Hello, welcome to
Issues and Answers
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Today we have two very special
guests. We have Fred and Brenda
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Stoeker and their ministry
is Living True Ministries
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and they are out of Des Moines
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Iowa. First of all though we'd
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like to start with a scripture
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and I'm going to be taking this
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scripture from Titus 2:11-14.
For the grace of God that brings
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salvation has appeared to
all men. It teaches us to say no
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to ungodliness and worldly
passions and to live self
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controlled, upright and godly
lives in this present age while
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we wait for the blessed hope,
the glorious appearing of our
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great God and Savior Jesus
Christ who gave himself for us
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to redeem us from all
wickedness and to purify for
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himself a people that are his
very own, eager to do what is
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good. We're going to be talking
about something today that most
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people, most churches avoid
and that is talking about sexual
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addiction. We're talking
with Fred and Brenda. They are
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authors and they've got lots
of books and have sold over a
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million copies. So what they've
got to say they've put a lot of
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research in and they understand
it. So we're going to be talking
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about sexual purity. I just want
to welcome Fred, how are you
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doing? It's good to see
you. Brenda, my pleasure and
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everything. First of all, why
don't we have a definition of
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sexual purity. Well
sexual purity for me is
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simple. At first when I began
to fight the battle for sexual
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purity it was hard to understand
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what it means in the Bible when
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it says that we are not to have
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even a hint of sexual immorality
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in our lives. What I came to
understand what it means is that
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we're not to get any kind
of sexual gratification from
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anything or anybody except our
spouse. That's a practical one
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that I think we
can all understand.
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Amen. You know it's some way
mentioned to me we can certainly
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have crumbs or we can have a
banquet by participating with
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what God gave us and that is our
mate which is the banquet that
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he gave us and it's so special
to each one of us. How important
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is sexual purity
in a relationship?
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Well in my experience it changes
everything. I know when I was in
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college I began to have a lot of
issues with pornography. I was
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chasing women very heavily, had
too many girlfriends. Then when
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I got married I thought all that
would kind of slip away, but
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what I found out is that even
though I was married my eyes
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weren't doing what they
were supposed to be doing. I was
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looking at the movies I
shouldn't watch. I was maybe
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lusting after the girl in the
bikini, whatever it might be.
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The long and the short of it is
I found that it was hurting my
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relationship with Brenda.
What happens when we have sexual
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purity in our lives is that it
heals that relationship with our
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wives and it also heals the
relationship with God, because
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I was being cut off from
him because of my sin and it was
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enough that it was very clear.
I mean I could notice it very
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clearly in my life.
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I think too that when we have
nothing coming into our lives by
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way of whatever kind of TV
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programs, movies, books,
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magazines we read, when you cut
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out things that have a lot of
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sexual content to them, you find
yourself really able to just
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rejoice in the partner the
Lord's given you. There is such
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truth in the Bible that what the
Lord has given you is more than
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enough and there's real
fulfillment with just that.
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I mean we both remember when
I began to cut all these images
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out of my life and I'm talking
about the joggers and maybe
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the lingerie ad inserts
that I would look at too long on
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Sunday mornings in the
department store ad inserts
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in the newspaper. What I found
is when I cut all those out
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Brenda began looking more
beautiful that anyone that I
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knew and I began to be very
attracted to her. Then the verse
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that Solomon gave us that we're
to take joy in the wife of our
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youth, that
became extremely easy.
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So it had nothing to do with
love. I mean, you loved your
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wife very, very much.
Oh absolutely, absolutely.
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As a matter of fact, sexual
sin really has very little to do
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without love for our spouses.
I mean, there's an addictive
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quality to sexual sin that draws
us back. We can still love our
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wife, we can still love our
kids; in fact, we can even still
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love God, but we can't have the
same kinds of relationships with
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them, the same kind of intimacy
with them with the sin in our
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lives. Do you see
that this is mainly a
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male issue or do
females also fight this battle?
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Unfortunately these days women
are struggling with it quite
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a bit more also. By nature men
are wired differently than women
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are. Their eyes are going to
focus in on sexual images and
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things. Women are not by nature
made that way, but with our
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culture today and so much
available through internet
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pornography, magazines, movies,
TV shows, things like that we
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are finding that women are
almost rewiring to where there
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are many, many women
experiencing trouble in this
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area also. What she
means by rewiring in
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some ways is they're just
training themselves to be more
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visual and the odd thing is
back in oh say like the '70s
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Play Girl magazine went defunct
because there was no interest
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and women weren't buying the
magazine, they weren't watching
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but what we found is that as the
MTV generation has come in and
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then you know a lot of the prime
time TV is getting more sensual,
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the TV shows, what we're finding
is that more and more woman are
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hooked on porn. They're going
to the internet to see what the
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hubbub is all about and they're
getting hooked themselves.
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If you go from 30 years of age
and younger you're finding these
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days there can be as many as 50%
of the women out there that are
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visiting porn
sites and getting hooked.
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So we're seeing that Satan is
working overtime. It's like my
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daddy used to say, he said Satan
is kind of like bank interest,
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he works 24 hours a day.
Boy that's the truth, that is
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the truth. So we're
finding here that if we
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open up at all, Satan is going
to attack us at that particular
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entrance. One of
the reasons why that
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happens is the way that our eyes
work. Not everyone understands
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that when we look at something
sensual that there's a chemical
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reaction that happens in
the brain. It's this wash of
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pleasure chemicals that hit
the limbic center of the brain
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which handles the sexual desire
and the sexual appreciation and
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enjoyment. When those pleasure
chemicals hit the brain it's a
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very pleasurable feeling. Wow!
She's hot; that's what we say.
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But in our brain there's a real
nice pleasure that happens and
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what happens over time is that
the individual wants to repeat
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that and the brain wants to feel
that again and so it's not just
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the spiritual battle here that
we're fighting. There's also a
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physical battle not unlike
drugs. We can find that these
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pleasure chemicals when they do
the studies that it's a lot like
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the effects of cocaine or heroin
on the brain's pleasure centers
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and so what we have to admit is
that if we're allowing into our
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lives those small things, that
we normally say are small, you
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know, looking at the bikini-clad
girl or looking at the movie.
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Well, you know, everybody's
doing it, it doesn't really
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hurt. What we find is that it
those things that are hurting us
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and those things are drawing
us into sin and into not just
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sin but a habit with sin.
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Let me ask you this question
because I imagine, Brenda, you
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hear this a whole lot. But
daddy's a Christian so this
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should not affect him at all.
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I think, J.D., one of the
hardest things for me is seeing
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that much today of our Christian
culture has very little
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difference than the secular
culture. In our experience,
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churches we visit, places we
go it seems that there's very
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little difference in what
Christians would choose to watch
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in today's common movies
and what TV they would choose to
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watch and we are every bit as
much vulnerable to this as any
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other person. It always makes
me think of in the Old Testament
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when God commanded the
Israelites to stay away from
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all the Canaanites because
he said you'll get sucked into
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their things. I think it's kind
of like the Christians going
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into so much of today's culture
and not staying separated from
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it. Yes and you know the fact
that it's not just a spiritual
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issue but there's that physical
pull and the drug addiction in a
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sense. That's why daddy,
who's a Christian, can still get
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hooked and that's why when we're
playing with the Canaanites,
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essentially like Brenda
said, we can still get hooked.
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So what we also find, J.D., you
might find interesting, is you
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can't necessarily just pray your
way out of this because it's not
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just a spiritual issue. It would
be no different than if you were
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a heroin addict. You can pray 23
hours a day to get rid of your
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heroin addiction but if you're
still sticking the syringe in
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arm and putting the drugs into
your body, you're going to stay
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addicted. What we need to
understand is, yes, we can love
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God, we can pray, we can worship
but if we're going to continue
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to put those drugs, so to say,
into our brains, we're going to
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stay hooked on the sexual sin.
Our eyes are still going to be
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chasing after every woman that
goes by and we're not going to
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be able to have intimacy with
God and our family that we wish
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we had. So how
do we overcome this?
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Well that's what my book Every
Man's Battle is my first book
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towards this issue and what
I did is I told the story of my
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own life. As I mentioned earlier
I got hooked on porn in college
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and by the time I was one
year out of college I had four
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girlfriends, I was sleeping
with three of them and I was
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actually essentially engaged
to be married to two of them.
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So, I mean, I was way outside
the bounds. About that time I
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got to the lowest point in my
life and the Lord moved into my
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life and I was saved. From my
wedding day on I didn't look at
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porn so I never purchased
porn or looked at porn on the
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computer since we've been
married so I kind of cleaned
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myself up partway. But then
the Lord kept calling and he was
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saying why do you call me Lord,
Lord, and do not do what I say?
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That's from Luke 6:46. And
as he began to kind of hound me
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with that question, I began to
understand that there was more
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to this purity thing than
just not looking at porn or not
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having an extramarital affair.
And he began to speak to me
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about what I was looking at all
day long and so when I'd begin
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to do something that I call
in my book bouncing the eyes.
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Say a woman in a string bikini
walks by. By nature a man's eyes
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are going to look at her. What
the Lord was telling me was I
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need to do more like Job did
in Job 31:1. In that verse, Job
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said, I have made a covenant
with my eyes not to look
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lustfully at a girl. So
what I did at that was set up
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defenses based upon Job 31:1 and
I began to train my eyes to look
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away from the babe in the string
bikini, to look away from the ad
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inserts on Sunday morning,
to look away from the joggers.
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You know that aspect of this sin
this physical, I was essentially
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going cold turkey and allowing
that chemical process that was
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going on in my brain to cease
and as I cut all these things
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out of my life, as I said
earlier, Brenda began to look
00:12:03.42\00:12:07.07
better but the best thing was
my connection with God began to
00:12:07.11\00:12:11.57
return. I was able to pray to
him, I was able to pray with my
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wife who I was too guilty to
pray with before and I was able
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to worship more freely. So
the first thing we need to do in
00:12:20.29\00:12:25.76
this battle is to recognize what
you said earlier in Titus that
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we need to understand that God
wants to teach us how to say no
00:12:30.62\00:12:34.89
to ungodliness. We need to not
only understand that truth and
00:12:34.92\00:12:38.75
listen to it but we need to walk
in it and as we walk in it and
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actually defend ourselves and
put up our defenses we can get
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rid of that addictive side and
as we get rid of the addictive
00:12:47.19\00:12:51.89
side God continues then to pour
in his life even more deeply and
00:12:51.92\00:12:56.59
then not only are we conforming
to the word but we begin to
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be transformed in our mind about
our sexuality and he takes us to
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complete
victory as that happens.
00:13:02.51\00:13:04.00
So it is true then,
we become what we behold.
00:13:04.04\00:13:07.65
Oh, very much so. Yes,
so you started just through
00:13:07.69\00:13:12.63
your own methodology
just putting this behind you,
00:13:12.67\00:13:17.05
changing your behavior
and then you wake up and this
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transformation has taken place.
00:13:21.46\00:13:23.06
Yes, well there is actually a
two-step process to it. I like
00:13:23.10\00:13:26.47
to call it a two-front war. You
remember in world war II there
00:13:26.51\00:13:29.70
was the Pacific theater and
there was the European theater
00:13:29.73\00:13:33.90
and in order to win WWII we had
to win on both fronts. For me,
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what I found in this sexual
purity battle is there is a
00:13:38.11\00:13:42.05
physical front of the battle and
that's based upon what Paul told
00:13:42.09\00:13:45.31
us in 1 Corinthians 6:18-20.
He said that this sin is
00:13:45.34\00:13:49.08
different from other sins and
that what we're supposed to do
00:13:49.12\00:13:53.06
is flee sexual immorality. Now
in practice what fleeing looks
00:13:53.10\00:13:56.99
like is bouncing the eyes away
and training your mind to take
00:13:57.02\00:14:00.90
your thoughts away from lustful.
So on the physical front of the
00:14:00.94\00:14:04.78
battle it has to do with
what we're doing to set up our
00:14:04.82\00:14:08.30
defenses. Now there's also a
spiritual front of the battle
00:14:08.34\00:14:12.57
which has to do more with our
relationships; how much are we
00:14:12.61\00:14:16.36
connecting with God, how deeply.
How much are we worshiping.
00:14:16.40\00:14:20.37
What I found on that side of the
battle is that's the side that
00:14:20.41\00:14:24.35
really cements everything
in place. I began to do more
00:14:24.39\00:14:28.29
worship at home on my own,
one on one with God. I began to
00:14:28.33\00:14:31.99
consistently pray and read my
Bible and I can talk to you more
00:14:32.02\00:14:35.68
about that in detail if we have
time but the main issue is that
00:14:35.72\00:14:40.06
as I began to do that I began to
pick up the mind of Christ and
00:14:40.10\00:14:44.41
as I picked up the mind of
Christ the transformation was
00:14:44.44\00:14:47.50
complete. What some people don't
understand, J.D., is that we
00:14:47.53\00:14:51.29
don't have to have the same
level of temptation all through
00:14:51.32\00:14:55.72
our lives. Once we get into that
mind of Christ position where
00:14:55.75\00:15:00.18
we are transformed to understand
our sexuality the temptations
00:15:00.22\00:15:04.99
from the enemy actually change.
In a sense, he's not as close to
00:15:05.02\00:15:09.76
us. It's harder for him to
lob that grenade into our lap.
00:15:09.79\00:15:12.89
It becomes harder for us to turn
on the computer and to look at
00:15:12.92\00:15:17.25
porn because the Lord seems so
much more real to us because of
00:15:17.29\00:15:21.50
that intimacy. So we don't want
to, in a sense, commit adultery
00:15:21.53\00:15:25.71
with him sitting right next
to us, you know what I mean?
00:15:25.74\00:15:29.46
Let me ask you this, Fred.
What direction or what proposals
00:15:29.50\00:15:33.73
would you have to improve a
broken marriage. Let's just say
00:15:33.77\00:15:38.18
that they chose not to repent
versus someone that does repent?
00:15:38.21\00:15:42.59
Well you know there are
really three ways that a man can
00:15:42.62\00:15:46.01
respond to God's call to purity
and one would be to repent and
00:15:46.05\00:15:49.64
move quickly into purity. That's
something that the wife of
00:15:49.68\00:15:53.41
course would like. He can
also waffle for a while, sort of
00:15:53.45\00:15:57.14
repent and sort of not; or
he can completely just turn his
00:15:57.17\00:16:00.82
back and say look I like this
00:16:00.86\00:16:02.56
sexual sin; I'm going to
00:16:02.60\00:16:03.68
continue. It's that issue right
there, that one of the three
00:16:03.72\00:16:07.21
that creates the biggest problem
in a marriage because here you
00:16:07.25\00:16:10.58
have a wife whose counting
on her husband to help build her
00:16:10.61\00:16:14.53
dreams to have a Christian
marriage and he's refusing to
00:16:14.56\00:16:18.97
care about it. What has to
happen at that point is that the
00:16:19.01\00:16:23.49
wife has to somehow be a
help mate, help pray him into
00:16:23.53\00:16:27.95
repentance so that God can move
in and sweep things clean. That
00:16:27.98\00:16:32.37
can that a lot of time and so
the wife has some pretty strong
00:16:32.40\00:16:36.54
work that she has to do to keep
patient and to keep her heart
00:16:36.57\00:16:40.02
strong in the face of that.
Maybe, Brenda, you can talk a
00:16:40.06\00:16:43.47
little bit about that.
00:16:43.51\00:16:44.49
Well, I do think for sure that
one thing we need to add to that
00:16:44.52\00:16:47.88
is that we believe biblically
00:16:47.92\00:16:50.59
there is full hope for her to
00:16:50.62\00:16:53.00
have her own heart restored and
00:16:53.03\00:16:55.07
peace in her own life even if
00:16:55.10\00:16:57.06
her husband doesn't. Adultery
has been committed here with
00:16:57.10\00:17:01.59
him being sexually unfaithful
like this. So we are not saying
00:17:01.63\00:17:05.79
oh she has to carry on with this
the rest of her life. Biblically
00:17:05.82\00:17:09.72
she has grounds between her and
the Lord to decide if she feels
00:17:09.76\00:17:14.12
that she can continue on with
this man or not. But the most
00:17:14.16\00:17:18.19
important thing I think for all
women is to really learn about
00:17:18.22\00:17:21.76
the differences between men and
women sexually because there are
00:17:21.80\00:17:25.31
huge, huge differences in
the way that we express intimacy
00:17:25.34\00:17:30.92
the way men view sexual things
in their lives and we just
00:17:30.96\00:17:35.79
really need to know those
differences. Also I think when
00:17:35.83\00:17:39.56
you understand those things
sometimes men's problems come
00:17:39.59\00:17:43.25
from even things in their past
and you learn to understand that
00:17:43.28\00:17:46.10
perhaps it's not all about me.
One of the main things that we
00:17:46.13\00:17:48.81
would hope for is that women
would understand it's not her
00:17:48.85\00:17:51.49
fault. She wasn't just
not attractive enough or not
00:17:51.52\00:17:55.33
everything he hoped she would
be. Many times it's just stuff
00:17:55.36\00:17:58.44
in their past. So when you
learn these things about the
00:17:58.48\00:18:01.15
differences between men and
women, you can begin to have
00:18:01.18\00:18:04.35
mercy on your husband and you
can have healing for yourself,
00:18:04.38\00:18:07.40
understanding that this isn't
all my fault. His sin is his sin
00:18:07.44\00:18:10.42
but it isn't all my fault.
00:18:10.45\00:18:11.64
The main thing that we wanted
to do in our book Every Heart
00:18:11.67\00:18:15.20
Restored, which Brenda and I
wrote together; we wrote it to
00:18:15.24\00:18:18.67
wives who are in this situation
because their emotions are
00:18:18.70\00:18:21.91
shattered. I mean they're
sitting there going boy have I
00:18:21.94\00:18:24.92
not been attractive enough,
have I not been the kind of wife
00:18:24.95\00:18:28.74
I need to be? Am I just not
spiritual enough for my husband
00:18:28.77\00:18:32.43
or whatever it might be. When
they find out their husband's
00:18:32.47\00:18:36.26
been looking at porn or caught
in sexual sin like that they are
00:18:36.29\00:18:40.04
feeling like their whole world
has been shattered. What we
00:18:40.08\00:18:43.82
wanted to do is point out
that look you need to start with
00:18:43.86\00:18:47.88
Jesus first and if you start
with him and focus on him even
00:18:47.91\00:18:51.19
more than on your husband and
what he's doing or not doing,
00:18:51.22\00:18:54.43
that's where true transformation
can happen for you. We feel like
00:18:54.46\00:18:58.72
a woman's heart can be restored
whether her husband repents or
00:18:58.75\00:19:02.97
not and we want women to
understand that. One of the
00:19:03.01\00:19:06.81
things that Brenda has learned
recently through the death of
00:19:06.85\00:19:11.24
her mother is how important
it is for we as Christians to be
00:19:11.27\00:19:15.70
disciplined in our approach to
God. She was very shattered in
00:19:15.73\00:19:19.95
her life; she was very close to
her mom. In that process, that
00:19:19.98\00:19:23.82
year as her mom died of cancer,
Brenda learned that she really
00:19:23.85\00:19:27.66
didn't trust God the way
that she always thought she did.
00:19:27.69\00:19:30.04
We see some parallels in that
to sexual sin issues because you
00:19:30.07\00:19:33.84
need to really trust God for the
restoration of your marriage and
00:19:33.88\00:19:37.71
it may take some time. What we
have found as we talk to women
00:19:37.75\00:19:41.58
in this situation is they don't
trust God quite as much as they
00:19:41.62\00:19:45.12
maybe always thought they did
and if they really open their
00:19:45.16\00:19:48.55
hearts to God they can be in
a position where even if though
00:19:48.58\00:19:51.94
the sexual sin thing has
shattered everything, it can
00:19:51.98\00:19:54.49
draw them into a closer
relationship with God than they
00:19:54.53\00:19:56.98
every dreamed possible. Brenda
maybe you can talk about some
00:19:57.01\00:20:00.42
of the discipline ways that
maybe women might approach this.
00:20:00.45\00:20:04.15
Sometimes, J.D., women are very
crushed and hurt by this kind of
00:20:04.18\00:20:08.28
a thing. It's extremely damaging
to your self-esteem. But boy
00:20:08.31\00:20:11.86
many of us women would be saying
I just must be worthless. He's
00:20:11.90\00:20:15.39
looking at other women and what
am I not doing right. Our self
00:20:15.42\00:20:18.91
esteems take a beating. At a
time like this we desperately,
00:20:18.94\00:20:21.83
desperately need to have
the word of God coming into our
00:20:21.86\00:20:24.71
lives all day long. It
transforms our hearts and
00:20:24.75\00:20:27.77
allows us to have the kind of
attitudes that we need to have
00:20:27.80\00:20:31.15
to deal with our husbands'
problems. I take a scripture
00:20:31.19\00:20:34.47
like say Psalm 139 and I began
reading that twice a day and I
00:20:34.51\00:20:38.44
would begin to really meditate
on that and just pick it apart
00:20:38.48\00:20:42.02
to see how it would apply to me.
It was so good because it would
00:20:42.06\00:20:45.27
talk about how there was no way
that I could be separated from
00:20:45.31\00:20:48.34
the Lord. He knew me so well, he
knew my very thoughts, there was
00:20:48.38\00:20:51.38
no darkness at a time when you
just feel like it's darkness,
00:20:51.41\00:20:54.12
there's no direction, there's no
nothing but he's there. It's a
00:20:54.15\00:20:56.83
very encouraging Psalm. After
reading it twice a day for a
00:20:56.86\00:21:00.22
while it wasn't long before
I had it memorized. I would add
00:21:00.25\00:21:03.54
other scriptures then that would
be suitable to what my situation
00:21:03.57\00:21:07.32
was. Maybe Psalm 55:22 Cast your
burden on the Lord and he will
00:21:07.36\00:21:11.08
sustain you. He'll never suffer
the righteous to be moved.
00:21:11.11\00:21:13.63
Or 1 Corinthians chapter 13 and
verses 1-7 that talks about how
00:21:13.67\00:21:19.20
we should love as Christians.
Those things transform our
00:21:19.23\00:21:22.70
hearts so that we can deal with
our husbands. They remind us of
00:21:22.74\00:21:26.59
God's love for us and instead
of coming at him in anger over a
00:21:26.63\00:21:29.04
situation. I am being tempered
by the Holy Spirit because I'm
00:21:29.07\00:21:31.50
constantly being reminded
this is how I need to respond.
00:21:31.51\00:21:37.25
God loves me. It's not my
problem or my sin, this is his,
00:21:37.28\00:21:40.48
and I can come at it with more
mercy and compassion. Otherwise
00:21:40.52\00:21:44.19
I think I'd just be angry and
be wanting to tear at things and
00:21:44.23\00:21:47.86
that won't get you anywhere.
00:21:47.90\00:21:48.96
The other thing is that the
discipline that Brenda displayed
00:21:48.99\00:21:53.45
during this time of pain to
me was remarkable. One of the
00:21:53.49\00:21:57.88
things she would do is she
would take those scriptures
00:21:57.92\00:21:59.78
and she would put
them on one of those sticky
00:21:59.79\00:22:01.40
notes, Post-It notes that we're
all familiar with and she would
00:22:01.41\00:22:04.89
actually take that scripture
00:22:04.92\00:22:06.34
around with her all day so if
00:22:06.37\00:22:07.68
she was in the kitchen, she'd
00:22:07.72\00:22:09.02
put it right above the window,
00:22:09.06\00:22:10.29
if she went to the car she would
put it on her steering wheel
00:22:10.33\00:22:12.73
and when she would stop at a red
light she would read it again.
00:22:12.76\00:22:15.33
She wouldn't just write the
scripture down, she would write
00:22:15.36\00:22:17.83
a couple of the points that the
Lord had spoken into her heart
00:22:17.86\00:22:21.56
when she read it so that all day
long that's being in her mind
00:22:21.59\00:22:25.25
and heart and it's
keeping her right on the nose.
00:22:25.29\00:22:28.40
If you have that scripture
pouring in all day long it will
00:22:28.43\00:22:32.05
transform your mind and heart.
Otherwise we women are beaten
00:22:32.08\00:22:35.66
up and chewed up by the
devastation and the pain of a
00:22:35.70\00:22:39.43
circumstance like this. So
that's why we say a heart can
00:22:39.47\00:22:42.82
be restored because God can
transform your life. It is hard
00:22:42.85\00:22:46.17
work and you have to be very,
00:22:46.21\00:22:47.62
very committed and dedicated.
00:22:47.65\00:22:48.99
I mean I'm reading my Bible,
I'm trying to say Lord what do
00:22:49.03\00:22:52.16
you have to show me today.
It might be only one chapter but
00:22:52.20\00:22:55.23
I read it a couple of times,
really think about it, jot down
00:22:55.27\00:22:57.84
a couple points and I'd be
sticking it around the house all
00:22:57.88\00:23:01.37
day long and just constantly
refreshing my mind and that is
00:23:01.41\00:23:04.87
vital, just
vital its God's word.
00:23:04.90\00:23:06.43
I'm so proud of you in watching
the way that the Lord is working
00:23:06.46\00:23:11.93
in your life. Because yes this
is Fred's issue but it's your
00:23:11.97\00:23:16.33
issue also and you're both
approaching it from different
00:23:16.36\00:23:20.69
directions but yet you're going
00:23:20.72\00:23:21.93
to come together in the middle.
00:23:21.96\00:23:23.42
Now I know that there's sometime
00:23:23.45\00:23:24.84
whenever men waffle back and
forth, okay. I miss it, but yet
00:23:24.87\00:23:32.53
I want to serve God. I
want my heart to be pure.
00:23:32.57\00:23:34.98
How does that all work?
00:23:35.01\00:23:36.34
Well, that puts a unique
pressure on the wife, okay,
00:23:36.35\00:23:40.91
because she is suffering, she
knows that you're not doing what
00:23:40.92\00:23:45.60
you're supposed to do as a
husband and she knows that her
00:23:45.64\00:23:49.07
marriage is not what she dreamed
it would be. She knows that
00:23:49.11\00:23:53.98
there's generational effects
on the children and I mean she
00:23:54.02\00:23:58.66
wants victory quickly. It's hard
for her to understand why he's
00:23:58.69\00:24:03.66
waffling. One of the things I
want to remind women of is that
00:24:03.69\00:24:08.18
remember there's a physical side
of this and even when a man's
00:24:08.22\00:24:12.33
spirit is starting to really
long for victory, there's also
00:24:12.37\00:24:16.96
this tug, this addictive tug,
that's pulling on him and it's
00:24:17.00\00:24:21.37
also an emotionally based thing,
not just physical. So I know in
00:24:21.40\00:24:24.88
my own life, for instance, when
I used to get real stressed in
00:24:24.92\00:24:28.20
my work, I was a salesman at
the time, and I would have to do
00:24:28.23\00:24:31.17
these proposals and sometimes
I'd go back to my office at
00:24:31.21\00:24:34.96
night and I would find myself
drifting away from the stress
00:24:34.99\00:24:38.66
and trying to find a little
vacation for a few moments and I
00:24:38.69\00:24:42.00
would let my eyes look at things
I shouldn't have them looking
00:24:42.04\00:24:45.66
at. As I would do that it would
relieve my stress and see so
00:24:45.70\00:24:49.76
there are a lot of things where
we as men get hooked emotionally
00:24:49.79\00:24:53.82
as well as physically on
the sexual sin and that can take
00:24:53.86\00:24:57.24
a while sometimes to really get
a grip on that and really break
00:24:57.28\00:25:00.98
free. However, a good wife who's
a good helpmate can do some
00:25:01.02\00:25:04.48
things to help bring us to
that level. Maybe you'd like to
00:25:04.51\00:25:07.94
address that. Just
what a helpmate would do.
00:25:07.97\00:25:11.79
Oh sure. Well, I think one of
the main things is being careful
00:25:11.82\00:25:17.44
to hold him accountable and
speak freely into his life so
00:25:17.47\00:25:20.96
that he knows without a doubt
what kind of hurt and damage
00:25:21.00\00:25:25.72
he's causing. If we are afraid
to speak up, you know, we're
00:25:25.75\00:25:29.29
sort of to blame if we're not
even going to stand up and say
00:25:29.33\00:25:32.25
listen this is what this is
doing to me. I'm worried about
00:25:32.29\00:25:35.47
our kids, this is unbiblical.
As a Christian we have a right
00:25:35.51\00:25:38.65
to hold him accountable
to those higher standards.
00:25:38.69\00:25:40.82
A lot of times women understand
very clearly the role of
00:25:40.85\00:25:43.70
submission and they need
to submit to their husband's
00:25:43.74\00:25:46.63
leadership. But they don't
understand so well their role
00:25:46.67\00:25:50.16
as helpmate. The way I describe
it in kind of laymen's terms
00:25:50.19\00:25:53.11
that a wife needs to be a
helpmate is that she needs to
00:25:53.14\00:25:56.80
help lift her husband to
Christian greatness. Christian
00:25:56.83\00:26:00.66
greatness just means Christ
likeness. If she's going to do
00:26:00.70\00:26:04.48
that she needs to be able to
speak into his life in the areas
00:26:04.52\00:26:08.37
where he's tearing down his own
home so that he can understand.
00:26:08.41\00:26:12.88
What happens when we just focus
as women on just the submission
00:26:12.92\00:26:17.36
side is that we allow our
husband to get a pass almost
00:26:17.39\00:26:21.55
into sexual sin. He pays
no price and what we have to
00:26:21.59\00:26:25.68
understand that in God's economy
there's a reaping and sowing law
00:26:25.71\00:26:29.58
and when we suspend that
law in our husband's life by not
00:26:29.61\00:26:34.23
speaking into his life freely,
a lot of times he can kind of
00:26:34.27\00:26:38.86
slide along and not
feel so anxious to change.
00:26:38.89\00:26:44.64
I think too, J.D. just a little
quickly for women is I think
00:26:44.68\00:26:49.08
sometimes we women are a little
careless about what we allow
00:26:49.11\00:26:53.30
in today's TV and movies in
our homes and I think we need to
00:26:53.34\00:26:57.33
take a better stand on guarding
what comes in, what our kids are
00:26:57.37\00:27:00.46
watching, what we're watching.
It's a little hard for me to
00:27:00.49\00:27:03.43
point a finger at him if
I'm watching some of the things
00:27:03.46\00:27:06.22
today that have inappropriate
things in them and they are
00:27:06.25\00:27:09.31
loaded. I mean boy you can't
pick too many movies that don't
00:27:09.35\00:27:12.37
have inappropriate sex.
00:27:12.41\00:27:14.50
Right. And if it's in there
it's going to have its effect
00:27:14.53\00:27:16.82
on your husband. Right.
00:27:16.85\00:27:17.96
I hate to have to bring this to
an end. Time is our enemy once
00:27:17.99\00:27:22.02
again. I just want to thank
y'all so much for being here.
00:27:22.05\00:27:25.35
Fred, Brenda. It's so obvious
that y'all know what you're
00:27:25.39\00:27:28.62
talking about here. Of course,
if you've got millions of books
00:27:28.65\00:27:31.68
out there it just makes sense.
I know that this is very close
00:27:31.71\00:27:34.70
to you, this topic
is very close to you.
00:27:34.74\00:27:37.25
I just want to close with this
particular scripture. I think
00:27:37.26\00:27:40.56
that it applies to
everyone. It's found in
00:27:40.57\00:27:43.06
1 Corinthians 15:57: But thanks
be to God who gives us victory
00:27:43.07\00:27:49.53
through his son Jesus Christ.
Thank you for being with us
00:27:49.54\00:27:52.94
today at Issues and Answers.
00:27:52.95\00:27:55.36