jeff. Rabbi means 03:25 teacher and so in that sense, I'm fulfilling the teacher roll. 03:28 I didn't go to a traditional rabbinical schooling. The terms: 03:33 Like we don't use the word church for our building either. 03:40 We'll call it a synagogue or a temple, again, because it 03:43 connotes more of that flavor of the Jewishness 03:48 of the worship service that we have. 03:52 All right. I want to spend most of our time talking about the 03:55 topic today. But just give me a really thumbnail version of how 04:02 you became a Seventh-day Adventist. 04:05 Okay. Well, I was born at a very young age, but that won't 04:09 be a short version. The short version is that my mother came 04:13 in contact with some Seventh- day Adventists. They ministered 04:15 to her needs she had at the time whether just an open Bible study 04:18 she had needs. They ministered to her. She told us about them. 04:21 She started quoting the Bible to me. I got a Bible to prove her 04:25 wrong and over six months, seven months' time, reading the Bible 04:29 to prove her wrong, I couldn't do it and so thus in the short, 04:33 she proved the Bible right. 04:37 Glory to God! Now you have been and Adventist for 20 years; 04:40 How long have you been in the pastor or rabbinical role? 04:44 Ah, seven years now. 04:46 Seven years now. Let's just get right to this. When we want to 04:52 share God's love with the Jewish people, it's much like, you've 04:58 heard of our World of Praise Network that we're getting ready 05:01 to launch here. The World of Praise network is for the inner 05:05 city, people of the inner cities, urban, thank you, that's 05:10 the word I was looking for. The reason we are launching World of 05:14 Praise Network is because the traditional methods of outreach 05:18 will not reach the urban people. 05:20 Even though they both speak English. It's going to be an 05:23 English station, this is an English station, it's all 05:24 English, but your focus group... 05:26 So using that as an illustration the same thing with our Jewish 05:33 friends. In the United States they speak English, but the 05:37 traditional church setting and inviting them just to come into 05:41 your church is not, I mean, I'm not saying that God can't do it, 05:44 but it's not the most likely way to reach them. So tell us what 05:48 you're doing to share God's love. 05:50 Okay. For one think, like I said, we've changed the names 05:52 and the declarations of the building. The buildings don't 05:54 look like a typical North American Church. 05:57 They look more like a synagogue. Instead of crosses, it'll have 06:03 menorahs and Jewish stars. On the bema, we call it a bema 06:07 instead of a platform, there's the iron Kadesh, a Torah ark 06:12 with the Torah in it. So just the visual coming is just 06:17 totally different. Then the worship service is different. 06:23 Then the liturgy is different. We'll be singing the prayers, 06:28 but we sing them. For song service, we don't call it a song 06:32 service, but to make that analogy, a lot of them are right 06:36 out of the Psalms and they are the ones that are sung all in 06:40 synagogues all over the world and are also the ones, many of 06:44 them, that Jesus sang. When Jesus went to synagogue, this is 06:48 what he saw, this is what he heard, and Paul and Peter. 06:51 and it's actually making inroads into our church because we call 06:55 it scripture songs. I mean, I go to women's retreats, I speak at 06:58 women's retreats all the time and they'll have scripture songs 07:00 or at camp meeting we'll hear scripture songs, so it is a 07:04 beautiful way of singing the scriptures back to the Lord. 07:08 Yes, and remember the scriptures that was too. A lot of them are 07:11 in Hebrew, but everything that is in Hebrew, we also do in 07:13 English. So we'll have a verse in Hebrew and a verse in English 07:16 matching it up or we'll read it in English and then we sing it 07:19 in Hebrew. So there is that whole flavor to it that is 07:23 totally different than a typical Methodist/Baptist church-type 07:29 of a setting or liturgy. 07:31 Why is it necessary, I mean, I made that as an assumption, that 07:35 it's necessary to take a different route. Why is it 07:39 necessary to take a different route to reach Jewish people? 07:43 Well because as humans, we listen more with our culture 07:47 than we do with our ears. 07:49 Repeat that; I like that. 07:51 Okay, we listen more with our culture than with our ears. 07:54 Body language and what we're used to and what we read from 07:57 our background and our upbringing, we read into what 08:00 people say. Maybe you've said things and people have said, 08:04 you said. I didn't say that, but they heard you say that in their 08:08 mind because they were filtering it through their culture or 08:11 through their background or whatever ideas they had. 08:14 Happens all the time when you're on television that people will 08:17 call and say, you said this, and you have to review the tapes, 08:20 and say, Never said it! Absolutely. 08:22 So to break down that barrier, that visual barrier... and 08:27 there's nothing wrong with churches, there's nothing wrong 08:31 with crosses, there's nothing wrong with a church service, 08:35 a typical American based out of the Puritan church service 08:39 type of a style with 11 o'clock morning service and the 08:43 children's story at the certain time and all that stuff. That's 08:46 fine for those who grew up with that; there's nothing wrong with 08:49 it at all and the hymns and everything. That's fine for that 08:51 culture, but those that are not used to that culture, including 08:54 Jews and Muslims and Buddhists and many other groups and a lot 08:58 of unchurched are not used to that. It's very foreign; it's 09:01 like basically speaking a foreign language and so they're 09:05 not hearing the message because they're looking at all this 09:08 other stuff and wondering what all that means and what it's all 09:12 about and it's just so unusual that it's hard to 09:16 get used to the taste bud, to get used to it. So instead of 09:20 having that as a barrier, we can get right into the Bible by 09:24 removing all the things that are foreign, that are not... 09:28 We don't have anything that would be against the Bible. 09:31 We are not continuing any traditions that would be against 09:34 the Bible. In Judaism, fortunately, there aren't very 09:38 many. I don't just like think of any just off the top of my head 09:41 that would be against the Bible. Now ministering to 09:44 another culture you might not be able to just take everything and 09:47 adapt it in but with Judaism it's very easy. 09:49 Praise the Lord. What kind of a success rate are you having? 09:54 Very good, I mean, especially if we compare with how 09:57 Christianity has done over the last 1900 years; a tremendous 10:02 amount of growth. A number of different reasons, but I think 10:06 that's one of the main reasons because, well like you mentioned 10:11 I've been a believer in Jesus Christ as the Messiah for 20 10:12 years now and have had a burden for reaching my people and have 10:15 tried different things. We've had different literature and all 10:18 these different types of things, but trying to bring them into 10:20 the church setting was always this barrier, always this break. 10:23 And some of the terms: You see in 1900 years Christianity 10:28 literally killed Jewish people. Now it wasn't maybe true 10:33 Christianity, but it was under the label of Christianity and 10:38 done in the name of Christ and done, you know, with crosses, 10:42 with a sword in one hand and a cross in another. You know, bow 10:46 down to this cross or we cut off your neck; kiss this statue or 10:51 we cut off your head. That was done continuously for 1900 10:57 years. So all of that is in our cultural memory. It's there and 11:03 we're told of this as a kid. So that makes a very big barrier. 11:07 So continuing with terms such as cross or even like crusade... 11:11 some Christians will use to term crusade. They're talking about 11:14 an evangelistic series of Bible teaching, but crusade to a 11:19 Jewish person or even a Muslim means massacres. So these terms 11:23 can be a stumbling block. Once you remove those terms and just 11:27 get into the word of God, well then it just 11:31 transitions over very easily. 11:34 So what I hear you saying, Jeff, is that if you want to reach out 11:38 to the Jewish people, if you've got Jewish neighbors, Jewish 11:42 friends or just people in your city, what you have to do is be 11:46 sensitive to their culture, sensitive to their traditions, 11:51 and just be thinking about what their experience or their 11:55 exposure to Christianity might be so that you don't use words 11:59 like crusade or something like this. 12:01 It should basically be loving, because even if you use the 12:04 wrong word but you are loving, it'll come across with the love 12:08 and that is what we need to be, not focused on, I'm going to 12:11 win this soul, you know, or something like that, but just 12:14 to love this person and to demonstrate God's love to them. 12:18 Over time, and asking like you say, if we're not familiar with 12:21 the culture, the best way to learn about the culture is to 12:24 ask the person about the culture and then you are showing an 12:27 interest in them and in their background and what they do 12:30 and then they may not. Most of the American Jews are not 12:35 practicing Judaism. Judaism for most Jewish Americans is a 12:39 culture, not a religion. And that is another thing that 12:42 Christians have a hard time getting around their head. It's 12:47 like telling an Italian that he's no longer Italian because 12:52 he now believes a certain way. It's a heritage, it's in some 12:57 ways a nationality but also, again, a cultural heritage more 13:01 that a religion for most. So it's not just teaching Bible 13:04 doctrines. I still consider myself Jewish, I'm still 13:08 Jewish, by heritage and by culture. 13:11 But I consider myself Jewish as well. We will get to that 13:14 in another program. 13:15 Right, right. So that helps, just loving the person, that's 13:19 a great way to start. You may not have a service or synagogue 13:24 like ours that you can bring them to. If they do that would 13:27 be great, but if they don't, then just loving them, getting 13:30 to know them, ministering to them, building up the friendship 13:33 and over time questions will come, needs will be there and 13:37 needs can be met. Then you can take it to the next step. 13:41 So when you have people come in to your church who are Jewish 13:44 and who have not yet accepted Jesus as the Messiah... 13:50 This month we've had 10, we've had 10 this month, just this 13:53 month. I could have said this week, but there were some 13:56 missing this week, so I'll stretch it out over the month 13:59 and then many of them are regulars and then of those that 14:02 are Jewish, background Jewish heritage, but have also accepted 14:06 Jesus as the Messiah, another 21. So within this month 31 14:09 people with Jewish backgrounds with 10 of them not yet 14:13 accepting the Messiah. 14:15 What is it like for them, I mean what is their number one 14:18 resistance when they do come in? Because you are showing visually 14:25 the things that they are accustomed to, does that break 14:28 down a lot of barriers? 14:29 It breaks down a lot of barriers. Like one man came in 14:31 about two months ago, came in for the first time, 14:35 Marty Lieberman, and after the service he said, If this is how 14:38 it was, services were like this when I was a kid, I never would 14:42 have left synagogue and so he just really enjoyed it, he was 14:46 blessed by it and so there were no barriers. 14:49 When you start ministering the gospel of Jesus Christ, what 14:55 is the most difficult thing for the average Jewish person to 15:01 accept? I think what I'm asking is, we see quite a number of 15:06 Jewish people are beginning to accept Christ as the Messiah; 15:11 Yahshua Hamashiach and they embrace him themselves now and 15:16 then they put themselves forth as messianic Jews, but why 15:21 haven't more Jews accepted Christ? 15:24 Well, I think one reason is we don't have more congregations. 15:27 We need more congregations I think and putting in more 15:30 places, we'll see the numbers go up. Those numbers that I gave 15:34 you were just for the congregations I work with. 15:35 There are about 10 other congregations in North America 15:39 that are associated, you know, with our denomination and then 15:42 there are others throughout the world, Argentina, Brazil, in 15:46 Israel and Russia and other places, too, so as we have more 15:50 of those that will be a big help. Becoming more culture 15:54 sensitive. We are producing literature so that people can 15:57 have things to share with their Jewish friends, training manuals 16:01 on how to share with your Jewish friends. 16:04 Now you've written a book even. 16:07 Yes. Well both those two books, the manual and a sharing book. 16:12 One is for the Christian to know how to minister to their Jewish 16:16 friends and the other is something to share with them. 16:20 These materials are available at Jewish Heritage? 16:23 The sharing book is available at jewishheritage. net 16:28 and the other is available through adventsource. org. 16:32 adventsource. org 16:35 So what is it when you first start talking to a Jewish person 16:42 about Jesus, what's the most difficult thing to overcome? 16:47 We are not finding much difficulty at all. Again, it's 16:53 not the first thing. We'll start off with starting on common 16:59 ground and common topics and then step by step on topics such 17:04 as faith and forgiveness and love, basically the gifts of the 17:08 spirit, just biblical things that they can relate to, stories 17:13 out of the Bible, Abraham, Moses, David, Bible stories and 17:19 then pointing each one to the Messiah over time and 17:22 developing-like in the Jewish Heritage scripture studies, it's 17:26 the fifth, sixth, and seventh chapters. So it's a gradual 17:30 process. Then by using his Hebrew name there's not that 17:35 stigma of Christ. Because when a Jewish person hears the word 17:39 Christ, many think a curse because that's how they've 17:43 heard it. They've heard Christ not used as a loving term to 17:46 describe the Savior of the world; they've heard used in a 17:50 curse, you know, in the streets or wherever, or they have been 17:54 called-my grandfather was called Christ killer or with 17:59 other negative connotations to it that Christ was against us. 18:04 Their picture of Jesus Christ is based on if Christians have 18:10 been doing all these things, these persecutions, these 18:13 killings and, I mean, just millions over the years. The 18:16 holocaust was just a culmination but it was continual for 1900 18:19 years. If Christians are doing this, Christ must taught that. 18:23 Christ must have taught them to do that and so Christ must have 18:27 taught them to not follow the Bible, to not follow the Torah; 18:31 that it's okay to eat pork, that the Sabbath day doesn't matter 18:35 and, you know, everything else and that it's okay to kill 18:38 people who don't believe like you do. So, if that's what 18:40 Christ taught we don't want to have anything to do with him. 18:42 So we have to repaint the picture. 18:44 So what you're saying then is to use the terminology as a Jewish 18:49 term for Jesus the Messiah is Yahshua Hamashiach, so if you're 18:54 referring to him in that way there's not that resistance to 18:59 the name Christ. So then if I'm trying to, let's say, my sister 19:05 has, I mean, she's just got such a heart for Jewish people and 19:10 she's got a special burden on her heart. How would you tell 19:15 her is the best way to minister to a Jewish person? 19:19 Okay. Again it's already a friendship, if it's a 19:24 sister-in-law or son-in-law or some close family relation, then 19:29 you time it out; you let the relationship grow over time. 19:33 Actually at prayer meeting, we've been going through the 19:36 reaching and winning book on how to share with your Jewish 19:39 friends and one of the ladies was there and she said well she 19:43 well she doesn't know any Jewish people yet. But she said she'll 19:46 pray for someone, pray that God will lead. So she came back the 19:49 next week and said, I was at the store, and I was at this isle 19:52 and this guy asked me this question about something that 19:55 was on the shelf and we got to talking and somehow he said he 19:58 Jewish and so she got his phone number and his e-mail, his card. 20:02 She gave it to me. I contacted him; we've been in contact. 20:05 You pray for a Divine appointment, God's 20:07 going to give you one. 20:08 That's right. That's right. And if you don't know all the terms 20:10 again, just say Messiah. Messiah is easy enough for most 20:13 Christians to remember. Just say Messiah. You know, that's an 20:16 easy enough term to use in substitute. Don't pressure 20:21 anybody but just let them grow in their walk with the Lord, 20:25 guiding and directing in the scriptures. 20:28 Guide them into the scriptures. 20:30 You know, I heard a testimony of someone who shared the book 20:36 Patriarchs and Prophets with a Jewish rabbi and he read the 20:41 the book and came back and was convinced that E. G. White was a 20:46 rabbi. That's right. Rabbi Kagen. Yes. so you know 20:49 the story the. Tell us the story. 20:51 The story's in the book. Tell the whole thing. 20:55 This rabbi, actually he worked for Ronald Reagan when he was 20:59 governor. He was his research man for Governor Reagan in 21:04 California. But growing up his aunt was raped by a parishioner 21:10 of a church and the priest stood over her with a cross and said 21:16 this is what you get for crucifying the Lord. Yeah. 21:19 Oh no. Oh that's horrible 21:22 So this is the kind of stuff that he grew up with. Many, many 21:25 of us, again, have that cultural memory in our minds. So he 21:28 wouldn't read the New Testament, he refused to read the New 21:31 Testament, but he read that book because, again, it was coming 21:34 out of the first part of the Bible, coming out of the Torah, 21:37 coming out the stories of Genesis and Abraham and Isaac 21:42 and Jacob and then leading to the Messiah from that 21:47 standpoint and it melted his heart. 21:49 Is it not true that, if it's the same story that I'm thinking of, 21:54 he actually that it had to have been written by a Rabbi. 21:57 That's right, because of the meter, the flow of the writing 22:01 was, as he termed it, Mishnaic which is a form of Jewish 22:06 writing, there's groupings of the Jewish writings, 22:09 the poetic form of it. 22:11 So this is something that kind of shows that he realized it 22:14 had to be divinely inspired when he realized who she was. 22:17 Because at that time when that book Patriarchs and Prophets 22:20 was written the Mishnah was not translated into English yet. 22:24 So how did she know all this, how did she have this insight? 22:27 Now he was able to read the Mishnah and those other 22:30 writings. What are some other resources that are good to show. 22:33 Well, there is a magazine, Shabbat Shalom, is a good 22:37 sharing magazine. It give the same principles, it works along 22:40 the same principles of sharing God's love out of the word of 22:44 God, and it's culturally sensitive and meshing it all 22:48 together. And don't we have, I know I've seen them, I just 22:51 don't know where, but we've got some kind of a series of Bible 22:54 studies that are done particularly as the Seventh-day 22:57 Adventist Church has done for the Jewish people. 22:59 Right, right. It was originally in the Bible studies form and 23:02 now it's together as a book called Jewish Heritage. 23:05 So it's all together and in addition to being 22 Bible 23:09 studies, like a series of studies, in addition to that 23:13 there are 29 stories including Rabbi Kagen's, Doug Bachelor's 23:18 and many others. So there's that emotional appeal, too, from real 23:22 life stories of people that have taken that step. There 23:25 are also 25 traditions covering things like the yarmulke, the 23:29 the kippa and other traditions. So they're reading it, they are 23:33 familiar with these things and it's giving a deeper 23:34 understanding of each one and then linking each one to the 23:37 Bible and to the Messiah and to salvation. 23:40 Glory to God! You know, what I'd like you to do Jeff is say a 23:45 special prayer for our viewers that God will enable them and 23:50 empower them to reach their Jewish friends. 23:52 One of the things we do at the end of the service is we say 23:56 what's called the Aaronic benediction and it is the 24:00 blessing that is written in the Torah, written in the Bible, for 24:04 Aaron to bless the people with. And it goes: The Lord bless you, 24:08 and the Lord keep you. the Lord make his face to shine upon you, 24:13 and be gracious unto you, the Lord lift up his countenance 24:17 upon you and give you his peace. 24:21 And this is something that if we will take it to heart and 24:27 understand that God still loves the Jewish people. You are 24:32 going to come back and we are going to be talking about who is 24:37 Israel today and we'll find that it's gentiles and Jews who are 24:44 Israel today. But those people of the physical nation of Israel 24:50 by physical birth, God still loves them, and he has a plan 24:55 for their future and his plan is to incorporate them into the 25:00 body of the Messiah. 25:01 One of the fears for Jewish people accepting the Messiah 25:05 is, What does this mean to me now? What does it mean about 25:08 my future? What does it mean about my grandparents. They 25:11 didn't believe in him so what's going to happen to them? 25:15 If I take this step, does this mean that they're going to be 25:19 lost? Am I denying them, am I denying my heritage, am I 25:22 denying my family, am I denying my roots and am I going to have 25:26 to change? What type of changes? Am I no longer going to be 25:30 Jewish? Am I no long going to be allowed to eat bagels and 25:33 knishes? What's going to happen? That's kind of like 25:37 subconscious, not on the conscious level. But change is 25:40 is difficult for anybody. But a dramatic change like that is 25:43 something that is scary to many of them. 25:46 You know, and particularly since you said that being Jewish is 25:50 more of a cultural thing than a religion. I never had stopped to 25:53 think, because I wouldn't think that an Italian accepting Jesus 25:58 as the Messiah would have those kind of thoughts, but from some 26:04 cultures I guess they would. 26:05 These are things we haven't considered before. 26:07 Especially if that means becoming a Christian 26:11 and the Christians have been the enemy 26:13 am I now becoming the enemy 26:15 of my grandparents? 26:17 How do you answer that? In less that a minute tell me 26:20 how do you answer that? 26:21 Well no he's still Jewish, Jewish believers in the Messiah. 26:24 They're Jews who have found their Jewish Messiah. 26:28 I'll bet you've got some great stories to tell. 26:31 Oh yeah. I'd like to share about Sidney. Sidney was an older man. 26:34 He came to our services. He was attending with us for quite some 26:36 time. We started studying the Bible together and as we were 26:40 going through he was accepting the Bible principles and really 26:43 enjoying it but he just wouldn't come to accepting Yahshua as his 26:46 own personal Messiah until I prayed about it and God 26:50 impressed me to ask him about his parents. I knew that he 26:54 really respected them. They were now deceased but very religious. 26:57 So I asked him, If they were here with us all this time and 27:00 attending services like you've been, knowing what you now know, 27:03 and reading what you've been reading in the Bible, do you 27:07 think that they would accept Yahshua as their Messiah? 27:10 And he said, Yeah, I think they would. When he could mentally 27:14 see his parents doing that, it basically gave him the approval 27:17 to then do the same. So I asked him, Then would you like to do 27:20 the same, would you like to accept him as your Messiah? 27:23 He said yes, he did. Later on we immersed him and it was 27:27 just wonderful. 27:28 He's now deceased but that's an example. 27:31 Jeff, thank you so much for being here today. 27:33 It's been a joy. Thank you. 27:36 I want to leave you with this from Numbers 6:24, it says: 27:41 The Lord bless you and keep you, the Lord make his face to shine 27:46 upon you, the Lord lift up his countenance upon you and give 27:51 you peace. I pray that for you entire family. Shalom |
Revised 2014-12-17